Open mike 02/06/2019

Written By: - Date published: 7:00 am, June 2nd, 2019 - 161 comments
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161 comments on “Open mike 02/06/2019 ”

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  1. johnm 1
    2 June 2019 at 7:08 am

    U.N. Special Rapporteur Calls for Julian Assange to Be Freed, Citing “Psychological Torture”

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErW1taJEPrs

  2. johnm 2
    2 June 2019 at 7:16 am

    On this episode of Going Underground, we speak to UN Rapporteur on Torture Nils Melzer about his assessment of Julian Assange’s condition. He says Assange has shown signs of psychological torture and that he has not seen anything as bad as the WikiLeaks founder’s case in his 20-year career. Next, we speak to former president of Ecuador, Rafael Correa, on the arrest and imprisonment of Julian Assange. He describes his successor Lenin Moreno as a traitor for allowing the UK to arrest Assange. Correa says Moreno has violated asylum law and talks about corruption allegations against the current president.

    • Andre 2.1
      2 June 2019 at 8:28 am

      " … he has not seen anything as bad as the WikiLeaks founder’s case in his 20-year career."

      Considering what kinds of things went on in Abu Ghraib and Gitmo, let alone in places that don't even pretend to pay lip service to human rights, anyone making a statement like that is utterly lacking in any credibility whatsoever.

      • francesca 2.1.1
        2 June 2019 at 8:38 am

        He is referring to the collective might and weight of three repressive democratic states brought to bear on one man

        I suggest his experience of these matters eclipses yours by some measure

      • johnm 2.1.2
        2 June 2019 at 8:41 am

        Andre: I don't think any U.N. human rights advocates would have been allowed entry to Gitmo or Abu Ghraib. Other places are war zones. He has a right not to risk his life going to such places. I do not give credibility to your assertion in the least.

    • johnm 2.2
      2 June 2019 at 9:52 am

      I have asked before and I ask again. If this were a dissident publisher in Russia, what would the UK political and media class be saying about his being dragged out by armed police, and convicted and sentenced to jail by a judge without a jury, just three hours later, after a farce of a “trial” in which the judge insulted him and called him a “narcissist” before he had said anything in his defence? The Western media would be up in arms if that happened in Russia. Here, they cheer it on.

      Julian’s personal possessions have been seized by the Ecuadoreans to be given to the US government. These include not only computers but his legal and medical papers. This is yet another example of completely illegal state action against him. Furthermore, any transfer must involve the stolen material physically transiting London, and the British government is taking no steps to prevent that, which is yet another of multiple signs of the degree of international governmental coordination behind the flimsy pretence of independent judicial action.

      https://www.lewrockwell.com/2019/06/no_author/the-unrelenting-state/

      • vto 2.2.1
        2 June 2019 at 10:24 am

        "The Western media would be up in arms if that happened in Russia. Here, they cheer it on."

        Very well highlighted johnm

        The poor old Russians have been so vilified over the years that we have lost all track of our relative cultures …

    • johnm 2.3
      2 June 2019 at 4:27 pm

      The final punishment of Julian Assange reminds journalists their job is to uncover what the state keeps hidden
      By Robert Fisk

      If we do our job, we will expose the same vile mendacity of our masters that has led to the clamour of hatred towards Assange, Manning and Snowden

      So let’s forget – just for a moment – the slaughter of civilians, the lethal cruelty of US mercenaries (some involved in child-trafficking), the killing of Reuters staff by US forces in Baghdad, the army of innocents held in Guantanamo, the torture, the official lies, the fake casualty figures, the embassy lies, the American training of Egypt’s torturers and all the other crimes uncovered by the activities of Assange and Manning.

      Let’s suppose that what they revealed was good rather than bad, that the diplomatic and military documents provided a shining example of a great and moral country and demonstrated those very noble and shining ideals which the land of the free has always espoused. Let’s pretend that US forces in Iraq repeatedly gave their lives to protect civilians, that they denounced their allies’ tortures, that they treated the inmates of Abu Ghraib (many of them completely innocent) not with sexual cruelty but with respect and kindness; that they broke the power of the mercenaries and sent them back to prison in the US in chains; that they owned up, however apologetically, to the cemeteries of men, women and children whom they sent to an early grave in the Iraq war.

      http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/51687.htm

  3. johnm 3
    2 June 2019 at 7:34 am

    Peter Pavimentov • 6 hours agoThe internationally organized moves for liberating Assange make it politically more expedient to have him expire while imprisoned. He is apparently already in intensive medical care. That would solve all political complications for Britain, Sweden and the US.

    The US and it's allies care not for what the UN says against them….look the US and Britain invaded Iraq which lead to the death of 100s of thousands of people….against the UN.The UN has already spoken about Assange….they brushed it off….all of them, the State and the MSM.

    kurumba Brandon the Top-Hatted Commie • 11 hours ago

    The MAIN target for criticism re Julian Assange should be first and foremost the AUSTRALIAN PUBLIC AND AUSTRALIAN REGIME. Assange is one of THEIR own yet very little criticism is directed against a country who portrays itself as "democratic" and "freedom loving" when in reality it totally supports – including most of the population – US Aggressions and sanctions. Assange has repeatedly pleaded for help from HIS OWN COUNTRY but he has received nothing. Worse, the so called "centre-left" including ex-PM Julia Gillard have described Wikileaks as quote "a criminal organisation". Assange's case really highlights what Australia has been for decades: a total US-British lackey and coward who is forever fearful of standing up to US Imperial terror and propaganda.

    • mpledger 3.1
      2 June 2019 at 12:56 pm

      Bridges "received" confidential papers he knew he was not entitled to. Assange "received" confidential papers which was legal because of journalisitic priviledge.

      The American are after Assange because they said he gave Manning verbal help. The attack on the confidentiallity of budget papers was partly done on beehive premises with beehive resources.

      Assange has the might of the most powerful nation aimed at him, the police decide not to take Simon's transgression any further.

      So, it's been ironic watching those who attack Assange on one hand, defend Simon on the other.

  4. Sacha 4
    2 June 2019 at 8:03 am

    Meanwhile, in New Zealand ..

    • francesca 4.1
      2 June 2019 at 8:30 am

      Meanwhile in NZ we would prefer to stick our heads in the sand.After all, what does a free press and torture mean to us?

      Let rogue states run riot in their efforts to enforce a rapacious economic system, it has little to do with us

      • Sacha 4.1.1
        2 June 2019 at 8:37 am

        Torture? Yes, do explain the relevance.

        • francesca 4.1.1.1
          2 June 2019 at 8:40 am

          pearls before swine..

          • Sacha 4.1.1.1.1
            2 June 2019 at 8:43 am

            It's such a prevalent problem for the labour movement in this country, after all. Nothing more important to discuss here.

            • johnm 4.1.1.1.1.1
              2 June 2019 at 8:55 am

              NZ issues are covered in depth in the main blog. Open Mike is for issues that concern us as individuals.

              • Sacha …
                2 June 2019 at 8:59 am

                Ah, that expectation explains a lot. Thank you.

              • Wayne …
                2 June 2019 at 9:04 am

                What evidence is that Assange has ever been tortured, even psychologically?

                Basically he was going to be extradited to Sweden and pretty soon thereafter he was in the Equadorian Embassy.

                It is true the UK authorities did not withdraw the arrest warrant, but could they really be expected to do so?

                Assange would have been vastly better off if he had gone through the justice system of Sweden. All he did was delay the inevitable and probably at considerable psychological damage to himself due to self imposed isolation.

                • francesca …
                  2 June 2019 at 9:15 am

                  Ah, Wayne, the special rapporteur on torture for the UN human Rights Commission probably has far more expertise on this matter than you. If you haven't read the report or heard of it you've been living under a rock

                  And if you can't see how the Assange case in Sweden has been grossly politicised you're probably practising wilful ignorance

                  https://www.thelocal.se/20190531/un-expert-accuses-sweden-of-joining-collective-persecution-of-assange

                  Read the link. The UNCHR mandates special rapporteurs because of their expertise in the field.These are the guys who determine whether torture has occurred or not

                  Mezler has that expertise and is far more qualified on the subject than you .

