Written By:
IrishBill - Date published:
8:44 pm, May 8th, 2013 - 95 comments
Categories: Economy, you couldn't make this shit up -
Tags:
Well Key’s cornerstone policy, the one that many commentators claimed was him showing his mettle, has come to fruition. And it’s such a poison chalice he didn’t even have the guts to show up for the big reveal in person (spoiler: less than half the number of people who signed up to oppose asset sales signed up to buy).
So let’s mark this nadir in political history with a caption contest. And who better to provide the mirth than the classic comedy duo of English and Ryall – flogging our assets together since 1990.
The current rise of populism challenges the way we think about people’s relationship to the economy.We seem to be entering an era of populism, in which leadership in a democracy is based on preferences of the population which do not seem entirely rational nor serving their longer interests. ...
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*sotto* Jesus Christ Bill. They’re not falling for it a second time. Wrap it up and let’s get the hell out of here.
Key’s voice in ear piece “Fucks sake, guys! Try to look like you’re singing from the same song sheet”.
i’m tired and i want to go bed …..
“So in short, privatisation is a flop, the economy is as dead as Wellington, and we don’t know how to fix it. Let us pray…”
Perfect…
Bill: $2.50 is a fair price blah blah blah mums and dads blah blah blah labour greens north korea economic sabotage blah blah blah…
Tony: this sudoku’s a bitch.
“You want me to comment on Aaron Gilmore’s good taste, when Tony Ryall stands so sartorially stentorian behind me?”
Well that is one way of spinning this….
Another way you could look at it is that MRP once it lists will have many more shareholders than any other listed company in NZ – also they are saying that 68% of those who signed up have no CSN number ( my better half and I) so are a large proportion of 1st time investors.
However, I am pleased by the looney left attack on the float as at $2.50 per share is a nice discount on the possible $2.80 initial price so great go for red/greens.
And with the recent failure of the CIR petition I would say that NZ has voted twice no thanks to the leftie agenda – so sad, gotta cry a river.
Oh and there is an extra 1.7 billion to help pay for schools and hospitals that don’t have to be borrowed to pay for. (And don’t go on about lost dividends – according to Shearer & Norman they are disposable and not so important)
So yeah a great deal all round…..
68% of those who signed up have no CSN number
You know Jimmie, rather than parroting lines from Farrar you should be asking yourself if you really want to put your hard-earned cash into something that Key refused to front for and Farrar is only buying into as far as he has to to maintain face.
Well yes it is – we put in $4K from our hard earned savings and have no regrets. This will be good for us long term and I am happy to have some personal ownership in MRP.
Buyers remorse comes later, idiot
You sound happy with your investment, and why not. By all accounts you will still get a good return on your MRP shares in the future, maybe just a bit less than you would have without NZPower coming into force after the next election. You believe you got a good price also, so you would support the NZPower policy then? (Seeing as though it is the reason you are pleased about your investment)
Spare a thought for the vast majority of Kiwi’s though. They couldn’t afford shares and will see the their power company lose 49% of it’s value immediately (transferred to you and other investors) and they will be missing out on future public services due to the loss of future dividends.
Support the NZ Power policy – no not really as I’ve never seen any system where big central government can produce an efficient service that delivers good results to the end customers (Think 1980’s Telecom)
Plus when all the other Lab/Green tax and spend policies are added voters would be deluding themselves to think that they will be financially better off by voting to the left.
Also Shearer and Norman have made it clear that they don’t mind losing dividend payments from the power companies so the dividend income stream is reduced under both National and Lab/Greens.
The difference is that Key will have 1.7 billion next week to plug into infrastructure that he never borrowed and under Lab/Greens in 2014 we will have a new department of paper pushers that will somehow magicly conjur up 5000 jobs through increased economic activity?
(Though how by giving $300 with one hand and taking twice that with the other hand is supposed to create jobs is beyond me)
I mean please – its a lost battle.
Jimmie
The overwhelming majority of NZers didn’t buy shares.
Selling MRP will add $100 million to the deficit each year. You’re one of the few people I know who thinks that’s good.
“The overwhelming majority of NZers didn’t buy shares.”
Umm … some mums and dads have decided gifting the money to sons and daughters to help them build the deposit for purchasing their first homes, thanks to the runaway housing market that has failed the younger generation.
We don’t have a big central government you idiot
Think of the mail service since the 19th century for gods sakes.
