Vid of Nicky Hager talk tonight, Waikato

Written By: - Date published: 9:11 pm, September 8th, 2014 - 32 comments
Categories: blogs, brand key, democracy under attack, election 2014, internet, news - Tags:

Nicky Hager’s talk at the University of Waikato was very well attended. There was spill over into a second room where some people watched the talk on video.  The talk was organised for journalism students.

Hager and his book Dirty Politics

The video livestreamed.  Unfortunately I only caught some of the questions at the end.  However, I will be watching the full video later tonight.

The video of the talk is here.

The introduction of Hager starts at about 21 minutes into the video.

Among the answers I heard to questions put to Hager after the talk, he siad the following:

Key’s friendly relaxed demeanour is fake. He’s actually very ruthless. Hager said its astonishing he’s got away with fake public image for so long.

In response to the politics of discouraging political engagement, encourage change by being role model – let people see you doing stuff.

No-one has taken legal action against Hager because of Dirty Politics.

Hager also said he used the most significant of Rawshark’s hacked material in the book.  So, basically, there’s not anything much more of significance to come out.

32 comments on “Vid of Nicky Hager talk tonight, Waikato”

  1. Saarbo 1

    Also said that the hacker only managed to get a fraction of info that was on Slaters computer.

    Attack Politics is used when there is a big gap between the political parties views and the general publics views.

  2. brian 2

    An extremely good evening. Hager gave a polished speech; and the questions (and responses) were insightful, I’ll watch the speech again from the video above.

    One of his conclusions that has been little discussed is that public servants, and scientists, and even the academics need to have the freedom to be political, after their day job being servants. We have fewer and fewer people involved in politics (attack politics have not helped); and an antidote to the development of the whaleoil stuff, is simply to have greater involvement in politics …outside of parliament. Public servants are not as constrained by rules in many overseas countries as they are here. Twenty/Thirty years ago political pressure groups had significant numbers of public servants. A simple rule change (from the top) could change this state of affairs.

    My wife and I were on koha duty. Thanks everybody for the contributions.

  3. Vaughan 3

    Thanks Karol, much appreciated.

    Nicky Hager is a Hero and a National Treasure. We The People are truly blessed to have someone like Nicky on our side – THANK YOU for your bravery and courage!

    Please let us consider Nicky Hager for New Zealander Of The Year 2015!

    Sacrifice a small amount of your time to nominate now online:

    http://www.nzawards.org.nz

  4. It was a great evening and this:

    “Key’s friendly relaxed demeanour is fake. He’s actually very ruthless. Hager said its astonishing he’s got away with fake public image for so long.”

    Was in answer of a question of mine as to whether John Key’s banking history as influenced the way he ran his ship.

    I was able to introduce Graham McCready of the John Bank’s court case fame who studies at the Waikato Uni to Nicky Hager. It was a sight to behold!

  5. Bill 5

    Hmm. One of the answers he gave made no sense whatsoever. He was asked if the two track system (and say, ‘Dirty Politics’ in general), were right wing phenomena. Part of his answer was that if Slater was seen as being successful, then some-one or some-ones on the left would emulate him and the network he’s a part of.

    But since the two track strategy is about putting people off from voting because it favours right wing agendas to have less participation….

    Anyway. It was a good presentation with good questions. Thanks for the heads up Karol.

    • Duggie 5.1

      The ‘two-track’ system refers to the practice of having the leader isolated from the dirty tricks campaign. Hager recently gave examples from the Obama campaign on Wallace Chapman’s radio show to show it is a tactic that has been used by the left overseas. Hager fears there is a danger that the left could stoop to it here also.
      That is different from putting people off from voting because it seems futile and corrupt. That seems to be exclusively a right-wing tactic.

    • emergency mike 5.2

      I don’t think it was nonsense. If Slater had carried on being successful then others would have emulated him. At some point some bright young spark in Labour might decide that they need their own Slater to compete. If that happened then NZ politics would indeed move further to the right as per Lusk’s long term plan. And yes voter turnout would fall, and yes that would favour the right. Because left options would slowly vanish.

      When Hager said that National had empowered Slater it hit me that that’s one of the things that really bothers me that hasn’t been much discussed. That by going down this road National has empowered Slater. Given him power to be feared. As he said people with families and careers might think twice about taking him on with his connections, and their resources.

