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The return of Kim Dotcom and the Internet Party and the NZ journalist seeking asylum in Russia

Written By: - Date published: 9:34 am, January 2nd, 2017 - 369 comments
Categories: election 2017, elections, internet party, the praiseworthy and the pitiful, you couldn't make this shit up - Tags: ,

For all you conspiracy theorists out there …

Kim Dotcom is thinking of resurrecting the Internet Party and having another go at the elections.

I have some sympathy for him. Even though he is a wealthy businessman with some dubious business practices in his past and even though he gave large donations to John Banks’ mayoral campaign in an effort no doubt to establish credibility I think he meant well.

His treatment by the New Zealand and US authorities was excessive in the extreme. It appears that he had made efforts to comply with copyright laws on his website. Even if he did not he should have been charged with copyright violations. The laying of racketeering charges to provide a pretext to seek his extradition appears to me to have been manufactured.

And Dotcom has a certain amount of shall we say style. Discovering that his data was being monitored by investigating why his super fast broadband connection so he could play games with the lowest possible ping rate was not operating in as pristine a manner as he had expected requires some understanding of the world around him or luck or both.

But his incursion into New Zealand politics did not help the left last time. Sure he wrote a big cheque and gave Mana access to resources it could only dream of. But this did not help. And his moment of truth meeting in the Town Hall was a big fizzer in that the conclusive proof Key knew about him did not appear.  This probably cost the left a couple of percentage points in support. Enough people to make a difference probably then decided to trust the staid predictability of National than the potentially instability of a left wing Government that would have in all likelihood depended on Mana-Internet for enough votes to gain Parliament’s confidence.

So with the greatest respect Kim can I suggest you give this election a miss.  There are big issues that the country needs to talk about, such as child poverty and climate change.  The fewer distractions there are the better.

But I sense there will be a disruption in the force this year …

The question has been asked.  Why did Key resign?  It all seems too strange, too sudden.

The writers at Fairfax think so.  They said this in their recent article on predicted political events for the year:

There will be one more political bombshell in 2017 that will change the course of the election and install Andrew Little as prime minister.

Maybe they were hinting at this.

There is a fascinating story breaking about how a New Zealand reporter Suzie Dawson is seeking asylum in Russia.  I could not work out if this was some sort of early April Fool’s day hoax.  But her twitter feed seems to confirm the contents of this article which sets out why she is doing this.

I must confess that I had not previously heard of her but she did write at Spinbin and the quality of her work is high.  My impression of her taste grew considerably when I saw that she linked to Simon Louisson’s excellent Standard post on the Panama Papers.

But to go full circle she claims that Dotcom predicts two terabytes of Government data will be released this year and the results will be catastrophic for the Government.

According to Dotcom:

Why do you think John Key resigned? This wasn’t about his family. It’s more likely about the next election and 2 terabytes of emails and attachments that were taken from New Zealand government servers. I heard from a reliable source that the Podesta emails seem like cotton candy compared to the amount of disgusting dishonesty the National government will see leaked at the next election. Key must know. He’s taken the parachute. He can’t stomach the kind of embarrassment that Clinton had to endure with daily releases of dirty emails. And this time even his media cronies couldn’t have saved him. The Internet and alternative media of reputable truth-telling websites are taking over. Leaks are the new political reality. Over time this will be the cure against dishonest politicians. They just can’t survive in this new environment of information.

We have been here before and I think that every claim by Dotcom needs to be taken with a rather large grain of salt.  But I suspect that this year will see another level of craziness that will make 2014 look like a walk in the park.

Update: I am satisfied the application for asylum is for real.  This could be the case of the first New Zealand reporter ever seeking asylum to  Russia.

369 comments on “The return of Kim Dotcom and the Internet Party and the NZ journalist seeking asylum in Russia”

  1. tinfoilhat 1

    oh dear …and if I may be so bold 🙄

    ..and I name myself tinfoilhat

    • One Anonymous Bloke 1.1

      Whether there is any substance to Dawson’s allegations or not, I suspect to many people they will be a sideshow. Authoritarian followers will say she “deserves” it. Petty George will wring his hands and say nothing at all over ten paragraphs.

      I wish Kim Dotcom no ill-will, but his involvement isn’t helping to change this shit government.

      Now, if the MSM finds that Bill English made some nasty remarks about Patrick Gower, that will be another thing entirely /sarc.

      Edit: for one thing, Dawson says to Google SSI Corp. Not having much luck there. Perhaps I’m using the wrong search terms 🙄

      • tinfoilhat 1.1.1

        “Now, if the MSM finds that Bill English made some nasty remarks about Patrick Gower, that will be another thing entirely /sarc.”

        LOL..that did put a smile on my face.

      • Draco T Bastard 1.1.2

        Edit: for one thing, Dawson says to Google SSI Corp. Not having much luck there.

        I get quite a few hits on it but across multiple companies.

        https://www.linkedin.com/company-beta/2126236?pathWildcard=2126236
        http://www.ssihoofcare.com/
        http://www.ssi-corp.com/
        https://www.surveysampling.com/
        http://ssitechnologies.com/

        etc.

        • One Anonymous Bloke 1.1.2.1

          Yeah I’m just having trouble matching them up with someone who offers “legal” surveillance services.

          • Carolyn_nth 1.1.2.1.1

            It seems to me that Dawson does a very good job of searching online for relevant material and then critiquing it.

            She does do some of her own interviews – though I don’t think her interview of KDC was all that searching.

            interesting that KDC aligns himself with Donald Trump.

            • One Anonymous Bloke 1.1.2.1.1.1

              Can you find a company called SSI Corp, with a Wellington office, “that explains at length what it is they do and how ‘legal’ it is to do it”?

              All I said was I’m not having any luck matching any of the companies with that name (even “Surveillance Systems Incorporated” doesn’t fit the bill) with the description that Dawson provides.

              • Carolyn_nth

                From the Occupy facebook page there’s a link to an SSI Pacific page that doesn’t work. But I deleted the page from the link, and got the SSI Pacific website.

                It has various pages about what it does, including this one

                It has an office in Wellington.

                this also about them.

              • veutoviper

                To add a little more information to that already found re SSI Pacific:

                The main company is based in Australia

                http://www.ssipacific.com/about-us/our-offices/

                The address of the Wellington office at 203- 209 Willis Street is that of Southmark House – an office building housing a range of businesses and community services.

                In particular, Level 5 houses BW Millar Dean, a Chartered Accountants firm who are the registered office address of many companies, both past and present.

                This seems to be the case for SSI Pacific’s Wellington office as in Oct 2016 BW Millar Dean filed to deregister the SSI Pacific Wellington office.

                http://www.companiesoffice.govt.nz/companies/app/ui/pages/companies/2162266/23479633/entityFilingRequirement

                The Willis Street address set off warning bells to me as Southmark House is the home of a lot of community service providers including the Wellington Community Law Centre, Wellington Rape Crisis, sexual abuse services, Prison Chaplaincy services, amongst others.

                As a result there is a very wide cross range of people in and out of that building constantly. My concerns that the privacy etc of some very vulnerable people might be compromised led me to do the above research.

                • One Anonymous Bloke

                  Looking at the website it doesn’t look too flash: quite a few broken links etc. Perhaps they really are going out of business.

                  • veutoviper

                    I think past tense may well be the truth. Gone out of business.

                    In terms of the Wellington office / SSI Pacific Limited, the deregistration link includes a link to the dissolution resolution dated June 2016.

                    In terms of the main company website, the latest news (two job descriptions) are dated Nov 2014. I am not IT savvy enough to find when the website itself was last updated.

                    I could be a conspirator and suggest that maybe it was short-term set-up to pursue a particular project/objective … LOL

            • One Anonymous Bloke 1.1.2.1.1.2

              Found ’em.

              Funny that a straight Google search didn’t do the trick – I got this link from Occupy’s Facebook page.

    • Tory 1.2

      Yep, paranoia is alive and well, even more remarkable who penned this post, perhaps one too many glasses of Chardonnay with Bomber at Xmas?

  2. Jen 2

    You say that kim dotcom gave mana access to resources- not true. mana did not receive any money from kim dotcom only the internet-mana party benefited financially.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 2.1

      Were people from Mana involved in deciding how to spend it? If the answer to that question is yes, that looks very much like “access to resources”.

    • red-blooded 2.2

      Internet-Mana said at the time that they hadn’t merged into one party; that they were in a working arrangement until the election and that after that they would separate.

      Mana took the cash and lost their integrity. Sorry, but that’s the way I see it.

      I also really hope that Dot Com stays out of the election. His meddling just confused and distracted people last time. The big issues got swallowed up.

      • Colonial Viper 2.2.1

        Mana took the cash and lost their integrity. Sorry, but that’s the way I see it.

        More like Labour, National and NZF were all pleased to work together to get rid of Hone.

        • red-blooded 2.2.1.1

          Oh rubbish – Hone was already gone and Mana were pretty much irrelevant. Let’s remember, too, that he was the one who walked out. Nobody “got rid of him”. The last I heard, he was in talks with the Māori Party to find another way back.

          Sue Bradford was right to walk away when Māna got into bed with Dot Com.

          • Colonial Viper 2.2.1.1.1

            And even with Labour, National and NZ First getting into bed with each other to get rid of Hone, you only managed to beat him by 750 votes.

            Weak.

            Labour was relieved though: Hone in the House was making Labour sound like last century’s centrists.

            • red-blooded 2.2.1.1.1.1

              “And even with Labour, National and NZ First getting into bed with each other to get rid of Hone, you only managed to beat him by 750 votes.”

              1) Who’s “you” in this allegation? Don’t make assumptions about what I wanted, in terms of Mana/Hone in parliament.
              2) Having said that, there’s no basis for this crap anyway. Labour didn’t combine with National and NZ First – they just declined the “cup of tea” suggestion and actually ran their own candidate who – shock, horror – won (by more than 1000 votes, BTW).

              • Colonial Viper

                Who’s “you” in this allegation?

                The temporary unholy alliance of Labour, National and NZ First over Te Tai Tokerau.

                [Labour] ran their own candidate who – shock, horror – won (by more than 1000 votes, BTW).

                Don’t spread fake news. Kelvin Davis beat Hone by just 743 votes. Weak.

                • Clump_AKA Sam

                  Iv spoken with Mana insiders, they said Mana revived 17% of Dotcoms campaign funds which lead Hone to believe he made a mistake. Lots of water under the bridge now. Yet Hones only concern remains the well being of the most vulnerable New Zealanders. So he will again make the case to put some Mana back into parliament.

                  • Colonial Viper

                    Where do you think he will go with the Maori Party, if anywhere?

                    • Clump_AKA Sam

                      Te Ururoa is just as stubborn as Hone. It’s always been the case that talks of a merger comes from grass roots supporters. Mana supporters actively support Marama Fox and Fox supports actively support Mana supporters, during things like treaty hui’s and they often organise amongst themselves.

                      Even the maori party charter says in there some where, it pretty much says one voice for all maori. But the current leadership of the maori party has kind of taken the maori party away from its charter.

                      So a full on merger, not going to happen. At best they’ll agree not to attack one an other (during elections, emphases on during elections) and they’ll want to stand down candidates in Te tai Tokerau/Waiariki/Ikaroa Rawhiti. And that’s a great place to rekindle close relations. Things happen slow in Maoridom so I’ll wait for Hone and Te Uturoa to step down before I start predicting a full on Mana Maori merger

                    • Colonial Viper

                      Thanks for your considered response, Clump AKA Sam

                    • Clump_AKA Sam

                      Any time

                • red-blooded

                  Oops – poor maths on my part. Hardly “fake news” though! You do tend to exaggerate (and squirrel, and obfuscate, and insult, and make assumptions, and and and…).

                  BTW, “you” – 2nd person pronoun – when used in response to a comment posted by an individual – is generally taken as addressing that individual and therefore referring to them (in this case, me).

                  • Colonial Viper

                    I admit that it’s an assumption but I always figured you as being close to the Labour Party hierarchy and that came out in my languaging.

              • swordfish

                “there’s no basis for this crap anyway. Labour didn’t combine with National and NZ First”

                Technically true, but both Key and Peters certainly endorsed Labour candidate Davis shortly before the 2014 Election.

  3. JP 3

    We don’t need this joker distracting voters again with what ever BS is going through his mind, let’s just focus on the real issues because what is what affecting real people not whatever conspiracy is around. The Internet Party is irrelevant along with the Mana, Conservative, they don’t matter, the less we talk about them the sooner they will go away and the few quality people in those organisations might find themselves within a more credible party.

    • Draco T Bastard 3.1

      We don’t need this joker distracting voters again with what ever BS is going through his mind, let’s just focus on the real issues because what is what affecting real people not whatever conspiracy is around.

      The problem with being that the existing parties aren’t addressing the problems. Instead they’re all trying to protect BAU which is nothing but a failure.

  4. invisiphilia 4

    I attended the “Moment of Truth” – having jumped the queue I was the last person to get in before they shut the doors on a long stream of people waiting to still get in. It was a completely surreal experience seeing Julian Assange and Edward Snowdon being live-streamed into the Town Hall. It was certainly disappointing that the bombshell wasn’t dropped there and then, however, if true there are powerful forces at play that probably wouldn’t think twice about making sure a person accidentally falls off a wharf somewhere. Perhaps Dotcom valued his life more than his credibility at that moment.

    As for the election it was great to see someone trying to introduce modern technology into our system of democracy with tools such as the Loomio Policy Forum. Shame that they tried to sidestep some of the political processes really as I have the greatest respect for Laila Harre (very poor choice of Press Secretary though). Also a shame that it undermined David Cunliffe’s campaign in the fact that the media were giving so much air time to the antics of Dotcom…

    We wait with bated breath!

    • mickysavage 4.1

      The sad thing about TMOT is that the information that was released was terrifying but attention to this was completely diverted by KDC’s failure to provide the smoking gun.

      • Carolyn_nth 4.1.1

        Unfortunately, KDC can’t resist grand-standing and putting himself front and centre. He just then becomes the primary focus, rather than the issues.

        – too many wealthy guys with big egos, and a certain amount of media savvy, trying to get themselves some political power.

        The information about the NSA spying in NZ should still be getting a lot of media attention. instead we get a GCSB-5eyes able to spy more freely on NZ ers.

        • Draco T Bastard 4.1.1.1

          Unfortunately, KDC can’t resist grand-standing and putting himself front and centre. He just then becomes the primary focus, rather than the issues.

          That and his naivety. He simply didn’t have a clue as to how politics works.

          • One Anonymous Bloke 4.1.1.1.1

            At one point he claimed to have realised his brand is toxic. Obviously that lesson didn’t stick.

      • infused 4.1.2

        And him sitting there giggling like an idiot.

    • Wayne 4.2

      Invisiphilia,
      If you believe the NZ govt goes around killing its opponents then I guess you would believe anything.
      For instance take the latest Kennedy theory. Apparently Jackie did it.
      By the way the High Court will be handing down the Kim Dotcom extradition decision. But I assume all that will do is lead to an appeal to the Court of Appeal.

      • One Anonymous Bloke 4.2.1

        Dawson’s allegations of serious harassment are not news to anyone who’s been paying attention. Rocky (Lprent’s niece)’s experiences spring to mind. Anne – who comments here – also has a tale to tell.

        My personal experiences are quite mild by comparison. I’m pretty sure I have my gender to thank for that.

        You live a very sheltered life, Dr. Mapp. Either that or you approve.

        • Draco T Bastard 4.2.1.1

          You live a very sheltered life, Dr. Mapp. Either that or you approve.

          Considering his comments in defence of the present government over the years I’d say it was the latter.

        • Anne 4.2.1.2

          OAB is correct Wayne.

          In my case, the harassment and covert malice I experienced were the work of individuals who I have reason now to believe were not part of any NZ government owned and operated entity of the day. However they were conducted in response to false claims by a tiny group (possibly only two) New Zealanders.

          As is/was usually the case where a woman is the target… male members of
          the [male] dominated NZ hierarchy of the day treated my claims with a strong element of derision and disbelief and did not conduct an investigation. Indeed, for a while I became an object of their suspicion too which – speaking metaphorically – felt like having a pot of boiling fat poured onto a deeply infested sore.

          So much for a fair and equitable justice system.

      • simbit 4.2.2

        NZ govts did kill their opponents, though I presume you mean since 1916-ish?

      • millsy 4.2.3

        Oh come on Wayne, you know what goes on in Cabinet, and we all know that you are not allowed to say anything.

      • mosa 4.2.4

        ” If you believe the NZ govt goes around killing its opponents then i guess you would believe anything”

        But this government engages in smearing and destroying its opponents and uses their friends in the media and Cameron Slater to fire the bullets( anonymously) all in the guise of a independent free media.

        And assisted by its corporate friends and the NZ Police force to ramp up the pressure legal or not, just ask Nicky Hagar about what he and his family experienced with the full force of the state by exposing John Key and Nationals political hit squad.

        The Americans of course are there to lend a hand and John Key would have welcomed their input into our internal affairs and change our laws just to appease them, i am sure John would have found it opened the right doors for him.

        And the Cabinet and National caucus stood by and never raised an eyebrow over these and other violations tells us a lot about these MPs who are elected and have sworn to uphold our sovereign laws and democracy.

        A vote for the National party gives you all of the above and more it would seem.

      • Anne 4.2.5

        My bad. A comment @ 4.2.1.2 was meant for you Wayne not AOB.

  5. Carolyn_nth 5

    Hmmm. And, as well as linking to the Standard, in this piece, Suzie Dawson posted an image of one of my tweets – about John key calling Nicky Hager a “left wing conspiracy theorist”.

    But interesting that Dawson also questioned, at length, Key’s role in making NZ a tax haven, including his implication in the Panama Papers. She, and people close to her, also thought there was strong evidence she was being targetted by the GCSB for her role in challenging their activities.

    Bomber reckoned one of the rumours about the reason for JK resigning so strangely, is that a book on the Panama Papers will be released in 2017, and that it is very damning of Key.

    And in advance to any right winger who responds by saying John key is now gone, so such things are of no interest (as they have done before on this site) : history is never disconnected from the present. We need to know about, and understand how the channels of power work. this has significant importance for the future.

    Thant’s my reply to RWers – won’t reply further to such diversions.