1980’s Telecom??? That’s pre-IT/internet boom of course it was slower than today!
Jimmie,
I’ll have whatever you’re having. Less than 3% of the population bought shares. Obviously the vast majority didn’t want a bar of this sham sale, or they couldn’t afford to buy shares. If you’re trying to spin this as a good news story, you’re going to have to do a lot better than that.
The CIR petition hasn’t failed. You’ll probably find that when the dust settles there’ll be about 3 times as many petitioners as there are shareholders. It makes you think.
Makes Jimmie think? Don’t count on it.
3% of the population?? Huh just more spin. Why not make it sound worse and say .0000001 of the world population bought shares so it is a fail.
The reality is that despite 3 years of leftie harping on about assets sales that it has gone through, the government has raised 1.7 billion for building other assets, ans over 100,000 kiwis are now personal owners of MRP.
Oh and the sky hasn’t fallen on our heads.
Really the left have to find another issue to bleat about as if you look at the miserable turnout to the various protests the rank and file know that this is flogging a long dead horse.
Well, in that case why are you so fearful and shrill?
“Why not make it sound worse and say .0000001 of the world population bought shares so it is a fail.”
The rest of the world couldn’t buy shares.
The fact that more than 97% didn’t buy shares is apparently of no concern to you. Surely, if this was easy money, every NZer would have been keen to buy. What went wrong?
What went wrong… Haven’t you looked at the picture above?
Obviously we’re all just not as clever and successful as Jimmie. Isn’t that the usual line?
Why not make it sound worse and say .0000001 of the world population bought shares so it is a fail.
Hah. Ironically, you’re absolutely correct, public companies and shareholders have been a miserable fail, as you point out it has only facilitated the robbing of the world’s wealth by a tiny minority.
“raised 1.7 billion for building other assets,” ……
1.7 billion is how much was unnecessarily given to investors in the dodgy South Canterbury Finance.
” ans over 100,000 kiwis are now personal owners of MRP.”……
ans over 3,900,000 kiwis are not now owners of MRP
I am continuously astounded at the lack of brain cells in te world……
silly jimmie
“Oh and the sky hasn’t fallen on our heads.”
Correct. And you still bought shares knowing about the definite possibility that the NZPower policy will be implemented. So obviously, you and other investors feel that you can still make a good return on your shares despite NZPower? So why all the doomsday type talk from potential investors? (unless they are greedy and wanting more than a good return)
Just as a matter of interest, MRP is forecasting somewhere around 4-5% net dividend return per share
So you would increase your $4000 to around $4200 after a year. If we take an average inflation rate of say 2.5% (avg since 2001 is 2.7%) for this year (the real inflation rate will be much higher than this, but we aren’t told about that), your ‘real’ return will be around $100. (let’s not think about the possibility of inflation jumping to 5% at some stage, which is it’s average for the last 50 years)
For the amount of shares you’re buying (1600), isn’t it a slightly risky investment with risks such as the possibility of NZPower on the horizon and Tiwai Pt winding down, as well as other standard risks, considering that you can get over 4% at the bank even in the current low interest environment with no risk. (and interest rates will rise). The default Kiwisaver options yield around 5% per annum over 5 years. I can’t see long term MRP share prices increasing substantially unless profits are increasing every year, which we would assume they won’t do as much under a NZPower regulatory environment. You stated it is a long term investment for you.So how do you see the investment as being “good for us” long term?
its not original Jimmie but – what do the govt sell every year after to ‘build other assets?’
“about 3 times as many petitioners as there are shareholders”
Over 400,000 went to the trouble of lodging their interest and asked for the prospectus.
113,000 people still put their money where their mouth is – even after a concerted sabotage effort.
On the flipside…
300,000 people made the earth-shattering commitment of picking up a pen – not even enough to get a “mandate” for a referendum. Hardly worthy of comparison.
Maths isn’t your strong point I see.
Don’t see your point – 400,000 people registered interest, that should be the comparable statistic. I think that shows greater commitment than signing a piece of paper.
113,000 put their money where their mouth is – that is hugely significant, would 113,000 signatories of the petition commit to anything more than ink a piece of paper shoved in front of their face by some funded lackey???
Signing up for the prospectus took even less effort than signing the petition. What was your point again?
Sorry??