      For me another thing he said when answering that question stuck. That the more a party’s agenda diverges from what they think they can openly sell to the electorate, the more they resort to dirty tricks. I thought of the tobacco, alcohol, and sugary drinks industries. The same thing applies. They know how unhealthy, i.e. carcinogenic, their products are, but they don’t want you to know. So their slimy back channel tactics are up there in severity. Similarly at a personal level when a psychopath targets a victim, they hide their true agenda, and go to extreme tactical lengths achieve their objectives.

      Cameron Slater is an aggresive carcinogen in our politics, and by extention, in our society at large. This government has actively enabled and empowered him. This point makes me angry the most. Thus they have both shown themselves to be a threat to our democracy. Slater is now toxic to the people and circles of influence whose attention he craved. I hope he has done his dash and will slither off into irrelevance. But the actual cancer, #teamkey, still has a chance, incredibly, to win this election. It must be removed before it grows.

      • Bill 5.2.1

        So, am I right to say that we agree the left couldn’t engage in DP as described by Hager, but that a professionalised political class could and probably would? Maybe (unfortunately) I needed to be precise on what I meant when I said ‘left’. By ‘left’ (in terms of parliament) I exclude any and all careerists in any party.

        So, for example, I’d view the ABC club – Goff, Shearer, Mallard, Hipkins, King, Cosgrove, Clark and others as professional political careerists with no real left credentials. And I’d draw parallels of intent, if not organisational presence and ability, between them and the Slater aligned cliques within National.

        I’d further suggest that Shearer was a failed attempt to install a ‘nice guy’ in Labour as a counterpoise to National’s JK, and that next on the careerists list of front men would be Robertson.

        The $64 000 question is how to shift their sharp little claws from the fabric of the Labour Party. They aren’t going to resign or move on off of their own backs. I recall that Cunliffe already suggested that those not fully supportive of a new direction for Labour ‘do the honourable thing’ when he became leader. No resignations resulted and the steady trickle of shit that was set to build around his leadership began.

        And yes, to be truly successful, they’d need a Slater etc, but you’d hardly be able to call such a person a ‘Slater of the left’, would you?

        • karol 5.2.1.1

          Hager’s answer is that people with the dubious politics of hidden agendas and 2 track politics, probably can’t be stopped directly. His answer is to build up the democratic public sphere, where people are not afraid to speak out and challenge them. This would result in sucking life out of those with their hidden agendas.

          He talked about going back to allowing public service workers to be able to talk about politics in their own time.

          • Bill 5.2.1.1.1

            Maybe a part of that building could be genuine politicians from whichever stripe to come together and make cross party efforts to cleanse parliament of these types.

            So…some smear is run by the Nat clique against a Labour MP. The larger Nat Party, instead of enjoying the point scoring, denounces the smear and brings the discussion back to substantial matters. Same applies if say a clique begins to smear an MP within their own party, opposition parties denounce the smearing and bring the discussion back to substantial matters instead of enjoying the schadenfreude.

            In other words, all politicians from all parties adopt an ethical stance, put all careerists/professionals ‘on notice’ and thus, perhaps, effectively shut down their operations.

          • CnrJoe 5.2.1.1.2

            Boycotting advertisers ala’ Dirty blog ..sorry Daily Blog is mmm so good. Why advertise 2 click-farms & bots?

        • lprent 5.2.1.2

          And yes, to be truly successful, they’d need a Slater etc, but you’d hardly be able to call such a person a ‘Slater of the left’, would you?

          If I see one emerging I think that I’d have quite a lot of fun eviscerating and humiliating them with words. They have some pretty obvious characteristics.

          The main one of which is the presumption of personal moral authority and intolerance of dissent to their opinions. In fact much the same characteristics as evangelicals or gurus, both of which are deeply appreciated by unscrupulous political operators.

          That is why I keep an eye on people like Josie Pagani and a few others.

          And yes, I’m quite aware that I have the potential for the guru effect myself. However I really dislike being anything like a guru mainly because I find acolytes offensive, and I prefer arguing and incremental improvements to “winning”. That was agreed on by the original main authors and is why this site is constructed to encourage intelligent disagreement.

          • Bill 5.2.1.2.1

            If I see one emerging…

            The only environment one could emerge in, would be one where we wind up with a wholly professionalised political class/parliamentary political system.

            In other words, there are many more things to be on the lookout for…essentially any gutting of traditional parliamentary left politics/parties would be indicative of the stuff that would make the emergence of a ‘Slater’ clone a possibility. And I think that was happening before Cunliffe. Now my worry would be the professionals/careerists within Labour enjoying a resurgence.

