Open Mike 02/10/2018

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, October 2nd, 2018 - 181 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose. The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

181 comments on “Open Mike 02/10/2018 ”

  • Comments are now closed

  1. bwaghorn 1
    2 October 2018 at 6:32 am

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12132076

    Landlords are selling up because they have to make houses livable sounds like a win win to me
    A part from the pets thing labour is getting it right .

    • Sanctuary 1.1
      2 October 2018 at 6:47 am

      Sourced from Tauranga.

      That is a hilarious story.

      Getting out of rentals will free up the market for first home buyers.

      Really, all we have there is bourgeois rent seekers getting pissy at a government that doesn’t hold their class interests as sacrosanct.

      • Ankerrawshark 1.1.1
        2 October 2018 at 8:49 am

        Cry me a river land lords……

      • SaveNZ 1.1.2
        2 October 2018 at 9:17 am

        It will free up for home buyers but what about a significant amount of renters left, who are highly unlikely to ever save up a $50k deposit and be in a position to have a mortgage for 30 years with a secure salary so a bank will lend?

        (Increasingly renter will be more and more kiwis who were born here on the lower salaries or no salary and no access to foreign money and jobs – the new underclass in NZ)

        NZ has had over 1/2 million new residents in last few years via immigration, many wealthy or able to access significant amounts of money from family/dowrys who are now the new ‘kiwi’ Home buyers, plus the Singapore investors can buy up our residential property as well as the Aussies (although less interested due to having land to buy themselves in their own country unlike other nationalities, NZ commercial real estate for Aussies, another story) .

        • McFlock 1.1.2.1
          2 October 2018 at 1:02 pm

          the houses they can rent from won’t make them sick.

          Win-win.

          • SaveNZ 1.1.2.1.1
            2 October 2018 at 1:38 pm

            All for houses that won’t make people sick McFlock, but where are the renters going to live as we already have a shortage and it seems significant amounts of renters (judging from the link where 900 people applied for a 1 bed house) needs are unmet, plus they may have other issues aka criminal record or bad references… we used to have state house rentals, now we have Kiwibuild aimed at those on over $100k salaries… with significant savings… what happens to those outside of that when there is already massive strain at the bottom end for housing and still more obstacles are out there…

            • McFlock 1.1.2.1.1.1
              2 October 2018 at 1:58 pm

              As you point out, kiwibuild is aimed at increasing the housing stock. So those people who get a kiwibuild house will also vacate rentals.

              So some of the shit rentals will be taken off the rental market. Most of them will be bought by poorer homeowners, who willat least have an interest in slowly upgrading them (unlike slumlords). Some will be upgraded, but because the market stays the same size the landlords will have to wear that investment.

              Kiwibuild will take renters out of the market. Even taking higher-end renters out of the market will keep rental prices flatter than otherwise.

              Oh, and yes, the government is increasing the state housing stock. So yay.

              • SaveNZ …
                2 October 2018 at 2:55 pm

                Well see what happens,McFlock, or people will buy them, renovate them at great cost and re rent them at double the rent… that’s what has happened in Auckland.

                I had a fabulous time as a student in damp, cold villas that so many on the Standard seem to disapprove of, sadly now they are all renovated in Grey Lynn, gone are the students, atmosphere, pacific multiculturalism, and instead we have beautiful houses that only People with 2 million plus can afford who read the Spinoff and are the new lefties, blue greens and natz lovers.

                Totally feel for my renting mates who struggle to afford the rents and have to fight off so many applicants to live centrally with a bit of green space.

                Personally feel it’s a middle class fantasy of what people who live in studio apartments want crossed with construction dollars and the elite want that vision because it is keeping the economy looking good but the price is going to be the future of our country, freedom to live a consumer less life and the poorest 30%.

                One of my favourite NZ movies, ‘this way of life’ – clearly not working with the middle class housing one size fits all policies

                • McFlock …
                  2 October 2018 at 3:05 pm

                  Not even houses that are all that beautiful.

                  This is a problem that has been decades in the making, it won’t be solved overnight.

                  Thing is, if some of the people who can afford to pay double the rent end up buying their own homes, the rent won’t double.

                  I guess I’m a bit more patient about the entire thing because I’ve lived close to a local renting market that fluctuates wildly. Some years renters pay hand over fist, other years the landlords are shitting bricks and installing spa pools to attract tenants. Swings and roundabouts.

        • KJT 1.1.2.2
          2 October 2018 at 9:37 pm

          State houses by the thousands, like the fifties and sixties. We can even “print” money for the houses, as we did then, and stop the hemorrhage of money to overseas banks.

    • AsleepWhileWalking 1.2
      2 October 2018 at 7:11 am

      Fewer blood sucking leeches. Good riddance.

      • OnceWasTim 1.2.1
        2 October 2018 at 7:22 am

        The biggest rat I’ve ever seen lived in one of those BoP shitholes a couple of years ago. The dump didn’t even have the most basic of amenities and a couple of tenants were bed-sharing so that collectively they could afford the rent. It did have natural ventilation – ruddy great holes all over the place caused by rodents.
        A couple of months ago, it looked like it had been abandoned.

      • Alan 1.2.2
        2 October 2018 at 8:23 am

        umm, what happens to renters when there are fewer properties to let available?

        • mpledger 1.2.2.1
          2 October 2018 at 9:09 am

          Then there are more houses to buy, so the prices drop, so more people can buy to live in.

          • Alan 1.2.2.1.1
            2 October 2018 at 2:09 pm

            you are ignoring the high number of people that do not have the means to buy – ever.

        • SaveNZ 1.2.2.2
          2 October 2018 at 9:21 am

          Napier rental gets 900 inquiries

          https://www.odt.co.nz/news/national/rnz/napier-rental-gets-900-inquiries

          Alan don’t be so practical!

          • SaveNZ 1.2.2.2.1
            2 October 2018 at 9:38 am

            Bear in mind that asking for simple things like a reference check and a police check whittled off over 850 applicants…

            So where do the 850 applicants that presumably can’t pass the ref check or police check live?

            And what happens to the unsuccessful 49 other applicants? Compete for the next rental with another 900 people?

          • Draco T Bastard 1.2.2.2.2
            2 October 2018 at 1:09 pm

            He’s not and neither are you.

            It really is bad for the country to have rentier capitalists with huge income from making society sick.

            • SaveNZ 1.2.2.2.2.1
              2 October 2018 at 1:57 pm

              Obesity makes people sick, pollution makes people sick, those cruise ships make people sick that Auckland council are so keen on attracting, North Havelock water makes people sick, quite a few things make people sick, living in cars and one room hotels make people sick, lucky the construction industry and developers seem to have the ear of government… weird that so many baby boomers were bought up in old houses and were completely well, with no insulation and so forth, high literacy etc in those days, but in those days one wage was enough to survive on, wonder that has changed? …

            • Alan 1.2.2.2.2.2
              2 October 2018 at 2:11 pm

              Draco, flying in the face of logic and reason again.
              Do you ever get out into the real world?????

              • Draco T Bastard …
                2 October 2018 at 2:43 pm

                I’m always in the real world. Those who believe in capitalism are delusional.

                • David Mac …
                  2 October 2018 at 3:00 pm

                  Does anyone else live in your real world?

                  It’s a real world with a population of one.

            • David Mac 1.2.2.2.2.3
              2 October 2018 at 2:23 pm

              Disagree Draco, the vast majority of landlords own one, sometimes 2 rentals. They are Mum and Dad superannuation policies.

              As per usual, you’ve got own foot on your throat.

              • Draco T Bastard …
                2 October 2018 at 2:42 pm

                They are Mum and Dad superannuation policies.

                That doesn’t make it anything less than bludging. Unearned income is always bludging.

                • David Mac …
                  2 October 2018 at 2:57 pm

                  Yes, I’m aware of how you view it. How would you suggest someone organises to pay for weddings, replacement vehicles etc when they are no longer able to work and forced to bludge?

