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Liar, liar, pants on fire

Written By: - Date published: 1:09 pm, February 10th, 2010 - 72 comments
Categories: election 2008, john key - Tags:

Apparently promises made before the election don’t count. GST was different then anyway.

72 comments on “Liar, liar, pants on fire”

  1. Pascal's bookie 1

    North of fifty dollars a week.

  2. gobsmacked 2

    I put this on another thread, but it’s worth repeating:

    Bill English told the same porkie: asked about an increase in GST …

    “We won’t be doing that … It is not our policy”.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/politics/747758

  3. Onomatopoeia 3

    He was talking about Australian GST.

  4. ghostwhowalksnz 4

    Whats the bet the GST increase will be passed AND implemented in the budget. Ie within a few days.
    Has to be in the budget to get the Coalition of the willing to vote for it

    While all the other offsets , well they would just ‘promises’ which hes very relaxed about.

    Cant see the tax cuts coming in till election year budget to take effect say September so you only get 6 months worth in that year

  5. big bruv 5

    I wish I could find the clip of Clark saying she would never support a ban on smacking.

    Times change guys, the NZ that Key was talking about when he made this statement is not the NZ he inherited, he (Key) certainly had no idea how bad the books were due to Dr Cullens incompetence.

    I keep saying it, this is not the way to go about eating into Key’s popularity, you guys are still using the same tactics that did not work at the last election, the more you make small minded attacks on the man the more he will be supported by the public.

    • Onomatopoeia 5.1

      I seem to remember something about “contrary to human nature”…

    • lprent 5.2

      I wish I could find the clip of Clark saying she would never support a ban on smacking.

      There is no ban on smacking, never has been, and it is probable that here never could be.

      You just have to be able to justify your actions, if charged, to a court. You cannot use a rather stupid defence that used to exist. I realise that you probably think that this is a gross infringement on your ‘right’ to beat children. But that is just tough shit.

      Incidentally there is no ban on assaulting people, murdering people, waving your dick in public, or anything else. What there are are consequences for all of these actions in the law. I have no idea where you get the idea of a ‘ban’ from (and I hesitate to suggest possibilities).

      So you are just being as pointless as usual, or just bleating one of those wingnut urban myths? Here’s another one for you – “north of $50” tax cuts.

      (like global medieval warm periods, global little iceages – for things that appear to have only happened in Europe.)

      • big bruv 5.2.1

        Iprent

        Where did you get the idea I am defending Key, I suspect I detest the man more than you.

        BTW, you are only making a fool of yourself by suggesting there is not a ban on smacking, in other posts I have mentioned that you guys are out of touch and arrogant, this type of hiding behind semantics is a classic example.

        • lprent 5.2.1.1

          There is no ban on smacking kids. There are consequences to doing the action.

          If you think that there is a ‘ban’ to stopping someone doing it, then I’d suggest that you have zero idea of what you’re talking about. It is impossible to stop people from doing anything. All society can do is put consequences in for actions.

          In this case all that happened was a defence in court was removed.

          Use your brain to look at what you said, rather than your mindless slogans. And pleeze stop being such a meathead.

          • big bruv 5.2.1.1.1

            Iprent

            Please stop being so precious.

            Clark lied to the people of NZ about the smacking ban, you know that, and in an attempt to change the debate you bring in the pathetic ‘child beating” slogan.

            You told me that you are a smart person, while I have yet to be convinced it amazes me that you continue to parrot Labour party policy day after day without even suggesting that you can think for yourself.

            Show us how smart you are Iprent, show us that you can actually debate an issue (any issue will do) without resorting to abuse or banning those who expose you as a person who is not quite as smart as you like to think you are.

            • lprent 5.2.1.1.1.1

              Just being accurate – which you seem to have a real problem doing. Just at present I’m unsure if you could find your arse with your hands as your accuracy rate seems to be so useless.

              Tell me exactly how you ‘ban’ anything unless you physically prevent A meeting B. It has never been proposed that would happen between most parents and their children.

              This discussion came about because you suggested that Helen lied about ‘banning smacking’. What I’m saying is that you are a moronic idiot who is so in love with your slogans that you fail to see that she said exactly the truth.

              Your avoidance behaviour in your last few comments is just that of a miserable serial liar trying to avoid the consequences of your ignorance and gross inaccuracies. You say things without bothering to check them for being correct.

              Face it – basically you’re just acting like a dickhead.