Spelling your name and remembering your address when someone shoves a piece of paper under your nose takes more effort than going to a website and filling out your details when you are seriously considering an investment decision?
Ross suggests that numbers aren’t my strong suit well I can assure you that I have a particularly strong background in behavioural finance and the complexities that committing money add to a decision-making process are far beyond those of signing a petition…. if that logic is beyond you then I’m afraid you’re not worth my time.
Behavioural finance? What a joke.
Do feel free to go if you believe that.
“Do feel free to go if you believe that.”
I might just do that and leave you at peace in your echo chamber.
Behavioural finance?
Another mumpty who thinks economics is a science.
Behavioural finance? Does that mean working out why people are happy when they win Lotto? I’m afraid you’re not worth my time.
“Spelling your name and remembering your address when someone shoves a piece of paper under your nose takes more effort than going to a website and filling out your details when you are seriously considering an investment decision?”
Seeing as anyone could register anyone else’s name on the website, yes. No effort required on your dog’s part at all, for example.
You could say the same for the petition of course, but the numbers would be against you. As it turns out, 25% of the signatures can be discounted. In the case of registering for shares, 75% can be discounted.
As has already been noted, maths isn’t your strong suit.
300,000 is more than 115,000. 4 million is also more than 115.000. I’m proud that the vast majority of my fellow Kiwis aren’t going within cooee of this sham.
See above.
Hugely arrogant to suggest that 4m NZers are opposed let alone you, in any way shape or form, speak for your “fellow kiwis” when 400,000 got off their collective arses to register interest.
Also doesn’t take away from the fact that you couldn’t muster enough of your so-called “fellow kiwis” to secure a mandate for a non-binding referendum.
3/4 of those “registering interest” turned out to be uninterested when the money was due
How many people would have signed your petition if they were later asked to contribute even just a token $10 to the cause?
Yeah I agree, democracies started going shit when poor people were given the vote
That is not my argument and you know it – I am saying that signing the petition is no more of a commitment than registering.
If anyone had to make a further commitment to your cause, be it in the form of time or a token donation the proportion would be far less than 113/400.
The only close valid comparison would be if the rallys attracted >113,000 – frankly, they didn’t.
You still don’t get it do you.
You’re judgements on what is a success or not matter fuck all. This mediocre MRP share float is the financial and market interest high tide of National’s entire asset sale programme. It’s all going out from here. They’re screwed in 2014.
You mean 400,000 sat at their computers…hardly an onerous task.
The fact remains that almost 3 times as many people said let’s have a referendum.
Oh you really can’t be redeemed if you think it is materially more difficult to sign a petition than lodge interest in an IPO.
Colonial Viper, well maybe the left’s entirely vindictive sabotage campaign had something to do with it, which if you asked Clint in private I’m sure he would confirm that you’re all ecstatic about.
Well, actually, having to stop what you’re doing, whether it’s shopping or enjoying a day out or dealing with a whiny child, to balance a clip board on your arm on a wet and windy day while you scribble your details on a mangled bit of paper and share a word or too with the dedicated volunteer who gave up half a day on a Saturday morning to collect signatures because they think it’s morally reprehensible to sell public assets, demands a bit more commitment from both the aforementioned parties than tooling around on your computer for thirty seconds in the comfort of your own home. Having said that, many people signed the petition on line. Do they win your seal of approval for their commitment? Oh, and quite a few of those same people have also been making donations to the Green Party and other causes they believe in so don’t go getting too ridiculous with your spurious value judgments about other peoples commitment to their beliefs and ideals.
“Also doesn’t take away from the fact that you couldn’t muster enough of your so-called “fellow kiwis” to secure a mandate for a non-binding referendum.”
And yet we’ll still be having a referendum on the issue and the Government, and you, will be shown to be representing only the tiny minority; the most venal and the disloyal of my fellow kiwis. Funny old world, eh.
“most venal and the disloyal of my fellow kiwis”
Holding a desire for our country to have functioning and healthy capital markets to fuel growth and job creation is about as far removed from being venal and disloyal as a kiwi can possibly get – I’m 8th generation which should (just about) make me kiwi enough to credibly hold that opinion.
Oh for goodness sake.
This claytons IPO isn’t a sign of healthy capital markets. If we had healthy capital markets we wouldn’t need to be flooding them with govt backed listings that require bribes in the form of ‘loayalty shares’. And what’s the point of that if it’s not political?