    • David C 5.1

      The perfect seagull posting from Carolyn..

      Fly in, make a lot of noise and shit everywhere…then leave!

    • One Anonymous Bloke 5.2

      Problem is, the alleged book’s alleged author is Ian Wishart – and his “less than zero” credibility rating.

      • Carolyn_nth 5.2.1

        Wasn’t the Ian Wishart book about something different? And it has already been published: it’s about Natural Health products and dietary policy in Australia.

        • One Anonymous Bloke 5.2.1.1

          I think proof of serious corruption – insider trading, bribery and so-on – might have an impact if Police and/or SFO investigations ensue. The SFO was complaining recently that they lack funds and cannot undertake several investigations as a result. Maybe that explains it, but I won’t be holding my breath.

          • Carolyn_nth 5.2.1.1.1

            Are you referring to the Aussie natural health products industry, or to the tax havens issue…. or something else?

            • One Anonymous Bloke 5.2.1.1.1.1

              To the alleged book, and at a wider level, the alleged leak Dawson refers to.

              • Carolyn_nth

                Ah. Ok. Agree. And the problem with Hager’s “Dirty Politics” was that there really wasn’t any in-depth investigations of many allegations made in the book.

                • Wensleydale

                  Funny that. Wouldn’t it be great if political reporters like Audrey Young and Claire Trevett would actually investigate some of this stuff? I mean, if coverage of the political issues of the day is your specialist area, then surely it would follow that this sort of thing would be of great interest to you.

                  But then, I guess it’s just easier to say, “I haven’t read the book, but I’m sure it’s all the fanciful imaginings of a left-wing conspiracy theorist with an axe to grind. John Key said so, and he’s a very nice man who always smiles at me when he sees me in the press gallery.” God forbid you exhibit an inquiring mind, and actually… you know, do your job.

                  I was late to the party when it came to sitting down with a copy of ‘Dirty Politics’, but some of the stuff in that book is utterly stomach-churning. What an absolute pack of bastards.

  6. millsy 6

    The internet party is (regrettably) dead in the water and Dotcom is full of shit.

    Happy to be proved wrong though.

    • Xanthe 6.1

      Hi millsy
      I think you are correct on both counts, BUT It would be foolish to discount the IP on that basis. Watch this space!

      • Olwyn 6.1.1

        In the last election KDC seemed to think that if people knew the half of it they would vote out John Key, but he did not foresee the degree to which other parties would feel compelled to distance themselves. While few on the left would want to deny him legal representation, acquiescing in his political ambitions would have seemed to them a bridge too far, given his controversial relationship with the US. If he has another go he will have a clearer idea of what he is up against.

  7. Wayne 7

    I have read all the links on Suzie Dawson.
    Definitely something unusual going on there. But it won’t be as a result of her journalism as such. Maybe she is a fantasist, and sees this as part of her crusading campaign.
    But in reality the govt could not care less about she writes. It would be like being upset by Bomber Bradbury, why would you bother? I doubt if many politicians have even heard of her.
    Was she one of the 88 surveiled by GCSB. Possibly since most of the 88 related to police requests of GCSB. So maybe the police did ask for her to be surveiled, perhaps not about her, but about someone else. But that is just speculation.

    • Sacha 7.1

      She was very involved in the Occupy movement. That is enough to attract spies.

    • garibaldi 7.2

      Wayne you really do take the cake.
      She is more likely to be rejected by the likes of Hosking and you as a “dirty rotten communist ” and “beneath contempt”.
      Can’t have anyone speaking truth to power can we?

    • One Anonymous Bloke 7.3

      something unusual

      From your perspective, perhaps. In reality, official harassment of activists is nothing new, not to mention stupid and redundant: paranoid authoritarian cops (not to mention your orange leader) pose a far greater threat to the country than peaceniks.

    • Anne 7.4

      Maybe she is a fantasist, and sees this as part of her crusading campaign.

      Thank-you for proving my point @ 4.2.1.2 Wayne.

      Just like women in the past who were raped and tried to report it eh? She’s a fantasist. Attention seeking. If she did get f****d she probably asked for it. Same went for individuals – invariably women but not always – who, for one reason or another, were being covertly harassed and intimidated. Report it and it was likely you would end up being regarded as the culprit or at the least… asking of it.

      • burt 7.4.1

        That’s right Anne, it’s a war between the sexes and we’re stuck in the 70’s & 80’s. Puff up you shoulder pads and buff up the hair, woman can do anything and men are all rapusts. Go sister !

  8. infused 8

    Oh man, you’re an idiot. And i’ll explain why.

    He did not make an effort to remove copyright material. The way his system worked is anything uploaded was hashed. Hashed files which had the same hash were then linked.

    When copyright was reported, only the single internet link to that file was removed, the original has was not. So if a movie had been uploaded 1,000 times, reporting a link only removed ONE of those links, instead of the original hash. The hash should then have been banned.

    This is why he got nailed.

    He tried to twist it and all sorts of shit. Fact is, I implement something similar in one of my websites and it’s not hard. I’m sure mega now removes the original hash, breaking all links to the file. If you read the technical specs behind this whole thing, it’s very easy to see why he’s guilty as sin. He was trying to make it as easy as possible to make the most money as possible. He was only caught because his site was seized so they could see the internal workings which verified what everyone already knew.

    Having sympathy for this idiot is laughable.

    I do hope he stands again. The left will do well.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 8.1

      Therefore copyright infringement is racketeering. M’kay 🙄

      • mickysavage 8.1.1

        +1

      • infused 8.1.2

        Yes. If you read what he was telling copyright holders, and what he was actually doing, then what he said he was doing in emails to his mates, you’d see why.

        They knew a lot of the material was illegal. It was in his emails. They knew that they were removing single links while telling copyright holders the original file was being removed. They knew the longer copyrighted material stayed online, the more cash they made.

        I know it’s hard for you oab, but stop being so stupid.

        • Xanthe 8.1.2.1

          The misrepesentation of MEGA emails was thoroughly canvassed in high court appeal the meaning that emerged was substantially different to what you are presenting here

      • infused 8.1.3

        And what caused this all in the first place is copyright holders found links going to the file megaupload said they had removed.

        It was all lies.

    • Xanthe 8.2

      Infused You dont have a clue. “Deduplication” is a standard function of any cloud storage and was at the time , this was understood by all involved. There was nothing unique or nefarious about the deduplication on MEGA . It is not and should not be the responsibility of the hoster to determine if any particular copy is legit!.

      • infused 8.2.1

        idiot. of course it is. You think Youtube doesn’t have to determine if what is uploaded is legit? Jesus.

        • Xanthe 8.2.1.1

          ” You think Youtube doesn’t have to determine if what is uploaded is legit? Jesus.”

          So you are telling me that youtube proactively determines copyright ownership and license,…… or maby they respond to complaints from license holders in exactly the same manner as MEGA did. Which do you realistically think is more likely scenario?

    • mickysavage 8.3

      Que?

      His business model was to save server space by having only one copy of a e.g. Movie and then providing multiple links to it. Some people had legitimate rights to upload material. Others did not. If a complaint was made the process was meant to break the link. Besides I am not defending the copyright allegation only that it was converted into racketeering charges.

      • Xanthe 8.3.1

        Correct MS except that the deduplication was not a result of any “business model”, rather it is an algorithm built into the OS of any bulk storage. It works like that out of the box, you will be very unlikely to find any bulk storage then or now that does not use deduplication.

        The whole intent of the persecution of dotcom is to move by non legal means the responsibility for upholding copyright from the copyright holder to the file hoster, this is contrary to the law and commonsense but the raid and ungoing harassment of dotcom was largly sucessful in scaring off any filehosters not big enough to take on the MPAA. This should be a concern to voters but many cant see past the cartoon “mr evil” characterization of dotcom

        • Clump_AKA Sam 8.3.1.1

          There is no solution to duplication over the Internet in the physical realm. It would be like banning plants from freely trading photosynthesis with the sun.

        • infused 8.3.1.2

          Again, you don’t know what you’re talking about. It was not the os, and it’s not deduplication.

          The fact is: Kim was telling copyright holders the original file was being deleted. It wasn’t. It was only the singular link going to it. All existing links were not affected. If the file was found to be a copyright breach, the original file should be been removed and the hash banned.

          He said he was doing this when he wasn’t. Again, get a clue.

          • Xanthe 8.3.1.2.1

            No you are wrong infused.. kim was not misleading anyone that anything more than a specific URL was being removed, this claim oft repeated made by crown was comprehensively demolished by evidence presented at high court appeal, (the outcome of which we breathlessly await). Infused please you really need to try and keep up!

            • Clump_AKA Sam 8.3.1.2.1.1

              It should be noted that US prosecutors failed to extradite Kim Dotcom. It turns out Dotcom didn’t actually brake any law. One of Dotcoms defence lawyers once said its like charging the owner of a mall for some one who steals from a shop.

              It also doesn’t help when investigators use illegal methods then lie about it. And as it turns out us authorities only interest in this case was to smash and grab about 50 million in assets.

              • Xanthe

                ” It also doesn’t help when investigators use illegal methods then lie about it. And as it turns out us authorities only interest in this case was to smash and grab about 50 million in assets.”.

                Yes but also to acheive illegally the transfer of responsibility to uphold copyright from license holder to ISP. Having failed (quite properly) to legislate for this they turned to method of “shock and awe” (And with the assistance of NZ govt sucessfully)

                • Clump_AKA Sam

                  Also cloud storage is dangerous to the US in other ways that isn’t acknowledge. I mean encrypting the Internet has huge ramifications to 5i’s who rely on easy access to every ones communication.

                  • Clump_AKA Sam

                    And another thing. Dragon Ball Super (Japanese cartoon) there isn’t an English version, but I can access an English Dub version on YouTube as unposed to subtitled, that’s also illegal and against YouTube algorithms but I can’t get English dub anywhere else. It would be ashame if we allowed the US to bulldoze the industry. Instead I suggest we do what any God fearing capitalist would do and leave it up to the free market.

                    That’s ironic that the home of the free markets would want to shut down free markets

    • mpledger 8.4

      The thing is that the file could have been legitimately uploaded multiple times by the rights holder and had multiple legal links. The rights holder could have links 1-99 as legal links but then complained about the 100th non-legal link (because they lose advertising revenue etc). So, KDC’s company can only delete the link specified and not all the other because he has not way of knowing if the others are legal or not.

      • Xanthe 8.4.1

        Yes ….. Crown made huge bullshit about this and media repeated it ad nausium…. reality was MEGA removed url links as requested end of story. While it may have lacked “pace” the livestream of KDC’s high court appeal was actually a ripping good drama very informative and interesting

  9. geoff lye 9

    All I can say is this election could be real interesting or a nightmare in the making by November we will know.

  10. Colonial Viper 10

    There is a place for the Internet Party in Parliament if they can get their shit together this time around.

    • millsy 10.1

      That’s a pretty big if there, CV.

      • Colonial Viper 10.1.1

        Huge. It will be helpful if Dotcom doesn’t hire Martyn Bradbury again.

        • mosa 10.1.1.1

          Might also be helpful not to incite your crowd to chant “Fuck Bill English” even if most people agree with the sentiment.

          Its having the right marketing and advice clearly lacking in 2014 despite the money and Pam Corkery and her media rants.

          • James 10.1.1.1.1

            I think it’s been well proven that “most people” didn’t agree with the sentiment.

  11. tc 11

    The MSM will be lifting every rock and raking every coal to fuel a year of distractions towards the GE.

    • Xanthe 11.1

      Yes they will as the US media did in promoting Trump in the early primary stage…. The danger is sometimes a distraction can transmogrify into the main event. They play with fire and just lately been getting burnt

      • Carolyn_nth 11.1.1

        If KDC is correct, and there’s a major hack that will be revealed before the elections, then his ego in the election contest would just be a useful distraction.

        • millsy 11.1.1.1

          There is no hack. Its all bullshit. People need to start putting up or go home.

          • One Anonymous Bloke 11.1.1.1.1

            +1

            But Kim Dotcom heard it from a reliable source!

          • Carolyn_nth 11.1.1.1.2

            Yes, I wouldn’t count KDC as a reliable second hand source.

            • James 11.1.1.1.2.1

              I’m sure it’s as reliable as his made up email at the moment of “truth”

              • reason

                James right wing biased opinions are not facts ……… you should stop pretending they are James …

                It just makes you look low class and dirty …..

                A bit like the real fact that you think public toilet sex is good …

                Apart from James posting that factoid here at the standard …… I wonder did he also write of his enjoyment on any public toilet walls ….. with his phone number ?.

                • James

                  Reason.

                  The email that kdc put forward has been labeled as a fake numerous times. It had zero credibility.

                  As for your public toilet sex accusations – well I think that says more about you than me.

                  • One Anonymous Bloke

                    It says that Reason is mirroring your own behaviour back at you and you lack the self-awareness to catch on.

                    • tinfoilhat

                      Disagree – what Reason wrote is the kind of tawdry filth that makes this blog increasingly difficult to read.

                    • One Anonymous Bloke

                      What else would a mirror-image of James reflect than tawdry filth?

                      Personally I don’t mind colourful language and remarks. The deeply held beliefs of right wingers and their useful idiots are far more offensive.

          • mpledger 11.1.1.1.3

            ROTFL – yea, like that’s going to induce anyone to play their cards early.

  12. Hi – thanks for this. Other than indy blogger Robin Westenra, The Standard is actually the first NZ publication that I’m aware of which has referenced my situation.

    Just some notes for clarity –

    1. it’s not in contention that I’ve applied for asylum – it was announced some time ago in this press release: http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PO1611/S00102/new-zealand-journalist-seeks-temporary-asylum-in-russia.htm and a copy of my asylum application certificate has been openly published here: https://twitter.com/HelpSuzi3D/status/796213774072037376

    2. my website suzi3d.com aggregates my long-form journalism & activism history

    3. my documentary ‘Diary of a Person of Interest’ explains the who/what/when/where/why/how of what has happened. You can watch it for free here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KaxGN9WgRU or here:

    (press release about documentary is here: http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/CU1609/S00165/diary-of-a-person-of-interest.htm)

    4. so far three Kiwi activists have stepped forward to back up my claims (I know there is more but I’m referring to three who personally know me and have been interviewed on the record about my case). You can read about that here: https://occupysavvy.wordpress.com/2016/11/26/kiwi-activist-it-is-deadly-dangerous-to-speak-against-the-government/ and here: http://voices.network/blog/index.php/ep-10-occupy-asylum/ (podcast) or here: http://voices.network/blog/index.php/2016/11/15/interview-transcript-occupy-asylum-on-voices-network/ (transcript + source links)

    5. there is also a tumblr account aggregating information about my situation, you can find that here: http://helpsuzi3d.tumblr.com

    6. there is a detailed interview of me published yesterday on We Are Change (NYC); you can read that here: http://wearechange.org/wrc-journalist-applied-asylum-russia/

    Thanks to the vast majority of people who have been really supportive of me and empathetic about what we’ve been through. I’ll keep you posted at the above.

    Suzie

    • Colonial Viper 12.1

      I know several of my friends here in Dunedin have been concerned about your situation. Keep your head held high and we wish you all the best in your future endeavours as a journalist.

    • Penny Bright 12.2

      Here you go Suzette Maree Dawson – directly to your face – as it were:

      As a VERY experienced New Zealand activist for the last 40 years, I have worked with Suzette Maree Dawson, and in my opinion, based on my personal experience – she is absolutely NOT to be trusted.

      The reason, in my considered opinion, why most New Zealanders have never heard of her, is because she has nothing of note to help the NZ ‘99%’.

      Suzette Maree Dawson came to Occupy Auckland with no proven track record as an activist, and in my view, played an extremely disruptive and divisive role.

      I’ll stand on my proven track record as an anti-privatisation / anti-corruption ‘Public Watchdog’.

      Do your own ‘due diligence’ and do your own ‘Google search’.

      I’m speaking as one of two people who were individually singled out by Auckland Council in their legal proceedings against Occupy Auckland’.

      As a ‘lay litigant’ – I defended myself, and worked together with the pro-Bono lawyer (Ron Mansfield) who effectively defended ‘Occupy Auckland’ as a group.

      We successfully won on Appeal in the Auckland High Court.

      http://www.indymedia.org.nz/articles/715

      Occupy Auckland wins Appeal against Auckland Council!
      by Penny Bright

      Thursday, 7th March 2013

      A statement by Penny Bright, an Appellant in her own name, in the Occupy Auckland vs Auckland Council Appeal.
      7 March 2013

      OCCUPY AUCKLAND WINS HIGH COURT APPEAL!

      ___________________________

      Penny Bright

      PROVEN NZ activist with a track record that goes back to 1972, when I helped establish a branch of the Halt All Racist Tours (HART) movement at Kuranui College Greytown.

      (In 1981 – named in PM Rob Muldoon’s SIS list, as a ‘subversive’ arising from the 1981 Springbok Tour.)

      2010, 2013 and 2016 ‘Independent’ Auckland Mayoral candidate.

      2009 – Attendee Australian Public Sector Anti-Corruption Conference.

      2010 – Attendee Transparency International Anti-Corruption Conference.

      2013 – Attendee Australian Public Sector Anti-Corruption Conference.

      2014 – Attendee G20
      Anti-Corruption Conference.

      2015 – Attendee Australian Public Sector Anti-Corruption Conference.

      2009 – Attendee Australian Public Sector Anti-Corruption Conference.

      2009 – Attendee Australian Public Sector Anti-Corruption Conference.

  13. Oh, and an addendum –

    just to be clear, I consistently reported on protest actions and related issues involving, and interviewed members of the Labour Party, the Green Party, the Mana Party and Internet Party. As well as organisations like Greenpeace NZ, Shakti, Palestine Human Rights and many others. I am actually not a member of any of the aforementioned.

    I do however support Dotcom because of the reasons stated in my documentary and also those outlined in my article ‘FVEY vs Kim Dotcom’ which is a must-read for anyone willing to take the time to read the story that they didn’t get from the mainstream media fairy tales surrounding the events of the last general election.

