Open mike 12/01/2025

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, January 12th, 2025 - 20 comments
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For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

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20 comments on “Open mike 12/01/2025 ”

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  1. SPC 1
    12 January 2025 at 7:22 am

    What is a libertarian? Is it liberation from shared community with others?

    Thus no regulation of the landlord, or the activities of the corporation, domestic or foreign as to the public commons.

    Is it making the ownership of wealth sovereign and ending any tax on wealth and capital gain?

    The no society with others would mean any government which acts in defence of the commons becomes a crime against private wealth (for which it must make compensation to its sovereign, the investing corporation). For organised capital is the libertarian God.

    And this religion rules over nations and provides those with no public commons a master to rule over them.

    To understand, what libertarian identity means, allows the cynicism in this column to be understood.

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360544306/new-zealand-where-we-live-not-who-we-are

    It says because the Maori defend their treaty claims, then there can be no public commons, no nation state and thus the libertarian must be allowed to rule – they have only their class and origin. And this is their land because there is no CG, no estate tax (the only one of its type in the OECD) and from it they extract wealth for them and theirs and no one else, only so many can be rich and sorted at a time.

    It also means those who serve the cult of mammon, form a temporary alliance with majoritarian settler privilege against the protection of the land and its indigenous peoples rights.

    Exploiting their voting power for profit to the few. And if the common settler realises that, they can go live in Oz for better pay for all the libertarian cares. And that applies to the migrant worker all the same.

    • KJT 1.1
      12 January 2025 at 8:43 am

      A Libertarian is primarily a hypocrite.

      Examples. They are big on "Property rights". Once they have stolen something from the commons they get to keep it. "Small Government", so long as it supplies police, military and Union busters to protect them and their "property", and regulation to support the same.

      In other words the same as someone said about economists. "Constructing a (seemingly) moral justification for greed.

    • Binders full of women 1.2
      12 January 2025 at 4:40 pm

      You can def be both a libertarian and a believer in community.

      • SPC 1.2.1
        12 January 2025 at 5:22 pm

        Sure, the gated community.

        • Binders full of women 1.2.1.1
          12 January 2025 at 8:13 pm

          While I wouldn't choose to live in a gated community… my libetarianism wouldn't prevent others eg retirement village, hippy commune, Gloriavale (minus the oppression of minors), The Green School or papa kainga etc.

  2. Res Publica 2
    12 January 2025 at 8:57 am

    I fundamentally disagree with the notion that New Zealand is “just a place” or that our identity is becoming purely transactional. As a Pākehā, I don’t identify with my so-called "European ancestry"—I’ve never even been to Europe! This country is not only where I live; it’s who I am.

    New Zealand isn’t just a geographical location or an economy—it’s a promise.

    • To Māori, it’s the promise that their rights, culture, and sovereignty as guaranteed under Te Tiriti o Waitangi will be upheld and respected.
    • To more recent immigrants, it’s the promise that their place in our society isn’t determined by the colour of their skin, their religion, or their heritage, but by their willingness to contribute and belong.
    • To all New Zealanders, it’s the promise that our value as citizens isn’t determined by wealth or class, but by our commitment to looking after each other and building a stronger, fairer community.

    Yes, identity is evolving, and in some ways, it always has been. But far from “segregating” ourselves, I see this evolution as a recognition of the diverse threads that weave together to make us who we are. For Māori, introducing themselves with their iwi isn’t about separating themselves from the nation—it’s about grounding their identity in the history and whakapapa that is central to their connection to these islands. That doesn’t detract from being a Kiwi; it enriches it.

    This country’s identity is not diminished because we’ve moved beyond the narrow, bicultural frame of the past. It’s growing stronger because we’re learning to embrace the full spectrum of who we are—Tangata Whenua, Tangata Tiriti, and everyone who calls this place home.

    If anything has eroded our sense of collective identity, it’s not an expansion of our understanding of what it means to be a Kiwi, but a narrowing of our focus on what binds us together. Libertarianism, with its relentless focus on individual rights and its morally and intellectually bankrupt creed, has contributed to this erosion. It rationalizes selling out everything that makes New Zealand great to protect the interests of the very rich at the expense of everyone else. It reflects the darker impulses of capitalism, prioritizing self-interest and profit over community, equality, and collective well-being.

    New Zealand is at its best when we honour Te Tiriti, celebrate diversity, and put people and community above individual gain. The challenge is not to retreat into nostalgia for a supposedly simpler time but to step forward with purpose, honouring the promises that make this country more than just a place to live.

    New Zealand is not just where we are; it’s who we choose to be.

    • Ad 2.1
      12 January 2025 at 10:09 am

      +100. Lovely.

    • Bearded Git 2.2
      12 January 2025 at 10:44 am

      Superbly put Res.