                  Although you probably have some knowledge on the other side of the ledger

                  • Morrissey …
                    2 June 2019 at 10:00 am

                    Francesca, you are a serious and concerned individual. Dr Mapp is the very opposite of that. He's been lying about torture, and defending torturers, and telling lies about journalists for years. Here he is being questioned in parliament in 2011….

                    Keith Locke: Has the Government done anything to follow up on the welfare of the Afghan civilians who were mistreated and tortured on that occasion, in order to provide some form of compensation, for example, given that it was the SAS that handed them over to mistreatment at that point?

                    Hon Dr WAYNE MAPP: Well, the mistreating authority was in fact the United States; surely the responsibility must lie with the United States, not New Zealand.

                    Keith Locke: Will the Government allow an independent inquiry to be held, so that the hard-won evidence of the journalist Jon Stephenson and the evidence that the Government has can be put to independent examination, and the full facts of whether New Zealand is handing over prisoners to mistreatment or failing to follow them up properly in Afghan detention can be brought out into the public domain?

                    Hon Dr WAYNE MAPP: Can I say this: the New Zealand Defence Force has investigated the allegations by Mr Stephenson—particularly those relating to 2002. Those allegations have been proven to be false, and I am frankly surprised that Mr Locke continues to rely on those allegations, which have been proven to be false. I also say on this issue that the National Government—and, I would like to think, other members in this House—believes the information given to us by the New Zealand Defence Force. I believe Lieutenant General Jerry Matepārae and Lieutenant General Jones on this issue.

                    ....ad nauseam.

                    https://morrisseybreen.blogspot.com/2018/01/keith-locke-goes-after-min-of-defence.html

                • johnm …
                  2 June 2019 at 9:23 am

                  What happened is Assange had consensual unprotected sex. The woman later grew apprehensive and asked him to take an STD test. He foolishly refused. She then went to the police and asked them if he could be constrained to do a test. He has never been charged even in absence with rape either by the woman or the police. he was freely allowed to leave Sweden. The torturous aspect I suggest you do a little research and it'll be as clear as a bell. We all have to educate ourselves sometimes. It's well publicised that the U$ is after him and intend to lock him up in a prison hell hole until dead. Mainly for the exposure of war crimes in IRAQ.

                  • Wayne …
                    2 June 2019 at 9:32 am

                    Johnm,

                    That is your view of the alleged crime in Sweden. Obviously the Swedish authorities had a different view. And were prepared to file for extradition in the UK and a trial in Sweden.

                    Both countries have an independent judiciary of high repute, and Assange should have trusted that.

                    • Morrissey …
                      2 June 2019 at 9:49 am

                      Thanks for showing us just how mindlessly obedient and authoritarian you have to be to be a National Party minister.

                    • Wayne …
                      2 June 2019 at 10:13 am

                      Morrisey,

                      I am pretty sure that most members of the current government also believe that the UK and Sweden have an independent judiciary.

                      I would have thought it is axiomatic that one of the fundamental principles of our democratic system is that we do trust the judiciary to be independent and impartial, even if they do make mistakes from time to time.

                      Since you mention Afghanistan , it will not have escaped your notice that I thought an independent Inquiry was necessary as soon as it was apparent there were credible allegations of civilian casualties (by Jon Stephenson in 2014 in his programme on Maori TV).

                      But nevertheless, I do trust Lt General’s Mateparae and Jones.

                    • Morrissey …
                      2 June 2019 at 10:16 am

                      In the 1930s people like you counselled concerned Germans to trust jurists like Roland Freisler.

                    • Wayne []
                      3 June 2019 at 9:44 am

                      The Nazi comparison is offensive, as well you know. But not unsurprising from you.

                    • Pat …
                      2 June 2019 at 10:21 am

                      Isnt trust the problem however Wayne….the reported instances where pressure has been applied to sections of the judiciary impacting the decision process on whether to prosecute or not are fairly widespread in many jurisdictions…..the level of trust will relate to the level of belief in the level of instance

                    • Psycho Milt …
                      2 June 2019 at 11:43 am

                      Wayne: you're wasting your time. Morrissey's responses to other people's arguments are a random selection from: appeal to authority; link to an irrelevant YouTube clip or quote; declarations of what a terrible person you are.

                    • johnm …
                      2 June 2019 at 3:18 pm

                      Wayne: ERR,no these are the facts of the situation and are not my view at all.

                      The byzantine insanity of the Swedish prosecutor's position:

                      "There is still probable cause to suspect that Mr. Assange committed rape," Swedish prosecutor Eva-Marie Persson said at a Monday press conference . She does not state clearly what that "probable cause is"!?! Why because there is none.

                      https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2019/05/swedish-authorities-re-open-rape-investigation-against-julian-assange/

                      Sweden is not clean any more. It's cooperated with U$ war criminal authorities to perform extreme renditions from their sovereign territory.

                      Sweden Violated Torture Ban in CIA Rendition
                      https://www.hrw.org/news/2006/11/09/sweden-violated-torture-ban-cia-rendition

                      What is my opinion is the whole business stinks and is a filthy set up against this man!

                    • johnm …
                      2 June 2019 at 3:57 pm

                      The byzantine insanity of the Swedish prosecutor's position:

                      "There is still probable cause to suspect that Mr. Assange committed rape," Swedish prosecutor Eva-Marie Persson said at a Monday press conference . She does not state clearly what that "probable cause is"!?! Why because there is none.

                      We choose to before any evidence believe that Assange committed rape even though no one has accused him of this but we suspect that nevertheless it happened. There is we believe a probable cause for our fantasy but we are not letting on to you good folks what that is yet until we decide what the feck it is! Jesus H Christ! Am I in a loony asylum!?

                      You could arrest half the males on the Planet on that basis!

                    • WeTheBleeple …
                      2 June 2019 at 6:19 pm

                      [Deleted pointless swearing and insult that adds nothing to the discussion – Incognito]

                  • Psycho Milt …
                    2 June 2019 at 11:39 am

                    johnm: have you thought about it what it looks like when a man explains from a position of ignorance how the rape allegation against that man must be false? Look up the term "rape culture" and see whether you still want to continue mansplaining rape allegations away.

                    • Morrissey …
                      2 June 2019 at 1:50 pm

                      Our good friend "Psycho Milt" attempts to comfort the afflicted. No, not a political prisoner—nothing like that. Psycho Milt has, rather, chosen to fly to the rescue of an ex-Minister of "Defence", one who has been recorded in Hansard claiming, in a parliamentary pantomiming of high seriousness, that he and the rest of the Key regime "believes the information given to us by the New Zealand Defence Force. I believe Lieutenant General Jerry Matepārae and Lieutenant General Jones…."

                      So, yes, this is someone who seriously needs help. Whether or not Psycho Milt gives him any is doubtful. Let's see what the Psycho one has to say, and then deal with each of his points….

                      Wayne: you're wasting your time.

                      Wayne wasted everyone's time for many years as Minister of "Defence", telling lies about journalists and defending murderers and torturers for no other reason than that they belong to the New Zealand military. Why should he not waste a bit of his own time?

                      Morrissey's responses to other people's arguments are a random selection from:

                      "Random"? How so? Does anybody—even those who really detest this writer, i.e., moi—really think my sources are chosen at random?

                      appeal to authority;

                      I cite authoritative academics and journalists, of course. Experts, in other words. You, on the other hand, recycle black propaganda from the most disreputable and discredited and scurrilous sources. You are on a par with Wayne and his declaration of belief in the assurances of "the New Zealand Defence Force… Lieutenant General Jerry Matepārae and Lieutenant General Jones…."

                      link to an irrelevant YouTube clip or quote;

                      Really? Such as?

                      declarations of what a terrible person you are.