The point of having ‘deeper’ markets is that more capital is available for investment, so why encourage people to park their money in these companies with an implicit govt backing?
How does that encourage “growth and job creation”? The companies aren’t getting the money, the crown is. What these ‘floats’ do is take money that might have been invested somewhere else, and give it to the crown. It’s not a sign of ‘healthy capital markets’ it’s a sign that people in NZ with money to invest can’t find anything to do with it other than give it the government in return for a share of the dividends provided by a crown built enterprise.
From a right wing perspective it’s a damning indictment on our private sector and capital markets.
What Pascal said, and also too:
If your investment decisions really are motivated by “a desire for our country to have functioning and healthy capital markets to fuel growth and job creation” then you’re a terrible investor.
Markets allocate capital to the companies that, on aggregate, investors believe will perform best in those investors’ own interest.
Frankly if you have any motivation other than a desire to see the best return on your investment then you’re not helping the market to function at all. You’re actually hindering the market from performing its primary role.
Some capitalist you turned out to be.
So how come these 4 million kiwis voted John Key back in in 2011?
They didn’t. He barely scraped in, and without a mandate to sell the assets.
Now I know that I’ve been accused of being poor at maths, so I should clarify, last I checked:
1,059,000 > 309,000?
Am I missing something when it comes to mandates?
Jimmie thinks nz has more than 8,000,000 voters?
Faboo.
Pray tell when was there EVER a vote held where 4,000,000 individuals voted against asset sales?
The general election is the only thing to go off here – 1 million + voted for National in the polling booths, which by implication means Te Reo is suggesting there are (AT LEAST) 5 million registered voters for him to have 4 million “fellow kiwis”.
Amazing how you take random words and throw them together.
Maybe we should sort out the entire mandate thing with, oh, a sort of vote where only one issue is considered rather than a hodge-podge of personalities and policies. It’s a word beginning with “r”, I think.
shagg if the all blacks had lost the world cup key wouldn’t be PM!
‘
Jimmie – well done bgig spender , hey you put $4000 dollars in, and hey if you double your money in eight to ten years you’ll have made…$4000. Woohooo. You idiot – we..and you already owned the assets..and your $4000 profit will buy fuck all then.
That’s the trouble with wee wankers like oor jimmie, they don’t care that the end result of their grubby conceit is that financially vulnerable people are made to further suffer just so jimmie and his ilk can enjoy slightly nicer wine during their next holiday to the Gold Coast.
Ok so the government spending 1.7 billion on hospitals and schools without borrowing will make finacially vulnerable people suffer??
Play the other one that goes jingle bells.
And FYI I’ve never been to the gold coast and I don’t drink wine
is that your caption?
or your contest?
“Ok so the government spending 1.7 billion on hospitals and schools without borrowing…”
Hmmm what happens when the money is spent, and we need to spend more money on schools and hospitals? Will we sell another asset? Then what? We do it all over again?
That’s plain dumb.
“Now for my next trick I’m going to teach your mum and dad investors to suck eggs” said Mr English.
Slurring into earpiece ‘You are my number 2 Blingy boy, here’s another stinker to front and sign off on…..you really should’ve done better in 02 Mr charisma like me in 08 and 11….’
Er, and if, by any chance, you’re thinking of putting SHARE FLOAT FAIL on the front page tomorrow, Tony’s got copies of the rest of Aaron Gilmore’s txts for you. Play ball and we’ll let you have the Hanmer hotel security cam tape on Friday. He agreed to go quietly if John took him out for a drink.
or:
26% of those who got the prospectus bought shares, so, ah, more popular than me, then.
or:
And now Tony will give you each a copy of the list of excuses we’ll be using …
We proudly announce that less than 3% of NZers have some money.
26.9% Retail
8.6% NZ Institutions
13.5% Overseas
49% owned by Kiwi Mums and Dads. = about 55,000 Mums and Dads. Not so wonderful???
By the look of it they’re playing creative accounting ianmac, their percentages look to be worked back to include the 51% kept by the Govt. The ‘paper said NZ institutions bought $300 million worth and that’s 8.6% of the full market value not the 49% sold. I’d think the retail investors are mum & dad. Of the shares sold I think it goes like this;
53.8% Retail $914 million
17.2% NZ Institutions $292 million
27.0% Overseas $459 million
That 17.2% is pretty concerning, I assume “NZ Institutions” includes the mobs with all the Kiwisaver cash and they really haven’t spent much here.
