Talley’s Group: Arsehole managers – bad faith and bullshit

41 comments on “Talley’s Group: Arsehole managers – bad faith and bullshit ”

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1. grumpy 1

   17 May 2012 at 11:46 am

   Certainly, someone is a liar. Time will tell……
   • bbfloyd 1.1

     17 May 2012 at 12:16 pm

     don’t be a puffball G…. it’s bloody obvious what the answer is to that…. despite government assistance, and support, translating as newspaper, and television propaganda misrepresenting the reality of talleys actions,,,, those involved with the actuality of this issue are in no doubt whatsoever who is doing the lying here….they are the ones who have to live the reality….

     please don’t insult peoples intelligence by making attempts at misdirection…. a very weak one i must say, but obnoxious for that still…
     • higherstandard 1.1.1

       17 May 2012 at 12:45 pm

       ummmmm

       http://thestandard.org.nz/talley-group-arsehole-managers/comment-page-1/#comment-472652
       • grumpy 1.1.1.1

         17 May 2012 at 1:52 pm

         Oh dear, does that mean this whole post will have to be retracted?????
       • Te Reo Putake 1.1.1.2

         17 May 2012 at 2:04 pm

         Just had a look at HK’s fb page and she is definitely referring to the Shearer visit. Sorry boys, back into your lairs.
2. Tiger Mountain 2

   17 May 2012 at 11:54 am

   Spot on LPRENT. During the Open Country Cheese lockout in 2009 there was a nasty assault on a new delegate who got a sliding office window slammed repeatedly into his head. OCC management claimed workers had released toxic waste into a nearby waterway, unfortunately for Talleys surveillence video did not show this as said workers were not on site at the bloody time of the spill!

   Also during the OCC lockout Talleys went to the trouble of importing some very nasty scab labour from the deep South. Documentary evidence is held by the NZ Dairy Workers Union Te Runanga Wai U on this sorry saga. There was one positive outcome apart from the courage of the workers that tried to unionise that site and get a CEA, the employment court found, in 2011, that the use of scab labour by Talleys at OCC was illegal under good faith bargaining provisions, and Talleys appeal was not even heard due to them pushing their luck a bit too far.

   There seems no dirty tactic this filthy company will not try. No AFFCO or Talleys in my freezer.
   • higherstandard 2.1

     17 May 2012 at 12:17 pm

     Their legs of lamb are a great deal at the moment.
     • tc 2.1.1

       17 May 2012 at 12:26 pm

       Once you pick all the scabs off, mmm num num you can almost taste the union bashing.
       • higherstandard 2.1.1.1

         17 May 2012 at 12:44 pm

         I had a leg last night with the family it was a beautiful piece and very reasonably priced too, enough left over for sandwiches for everyone today as well.

         Do you think the use of the term ‘scab’ to describe people working helps your case against AFFCO ?

         From a medical perspective scabs are a pretty useful response to certain conditions so I’ve often found the term used in a derogatory fashion rather foolish.
         • Uturn 2.1.1.1.1

           17 May 2012 at 1:18 pm

           “… use of the term ‘scab’ to describe people working…”

           lol

           “From a medical perspective scabs are a pretty useful response to certain conditions so I’ve often found the term used in a derogatory fashion rather foolish.”

           I guess so, but only if you accidentally graze your knee. If you have some sort of mental illness where you self-mutilate, a doctor praising the scab while ignoring the cause of injury is probably interested only in profit from consultation fees rather than the health of the patient.

           You’ll of course agree that calling Talley managers arseholes is, in fact, a compliment. From a physiological perspective, an arsehole has a useful function; to free unwanted waste from the body and necessarily distributing shit on anything arbitrarily below it. Think of the Unions as a wet-nurse and employment relations law as a nappy. Would you agree that anyone trying to lower the quality of nappy would be a bit foolish? Shitty bummed babies with faulty nappies is not a healthy prospect for any community.
         • Psycho Milt 2.1.1.1.2

           17 May 2012 at 2:09 pm

           Do you think the use of the term ‘scab’ to describe people working helps your case against AFFCO ?

           The use of a particular word neither helps nor hinders the case against AFFCO’s management (which is usefully described further down the thread as “…managerial ideological stupidity at its absolute worst”). The term ‘scab’ is however a term in common use for workers who assist employers with strike-breaking, so what’s your complaint?
           • bbfloyd 2.1.1.1.2.1

             17 May 2012 at 2:30 pm

             they are just being themselves psycho….. it’s ugly, but short of a firing squad, there’s no cure for that…
             • Tiger Mountain …

               17 May 2012 at 2:43 pm

               Another poster not far from here reminded me of an old obscure pom TV show about a Walter Mitty dreamer type revolutionary in urban UK. Wolfie Smith and the Tooting Popular Front. “come the revolution you’ll be first up against the wall mate. Bop. Bop. Bop.”