                      I think someone who knowingly lies to Parliament is indeed pretty terrible. What do you think of that behaviour, sir?

                    • johnm …
                      2 June 2019 at 3:35 pm

                      I'm sure Pamela Anderson, former Baywatch star, who has visited him to support him both in the Embassy and in Belmarsh would not have done these actions if assange were guilty of "rape culture." She may be a sex symbol but she isn't stupid! Re: Psycho Milt

                    • Psycho Milt …
                      2 June 2019 at 4:13 pm

                      Morrissey: no, Assange isn't a political prisoner, not unless the Yanks get their hands on him.

                      Wayne Mapp was a politician, so I'd be very surprised if he hadn't found himself required to at least obfuscate or find words that put his government in a better light than a plain reading of the facts would have, because that goes with the territory. Your quote of him saying something in Parliament that was later shown to be wrong isn't proof that he lied at the time, and is a fine example of item two in my proposed list of Morrissey responses: an irrelevant YouTube clip or quote.

                    • Psycho Milt …
                      2 June 2019 at 4:16 pm

                      johnm: you're effectively saying that Pamela Anderson wouldn't support Assange if he was rapey, which is another rape culture item.

                • Anne …
                  2 June 2019 at 10:22 am

                  Assange would have been vastly better off if he had gone through the justice system of Sweden.

                  The problem was, Assange and his team knew the rape claims were being used as a means by which he could be extradited to Sweden. And lurking in the background was the FBI who appeared to have come to some arrangement with the Swedish authorities that, at some point, he would be passed onto them for extradition to the US. That was the basis for him hiding in the Equadorian Embassy and I doubt he or anyone else knew it would last as long as it did.

                  I have no idea whether Assange committed those two rapes and I venture to suggest nobody else does either. Those who have taken sides are doing so without any evidence-based knowledge that I know of anyway.

                  Rape and/or sexual harrassment occur multiple times on a daily basis in every town/city in the world. Most women at some stage of their life have been through it. And up until very recent times most women did not report it either to their superiors or the police because the attitude was: stop bothering us with your petty complaints. Suck it up. It was probably your fault anyway.

                  Given that attitude, why was Assange's alleged rape complaint given so much more prominence from the moment they were made? It came across as a bit fishy to me given my own experiences.

                  And, in the event someone misinterprets my comment:

                  I am neither a supporter nor a detractor of Assange because I don't know the truth and I make no assumptions until the truth becomes clear.

                  • Morrissey …
                    2 June 2019 at 10:31 am

                    I am neither a supporter nor a detractor of Assange…

                    ?????

                    Do you support the right of journalists to report on government crimes or not?

                  • Andre …
                    2 June 2019 at 10:45 am

                    Anne, you got any credible linkys for the allegation the FBI had a secret arrangement with the Swedes to ship him on to the US? I've seen that claim plenty of times from the blindly pro-Assange crowd, but not yet from any sources look even slightly impartial. Counter to that is the 2013 reporting that Obama and Eric Holder had decided against going after Assange because of the "New York Times problem", that going after Assange would be chilling for legitimate journalism.

                    What is your opinion on the appropriate path forward with Assange and why? My view is if Sweden revives the extradition request, then Assange should be sent to Sweden, to answer the rape allegation. But he should definitely not be sent to the US, since the superseding indictment issued for his publishing work makes it clear the Drumpf administration wants to use him for an attack on the free press.

                    From a practical point of view, it should be more difficult for the US to extract Assange from Sweden than from the UK, since the UK and Sweden both have to agree to send him on to the US, and because a European Arrest Warrant was used, there's a further European court Assange can appeal to. BTW, this was also true back in 2012 when Assange first scarpered to the Ecuadorian embassy

                    • Morrissey …
                      2 June 2019 at 10:52 am

                      "Abstaining from the witchhunt would have classed the dissenter as an enemy. Stalin was supported by fanatics, cynics, sadists and moral cowards."

                      —-Donald Rayfield, Stalin and His Hangmen: An Authoritative Portrait of a Tyrant and Those Who Served Him (Viking, 2004)

                    • patricia bremner …
                      2 June 2019 at 11:50 am

                      However Sweden gave no indication they would NOT send him to the USA.

                    • Andre …
                      2 June 2019 at 1:24 pm

                      @patricia: some thoughts here on whether there is any way Sweden legally could give a guarantee not to extradite to the US. In short, it probably legally can't, and even trying would open a whole can of worms.

                      http://klamberg.blogspot.com/2012/08/sequencing-and-discretion-of-government.html

                      https://newmatilda.com/2016/02/08/julian-assange-hero-and-villian/

                      Why on earth would the Swedes inflict that on themselves for so little payoff? Especially when there's every chance Assange would just break his word anyway, as he subsequently did with his promise to give himself up to the US if Manning was granted clemency.

      • Morrissey 4.1.2
        2 June 2019 at 9:27 am

        Gordon Dimmack
        @GordonDimmack
        ·
        1h
        A subscriber of mine has sent me this:

        "Just spoke to Belmarsh Prison 0208 331 4400 and was told the following:
        1. You can send Mr Julian #Assange a money order of up to £250.00, out of which he will be allowed £15.50 a week for in prison purchases and this: phone calls…

        https://twitter.com/GordonDimmack?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

    • mauī 4.2
      2 June 2019 at 9:28 am

      "Meanwhile, in New Zealand .."

      Interesting conversation starter… You were saying…?

  5. esoteric pineapples 5
    2 June 2019 at 8:55 am

    "Earlier this month, tech giant Microsoft announced its solution to “protect” American elections from interference, which it has named “ElectionGuard.” The election technology is already set to be adopted by half of voting machine manufacturers and some state governments for the 2020 general election. Though it has been heavily promoted by the mainstream media in recent weeks, none of those reports have disclosed that ElectionGuard has several glaring conflicts of interest that greatly undermine its claim aimed at protecting U.S. democracy.

    In this investigation, MintPress will reveal how ElectionGuard was developed by companies with deep ties to the U.S. defense and intelligence communities and Israeli military intelligence, as well as the fact that it is far from clear that the technology would prevent foreign or domestic interference with, or the manipulation of, vote totals or other aspects of American election systems."

    https://www.mintpressnews.com/microsoft-electionguard-a-trojan-horse-for-a-military-industrial-takeover-of-us-elections/258732/

  6. Observer Tokoroa 6
    2 June 2019 at 9:03 am

    Could it be…?

    That persons who endeavour to seize the digital, published or unpublished property of nations – without permission – are likely to be caught up in a serious maelstrom.

    Having read the background of Julian Assange such as on Wikipedia, I gather that Assange has a spotted and unsettled life.

    He appears to have been given runaway, indeed lavish, support from assorted lawyers, Journalists, Newspapers and merry go-round cheer leaders. None of whom secretly took on nations such as USA, or Australia, or the UK.

    Assange's girl Friday, Chelsea Mannering did. Julian partially did. He suffered huge difficulty with what he had done. Fearing murder on the part of the USA.

    But the "supporters of Assange" – wanted to drag the unwise Julian through impossible violations of national security and determination.

    No Nation of any importance is going to allow even minor breaches of security to take place. Assange ran a strange – weird – gauntlet.

    Those who rubbish their own Nation, and any outsiders, are seen as treasonous. The populations of attacked Nations do not support theft and the inevitable global damage of their nation.

    Julian Assange is not a typical citizen. Not a typical Australian. The Full Psychclogy of Julian is unknown. It has always been thus.

    Hopefully, A less eratic future lies ahead for Assange, Chelsea, and Snowden.

    • francesca 6.1
      2 June 2019 at 9:17 am

      Keep digging

    • Foreign waka 6.2
      2 June 2019 at 1:37 pm

      The question remains, will we ever know the truth? With the US military being out for some serious vendetta and the threat to anyone interfering, is it any wonder that a couple of people are being made to be sacrifices for "the good of all". No surprises there. A nation that can kill presidents and pretends to be a democracy, we appeal to something they don't have. Full stop.