    • BM 1.3
      2 October 2018 at 7:43 am

      An average 2.1 people live in owner-occupied housing in New Zealand, but there is an average 3.9 people per rental property. Every time a rental property is sold to an owner-occupier, on average 1.8 tenants still need a home to rent.

      https://thespinoff.co.nz/business/01-03-2018/pushing-landlords-out-will-only-make-renting-more-expensive/

      Combine that with no interest in investing in new rental developments and we’ve now got a housing crisis magnitudes greater had what we had before.

      The government is creating an environment where a huge proportion of renters will have to be housed by the state but Housing NZ is in no position to do that.

      Labour is making a bad situation 10 x worse.

      • solkta 1.3.1
        2 October 2018 at 7:53 am

        That statistic is as misleading as the average wage.

        • BM 1.3.1.1
          2 October 2018 at 8:01 am

          Why?

          First home buyers tend to consist of 2 adults, that’s why you buy a house to have your own bit of space, create a nest.

          Think there were 4 people living in our first house, that went to two when we brought it.

          • AB 1.3.1.1.1
            2 October 2018 at 8:13 am

            The primary reason for getting landlords out of the market is to reduce demand, and therefore price. It won’t on its own do a hell of a lot for supply. That’s why Phil T has to get lots of extra houses built too.
            It’s a pincer movement BM – lower the demand and increase supply simultaneously. With luck, a substantial reduction in your wealth is in the wind. Cheers

            • BM 1.3.1.1.1.1
              2 October 2018 at 8:29 am

              That will take years and years if he can even achieve that, what will people do in the meantime? live under bridges? live in tents in parks?

              Labour seems to forget that NZ isn’t China, we’re a democracy, we have elections, Labour has a very short time to come up with the goods otherwise they’re out and out for a long time.

              • mauī …
                2 October 2018 at 8:42 am

                Ever thought about claiming refugee status for the next wee while just so you can get through?

              • ankerawshark …
                2 October 2018 at 10:20 am

                BM people are already living under bridges, in parks……………………it happened or expanded hugely under National.

                • BM …
                  2 October 2018 at 10:23 am

                  It’s going to get a hell of a lot worse.
                  Cost of living has gone through the roof in the past year.

                  • Macro …
                    2 October 2018 at 10:58 am

                    BULLSHIT!
                    A 1.5% increase in the CPI is hardly “going through the roof”

                    • BM …
                      2 October 2018 at 11:21 am

                      Tell that to the people who are currently renting.

                    • Macro …
                      2 October 2018 at 1:45 pm

                      You were referring to the cost of living – which is measured by the CPI. The cost of renting is another measure entirely. But good to see that you are so concerned about the rising cost of housing over the past few years, and I’m sure you will be right behind the current Govt which is actually attempting to do something about this, and address the resultant homelessness; rather than the previous one which was dilatory, and indeed downright neglectful of this matter.

                    • BM …
                      2 October 2018 at 1:52 pm

                      The current government is making the situation a lot worse.

                      Why would I want to support these amateur arse hats?

                  • Stuart Munro …
                    2 October 2018 at 3:56 pm

                    Of course it’s going to get a lot worse – there are decades of bad policy behind this shipwreck – it won’t be turned around quickly or without substantial action.

                    A captain whose ship is headed for the rocks is advised to take early and substantial action sufficient to avoid the collision. For reasons that may be summarized as ‘politics’ or ‘vested interests’, politicians have got out of the habit of doing the same.

                    The minimum requirements to contain the burgeoning housing crisis:

                    No foreign buyers.

                    A state funded building program not dependent on foreign investors.

                    Capital gains tax and penal taxes on accumulating domestic property.

                    Significant workplace reform so that there are plenty of permanent jobs which pay enough for ownership.

                    Reform of the real estate industry who created much of the problem.

                    Rigorous enforcement of immigration rules and mandatory deportation of scammers.

            • SaveNZ 1.3.1.1.1.2
              2 October 2018 at 12:19 pm

              @ AB Only the demand is not lowered because NZ is still having huge immigration gains and people from Singapore and OZ can buy them too…in fact the construction industry alone is hoping to bring in 35,000+ migrant workers for their industry alone…

              The houses they are constructing cost more than the existing houses therefore not lowing prices at all. The construction is increasing prices, plus with zero focus on quality and nothing real in place to stop bad workmanship/materials/resource consents that plague NZ building, how likely is it that a significant amount of new construction will need remedial work and who is going to pay for that work (typically the ratepayers of the councils..)?

              Added to this there is nothing stopping people buying residential property through another party who might be a citizen in NZ….

            • Herodotus 1.3.1.1.1.3
              2 October 2018 at 2:41 pm

              Crap, the 2 major Kiwibuild announcements involve demo state houses. So no increase to state housing stock. Increase state housing and that will reduce demand for private rentals, and reduce the wasted transfer of state wealth in Accomodation Allowances
              IMO Labour are selling off state assets to both: private developers and Kiwi build is to keep their Balance Sheet neat and comply with Budget Responsibility Rules.
              For some non accountants
              A balance sheet is a listing of assets, debts & Capital
              Borrow to build additional state houses increase both Assets and debt by the same amount. Nett Result Govt is in the same position as before, but with an increase of State houses.

          • Muttonbird 1.3.1.1.2
            2 October 2018 at 8:14 am

            Perhaps we should just ban all sales to first home buyers. They are obviously the problem.

      • ScottGN 1.3.2
        2 October 2018 at 8:12 am

        Isn’t that opinion piece by the same guy who recently claimed that tenants actually like the rent bidding wars that some landlords are encouraging at their properties because it lets richer tenants muscle out competitors?

      • SaveNZ 1.3.3
        2 October 2018 at 9:22 am

        +1 BM “Combine that with no interest in investing in new rental developments and we’ve now got a housing crisis magnitudes greater had what we had before.

        The government is creating an environment where a huge proportion of renters will have to be housed by the state but Housing NZ is in no position to do that.

        Labour is making a bad situation 10 x worse.”

      • miravox 1.3.4
        2 October 2018 at 9:50 am

        “Every time a rental property is sold to an owner-occupier, on average 1.8 tenants still need a home to rent.”

        Every time a rental property is sold to an owner-occupier, on average the number of people living in an owner-occupied home increases.

        fify

        Not a bad thing, 2.1 people/owner-occupied housing is on average an under-utilisation of our housing stock.

        • BM 1.3.4.1
          2 October 2018 at 10:29 am

          Every time a rental property is sold to an owner-occupier, on average the number of people living in an owner-occupied home increases.

          And another rental disappears and 2 people have to find another place to live.

          I’m not quite getting your point?

          • miravox 1.3.4.1.1
            2 October 2018 at 12:04 pm

            Every time a renting family buys a home (e.g. 2 adults, 2 children) instead of renting, the number of people per household in private dwellings increases.

            I just don’t think that statistic you quoted means very much on it’s own.

      • ankerawshark 1.3.5
        2 October 2018 at 10:19 am

        So BM should we just allow landlords to let cold mouldy etc houses that don’t meet basic standards?

        There will be a solution to any rental shortage that comes out of many landlords leaving the market. Personally I hope they have to sell their rentals at really low prices. Next landlords can buy them and have enough capital to make them warm, dry etc. Problem solved.

        Was a landlord once myself, didn’t buy for investment, let out my own home when I moved city. I put in a lot of improvements such as insulation, DVS that I couldn’t afford when I lived there. It was only right I did that. These people were paying me money.

        • BM 1.3.5.1
          2 October 2018 at 10:28 am

          Nothing wrong with improving the housing stock, it’s the draconian laws Labour wants to introduce that’s making landlords leave the market.

          As AB wrote at 1.3.1.1.1 this is deliberate, Labour wants to make being a landlord as unattractive as possible.