              • big bruv

                I have not avoided anything Iprent.

                I have invited you to debate the issue with me and show that intellect that you so often tell us about.

                Your lack of patience with somebody who shares the same goal as you says so much about why Labour is in the basement at the moment.

                The nation rejected your superior “we know best” attitude in Nov 08, I would have thought that you might have learnt something from that.

                Seems I was wrong.

                Let me know when you get over your arrogance Iprent, let me know when you wake up to the fact that the public are not going to come running back to you guys screaming “we got it wrong”.
                I have some ideas that might help.

                • lprent

                  big bruv:

                  I have not avoided anything Iprent.

                  I have invited you to debate the issue with me and show that intellect that you so often tell us about.

                  Still squirming I see… Lets put the specimen pin in a little deeper…

                  You made several inaccurate assertions. Now you’re trying to avoid taking responsibility for them by diverting attention. Pretty typical of a meathead Act supporter who’d prefer to lie rather than use their brains. Lets have a look at them again shall we…

                  I wish I could find the clip of Clark saying she would never support a ban on smacking.
                  and
                  Clark lied to the people of NZ about the smacking ban
                  You followed up on that by saying
                  you are only making a fool of yourself by suggesting there is not a ban on smacking

                  You are totally inaccurate in all of your statements. Because there never was proposed to be a ban on smacking children. If you have a child in front of you that you want to hit, then you’re perfectly capable of doing so. However, there are consequences to hitting anyone, including children and always have been. The police are entitled to look at your actions and decide if they want to press charges.

                  The only thing that s59a did was remove a defence in court that the judges had condemned as being too vaguely worded and prevented them from judging appropriately.

                  Of course hysterical dickheads like yourself seem to fail to understand that. You cling to your inaccurate slogans like a babies safety blanket. Too sacred to face the real word without their comforting embrace.

                  The lie is your slogan of “banning smacking” – debate that.

                  • big bruv

                    Iprent

                    I really seem to have hit a raw nerve don’t I.

                    I note that in true Alinsky fashion you are now accusing me of doing what you yourself are doing.

                    I am not incorrect Iprent, and frankly, you look like an idiot by hiding behind semantics.

                    But lets move on….

                    • lprent

                      Nope – this is more fun….

                      Using stupid slogans instead of thinking is sort of your trademark. Lets keep looking at what you say…

                      You really do make the most stupid statements without thinking. I’m sure it is a habit we can cure you of.

                    • grumpy []

                      Careful BB, in an unguarded moment some time ago lprent let slip he has an MBA.

                      A lefty with an MBA – how can he live with himself?

                    • big bruv []

                      “A lefty with an MBA how can he live with himself?”

                      Because according to his own words he is “brilliant”.

                      Must be hard to be that smart and modest at the same time.

                    • grumpy []

                      Not to mention an Earth Science degree. Now, where could you go with that and an MBA – ENRON?

                      Thank God for a Carbon Trading Market – not!

                      Still, he’s one of the more balanced authors on this site – not that it means much!

                      [lprent: Accurate on both degrees (but there are a number of other part finished ones – I get bored). However, I somehow (obsession) wound up as a high-end computer programmer. It is more fun than Enron. ]

                    • grumpy []

                      Ken Lay – is that you?

                      I thought you were still inside?

                      [lprent: no need to repeat. We get around to releasing stuff from the auto-moderation/auto-spam eventually if they get in there by accident. ]

                    • grumpy []

                      Point taken Ken, but no need to be so touchy. You wouldn’t be the first white collar wrong doer to be retrained into IT by the Government.

                      But it’s the radical change in politics that puzzles me.

                    • big bruv []

                      Iprent

                      Are you sure you find this fun?, it is highly embarrassing for you, I would have thought you might have had enough by now.

                      I am not one given to acts of cruelty, but if you insist on carrying on then so be it.

                      Now, how about we chat about the appalling way you guys are going about being the opposition?

                    • lprent []

                      Nope, I’ll just keep an eye out for you substituting slogans for understanding.

                      I always find it appalling and irritating that people turn their brains off in favour of their prejudices when they hear a good slogan.

                      You’re one of the worst offenders. Care to debate that?

                    • Lanthanide

                      “you look like an idiot by hiding behind semantics”

                      Depends on your point of view.

                    • Mr Magoo

                      Or are YOU accusing HIM of doing the same as what YOU are doing??