  7. Sacha 7
    2 June 2019 at 9:35 am

    Govt signalling shift to other investment vehicles like urban development agencies by cutting fund for inherited national infrastructure agency: http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU1905/S00934/budget-2019-govt-cuts-urban-infrastructure-fund-in-half.htm

    • greywarshark 8.1
      2 June 2019 at 3:08 pm

      From Sacha's link above at 8.

      Recreation Aotearoa Advocacy Manager, Sam Newton.

      “New Zealand has long benefited from good relationships between landowners and recreational users. Access to our bush, mountains, lakes and streams is part of what it means to be a New Zealander,” Mr Newton said.

      That point of view echoes one regularly and complacently rolled out; an example of how many are happy with the status quo that leaves many people having a ghostly presence at the fringe of society – the rabble outside the usually invisible gates.

      If being able to access our bush etc is 'part of what it means to be a New Zealander' then there are large tranches of people who are not acknowledged as being included as real NZs, as part of their birthright in their own country. They can't afford to move around their own locality, and may not be able to afford to visit their families in other parts of the country, much less go swanning off to the bush, the beach, and the public baths (which are probably more hygienic than venturing into what used to be unspoiled nature.

      When Helen Clark wanted to recreate she went off tramping in the bush and the mountains. I think I read that Theresa May goes to Switzerland. The world is dividing up into worthy of a lifestyle, and unworthy of one. The phrase about being from the wrong side of the tracks crops up USA songs, now they have spread their culture over us who tried to achieve equality. And our birthright has been up for grabs for some time. It is time we began Health Camps again, we are at that Depression level now.

    • Bearded Git 8.2
      2 June 2019 at 3:18 pm

      cheers sacha…interesting….wtf is a PCBU?

    • mac1 10.1
      2 June 2019 at 10:54 am

      Sacha, you might need to explain your rationale more here, as the article by itself seems to say differently. I am genuinely unsure of this, and would appreciate your explanation, as adequate benefit levels are very important.

      • Sacha 10.1.1
        2 June 2019 at 10:56 am

        It's a trifling move, spread over years. The WEAG recommended a far more significant urgent increase. Which part of the article did you read as saying otherwise?

        • mac1 10.1.1.1
          2 June 2019 at 12:02 pm

          Thanks for the explanation. The WEAG was mentioned by a Green commentator but the article did not talk about a far more significant increase.

          The increase spoken of is between $10 and $17 per week over and above an increase under the former calculation method.

          That's between $520 and $884 a year extra. This is on a par with the winter energy payments- for which we were grateful yesterday as the cold front came through.

          The method also puts it into line with the way my Super is calculated.

          The article said that benefit payments were expected to grow between $27 and $46 per week over four years, above inflation increases. That's a yearly increase between $1404 and $2392. The measures will affect 339,000 people and are part of a package to lift some 74000 children out of poverty. That goal is to be measured and the government held accountable by that measurement.

          Is that trifling? Remember that there are also other payments available.

          What do you suggest as a decent yet affordable benefit level? All I really know about is superannuation as a long term payment to live on.

          What did the WEAG recommend?

          I see further down you recommended some further reading. I’d appreciate a steer in that direction, too.

          • Sacha 10.1.1.1.1
            2 June 2019 at 12:07 pm

            See https://www.auckland.ac.nz/en/news/2019/05/15/what-wish-Sepuloni-had-said-welfare.html

            Here’s what WEAG actually wanted in Recommendation 20:

            Reform main benefits by:

            – increasing main benefits by between 12 percent and 47 percent.

            – increasing the abatement thresholds for: – Jobseeker Support to $150 a week – Sole Parent Support and Supported Living Payment to $150 a week and $250 a week.

            To their credit, the Budget has raised the abatement threshold more than govt was suggesting just after the WEAG report was released.

            • mac1 10.1.1.1.1.1
              2 June 2019 at 12:53 pm

              Thanks again. I'll give Prof. Susan St John's report a good read. I note the article you cite from her is dated 15 May, and pre-Budget therefore. I'd be interested to look up her actual take on the Budget provisions if there is one to be read yet.

              • Sacha …
                2 June 2019 at 1:19 pm

                Part of CPAG’s response: https://www.cpag.org.nz/news/budget-provides-relief-but-nothing-transformational/

                “The new approach signals a greater understanding of the tragic extent of the social deficits created over many years of neglect,” says Associate Professor Susan St John, CPAG’s Economics advisor. “Struggling families will benefit from the extra spending on mental health, domestic violence, and early intervention for at-risk children. But little has been done to address the serious problem of inadequate incomes.”

                CPAG says the plan to index benefits to average wage inflation is a step forward to prevent families from falling even further behind, but it doesn’t address the almost three decades of failure to index adequately. As a result of this failure, current benefit levels fall far below the real costs of living, and families who receive income from a main benefit are struggling to meet even the most basic of their children’s needs, and rely more than ever on charity to fill the gap. A substantial increase in benefits was needed.

                “Children simply cannot wait until 2020 for a meagre increase based on the previous year’s wage inflation – they need benefits to be based on actual and realistic costs of living,” says St John.

                • mac1 …
                  2 June 2019 at 1:46 pm

                  🙂 Appreciate the feedback, Sacha. Some sense and purpose amongst the trollery and the folly here.

                  • Sacha …
                    2 June 2019 at 1:57 pm

                    Cheers. I find that tiring too.

                  • Morrissey …
                    2 June 2019 at 2:16 pm

                    "Sense and purpose"? Oh, that's right—you're another supporter of state suppression of journalism, aren't you.

                    • mac1 …
                      2 June 2019 at 2:18 pm

                      Why do you think I was referring to you, Morrissey, or to your issues?

                    • Morrissey …
                      2 June 2019 at 2:20 pm

                      You're expressing—for some bizarre reason—support for Sacha, who tried to belittle and derail a discussion about the state destruction of Julian Assange this morning.

                      What's the "trollery and the folly" you're talking about? Have you actually looked at her contributions?

                    • mac1 …
                      2 June 2019 at 2:26 pm

                      I am expressing thanks for her response to me about issues to do with benefit levels. Under #10 thread. Morrissey, read my comments in context, please.

                    • Morrissey …
                      2 June 2019 at 2:34 pm

                      Sorry, Mac. My mistake.

                  • Sacha …
                    2 June 2019 at 2:33 pm

                    Sorry you copped that. Context and perspective really do elude some commenters.

  11. Jenny - How to get there?give 11
    2 June 2019 at 9:45 am

    One of the reasons why establishment historians and educators refuse to allow New Zealand history of British colonialisation and conquest and war in our schools, is that it might bring an understanding of the true nature of imperialism, conquest, plunder, colonialism, racism and war, that still has relevance today.

    How Britain stole $45 trillion from India

    And lied about it…..

    https://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/britain-stole-45-trillion-india-181206124830851.html?fbclid=IwAR0w4vH8cg0RGdyAMFh4zL9SIDPPBW3BO-BvGIS8ncvEgjjBMAk9EI2xcSs

  12. Sacha 12
    2 June 2019 at 9:48 am

    Dunedin Council dinosaurs out themselves: https://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/dcc/1m-plus-extra-climate-change-work

    There were pleas for the Dunedin City Council to overcome its own inertia on climate change as councillors pressed for action yesterday.

      • Jenny - How to get there? 12.1.1
        2 June 2019 at 10:18 am

        The initiatives would also help ease the pressures of peak traffic and parking demands in the city, while lowering the city’s carbon footprint as its population grew.

        Other councillors to back the initiatives included Cr Christine Garey, who said the loop service was a missing piece of the puzzle needed to encourage people out of their cars and respond to climate change concerns.

        Cr David Benson-Pope said central-city traffic patterns were already changing, and more disruption was on the way as major projects loomed.