               And Talleys have so much obvious hate for workers that is the type of reaction they are helping create.
             • Dan …

               17 May 2012 at 2:46 pm

               I guess you’ll just have to find your own Anders Brevik then bb
           • higherstandard 2.1.1.1.2.2

             17 May 2012 at 2:42 pm

             Yes thats all common knowledge PM, what I was really asking was whether its use as a derogatory term is really useful these days outside of shouting matches, to me its a bit like the use of other perjoratives to describe people such as ‘fenian’ or ‘carpetbagger’.
             • Psycho Milt …

               17 May 2012 at 3:00 pm

               The use of a derogatory term to describe someone actively working against you for financial gain is hardly surprising. That is as true “these days” as it ever was.
         • Pam 2.1.1.1.3

           18 May 2012 at 1:26 pm

           *S*C*A*B* … on the picket line here in Wanganui we refer to the term SCAB as ” Supporting the Company Against your Brothers”.
     • Foreign Waka 2.1.2

       19 May 2012 at 9:42 am

       yep, because some export contracts went south…
3. FeirnessAtWork 3

   17 May 2012 at 11:58 am

   great piece. Slight correction – Helen’s Facebook post is referring to her trip down to Motueka last week with some of the locked out workers – they tried to visit with Mr Talley, but he refused….
   • Te Reo Putake 3.1

     17 May 2012 at 2:05 pm

     No it isn’t. It was posted this morning with a link to the NZH article.
     • Chris 3.1.1

       17 May 2012 at 5:13 pm

       Na Helen Kelly has commented on that link now and clarified that it was at Moteuka when they tried to meet with them.
4. Goober Grape 4

   17 May 2012 at 12:06 pm

   Probably best not to work for them then.
   • Tiger Mountain 4.1

     17 May 2012 at 12:12 pm

     At some subterranean level Goober that might be the case. But in a high unemployment tory govt. environment, which is what encourages Talleys, keeping the pressure on them to pull their heads in is a better option.
5. Goober Grape 5

   17 May 2012 at 12:29 pm

   Knock yourself out, Tiger.

   In fact – drive the bastards out.

   Get rid of ’em all!

   That will show them.
6. lprent 6

   17 May 2012 at 12:47 pm

   I come almost entirely from the management side. In my immediate family there was one grandfather, father, mother, and sister who are/were managers, and mostly around the production and operation side. I think my other grandfather and grandmother were a unionists/union delegates at one stage and foreman /supervisor at others at Crown Lynn. I worked in the family profession of production and operations management for most of a decade (picking up a MBA on the way through) before I started programming for a living.

   I’ve never been a unionist (I may have been in a union in my youth when it was compulsory and I was working as a machine operator) but mostly I’ve always worked under individual salary contracts. My usual natural sympathies are towards the management side (I have met some quite dumbarse union delegates). But I’m not against unions either. It is usually a damn site easier dealing with a union than it is dealing with lots of individual gripes – at least it is if you’re doing a good job as a manager.

   But when I look at anything to do with Talley’s Groups industrial relations I just see managerial ideological stupidity at its absolute worst. Management generated industrial conflict that doesn’t appear to have much of a basis apart from that Talley’s group just doesn’t like unions. Mostly it is a waste of time in terms of productivity of the plant as a whole…
   • ianmac 6.1

     17 May 2012 at 2:36 pm

     Government is developing a Change which allows Management to abandon talks if they have gone on “too long”. I suspect that Talleys are deliberately prolonging this dispute so that the Government can justify the change. Collusion perhaps? Create a problem so that you can “solve” it.
   • DH 6.2

     17 May 2012 at 5:20 pm

     I’ve been mostly management too & agree with lprent. There’s a real master/servant attitude, it’s more than just business with that lot. Owner operators can be hard bastards to work for, they’ve got more at stake than the professional manager, but this mob seem in a class of their own. My sympathies are with the workers.
7. Tiger Mountain 7

   17 May 2012 at 1:10 pm

   Talleys strategy and culture apart from being bullying and unpleasant is also a Lose Lose for NZ
   • wages and job security are reduced for the employees
   • the company brands will take a significant hit from consumers if the AFFCO lockout goes on any longer
   • CEAs and rights at work, freedom of association are ILO principles, union rights are human rights
   • International and national solidarity does work, ask the Ports of Auckland and ACIL
   • HS likes cheap lamb, hardly a basis for supporting union busting, but of course for neo-libs maybe it is! Wah wha, lovely leg and stuck it to those awful lefties! (the unlovely charm of the bourgeoisie)
   • higherstandard 7.1

     17 May 2012 at 1:22 pm

     I don’t support union busting at all in fact my stance is very similar to Lynn’s comment above yours.