    You can find that article here: https://contraspin.co.nz/fvey-vs-kim-dotcom/ and Kim tweeted this about the article: https://twitter.com/KimDotcom/status/683874899425804288

    Thanks,
    Suzie

    • Xanthe 13.1

      And thanks for this suzie: https://contraspin.co.nz/how-liberal-media-turned-trumps-opposition/
      puts into words what many felt

      • D'Esterre 13.1.1

        Xanthe: “puts into words what many felt”

        Exactly. In this household, we’ve been discussing the issue again. Dawson calls it just how we saw it at the time.

        A couple of days after the election, I remarked to an acquaintance that anyone who had had any lingering doubts about whether the MSM has a liberal bias should have had such doubts laid to rest.

        As to getting media organisations into one room and giving them a piece of my mind, oh, would I love to do that! I’m mighty pleased that Trump’s done it.

        Since the election, I’ve written to various media outlets, expressing my fury at how the campaign was reported. I did this before the election as well: fat lot of notice they took…..

  14. Clump_AKA Sam 14

    I fucken called it. All that has to happen now is the destruction of the National party. When I made my prediction that John Key would destroy the National party seeking his fourth term it was because I thought he was the last of the TPPA infiltrators and that there must be communications between him and transnational corporations. Harper/Abbott/Cameron/Hillary/Key and now Obama are goners all on complete contrast to what mainstream was saying in the lead up to their respective demise.

    5i’s is also about to get new leadership so let’s not take the foot off the throat.

    #BurnAllTPPAPlantsAlive2017. Burn em all

  15. Tiger Mountain 15

    the Internet Party had some innovative ways of attracting young people and democratically developing policy online compared to all the other parliamentary parties

    the way Kunning Kelvin was supported in West Auckland by the LP machine that starved other LECs, and everyone united with Key to attack IMP and Hone smoulders like a stack of burning old tyres in NZ political history

    Dotcom would be well advised to keep his beak out this time though and just donate cash

    • red-blooded 15.1

      “the way Kunning Kelvin was supported in West Auckland by the LP machine that starved other LECs, and everyone united with Key to attack IMP and Hone …”

      A couple of comments:
      1) The “LP machine” is, simply, the Labour Party. All parties have national and local strategies, all deploy their resources where they think they’ll get the strongest result. There’s nothing unusual or “stinky” about this.
      2) Do you remember ANYTHING about the 2014 campaign? Labour certainly did not “unite with Key” – it was a bloody hard-fought campaign and if anything the negative messaging around Key undermined Labour and made the apolitical think Labour were too negative and didn’t have their own independent vision.

      People have to get over the “all united against Hone” thing. Hone stood for reelection. He didn’t win. That’s the thing with elections – MPs don’t have an automatic right to be elected, after all…

      As for the money issue – I just hope Dot Com stays out of it, full stop. We don’t need any “follow the money” scandals on the left.

      • Xanthe 15.1.1

        Well i support the claim that the LP joined with key and MSM to attack dotcom.. thats how it presented to me at the time… I firmly believe that this was major factor in their loss in 2014. more than any other act this demonstrated to voters that they were (and still are) just a slightly different packageing of of the same product as Key.

        • Colonial Viper 15.1.1.1

          Also Hone was somewhat careless in getting distracted from building more turn out infrastructure and campaigning in his own electorate during election year.

        • Leftie 15.1.1.2

          “claim”

          kleɪm
          verb
          1.
          state or assert that something is the case, typically without providing evidence or proof.

          <a href="https://www.google.co.nz/?gws_rd=ssl#q=claim+

          • Xanthe 15.1.1.2.1

            Correct its a “claim” thats why i wrote “thats how it presented to me” . how things appear to voters is important!

            • Colonial Viper 15.1.1.2.1.1

              What fascinates me is the utter lack of curiosity in many of the same people who claim that there is no evidence or proof.

              It’s like they can’t investigate or piece ideas together in their heads without being spoonfed.

              In other words, they don’t really want to know anything outside of their psychological comfort zone, and they intellectualise that as the rational, empirical and evidence based place to recline.

              • Leftie

                Assumptions, more often than not, turn out to be wrong, Colonial Viper.

                • Xanthe

                  ” Assumptions, more often than not, turn out to be wrong, ” yup… brexit, trump, key. often direct observation turns out to be better than theory and focus groups

                  • One Anonymous Bloke

                    Hindsight is 20/20! Stop the press! The trick is the Ken Ring/Zerohedge method: make lots of predictions and some will stick.

              • One Anonymous Bloke

                What fascinates bores me are your projection issues and utter lack of self-awareness.

      • reason 15.1.2

        The greens were the only party which did not join in the combined effort of National + Labour + NZ first to unseat Hone ……… Simon Lusk was also heavily involved in the dirty unholy alliance…..

        “Simon Lusk also claimed on Story he had been instrumental in unseating Mana Party co-leader Hone Harawira in the last election. Unnamed “businessmen” had paid thousands for that, he said. And in conversation with his co-host last Monday, Duncan Garner said money had been paid to get Maori electors to vote in Te Tai Tokerau.” ………….. http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/mediawatch/audio/201779410/dirty-politics-players-back-in-the-frame

        National voters were also given the word to vote for Labours candidate Kelvin Davis …

        The whole thing stinks of very shitty behavior …….

        Who knew that fighting apartheid and wanting to feed hungry kids made Hone such a danger and threat that Labour would team up with the Nats to get rid him ???

        • Leftie 15.1.2.1

          Reason. The word of a National party operative, liar, smear merchant and shit stirrer can be trusted?

          • Molly 15.1.2.1.1

            In terms of election results, ensuring that Hone did not get in, increased the chances of National leading the government.

            This is in line with the leverage used by incorporating ACT, United Future to get more seats than the party vote entitles them.

            Even though the intent may have been different, it is very reasonable to consider that National would not have wanted the Internet Mana Party to get an electorate, as the party vote allocations may well have lost them control of the government.

            • Leftie 15.1.2.1.1.1

              The election result is proof of Simon Lusk’s claims? Was Sue Bradford vindicated?

      • Leftie 15.1.3

        +1 on all of your comments Red- Blooded.

  16. HDCAFriendlyTroll 16

    “I have some sympathy for him. Even though he is a wealthy businessman with some dubious business practices in his past and even though he gave large donations to John Banks’ mayoral campaign in an effort no doubt to establish credibility I think he meant well.”

    Bwahahahahaha hahahahahah, bwahahahahaha , oh god, oh god, oh god.

    “It appears that he had made efforts to comply with copyright laws on his website. Even if he did not he should have been charged with copyright violations. ”

    HAHAHAHAHAHAH, bwahahahahaha, oh god my sides hurt.

    KDC is like Colonel Viper and The Standard. You wonder what he’s still doing here.

    • infused 16.1

      People obviously haven’t read the technical information behind why KDC is being shipped home. If people actually took them time to read through it all, they’d see he is guilty as sin.

      • Xanthe 16.1.1

        You are ignorant! The technical information shows there was never any case to answer!

        And he is not being shipped anywhere any time soon if at all.

        Educate yourself!

      • Colonial Viper 16.1.2

        Guilty for getting in the way of big Hollywood corporates, guilty for getting Hollywood agent Joe Biden on his case, guilty for running systems difficult for the western intelligence services to break.

    • Xanthe 16.2

      Yup some people just wonder, and mock,…. until they are swept away, others seek to understand and adapt.

    • Colonial Viper 16.3

      KDC is like Colonel Viper and The Standard. You wonder what he’s still doing here.

      The people who get it, get it. The people who don’t, won’t.

  17. Hmmmm… external floodlights , internal / external security cameras when you leave home or go to bed , and a couple of trained German shepherds in an enclosed yard.

    And a few nosy neighbors on your side seems to be the necessity here.

    As well as all the recommendations mentioned above by S . Dawson.

    Works well for those established but not necessarily for those lacking permanent digs , I will admit. But nothing like watching those watching you. Always carry a camera and walk up to their face if you’ve got a shadow and have a wee chat.

    ” nice baseball cap you’ve got there”…. ” love that hoodie ”…

    * Hehehe… the G. sheperd is my favorite breed btw . Always had one – or two.

  18. Andrew 18

    People seem to forget that Hone is a raving lunatic with no knowledge of the ideas, principles and history of the Left.

    He simply has a collection of grudges and an occasional half-baked opinion.

    What policies has he come up with that are workable and genuinely social democratic?

    People have lost the connection to the culture of the Labour movement, this is why they are grasping at straws with these desperate tactics.

    Im not commenting on the work Ms Dawson has done on the deep state, I don’t know enough about it. She is certainly a very brave woman.

    I just think people need to acquaint themselves with the way working people have made change in the past. This involves the most effective means of people’s power in history – the social democratic party and the trade union.

    • You are aware that Hone was a public face highlighting the sell off of Glen Innes state housing , are you not?

      In which case I would say he is far more aware of ‘ policy’ and whats going on and with ‘ whom ‘ than you are….

    • Colonial Viper 18.2

      People seem to forget that Hone is a raving lunatic with no knowledge of the ideas, principles and history of the Left.

      Strange and ultimately non-credible character assassination attempt there Andrew.

      Is the right wing so afraid of a true left wing voice like Hone in Parliament that you have to treat the readers of The Standard as idiots?

      • Clump_AKA Sam 18.2.1

        It’s just Andrew trying to use capitalist theory to thought experiment a boost to everything capitalism suppressed or destroyed since the enlightenment

    • Sacha 18.3

      Hone has done a lot of practical work in Northland over many years to improve people’s lives. He has earned significant respect from that.

      • Rosemary McDonald 18.3.1

        “He has earned significant respect from that.”

        Hmmmm…..quite often, in the Far North, the name “Hone” is often accompanied by the descriptive “blowarse”.

        Kelvin Davis seems to command more respect.

        • Clump_AKA Sam 18.3.1.1

          You sound new to northern politics

          • Rosemary McDonald 18.3.1.1.1

            Not at all. Spent much of my time in the Far North over the past five years.

            I was up there during the 2014 General election and the by- election that replaced Mike Sabin with Winston. Held many conversations with locals…

            it seemed to me that the electorate were underestimated by some of the candidates.

            Merely showing up and posturing is not enough. Hooking up with KDC was a singularly bad move for some voters…some chose not to vote for anyone rather than vote for Hone plus Kim.

            When I left in late October…the courtship twixt Hone and the Maori Party was just getting off the ground. Again…Hone might have misread his electorate…the MP are seen by many as being National Party tools, and there is little aroha for Tukuorangi…

            Mind you…I just converse with the ordinary folk. I have no doubt that in the true political circles in the Far North there will be a completely different view.

            • Clump_AKA Sam 18.3.1.1.1.1

              Iv meet many people from Te Tai Tokerau involved with treaty settlements that fall into two groups, those for and against. After years of lived experience it turns out that Iwi entities have more incomin with the crown than the underclass. Simply by settlement money extending disenfranchisement of maori via the tax system that pays police who bash in the skulls of those who say hold up, you took that land under the works act and was meant to give it back when finished but never did. Now you want to pay 1 cent in the dollar compensation. And it turns out that the crown has no jurisdiction up north because the maori land court ruled Nga Puhi never seeded sovereignty.

              We created the treaty of Waitangi with two competing versions that fight for the same resources, now there isn’t enough to go around because we messed up the treaty in the first place. THis contridiction is the source of all this mess.

    • reason 18.4

      …. wanting to feed hungry kids Andrew ???????????

      Fighting injustice ??????????????

      Does your grudge preclude them or something ????????????

  19. Andrew 19

    I am left wing, CV. More left wing than you, judging by your support of Orange Hitler.

    Hone is just a grumpy dimwit. He doesn’t even know what socialism means. Democratic socialists should have nothing to do with him.

    He might be ok as a party member. But I have found that understanding of what it means to be left takes years of study and experience. Only the cream of the crop should lead. Is Harawira anywhere near cream of the crop?

    Listen to Bernie Sanders when he speaks. The man is resolutely on message. He has absolute discipline. Sure, I’m not expecting NZ politicians to be at that calibre necessarily, but Hone is just a thug.

    People in some sections of the left just throw out any sort of sense, they are desperate, they want to believe. So they cling to any old thing that comes along.

    It’s not about being establishment Left or any of that bullshit. That’s not my thing. It’s about just fucking thinking for a second. Can you imagine someone like Harawira in a debate with Bill English? Just use some fucking common sense man.

    • Colonial Viper 19.1

      You claim that Hone is not a true left wing socialist, but you miss out the small fact that he is more left wing than most every other MP in Parliament today.

      I am left wing, CV. More left wing than you, judging by your support of Orange Hitler.

      You’re more left wing than me? Don’t be stupid. You’re an establishment shill, that much is obvs.

      “Orange Hitler?” The term Time Travelling God Emperor is more appropriate.

      Can you imagine someone like Harawira in a debate with Bill English? Just use some fucking common sense man.

      Yes. Hone would easily do better than Andrew Little or James whats his name.

      • Jenny 19.1.1

        Personally CV I would term you a National Socialist, or fascist.

        And before you invoke Godwin’s law on me….. My test for determining if someone is a fascist is a simple one:

        Anyone who commits, or supports the committing of genocide, or mass murder (whatever the pretext)

        In this context it pays to remember CV, that the original German and Italian fascists also considered themselves progressive and even Left.

        But if you are not sure CV, here is a simple test,

        Do you support this –

        • WILD KATIPO 19.1.1.1

          Um ,… Jenny …

          • Clump_AKA Sam 19.1.1.1.1

            The presumption of innocence is the corner stone of any legal fraternity. If it can be proven that a Dictator commits acts of aggression against its opposition then he deserves his day in court and any punishment that jurisdiction see fits. Other wise the whole thing turns into a farce. In extreme cases where the rule of law brakes down and foreign countries hide dictators/terrorists or leader imitators, there is a UN resolution which NZ signed up to that says if any one kills more than ten thousand people we have a responsibility to send soldiers until the threat stops being a threat.

            In fact 5i’s which NZ is a member of does everything possible to keep terrorists out of public courts because they themselves are committing illegal acts.

            My comment: I see people trying to make sense of all this terror business but from a military point of view. This war will go down in history as the single greatest military fuck up in all of history, way worse than the last charge of the light brigade. The only thing we can do now is pull everything out of the Middle East and say sorry, we’ll leave you alone now

            • Colonial Viper 19.1.1.1.1.1

              Jenny hasn’t figured out that she is on the wrong side of history yet.

              • Clump_AKA Sam

                It’s easy to see why when you watch those videos she posts, tugging on the Heart strings. My first bullshit alert went off when the over dramatic music came on. Straight out of fucking hollywood that was.

                I’m mean it’s my belief that journos report facts not appeal to your sense of moral outrage. At least that should throw up red flags for any one. Guess I’ll have to wait a bit more for saner minds to emerge

                • Colonial Viper

                  Millions and millions of dollars have been poured into anti-Assad PR campaigns. Who has that kind of money? Saudi Arabia, Qatar, the Pentagon, the CIA. All want Assad gone.

                  It’s grim that pseudo-lefties can’t even spot the most obvious corporate created propaganda. Another case of illiberal liberal drones.

        • Colonial Viper 19.1.1.2

          Anyone who commits, or supports the committing of genocide, or mass murder (whatever the pretext)

          That would be you of course, for supporting the illegal US/Saudi/Qatar/Turkey sponsored proxy war of regime change against Assad in Syria.

          But, Russia, Iran and China are pretty much bringing it to a close now.

          That should make you happy: the Assad led Syrian Government is secular and far more tolerant of women, ethnic minorities and religious diversity than the foreign funded Islamic Jihadists that you implicitly support.

          • Jenny 19.1.1.2.1

            You haven’t answered the question CV. You openly state your support for the Assad Junta that has been robbing and murdering and torturing the Syrian people for decades, but you won’t be drawn on whether you support the methods they use.

            CV you are either a hypocrite, or you don’t want to reveal to our readers your depravity and that you do support the aerial genocide delivered to the Syrian people by the dictator Bashar Assad.

            • Clump_AKA Sam 19.1.1.2.1.1

              It’s my belief The last two Syrian Elections was over seen by the UN. Assad won both.

              If it was up to me I would offer Assad full immunity and a plush mansion some where in the US in exchange for his immediate resignation, at which point fresh elections held. And I garentee no voter ever votes for a bullet.

              • Macro

                It’s my belief The last two Syrian Elections was over seen by the UN. Assad won both.

                There was an election of sorts in 2014 – the first multiparty election in decades since the Ba’ath party came to power in a coup. Most Syrians were either unable to vote or chose not to vote for a wide variety of reasons (being refugees and unable to reach an embassy in time, polling booths being shelled and bombed, the vote not being held in rebel controlled areas, etc). The EU, the US, and Ban Ki-moon, the UN Secretary General, criticized the election under the circumstance that it was being conducted during a civil war. Brazil, Russia, Iran, and Venezuela supporters of Assard, supported the election.
                It was highly predictable that Assard would have won the election, as anyone opposed was either prevented from voting, or chose not to from fear.

                I entirely agree that the most successful resolution to this ongoing travesty would be to offer him a mansion someplace in the US. The Mar-a-lago Resort springs to mind. Warning – link to Daily Mail.

            • Colonial Viper 19.1.1.2.1.2

              You’re an ignorant chump, Jenny. I support the rule of international law therefore I recognise the Assad led government as the legitimate sovereign government of Syria, and I recognise that the foreign (US/Saudi/Qatar/Turkey) sponsored proxy war against that government as totally illegal.

              So unlike you, I do not support ISIS running their black flag up over Damascus and enforcing salafist Sharia law over Syria, enslaving women, beheading enemies, and burning people alive over the internet as punishment.

              Now let me ask you a question you stupid fool who have learnt nothing from the west turning Libya into a failed state terrorist breeding ground.

              If Assad’s forces were to collapse and he lost control of Damascus to ISIS and Al-Nusra, what do you think would happen next?

              • Jenny

                “If Assad’s forces were to collapse and he lost control of Damascus to ISIS and Al-Nusra, what do you think would happen next?”

                Colonial Viper

                What would happen next, is what had already happened before the genocidal area bombing set out to destroy it, and make life unliveable.

                http://litci.org/en/we-must-understand-syria-as-a-popular-struggle-despite-its-complications/
                ,

                The revolutionaries in Syria who are struggling for freedom are not unlike the revolutionaries in Tunisia, Bahrain, Libya, Egypt, and elsewhere, who oppose both the authoritarian regimes that brutalize them and the fundamentalists who reject meaningful notions of freedom and liberty.