            I really do wish (and I said it at the time) that Cunliffe had acted ruthlessly towards the technocrats, professionals and careerists within Labour instead of seeking to accommodate and mollify them. But hey, what’s done is done.

        • just saying 5.2.1.3

          There was no “new direction” for them to slither away from. Maybe Cunliffe is just the unpopular member of the club. I’m sure all those mentioned above are quite happy with the Labour Party as of September 2014, if not their current places in its hierarchy. But they are patient beasts…

  6. ExStatic 6

    I can’t understand why Hager did not name the high profile journalists who had almost daily contact with Slater. Surely that is in the public interest to know?

    • Peter 6.1

      How difficult would it be to come up with a shortlist?

    • brian 6.2

      I’m not sure that most should be so vilified, with our benefit of hindsight. Most would have used him as a necessary source ….Slater was after all being used by the “office” of the Prime Minister. Possibly I’m being too kind, but I’d also not like a witch hunt to follow, simply because people have contacted him in the past. I’d question more any journalist who continues to have contact with him.

      • brian 6.2.1

        Now I have just seen the Waikato Times report of Hagers talk to WIntec students yesterday afternoon (before his evening speech at Waikato University)
        http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/10474046/Hager-avoids-shaming-journalists

        Hager deliberately avoided using the names of journalists in his book …except for the “despicable Glucina”. More good decision making from Hager.

        • karol 6.2.1.1

          Thanks, Brian for the very good reports of the event, and for the linked article.

          Hager is also putting the journalists on notice, saying to the dodgy journalists, I know who you are, clean up your act.

          • Bill 6.2.1.1.1

            So one or two journalists have done the ‘mea-culpa’ – and all credit to them.

            But I’m picking that most will be reaching for the broom and lifting the edge of the carpet. Anyway, it’ll be interesting to see just how many WO and Kiwiblog lines continue to be picked up.

            • karol 6.2.1.1.1.1

              I think it will take a change of government, for there to be a shift in the MSM along with RNZ/MTS/new public service TV channel, to start employing more journalists that aren’t somehow implicated in the WO smear machine.

  7. karol 7

    I have tremendous admiration for Hager and the work he has done with Dirty Politics and his previous books.

    I do have a bit of a niggle about his understanding of the blogosphere. He clearly has a very good understanding of what has gone on with WO and to a lesser extent KB. He did say last night that leftwing blogs don’t do the same dirty dealings of Slater et al. But I think he is a bit shaky in understanding how the wider blogosphere works.

    nevertheless, Hager does make some sweeping statements about the unruliness of blogs. he says bloggers print whatever they like even if it is totally made up or inaccurate.

    But we still need to follow laws of defamation, etc.

    WO has got away with a lot, partly because of the way it was empowered by the government and by some significant MSM journalists.

    However, since Hager’s book has put WO under a spotlight, many of its posts have been deleted.This indicates that, once put under scrutiny by society at large, there’s stuff Slater et all think they could get into trouble for.

    Sunlight is clearly a very good disinfectant.

    And I think a blog that wants to get a solid reputation, will aim to be as accurate as possible, and will guard against infringing laws of defamation, copyright, etc.

    • Tracey 7.1

      Contact hom karol, email him a description of the blogosphere. I believe he would welcpme it.

      • karol 7.1.1

        I may do a post on it at some point. Right now I am overwhelmed with keeping up with election developments, plus loads of stuff happening in various parts of my life. I am feeling I’ll be glad when the election is over.

  8. Z 8

    Sound is terrible and quite agitating to listen to. Nicky of course is wonderful <3

  9. Dramaticus 9

    When you look at what John Keys uncle Alan did to Brooksley Born over her trying to stop the derivtives ripoff you can see why Key is here running this country into the ground
    The power of the Fed to make or break a country is so obvious and Key has been a major player in all of it
    He is far more than just a happy rich boy completing his boyhood dream
    We should almost fear for our very existance if he is allowed to rule
    We will not have the country that is Godzown

  10. Dont worry. Be happy 11

    OK here’s a journo who is not afraid. Rachel Smalley.

    Please someone who knows how link to Rachel Smalley’s editorial on Newstalk ZB this morning, 10th Sept around 5.15 am, please do it and post.

    She spoke of poverty and the choice we get to make. And while I dont agree with the “Great Leader” motif, preferring a Great Movement, she spoke Truth to Power. Courage, compassion and brains, the trifecta!