     I do however enjoy baiting the occasional commenter like yourself.
     • Tiger Mountain 7.1.1

       17 May 2012 at 1:38 pm

       I somewhat get where LPRENT is coming from. On a strong union job in Auckland years back the employer started engaging retiring people, still with a few years in them, from Papakura military camp in the hope of weakening the site. Big mistake. After a few months the ex army guys became some of the best union members because they were organised, disciplined and most of all did not like waste, inefficiency and being bullshitted by superiors.

       Anyway enjoy your lamb sammies but it is Talley BAN for me.
       • higherstandard 7.1.1.1

         17 May 2012 at 2:43 pm

         As is your right.
8. Psycho Milt 8

   17 May 2012 at 2:11 pm

   It doesn’t matter whether he asked to see them or not. I’d hope that if he did talk to them it would only be to tell them what contemptible shits they are, so there wouldn’t be a whole lot of point to it.
9. acting up 9

   17 May 2012 at 8:11 pm

   Seems that the pathetic managers that the Talleys employ are upset that the next PM doesn’t see them as important enough to talk to. Boo hoo.

   But then, I don’t see the locked out workers getting all pissy because John Key is unlikely to ever meet with them.
10. Rodel 10

    17 May 2012 at 9:05 pm

    Just follow Hone’s advice Don’t buy anything Talleys.
    • M 10.1

      17 May 2012 at 10:45 pm

      Indeed Rodel and ever since I did a paper on industrial realtions in the ’90s where Talley’s featured I have never bought anything from them either – they are complete bastards.

      I think that Lynn’s natural sympathies of being more for management carries more weight when he rightly calls them worst arseholes of NZ managers because I’m sure that for most of them a job as a hump in a car park would be a step up.
      • lprent 10.1.1

        18 May 2012 at 8:18 am

        The quality of NZ managers could do with some improvement. But it is a hell of lot better on average than it was 30 years ago when I started observing the profession.

        I’d expect that it will keep incrementally improving.
      • IcI 10.1.2

        20 May 2012 at 11:27 pm

        & where does it end, this not buying from Corp X.?

        Firstly, remember that for everyone of you & me that do not buy, there are enough sheeple to keep them in business. I’m in search of more than just my purchase power to change this type of behaviour because my voice is not being heard.

        Next, who do I buy from instead? I have to give up some of the (for me) best tasting vegetables in NZ because of crappy management. I already don’t buy Sony because of rootkit CD-ROMS and no disclosure on hacked PlayStation network. Can’t support Apple because of crappy worker factory conditions in China. Apparently The Red Cross don’t use the money you give for a particular cause on that cause. And what about their competitors that we don’t hear from?

        Sites such as http://www.hellopeter.com and http://www.feefo.com are a step in the right direction and social media isn’t there for some of the smaller issues.
11. Jeremy 11

    18 May 2012 at 8:33 am

    I think managers and unions get in trouble when they start thinking they own the jobs. Only customers own jobs.
    • Colonial Viper 11.1

      20 May 2012 at 11:48 pm

      Only customers own jobs.

      Actually, US executive management shipped all their customers’ jobs to China. Their customers ended up with fuck all. 48 million on food stamps.

      As China says these days – all your jobs are belong to us.
12. jingyang 12

    18 May 2012 at 9:39 am

    Back in the days when there was a collective award in the food processing industry and there were yearly award negotiations between the Food Processing Workers Union and the employers (so pre-1991), Talleys were always the last to settle, and would fight tooth and nail against any changes to working conditions or non-wage aspects of the agreement. Because any changes to the award (such as wage increases) were not back-dated to the expiry of the previous award, Talleys would manage to
    ‘save’ themselves a couple of months of increased wages. Every year I was in that union (1982-88) we had to go on strike to get the last employer holdouts (Talleys and Unilever) to sign the new award so it could take effect.
    Talleys have been arsehole employers for a long time.
13. Rodel 13

    19 May 2012 at 3:08 pm

    Nick Smith on some TV interview recently said that the Talley brothers have ‘a disdain for unions’. If a nat (ex) minister says that it all the more reason for Hone’s boycotts.

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