                This popular resistance has been the most neglected aspect of the Syrian uprising. Since the revolution began, Syria has witnessed remarkable levels of self-organization—more than any other country in the region faced with similar circumstances.

                It is true that the uprising’s militarization has impacted this self-organization. Indeed, the war’s evolution has stifled the space for mass demonstrations and civic engagement, which was common during the uprising’s early years. Remnants of the original revolution still exist, however, in the form of democratic and progressive movements, which have consistently opposed all counter-revolutionary elements, including the Assad regime and extremist forces. Far from being dead, these popular forces made themselves and their democratic aspirations known in February 2016. Following the partial cessation of Russian and regime airstrikes, hundreds of civil demonstrations occurred throughout liberated areas of Syria. The chants and flags of extremist forces were notably absent from these protests.

                Among the civic initiatives in Syria, citizen-driven local councils, elected or established on consensus, exist in some regions and provide services to the local population. It is not a coincidence that the free regions of Aleppo and Douma, both run by local councils, are among the most brutalized targets of regime and Russian bombing. That these areas represent democratic alternatives, apart from the regime and fundamentalist movements, is something Assad and his allies fear.

                Local councils are not the only civic organizations that have been established during the conflict. The Syrian Civil Defense, commonly known as the White Helmets, works to save victims of airstrikes and deliver public services to nearly 7 million people. Other popular organizations have also undertaken a range of activities and campaigns around education, health, human rights, and empowering women, to name a few. These include Women Now For Development, Keshk, The Day After Tomorrow, the Fraternity Center, and Raqqa Is Being Slaughtered Silently, among others.

                There has also been a surge of free and democratic newspapers and radio stations in the country, especially in liberated areas. Examples of these include Arta FM, Syrian Media Action Revolution Team (SMART), ANA Press, Enab Baladi, and Souriatna.

                It is imperative for leftists to appreciate these realities, and separate the aspirations of besieged Syrians from those of international and imperialist actors. Approaching Syria from a “bottom-up” rather than “top-down” perspective can help with this.

                I reccomend CV, that you read the whole article contained in the link.

                And you would be mistaken to term me as “ignorant”. At least I have been to Syria.
                In late 2010 I had the great luck and priviliege to be able meet with and talk to the Syrian people and with the Palestinian refugees, (of which there are many in Syria. You may not care for the Palestinians and their cause CV but It is worth noting that the Palestinians and their leadership have sided with the Syrian people against the regime.)

                One of the first civilian areas bombarded by the regime in early 2011 was the Palestinian refugee camp in the Northern Coastal city of Latakia. I had had the privilege of staying with the Palestinians in this refugee camp for 11 days, in October 2010. And on returning home to Aotearoa had to watch appalled as this refugee camp was bombarded by war ships and tanks.

                I can personally vouch for the fact that the regugees would have been completely helpless and defenceless.

                And what was their crime?

                Joining in the anti-regime protest rallies in the nearby city centre.

                (which is only a short bus trip away)

              • If Assad’s forces were to collapse and he lost control of Damascus to ISIS and Al-Nusra, what do you think would happen next?

                You mean, what would happen if the different regional and global powers (Iran and Russia on one side, the Gulf states and USA on the other, and Turkey playing both groups for its own purposes) stopped carrying out a proxy war in Syria and left it up to the Syrians to run things? Who knows, but it would be nice to find out.

            • Win 19.1.1.2.1.3

              Jenny you really need to do some research on this and not read msinstream media propaganda. Syria was/is a secular state. Assad was an ally of yoyr American buddies until he refused he Qatar/US sponsored pipeline through Syria. Then all hell broke lose. If you want to know what’s gping on read Vanessa Beeley or Eva Bartlett – are journos who have been to Aleppo. Your videos show the destruction. But guess what, Assad is fighting the terrorist eg AlQaeda, Al Nusra, ISIS who are holed up in Syria, imprisoning, killing, raping and terrorising the Syrian population in those areas. So called moderate rebels supported by US/MSM still chop the heads off children and do all of the above. What is Assad supposed to do? Leave them be and let them become the govt in Syria? You lady are at this stage uninformed and ignorant of the true Syrian story. Until you go to alternative media for the truth, stop posting those videos of the destruction of Syria, which was instigated byt the West, including The US and NATO countries.

        • BM 19.1.1.3

          Fuck off with this boring Aleppo shit.
          It would be great if you one track nut bars didn’t pollute every thread with the same endless wankery.

          Christ, It’s like the US election all over again.

    • Mike the Lefty 19.2

      Although in 2014 I wasn’t exactly a big fan of Hone, I thought he campaigned rather well, within the limitations put on him in the television style format. He talked reasonably and logically and was respectful of his opponents – not something you could say about some of the others.

  20. Sacha 20

    Yelling “I’m more left-wing than you” does not win elections. Neither does focusing energy on issues that voters are not already warmed up to, no matter how important they may be. That can come after a win.

  21. Andrew 21

    I’ve got no problem with Tikanga Maori. I think you have misunderstood it, however. There’s more to it than ‘direct democracy’.

    I’m interested in abolishing neoliberalism and enacting socialist policies. That requires communication to and understanding of the NZ electorate.

    You can go ranting and raving all over the place in strategies cooked up 1 years out from an election. The left have learnt from last time. Maybe you and your Trump-supporter mate Colonial Viper haven’t. But we have.

    You sound like a GCSB spy, trying to fuck up the movement with flaky bullshit. Maybe you are already a member of ACT. You’re playing into their hands anyway.

    • Clump_AKA Sam 21.1

      Ok if I ignore your last two paragraphs and you ignore my last paragraph we may overt an I’m the most left wing of them all masturbation thread. Iv also been told that I’m right wing. And I am. In that I’m a fiscal conservative.

      A friend from the UK who is clearly left wing rang me once with his left wing problems that included, wages, pension, rent, police. And me being a right wing fiscal conservative replied “you don’t want to boost all that, you want to jail bankers, go for Corbyn.” So that’s me.

      Right now politics and economics is at the stage just before Capernicous created astrology as we know it today, that the earth rotates around the sun. And all the formulas and theories that supported flat earth syndrome is exposed for what it is – junk science. The only things we can keep from old systems are the observations.

      Going forward we’ll see increasing acts of sovereignty all over the globe. We talk competition/free trade/externalities/rule of law but when it comes time to act. Pollies will roll out the unaffordable price and say sorry, can’t afford it. Even though that’s a lie. Hence the increasing acts of sovereignty.

        • Clump_AKA Sam 21.1.1.1

          We have nukes so those rulz stay. Energy prices are crashing which is boosting manufacturing, mining gets a boost. Chilly has the worlds largest deposit of lithium so they’ll be big winners in the next 50 years.

          Companies that successfully intergrate VR goggles into there sales will be the owners of the new world. In the new world it will be conceivable that people will live in 10 square metre apartments with a toilet and shower in one corner and a drone drops off food/laundry and picks up rubbish/laundry.

          Smart phones which complete the VR system are cheap and getting cheaper because manufacturing because the cost of energy to produce these widgets are cheap. And every one can rack up debt like there’s no tomorrow happy in the knowledge that they’ll always have a way of participating in the new world because they’ll have free energy harvested from the sun to feed into there devices.

          It’s not my cup of tea so every day I maximise my earning potential to escape these manufactured wants and figure out how to become a winner out of all this and not a loser.

  22. occupyguy 22

    Suzie Dawson hasn’t done herself any favors with the level of paranoia she is displaying or has displayed in the past.

    I know for a fact at least one of the things she says were ”government spy agencies” was actually just other regular online activists trolling her for being so self-important.

    She is similar to dotcom in that sense. I can’t discount every claim but it just seems so ridiculous that the government would waste that many resources on a low-level widely unknown blogger.

    why would they not put in the same level of harassment to widely known people like Nicky Harger?

    I think she is suffering from paranoid delusions myself. The whole Sabu thing, people had known sabu was an FBI informant way back in 2012-2013. I’m not sure when she was claiming to have an online relationship with him in world of warcraft, it could have definitely just been another person trolling her.

    If you get involved in the anonymous world, or claim to be part of anonymous, you will get trolled by not only anonymous haters, but other anons that don’t like you. some of them are pro-level trolls. There was a movement a while back to try and expose all the fake ego-inflated anons for what they were.

    anyway all the best to her, i think she might do her mental health a favor if she took a break from all this stuff that seems to be making her super paranoid.

    • Clump_AKA Sam 22.1

      This isn’t a medical website and no one should take medical advice from anonymous avatars.

      It’s also well known that GCSB or SIS or what ever actively spies on and interacts with people they suspect of wanting a better system.

      Who ever they are has put in work to disrupt Sues life.

      Sue isn’t claiming she has links with any recently, her supporters are.

      Your concern for her well being isn’t nessecary as no one asked.

      Even a cursory look at publicly available info on this matter highlights the fact you just made up some bullshit.

      Beside, Russia is the largest country by land mass which beats living in an Ecuador embassy.

      John Key has manufactured our first defector and all you can say is woman’s got problem.

      Fuck you

    • BM 22.2

      Yeah, fairly obvious she’s a fantasist

      Hope she gets the help she needs.

      • Clump_AKA Sam 22.2.1

        Any one mocks woman as subject to fainting fits should apologise immediately

        • David C 22.2.1.1

          Why?
          Does she get a free pass because she owns a vagina?

          • Clump_AKA Sam 22.2.1.1.1

            Grow up. It’s what grown ups do.

            • David C 22.2.1.1.1.1

              I pay my taxes and one day I will die.
              Growing up is totally optional.

              Still, why would you think the owner of a vagina should be subject to less scrutiny than the owner of a penis?

              But then, its in the Labour Party constitution, so it must be true!

              [lprent: Enough. Banned 2 weeks for pointless abuse and persistent trolling with no substantive content worth mentioning.]

              • Your actually quite vulgar little cretin , aren’t you , Sam C’s brother…

                So full of your own sense of self importance because ” I PAY MY TAXES ” …

                What are you trying to prove?… that no one else does ? – and you need a medal? The problem is , your type don’t pay ENOUGH taxes.

                And because ” YOU PAY YOUR TAXES ”… does that entitle you to be an ignorant little jerk?

                Nope.

                Here’s a suggestion , Sam C’s brother ,… how about til you grow up you go back into the dunces corner at the back of the class and pay your taxes all by yourself while the rest of us get on with trying to make this a better world.

                AND pay our taxes without making a big song and dance about it .

      • WILD KATIPO 22.2.2

        ^ BM – Sam C and David C’ s cousin.

        Runs in the family , dontcha know…

  23. Nick 23

    A good start to the New Year at the Standard….lots of interesting posts from y’all……….smash the Natz 2017 !! ….and I do hope Shonkey gets his nose rubbed in 2 terabytes of shit….

    • Clump_AKA Sam 23.1

      I’m still waiting for my reply from some right wing guy about his “position on the death penalty for public servants who share state secretes with transnational corporations.” If any remembers that comment/thread/ or his Handel please let me know. I’m still waiting

    • David C 23.2

      Nick. Please catch up, google.com is your friend.
      Key has left the building.

  24. occupyguy 24

    right.

    If Dawson is able to produce any hard evidence any of this happened lets see it. Running a twitter account with anti-government opinions is simply not enough to get that level of harassment in my opinion. If it turns out to be true, and all the claims she has made are true, then we have some seriously insecure people in government.

    Claiming that every negative online interaction you have is government surveillance or paid FBI trolls not only sounds ridiculous it sounds down right silly.

    As for Dotcom and the surveillance nutters. Yes mass collection of our metadata happens, but we’ve all known that for years now. I call them the ”distractionaries” distracting people from the real issues, such as poverty and low wages.

    Dotcom never had any policies on how he was going to help people living in poverty, it was all “look at me, look at me” grand standing politics. Just as bad as the rampant identity politics we see on the left these days.

    Politics isn’t meant to be a game about you or I, it’s meant to be a game about helping though that desperately need it, yet so many are completely willing to bring it down to a personal level and make it all about them.

    • Sacha 24.1

      There are enough ‘seriously insecure’ people in our spy agencies and police. Do tell us more about your involvement with Occupy, guy.

      • Muttonbird 24.1.1

        I’m waiting for further explanation about who on the left is guilty of rampant identity politics.

        Massive problem apparently but I can’t think of anyone.

    • Colonial Viper 24.2

      As for Dotcom and the surveillance nutters. Yes mass collection of our metadata happens, but we’ve all known that for years now.

      No, it’s mass collection of all our electronic communications, both content and metadata.

      If it was just metadata that they were collecting, the NSA would have no need for thousands of square metres of data storage facilities. All the world’s metadata could be stored inside a large 4 car garage.

      This system of mass surveillance is designed to usurp democracy, destroy political opposition, corrupt leadership and install totalitarianism.

  25. Gabby 25

    If kdc can soak up a few nats voters, fine.Otherwise he’s just a distraction and an excuse for the media to ignore labour.

    • James 25.1

      He won’t take voters from the right – it will be green voters he takes (my guess). But only very very few of them.

      He will get Facebook “likes” but that does not equate votes

  26. occupyguy 26

    Sacha so you can personally attack me? is that all you have left? go watch her video and tell me it doesn’t sound crazy. I am not denying some of the stuff she has mentioned happened to her but if all of it was government spy agencies i would be suprised.

    and the “I was more involved with occupy than you were” is a dead argument that presents no substance, in fact it is not even an argument. most of the occupiers discredited themselves by claiming things like the FBI was trying to kill them covertly.

    I don’t think I will ever get the idle KDC worship. He’s no different from Key, a rich businessman.

    • Sacha 26.1

      I was not involved at all with Occupy. What was your relationship? Fair enough if you weren’t impressed.

      • Penny Bright 26.1.1

        I was VERY involved with Occupy Auckland Sacha, and wouldn’t trust Suzette Maree Dawson as far as I could throw her.

        (As I have explained above – in a direct reply to ‘her face’ – as it were.)

        Penny Bright

        Respondent in my own name in the Auckland Council vs Occupy Auckland District Court proceedings.

        A successful Appellant in the Auckland High Court.

        • Sacha 26.1.1.1

          Interesting, thanks.

        • James 26.1.1.2

          Gee penny you don’t half hate other “activists” getting any mention do you.

          First you bagged Chloe now it’s Suzette.

          I’ll make up my own mind as opposed to listing to you self inflated opinions.

          • Penny Bright 26.1.1.2.1

            Wrong.

            I hate BULLSH*T and will call it out when I see it, based on facts and evidence.

            Chloe Swarbrick supports privatisation via Public-Private-Partnerships (PPPs).

            Did you know that?

            Do you agree with privatisation via PPPs?

            I don’t.

            Suzette Maree Dawson, in my opinion and experience, tells lies, is extremely divisive and disruptive, and the fact that her main ‘advocate’ appears to be her mate Ben Cooney (Red Star), who stated on his video covering the 8 December 2012 anti-TPPA protest “There’s Penny Bright – SIS informant”.

            Which was published on the private ‘Occupy Savvy’ website of Suzette Maree Dawson.

            Penny Bright

            • One Anonymous Bloke 26.1.1.2.1.1

              Climate denier hates bullshit. Read all about it.

            • james 26.1.1.2.1.2

              and yet Chloe was more successful than you on her first attempt (you have 40 years of failure) and will go on to better things with the greens. She will end up making a difference.

              You will just keep running for mayor and losing again and again.

            • james 26.1.1.2.1.3

              I love how you always put “in my opinion” as opposed to stating things as fact – gee I wonder why you do that???

              • lprent

                I love how you always put “in my opinion” as opposed to stating things as fact – gee I wonder why you do that???

                I suspect for the completely obvious reason. It is her opinion.

                I love the way that you state the frigging obvious as if it was significiant – gee I wonder why you do that??? (possibly being a Dickhead?)

    • Colonial Viper 26.2

      Trying to discredit a journalist and activist with character assassination and vague smears, what a great pretend leftie you are. Go back to training school.

      • Penny Bright 26.2.1

        Have you read my Indy Media post in full CV?

        I suggest you do.

        Penny Bright

        • Clump_AKA Sam 26.2.1.1

          The left thing to do would be after informing ones self would be to mobilise by organising every concern of the bottom 80% of NZ earners.

          We’ve shared our concerns and received replies. Now it’s time to support each other to act and control leaders.

        • James 26.2.1.2

          I did – a litany of failure.

  27. Pete 27

    I knew of Suzie during and after Occupy. She sadly went off the deep end.

    If you go back and read her twitter feed or watch her doco with a unbiased and rational eye you will see it for what it is: paranoid delusions mixed with a persecution complex and a hefty dose of ego.

    I want those defending her so quickly and easily without ANY actual evidence to come out an state in the open that they honestly believe that:

    – The NZ Govt tried to kill her and her children…twice.
    – That they used high pitched sound generators to harass her in her home.
    – That they broke into her home multiple times to steal her phone even though she has never to my knowledge held or released any classified documents or even hinted she has.
    – That JK’s office got her fired. (ref: Her OIA request)
    – That she is on the FBI’s radar in a serious way….
    – …to the point that someone from the FBI spent 10’s-100’s of hours on Warcraft getting intimate with her and then having multiple instances of cybersex (NB: This is on her website so this is not a nasty reveal) because….I could not even think of a reason…

    Those are just some of her claims and no I am not joking. And I want you to admit that they did that to someone who is so far under the radar very few people have heard of her and her following is barely significant. (to date 1500 followers)
    Those NZ spies must be harassing and trying to kill 1000’s of people if that is the case…or not…

    Let’s be honest here, as far as threats go, Suzie is not up there in the “kill them” bracket – not even close.

    Not expecting any of the zealots to believe me and I could not care less if they do. But feel free to shoot me down and tell me and everyone that you believe everything I have mentioned plus the other claims (again without evidence) I could not remember. Go on, I dare you.

    And no I am not going to id myself so don’t bother. Take it or leave it.

    But the truth is out there. (pun intended.)

    All I hope is that she gets the help she so desperately and obviously needs. Also that the nutters stop enabling this psychosis with their blind support.