    No doubt her name now goes on some sort of list that’s kept in some sort of drawer. Even if the list and the drawer don’t exist we have been bullied into believing they do…

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  • Speak Up for Women calls out Greens’ censorship
    This open letter to the Green Party was penned after an opinion piece by Jill Abigail, a feminist and founding member of the party, was censored by the Greens’ leadership. (Redline has reprinted her article here).The intolerance of the Green Party leaders and their acceptance of the misogyny of gender ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • Member’s Day: End of Life Choice, part 3
    Today is a Member's day, and David Seymour's End of Life Choice Bill continues its slow crawl through its committee stage. They're spending the whole day on it today, though the first hour is likely to be spent on voting left over from last time. After that they'll move on ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Flight to Los Angeles turned back after passengers decide they don’t want to go anymore
    An ambitious plan to fly to Los Angeles petered out into a brief sight-seeing trip and a desire to return home and get some sleep before work tomorrow. Air New Zealand has confirmed a flight to Los Angeles last night was turned back about a quarter of the way into ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • Indigenous Futures: defuturing and futuring – an analytical framework for policy development?
    There appears to be consensus – by omission – that the concept of indigenous futures should be accepted at face value. So I scavenged the internet to see if I could locate an academic descriptor or a framework around how we think about it as a concept, and whether it ...
    EllipsisterBy Ellipsister
    1 week ago
  • Cadbury rumoured to be releasing the Pineapple Trump
    Here’s another novelty chocolate to shove in your gob, New Zealand Cadbury could be seeking to make itself great again with a rumoured new release: Pineapple Trumps, a spin on its classic chocolate-encased pineapple treat and do-it-yourself tooth remover. The global confectionery manufacturer and bumbling “before” character in an infomercial, ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • The coming resource war.
    During my time in the Pentagon I had the privilege of sitting down with military leaders and defence and security officials from a variety of Latin American nations. Sometimes I was present as a subordinate assistant to a senior US defence department official, sometimes as part of a delegation that ...
    KiwipoliticoBy Pablo
    1 week ago
  • Māori Language Week with The Civilian
    Kia ora, Aotearoa. It’s that magical time of year. Te Wiki o te Reo Māori. In English, the week that frightens talk radio. As you probably know by now, all your favourite media outlets are participating, some more successfully than others. Stuff has changed its name to Puna for the ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • Will Horizons act on climate change?
    Local body elections are coming up next month. And it looks like all Palmerston North candidates for Horizons (the Manawatu-Whanganui Regional Council) want to take action on climate change:Climate change is set to be a key issue in Palmerston North for the next three years if those wanting to get ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • BORA reform is stalled
    Eighteen months ago, the government promised to strengthen the Bill of Rights Act, by explicitly affirming the power of the courts to issue declarations of inconsistency and requiring Parliament to formally respond to them. So how's that going? I was curious, so I asked for all advice about the proposal. ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Corbyn and Brexit
    As the Brexit saga staggers on, the focus is naturally enough on the Prime Minister and his attempts to achieve Brexit “do or die”. But the role played by the Leader of the Opposition is of almost equal interest and complexity. The first problem for Jeremy Corbyn is that he ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    1 week ago
  • A ditch for him to die in
    Last week, English Prime Minister Boris Johnson boldly declared that he would rather die be dead in a ditch than delay Brexit. Unfortunately for him, the UK parliament accepted the challenge, and promptly dug one for him. The "rebellion bill" requires him to ask for and secure yet another temporary ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Warning! Warning! Danger Jacinda Ardern! Danger Marama Davidson! Warning!
    Lost In Political Space: The most important takeaway from this latest Labour sexual assault scandal, which (if I may paraphrase Nixon’s White House counsel’s, John Dean’s, infamous description of Watergate) is “growing like a cancer” on the premiership, is the Labour Party organisation’s extraordinary professional paralysis in the face of ...
    1 week ago
  • Union solidarity with Ihumatao land occupation
    by Daphna Whitmore Every Sunday for the past two months unionists from First Union, with supporters from other unions, have set out to the Ihumatao land protest, put up gazebos and gas barbeques, and cooked food for a few hundred locals and supporters who have come from across the country. ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • Climate Change: The wrong kind of trees?
    Newsroom today has an excellent, in-depth article on pine trees as carbon sinks. The TL;DR is that pine is really good at soaking up carbon, but people prefer far-less efficient native forests instead. Which is understandable, but there's two problems: firstly, we've pissed about so long on this problem that ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • No freedom of speech in Turkey