        New transport options were needed, and the trial loop service would be hugely supported he predicted.

        I only wish we had city councilors as forward thinking as this in Auckland.

        The equivalent of the Dunedin Fare Free City loop in Auckland, would be Fare Free on the Northern Busway and across the Harbour Bridge.

        Seems a no brainer to me.

        • Sacha 12.1.1.1
          2 June 2019 at 11:04 am

          The equivalent? A service to only one part of the region in no way compares with a central loop.

          • McFlock 12.1.1.1.1
            2 June 2019 at 4:09 pm

            The devil is in the definition of "loop" (the screwed that one before, putting the loop where they wanted people to go rather than where the people wanted to go), but it's a good start.

            Suddenly we're seeing tangible action from councillors – you'd think it was an election year or something…

    • mauī 12.2
      2 June 2019 at 10:08 am

      Ok that's enough now, you're reminding me of Ed and that's a bit upsetting.

      • Sacha 12.2.1
        2 June 2019 at 10:10 am

        Heh. Think of it as a day's worth at once – and not all about one fringe topic.

        • greywarshark 12.2.1.1
          2 June 2019 at 11:40 am

          But wouldn't you agree Sacha that Auckland with its bridge reaching maximum capacity would be a good pilot program for showing how to reduce individual car trips. First the free buses, then the back-fill of park and ride, and other systems for people getting from home to bus station. You are thinking major idea, but there are steps towards that which would be valuable in showing the way and how to work it.

  14. marty mars 14
    2 June 2019 at 10:11 am

    Truth hurts… but not always and not forever IF it is acknowledged imo.

    James Cook was obviously not the first human to traverse the Pacific, nor even the twelfth. But he was the first European to land in New Zealand, and so the commemorations have less to do with his feats of navigation, or even whether he was or was not a white supremacist. He was, of course, because colonisation was founded on the presumed European right of white people to rule the “other”, who was thought to be inferior. But the commemorations are actually part of a wider narrative in which racism has been denied more often than it has been acknowledged.

    That narrative is the story of New Zealand’s “nation-building” that Cook has always been credited with initiating. It’s a variation on an old story about legitimising the power that was first asserted in his acts of “discovery.” It’s also the story of how the colonisers have tried to find a new identity by morphing themselves from colonisers to “settlers” and then “Kiwis”.

    The commemorations are therefore just another our-story, an expensive reaffirmation of what the colonisers have always thought about “what is, is.” They merge the glorification of Cook into the glorification of a colonisation that the Crown has always described as occasionally flawed but, essentially, benevolent. Like the plaque on one Cook monument, it was motivated by a “kind and humane usage”, rather than some violent will to dispossess.

    https://e-tangata.co.nz/comment-and-analysis/james-cook-and-our-monuments-to-colonisation/

    • vto 14.1
      2 June 2019 at 10:20 am

      With hindsight marty mars, what would have been a more appropriate way for all of the world's explorers and colonisers to go about their explorations and colonisations, since humanity first walked out of Africa? And is there a particular group of explorers and colonisers that you know of which conducted themselves in this way, or a better way?

      I'm just curious – no ulterior motive to the question. Have been doing a lot of reading the last while about humanity's expansions around the planet on many multiple occasions and across multiple species. It is a fascinating subject I think.

      • greywarshark 14.1.1
        2 June 2019 at 11:16 am

        I was thinking of Cook this morning and how right from his days, there was an appreciation of the different cultures and knowledge here than what Captain Cook and his compatriots knew. Tupaia in 1769 was the bold guide and pilot who went with the white adventurers, braving the seas and many unknowns as the Polynesian adventurers had succeeded in over generations.

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupaia_(navigator) Tupaia (also known as Tupaea or Tupia) (c. 1725 – December, 26 1770) was a Tahitian Polynesian navigator and arioi (a kind of priest), originally from the island of Ra'iatea in the Pacific Islands group known to Europeans as the Society Islands.

        There has been a study of a chart he produced from The Journal of the Polynesian Society. http://www.jps.auckland.ac.nz/docs/Volume116/jps_v116_no3_2007/3%20A%20new%20reading%20of%20Tupaias%20chart.pdf

        On 13 July. 1769, upon leaving Tahiti for the Leeward islands, Cook wrote: … throughout their voyage and to pilot the Endeavour through the uncharted waters of….

        If we remember that early dependence and respect for knowledge and cultural guidance, and increase our commitment to follow as many of the cultural practices as possible it will be a huge boon for us to ride the waves of climate change and attempted new colonisations from all over the world.

        Paul Spoonley on immigration may have useful thoughts. It may be that Maori would agree that we should enable numbers of Pacific Islanders to come here and form small communities within the larger ones, that can be self-sustaining for the basics. They call on the world for help and we, near neighbours, should be finding ways to assist and include them.

        We could for instance, limit entrance to Indians and perhaps Filipinos, not stop them, but just limit numbers by stopping ripping-them off as paying customers, by having no registered agents but allowing con-artists to treat them fraudulently on our behalf.

        • marty mars 14.1.1.1
          2 June 2019 at 11:39 am

          Cook was a product of his times as much as we are of ours. He was no saint nor demon imo – just a flawed man with skills. I've read a lot of books on the man and his family. But who he was is incidental to what he represents in today's world – sad but history does that.

          For in that little corner of the Moors is a monument to James Cook. It’s a fairly nondescript example of monumental art — rather like a tottering brick chimney. But its inscription has all the misleading rhetoric, the false grandeur of all statues erected to purported heroes:

          While it shall be deemed the honour of a Christian nation to spread civilisation … among poor and savage tribes, so will the name of Captain Cook stand out among the most celebrated and most advanced benefactors of the human race.

          In many ways, the monument is an example of history being retold. For histories are really just stories that people tell in their own way, about themselves and their past. They are “our-stories” that exclude as much as they include, and forget or misremember as much as they choose to tell.

          https://e-tangata.co.nz/comment-and-analysis/james-cook-and-our-monuments-to-colonisation/

          • greywarshark 14.1.1.1.1
            2 June 2019 at 11:52 am

            Okay I know there is controversy about celebrations of Captain Cook. But what I said about how he tried to understand what was going on in his often initial meetings with locals is something pakeha must continue today. I think that honouring him as a great adventurer and navigator in NZ, must include Tupaia who acted to assist him, and together the two men with a deep knowledge of the marine environment and sailing history understood each other. Rather like Hillary and Sherpa Tensing.
            Edit:
            Pakeha and tauiwi have done much in combining our political and cultural ways with Maori but it is only baby steps to where we should go now. And when Maori think about the ways we conduct ourselves I think you would agree Marty Mars, Maori finds pakeha too patronising and judgmental. I as a pakeha find many pakeha like this, particularly those who have monetised everything and set standards of which they are the arbiters; the words 'style over substance' occur to me often.

            • marty mars 14.1.1.1.1.1
              2 June 2019 at 12:06 pm

              He didn't try and understand so much. No so great that guy. Read some history about him – he is a complex stoic interesting man.

              • greywarshark …
                2 June 2019 at 12:41 pm

                Marty Mars Edit
                We all are complex interesting people who come here (both to NZ in the past and to The Standard in the present) and try and navigate the troubled seas of modernity and technology addiction Marty Mars. I am a pakeha and am learning from you, a Maori, and trying to understand your strengths and flaws, as well as my own with a view to imagining, imaging, visualising an uncertain future where people can use their talents to overcome dangers, one of them being that of resiling into the bestiality of society of the major slaving times, and the 19th and part 20th century.

                And that quest is being replicated throughout this site. Voyagers into the unknown we are. Just a thunk.

                I think they are touching on this in The Truth Sayers post. But I have to go and do something – the sun is out am I supposed to meet a friend this afternoon can’t remember, I should be in the garden. So I’ve put my 2 dents (cents) worth in for the day. And am I too old fashioned to be of use – 2 cents isn’t even a currency any more?