Interesting maths on the Retail side, average of about $8000 spent per investor.
‘
I think the Kiwi Saver crew are pretty flush at the moment. Didn’t they sell the New Zealand forests to the Chinese last week? Timing is everything.
“Um….yeah. John ran off ten minutes ago muttering something about Hawaii. I tried to get Gerry to do it, but he told me to get stuffed. So then I promised Tony the deputy leadership if he’d come with me. Oh, God, why is it always me?”
Ha ha, meanwhile Ryall thinks “Yes! Me again!”
O Come All Ye Faithful
Joyful and triumphant,
O come ye, O come ye to Bethlehem.
Come and behold Him,
Born the King of Angels;
O come, let us adore Him,
O come, let us adore Him,
O come, let us adore Him,
Christ the Lord.
O Sing, choirs of angels,
Sing in exultation,
Sing all that hear in heaven God’s holy word.
Give to our Father glory in the Highest;
O come, let us adore Him,
O come, let us adore Him,
O come, let us adore Him,
Christ the Lord.
All Hail! Lord, we greet Thee,
Born this happy morning,
O Jesus! for evermore be Thy name adored.
Word of the Father, now in flesh appearing;
O come, let us adore Him,
O come, let us adore Him,
O come, let us adore Him,
Christ the Lord.
Pre-registration ejaculation proves hard to wash off.
Ryall studies Keys apology for rorting pre-registration process before reading it to the media.
We are taking $1,700,000,000 from good ordinary kiwis and giving it to South Canterbury Finance investors. No we’re not, we are giving $400,000,000 of it to farmers for their water takes. I mean, no that’s not right. We are investing this $1,squiggly,000 in … um, well
“hang on – it says $50,000.00 here”
Vile & Bonehead strike again
Gok Wong resigns post of Tony’s fashion adviser. “Some jobs are just too big……”
” We now don’t own a fair bit of what we did own before we didn’t own what we did own after we did own what we now don’t own. That’s what John said to say anyway and yeah, nah I haven’t got a fuckin clue what it means either. What do you think, Tony” . “Fucked if I know, I’m only here because I get a free suit from Letsalllooklikewankers, if I get on TV”.
Sorry……Gok Wan.
“Why yes we think it’s a great investment, you invested right Tony? Tony?”
“It’s no good Bill. I think they still remember who won last time.”
“You mean the election, Tony?”
“No Bill, I mean the 1980s.”
Neil Finn and Noel Crombie experiment with phase cancellation.
(ryall – to self)
“..must – not – smirk..!”
phillip ure..
ryall:..
“..just making sure bill is following the agreed-script..”
phillip ure..
english:..”..”..Only if you have the core competencies will you be able to action the key deliverables for your relevant stakeholders going forward..”
ryall (to self) “..whoar..!..nice one bill..!..”
phillip ure..
english:..”oh..!”
(question:..where exactly is ryalls’ right hand..?..)
phillip ure..
english:..to the mug-punters/former owners of mighty river power…
“..now..when you bend over and grab yr ankles for us..make sure you grease up first…
..and make sure you say ‘thank you!’..when we’re finished..”
philllip ure..
(bad-radio..)
..bill and tony..reprising the big-hits..of the 80’s..
phillip ure..
ryall:..”my american-masters wanted me to wear the red white and blue shirt..
..they thought it would make a nice touch..
..and would be far more subtle than a flag-pin..”
..phillip ure..
“look, when we announced this package we used hyperbole and spin, we over hyped and over promised the public interest and we used duplicitous language to promote it. In terms of the actual benefit for the country I was honest enough to say I could only guess, that I really had no idea
Now I can announce that the policy is a success. We met none of the over hyped criteria we stated in public but have met the real objective, placing the collective wealth of NZ into the pockets of a few.
I can announce today a further changes. Mum and Dad power users are going to be paying more for their power from now on to subsidise the lifestyles of the 3%”
97% of NZers want no part in ripping other power users off.
Bill and Tony, New Zealand’s got Talent. Yeah Right.
Back to the caption contest… “mmm these are funny communists .. Muesli & Mumbletruck.. their NZpower scheme will benefit rich families more than poor families ( who will get FOUR packets of chewing gum)”