          • Stuart Munro 1.3.5.1.1
            2 October 2018 at 6:53 pm

            Draconian Pfft.

            Of course they want to deter landlords. They contribute nothing to society.

      • bwaghorn 1.3.6
        2 October 2018 at 10:59 am

        Na there will always be land lords what labour is doing is weeding out the scum slum landlords .

      • Chris T 1.3.7
        2 October 2018 at 2:10 pm

        Would think that would be because people tend to buy houses where there is a spare bedroom while the majority of renters rent the house with the perfect amount of rooms for how many people there are. eg the mass amounts of uni students renting

    • SaveNZ 1.4
      2 October 2018 at 9:30 am

      I just hope when millions of people don’t have a rental they descend onto parliament and live in their cars their until the state finds them a house to live in, maybe then it will become… r.e.a.l

      Oh sorry, petrol prices and public transport links plus the prices of travel will probably mean unlike the farmers they can’t get there so instead will what… what is what I wonder… where are they going to go???

      Pretty cruel thought to talk about delivering warm dry houses, when actually a significant proportion and most of them with other problems will be worse off because they won’t have a house at all to live in…

      I’m sure some private practise or ‘charity’ will rush to the rescue with massive tax dollars spent on the issue, so just another way to divert funds to a go between to house people when we used to have a much simpler system of housing NZ for poorer folks or private rentals for richer folks…

      • David Mac 1.4.1
        2 October 2018 at 1:29 pm

        I agree savenz, I recently helped a friend let a property.

        The amount of enquiries we fielded was staggering. We immediately discounted applicants with children, weren’t working, had pets, poor credit histories or limited references. This left us with about 20 interested parties.

        He selected a retired couple that live in Auckland and wished to have a base when they visited their coastal block of land every fortnight. This couple are paying a weekly market rent and only living in the house approx 2 of every 14 days and holidays.

        • Pingao 1.4.1.1
          2 October 2018 at 5:20 pm

          Crikey! When I let out my house I immediately discounted people who were without children and dogs and had well paid jobs. Dog owners make great tenants as they want to hang onto their tenancies.

          • David Mac 1.4.1.1.1
            2 October 2018 at 6:14 pm

            I love dogs, I have one but of the 8521 rental properties currently advertised on Trademe only 1190 are ‘Pets OK’ why do you think this is?

            I think it relates to minimising risk/wear and tear and the manner in which the Tenancy Tribunal deals with claims for damage done by dogs.

            “You allowed the dog to live at the property, that’s what dogs do, suck it up.”

      • OnceWasTim 1.4.2
        2 October 2018 at 1:40 pm

        I do find it a bit strange, now that we’ve acknowledged there is indeed a housing ‘crisis’, that every time I’ve crossed the Desert Road how quick it was that new Army housing had sprung up off in the distance.
        Is it “a crisis”, or is it not especially when we’re worrying about the possibility of more people living under bridges or in buzzniss doorways.

        • SaveNZ 1.4.2.1
          2 October 2018 at 2:02 pm

          There is not a housing crisis so much as an affordability crisis for housing.

          The houses going up in Auckland are more expensive than existing housing and new spec houses of over 1 million dollars.

          A few years ago existing housing and apartments were half the price of the new builds that the government seems so keen on, especially in areas like Henderson or Auckland city apartments..

          • David Mac 1.4.2.1.1
            2 October 2018 at 2:28 pm

            I don’t think it’s a problem of $. The government will pay all of a family’s move in costs and the lion share of the rent. I think it’s a problem of sliding discernment.

            10 years ago to not be considered for a private rental property required something like repeated rent arrears evictions. These days, a child is enough to get me off the short-list.

          • OnceWasTim 1.4.2.1.2
            2 October 2018 at 4:09 pm

            “There is not a housing crisis so much as an affordability crisis for housing.”

            Wow @ SaveNZ. You’re now telling me that all the growth in immigrant numbers we see as being a problem (whether those on shitty student visas or work visas for example), can be accommodated in existing stock? It’s all just a question of affordability?
            I’d say it’s numbers, AND affordability, AND properties laying empty AND probably a few other reasons (including existing stock kept vacant or being UBERed in order to maximise ‘investment’).

            By the way, that shithole I mentioned previously is/was owned by an absentee landlord living offshore – now vacant. In my immediate neighbourhood there have been 3 properties I know of that have been kept vacant for months

            The common denominator though appears to be that property is regarded as an investment asset class rather than as a means to put a roof over people’s heads.
            All the above of course, assuming that housing stock numbers we have is fit for habitation,

            • SaveNZ 1.4.2.1.2.1
              2 October 2018 at 4:30 pm

              OnceWasTim, Yes you are right, but around Auckland there is a lot of talk that all the new builds will stem demand but the problem is, the houses they are building are more expensive than the exisiting houses and so I can’t see them being rented and if they are they will be expensive.

              If it becomes illegal to rent properties because they fail to meet the standards (and lets face it the many standards banded about in NZ are very subjective and often being led by lobby groups and impractical committees that profit in some way from the standards aka apparently 90% of all houses FAILED the rental WOF – my house that I live in would have failed it and it’s a warm, dry house, it’s getting like the Meth standards that were later found to be fictitious and a scam).

              So if 90% of houses fail whatever standards are bought in, guess what, 90% of rentals many of them perfectly warm and dry might be left empty so adding more standards ain’t going to increase rental availability.

              Government can’t have it both ways, either houses are rented or they are empty waiting to be renovated… just like the Meth houses… we have a ‘meth’ house in our street been empty for 2 years. It’s not owed by a landlord it was bought by a developer cheaply because they got a Meth test and then everyone else was scared off buying it at the auction, now it’s sitting there empty doing nothing.

              The Labour government and the National government seem to both be equally keen to sell off housing NZ rentals or land… and neither to significantly increase government rental stock in high demand areas…

  2. OnceWasTim 2
    2 October 2018 at 8:22 am

    And let’s hope Megan Woods ‘takes on board Geoff Bertram’s analysis going forward rhubarb rhubarb’
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/opinion-analysis/107508109/its-all-there-in-the-accounts-electricity-distributors-are-making-excessive-profits

    Trustpower just informed me that their electricity prices are “changing”.
    I’m about to ditch them on the basis of that bullshit alone. They’re going up!

  3. Morrissey 3
    2 October 2018 at 9:09 am

    “Israeli cynicism and western cowardice…”
    Gaza: An Inquest into its Martyrdom by Norman Finkelstein
    (University of California Press, 2018)
    Reviewed by NOAM CHOMSKY.

    To plumb the depths of human savagery is a formidable task, and not a pleasant one. The task is undertaken with rigorous argument and scrupulous scholarship in Norman Finkelstein’s monumental “inquest into Gaza’s martyrdom.” And with undisguised passion. As he writes, “this book rises to a crescendo of anger and indignation.” It is hard to see how anyone with a shred of humanity could react differently to the bitter record unraveled here.

    There have been evocative, often shattering, accounts of the tragedy of Gaza. Some of the most infuriating are live testimony from the scene during the periodic escalations of the crimes: among them the reports by the remarkable Norwegian surgeon Mads Gilbert from the trauma wards of al-Shifa hospital and the painful daily reports by the courageous Palestinian journalist Mohammed Omer. There have also been studies by prestigious commissions of inquiry and by the major international human-rights groups, all mined in Finkelstein’s inquest. Understanding has also been enriched by work of fine journalists and scholars. But in its comprehensive sweep, deep probing and acute critical analysis, Finkelstein’s study stands alone.

    Concluding his inquest, Finkelstein cites warnings by UNCTAD and other international monitors that Gaza could become literally uninhabitable by 2020 “due to ongoing de-development, eight years of economic blockade and three operations” from 2009 to 2014. The grim figures on the availability of potable water, energy and housing, on unemployment and dependence on humanitarian aid even for food, depict all too clearly the nature of the catastrophe as 2020 approaches.