    Canan Kaftancioglu is a Turkish politician and member of the opposition Republican People's Party (CHP). Like most modern politicians, she tweets, and uses the platform to criticise the Turkish government. She has criticised them over the death of a 14-year-old boy who was hit by a tear gas grenade during ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Speaker: Tadhg Stopford: Why I’m standing for the ADHB
    Hi there, just call me Tim.We face tough problems, and I’d like to help, because there are solutions.An Auckand District Health Board member has nominated me for as a candidate for the ADHB, because her MS-related pain and fatigue is reduced with hemp products from Rotorua.  Nothing else helped her. If I ...
    1 week ago
  • Good little vassals
    The Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security has published their report on whether the SIS and GCSB had any complicity in American torture. And its damning. The pull quote is this:The Inquiry found both agencies, but to a much greater degree, the NZSIS, received many intelligence reports obtained from detainees who, ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Who Shall We Turn To When God, And Uncle Sam, Cease To Defend New Zealand?
    Bewhiskered Cassandra? Professor Hugh White’s chilling suggestion, advanced to select collections of academic, military and diplomatic Kiwi experts over the course of the past week, is that the assumptions upon which Australia and New Zealand have built their foreign affairs and defence policies for practically their entire histories – are ...
    1 week ago
  • The Politics of Opposition
    For most of the time I was a British MP, my party was out of government – these were the Thatcher years, when it was hard for anyone else to get a look-in. As a front-bencher and shadow minister, I became familiar with the strategies required in a parliamentary democracy ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    1 week ago
  • More expert comments on the Canadian fluoride-IQ paper
    The Green et al (2019) fluoride/IQ is certainly controversial – as would be expected from its subject (see If at first you don’t succeed . . . statistical manipulation might help and Politics of science – making a silk purse out of a sow’s ear). Anti-fluoride campaigners have been actively promoting it ...
    1 week ago
  • The return to guerrilla war in Colombia
    by Gearóid Ó Loingsigh On August 29th a video in which veteran FARC (Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia) commander Iván Márquez announced that they had taken up arms again was released. There was no delay in the reaction to it, from longtime Liberal Party figure and former president Uribe, for ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    2 weeks ago
  • Air New Zealand identifies this enormous plot of unused land as possible second airport site
    Air New Zealand couldn’t believe its luck that this seemingly ideal piece of real estate had so far gone entirely unnoticed. Air New Zealand’s search for a site to build a second Auckland Airport may have made a breakthrough this afternoon, after employees scanning Google satellite imagery spotted a huge, ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago
  • Redline on the Labour Party
    No-one on the anti-capitalist left in this country today puts forward a case that Labour is on the side of the working class.  There are certainly people who call themselves ‘socialist’ who do, but they are essentially liberals with vested interests in Labourism – often for career reasons. Nevertheless, there ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    2 weeks ago
  • New Fisk
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Labour’s failure
    When National was in government and fucking over the poor for the benefit of the rich, foodbanks were a growth industry. And now Labour is in charge, nothing has changed: A huge demand for emergency food parcels means the Auckland City Mission is struggling to prepare for the impending arrival ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Ardern attempts to vaccinate Clarke Gayford live on television to prove that it’s safe
    Gayford, pictured here on The Project, before things got wildly out of control. A bold public relations move by the Government to encourage parents to vaccinate their children has gone horribly wrong. Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern appeared on tonight’s episode of Three’s The Project, where the plan was for her ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago
  • Has Mr. Whippy gone too far by parking on our front lawns?
    Mr. Whippy’s business model has driven it down a dark road of intimidation. Residents in major centres around the country are becoming disgruntled by the increasingly aggressive actions of purported ice cream company Mr. Whippy, who have taken to parking on people’s front lawns and doorsteps in a desperate attempt ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago
  • Cleaning up the water
    Today the government released its Action Plan for Healthy Waterways, aimed at cleaning up our lakes and rivers. Its actually quite good. There will be protection for wetlands, better standards for swimming spots, a requirement for continuous improvement, and better standards for wastewater and stormwater. But most importantly, there's a ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Fronting up
    Today I appeared before the Environment Committee to give an oral submission on the Zero Carbon Bill. Over 1,500 people have asked to appear in person, so they've divided into subcommittees and are off touring the country, giving people a five minute slot each. The other submitters were a mixed ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Politics of science – making a silk purse out of a sow’s ear
    Anti-fluoride activists have some wealthy backers – they are erecting billboards misrepresenting the Canadian study on many New Zealand cities – and local authorities are ordering their removal because of their scaremongering. Many New Zealanders ...
    2 weeks ago

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