                • Stuart Munro. …
                  2 June 2019 at 9:31 pm

                  He was an interesting bloke – not really upper crust, but managed to assemble a crack cartography team. The only reason we've heard of him was because he produced a high end chart of Hudson Bay, which got him the Pacific job. The Koreans are annoyed with him too – not for colonizing, but for labelling their East Sea (Donghae) The Sea of Japan.

              • Grafton Gully …
                2 June 2019 at 1:14 pm

                Likely the crew of a smaller vessel that transported Cook and other "notable persons" from the Endeavour were the first to step ashore. Cook and Banks and probably others kept diaries and there are books about them and Tupaia. We will never know the stories of the men and boys who sailed and rowed the vessels.

                nzetc.victoria.ac.nz/tm/scholarly/tei-MacHist-t1-body-d3.html

  15. marty mars 15
    2 June 2019 at 10:26 am

    Bad apples DO spoil the whole bunch – sometimes – wonder what they wanted the information for?

    Dozens of police and Corrections staff were caught misusing their offender databases last year.

    According to figures released under the Official Information Act, a total of nine police officers were found to have misused the National Intelligence Application (NIA) database in 2018.

    Eighteen Corrections staff also faced disciplinary action for misusing their Integrated Offender Management System (IOMS).

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/113081264/police-and-corrections-staff-caught-misusing-their-offender-databases

    • McFlock 15.1
      2 June 2019 at 10:00 pm

      Nice bit of figure-fudging in that report – say only two police officers doing it so far this year, but at the end says that incidents atill under investigation aren't included in that total.

      So it looks like the problem is drastically improved from 2016 (25 cops doing it) to 9 in 2018 to 2 so far in 2019, but if the investigations and organisational appeals take on average longer than six months you can probably add at least another 2 to the 2018 figures. And if you can really drag out the investigations and appeals, who knows whether there's been any improvement at all…

  16. greywarshark 16
    2 June 2019 at 10:43 am

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/sunday/audio/2018697819/research-shows-teachers-predict-student-success-as-well-as-exams

    New research from King's College London has found that teacher assessments are equally as reliable as standardised exams at predicting educational success. The study's co-lead researchers join Jim to discuss their findings and what it could mean for the educational sector.

    Teachers need adequate funding, and fair classroom/teaching conditions, to enable them to fully do their job and most of them will comprehend their students' abilities and weaknesses and help them to success. I think that follows reasonably, from the above paragraph.

    And students facing a kaleidoscope world while they are developing into adults, which is a delayed process in the western? world, where they are treated as children with limited agency right through their secondary, teenage years, and often into their university years. In other cultures they might be adult at 14.

    Counselling help is already given at times but many need more than that.
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/sunday/audio/2018697825/dr-sharon-hoover-mental-health-assistance-in-schools-will-transform-lives

  17. marty mars 17
    2 June 2019 at 10:43 am

    The truth is coming out over there too – for years indigenous activists and caring others have said there is a REAL situation here – women are dying, indigenous women are disappearing.

    Three decades of missing and murdered Indigenous women amounts to a “Canadian genocide”, a leaked landmark government report has concluded.

    The document, titled Reclaiming Power and Place, was compiled over more than two and a half years. Canada’s CBC News was given a copy of the report, which is due to be released on Monday, on Friday. Its contents were confirmed to the Guardian by an individual working within the inquiry.

    The report, by the National Inquiry into Murdered and Missing Indigenous Women and Girls, determined that “state actions and inactions rooted in colonialism and colonial ideologies” were a key driving force in the disappearance of thousands of Indigenous women.

    “We do know that thousands of Indigenous women, girls and 2SLGBTQQIA (two-spirit, lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgendered, queer, questioning, intersex and asexual) people have been lost to the Canadian genocide to date,” said the report.

    While the number of Indigenous women who have gone missing is estimated to exceed 4,000, the report admits that no firm numbers can ever be established.For years, activists and Indigenous peoples have pushed for a government inquiry into the high number of Indigenous women who have either gone missing or been killed.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/31/canada-missing-indigenous-women-cultural-genocide-government-report

    • greywarshark 17.1
      2 June 2019 at 11:29 am

      I have remembered for decades the closing down of a small town in Canada about the truth of a murdered Cree woman. One of the perpetrators actually confessed in public but they continued to repress the facts and avoided admitting and facing justice by the white young men who were guilty and had been deliberately brutal (it wasn't death by accident at all).
      Edit:
      Helen Betty Osborne, or Betty Osborne (July 16, 1952 – November 13, 1971), was a Cree Aboriginal woman from Norway House reserve who was kidnapped and murdered while walking down Third Street in The Pas, Manitoba.

      During the initial days of the investigation, attention was placed on Betty's friends. Unfortunately, unacceptable recording and preserving of evidence at the Pump House (the crime scene) seriously crippled the investigation.[4]

      Dwayne Archie Johnston, James Robert Paul Houghton, Lee Scott Colgan and Norman Bernard Manger, four young, Caucasian men from The Pas, were eventually implicated in her death. However, it was not until December 1987, sixteen years after her death, that any of them were convicted of the crime. It was at this time that Constable Rob Urbanowski took over the investigation and placed an ad in the local newspaper asking for witnesses to come forward. Even then, only Johnston was convicted, as Houghton had been acquitted, Colgan had received immunity for testifying against Houghton and Johnston, and Manger was never charged.

      The Aboriginal Justice Implementation Commission conducted an investigation into concerns surrounding the length of time involved in resolving the case. According to the Commission report, Osborne's autopsy showed that "along with well over 50 stab wounds, her skull, cheekbones and palate were broken, her lungs were damaged, and one kidney was torn. Her body showed extensive bruising."[5] The Commission concluded that the most significant factors prolonging the case were racism, sexism and indifference of white people.[3] The Royal Canadian Mounted Police officially closed the Osborne case on February 12, 1999.
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helen_Betty_Osborne

  18. Morrissey 18
    2 June 2019 at 11:05 am

    WARNING: Some dire radio coming up this morning.

    Jim Mora has a Venezuelan guest at 11:45 this morning. Expect some complacent observations and ill thought through questions, and little or no mention of the U.S. war on that nation.

    11.45 a.m. Alejandro Cegarra: award winning photographer at Auckland Festival of Photography

    Venezuelan photographer Alejandro Cegarra is presenting his internationally acclaimed work at the Auckland Festival of Photography. His work, "State of Decay", documents the impact the rule of Hugo Chavez continues to have , four years after he died. The images earned him an award from the prestigiousWorld Press Photo organisation. He speaks to Jim about what's happening in his home country and what he hopes his images will achieve.

    Here, for the record, are just a couple of instances of Mora making malignant and ignorant remarks about Venezuela…..

    https://morrisseybreen.blogspot.com/2018/01/minecraft-chat-rooms-are-full-of-inane.html

    https://morrisseybreen.blogspot.com/2018/01/two-democratic-heroes-two-very.html

  19. Sacha 19
    2 June 2019 at 11:23 am

    Good aerial photos illustrate story about the huge cut-down of urban trees after last govt changed laws protecting them: https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/112898870/the-aotearoa-chainsaw-massacre

      • Ad 20.1.1
        2 June 2019 at 4:51 pm

        Someone here is going to have to stretch their analytical legs and forecast the future economic and social strength of the UK after leaving the EU. It's going to happen, probably now in October, and in reality there's no turning back. After this shit there's little way the UK would be admitted back.

        I can easily see the UK being relegated to the same economic size as Brazil, and slipping fast down the top 20 economies.

        Diplomatically it will quickly become an irrelevance of little use to the US, because it will no longer be an English-speaking gateway into the EU.

        I don't wish decline onto any country, but this is where the UK is going and going fast.

        • Sam 20.1.1.1
          2 June 2019 at 4:58 pm

          Here's my prediction. One, maybe two generations of UK kids in school are fucked. It's like the post war with out the war. Just self mutilation.