    Responding to the imminent catastrophe, President Trump ordered that the U.S. contribution to UNRWA — “a lifeline for Palestinians” — be cut to one-sixth the scheduled funding. As he explained, he saw no reason to fund people who show “no appreciation or respect” as he dangles before their eyes his “ultimate deal” while handing Greater Jerusalem over to Israel.

    The idea that nearly two million people, median age 17, are locked by force in a small cage that is soon to become uninhabitable while the world looks away is almost unfathomable. True, there is sometimes a reaction of disgust; in one recent case, on May 14, 2018, when, on the eve of Nakba Day, split-scene photographs appeared showing Israeli snipers expertly murdering desperate Gazans protesting their martyrdom, alongside images of Ivanka Trump smiling happily with a beaming Netanyahu at the celebration of the opening of the U.S. embassy in Jerusalem. But such moments are rare.

    Visiting Gazan health centers after the Israeli atrocities of spring 2018, UNRWA Commissioner-General Pierre Krähenbühl found scenes that were “shocking and deeply disturbing,” including “a pattern of entry and exit wounds that indicates ammunition used caused severe damage to internal organs, muscle tissue and bones.” One hundred seventeen were killed by Israel forces during peaceful protests and 1,200 injured, many at a distance from the troops and posing no imaginable threat — even a young woman bravely tending to the injured. What he found is “truly staggering,” Krähenbühl reported.

    Read more….
    http://normanfinkelstein.com/2018/09/30/noam-chomsky-on-finkelsteins-gaza-book/

  4. Cinny 4
    2 October 2018 at 9:59 am

    There’s a really interesting article on Newsroom this morning about the conflict of interests with the meth cleaning companies. Well worth a read.

    Conflicts of interest

    At the same time, government policies around meth-testing were themselves partly shaped by the industry that stood to profit from them, two companies in particular. One was Forensic and Industrial Science Limited, the company behind Kim Gouk’s ordeal. The other was MethSolutions, run by Miles Stratford.

    https://www.newsroom.co.nz/2018/10/01/253344/foxes-in-charge-of-the-meth-house

    • Macro 4.1
      2 October 2018 at 11:09 am

      Oh Dear! Surprise! Surprise!* How come it has it taken the media that long to figure out? That was just Nat policy at work – “I’ll piss in your pocket if you piss in mine”. JFK’s mates were creaming it.

      * not directed at you Cinny. The above reported conflict of interest has been obvious to anyone with their eyes and ears open for as long as this travesty has been in progress, aided and abetted by the Nats. Meanwhile our “erstwhile” media have stood aside and reported nothing until now.

  5. Pete 5
    2 October 2018 at 10:06 am

    The Herald’s carrying a story about the PM being questioned by Mike Hosking about the cost of employing someone to take photos in New York. Photos provided to NZ media.

    Don’t go through the archives trying to find Hosking questioning John Key or Bill English on incurring costs for doing the same thing. Especially after boldly being critical of the activity.

    That’s because he didn’t, he wasn’t . Maybe his view was obscured by being up the orifices he resided in at those times.

    • Ed 5.1
      2 October 2018 at 10:12 am

      The media is a tool of the establishment.
      And Hosking is a tool.

    • chris73 5.2
      2 October 2018 at 10:20 am

      Wasn’t the ad agency contracted to take the pics also a Labour party donor?

      • Pete 5.2.1
        2 October 2018 at 10:34 am

        Are political parties to not engage any individuals or companies who make political donations? Is a government not to engage any individuals or companies who make political donations?
        If anyone from a government communicates with any outside person or company should they ascertain whether they have made political donations?

        When the ‘backroom’ negotiations were taking place for the Auckland Convention Centre did the politicians involved ask each and every individual involved if they were political donors?

        • chris73 5.2.1.1
          2 October 2018 at 10:44 am

          Perception is everything, had National done the exact same thing I’m pretty sure Labour wouldn’t have just let it go

          • Ed 5.2.1.1.1
            2 October 2018 at 10:44 am

            One only perceives it if you read and believe Hosking.
            I don’t.

          • Bearded Git 5.2.1.1.2
            2 October 2018 at 11:09 am

            Key paid to go on US TV….were we told at the time? Of course not. He portrayed himself as the lovable hero that was in demand.

            Jacinda is the real deal.

          • Dukeofurl 5.2.1.1.3
            2 October 2018 at 1:55 pm

            “d National done the exact same thing I’m pretty sure Labour wouldn’t have just let it go”

            They did let it go, when Key advertised for a videographer on the leaders office payroll. And would take that person on overseas trips.

            As Ardern said, ‘it was cheaper than bring someone along from NZ’

      • Macro 5.2.2
        2 October 2018 at 11:15 am

        Have you any evidence to prove that they were?
        Is there a conflict of interest if they did?
        Does the National Party employ photographers who donate to them?

        • chris73 5.2.2.1
          2 October 2018 at 11:28 am

          “Have you any evidence to prove that they were?”
          Assuming its the same company then yes (thanks kiwiblog)
          https://www.elections.org.nz/sites/default/files/bulk-upload/documents/labour_party_-_annual_return_2017.pdf

          “Is there a conflict of interest if they did?”
          If they donated money to Labour and then got a contract from Labour then possibly, although I won’t discount the possiblity of legal finagling to show it isn’t

          “Does the National Party employ photographers who donate to them?”
          Beats me

          • Draco T Bastard 5.2.2.1.1
            2 October 2018 at 1:22 pm

            If they donated money to Labour and then got a contract from Labour then possibly

            Did you say the same thing when a company that donated $100,000 to National then got a $7.2m government contract to run a hotel?

            • SHG 5.2.2.1.1.1
              2 October 2018 at 1:52 pm

              The most depressing thing about this government is just how quickly it has pivoted from optimism to a position of “look this is just how things have always been done, National did it, we do it, nothing to see here”.

              • David Mac …
                2 October 2018 at 2:42 pm

                I think they have their eye on the big prize, an election win and no need to talk to Winston. Push too hard left and that’s not going to happen, with or without NZ1st.

                Labour/Greens don’t need to win the hearts of those with a left bias.

                • Stuart Munro …
                  2 October 2018 at 3:59 pm

                  Don’t count on it.

                  Bullshit like 1080 will cost the Greens a lot of votes.

                  • David Mac …
                    2 October 2018 at 4:09 pm

                    Hi Stuart, yeah I think that’s a valid point but I think the Nats would need to adopt a ‘We’re going to ban 1080’ platform to get them to shift over and I think that’s unlikely.

                    • Stuart Munro …
                      2 October 2018 at 4:39 pm

                      For the Gnats it’s enough to suppress the left vote. They won’t stop the 1080 – it was their policy after all.

            • Chuck 5.2.2.1.1.2
              2 October 2018 at 2:33 pm

              Get with the times Draco…

              Labour leader Andrew Little apologised to Earl and Lani Hagaman back in April 2017.

              • Draco T Bastard …
                2 October 2018 at 2:41 pm

                So, such actions are fine for National to do but not for Labour?

                Personally I think that this sort of corruption needs to be stopped by simply banning donations of any kind to political parties.

            • chris73 5.2.2.1.1.3
              2 October 2018 at 7:25 pm

              Ask Jacinda Arderns father about that

          • Macro 5.2.2.1.2
            2 October 2018 at 1:35 pm

            Conflicts of interest

            At the same time, government policies around meth-testing were themselves partly shaped by the industry that stood to profit from them, two companies in particular. One was Forensic and Industrial Science Limited, the company behind Kim Gouk’s ordeal. The other was MethSolutions, run by Miles Stratford.

            and of course we should never forget Niue,

            A hotel group that won a contract to run a Niue resort has denied any conflict, despite its founder making “numerous donations” to political parties.