    Seriously people: its NOT helping.

    • Well ,… to be fair – we’ve had the Paul White / Citibank affair and the Wellington Trades Hall bombing in this country…

      Google Paul White / Citibank fiasco and you’ll come to Wisharts version. And it does seem likely White was set up.

      briefingroom.typepad.com/files/paradiseconpreview.pdf

      http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion…/Trades-Hall-bombing-tragedy-still-an-unsolved-mystery

      So ,… I wouldn’t get too complacent about ‘ that sort of thing doesn’t happen here in New Zealand’… and surely it is the obligation on all citizens to be informed enough to do something about it. There’s been an awful lot of outright skulduggery that’s gone on behind closed doors in this country. Far too much of it.

      We pay the spooks and we pay the govt out of our taxes – they would be well to remember that.

      We are slaves to no one.

      We the public are the government.

    • Colonial Viper 27.2

      Interesting that Suzie deserves such detailed character assassination and smearing from someone who then glibly also pretends to care about her.

      Nice one Pete, nice one.

      BTW the Russians will be able to figure out her full psychological profile in just a few days, so you needn’t be concerned.

      • Pete 27.2.1

        If you truly care about someone you try to give them the help they NEED, not they help they want. There was nothing in my post that assassinated anyone.

        Enabling this is not helping and while I am sure many consider this their victory lap that proves what they “knew all along” well all I can say to them is:

        There is no proof without evidence.

        And no, those “eye witness” accounts do not prove anything. Go and read them. They are of the same sort of proof as the people on this board agreeing.

      • Pete 27.2.2

        PS:

        The russians have not commented yet – it is still pending.

        But the Russian NGOs have and they have refused to help her as per her donation page.

        She claims it is because of western funding. But the reality is something simpler than that…

  28. occupyguy 28

    Pete, great post. This is one of the biggest problems on the left, especially amongst the younger ones. Blindly believing any conspiracy theory fed to them. I have nothing personal against her.

    i mean the fact that I came out and said it all sounds a bit ridiculous and got attacked for it just shows how venomous some of these people are. the truth is the truth and in this case i think common sense will tell anyone with a brain some things seriously don’t add up here.

    as for identity politics that is a completely different unrelated subject but would love to see a write up here on the standard about it. hasn’t really been debated in NZ as far as i know but is splitting the left over in the states at the moment.

    [lprent: Don’t whine about being ‘attacked’. This site is here for robust debate – see the about and the policy within the behavioural limits set by the moderators. So far all I have seen is people questioning your motivations in attacking Suzie Dawson. That is well within our bounds.

    However if you read the policy, you will find that the behaviour of being a self-evident hypocrite and whining about things that you do yourself is quite likely to draw the attention of moderators to you. Consider this to be your warning. ]

    • Clump_AKA Sam 28.1

      By my standards New Zealand is the best country in the world but Suzzie’s experience is a completely intolerable invasion of personal space and privacy. It’s not new but it is reaching new hights, as more technology develops the repressive systems that our government uses to monitor low level crime and solo mothers to control the population, but commercial institutions use it too. Companies keep records and data of all purchases to try and direct you to do things they want you to do. This isn’t new because it is standard business literature. You find this if you look something up on google or buy something from Amazon, they’re taking information about you, governments do it to and it shouldn’t be done, there should be space for personal life and it’s being invaded.

      There hasn’t been a study on this but my impression is that there’s a generational difference in reaction to this, that younger people are less offended by this than older people, and the accessibility to technology is a great privilege – are living in an exhibitionist culture where people put up anything on social media, we couldn’t have imagined this a generation ago because we didn’t have this kind of access to technology, but it’s now apart of life, every one is supposed to know what every one is doing. It astounds me the necessity to inform of everything that happens. Every where I go half the kids are communicating on devices because you have to keep in contact with people all the time. Every one I know born after the 2000 all complain of fatigue, I check at night and I can see the pale glow of devices and it’s them checking messages of people saying I’m crossing the street. It’s a different mentality and I suspect it may lead to support for invasion of privacy. Which will be very unfortunate I think.

      The concept of private life is declining under the impact of new technologies and private life must be defended. Post grads have unique responsibilities only because they have unique privilege. Privilege interns of access to technology. Privilege responsibility; the more privileged you are, the more options you have, the more responsible you are, the choice is what do you do about it. The problem is indoctrination borrowed from liberal critiques of institutions. If you go back to the 60’s when there was a huge reaction to activism in a liberal period, just opened up a lot of things, a lot of freedom/democracy/participation. That also caused a lot of fear among elites across the spectrum. Towards the liberal end – it was expressed in a book called “The Crises of Democracy” which basically said there’s to much democracy, we’ve got to rain it in. In the book a Harvard professor says “there is a failure of institutions responsible for the indoctrination of the young. The young have to be better indoctrinated in schools, in collages, in churches, in all the rest of the institutions responsible for the indoctrination of the young.” It’s not often said clearly like this but this book wasn’t meant for wide public distribution. But it’s the basic conception that goes way back, as far as one wants to look.

      In modern history it goes back to the first democratic revolution in England’s 1640’s. There was a civil war between parliament and the King, but meanwhile the country got freer, speakers such as MP’s/Academics/socialites distributed pamphlets, most of which promoted very radical movements. This is a frighteningly privileged sector, the people who called themselves the men of best quality, the gentry. The state was appalled by the fact that people said we don’t want to be ruled by a king or parliament, we don’t want any part of your system, we want to be ruled by country men who understand our needs and wants. Not by knights and gentlemen who oppress us. That’s frightening that should never be allowed to happen. The whole history of democratic society in this incident is an attempt to repress, it’s even in the NZ constitution act.

      The idea of freedom to control ones own life is frightening to elites, they say we must indoctrinate the young. What can be done about indoctrination in the 21st century? Well there is an increase in freedom and privilege and it didn’t come about as a gift it was born out of struggle.

    • Colonial Viper 28.2

      of course you got attacked for it, you are thoroughly insincere.

    • Colonial Viper 28.3

      your stinking insincerity deserves attack

      • One Anonymous Bloke 28.3.1

        🙄

        RT’s well-worn megaphone knows all about stinking insincerity. After all, he’s still a member of the NZLP.

        • Clump_AKA Sam 28.3.1.1

          I remember the day I posted a link to the Keiser Report when nobody in New Zealand had a clue what the Keiser report or RT was just 2 years ago. Max Keiser has helped millions understand the complexity of finance scandals and corruption.

          • One Anonymous Bloke 28.3.1.1.1

            So have Michael Lewis and Steve Eisman. Eight years ago.

            • Clump_AKA Sam 28.3.1.1.1.1

              Fair Go is up there. Just so happened to be air on a state broadcaster as well

              • ropata

                Max Keiser is a bit of fun but not to be taken too seriously, he’s spruiking for Putin and gold merchants and bitcoin half of the time, and he has a tendency to give oxygen to fruit loops like Alex jones. At least he had the decency to look embarrassed during that debacle.

                • Clump_AKA Sam

                  As opposed to the establishment (read Paul Krugman) being right about Hillary/Gold/Bitcoin?

                  Actually lets not do this here. I’ll write something up and post some ideas about this in open mic so you can have something to chew on, later.

                  • ropata

                    Max is sensible in the areas where he is knowledgeable – i.e. markets and finance, but his analysis of geopolitical machinations can tend toward the silly.

                    Nice avatar BTW 😛 Hillarump Clintonald?

                    • Pat

                      “Max is sensible in the areas where he is knowledgeable – i.e. markets and finance”…..you mean Stacy?

                    • Clump_AKA Sam

                      (Cl)inton+tr(ump)=Clump

                    • Colonial Viper

                      Max is sensible in the areas where he is knowledgeable – i.e. markets and finance, but his analysis of geopolitical machinations can tend toward the silly.

                      Examples please.

                      Because I think Max and Stacey (yes they are a team) have got geopolitics more right than the New York Times and the Washington Post.

                      Examples:
                      – Brexit.
                      – The deliberate debt subjugation of Greece by Germany.
                      – The TPP as an instrument of US and corporate control.
                      – The Trump phenomenon.
                      – The political and economic case for de-dollarization.
                      – Obama as a pawn of the bankers.

                      Frankly, Max and Stacey should be given equal weight to the WSJ and FT, as well as other mainstream news sources.

                      and he has a tendency to give oxygen to fruit loops like Alex jones.

                      Alex Jones has got it spot on a substantial portion of the time IMO. Roughly 50% give or take.

                      But more importantly Alex Jones identifies truthy angles that do not fit the establishment approved MSM narrative.

  29. Cinny 29

    By crikey it’s going to be a fascinating year, there is much change coming.

    Thanks for posting such interesting information Pete, comments are just as compelling.

    I always felt that Kim had his heart in the right place and genuinely loved NZ and is super switched on re corruption in government and was sick of seeing it happening here so took it upon himself to be proactive about it.
    It’s a real shame that many kiwi’s are simply not into ‘foreigners’ involved too much in our political system. Especially those not in the commonwealth, least is what I see at times, too old school and many are too easily brainwashed by the media machine. And our mainstream media sure has a good crack at controlling and feeding information. All the best Kim, not sure if it’s a good idea or not after last time, but all the best to you and yours.

    Anyways, dang about Suzie Dawson, will have to go exploring a bit, am all for freedom of speech and protection of whistle blowers. Stay safe Suzie, looking forward to learning more.

    Isn’t it interesting in reading comments here.
    Sometimes people are told things which they feel are too strange to be real… all I can say is, weird shit happens all the time, stuff you would not believe, doesn’t mean it’s made up… anyways yet to do my own investigating on said subject.

  30. reason 30

    Destruction of Iraqi town Ramadi http://globalnews.ca/video/2804759/drone-footage-shows-the-extent-of-the-destruction-in-iraqi-town-of-rama

    Destruction of Falluja in Iraq https://www.google.co.nz/search?q=Destruction+of+Fallujah

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/mosul-offensive-latest-isis-destruction-ancient-city-of-mesopotamia-nimrud-a7421036.html

    Destruction of Libya http://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2015/09/30/us-nato-military-alliance-destroyed-libya.-where-next.html

    Destruction of vietnam “Between March 1965 and November 1968, aircraft of the U.S. Air Force had flown 153,784 attack sorties against North Vietnam, while the Navy and Marine Corps had added another 152,399.[105] On 31 December 1967, the Department of Defense announced that 864,000 tons of American bombs had been dropped on North Vietnam during Rolling Thunder, compared with 653,000 tons dropped during the entire Korean War and 503,000 tons in the Pacific theater during the Second World War.[106]” …. ” estimated that approximately 1,000 casualties had been inflicted on the North Vietnamese population per week, or approximately 90,000 for the 44-month period, 72,000 of whom were civilians.”

    Mass slaughter …….” In Indonesia. The most widely accepted estimates are that 500,000 to more than one million people were killed,[4] with some estimates as high as two to three million.[5][6][7″ It was later revealed that the American government provided extensive lists of communists to Indonesian death squads.[11][12][13][14][15] A top-secret CIA report stated that the massacres “rank as one of the worst mass murders of the 20th century, along with the Soviet purges of the 1930s, the Nazi mass murders during the Second World War, and the Maoist bloodbath of the early 1950s” ….

    “The report detailed horrifying details of rape and torture, including accused communists being forced to drink soldiers’ urine, while in other cases victims’ ears were cut off and they were forced to consume them.

    According to the report, other acts of torture included, burning body parts, electric shocks, water torture, pulling out of fingernails and tying victims inside a sack with snakes.

    Indonesian President Joko Widodo has said he will not apologise for the historic atrocity ….. ”

    etc etc etc

    If the west were less corrupt and u.s.a stopped fueling war millions of civilians would not have been killed.

    Syria being the latest example ………….

  31. Wayne 31

    This site is the one that has provided the information that Suzie Dawson was seeing political asylum. Was that wise?

    It is not surprising that the background of the claim has generated the comments that it has. In reality virtually no-one (even commenters on this site) believes that the NZ state acts in a way that generates political asylum claims.

    I don’t know anything about Suzie Dawson, except that such a claim automatically merits skepticism. I am not surprised what I have read in the comments. I expected as much, hence the reason why my initial comment said her case seemed a little unusual.

    Perhaps The Standard should not have publicised her case, because surely the author of this post should have had enough insight to know what might happen.

    • Pat 31.1

      It is not often i agree with you Wayne however i suspect that you and yours bear as much responsibility for creating the conditions where such claims are afforded any possibility of credence

    • Andre 31.2

      Surely the fact that someone has felt the need to seek asylum in Russia, with the stated reason of harassment from authorities in New Zealand, is a topic worthy of public discussion and scrutiny?

      As it turns out, at least one lunatic fringe member of the activist left is raising questions about Dawson’s motivations and credibility (unless Penny’s persona has been very cleverly hacked and spoofed! cue spooky music and video).

      To me, this illustrates how, on the mainstream left, stories get critically examined. Those that don’t have substance then get shelved and moved on from.

      BTW Wayne, now that you’re here, what are your thoughts on the police raid of Nicky Hager’s home and the subsequent gratuitously malicious treatment of him and his family?

      • Penny Bright 31.2.1

        ‘Lunatic fringe member of the activist left’?

        Gosh – do keep up 🙂

        When NBR investigative reporter Karyn Scherer refers to me a as ‘anti-corruption campaigner’ and includes a photo, seems at last some people are ‘getting it’?

        Be interesting to see how concerned about corruption voters are in the 2017 Mt Albert by-election?

        Penny Bright

        ‘Independent’ candidate, 2017 Mt Albert by-election.

  32. Wayne 32

    Pat,

    National has done nothing that would create conditions where a person would seek political asylum. Debate in NZ is as robust as it has ever been. Nothing has changed in that regard.

    In fact New Zealand is a place where political refugees continue to seek asylum.

    On all international measures New Zealand is virtually at the top when is comes to being a free society (rule of law, no corruption, honest police, independent courts, freedom of speech)

    There is now enough out there, on this site, and now on Kiwiblog that indicate the background of the application in Russia. Hence the reason why I said this morning that The Standard should not have mentioned her case. And my post on that point was before I was aware of David Farrar’s post on the issue.

    Did Micky Savage know enough about the circumstances that made it unwise to even post on the issue in the first place?

    Andre,

    As for Nicky Hagar. Well the police have had to pay damages for what seems to be an excessive search.

    • Pat 32.1

      “National has done nothing that would create conditions where a person would seek political asylum. Debate in NZ is as robust as it has ever been. Nothing has changed in that regard.”

      Think you have deliberately misinterepted….the conditions of which i spoke are exampled by the likes of dirty politics, misuse of the intelligence services, politicisation of the public service and a policy of misinformation that culminates in the likes of dodgy sheep deals and police paying precautionary visits to elderly women…..when an administration is constantly exposed operating outside the intent of the law its no great stretch for people to start to assume the worst…..that is the legacy of this government.

      Trust, once it is lost, is difficult to regather.

    • Andre 32.2

      Your comment comes across as “Nicky got paid off so it’s all good”. Reducing it just to money, nothing about principle or making changes to correct things that went badly wrong.

      How about sanctions against those involved in misleading the court in order to obtain the warrant? Y’know, personal responsibility and accountability? How about some simple civics education to the police top brass about the extremely important role ethical journalism plays in maintaining a free and just society? There’s a long list of things I would expect a responsible government to be doing with the police in response to this egregious breach of ethics, that simply doesn’t seem to be happening.

      As I understand it, Nicky has yet to receive damages. He has been awarded an interim partial payment of his out-of-pocket costs. His action against police is ongoing. His daughter has been awarded damages and her case is now closed.

      http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/86374200/nicky-hager-gets-interim-costs-award-against-police-for-illegal-search-case

    • lprent 32.3

      Did Micky Savage know enough about the circumstances that made it unwise to even post on the issue in the first place?

      Huh? Don’t be a fool. This isn’t a government department. There is and should be no expectation about what authors choose to write about so long as it doesn’t exceed the bounds of the law – and none of this post does. It is something that is of interest and worth having a look into.

      Sure I can understand David Farrar creaming his shorts with the post. As a long paid-for sock-puppet for the National party, he has a legitimate interest in smearing people from Labour, the Greens, and anyone else that National and swing voters can get upset about. That is within the bounds of the law and appears to me to have been his long-term secondary interest after squeezing money from National’s bountiful coffers (now supplemented by taxpayers funds).

      Debate in NZ is as robust as it has ever been. Nothing has changed in that regard.

      I’d seriously dispute that and consider that you verge on the level of being dangerously naive for someone in your position. After all you’d probably have also stated a few years ago that the police wouldn’t pay for infiltrators into people exercising the rights to free assembly and protest and inciting them to break laws. Yet we’ve had Rob Gilchrist (and others) do exactly that, reputably complete with monetary compensation when their employment by the police was terminated..

      As for Nicky Hagar. Well the police have had to pay damages for what seems to be an excessive search.

      So far they haven’t paid Nicky Hager anything except some court costs? I suspect that you are indulging in the same kind of mischievous spinning of bullshit that Farrar likes.

      I thought that the only damages were paid to his daughter, someone who wasn’t even subject to the search warrant. That was both a slam dunk, and something that took more than 2 years to get acknowledged. Quite simply the officer in charge should have been prosecuted for that particular misuses of their powers. A monetary payment doesn’t exactly send a message to the police that that kind of shit is something that shouldn’t be tolerated.

      It isn’t enough to state that a search is ‘excessive’ and to leave it at that.

      We trust the police with extraordinary powers and make it so that they are effectively beyond any substantive application of law when they misuse them (the IPCA is simply just a joke). At the least any censure or punishment for that dirty deed should have been transparent and public. If anything did happen, it wasn’t visible to me.

      That kind of quiet sweeping on muck is exactly what fuels the paranoia that many people feel about our police and security services. It provides a dampening effect on debate in this country and has for a long time. Ask almost any activist who is actually trying to change anything. Having a unthinking fool like yourself or Farrar smearing at it is just stupid. But I guess neither of you have been notable for either questioning your society nor doing much to help its slow transformations. Just too lazy I suspect.

      The legal system should provide an effective way to emphasise when the police over-step the mark. Perhaps that is something for the law commission to consider? After all it’d probably be more useful than some of the recent bullshit coming for that quarter.