          • Ad 20.1.1.1.1
            2 June 2019 at 5:40 pm

            Post-WW2 Great Britain especially 1945-1951 was governed exceptionally well and tackled poverty, health, education, and inequality head-on.

            Here's two summaries:

            https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2001/mar/14/past.education

            https://www.bbc.com/bitesize/guides/zt4hvcw/revision/2

            There's still good coherence amongst Northern Ireland government, and scraps of it remaining in Scotland, but England itself – well I can agree with you in its future damage to children – once the Conservatives really carry out what they promise post-Brexit, which is a fully root and branch deregulation of the English economy and English society.

            • Sam 20.1.1.1.1.1
              2 June 2019 at 6:12 pm

              Property speculation has worked pretty well across the western world for one reason – immigration.

              Margaret Thacthers property boom did more to destroy the UK than Hitlers Germany could have ever hoped. Right now birth rates are falling across the western world. For some reason having babies is now seen as a taboo issue for the woke to signal to there friends it's okay to be outrage about a penis ejaculating into a vagina bareback. I digress.

              So think about it. Hard boarders post BREXIT is a signal to tighten immigration. When the birth rate hits 1 which last I looked Britain wasn't to far off hitting, but when it hits 1 the population halves in 20-40 years or 2 generations or so. All the buildings will still be there it's just that there will be half the people. Thx Maggy.

          • vto 20.1.1.1.2
            2 June 2019 at 6:29 pm

            Here's my prediction. The world will continue to globalise and not even notice Brexit. And every nation will be caught up in it, including especially such powers and actors as the UK.

            As such, the UK wont feel Brexit at all, except perhaps some initial teething, and it will get pulled into the globalisation that humanity is undergoing,… brexit? pfftt… world governance of various shades will continue to spread and, other than the occasional foot trip, nobody can stop it..

            • Sam 20.1.1.1.2.1
              2 June 2019 at 6:56 pm

              Why bother tho? Heathrow is one of the shittiest airports Iv been to. There's always some kind of delay in there. If it's not the gates shutting on you as you exit the plane the carrousel or some dumb technical bulshit. And all the staff just stand around like duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuh, I don't know duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuh. It's fucken cold, dark and Prince Charles will be King soon. Tell me, why should I invest in the UK?

            • RedLogix 20.1.1.1.2.2
              2 June 2019 at 6:57 pm

              Yah! At last someone talking sense on Brexit. Although my gut feeling is a 'no-deal crash out Brexit' will have real impact on the UK in the short-term (for instance there is a real chance Scotland will secede and Northern Ireland will join up with the Republic), you're otherwise on the nail.

              Regardless of Brexit, the EU will will prove in historic terms little more than a step along the way towards something more effective. We haven't even seen the impact of Xi Xinping's Belt and Road initiative yet.

              • Sam …
                3 June 2019 at 9:52 am

                Only thinking that will happen to the UK post BREXIT is the U.S turns the U.K into the little Okinawa of the Atlantic.

            • greywarshark 20.1.1.1.2.3
              2 June 2019 at 7:04 pm

              I consider this a possibility (vto 6.29 pm) but if people don't like that scenario, they must get up and find and form a new extended family to prevent us getting picked off by the machine-brain, monetised, materialistic, elite and fellow travellers presently to be found as close as in your own families.

    • joe90 20.2
      2 June 2019 at 4:12 pm

      No horse and guards welcome, no address to Lords and MPs, no speech to Parliament and no palace stay. Ouch.

      https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/bare-minimum-britain-decides-no-palace-stay-or-parliamentary-speech-for-trump-in-low-key-state-visit

  21. greywarshark 21
    2 June 2019 at 12:48 pm

    I have heard of people writing to KiwiBank and saying they should not be ditching cheques and should keep this basic old fashioned transaction system as a useful tool, in case!

    • mac1 21.1
      2 June 2019 at 1:55 pm

      Grey Power at its recent Federation AGM gave the CEO of KiwiBank a good serve a fortnight ago when he spoke to the delegates. He reported that his mother gave him the same arguments against ditching cheques and closing branches. His argument was that his bank did not want to be the last one to be servicing cheques (so they got in first?). Those wanting to use cheques could go elsewhere. The service he argued had to be closed before the last cheque was written by the last chequebook holder.

  22. Morrissey 22
    2 June 2019 at 2:00 pm

    Back on Kiwiblog, but still not feeling the love.

    Fifty downticks so far….

    https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2019/06/general_debate_2_june_2019.html/comment-page-1#comment-2501494

  23. Morrissey 23
    2 June 2019 at 2:14 pm

    "….the threat of being pushed into the sea." Does Duncan Greive do no editing? How did this garbage get through?

    After the March 15 massacre in Christchurch, someone calling herself "Sara Green" wrote a mostly anodyne and unremarkable little response to it. Most of this piece is pedestrian, but she ("Sara Green" is a pseudonym) veers off into fanaticism and propaganda near the end….

    Israel is a Jewish homeland and sanctuary. Yet every day its citizens, both Arabs and Jews, live with acts of terrorism and with the threat of being pushed into the sea.

    https://thespinoff.co.nz/society/02-06-2019/on-being-jewish-after-march-15/

    • greywarshark 23.1
      2 June 2019 at 6:50 pm

      Why Jews all the time? Quoting religion and the taking of Jesus' life is given as an excuse. She just is thinking through her feelings after the Christchurch massacre. She explains it all in these paragraphs:

      She visited Israel:

      And – horror of horrors – I noticed the hierarchy. At the time of my visit, those at the bottom of the pecking order were refugees from the dissolved Soviet Union; before that, I was told, it was the North African Jews. All Jews were clearly not equal in Israel.

      Israel is a Jewish homeland and sanctuary. Yet every day its citizens, both Arabs and Jews, live with acts of terrorism and with the threat of being pushed into the sea.

      It’s an unfortunate fact that you can’t alter extreme and rigid beliefs with rational argument. So we can’t change extremists, only ourselves – potentially.

      Threats remain against Israel although it has taken extreme defence measures, including getting an atomic bomb. But the threats unite the country and make it easy for a military backed political party that responds to Palestine armed protest with unequal violence. It can even be said that they provoke attack so they can justify their scare tactics and propaganda. But this is what the Jews have had in the past, can't forget.

      Jews are used to being on the move, to being expelled, from Rome in the 1st century AD, from England in 13th century and from Spain in the 15th century. They are used to being directed where they can live, to ghetto life. The Pale of Settlement (now Belarus). The Warsaw Ghetto. Pogroms. Jew-baiting.

      How can people behave in such a way towards members of their own society?

      The history of their suffering over the generations is always there. How can you relax completely when time and again the country you live in turns against you. It was almost The End in Germany and other places also.

  24. SPC 24
    2 June 2019 at 3:17 pm

    Parker will regret that contract he signed.

    Ruiz knocks down Joshua twice in the third and twice in the 7th and wins by KO.

    • Ad 24.1
      2 June 2019 at 4:45 pm

      Ruiz!

      Just love it when the unprepossessing short guy wastes the cocky prick.

      There's still hope for a body like mine.

  25. Incognito 25
    2 June 2019 at 3:49 pm

    Good piece by Henry Cooke.

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/113157184/budget-2019-could-be-transformational-but-we-wont-know-right-away

    Although, [Helen] Clark would probably have Gabriel Makhlouf's resignation on her desk by now.

    I believe that technically neither the Minister of Finance nor the PM appoint or employ the Treasury Secretary so neither could fire him or accept his resignation. As far as I know, he has already resigned, with notice.

    • Incognito 26.1
      2 June 2019 at 7:05 pm

      It is well known that generics cause nasty side effects because they are cheaper, which makes them also less effective. Mainstream and social media are perfectly safe and have no physiological effects on us at all. How could they? We don’t ingest or inhale them, do we? wink

  28. greywarshark 28
    2 June 2019 at 10:09 pm

    Speaker on Te Ahi Kaa today had some interesting points.