            During the 2014 election, Scenic Hotel Group founder Earl Hagaman donated $101,000 to the National Party.

            A month later, the company won a contract to manage the Niuean Matavai Resort, heavily funded by the New Zealand government. Last year, $7.5 million in aid funding was announced to expand the resort.

            https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/79067679/numerous-donations-by-hotel-founder-to-national-party-but-no-conflict
            of course no conflict of interest there /sarc

            Pot, Kettle, Black?

      • veutoviper 5.2.3
        2 October 2018 at 12:12 pm

        This was discussed in detail by the PM in her weekly interview with Guyon Espiner on Morning Report this morning. Starts at 5 mins in.

        https://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/2018664969/labour-would-vote-against-kiwi-values-bill-jacinda-ardern

        Apparently. it had been proposed that they take a photographer to the UN GA in NY as previous PMs have done in the past including Key. Ardern had looked at the costs and vetoed taking someone from NZ. Instead she had set the expectation to the team that the cost of using local photographers in NY must not exceed the costs of taking someone from NZ.

        The company used was Augusto, an Auckland based hybrid production and creative agency set up by young NZers who are in the process of starting up a branch in New York.

        https://www.augusto.co.nz/

        https://www.augusto.co.nz/news/

        Espiner suggested that the company had given a donation to Labour during the 2017 general election campaign of $18,274.49. Ardern queried whether he was insinuating a cash donation and said that from her recollection that would have been “in kind” support provided during the campaign as they had done promotional work for Labour.

        With regard to the images etc taken in NY the costs of employing Augusto would be paid from Ardern’s Leader’s fund. In accord with the rules on use of the Leader’s Fund, the photos etc could be used for general promotion at any time in the next year or so – except during the 2020 election campaign period.

        In other words, they had appeared to have done their homework to ensure that everything was above board.

        Personally, I think it is great to see her support young entrepreneurial New Zealanders rather than the big overseas based PR corporates.

        • chris73 5.2.3.1
          2 October 2018 at 12:26 pm

          “from her recollection”, is that like how she didn’t know Derek Handly and had barely spoken to him, apart from giving him her personal email address that is

          • veutoviper 5.2.3.1.1
            2 October 2018 at 12:36 pm

            Provide a link to where Ardern said* that “she didn’t know Derek Handly (sic)”.

            Go on, we’re waiting …

            * by that I mean where Ardern herself said that – not what was reported by someone else (eg media or Bridges or the man in the moon)

      • Gabby 5.2.4
        2 October 2018 at 2:15 pm

        Wasn’t Early Haggyman a gnatz donor christy?

    • Cinny 5.3
      2 October 2018 at 11:01 am

      It was cheaper to contract someone in NY, than fly a kiwi over to accompany her and take photos.

      Pete you are so right re hosking not questioning the pm who quit on the same. Crikey many of us have only recently discovered that key paid $10k to get on the tonight show.

      Little mike really hasn’t been handling the election loss, it’s been a year now, maybe when the coalition wins again in 2020 he will accept it.

      Besides the $ for said photography came from Jacinda’s leaders fund.

      Any word on the leaker, wonder how much simon has spent via his leaders fund chasing that tail.

      • Ffloyd 5.3.1
        2 October 2018 at 1:25 pm

        Jamie Lee Ross is taking leave for health reasons. Personal and private so no details. Simon wants to give him some space. Nothing to do with being incontinent apparently.

      • riffer 5.3.2
        2 October 2018 at 2:08 pm

        Same interview Bridges also says he does not know who the leaker is. I doubt you rule out anybody at this stage.

      • Chuck 5.3.3
        2 October 2018 at 2:40 pm

        All political parties like to spend public $, especially those on the left.

        However, you miss the point Cinny – Ardern paid for the PR blitz via the leader’s fund. Then Ardern says the photos/movie will be used amongst other things for electioneering. Now that is illegal to do so, her office had to correct Ardern’s statement the following day.

        Was it a slip of the tongue by Ardern? either she had no idea of the rules or hmmm she was busted.

        • veutoviper 5.3.3.1
          2 October 2018 at 2:44 pm

          “Then Ardern says the photos/movie will be used amongst other things for electioneering. Now that is illegal to do so, her office had to correct Ardern’s statement the following day.”

          So where and when was ‘ this correction the following day’ made? Please provide a link as this does not align with information provided today.

        • Sacha 5.3.3.2
          2 October 2018 at 3:37 pm

          Electioneering? The word she used was “campaigns” – which is a term common to both marketing and politics.

        • Cinny 5.3.3.3
          2 October 2018 at 4:25 pm

          But couldn’t any footage of a PM potentially be used in the future for a campaign?

          Plenty of footage of the PM who quit was used for such.

          As footage is being captured wouldn’t the people involved be thinking of all the different applications said footage could be used for? Would that not be forward planning/brainstorming?

          It’s all in the wording.

          • Chuck 5.3.3.3.1
            2 October 2018 at 5:04 pm

            “It’s all in the wording.” Indeed so.

            Campaign:

            For Sacha (above post) it means marketing and politics.

            synonyms:
            crusade, fight, battle, work, push, press, strive, struggle, agitate; promote, advocate, champion, speak for, lobby for, propagandize
            “a movement campaigning for political reform”

    • Tiger Mountain 5.4
      2 October 2018 at 12:21 pm

      …in reply to Pete @ #5
      Winston Peters in the recent past–while our glorious ex leader Mr Key was PM–called Hosking “a National Party stooge whose jowls are up the Prime Minister’s cheeks”

      which while a mangled version of “cheek by jowl” as Brian Edwards pointed out, makes the point quite well of the extent of Hoskings “Key Love”

  6. Dennis Frank 6
    2 October 2018 at 11:14 am

    Looks like we will have to get real about the threat posed by young male islamic immigrants. “Party leader Winston Peters said there was sexism in some migrant communities, where women were treated “like cattle”. https://www.newsroom.co.nz/@politics/2018/09/30/258780/adhere-to-new-zealand-values-or-get-out

    “If Winston is saying women should be treated better we agree, across cultures and communities. Domestic violence and other women’s rights abuses are pervasive across the world and occur in New Zealand at record rates, and the Green Party are working to address that,” Ghahraman said.

    Too bad she seems intent on avoiding the issue that NZF are pointing too. When a religion indoctrinates the young with the belief that patriarchy has a divine mandate, and we import lots of foreigners who believe accordingly, on what basis can we expect them to respect the civil rights of kiwis that are incompatible with their faith??

    That’s the problem that NZF are seeking to legislate a solution to. Having the Greens join the Nat/Lab duopoly in denial of this problem is unacceptable. The Greens must reposition themselves as part of the solution. Using their brains would be a good start.

  7. The Chairman 7
    2 October 2018 at 12:06 pm

    Was Labour’s Electricity Price Review a whitewash?

    Seems it was: https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/opinion-analysis/107508109/its-all-there-in-the-accounts-electricity-distributors-are-making-excessive-profits

    Labour, the party the left can count on to let them down.

    • Ed 7.1
      2 October 2018 at 12:22 pm

      Labour is not a socialist party.
      It is an extreme capitalist party.

    • Draco T Bastard 7.2
      2 October 2018 at 1:36 pm

      Labour has always been a capitalist party so we really shouldn’t be surprised when it supports the capitalists ripping off the community.

      • David Mac 7.2.1
        2 October 2018 at 2:48 pm

        Since the coming of the white man we have been a capitalist country. Alternatives struggle to win 1000 votes.

        • Ad 7.2.1.1
          2 October 2018 at 5:42 pm

          We should expect at minimum a well regulated economy.
          We don’t have it. We should.

          • David Mac 7.2.1.1.1
            2 October 2018 at 6:05 pm

            Yeah, I agree.

            A culture of self regulation would be ideal. An enhanced sense of ‘Am I doing the right thing here?’