                      Or maybe you are both accusing each other of doing what you both are doing and this is just a tangled web of hypocrisy?!

                    • djp

                      Ok sure, they have banned smacking “for the purpose of correction”.. congratulations you win the obtuse medal of the day.

                      I suppose they never banned smoking in workplaces either, because there is no smoking guards armed with water pistols walking the corridors.

      • dave 5.2.2

        lprent theres no clip – it was an audio. DO you want it?

      • HitchensFan 5.2.3

        Oh my god. Well put. At LAST a commentator that actually understands the amendment to section 59.
        I applaud you, Iprent. Now can you take some of that reasoning over to Farrar’s blog with his band of merry christian child bashers who appear not to have even read s 59???

        [lprent: I think that the intellectual inbreeding over there is a bit intense. I’ll concentrate on keeping my home site clean of the same problem. ]

        • HitchensFan 5.2.3.1

          Yeah good point. Fair enough. I must stop reading it actually. The populist, christian-based, uneducated posts and comments over there just wind me up for the entire day!

      • aj 5.2.4

        I have to support iprent.
        Smacking is permited under quite a range of circumstances. Read the law bro.

        • Herodotus 5.2.4.1

          I think the clip is the Radio Rhema interview with Bob McCrostie, and now you are playing the political game of symantics. A very crafty politician can get out of almost any statement by using symantics. And for me it is extremely poor that “we’ have to resort to this. Once an arguement has entered this stage it has been won/lost for the majority. We are not dumb, even if we do not get into politics

    • aj 5.3

      John English siad the books were brilliant.
      Let us konw if you ever find the Clark clip {irrelevant anyway as we are talking $$$ now, so dear to the right}

  6. ghostwhowalksnz 6

    So replaying his old words is ‘small minded’ and will make him ‘more popular’
    The context of the interview was that the books would be looking so bad and of course the tax cuts had to be reversed as well.

    Two broken promises! Let us be the judge of what the voters want to hear

  7. SD 7

    Like my grandad always said..

    “Never trust a tory!”

    • big bruv 7.1

      Funny that, mine always told me never to trust a socialist and always check your wallet when you have been in their company.

      • sk 7.1.1

        funny, that was exactly what an Aussie mate of mine used to say about Key in the 1990’s (the checking your wallet bit after being in his company)

      • Mr Magoo 7.1.2

        grandfathers tend to be a bit too attached to cliches..

        A bit like my last sentence.

        However every analysis I have seen of Right vs Left politicians and keeping their promises, the Right falls short.

        This is no surprise to anyone, including the Right. They know what they are doing. They are just disingenuous.

  8. Nick 8

    When asked about his change of stance, Key replied, “I’m pretty relaxed about it”.

    • Moon Goddess 8.1

      Please watch your language. And it’s not nice wishing that others were deceased. UPDATE: Deleted other abusive comments. You’re not welcome here Moon Goddess – MF

  9. big bruv 9

    Ghost

    You and I agree on one thing, we both want Key gone.

    But, you can bash him as much as you want it is going to get you anywhere, you need to drop the tired old aggressive socialist style of attack and think a bit smarter.

    Kiwis rejected that style of politics and that style of leader, sure these type of attacks might raise the morale of your hard line supporters but they are not the ones you need to convince, middle NZ is where it is at Ghost and while you might feel better with attack politics the average voter is turned off by it.

    • Mr Magoo 9.1

      You need to drop the tired old socialist-as-an-insult cliche.

      Just because people are to the left of you does not make them a socialist.

      And being called a socialist is not an insult. I would be far more insulted being called a neo con than a socialist!

      But seriously. Using the loaded S word just makes everything else you say kind of vanish in a right-headed haze.

      • big bruv 9.1.1

        Use what ever you like Magoo, but prepared to be on the opposition benches for years and years to come.

        You guys need to change….big time.

        Your message is not getting through, the public are yawning at what you have to say and the people who are saying it.

        • Moon Goddess 9.1.1.1

          Oh you are so banned – MF

        • Mr Magoo 9.1.1.2

          Your line of reasoning as as tired as I am of dicussing it with the closed minded right.

          I really could not give a rats ass what you think I or people you think I am associated with (read: I am not) should do.

          You are just another disingenuous righty come to these here boards to make trouble. Your mind has been made up and is thus CLOSED to all further discussion.

