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Summer service: open mike 08/01/2012

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, January 8th, 2012 - 42 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

As usual, it’s reduced service over the summer break, unless anything big happens. We hope you’ll get a good break with those dear to you, and that we’ll have some decent weather to enjoy. And if you still need your politics fix… Open mike is your post. For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose. Step right up to the mike…

42 comments on “Summer service: open mike 08/01/2012 ”

  1. Tigger 1

    24 hours after the balloon tragedy and still nothing from Key? 

    • hs 1.1

      What do you expect key to do ?

      • Lanthanide 1.1.1

        It’s been called a national tragedy.

        • hs 1.1.1.1

          It’s a terrible accident and horrible and traumatic for all the families and rescue workers involved but what do you expect key to do ?

          • Colonial Viper 1.1.1.1.1

            1) Issue his sincere condolences to the families affected, whether in person, or by the media.

            2) Promise publicly that the investigation into what happened will be fully resourced and supported by central Government as an air safety priority.

            3) Communicate, through his officials, with the hot air ballooning industry and identify if any interim precautions or changes need to occur immediately.

            4) Reassure those families (and rescue workers) affected by the tragedy that financial, counselling and other support will be made available to them.

            So hs, you wanna make me Prime Minister or what, so I can get the needed job done.

            • Treetop 1.1.1.1.1.1

              Is Key still not the minister of tourism?

              I am assuming there were no tourists killed, had there been, would we still not have heard from Key?

              Key needs to find five minutes to express that a tragic event caused the loss of 11 people. It is about being respectful to the families and acknowledging their loss.

            • Salsy 1.1.1.1.1.2

              Where is the prime minister?
              Rena is now in two pieces 30m apart and set to degrade futher significant discharge of containers and wildlife response units alerted, so more oil, debris etc. We have our worst aviation incident since erebus and worst maritime incident occuring simultaneously and no prime minister? At least David Shearer has had the good grace to offer condolences on behalf of Labour.

            • Colonial Viper 1.1.1.1.1.3

              So hs, hows this for a list so far mate? What’s your response?

              • hs

                Of your list I expect 2-4 are all done on automatic pilot when such accidents occur.

                I do note that some people expect Key to issue a statement or front on TV – I understand that the GG has done this on behalf of all poli’s.

                Personally I saw more than enough of Key during the election campaign.

                In relation to making you PM – why not you appear to be a ideologically blinded, self important buffoon so would probably be perfect for the position.

                • Colonial Viper

                  Of your list I expect 2-4 are all done on automatic pilot when such accidents occur.

                  Except Key hasn’t done any of them.

                  I understand that the GG has done this on behalf of all poli’s.

                  The GG did this on behalf of the Queen – since he is the Queen’s representative. The GG does not represent “poli’s”. I thought you understood NZ’s basic constitutional set up. Or you do understand and are just obfuscating.

                  Personally I saw more than enough of Key during the election campaign.

                  Yeah, I suppose that’s an acceptable reason for Key not fronting up to a National tragedy.

      • Draco T Bastard 1.1.2

        The same as he’s done for every other disaster (Pike River, Rena, Airforce heli crash…). Of course, he’s not looking to get re-elected next term so I would assume the mask of care has been dropped (although it’s been slipping for quite some time now).

      • Well if it had been election time he would have been in every papers front page and looking very sad onTV .Now the elections over he could not care a dam.However it was good to see that Shearer was the first to express his condolences to families involved,

    • Carol 1.2

      When Reagan was President, there was a running joke about “the president’s brain is missing”. We need one that goes like, “the Prime Minister’s body is missing.”

      [lprent: fixed the typo. Wasn’t Regan someone’s chief of staff? ]

    • Transport Minister Gerry Brownlee earlier expressed condolences on behalf of the government, and duty minister Nathan Guy visited Carterton, where the accident occurred.

      http://www.3news.co.nz/Key-expresses-sympathy-to-balloon-victims/tabid/423/articleID/238474/Default.aspx#ixzz1ipgAR6er

      “I was shocked and saddened to hear of this terrible tragedy,” he said in a statement. “My heartfelt condolences go out to the families and friends of the 11 victims of this tragic event.”