    • bwaghorn 2.3
      12 January 2025 at 12:08 pm

      But surely the path to peace on earth is for us to leave behind archaic beliefs of separate races , classes, countries and gods , i have no time for the libaterian small government cash is king mind set but don't throw the baby out with the bath water.

      • Res Publica 2.3.1
        12 January 2025 at 12:41 pm

        Sure, that sounds great!

        But we have to be careful that building shared values and vision doesn't look like those with power imposing their views on everyone else.

        So for now, the way forward looks like embracing our differences while highlighting the things that bind is together: both as citizens, and human beings.

        I suspect a better, more fairer society is always going to be a work in progress. Like that room in your house you never quite get around to repainting because you can't agree on a colour scheme.

        But that doesnt mean we shouldn't start fighting for it.

      • SPC 2.3.2
        12 January 2025 at 5:56 pm

        The libertarian wants a global order of rule designed by and for the rich and sorted (it is very much class rule).

        One where power is about the transportability of wealth/capital to rule and reign where-ever those who have it go, or choose to invest.

        Not being one based on the feudal landed gentry order of kingdom land areas does not make it an improvement – in may ways it reduces democracy and returns us to that era of power in the hands of the oligarchic few.

        Whereas the (democratic) nation state is part of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights order, it is also premised on co-operation, such as on environment and labour standards.

        Grant infers a Faustian bargain where the rich work with the race and religion supremacy culture of the mob – law and order against “x” (these giving the neo-liberal regime popularity within the nation state).

  3. joe90 3
    12 January 2025 at 2:51 pm

    I feel sorry for Naomi Klein when people confuse her with this moron.

    @donachaidh.bsky.social‬

    Oh my god you fucking simpleton, the CA is for California. Ontario, CA is in San Bernardino County.

    https://bsky.app/profile/did:plc:l2x3nn7edvmirt4od4iuvhb7/post/3lfirv7juwc2u?

    @shayan86.bsky.social‬

    In the space of 24 hours, Naomi Wolf has claimed that the fires in LA are an actual war or foreign invasion, a plot to kill people to destroy evidence of Covid vaccine adverse effects, weather manipulation, a deliberate bombing campaign, and mass spraying of mood stabilisers.

    https://bsky.app/profile/shayan86.bsky.social/post/3lfie3v4pcs23

  4. Jenny 4
    12 January 2025 at 3:16 pm

    '

    The Jerusalem Post Asks:

    " …..which countries can be considered "safe" for Israeli tourists with military service backgrounds, especially those who participated actively in the current conflict?"

    And answers itself:

    …..Argentina, Costa Rica, and Mexico—though signatories to the Rome Statute—are considered safe for Israeli tourists. Argentina, in particular, under President Javier Milagrosa, a strong supporter of Israel, poses minimal risk to visiting Israelis…..

    Among the popular destinations for Israeli travelers, particularly those who have completed military service, are 28 Latin American countries….

    ….due to recent developments, travel to these countries is now discouraged due to potential legal risks.

    What is the safest place for Israeli tourists abroad?

    The US remains the safest destination in the Americas for Israeli tourists, as it is not a member of the International Criminal Court (ICC). Meanwhile, Canada, though a signatory to the Rome Statute and recognizing the ICC's authority, has shown no indication of pursuing legal actions against Israeli visitors….

    https://www.jpost.com/international/article-836188

    New Zealand like Canada, has shown no indication of pursuing legal actions against IDF visitors. Unlike Australian border officials, New Zealand doesn't even question visiting IDF soldiers for any possible involvement in committing war crimes.

    Now that many former popular South American destinations for IDF soldiers to spend their vacatjons are closed to them, will New Zealand become a popular place, above many others, where IDF soldiers on leave who have committed will now come for their holiday?

    Will Mr Yuval Vagdani, for instance be arrested, if he comes here for his next vacation.

    Seeking Justice: Tracking IDF War Criminals Around The World

    Beginning @21:30 minutes:

    We are not filing cases against every Israeli soldier.

    But, if you blew up homes of people, if you killed people, if you looted, if you were a sniper and you were sniping at people. Well then you know yourself that you have done criminal stuff.

    And well in that case of course, we will file cases against you…..

    @22:04

    I heard Mr [Yuval] Vagani, when he came back to Israel, he gave an interview to an Israeli paper and what did he say?

    He doubled down, he said, "Oh I uh, I've done, uh posted the beautiful explosion and uh and, they are acting as if I killed children."

    We don't know if you killed people, but we are not suing Mr Vagdani because we think he killed people, we don't know about that, maybe may he did, but destroying civilian infrastructure, destroying homes of people, Oh and by the way, in the case in Brazil the plaintiffs were the owners of the houses that he [Yuval Vagdani], destroyed, and that he's again qualifying as "beautiful explosions". These are people, these are journalists, who are fully civilian have no contacts with any organization whatsoever. One of [the plaintiffs] even had a work permit in Israel, so you can imagine the level of screening that you undergo before getting that work permit.