          You seem to assume that you have some wisdom to impart here. Your tired old cliches and insults really are pathetic and do not add one iota to the debate.

          Go back to your cave.

          • big bruv 9.1.1.2.1

            Got any more cliché’s you want to toss in ?

            My mind is not closed, I was a supporter of Key, now I see him as the most dangerous man in the country.

            Those with closed minds are the Labour people who refuse to admit that they are on the wrong track and have not yet accepted that the nation turned away from their style of politics.

            • Mr Magoo 9.1.1.2.1.1

              Ahh another enlightened Act supporter.

              You were fooled into thinking key would lie through his teeth and then sell NZ out to the Neo-Con Way(TM) but it turns out he fooled you instead.

              Good for you….

  10. ghostwhowalksnz 10

    Gee Big bruv , wonder why the Dom is running the video clip on its web page.

    I suggest TVNZ or TV3 will do the same on the news. Its such an easy story to do.

    Showing Key is a liar-eventually the wider public get it. Its not rocket science.

    But will Key go on Q+A this week and will Espiner have the nerve to confront him over the broken promises and the tax cuts which are paid for with tax increases

    • big bruv 10.1

      So bloody what?

      Are you going to rely on the mindless NZ media to do your job for you?

      The Nat’s had to battle nine years of media bias to defeat Clark, the sooner you learn that you no longer set the rules of the game the better.

      You highlight exactly my point Ghost, you are a hard lefty, you are going to get all excited about this clip showing on the news, middle NZ or the floating voter does NOT CARE LESS.

      • Mr Magoo 10.1.1

        Last time I checked neither do you.

        You comments are kind of ridiculous. They sound an awful lot like the US republican propaganda to be honest. You don’t watch/read a lot of fox news per chance??

        – liberal use of “socialist” (pun intended)
        – liberal media bias
        – clueless

        yep..I am smelling Fox in there….

  11. keys nose is growing as we speak – i wish i could do pinocchiokeyphotoshop

    from wikipedia
    The name Pinocchio is a Tuscan word meaning “pine nut” – says it all really

  12. felix 12

    That nice Mr Key is having a terrible time in the house.

    Repeating his lie over and over isn’t helping either.

  13. And the nzherald reported it, so much it for being in keys back pocket.

  14. gingercrush 14

    Oh FFS. This thread resembles Kiwiblog.

    [lprent: Yep. Idiotic isn’t it. But look at the participants. ]

  15. big bruv 15

    Iprent

    This is your place, I will play by your rules.

    Fire away….

    Always allowing for the fact that I work for a living and from time to time I have to pop out and administer a beating to my non union employees for not increasing productivity.

    • lprent 15.1

      I have to work as well. However I’m usually beating software into submission. Right now it is a recalcitrant IIS7 server that is failing to deliver my WPF xaml application, and prefers sending me 401 ‘Unauthorised’ errors instead. The IIS6 server serves it perfectly, and so would Apache if I tried that.

      Fortunately there was a convenient target blathering slogans to offload the Mickeysoft frustration into, while I had a wee think about what they’d screwed up this time.

  16. big bruv 16

    Iprent

    My reply seems to have vanished into the ether…

    Or did you delete it because I embarrassed you again?

    • Draco T Bastard 16.1

      Bruv, nothing you could ever say would ever embarrass anyone on the left. I’d say that it embarrasses people on the right but they’re far to inconsistent to realise that they should be embarrassed.

  17. grumpy 17

    Ken Lay!, Is that you – I thought you were still inside?

  18. Murray 18

    Who bloody cares, The world has changed since 1988 or haven’t you lot noticed.
    Shows how desperate Goff is getting bringing this crap up

    • felix 18.1

      Um, this vid is from 2008, not 1988.

      You might recall there was an election coming up at the time.

  19. Herodotus 19

    I am sorry your post is out of context. Nat are not increasing GST to cover debt, so John Key is technically correct. Even so I still believe that it is not a step in the right direction. His actions are that of a 2nd term government I was looking for someone to have a positive radical change in philosophy, but this appears not to have occurred. What I see is a tampering of the deck chairs.
    His comments are to be taken as the same as Labours “Free” childcare, Michael Cullen NZ cannot afford taxcuts (pre 2005 electon) then giving them to us,& Helen Clarks interview with Bob McCoskie on Radio Rhema re S59.
    I want more for NZ and what I can see Lab are not displaying anything that will move us forward. I was hoping Nats had a great plan (Like Obama) there is none, and the left have nothing to offer as well.