      Mr Key said government agencies had launched multiple investigations into the balloon crash and their findings would be carefully examined for lessons that could be learned.

      “None of this will be any comfort to the families and friends of those who died. I would like to express again the government’s deepest condolences to them,” Mr Key said.

  2. Brian Leyland, that well known “independent” commentator on global warming is at it again. He reports this morning that it is all an Enron circulated myth.  Apparently Enron knew it was not happening but pushed it for profits.

    This is the first I have heard of this particular allegation and I would love to see the proof.  I am sure however that it is as accurate as his other claims like the world’s temperature plateaued in 1988. How he reconciles this with the fact that the 13 warmest years occurred since 1997 I do not know.  It has a theme that Slater would be proud of.  It blames the corporate industrial world FOR the theory whereas it is clear to me that the corporate industrial world is trying to do the opposite like hiring tame academics to try and raise doubts that climate change is happening.

    Where SST is the balance?  The editors and Leyland should be strapped in a chair and forced to watch There once was an Island which I managed to see last night.  Great film LPrent by the way.

    • Armchair Critic 2.1

      Brian Leyland is a sad case. He used to be thoughtful, considerate and very much worth listening to. He has stopped listening, but he has kept talking, and what he says is not having enough scrutiny applied to what he has to say.
      I expect that SST had a bit of spare space and decide to chuck in there, “oh, look, here’s something from Brian Leyland, that will do.” He’s on my list of people not to read.

  3. Colonial Viper 3

    Identify the psychopaths/sociopaths amongst us high up in our society.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMG1qjpzNPg&list=UU-7vnmA1Zf1cRyqs9aR77ag&index=1&feature=plcp

  4. Draco T Bastard 4

    ‘Greedy wharfies’ tale hides ambitions for port

    Intriguing also was the wharfies’ response to Gibson’s claims about their pay. They offered not take any increase. In fact, they’d cut their annual wage by $10,000 as well as extend their working week from 26 hours a week to 40 for no extra pay.

    Interesting…

    First, a wharfie on 40 hours a week gets $56,000. The hourly rate is $27. With overtime, some can earn up to $71,000. The union says that to earn $91,000, a worker would have to work additional overtime equal to 32 weeks fulltime in a year.

    So it would appear that the $91k that wharfies are paid is complete bollocks spread by the psychopathic managers and RWNJs around the country.

    So, what then is this ambition for PoAL?

    But I got suspicious when Christine Fletcher, the leader of the right wing on the Auckland Council, which owns the port, said that the wharfies’ behaviour meant we should privatise the port.

    Yeah, not all that surprising. The RWNJs are trying to give even more of our wealth to their rich mates. This will, of course, make the rest of us poorer and in less control of our destiny as more political power and wealth gets transferred to a few.

    • Carol 4.1

      I heard a guy for the bosses side talking on RNZ talking about how it was all about a need to “change”, because this is what the current context and their customers, or businesses who use the ports require. There was no analysis of exactly what change means and who it benefits. The implication was that all change is good. He was characterising the wharfie union as being behind the times and out of touch with the current context.

      • prism 4.1.1

        Quote ‘ What part of change don’t they understand?’ What part of business education don’t managers like Gibson? understand? Surely they are taught how to negotiate when in business studies or was he away doing something more interesting when that was covered. Probably there was a 2page reading with an anecdote showing how a company won by taking the hard line against workers.

  5. Herodotus 5

    All the discussion regarding increasing taxes or the appropriateness of the current regime. IMO we have adequate tax rates, just inadequate laws and policing/collection. It is just those who do not pay their dues or have the skills to illegialy not pay their taxes e.g. the Black/grey markets (A cash job does not only bypass the 15% GST, but there is also the loss of tax on profits costing in many cases the country 40% of the gross value in lost taxes) of those that the law allows to utilise “Tax Arbitrage”.
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10777326

    • mik e 5.1

      Hero to the greedy Capital gaingsters pay no tax at all .The rest of us subsidize these tax flaunters while they drive round in flash cars get free education for their kids cheap doctors visits because their declarable income is probably so low a lot of them get a community services card.