            • Draco T Bastard 7.2.1.1.1.1
              2 October 2018 at 6:49 pm

              A culture of self regulation would be ideal.

              That’s what the capitalists have been telling us for the last few decades as they’ve removed almost all of our ability to hold them to account for when they fuck things up.

              An enhanced sense of ‘Am I doing the right thing here?’

              And that’s why we have regulation. So that they don’t have to have a sense of it but can read it in black and white.

              • David Mac …
                2 October 2018 at 7:28 pm

                A dozen policemen on every corner is a crap aspiration Draco, aim higher.

                • David Mac …
                  2 October 2018 at 8:46 pm

                  What a double edged sword a cashless society would be. So much to be gained under that ominous cloud of Big Brother.

                  As far as taxation goes, we wouldn’t need policemen shining torches up our affairs.

                  If there was no cash, when I habitually spend or save more electronic money than I’ve paid tax on, unless I’ve registered an exception, I don’t get a knock on the door, I get a summons to appear in court to face damning evidence.

                  Wages: When Ravi is being regularly paid $2 per hour below the minimum wage, an algorithm prints a court date for Ravi’s boss.

                  If Ravi’s boss is here illegally, he could score a summons and the chance to see his Mum again.

                  But Geeeez, the Big Brother thing…

                  • Draco T Bastard …
                    2 October 2018 at 9:38 pm

                    If Ravi’s boss is breaking the law as you say then he obviously needs to face the consequences.

                    Do you think that police shouldn’t hide speed cameras as well? You know, adhere to the idea that people should be able to break the law just because they can’t see a policeman?

                    As far as cashless society and cameras on roads go the recording isn’t the problem – it’s when it’s used for nefarious purposes which really only requires the necessary processes in place to prevent.

                • Draco T Bastard …
                  2 October 2018 at 9:33 pm

                  You seem to be using exaggeration to induce fear into people while not adding anything to the discussion.

    • Ad 7.3
      2 October 2018 at 5:41 pm

      Yes I agree with you Chairman it was a whitewash.

      A really active government would have cleaned out the Board of the Electricity Commission and Transpower as soon as it got into government.

      On about a million fronts this government is not tackling governance issues, when it is a core part of what this coalition government should be doing. There are plenty of good candidates for the government of replace them with, who would also generate fresh thinking. Clearly there’s enough candidates to fill the review committees, think-tanks, and advisory boards churning forests of paper through Wellington right now.

      Vector sending me and hundreds of thousands of others a $30 cheque from their profits instead of reinvesting it in their network that broke down so catastrophically across Auckland in April beggars belief.

      There are no instruments to hold electricity prices to account other than occasional checks of the spot market, which is a joke. There’s not even a decent price regulator, let alone a body that speaks for the electricity consumer.

      Even Australian generators get more scrutiny than this.

      You can go through not only electricity, but the whole of the State Owned Enterprises schedule and find the majority still stacked with National Party acolytes.

      We sure aren’t going to get governance accountability of the system at this rate.

    • Ed 8.1
      2 October 2018 at 12:50 pm

      An old Standard thread includes comments by a contributor called Blondie suggesting Ross is a puppet of Slater’s.

      All I know is this: on numerous occasions, I witnessed Cameron with my own eyes and ears, telling Jamie Lee to do this or that – and then the next week it’d be reported that he’d done exactly as Cameron Slater instructed him. Usually in relation to asking Len Brown a tricky question. And then the Whaleoil site would say how wonderful he was for calling Len to account – and then it’d get picked up by the MSM.

      Furthermore, Cameron himself told me how involved he was in Jamie Lee’s campaign. Having witnessed that FIRST HAND, it’s not rocket science to work out who’s pulling Jamie Lee’s strings.

      https://thestandard.org.nz/jami-lee-ross-runs-scared/

      • Muttonbird 8.1.1
        2 October 2018 at 12:53 pm

        An OIA asking for recent communications between Ross and Slater wouldn’t go amiss.

    • Ed 8.2
      2 October 2018 at 12:53 pm

      A NBR article points to links with Simon Lusk.

      The Prime Minster says he has not read secret documents which detail plans to form a hard-right wing faction within the National Party, essentially forming a party within a party.

      The plans are reportedly the work of political consultant Simon Lusk, who has managed the campaigns of several National backbenchers, including Sam Lotu-Iiga, junior whip Louise Upston, and Botany MP Jamie Lee Ross.

      https://www.nbr.co.nz/article/pm-responds-secret-plans-push-nats-right-ck-140987

    • Ed 8.3
      2 October 2018 at 12:58 pm

      According to contributor ghostwhowalksnz

      The released email details point out a conversation where Slater comments about what Jamie Lee Ross would do in a certain situation:

      He will do as hes told

      https://thestandard.org.nz/tewharewhero-careering-to-the-right/

    • Ad 8.4
      2 October 2018 at 5:43 pm

      The only “medical personal issue” Jamie Lee Ross needs to cure is the fact that he’s a total asshole.

  9. Pete 9
    2 October 2018 at 12:38 pm

    “Mr Bridges said the decision had nothing to do with the party’s ongoing leak investigation, and he would not be making any further comment on Mr Ross’ health issues as it was a private matter.”

    I wonder if the private information will leak out.

    • Muttonbird 9.1
      2 October 2018 at 12:41 pm

      Talk about being economical with the truth, Mr Bridges!

      • ScottGN 9.1.1
        2 October 2018 at 12:52 pm

        Timed for the parliamentary recess too.

        • Muttonbird 9.1.1.1
          2 October 2018 at 12:54 pm

          How cynical. I expect Farrar to be all over the timing of this.

          • Dukeofurl 9.1.1.1.1
            2 October 2018 at 1:44 pm

            Ross could hardly be both attending parliament and be in a ‘fragile emotional position’, so this is a way of aligning the ‘optics’ for Ross and for Bridges means the issue largely goes away for 2-3 months as he ‘cant comment’.

            Is also a way to neuter any reveals that Peters my try in parliament.

            • Muttonbird 9.1.1.1.1.1
              2 October 2018 at 1:49 pm

              The wider optics are that to draw attention to Bridges wasteful spending means you aren’t mentally fit.

            • Ffloyd 9.1.1.1.1.2
              2 October 2018 at 1:52 pm

              Expect to hear Guyon all over this in the morning. Could be waiting a while though. Won’t be holding my breath. Bridges ‘owes it to all NZ ers’ to tell us the reason.

  10. Pete 10
    2 October 2018 at 12:54 pm

    It is sickening to be sitting on that side of the House. Not just for those in the House. The ailing each day flaunt the maladies induced by it.

  11. Draco T Bastard 11
    2 October 2018 at 1:32 pm

    The World’s Most Beautiful Battery

    The Kaprun hydroelectric station may be 70 years old, but Helmut Biberger’s job is to ensure it can handle the rapid swings in modern electricity markets. He’s helped rig the facility to generate power at a moment’s notice, using a network of winding tunnels and reservoirs built into the side of the country’s tallest mountains.

    The station functions as a giant battery, by using energy when it’s abundant–and cheap–to pump water to a mountaintop reservoir. There it sits in the bluest of blue Alpine lakes until power demand spikes. At that moment traders 250 miles away in Vienna open the dam, spilling that same water downhill to spin those turbines, and selling the resulting electricity at higher prices.

    Which why solar and wind power in NZ is both viable and almost easy to put in place – we already have a large number of hydro-dams. Just need a bit of modification to turn them into batteries.

    Of course, we’d still be better off if it was all state owned with no dead-weight loss profit involved.

    • McFlock 11.1
      2 October 2018 at 1:42 pm

      If you look at the diagrams, they involved two reservoirs, not our single-reservoir systems. Got to maintain river flows.

      Whereas we’re already too intensive in hydro – we need to diversify into other renewables, because droughts happen.