  20. The Two Faces of John Key

  21. John 22

    Politians, they have lied in the past, they are lying today and they will be lying tomorrow. When will we ever learn!

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    A briefing to the Minister of Education reveals 20,000 at-risk students can’t be found, undermining claims by Hekia Parata that a new funding model would ensure additional funding reached students identified as at-risk, says Labour’s Education spokesperson Chris Hipkins. ...
    1 week ago
  • Crime continues to rise
    Overall crime is up five per cent and the Government just doesn’t seem to care, says Labour’s Police Spokesperson Stuart Nash. ...
    1 week ago
  • Treasury fritters $10 million on failed state house sell off
    The Treasury has wasted $10 million in two years on the National Government's flawed state house sell off programme, including nearly $5.5 million on consultants, says Labour Finance spokesperson Grant Robertson. "New Zealand needs more state housing than ever, with ...
    1 week ago
  • National slow to learn new trade lessons post TPPA
    Yesterday, the Minister for Trade misused economic data in order to try to make the case for more so-called ‘trade agreements’ like the TPPA which are actually deregulatory straitjackets in disguise. In welcoming a Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade ...
    GreensBy Barry Coates
    1 week ago
  • Skilled migrant wages plummeting under National
    Wages have plummeted for people with skilled migrant visas working in low-skilled occupations, driving down wages for workers in a number of industries, says Labour’s Immigration Spokesperson Iain Lees-Galloway. “Documents acquired by Labour under the Official Information Act reveal that ...
    1 week ago
  • Child abuse apology needed
    The Government's failure to act on recommendations from Judge Henwood, based on years of work by the Confidential Listening and Assistance Service (CLAS) will further undermine any faith victims may have put into the process, says Labour’s Children’s Spokesperson Jacinda ...
    1 week ago
  • Reserve Bank again highlights National’s housing failure
    National’s failure to deal with the housing crisis in New Zealand is once again being exposed by the Reserve Bank today, in a scathing assessment of the Government’s response, says Labour Finance spokesperson Grant Robertson “Governor Wheeler is clearly worried ...
    1 week ago
  • Palm Oil Labelling: Possible Progress?
    On Friday, the Minister for Food Safety, along with her Australian colleagues finally looked at the issue of mandatory labelling of palm oil. We’ve been calling for mandatory labelling for years and we were hoping that the Ministers would agree ...
    GreensBy Mojo Mathers
    1 week ago
  • National: Fails to achieve
    The ineffectiveness of the National Government’s approach to schooling has been highlighted by the latest Trends in International Maths and Science Study (TIMSS) report released overnight, Labour’s Education spokesperson Chris Hipkins says. ...
    1 week ago
  • Faster into Homes – a new pathway for first home buyers
    This week Parliament will select another members’ bill from the cookie tin (I kid you not, it really is a cookie tin) and I’ve just launched a new bill I’m hoping will get pulled – to help people get into ...
    GreensBy Gareth Hughes
    1 week ago
  • Selling off our state housing stock isn’t working for NZers
    I want to end homelessness and ensure that everyone has a warm, safe, dry home. This National Government has let down New Zealanders, especially the thousands of New Zealanders who are struggling with something so basic and important as housing. ...
    GreensBy Marama Davidson
    1 week ago
  • Government needs to ensure fair deal on EQC assessments
    Kiwis affected by earthquakes might not get a fair deal if the Government pushes ahead with secret plans to let private insurers take over the assessment of claims, says Labour’s Canterbury spokesperson Megan Woods. “Under questioning from Labour the Government ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Key’s priorities the real ‘load of nonsense’
    The Prime Minister’s fixation with tax cuts, despite a failure to pay down any debt and growing pressure on public services is the real ‘load of nonsense’, says Labour Finance spokesperson Grant Robertson.  “We’re getting mixed messages from National. John ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Free Speech and Hate Speech
    Last week we were very concerned to hear that an Auckland imam, Dr Anwar Sahib, had been preaching divisive and derogatory messages about Jewish people and women during his sermons. It was a disturbing incident coming at the end of ...
    GreensBy James Shaw
    2 weeks ago
  • Young Kiwis struggling under record mortgage debt
    The Government needs to step in and start building affordable homes for first homebuyers now more than ever, says Leader of the Opposition Andrew Little. ...
    2 weeks ago