      • Wayne 32.3.1

        Iprent

        You haven’t answered the question. Did MickySavage know of her circumstances or not?

        Saying you are not a govt department does not excuse you or Micky. If you know a person is vulnerable, then it is plain commonsense not to open that person to publicity that will further harm them. Taking refuge in staying within the “bounds of the law” is not in my view a satisfactory excuse.

        And if you think it it is, then you are the fool here.

        And I stand by my view that nothing has happened in the last 8 years that limits freedom of speech in NZ any more than was ever the case. If you think that then all I can say is that you are being paranoid.

        • One Anonymous Bloke 32.3.1.1

          So the argument has now shifted from “it isn’t happening” to “Labour did it too”.

          Which is odd, since it’s the Police who are being accused of “doing it”.

          I wonder how the ‘quality’ of Dr. Mapp’s arguments is tolerated at the Law Commission, and if so, what value their work is.

        • Clump_AKA Sam 32.3.1.2

          Wayne’s bitching in the face of an article that exposes links between high ranking National party members and transnational corporations and a forign country to collude and extra judiciously arrest a New Zealand citizen in a place America has no jurisdiction. And lost.

          Not to mention Teina Pora’s case. Your very thick Wayne. Foolish actually

        • mickysavage 32.3.1.3

          Short answer for you Wayne I did not know about her until I chanced upon a post saying she had sought political asylum in Russia.

          I thought this made it a fascinating story one worthy of comment.

          How many NZ reporters can you recall seeking political asylum in Russia.

          Besides she put it into the public arena herself. Just read her comments here for the links.

          • BM 32.3.1.3.1

            Do you believe her story MS?

            • mickysavage 32.3.1.3.1.1

              I have no idea BM. But after what has happened over the past few years I know not to rule anything out unless there is conclusive proof.

          • Wayne 32.3.1.3.2

            Fair enough answer. As you say a fascinating story. Though surely you must have thought that there was something more than a little odd about it. At least that was my immediate reaction.

            • mickysavage 32.3.1.3.2.1

              I must also say that this emphasis on her background is somewhat distasteful. The fact she has applied for asylum I thought was newsworthy. The one quote I took from her was the allegation that Dotcom made about the 2tb of allegedly hacked data.

              This claim has been made elsewhere. Whether we like it or not unless it can be conclusively proven to have not occurred and given that Dotcom appears to want to continue to be involved in politics the claim will be made again and will be part of political discourse this year.

              I was very careful to put it in the same context as his moment of truth which I have described as a resounding failure.

              So the newsworthy aspect of Suzie is her application for asylum. In my post the only claim I have her make is one that Kim Dotcom has made already.

              • veutoviper

                The one quote I took from her was the allegation that Dotcom made about the 2tb of allegedly hacked data.

                I have no doubt that there will be people that try to spin this as KDC saying that he had/has this data etc etc.

                On 23 December 2016, following the Investment Watch Blog article, KDC tweeted that he had not said that he had this data; rather that there were rumors about a big leak coming in 2017. “We will see”.
                https://twitter.com/KimDotcom/status/812366096997044224

                Suzie Dawson also confirmed in the Twitter thread that the Investment Watch headline was incorrect, and supported KDC’s clarification.

                Just wanted to record this “for the record”. Yes, there have been times when KDC has not come through ‘with the goods’ claimed – eg MOT.
                OTH he has also proven to be not lying on many occasions.

        • lprent 32.3.1.4

          You haven’t answered the question. Did MickySavage know of her circumstances or not?

          I did answer it. Why would I care? Outside of things that cause this site legal issues, I generally trust the authors to exhibit sense and they seldom fail me. This is all public information put up by the person concerned and raises some issues related to issues that are of public interest to the common weal.

          You on the other hand are appear to exhibiting a trait of diagnosing someone based on what appears to be your own bigoted prejudices. Similarly:-

          Taking refuge in staying within the “bounds of the law” is not in my view a satisfactory excuse.

          The laws are there to define the actual bounds of behaviour for members of this society. What other measure could or should I use for the limits?

          Should I use a standard similar to that used for what passes for moderation in the sewer. The lowest common denominator and group bullying?

          That you have different ideas about ‘propriety’ just makes you another Mrs Grundy who tries to enforce behaviours based on your child implanted bigotry. That’s fine. Just don’t expect me to abide by such simple-minded and badly thought through unwritten ‘rules’. That way is completely stupid.

          If you want to change the rules of society, then do what any activist does and get off your butt and try to get them into public debate rather than trying to do it via leverage, stealth and insinuation. It shouldn’t be hard for you to do it. However to get most law in place, you have to get a wide agreement and then you need to have written it in a way that judges can see how to apply it. Just look at the chaotic fun with the HDCA to see what poorly written legislation does for them.

          For that matter, what business it that of yours why Mickey decided to write this post anyway? Prurient curiosity? An insatiable desire to smear your excrement on every available surface and call it political art?

          And I stand by my view that nothing has happened in the last 8 years that limits freedom of speech in NZ any more than was ever the case. If you think that then all I can say is that you are being paranoid.

          Ah and where did I say that? I think that you are simply seeing what you think I was saying rather than what I was actually saying.

          I guess that is easier for you than looking at reality eh?

          What I said (for memory) was a decade. Most of the really egregious problems with the police and security services happened after they got a pile of more funding in the early 00s and started to come to light from 2005/6 onwards.

          However these were simply expansions of capabilities of what they had been doing from far earlier. Ask any activist from decades ago and they will tell you in detail the infiltration and incitements used by the police and SIS from far earlier. Basically NZ has bugger all real security work. So they practice on anyone who happens to be handy and who they don’t like the opinions of.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 32.4

      seems to be an excessive search

      What weasel words, as though some sort of less “excessive” search would have been just fine. This from a law commissioner, apparently oblivious to the fact that he just validated Pat and Andre’s arguments one hundred percent.

      Seeking to minimise and excuse the criminals who lied to the court to get the warrant in the first place (perjury is still a crime, no matter how many lies right wingers tell themselves) erodes trust in the very institutions Mapp genuflects to.

      Own goal, idiot.

    • mickysavage 32.5

      This site is the one that has provided the information that Suzie Dawson was seeing political asylum. Was that wise?

      Everything in the post was already in the public arena.

      Some sources are here:

      http://robinwestenra.blogspot.co.nz/2017/01/the-new-zealand-journalist-seeking.html?spref=tw

    • Morrissey 32.6

      As for Nicky Hagar. Well the police have had to pay damages for what seems to be an excessive search.

      The harassment of Nicky Hager was not simply “excessive”, it was illegal.

  33. National has done nothing that would create conditions where a person would seek political asylum.

    It does seem like this is a case of a person with mental health problems more than anything else, but you’re going way too far with that statement. Maybe you missed all the news reports, but the current government has done a lot of illegal spying and has passed legislation to make that spying legal in future. That spying tends to be carried out against left-wing political activists to a completely unjustified extent, and harrassment of activists by government agencies (especially the Police) has been well-documented. You point out that the Police have been required to pay damages to Hager – yes, they have, because people donated enough money for a legal challenge. That routine harrassment on behalf of the government is carried out all the time against others who don’t have the means to challenge it.

    So, yes, we don’t have the conditions that justify an asylum request, but let’s not bullshit ourselves that National isn’t spying on and harrassing political activists.

    • BM 33.1

      the current government has done a lot of illegal spying

      I thought most of that stuff was done under Helen Clarks watch?

      • Wayne 33.1.1

        BM,

        You are right about the illegal spying. Most of the 88 cases actually relates to whether the police had the legal right to request assistance from the GCSB, hence the characterisation of it as illegal.

        In fact it is National that has fixed up the oversight of the intelligence services, with a a fully resourced inspector general, a special warrant system, and the Attorney General as Minister.

        • BM 33.1.1.1

          Thanks Wanyne, that’s what I thought, more to do with misinterpretation than anything else.

          Not quite the corrupt police state that some members of the left believe NZ to be.

          • lprent 33.1.1.1.1

            Not quite the corrupt police state that some members of the left believe NZ to be.

            Clearly you haven’t bothered to look very hard. I don’t think that the police or the security services are particularly corrupt. However they are about as unimaginative and deeply suspicious at you are of people who they don’t understand.

            The police and the SIS have some pretty active infiltration operations of activist groups for as long as I have been around. Now that is to be expected. If they don’t have enough information and have cause to suspect that the bounds of peaceful activism might be exceeded, then they do need to gather information that makes them feel confident that is all that is happening.

            However they also have a long history of going far further than that and actively inciting breaches of the law, or simply making up spurious charges to justify the expenses that they are incurring. The problem is that there are virtually no consequences to them doing this even if it is exposed. So they keep doing it with disastrous operations like the complete cockups that they have done in the last decade.

            • Tory 33.1.1.1.1.1

              It was your fuckin ex leader who sanctioned the 2007 Ruatoria Raids, perhaps that’s where the coruption started

              • lprent

                You are being a silly unthinking fool and clearly don’t understand the process or the position of the police. Go and give your brain some exercise. Read the Police Act.

                The government is not in direct operational control of the police. Helen would have been advised in the course of a meeting that the operation was going ahead. She and others at that meeting would have been given some of the (as it turns out) quite spurious ‘evidence’ collected by the police. That evidence, like what was used to obtain a search warrant for Hager, appear to have been mostly suspicion and bugger all any hard evidence. It was also obtained largely outside the laws that actually govern the police, primarily because the police themselves didn’t understand some new legislation.

                You can see that same dull process of educating the police on their limits happening with the Harmful Digital Communications Act where the police lack the skills to determine what is a valid case (for instance this).

              • Clump_AKA Sam

                Who are you to speak about Ruatoria?

              • Tiger Mountain

                what an ill tempered post–it does rather draw attention to the fact that you are also factually wrong as well as rude

            • BM 33.1.1.1.1.2

              Clearly you haven’t bothered to look very hard

              Very true, I was never really that interested or had the time to look deeply into the whole GSCB Dotcom spying incident.

              Which is why I come to places such as this so I can get a bit of a broad overview of what it’s about or what went on.

              The problem is that there are virtually no consequences to them doing this even if it is exposed. So they keep doing it with disastrous operations like the complete cockups that they have done in the last decade.

              The complete lack of accountability has aways been an issue with the public sector, far too many people in managerial positions who don’t have the skills or knowledge to do the job properly as long as their job is safe they don’t care what goes on.

              • One Anonymous Bloke

                Making sure the job is properly managed sounds like the sort of thing “back room” staff do. Perhaps sacking them all was a mistake or something 🙄

        • Psycho Milt 33.1.1.2

          Most of the 88 cases actually relates to whether the police had the legal right to request assistance from the GCSB, hence the characterisation of it as illegal.

          I think it was the fact it was illegal that explains the characterisation of it as illegal.

          In fact it is National that has fixed up the oversight of the intelligence services…

          I guess if you consider retrospectively legalising the illegal spying and extending the government’s ability to spy on its citizens as “fixing” things, it has. The fact that Key put a personal friend in charge of the GCSB and then lied about it tells us everything we need to know about National’s thoughts on “oversight” of the intelligence services.

    • B 33.2

      With people with views the government dont like who then become active politically in some form or another there is a chicken-and-egg problem: what came first, the mental health issues or the spying?

      Because being interfered with by the SIS does drive people nuts. Then, convieniently, they can be called crazy if they continue to speak up.

      What is messed up is how early the government gets onto people they don’t like. They neutralize perceived threats extremely quickly, and that is why they can be said to behave facistically and why their extension of new powers is so frightening. The GCSB, SIS, the Police and other agencies exist to shore up power – even Fijian dictatorships. That the SIS would work with the Mossad, for instance, to destroy the career of people advocating solidarity with various minority groups should be a real worry. The SIS screw with people until they are dead in some instances, but some of their partners regularly kill.

  34. Penny Bright 34

    How many of those defending Suzette Maree Dawson have actually worked with her – particularly at Occupy Auckland?

    I have.

    How many of those defending Suzette Maree Dawson, have done their own ‘due diligence’ and bothered researching via Google, for any evidence of her proven ‘activist’ background prior to her arrival at Occupy Auckland in October 2011?

    As someone who was VERY involved with Occupy Auckland (ask lawyer Ron Mansfield, who, on a pro-bono basis, defended Occupy Auckland in the Auckland District and High Court, while I defended myself as an individually named Respondent – then (successful) Appellant) – I found there were a number of people who effectively came from nowhere to Occupy Auckland.

    What I learned from the Occupy Auckland experience, was to beware of those who come from nowhere, and make a ‘bee line’ for positions that help control the ‘message’ or means of controlling the message.

    ie: Media, (media team), control of Facebook, websites etc.

    The ‘Occupy Savvy’ website was / is the personal website of Suzette Maree Dawson.

    You may find it interesting that someone like myself, who played a significant role, particularly in effectively defending Occupy Auckland (
    albeit in my own name), was blocked from commenting on the ‘Occupy Auckland’ Facebook page?

    Another person, who in my considered opinion, and experience, who is not to be trusted, (who worked very closely with Suzette Maree Dawson at Occupy Auckland and subsequently), is Ben Cooney (‘Red Star’).

    Why do I say this?

    Because, published on the ‘Occupy Savvy’ website of Suzette Maree Dawson, in a You Tube clip covering the December 2012 protest, Ben Cooney says “There’s Penny Bright – SIS informant’.

    What’s the worst thing you could ever say about a political activist?

    In my considered opinion, both Suzette Maree Dawson and Ben
    Cooney are absolutely NOT to be trusted.

    Be warned…..

    ‘Seek truth from FACTS’.

    Penny Bright

    ‘Anti-privatisation / anti-corruption Public Watchdog’.

    Named as a ‘subversive’ in the SIS list released by National PM Rob Muldoon because of my activities opposing the 1981 Springbok Tour.

    • Cinny 34.1

      I absolutely value your opinion Penny, and very much appreciate your insight and comment on this topic, thank you for contributing and sharing your knowledge and your facts and above all your personal experience. Thanks again Penny you are a wealth of information as always.

    • pb is a class traitor 34.2

      It is those who throw rubbish that need to clean their own yard.
      You have zero credibility and are a washed up hack.
      you out any one who dares to have a differing opinion and endanger their liberty .
      you have a track record of throwing people under the bus. Water pressure group. Transparency international and taking monies from auckland taxpayers.

      the worm will turn and [r0b: steady on there. Allowing this comment through but leaving your comments on probation.].

      pb is a nasty piece of work and should be treated as the enemy to critical and rational thought that she is.

      • One Anonymous Bloke 34.2.1

        Useful idiots aren’t the enemy. They’re just tools.

      • Penny Bright 34.2.2

        Really?

        At least I put my name to my posts and back up my opinions with facts and evidence?

        Kind regards

        Penny Bright

        PROVEN ‘Anti -privatisation / anti-corruption campaigner’.

        2017 Mt Albert by-Election Independent candidate.

    • Merlin Blackmore 34.3

      “What I learned from the Occupy Auckland experience, was to beware of those who come from nowhere, and make a ‘bee line’ for positions that help control the ‘message’ or means of controlling the message.

      ie: Media, (media team), control of Facebook, websites etc.”

      Could you please enlighten us all, Penny, as to Chris Glen’s activist background? In fact, any background of his at all? After all, he did hold senior positions on each of the following, critical teams at Occupy Auckland:

      – Council Liasion
      – Finance
      – Media
      – Town Planning

      Didn’t think so; yet you teamed up with him in your failed attempts to take over the Media team, and thus control the message. There goes that argument…

      Everybody starts their activist journey somewhere, and for Suzie (and myself) it was Occupy Auckland. I saw what was happening in New York, and I responded to the global callout. I didn’t know a soul there, but I put my hand up as someone with social media skills and was taken on-board the media team that 1st day. I devoted myself completely to the cause, and I was far more involved than you’d like to think you were, and I personally suffered a great deal as a result of my willingness to call bullshit bullshit, or a cunt a cunt (as I did to your face, and then apologized after much pressure from other occupiers, for the good of the occupation).

      Do you remember why that was? It was because, after weeks of your supposed investigation into the allegations of inappropriate behaviour (offering drugs for sex, consuming drugs on site) against convicted rapist Tipene, we were yet again at another General Assembly where you were defending him, and I stood up and said “Enough! This has dragged on for far too long, he’s been doing XYZ and he needs to go!” You then got right up in my face (after the GA) to berate for me speaking what everyone was thinking (as evidenced by the reception that received at the GA).

      The real activists, the ones who had the experience and dedication to get things done right, like Simon Oosterman, had given up by then because it had just turned into bullshit. Your insistence on managing the Tipene situation (because you knew him) was absolutely the primary factor in these activists’ departures, because it had consumed the entire occupation, and was all anyone could talk about. Do you remember how you also then sent Tipene down to Occupy Wellington?

      You disgust me, Penny, and despite your delusions I’m comfortably in the majority that have had the displeasure of working with you.

  35. rsbandit 35

    This is indeed disturbing. Thanks for posting it.

    I propose that we suspend refugee settlements here as if it’s not safe for Dawson, just how safe is it going to be for someone from an Islamic war zone?

    Seriously, The Standard needs to up its game. This is Bradbury level.

  36. Muttonbird 36

    Suzie Dawson certainly does have some enemies. Two of them in occupyguy and Pete showed up here at The Standard very quickly.

    Jilted suitors, perhaps? I can’t think of another reason for them being so concerned.

  37. Sacha 37

    Greens activist John Palethorpe exhorts us not to rely on some big surprise if the left is serious about winning the election: https://shinbonestar.org/2017/01/03/get-involved/

    If your path to victory requires an external intervention … then you obviously lack the confidence that your political ideas, political party and political representatives can do the job.

  38. Richard 38

    Mickey Savage: Dawson clearly has some problems and you’re reinforcement of her delusions is just making them worse for her and her children. Good work mate.

    • mickysavage 38.1

      Richard did DPF send you over to comment. Reread the post. All of the information was already in the public arena. Given the strange things that happen in election year I am sure this information will resurface and will have an effect.

      And BTW you should not believe everything you read on Kiwiblog. I read it and had major difficulty reconciling it with what I wrote.