      • Draco T Bastard 11.1.1
        2 October 2018 at 2:50 pm

        If you look at the diagrams, they involved two reservoirs, not our single-reservoir systems. Got to maintain river flows.

        I did say that they’d need some modification. And each of our rivers has multiple dams on it. Each damn is a reservoir.

        Whereas we’re already too intensive in hydro – we need to diversify into other renewables, because droughts happen.

        True.

        • McFlock 11.1.1.1
          2 October 2018 at 3:24 pm

          Each dam has a reservoir, but the reservoir array in the article was significantly smaller and closer than our clutha river dams, for example. Pumping up from Roxburgh to Clyde in reasonable quantities is a bigger prospect than the dam in that article: 30km rather than 1km, and then there’s the volumes required. The entire complex in that article is a smaller generator than the Roxburgh dam alone.

          That solution was right for them, but one size does not fit all.

          • Draco T Bastard 11.1.1.1.1
            2 October 2018 at 6:45 pm

            Pumping up from Roxburgh to Clyde in reasonable quantities is a bigger prospect than the dam in that article: 30km rather than 1km, and then there’s the volumes required.

            Or it could be that the water is pumped from the bottom of the dam to the top and not from the next dam and thus being only a distance of a few hundred metres.

            That solution was right for them, but one size does not fit all.

            I have constantly said that modification would be required and am thus not promoting a one size fits all solution. That modification would be based upon detailed research which may come to the conclusion that it’s not worth doing at all or maybe only doing in some places.

            It’s an idea which, by all indications from the real world, has merit which makes worthwhile looking at for NZ considering our large number of hydro-dams.

            • McFlock 11.1.1.1.1.1
              2 October 2018 at 8:58 pm

              But they go into rivers, not other reservoirs. The most you can pump up is what you let through at the time, and then you have to maintain river flows.

              but if you pump up from a reservoir, you can pump up water that has been stored for weeks. If you’re pumping from the river flow you’re letting through at the moment, why not just let less through?

              And you’ve merely said “some” or “a bit” of modification to do the repumping idea. I suspect “some” is a 30km pipeline requiring resource consent and probably land purchases.

    • Dukeofurl 11.2
      2 October 2018 at 1:47 pm

      “Just need a bit of modification to turn them into batteries.”

      Duh . They are allready batteries , thats what lake storage does. Hint batteries store power.

      • Draco T Bastard 11.2.1
        2 October 2018 at 2:52 pm

        I was thinking about the ability to pump water back up to a higher reservoir using excess power from other renewables to make them better batteries.

        • David Mac 11.2.1.1
          2 October 2018 at 4:04 pm

          Yes, I like this system too Draco. It addresses the primary shortcomings of solar and wind. It doesn’t matter if there is no wind or sun on a particular day, you just need to pump enough water up to a higher reservoir when there is.

    • David Mac 11.3
      2 October 2018 at 2:51 pm

      It would be good to have our growing fleet of electric cars recharging when we have an over supply. eg: Cheaper power to recharge the car from midnight to 6am.

      • Draco T Bastard 11.3.1
        2 October 2018 at 2:54 pm

        Cars, even electric ones, are still a waste of resources and even when autonomous will still cost the country billions every year in congestion.

        • David Mac 11.3.1.1
          2 October 2018 at 3:53 pm

          Yeah, the trick would be banning all personal transport and winning an election. Good luck with that reality.

          About 100 years ago cars weren’t the problem, they were the solution.

          “Towards the end of the 19th century, London was virtually unliveable. The city had 11,000 carriages, several thousand buses and a variety of carts, wagons and buggies—a vehicular density unprecedented in history. And while the challenges of congestion and hygiene are not dissimilar to those we face today—19th century vehicles were horse-drawn and that brought with it a uniquely different set of issues. Horses generate a not inconsiderable quantum of solid waste. The average draft horse produces 10kg of manure per day. As a result, toward the end of the 19th century, the city of London was generating over 20,000kg of horse dung every month. Manure soon began to pile up on the streets faster than it could be cleared away and by the end of the 19th century, London was literally carpeted with a warm, brown matting . . . smelling to heaven. Leaving aside the filth and the smell, this gave rise to numerous other problems like sanitation and the rapid spread of communicable diseases—so much so that residents in the 1890s were literally being killed by the streets they walked on. In 1894, the Times of London predicted that within 50 years, every street in London would be buried under 9 feet of manure.

          This was the Great Horse Manure Crisis of 1894, an urban catastrophe that, at the time, was the bane of every large city in the world, from New York to Sydney. At the very first International Urban Planning Conference convened in New York in 1898, horse-dung was the only topic on the agenda—and it was such a fraught subject that the conference was disbanded in three days without a solution. At the time, it seemed as if life on earth would end, not due to a collision with a meteor or other cataclysmic events—but under an ever-rising pile of dung.”

          • Draco T Bastard 11.3.1.1.1
            2 October 2018 at 6:33 pm

            Yeah, the trick would be banning all personal transport and winning an election.

            Why would anyone ban bicycles?

            About 100 years ago cars weren’t the problem, they were the solution.

            And now cars represent a much bigger problem in climate change and congestion. Electric ones may address the climate change issue but they don’t address the congestion as private motor vehicles are the cause of that congestion.

            • David Mac 11.3.1.1.1.1
              2 October 2018 at 6:47 pm

              Ha! You’re contrary for the sake of being contrary, get an argumentative girlfriend.

              “Great news everyone, cars are outlawed but it’s ok, you can get a push-bike.” It’s election suicide Draco.

              I hear you but I think you’re a long way from a viable solution to congestion. I think we should be looking at things like strong motivation for us to spread out. Moving Auckland’s port to Whangarei, that sort of thing.

      • KJT 11.3.2
        2 October 2018 at 9:05 pm

        Close Tiwai pt and we have enough excess off peak electric power for a huge fleet of electric cars, trucks and trains

    • Exkiwiforces 11.4
      2 October 2018 at 4:23 pm

      Have a look at this battery from Tesla down in South Australia, no wonder some of the Righties here in Oz are carrying on like a bunch of green pork chops that gone off past use by date atm about the cost of renewable energy and saying coal fired power stations are more a efficient. They have shares in coal thermal coal mining and coal fired power plants.

      http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-10-02/tesla-battery-proves-a-leading-source-of-dispatchable-power/10326420

      • Dennis Frank 11.4.1
        2 October 2018 at 5:53 pm

        Looks like a big improvement in infrastructure resilience & efficiency. You’d need expert analysis from electrical engineers employed in our regional systems management to provide advice to our govt on potential relevance here, eh?

    • Ad 11.5
      2 October 2018 at 5:46 pm

      Even under a state owned system, Lammamoor wind farm was refused.
      As was a single turbine in Blueskin Bay.
      As were plenty of others.
      Even the single marine generator in Kaipara Heads was too hard.

      The biggest dead weight loss we have to energy sustainability is democracy in the form of the RMA.

      • Draco T Bastard 11.5.1
        2 October 2018 at 6:35 pm

        The biggest dead weight loss we have to energy sustainability is democracy in the form of the RMA.

        Ah, so you’ve bought into the lies of the RWNJs.

      • Molly 11.5.2
        2 October 2018 at 6:41 pm

        “The biggest dead weight loss we have to energy sustainability is democracy in the form of the RMA.”
        No, more in the way that the RMA is implemented, and the changes that have been made to that legislation in the last 27 years or so, that have reduced the effectiveness of it.

  12. ankerawshark 12
    2 October 2018 at 1:36 pm

    Ok Jami Lee Ross standing down for a few months for health reasons, but” he isn’t the leaker”

    Sincerely wishing him all the best.

    • Muttonbird 12.1
      2 October 2018 at 1:47 pm

      I do too. In the very very very remote chance what Bridges said is true then I hope he’s able to overcome his personal problems.