    One of our main plentiffs who is now living abroad and that's why he dared, because many people do not dare to file cases…..

    @23:23

    International criminal law, but also war crimes, is a whole spectrum of things.

    And for us, somebody who destroyed a whole neighborhood and is boasting about it, is a war criminal, and this is what also the judge saw. because the proof was damning….

    [machine transcript lightly edited for clarity. J.]

  5. adam 5
    12 January 2025 at 3:37 pm

    Is it just me or is Claudia Sheinbaum just a wonderful foil for trump.

    At every turn when the orange one speaks ill of Mexico she hits back hard with wit and total class.

    From her talk about it's Mexicans dying so yanks can snort, smoke, or swallow anything they like, whilst Mexicans die. To the latest dig about the gulf of Mexico.

    Long may she keep the rational responses coming.

    https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/us-news/donald-trump-trolled-mexican-president-34450181

  6. joe90 6
    12 January 2025 at 6:57 pm

    Delusions of deity from the Chekist thug.

    .

    The Kremlin informed Russians that Putin had asked the country’s top priest “to engrave his own initials” on chains for the crosses worn by soldiers.

    Patriarch Kirill and Putin were filmed together: “Here are crosses, as well as other pectoral icons, with the image of the holy equal-to-the-apostles Grand Duke Vladimir, the founder of our Rus, our state, the one who defended our Fatherland with a sword in his hands, and who is now also such a symbol of the gathering of the Russian land. But, in addition, he is also your heavenly patron” the priest said, addressing Putin. “So, I think that this will be doubly intelligible and pleasant for all the soldiers who receive these images,” continued Kirill, before consecrating the necklaces.

    Russian Kremlinologists were shocked. The president’s initials on crosses for soldiers was definitely a sign of a completely new development. “We could not even imagine anything like that happening before,” Putin’s former speech writer, Abbas Galliamov, told The Daily Beast in an interview on Saturday. “Putin was much more level-headed before, he did not pretend to have a holy status.”

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/from-president-to-divine-protector-putin-elevates-himself-to-new-heights-with-godly-rebrand/

  7. joe90 7
    12 January 2025 at 7:25 pm

    Thread.

    Michael Hobbes

    ‪@michaelhobbes.bsky.social‬

    Been devouring this the last few weeks and I cannot believe how essential it feels for understanding our current moment https://susanfaludi.com/backlash-chapter.html

    https://bsky.app/profile/did:plc:j76trmiofvaxxpvx2vnb2vwf/post/3lfhxjd5wfs2z?

    • CD 7.1
      15 January 2025 at 12:50 pm

      The excerpt of this book from the link has some laugh out loud moments. The Sherrif who says since women have been "free" they've been committing more crimes, and the result of a survey that says a woman's lot hasn't much improved – made by a cigarette company who marketed their product to women in 1990. The multi level irony! Ha! Yeah, some sobering realities too. I've seen a discussion about this book from what I would call the Feminist Right, if that isn't an (eventual) oxymoron. The cracks in the narrative begin to open up pretty quickly. Some solutions already exist.

      I tack this here because these books are sometimes like reverse self-help instructionals. It's not that shit don't happen, it's that the meaning, the cause, and the solution, can't be arrived at by the same method.

      What your Gran got up to all those years ago.

      Forgive the specific example – it's just one that most people can easily grasp: Men, 'cus they like shootiing things, and Women, 'cus they get things done. (Sorry, I couldn't resist.) Don't focus on the Era, or the geography, just follow the themes: Women in heavy industry push social and industrial horizons.

      Also be aware there are some unpleasant descriptions how and why further along the story e.g. industrial accidents solved after the fact. Let us acknowledge their sacrifice as we continue.

      You could argue we are getting "softer" than our great/grandparents, but to counter I would argue that during 1939, the UK Government was worried middle class men wouldn't hold up under military discipline, and made plans to meet the challenge. The rest, as they say, is History. I'm also not saying we should force women into the life, or ask them to accept any of the existing structural arrangements of heavy/Trades industry. God forbid.

      We don't actually need a war to further ourselves and correct our social errors. We don't need an enemy. If anything, the enemy is the idea we need an enemy to motivate us into anything. As far as women are concerned, Technology allows us to be physically weaker and more effective at the same time. Gender-Role Free Local Industry is not only a necessity for NZ facing the pre-Libertarian Hellscape, but a platform for constructive social change. With a coherent direction, it both eliminates the old class divisions of the Left, (Yay, advancement, long over due!) supports innovation, potentially increases rewards, and reveals the why. Forget Culture Wars, walk around it and try Cultural Expansion.