      • Richard 38.1.1

        No, I’m not part of a conspiracy against you.

        It might have been in the public arena already but you headline the story with the asylum claim and link to the justification for it without any qualification to how utterly implausible the claims of persecution are. Indeed you’ve framed it as evidence that there might be something to Dotcom’s latest claim that he’ll bring down the govt. Dawson is clearly going to see this as reinforcement for her claims of persecution.

        Do you really think that any of the claims about govt persecution in the wearechange story you linked to are anything but a dangerously overactive imagination? Sounds more like what Antonie Dixon thought was happening to him than a researched Hager book to me.

        • lprent 38.1.1.1

          Hey Richard, are you trying to say that mickey can’t raise this because – nothing?

          I can’t see you state any reason part from that you think there is nothing in it – without giving any reason why.

          You do realize that it makes you look like a unthinking and naive munter?

          Sources for all kinds of information are often rather dubious. That doesn’t mean that they aren’t worth looking into or highlighting

          For instance ona small local scale, I was deeply suspicious about Ben Rachinger when he was muttering on twitter about Cameron Slater paying him to hack information from my servers. I was incredulous that anyone would have been so stupid. However that turned out to be true. Cameron Slater admitted his guilt to the court to get diversion.

          It isn’t hard to find cases where crazy things have been exposed by people who look at first pass to be dubious. For instance I just read some material about the DoD in the US and their LSD experiments. The way that the effects of agent orange got exposed…..

          You simply can’t dismiss people because you think that they are nuts. You have to investigate. Part of that is to put the stories into public so others can have a look at them as well. To dismiss on the basis that you are doing it just makes you look like a fool.

          • Richard 38.1.1.1.1

            I’m saying it’s irresponsible to feed potentially dangerous delusions, which seems a pretty reasonable position even if I wind up getting called names (classy that, you must change a lot of people’s minds with that kind of thing).

            I read a fair bit of Dawson’s stuff before commenting there doesn’t seem to be a single thing that would single her out from any other alt news source (except perhaps her good grammar and spelling). There’s no Winebox or Karen Silkwood reveals there. Where’s the motivation for any party to want her dead and then where’s a skerrick of evidence? Some people support her – that seems to be it. Dismissing claims on the the basis they have no evidential basis seems a pretty solid approach, especially when such claims are so often made by people who need help.

            If you guys think her claims of victimisation are newsworthy, fine. But MS could have simply said Dotcom made his latest claim via Spin Bin, and not encouraged Dawson’s issues any further.

            • lprent 38.1.1.1.1.1

              I’m saying it’s irresponsible to feed potentially dangerous delusions,

              That may be your viewpoint. Hardly convincing when you fail to provide ANY argument or ANY evidence of any harm to support it. In fact it has exactly all of the sincerity and authority that any fool with delusions of grandeur would offer. Perhaps we should follow your advice and not publish you?

              The point is that you offered no reason to back your opinion. Which just makes it far more worthless than the person you were dissing. At least she offered some arguments.

              But I’d expect that you don’t have a single basis apart from a simple level of your silly customs.

              • Richard

                you fail to provide ANY argument or ANY evidence of any harm to support it.

                Fleeing to Russia in fear of your life is obviously a harm. As NZ governments don’t kill journalists, as you and MS know (publish the exposé if you think otherwise – you’ll bring down the government) there’s a clear basis to conclude that Dawson’s is not thinking straight and is suffering harm as a consequence of that. Pretty clear logic. That it’s that straight foward is probably one reason no other media has touched this story, other than Kiwiblog’s mocking.

                Not feeding delusions isn’t a silly custom, it’s decency.

                Anyway time for you to throw some more insults – still not getting me round to your point of view btw.

        • Anne 38.1.1.2

          No, I’m not part of a conspiracy against you.

          And who said you were?

  39. Hi guys. Fascinating to see the spirited debate. Thought I’d clear up a few points.

    1. The fact that the FBI, NSA and CIA spied on people in World of Warcraft is a matter of public record. You can read about that here: http://gawker.com/nsa-and-cia-spied-on-world-of-warcraft-other-online-vi-1479458437 and here: http://news.mmosite.com/content/2011-04-19/fbi_hunting_for_terrorists_in_wow.shtml and here: http://edition.cnn.com/2013/12/09/tech/web/nsa-spying-video-games/

    2. There are countless examples of intelligence agencies attempting to sexually compromise their targets. Recent cases in the UK against the Metropolitan Police undercover agents for doing exactly that have resulted in settlements for the women involved. The Snowden documents outline the JTRIG program by GCHQ, including their precise methodologies for targeting people sexually online and their motives for doing so. The FBI is notorious for such tactics. There are also cases of this on record in New Zealand. It is well established.

    3. The various tactics used to intimidate me are textbook spy tactics, experienced by countless others. You can read about these on Wikipedia: tradecraft https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tradecraft and gas lighting: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaslighting

    4. Attempting to depict me as having a mental illness (which I have zero history of) is also a tactic to discredit me and to dissuade people from looking into the facts.

    5. Since I made my documentary many people have contacted me describing similar experiences. This is by no means a one-off case.

    6. The Twitter account being referred to, with 1,500 followers, is not my main activism account, which had nearly 4,000 followers, and which is in turn followed by accounts that have millions of followers and who follow very few people. I can assure you that the major names who have shared my work multiple times did their own due diligence on me before promoting my journalism. The real significance of my reach was seen in the ‘media resources’ files I would send to major outlets before actions. For example my MoT pastebin – http://pastebin.com/aDSG5Br4 – which was sent to international media only 5 hours before the event, got over 6,000 hits from just a handful of tweets from my account. Given that those are hits by journalists with their own platforms, the actual reach is exponential. My ability to break NZ stories internationally, and my long-form journalism being regularly shared by massive accounts was a major factor in why I was so heavily targeted.

    7. I have never ‘worked with’ Penny Bright. I was not in any of the 5-6 working groups that she inserted herself into at Occupy. I was in only 1 working group. Our media team did initially try to promote her work, as we did for everyone at Occupy. To my knowledge she has never once promoted any of ours. I was the 5th person at Occupy that I am personally aware of, who was smeared relentlessly by her. She attacked members of our media team one by one over a protracted period of time, eventually spending months submitting proposals to attempt to overthrow our entire media team and seize the media assets. She was unsuccessful. Which is why our team still exists. After a year of constant attacks by her our media team released an article detailing her history of abuse of us. You can read that here: https://occupysavvy.wordpress.com/2012/11/05/penny-bright-fails-to-co-opt-occupy-auckland-again/

    8. I note that whenever we do anything, she pastes hateful messages about us all over it. We have never done such a thing to her work or campaigns. We live and let live.

    9. I was not fired from my job. That is a total fabrication. Nor did I ever say John Key had me fired. That is also a total fabrication. I made a request asking if any information existed regarding political interference in my career as there was reason to believe that technology my development team was working on may have been being capitalised on by persons related to the perpetrators of the Dirty Politics scandal. It remains to be seen if that is the case.

    10. To whoever thought no politicians know who I am – I guess you haven’t read the testimonials on my website. Just to name a few I have interviewed Birgitta Jonsdottir twice, Phil Goff, Russel Norman, Marama Davidson twice, Hone Harawira twice, Kim Dotcom twice, Joe Carolan twice, John Minto, among many others. As well as a bunch of media figures and musicians. I covered 50 live protest actions over a number of years and if I had been able to safely remain in New Zealand would still be covering NZ activism to the best of my ability, to this current day. One of my biggest regrets about my situation is that I’m no longer able to do for NZ activism what I was when I was in NZ. I am grateful however to be safe enough to be able to continue my journalism, at least for now.

    Thank you for your time and I am sorry for the nonsense that has been posted by those who desperately wish to keep you from reading my work and confronting the issues raised in it.

    Another thank you to those of you who can see through the mud being kicked up to what is really going on.

    All the best,
    Suzie

    • Sacha 39.1

      7) Interesting link, thank you. Very consistent with the behaviour seen here, even.

    • Anne 39.2

      Well, that response from Suzie Dawson doesn’t come across to me as emanating from someone who is mentally deranged. To the contrary, it comes across as from someone who is both intelligent and very clear headed.

      • Colonial Viper 39.2.1

        The cooly calculated professional concern troll smearing against Suzie of the suddenly turned up commentators was just so frakking obvious.

        Which only increases my suspicions that Suzie has indeed been noticed by the wrong people, as she claims.

        • Anne 39.2.1.1

          +1 CV

        • lprent 39.2.1.2

          It reads more like partly the idiot sewer fringe to me from Kiwiblog, along with a small number of assorted people with grievances about occupy.

          Incidentally Occupy in NZ has to be one of the classically reeking swamps of disorganised activism that I have seen in the last couple of decades. It looked like a pile of people talking past each other.

          Pretty normal for this site. I can’t see any concerted action beyond those.

          • Clump_AKA Sam 39.2.1.2.1

            Sometimes the gutter class brings the best out of me

          • Anne 39.2.1.2.2

            It reads more like partly the idiot sewer fringe to me from Kiwiblog, along with a small number of assorted people with grievances about occupy.

            Yes. On second thoughts I go along with that. Can’t see the pros. doing it. Nothing to gain.

      • Penny Bright 39.2.2

        Did YOU write this wee Hong Kong ‘travelogue’ post Suzette Maree Dawson?

        April 2015?

        How does travelling around the world and writing about your experiences – fit with your having to seek political asylum in Russia because of your being supposedly targeted as an activist?

        Doesn’t quite fit – in my view.

        Other independent thinkers may be asking the same question?

        http://publicaddress.net/speaker/hong-kong-and-the-matrix/#comments

        Since joining the Occupy Auckland media team in 2011, Suzie Dawson has been a driving force behind many social justice and political movement media campaigns and events, including #GCSB, #NZ4Gaza and #TPPANoWay. Her work has been shared internationally including by RT.com, Wikileaks and Business Insider. She is currently traveling the world and writing about her experiences.

      • inspider 39.2.3

        You’re right that the claims of mental instability are unfair. But that does not mean she can’t be an idiot. And idiocy seems the only explanation for an “independent journalist” to seek asylum in a country where the state regularly supports assassination of such journalists.

        https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_journalists_killed_in_Russia

        • Anne 39.2.3.1

          I take your very good point inspider. I guess it depends on the political bias of the journalists/whistleblowers concerned. In the case of this journalist, Suzie Dawson she is only asking for temporary asylum and she claims it was coincidental she happened to be in Russia when the need for asylum became urgent.

          I think we should all refrain from being too judgemental until the facts of the case are better known. I especially direct this piece of advice to those who are rushing in to charge her with mental instability without knowing all the facts. As someone who has been on the receiving end of sociopathic behaviour, I find such a judgement precipitate (and below the belt) at this juncture.

    • Pete 39.3

      And yet not one person I have read so far will accept my challenge of coming out and stating they believe it all…including the 2 attempts on your life and the life of your kids.

      I want someone other than you to come out here on this forum and state explicitly they think the NZ govt tried to kill you and your kids twice. So far they have just accused people who don’t buy a fantastic story without proof of being government spooks or some such – speaks volumes in of itself. I am sure someone will, there is no limit to crazy after all, but I want them to actually go through the process of typing it and hitting submit.
      I mean is it really that much of a crime to ask for evidence of such a thing before swallowing it whole? Are we really this much into the post truth era that this is now something that should be attacked and shouted down? Ironically (or perhaps not) on a left wing forum?
      Try thinking rationally for just a micro second and tell me where such logic will lead? Perhaps so far as to Moscow to seek asylum from the NZ govt?

      And throughout your post as per usual: no actual evidence. Just vague finger pointing, speculation and comments about it happening elsewhere so it must be happening to you.
      The fact that something vaguely similar happened to someone else somewhere else is not evidence. Your personal friends coming out years later and saying that something happened only after you need it for an asylum bid is not credible.
      And I have read all your evidence. From your flight to Germany, then Belarus and then to Russia. From you claiming that the govt sabotaged and ended your 200k per year IT career (again, no proof) which apparently was not being fired which I will concede was my bad – not sure what else that could have meant TBH!?

      I don’t think it all happened. I’ll even concede that some of it MAY have happened but this does not change my point one bit.
      It makes no sense that it could have. Thus the only horrible reality is that you have dived in too deep into this and need to pull up. It happens to many people in many ways. It is not something to be ashamed of. But it is something that needs to be dealt with.

      Suzie, for the sake of your kids if nothing else, you need to stop this and get help. This is not doing you or them any good. And typically this would be none of my business, but this has been very public for a long time and SOMEONE needs to try to call it out instead of enabling it.

      I imagine this will be like shouting into a strong wind, but it is said now.

      And again, a note to all the enablers: Please for the love of god stop it…

      • Muttonbird 39.3.1

        Can we ask why you are so concerned? Can we ask what your relationship to Dawson is?

        First you scoff at the suggestion government security agencies and police would even bother with an unheard-of and irrelevant Dawson, then you claim this has been very public for a long time. Which is is it?

        Referencing her kids in your argument is pretty rank too, imo.

        Then, why demand proof all of her claims are true as if even one is unlikely then so must they all be unlikely? You have admitted some events might be attributable to spy action, and I suggest the rest are attributable to enemy trolls like yourself.

        I suspect it’s like lprent suggested; that the SIS, GCSB, police, and the ninth floor had all been clumsily treading over guidelines and laws in an attempt to shake up the activist scene (and opposition politicians) to show them who is boss. Until, that is, they were pulled up by the opposition, activists, and the few investigative journalists we have left.

        • Pete 39.3.1.1

          That’s right, attack the messenger. Attack the person asking for evidence. Because it could not possibly be something else, right?

          Of course not. Never in a million years would this be something other than a grand conspiracy including the murder of children, right? How could it be?
          And how DARE someone ask for evidence or even suggest that it could be something more benign. How DARE they! Your only acceptable response must be to turn off your brain, blindly accept it and say something completely worthless like “oh my aren’t you brave”.

          You are so right. Sorry, my bad, I will retract everything I have said and just go with what you say.

          Suzie brought her kids into this by using them to try to obtain donations. https://fundrazr.com/helpsuzi3d
          THEY are the main victims here – and not from the government. That is why I care so much. I met them. According to her funding page they are all broke in Moscow, unable to attend school and in danger of being homeless.
          So yes, I care. You and the others, however, appear not to care about what is important here. I did not expect anything else because I have dealt with this sort of paranoid nonsense before and it does not bother me.
          Attack me, insult me and accuse me all you want. It wont change a single thing nor prove me wrong.

          I am not making fantastic claims in public so I am not the one who needs all the evidence. I am just presenting something other than the frothing at the mouth, naive, gullible and ultimately destructive acceptance of this tragic situation.
          And for that I am the evil, nasty government spook? Seriously?

          Grab a mirror.

          The fact that people like you are encouraging this is the most shameful aspect of this.

          • One Anonymous Bloke 39.3.1.1.1

            Most here are skeptical. As opposed to dismissive.

            I note that you cannot tell the difference between (mostly) valid criticism of your comments (such as Muttonbird’s) and a personal attack. Suzie’s comments here are more measured than yours.

            That isn’t evidence of anything either.

            • Muttonbird 39.3.1.1.1.1

              Agree. Quite apart from Dawson’s blogging history elsewhere, the toy throwing here has come from her embittered enemies. That says something.

          • Muttonbird 39.3.1.1.2

            Pete, if you want an example of an hysterical post on this thread, yours tops the list.

            Think about that for a minute.

            • Pete 39.3.1.1.2.1

              I have thought and read about this for many hours.

              I know what I am, what I am saying and am not hysterical in the slightest.

              You think you have won but when this saga comes to its inevitable and tragic end (assuming you are even still paying attention) I want YOU to think about you part in this.

              And all to feed your own personal fanaticism.

              Shame on the lot of you.

    • Penny Bright 39.4

      What utter CRAP Suzette Maree Dawson!

      “….

      8. I note that whenever we do anything, she pastes hateful messages about us all over it.
      We have never done such a thing to her work or campaigns.
      We live and let live.
      …”

      Your mate Ben Cooney (Red Star) describing me as an ‘SIS informant’ while filming the December 2012 anti-TPPA protest that was published on YOUR private ‘Occupy Savvy’ website is a FACT.

      Unlike yourself, Suzette Maree Dawson, or your mate Ben Cooney (Red Star), I was actively involved in opposing the TPPA, as both inside as a ‘stakeholder’ in 2010 and 2012 Auckland TPPA meetings, and outside as a protestor.

      These FACTS can be confirmed with Jane Kelsey, Barry Coates and the Auckland ‘It’s Our Future’ team.

      Unlike yourself Suzette Maree Dawson or your mate Ben Cooney, my track record as an experienced political activist over a range of social justice, human rights and anti-corporate issues goes back over 40 years.

      As the ‘process-server’ who served the witness summonses (on behalf of Graham McCready), which got Kim Dot Com, his lawyer, his former security adviser, and the former CEO of Sky City into Court to give oral evidence in the John Banks trial, I’ve met Kim Dot Com, who has actually been very respectful of my work.

      Keep going Suzette Maree Dawson – your words will continue to haunt and discredit you ….

      Penny Bright

      • One Anonymous Bloke 39.4.1

        🙄

      • Anne 39.4.2

        Please have your tantrum elsewhere Penny Bright. This post is not about you. Bear in mind you are the one who threw allegations around about Ms Dawson – not the other way round.

      • redNblack 39.4.3

        Penny. . You are a world class fool. Thankfully I will never exist in the twisted internal torment you seem to reside in.

        you know nothing about me other than your illusionary world of smoke and monsters.

        You and I are universes apart in every aspect of realiy.

        If you have “truth” and “facts” about my non history in activism and general political things for many, many years before I had the pure dis-pleasure of meeting you and witnessing your meddling, selfish, devisive, baby boomer focused “me, me me” politics and your putrid style of psudo cult of personality , fail brand.

        you are a joke, a tired lonely bitter pungent stench of a washed out age.

        you have dragged my name through your own filth for years. And for what? Oh wait? Thats right. . . Your own self interests and fear of a new generation that dont want to be a “featured malcontent” and new technology that you simply cant dont and wont understand.

        Seriously . . Go lurk in your hovel in kingsland and bitch and moan about how hard done by you are for “having to pay rates” like other workers do.