      In the very very very likely chance Bridges is lying on this and Ross is the leaker then I salute him for drawing attention to Bridges’ arrogant, wasteful, and narcissistic spending on crown limos.

    • BM 12.2
      2 October 2018 at 1:53 pm

      I read that his wife is ill.

    • riffer 12.3
      2 October 2018 at 2:10 pm

      Entirely possible that both scenarios are true.

  13. Dennis Frank 13
    2 October 2018 at 2:29 pm

    Gordon Campbell alerts us to this emerging future: “who is the best hope of ridding the world of Trump? Over the past six weeks, Massachusetts senator Elizabeth Warren has emerged from the pack as Trump’s likely Democratic rival in 2020.” http://werewolf.co.nz/2018/09/gordon-campbell-on-elizabeth-warrens-plan-to-save-capitalism-from-itself/

    Warren’s agenda is to transform corporations: “Warren is not offering the left’s usual solutions i.e. new and costly government programmes to compensate those left behind by unfettered market capitalism. Instead, and as set out in the Accountable Capitalism Act she launched in August, Warren aims to rein in those market forces. In future, large firms and multinationals will no longer be able to act as sociopaths with no obligations to anyone (or anything) but their own shareholders.”

    “Firms with an annual turnover above $1 billion will be required to register as United States Corporations and obtain a federal charter of corporate citizenship: Warren wants to eliminate the huge financial incentives that entice CEOs to flush cash out to shareholders rather than re-invest in businesses. She wants to curb corporations’ political activities. And for the biggest corporations, she’s proposing a dramatic step that would ensure workers and not just shareholders get a voice on big strategic decisions. Warren hopes this will spur a return to greater corporate responsibility, and bring back some other aspects of the more egalitarian era of American capitalism post-World War II — more business investment, more meaningful career ladders for workers, more financial stability, and higher pay.”

    “This charter won’t simply consist in warm and woolly good intentions. Under the charter, United States Corporations will be required to allocate 40% of seats on their board to workers, roughly in line with Germany’s ‘co-determination’ rules for business. Also, 75% of the board and 75% of the shareholders will have to endorse the firm’s political activities and donations.”

    Warren is positioning herself as that most unusual kind of leftist: one capable of replacing slogans with serious political intent of the radical kind. If she can get Sanders on board with this agenda the Democrats will start to look like winners for a change. Their corporate funders will be aghast, of course. Wall St will seek an establishment democrat to oppose her, fast!

    • Bewildered 13.1
      2 October 2018 at 11:10 pm

      Trump will be her biggest fan supporting her to stand all the way. Pocahontas vs the Donald

  14. eco maori 14
    3 October 2018 at 8:32 am

    Kia ora The Am Show Our education system needs a over haul start teaching mokopuna trades at 13 make the place a magnet for all children including the ones who wag change are need .
    I say they would need more money . There is a phenomenon that I did not add into my thought’s on why there are many strikes the last lot using Thompson & Clark & co to intimidate the protester’s won’t be happening NOW.
    That’s my thought’s on the wedding good on them .
    Wild Journey’s is story’s from our past it will be a cool read.
    Our personal Data one need to view Truth & Power that’s a eye opener .
    I have my morel’s never kick a person who’s down.
    Ka kite ano P.S I know a neo liberal capitalist will not have these morel’s

  15. eco maori 15
    3 October 2018 at 10:23 am

    Our Tangata whenua Australian couisn’s have been treated worse than Maori .
    Our culture’s have a lot in common bad health stats crime education we have the same views on Papatuanuku her environment and beautiful creatures .
    I encourage all Indiginous cultures to be proud of your selves and cultures
    Promote and support your strong wahine to run for elections local state and national .
    This is the only way you will speed up the long walk to equality for you and your mokopuna’s .I beleve in a balance live its self in a fine balancing act ying/yang
    Our world is thrown out of balance by to many men in power and that phenomenon can be linked to all the problem’s we face.
    If one has to much power they take all and just leave what drips off there plate for the smaller powers I see this happening all around the world. Kia kaha indigenous peoples
    Ka kite ano link is below

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/sep/26/im-exhausted-but-as-an-aboriginal-woman-im-also-strong-and-proud

  16. eco maori 16
    3 October 2018 at 12:04 pm

    I did say that humane caused climate change will cause more suffering for the poor people here is a link that proves that it is not a fable it quite a easy scenario to work out
    Link below ka kite ano

    https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/2-hurricanes-lay-bare-the-vulnerability-of-americas-poor/

  17. eco maori 17
    3 October 2018 at 2:59 pm

    Apogees to Aretha Franklin and family I got the song mixed up

  19. eco maori 19
    3 October 2018 at 4:10 pm

    This is a better Idea having wild life sanctuaries all over Aotearoa instead of trying to wipe out all predators from Aotearoa I say that Idea being publicized was a silly play from shonky.
    Link is below ka kite ano

    https://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/367828/predator-free-project-receives-4m

  20. eco maori 20
    3 October 2018 at 5:44 pm

    Maori staff back Uni vic chancellor and so do I .
    Now don brash mite be a polite person and he thinks his view on Aotearoa should be heard but if one look’s into his past one can see he has a view that has been let behind in our history book’s .
    Yes it would be nice for everyone to be treated the same and have no need to promote maori culture maori tikanga maori TV Te treaty of Waitangi he is dreaming untill everyone is treated equally in all aspects of life in Aotearoa incomes housing health wealth education that dream will never be achievable.
    Maori have been TAX and suppressed in Aotearoa for 150 years so we still have a long walk to Undo the injustices of bygone era Kia kaha ka kite ano link is below.
    P.S that muppet was opposed to Maori TV.
    I have been watching Barry Barclay auto biography on NZONSCREEN he was a great leader like Merata for Maori movies and documentarys

    https://www.radionz.co.nz/news/te-manu-korihi/367507/maori-staff-back-uni-vice-chancellor-amid-controversy

  21. eco maori 21
    3 October 2018 at 6:46 pm

    Kia ora Newshub synthetic drugs need to be controlled it is a man made poison.
    There you go the poor are suffering the most in Indonesia kia kaha
    I have been following company for a few years prouducing fuel from carbon capture and used to grow algae to be refined to fuel.
    Yes its cool that Cook is taken of Titirangi and put in the museum there should be statues of Great Maori Ariki .
    Well there you go on trump enough said
    Our scientists are still finding new thing in space a new planet ka pai.
    Iwi the Kiwi is a huge ballon some people around the world don’t like the popularity that New Zealand is getting at the minute it’s not hard to see who this could be how were it has turn up would be as good as any.I read it weights a few ton one must be determined to fright that around the world.
    Many thanks to the Auckland council for putting up rail crossing barriers and gates around Auckland.
    Cool the extra tax write off for research funding this is a must I know the last lot cut that who Knows why but it was not a intelligent move.
    That’s sad that te Maui dolphin dying she was pregnant to only 60 left in Tangaroa lets hope they can rebound in numbers in the near future .
    Ka kite ano.

  22. eco maori 22
    3 October 2018 at 7:23 pm

    Kia ora The Crowd Goes Wild James & Mulls .
    I heard a bit of hollering going down on the Rock Mulls.
    I had a skipper he was called old yella he would scream and swear when the gear was coming up and being set everyone new this about him I was 15 I tryed to work for him when I was 20 he started yelling I look at him and told him were to stick his job
    he did not stop yelling lol .I learnt his bad habit but I got it under control as the teeth got longer
    Youth Olympics a Wairangi does it make you feel young hope the team does well.
    Conner looks like a determent young fella good race driver a.
    I brought my first car at 15 could not even drive that good I soon learned one of my car is in the Waiapu black EH Holden 1967.
    Was Jeremy and Mike Havoc around in Dunedin at that time Mulls.
    Ka kite ano

The server will be getting hardware changes this evening starting at 10pm NZDT.
The site will be off line for some hours.