  6. logie97 6

    New Zealand journalism demonstrates that it has yet to come of age, when a national broadsheet sees fit to make this a headline and then analyse the figures to the nth degree …

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/6226596/Capital-scores-in-gay-union-stakes

    … and won’t till it realises that most people don’t care.

    • Lanthanide 6.1

      Um, I found the story and stats quite interesting.

    • Colonial Viper 6.2

      I’m just pleased that an MSM article showed some semblance of statistical competence. Now would the media start quoting median statistics for income please instead of the average income.

  7. Well I am not religious or superstitious but one must wonder if this PM is jinxed in some way . Nearly every day a new tragedy or crisis . If I was him and had the countries interests at heart I would seriously consider resigning.

    • Colonial Viper 7.1

      Wondering if you saw this little discussion

      Summer service: open mike 07/01/2012

    • RedLogix 7.2

      The reasons why I don’t like that kind of comment are:

      1. It’s wrong. However much anyone here may dislike John Key (or any other pollie for that matter), they are not the cause of earthquakes or balloon accidents. It’s a kind of magical thinking that humans are prone to; we have propensity to look to ‘strong leaders’ to solve all of our problems … when often as not it’s a way of avoiding taking responsibility for ourselves. The same thinking also has a dark side; one that seeks to irrationally blame our political leaders for events utterly outside of their control.

      2. More pertinently from the point of view of The Standard, that kind of comment pushes other people’s emotional buttons.. and starts really pointless flame-wars. Especially in the immediate aftermath when emotions are still raw. I take no pleasure in having to hose down flame-wars and issuing bans.. when a spot of prevention would have served better.

      3. It’s the kind of thing RWNJ’s used to say about Helen Clark and it’s no prettier now when it’s said about John Key.

      [lprent: Exactly. Give your opinion by all means. But confine yourself to facts or opinions. Don’t try to mix them to produce fantasies for an interesting universe – we have fantasy writers and political columnists for that.

      He isn’t a demon with supernatural powers or a self proclaimed super villain with a intellect unencumbered by a emotional immaturity (ie he isn’t in Libertarianz). He is, in my opinion, just someone with slightly more intellectual grunt than Cameron Slater and somewhat similar levels of emotional maturity. ]

      • Jackal 7.2.1

        Essentially I totally agree with your argument RedLogix, but there’s another layer that’s not highlighted by the pink postman’s comment.

        There is no question that incompetence can result in bad luck and the inability to react properly to so called acts of god. But there’s a very real dynamic responsible for that incompetence, which appears to be more evident under a John Key led government.

        National has maneuvered many inexperienced people into positions they’re not suitable for, specifically because they’re their mates. Personally I blame cronyism for much of the dysfunction… or what some superstitious people call bad luck.

        Of course we cannot rationally blame one man for acts of god or expect the government to be responsible for everybody’s actions… but we should not ignore the fact that bad luck is closely intertwined with incompetence, which has increased under National’s system of rampant cronyism.

        • RedLogix 7.2.1.1

          but we should not ignore the fact that bad luck is closely intertwined with incompetence

          And The Standard has a solid track record of ripping into the govt where incompetent responses, eg in the immediate aftermath of the Rena grounding, have been evident. No problem with that at all.

          But … and this is the big but…. it’s still quite wrong to then make the leap to attributing the same incompetence to being the cause of the disaster. OK in the case of the Rena, or Pike River there is a definite political dimension going back to de-regulation in the 90’s…but that was well prior to John Key being PM; which makes it wholly irrational to label him a ‘jinx’ or ‘bad luck’ in connection with the cause of these events.

          If nothing else such thinking is very bad politics.

      • felix 7.2.2

        “He isn’t a demon with supernatural powers or a self proclaimed super villain with a intellect unencumbered by a emotional immaturity”

        I don’t think anyone suggested any such thing.

        Haven’t you ever met people who drag bad luck around behind them everywhere they go?

        • Colonial Viper 7.2.2.1

          There are definitely some mates that you would never take a long to the races or the casino.

  8. Listening to a replayed Chris Laidlaw interview with the Prime Minister’s Science Advisor, Sir Peter Gluckman, made me realize who much good advice the Prime Minister is ignoring:
    http://localbodies-bsprout.blogspot.com/2012/01/sir-peter-gluckmans-advice-ignored.html

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