        Most of all . . Stop harrassing me. Spreding unfounded lies and accusations. You look like a bitter old shrew . . .

        Oh. . . . Wait.

        K thnx bye!

      • Sacha 39.4.4

        Logic fail. Acting against the TPP and meeting Mr Dotcom do not prove or disprove anything about being an SIS informant. You seem to acknowledge it is a charge levelled by someone other than Suzi (no, we do not need her full legal name).

        Occupy movements in more places than Auckland identified a problem with fresh activists being confronted by more established ones. Wonder why the energy died ..

      • james 39.4.5

        You keep going on about the John Banks trial – like it was a success.

        He was acquitted.

        And as for the witnesses you got into court – Dotcom – who was sooo respectful of your work:
        “The court said the memorandum, in which the Crown said it had re-interviewed principal witness Kim Dotcom and his story no longer matched with the one given when Banks was convicted”

        I would say Suzette Dawson has more credibility than yourself.

  40. tinfoilhat 40

    “Another thank you to those of you who can see through the mud being kicked up to what is really going on.”

    i must admit to be one of those that can’t see through the mud that’s being kicked up Suzie, can you give me a very brief precis of what is going on and why you feel you need to apply for asylum in Russia.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 40.1

      The best summation I’ve read is this passage from the WRC article linked in the OP:

      …recent revelations leading to her asylum claim indicate that Suzie Dawson may have been one of at least 88 New Zealanders who were illegally surveilled by the New Zealand spy agencies in conjunction with the NSA.
      In addition to being spied on, she was also targeted for harassment and sabotage and threatened on numerous occasions.

      • Penny Bright 40.1.1

        So Suzette Maree Dawson – did you bother to go through the process to try and find out if you WERE actually one of the 88 New Zealanders unlawfully spied upon by the GCSB?

        Have you / did you request in writing for the GCSB to confirm whether or not you were one of those 88 New Zealanders?

        If not – why not?

        That’s the process to follow – (I went through it myself ).

        Penny Bright

        • One Anonymous Bloke 40.1.1.1

          🙄

          You obviously didn’t bother to read any of the linked articles. No, wait – you did read them and still remain utterly clueless.

        • Xanthe 40.1.1.2

          Were you one of the 88?

  41. rsbandit 41

    Just because spy agencies spy on some people does not therefore mean they are spying on you. Big claims require big proof and there appears to be no substance of spying claims here that has been proven. For example, from your interview “I remember us getting followed around by Auckland Transport vehicles ” What does that mean? Anyone can have an Auckland Transport vehicle following them, because, you know, roadways are single carriage.

    Journalists verify. Gossip bloggers imply. Where on that continuum do you fall, Suzie?

    • One Anonymous Bloke 41.1

      Did you read the WRC article?

      It has been a slow escalation … By the time I received the responses from the spy agencies in September and applied for asylum, my legal advice was that there was a real risk that I may also have my passport cancelled, as had happened to others who have been targeted by the New Zealand and US Governments, and that if it was cancelled, that they would likely wait until I was in transit to do so, leaving me in a legal and physical grey zone…

      My cards and internet banking access were periodically frozen and very difficult to get reinstated. I was stranded with no access to funds several times. Each time, my bank claimed that it was an algorithm doing it and that it was a consequence of the “Anti-Money Laundering and Financing of Terrorism Act”…

      These are substantial claims that can be verified. There are third party interviews that support Suzie’s specific allegations of harassment and so on (linked in the WRC article).

      Not exactly the “big” proofs you mention – and I agree that extraordinary claims require them – but not nothing, either.

      • lprent 41.1.1

        My cards and internet banking access were periodically frozen…

        I regularly wound up with my cards suddenly stopping to work when I am travelling offshore for work. Similarly my internet access to accounts is often a bit fraught when I shift computers.

        It is just the banks looking for changes in patterns and possible fraud. They shut down the access and wait for you to contact them. Needless to say it’d work better if I told them I was travelling before I did it. However in the usual couple of days of madness before I fly (I usually only get a few days of notice of when I’m actually going) I always seem to forget.

        • One Anonymous Bloke 41.1.1.1

          Are you sure you aren’t a person of interest? 👿

          • Tiger Mountain 41.1.1.1.1

            if you have an SIS file, even an inactive one, you will routinely be given extra attention when travelling internationally

          • lprent 41.1.1.1.2

            Oh I am sure that I am. Apart from my rather public opinions, then to do for reasons related to work. But it is like most of the stuff with security systems. Unless you actually want to intimidate and disrupt, then you don’t want to reveal your capabilities.

            However it is more likely to be bank related. Every time I go offshore my finance patterns shift radically.

            • Paul Campbell 41.1.1.1.2.1

              Yes – what lprent said – you should ALWAYS call your bank and tell them before you go travelling.

              I too travel a lot for work with little warning, “call the bank” is right there next to “buy travel insurance” on the list – often it all gets done in Auckland Airport – I hate having to fly to the other end of the country and sit somewhere for 5 hours every time, the sooner we break the AirNZ Auckland airport monopoly thing the better, but it does give me time to get this stuff done.

              (written from China where my cards are working fine thank you very much)

              • lprent

                I am glad that someone else has the problem as well.

                Fortunately I have a company credit card and a company travel policy so I wasn’t bereft. However I’d dumped all other credit cards apart from a debit visa. Worked fine in Hong Kong and didn’t work 12 hours later in Frankfurt when I wanted a coffee and a roll while watching the sun come up.

                I HATE travelling. No useful data on the flight until my 5th flight (on the way back). Then the brand-new plane from Rome to Hong Kong was USD20 for reasonable net access.

                • Paul Campbell

                  Sadly the open source biz seldom springs for company credit cards, or internet on planes, it all comes out of my pocket in the end, one has to make do with what one can – but the main lesson here is to plan ahead and not find yourself penniless far from home. I’ve started to hold on to my yuan/$/yen/euros/rupees/… to make washing up somewhere new easier, that and a collection of subway cards

                  • lprent

                    I am likely to head in the open source in a decade or so. It seems like an interesting way to wind down and I have a few ideas.

                    But I just finished two decades winding up export startups and small firms exploiting new markets and never travelling to customers. It is kind of nice front footing for an exporting corporate for a change. And in this area I need the customer contact. It takes the taste of corporate away..

                    So long as they don’t try tearing me away from the code into the petty and simple business of management we will get along fine. I decided against that during my MBA.

                    • Paul Campbell

                      I feel the same way, I’ve successfully avoided management for so long. One of the great things about the tech biz is that you have to stay up to date, you get to reinvent yourself every 5-10 years, keeps the work interesting.

                      I’ve worked for startups most of my life, and come to decide that a business model that depends on exponential growth is seldom going to be a good one, there a few good models for small sustainable businesses in the tech world, the sort of thing where a bunch of people design something, build it, sell it and simply live off of the proceeds, if you fund stuff with VCs there’s always that vampire standing in the corner waiting for his or her exponential profit curve to kick in, rather than something owned by it’s employees. Sure you give up the negligible chance of becoming a billionaire, but I’m not going to win the lotto either.

                      The few great examples of these sorts of companies do seem to be in the Open Source world, I’ve decided that the kickstarter style thing done right is the way to solve the bootstrap funding problem and avoid the vampire in the corner. Of course you have to work hard to deliver on your kickstarter promises and build a reputation for delivering, and there’s still a funding shortfall between a kickstarter and turning a something into a long term product to deal with, but it’s easier to manage than a banker.

                    • lprent []

                      One of the great things about the tech biz is that you have to stay up to date, you get to reinvent yourself every 5-10 years, keeps the work interesting.

                      Yeah about 20-25% of my ‘work’ time is straight learning. A lot easier with the net around. The learning curve is the main reason that I’m a programmer. I don’t get bored and start a new career. Prior to that it was ‘work as a farm hand – go into the army’ followed by ‘do a BSc in earth sciences – go and work in management’ followed by ‘do a MBA – start programming computers’. When I did a compsci postgrad and started to find myself starting to want to do anything else, I detected a pattern and dropped out to do a coding contract. Been happily struggling ever since.

                      The last decade seems to have largely been about stuffing programs in linux systems on small hardware interleaved with writing data packaging a distribution systems over the net (the actual web and database stuff in the same time has just a hobby done for volunteer work).

                      But I’m starting to get fascinated with just how badly most mobile apps are written. Not iOS for obvious reasons (I really detest having to have a physical Mac Mini on my desk simply to compile code for a iPod). The android NDK has been quite interesting to play with for serious processing. Nice after the the JDK – which was just so damn buggy (just not as bad as those munted ObjectiveC libraries in iOS). And then there are all of those missing applications in the linux ecosphere with those quirky, strange, and generally buggy python place fillers. It isn’t a bad language for glue code. But frankly using mono C# thunked to solid libraries does a more dependable job.

                      Not enough time to play with them all. Makes me almost look forward to not working for work..

              • Xanthe

                Advice from our bank was run your card thru an ATM at airport before departure and on return

                • lprent

                  Umm… From memory I did that at Auckland airport on the last trip before departure. Yep. there is a coffee on the eftpos. It is a debit visa. All goes through the same account.

                  • Xanthe

                    Hmmm dont really know but would ecpect airport ATM to maby be different to airport coffie shop EFT POS …in terms of alerting bank algorithm to impending travel, OTOH perhaps in suzie’s case this would not be the preferred outcome?

                    • Paul Campbell

                      I think that’s a great idea, they can look thru your transaction history and see you went to the airport, went overseas, came back … helps them decide “oh yes she’s out of the country, this restaurant bill in Hong Kong is probably legit”.

                      I went to Burning Man a few years back, stocked up at Home Depot in California on the way. Home Depot had a big break in and lost a lot of cards, mine was used in Miami, my NZ bank cancelled it and replaced it the next day, didn’t cost me anything, it was obvious that I wasn’t where the card was used – that’s a good thing.

                      Of course the GCSB can do all this too should the bank roll over and hand over your details without your permission as Nicky Hager found out …..

      • rsbandit 41.1.2

        “Cards and internet access frozen”? Again a) where is the proof that happened and b) that can happen to anyone. It’s happened to me and had nothing to do with spying and everything to do with security and system glitches.

        “my passport cancelled” – I’m sure there are many reasons for a potential cancellation of passport. What, specifically, was the legal advice and in what context? No, not a retelling of it – the actual documentation.

        “Not exactly the “big” proofs you mention – and I agree that extraordinary claims require them – but not nothing, either.”

        I don’t see any evidence, do you? I see people claiming things to be true. Until some evidence emerges for these very big claims, then the reasonable thing to do is remain skeptical, is it not?

        • One Anonymous Bloke 41.1.2.1

          I’m just saying these are verifiable (eg: the docs you mention) claims. The reasonable thing to do is maintain skepticism even after you’ve seen the evidence.

          • rsbandit 41.1.2.1.1

            Where? What evidence? For what assertion?

            Holes in the roof? Auckland Transport? Some people on WOW got spied on so therefore I’m being spied on? Running from NZ to Russia for protection? Please. It’s just painful.

            Evidence required – and it had better be rock solid.

            [lprent: Evidence is not required for speculation, but it is desired for clear assertions of fact.

            However warnings are required for idiots that insist that they make the rules here. Go and read the policy before I get around to kicking your teeny and inadequate pretensions towards adequate trolling away from my view. ]

            • One Anonymous Bloke 41.1.2.1.1.1

              You will be disappointed if you think you will find “rock solid” evidence of the sorts of crimes Suzie is alleging.

              I haven’t said there is any. Perhaps you need to read what I’ve written again.

              Of the various claims she’s made, some can be verified with documents: eg: the legal and bank advice. That wouldn’t make her case though.

              However, we know for a fact that spies lie, manipulate and break the law. So dismissing Suzie’s allegations out-of-hand is unwise.

            • rsbandit 41.1.2.1.1.2

              Evidence is required for these outlandish claims, else what is the flippin’ point of this thread? Serious question. Fine, ban me.

              “And again, a note to all the enablers: Please for the love of god stop it…”

              Peter is right.

              Please stop enabling.

              • Pete

                “Evidence is not required for speculation, but it is desired for clear assertions of fact.”

                It is “desired” but apparently unnecessary – that in itself speaks volumes. In addition the bar for what is considered fact is so low limbo masters would struggle to make it under.

                I am out at this stage. I came to say something I have been thinking for a long time now as I have read the entirety this tragic saga (unlike many of the “faithful”). That is done.

                I never intended to convince the faithful because I am not an idiot so I know there is no convincing such people.

                But I spoke out and tried which is sadly all I can do at the moment.

                Peace out.

  42. redNblack 42

    Its remarkable how much penny loves to jump on anything and anytime suzies name comes up and then is quick to name others. This is known as “snitch jacketing . Its a dangerous method of attacking others. For a “person” who is so self absorbed and so self important to crow on endlessly about how rightous she is “known activist” , “40 plus years”, (failed) mayoral candidate, endless pain in the bum, tax dodger, supporter of right wing fringe neo conservative ideas .

    Her demonstrated ill will and nasty treatment of others shines thru.

    Personally I have been harassed, name called and followed, have been filmed and photographed she has filmed and photographed my son, my friends.

    I would urge penny to fade away and stop embaressing her self. . As we do seek truth from facts. These being that penny is dangerous and not to be trusted! And the facts are anyone who targets any others who disagree and drags their name thru the mud and publish them again and again and again obviously are unhinged and pure nasty , toxic “people” that should be avoided

    • Penny Bright 42.1

      Gosh – this wee rant sounds rather like ‘Red Star’?

      🙂

      I’ll stand and be judged on my proven track record.

      Suzette Maree Dawson’s reply again confirms why, in my considered opinion, she is absolutely NOT to be trusted.

      You may note that Suzette Maree Dawson was not individually singled out for prosecution by Auckland Council in the Occupy Auckland Court proceedings, (as I was) and was not involved in our successful Appeal.

      Beware folks!

      Things and people are not always what they seem…..

      ‘Seek truth from FACTS’.

      Kind regards

      Penny Bright

  43. ropata 43

    Some very interesting speculations that may become a MSM story. Suzy3D is obviously a lot more rational than the pestilential Penny Bright.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 43.1

      Suzie’s claims invite skepticism. Penny’s invite sympathy at best.

      • Sacha 43.1.1

        Penny commenting on the Kiwibog thread linked below: “The, in my opinion, phoney Suzette Maree Dawson” – casting doubts on somebody’s identity is hardly charming behaviour.

  44. Red 44

    I suggest a few people here including Suzie go and watch the movie “a beautiful mind” Also check your roof for leaks, borer tend to like moist timber

    • ropata 44.1

      Still selling all that “positive thinking” and blind faith in “progress” and unbridled capitalism to lead us all to a grand utopia?

      Don’t let annoying things like climate change or global finance collapses (or the leaky homes crisis for that matter) bother your pretty little head.

      • Red 44.1.1

        A bit off topic and a long bow on a movie recommendation, you really are a join the dots conpiracy and fun kind of guy Ropata, cheer up and happy a new year by the way 😀

        • One Anonymous Bloke 44.1.1.1

          Leaky homes are a conspiracy? Or feeble smears are the best you can do?

          It’s the second one, eh.

        • WILD KATIPO 44.1.1.2

          ” A bit off topic and a long bow on a movie recommendation,”

          Like this you reckon ?

          • Red 44.1.1.2.1

            Seen it, interestingly the one fingered salute came from this time as the English bowmen rose their draw finger to the French, This was done as an insult by the English who if caught by the French would have finger lopped off ending their days with the longbow So a one fingered salute to you Wk 😀

        • ropata 44.1.1.3

          Having great holiday thanks for asking. Fishing, diving, mountain biking, shooting possums, and smacking down trolls 😉

        • ropata 44.1.1.4

          BTW John Nash’s beautiful mind also enabled him to win the Nobel Prize in Economics. The ability to recognise patterns is a very human skill which mathematicians excel at, and journalists also have to be pretty good at sniffing out.

          Of course self satisfied RWNJ fat cats don’t like critiques of (or even speculations about) the socioeconomic structures that buttress their privilege — in this case a pattern of persecution of an Occupy activist.

          • Red 44.1.1.4.1

            Also the movie highlighted a human weakness (at the extreme) to see patterns where they don’t exist,

            • ropata 44.1.1.4.1.1

              Another weakness (called confirmation bias) is to ignore evidence that doesn’t fit your cosy view of the world.

  45. ropata 45

    DPF’s kiwibog arselickers find all this so amusing, but NZ spy agencies have a sordid history of wrecking people’s lives for political activism.
    http://oasisfromsurveillance.blogspot.co.nz/2015/07/a-quick-look-at-some-spying-gone-wrong.html

    I was at the MOT and there were 3 massive Humvee type vehicles parked directly in front of the Town Hall, plastered with some rather offensive slogans against KDC and the Left in general. Leaning on said vehicles were several large skinhead types — Steve Crow among them I believe — who were clearly just there to intimidate and hopefully create a disruptive scene for the TV cameras.

    Fuck them and their intimidation tactics

  46. Trotskyist 46

    Why is it everyone that doubts her claims gets theatend with a ban? Lol at your ip bans anyway.

    I first came across endarken in 2012 on twitter and was one of the only other accounts tweeting about occupy nz.

    I had no idea who it was but we exchanged a few mentions and I thought whomever it was at the other end was pretty cool.

    Unfortunately due to trolls or my anon status being comprised I had to delete twitter accounts and come back under diff handles.

    For some reason endarken was extremely hostile even though she had been friendly in past.

    I guess this is a symptom of that online world and during those days I got a lot of hate from anti occupy people. I stood up for them against trolls time and time again.

    To be fair I like some of her blogging. I also felt like I was targeted but always used tor so may have made it more difficult to track or intercept.

    I however don’t think every troll was govt funded. Most if not all were just right wing trolls.

    There was definitely some fucked going on though. Someone sent me nudes and pretendEd they were my groupie pretty much in an attempt to compromise me.

    Was this the work of gcsb or nsa trolls?
    Probably not. More likely just a sick individual.

    Ben Rachinger had also been round desperately trying to get validation as a social engineer so I wouldn’t be surprised if there was a lot more fucked execuTed by him we don’t know about.

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