    Clinical Psychologist Dr Waikaremoana Waitoki than provides her own analysis of what it means to be happy.

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/teahikaa/audio/2018697687/te-ahi-kaa-for-2-june-2019

  29. Pat 29
    2 June 2019 at 11:04 pm

    "Rationing to tackle the climate crisis could be given a modern-day makeover. People could be allocated polluting credits to cover activities such as meat eating and flying that they can sell and buy in an online marketplace. If you’re short of cash, or not that bothered about eating meat or flying abroad, you can feel smug as you sell your credits to someone who is, which makes this far more equitable than green taxes. And setting a population-level limit on something such as meat consumption would create huge incentives for companies to invest more in the production of things such as environmentally friendly, lab-grown meat.”

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jun/01/sin-taxes-on-meat-or-flying-wont-change-a-climate-hypocrite-like-me-rationing-might

    Is it possible that the only realistic method to achieve the change required in a timely manner could be gathering steam??

  30. The Chairman 30
    2 June 2019 at 11:16 pm

    How did it come to be MSD paid around $3800 a week for a property that was rented out for around $500 a week? Moreover, how many other properties are they vastly overpaying for?

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/property/113166235/tenant-made-more-than-60000-after-illegally-subletting-rental-to-homeless

  31. Eco maori 31
    4 June 2019 at 8:38 am

    Kia ora Newshub.

    Graham I feel the same way as you about Aotearoa congratulation O Sir Graham sorry.

    That's good news the housing price is stabilizing and rising slightly.

    Tamariki get hurt playing sports just playing in a field a tamariki can get hurt I don't think there is a problem with our children sports.

    Eco Maori knowns about security I go into a organization and they are Already nervous go figure they have racially profiled me discriminated against me.

    kevin spacey finally sitting on a hot seat in a courthouse about time.

    The cricket is looking exciting this World Cup.

    I do agree a murder should have no calls on there children unless there are no love ones no carers then they have a say.

    I agree the Japanese Wahine having to wear highheals as a worker's dress code for mahi work that law needs be banned too our history books.

    Ka kite ano

  32. Eco maori 32
    4 June 2019 at 10:08 am

    Some Eco Maori music for the minute.

    https://youtu.be/amGI5T0JGDc

  33. Eco maori 33
    4 June 2019 at 12:16 pm

    Human caused Climate changes will have a direct impact negatively on tangata health and all the creatures.

    We can see the negative impact on Papatuanuku now that's reality.

    Climate crisis seriously damaging human health, report finds

    National academies say effects include spread of diseases and worse mental health

    A report by experts from 27 national science academies has set out the widespread damage global heating is already causing to people’s health and the increasingly serious impacts expected in future

    Scorching heatwaves and floods will claim more victims as extreme weather increases but there are serious indirect effects too, from spreading mosquito-borne diseases to worsening mental health.

    “There are impacts occurring now [and], over the coming century, climate change has to be ranked as one of the most serious threats to health,” said Prof Sir Andrew Haines, a co-chair of the report for the European Academies’ Science Advisory Council (Easac).

    'So much land under so much water': extreme flooding is drowning parts of the midwest

    However, there were also great benefits from action to cut carbon emissions, the report found, most notably cutting the 350,000 early deaths from air pollution every year in Europe caused by burning fossil fuels. “The economic benefits of action to address the current and prospective health effects of climate change are likely to be substantial,” the report concluded la kite ano link below.

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/jun/03/climate-crisis-seriously-damaging-human-health-report-finds

  34. Eco maori 34
    4 June 2019 at 1:39 pm

    Some Eco Maori for the minute.

    https://youtu.be/F6aB2xqVuZA

  35. Eco maori 35
    4 June 2019 at 6:33 pm

    Kia ora Newshub.

    Lloyd I back the protesters protesting trump he is a climate change denier we have to stand firm on that climate change.

    Our tamariki sports stars are ok stop with the cotton wool.

    His heathers look in excellent condition no comment on his issues with MPI .

    With the jailed father mother ect it has to be about what good for the children don't take all the family rights from people in jail take the custody right from those that kill there parents everyone should not suffer for the wrongs of the few.

    Brian has dune good for a lot of tangata whenua he just forgets that no one is perfect .

    Ka kite ano

  36. Eco maori 36
    4 June 2019 at 6:48 pm

    Kia ora te ao Maori news

    I could see that Kohanga Reo were under resorsed 20 years ago it will be harder now.

    Winston in the Solomon Island ka pai our Pacific cousins needs Aotearoa help in this fast changing Papatuanuku and climate change.

    Haka Brazil ka pai teach everyone about how great tangata whenua O Aotearoa cultural is in Reality.

    Its cool that the old Maori ronga looks likely to heal Tane Mahuta from the Kauai die back disease heaps of Maori medical knowledge has been losted. I see that the WHO World Health Organization has given the thumbs up to traditional Chinese Medicine.

    Ka kite ano

  37. Eco maori 37
    4 June 2019 at 7:37 pm

    Some Eco Maori music for the minute

    https://youtu.be/Xo7WjnC8ekQ

    Thanks to 7 sharp for running the story on Ngati Porou East Coast Rugby

  38. Eco maori 38
    5 June 2019 at 8:20 am

    Kia ora The Am Show.

    Graham I think that council's needs to find the most efficient way to provide services. I say taking the option to save money is a must we have to minimize OUR consumption of goods and services to save our future. The Onekawa pools we cool a few years ago.

    We need to taxs the——-out of carbon that will let natural products rise to their correct status. Wool wood ect and save Papatuanuku.

    I think our government should go for more taxes from the Tech internet industry. Companies tax doesn't even pay half as much as the PAYE pay as you earn figure that one out they make BILLIONS using OUR infrastructure the many subsidising the 00.1%.

    Thanks to the Auckland council for taking the Kauri die back disease seriously by closing down walking tracks to minimize the spread the disease.

    The cabinet reshuffle I have my backing on a couple of people rising.

    I was going to congratulate Mark on his shirts.

    Ka kite ano

  39. Eco maori 39
    5 June 2019 at 2:20 pm

    Some Eco Maori music for the minute.

    https://youtu.be/1SN7Pko_jCM

  40. Eco maori 40
    5 June 2019 at 4:07 pm

    Some Eco Maori music for the minute.

    https://youtu.be/tgIqecROs5M

  41. Eco maori 41
    5 June 2019 at 6:29 pm

    Kia ora Newshub.

    Looks like tawhirimate has been up to mischief up Northland Global warming has increased his mana.

    Thanks for all your years of service Steve Tue

    That's what Eco Maori wants Peace freedom and JUSTICE Jeremy Corbyn .

    Wow I just told someone a story about me and my cousin next minute.

    That's a hard one the guy being charged with being a coward not everyone has courage but I suppose he should not have had a job as a security guard when you ain't got it —–that is.

    The weather is cold Ingred

    Ka kite ano.

  42. Eco maori 42
    5 June 2019 at 6:49 pm

    Kia ora te ao Maori news.

    Talisa it will be a lot warmer there in the Solomon island it looks like they need heaps of help with their economy and infrastructure it is good that Aotearoa can help them

    I'm a big Fan of Moana Jackson yes we need to help our homeless tangata.

    I agree with Ella Henry the price of housing has pushed tangata whenua out of the market they are way too expensive.

    But it will take a bit of time for Labour to clean up national short mess in whare.

    I don't think that the tax on smokes should go up any more.

    I agree smoking is the hardest habit to kick I gave up 2 times one we ran out of smokes at sea for the last 2 weeks the other I was in hospital for 2 weeks lol.

    Ma te wa When im in the correct place then I will focus on giving up .

    Our rangitahi do need a lot of help with mental health and addictions its so easy for them to find the bad contraband.

    Ka kite ano

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