Open mike 02/10/2013

Written By: - Date published: 6:30 am, October 2nd, 2013 - 112 comments
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Open mike is your post. For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose. The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy). Step right up to the mike…

112 comments on “Open mike 02/10/2013 ”

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  1. richard 1
    2 October 2013 at 7:20 am

    It’s really disapointing to find out that the ghost of Roger Douglas is still casting a strong shadow on the thinking of the Labour party. A technique of running down the public service pioneered by Ronald Reagan and Douglas was to reduce the government income and then claim that the government couldn’t afford to provide a better public service.

    Contrast the Herald headline on the Anger over ACC’s ‘obscene’ surplus with the reeported statement from Labour’s ACC spokesman, Iain Lees-Galloway – Call to chop levies after ACC bonanza.

    So Labour looks to lock in the shoddy treatment that ACC gives to it’s “clients” by making sure that it won’t have enough money to provide any better. Shame on Labour.

    • vto 1.1
      2 October 2013 at 7:52 am

      Having being through the complete debacle that is government-owned EQC in Christchurch I feel so very sorry for those who have to deal with government departments with similar bad attitudes (winz, ACC) 24/7/365.

      It is like smashing your head against a brick wall.

      A tip for people prone to earthquakes…. do not rely on EQC at all. Take out an insurance cover to replace the EQC component of your insurance.

      And on top of all that, EQC carries out the most shoddy repairs ever seen. Absolute crap.

      • miravox 1.1.1
        2 October 2013 at 7:56 am

        +1 richard

        Reducing income to reduce services.

        “Take out an insurance cover to replace the EQC component of your insurance.”

        Exactly the model coming into play with ACC.

        • vto 1.1.1.1
          2 October 2013 at 8:04 am

          Ahaa, so you are suggesting that those governments of certain political persuasions (usually the right) will intentionally provide bad government service as one of several tools to weaken the government service and the esteem in which they are held by the public?

          Makes complete sense. It has certainly happened with EQC I would suggest.

          • miravox 1.1.1.1.1
            2 October 2013 at 8:36 am

            vto,

            I am suggesting just that. Privatisation by stealth when the the private sector can’t afford to buy in or the public has no appetite for it. For example see some quickly googled links of how the argument for ACC privatisation has been lost over the years.

            2008

            2011

            2013

            What to do? Run the service down so it doesn’t provide what was intended and people need to take out private insurance so the public scheme is no longer relevant.

            imho, of course.

      • greywarbler 1.1.2
        2 October 2013 at 11:48 am

        This monring on 9 to Noon – interesting on ACC. It seems to have bigger piles than Grandpa McDuck. http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/ninetonoon

        ACC surplus ( 20′ 13″ )
        09:08 Tony Gibbons is an ACC claimant representative with Access Support Services,
        a nationwide advocacy organisation; and Jonathan Eriksen, managing director of actuaries and investment firm Eriksen & Associates, which evaluates the liabilities of funds like ACC.

    • karol 1.2
      2 October 2013 at 8:43 am

      Read what is in the article. Lees-Galloway is saying Team Key/Collins should give the levy cut now, and don’t use it as an election bribe in election year. It’s just a response to the way it’s being manipulated by the government, yet again after keeping the levies articificially high.

      Opposition ACC spokesman Iain Lees-Galloway said the surplus had come out of the pay packets of hard-working Kiwis and there was room for ACC Minister Judith Collins to slice $2b from levies.

      The Government had been gouging New Zealanders for years and had talked up a “phoney” crisis when it took office in 2008 to push levies artificially high, he said. More recently it had ignored advice from the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment, and from ACC, to significantly cut levies.

      “That would have given someone on the average wage an extra $125. Now it is proposing to ‘give back’ some of what it’s taken in election year. That’s a bribe, no two ways about it,” he said.

      “Judith Collins should axe the ACC tax now.”

      Also in the article, the question is open as to what Labour will do. I guess Cunliffe hasn’t got to that yet.

      Lees-Galloway said it was an open question if Labour would continue to argue for full funding or adopt his predecessor Andrew Little’s push for a return to pay-as-you-go funding to keep levies down. “We don’t have a firm view on it. It’s a live debate and we need to consider both sides.”

      • miravox 1.2.1
        2 October 2013 at 9:13 am

        Clearly I’m with richard on this one. Labour should not be arguing that the government should give a levy reduction now instead of in election year. The gouging is happening not because the levies are too high, it’s because the services are too low.

        Labour has the wrong end of the stick – It should be talking about an immediate restoration of accident funding not an immediate levy reduction. They could still complain about the government election bribe by refusing to accept that ACC’s ‘denegerative’ and ‘pre-existing’ condition cop-outs and requirements for patient part funding for rehabilitation services are here to stay.

        I’d quite like the debate to consider fully funding services. That’s what ACC was designed for, after all.

        Bright side is I guess people who are struck down with chronic illness will no longer have to compare their shoddy deal with long term accident victims. They’ll all be on the lowest level of care that funders can get away with.

      • richard 1.2.2
        2 October 2013 at 9:18 am

        Karol, your comment smacks of the apoligism the Labour party peddled in the 80’s – the Labour MPs are doing bad things but we won’t criticize too much because we can see that their intentions are good.

        The facts are that ACC is not meeting the needs it was set up to achieve.
        The net effect of “giving the levy cut now” is that ACC’s income will be reduced by the amount of the levy cut. This will mean that ACC will never be in a position to deliver what it should.

        If Lees-Galloway was sincere, he would be pushing for the improvement of ACC services, rather than advocating for measures that ensure that ACC will fail.

        • karol 1.2.2.1
          2 October 2013 at 9:21 am

          All I’m saying is wait and see. It looks like they haven’t worked out their approach to ACC yet.

          • bad12 1.2.2.1.1
            2 October 2013 at 9:40 am

            i agree with you Karol to a certain extent on ‘wait and see’, we have to give Labour at least to the new year for David Cunliffe and the Party to have sorted through what the policies are,

            Blind faith tho can only carry us so far, and such faith has had Labours left wing cruelly rewarded befor…

            • karol 1.2.2.1.1.1
              2 October 2013 at 9:52 am

              Agreed about blind faith, bad, which is why I will be party voting Green next election.

              But I actually haven’t seen any comment from the Greens on the ACC proposed levy drop as yet. At least under Cunliffe his spokespeople are pretty much out there quickly with responses to things (except on the TPP – that’s a real worry).

              Cunliffe has indicated a certain amount of caution about the policies Labour will roll out under his watch – ie that he’ not going to make promises they can’t keep.

              Myself, I’m still under ACC (sort of) for my injury that resulted in permanent damage). I get ACC funded regular check ups – specialists watching to see when a joint replacement might be in order. And I have no idea how much ACC might support such ops in the future – there’s a worry of uncertainty.

              I understand the worries people have about crucial injuries not getting the necessary coverage or rehabilitation now and in the future. ACC staff can be difficult to deal with.

              But I’ll wait a little and see what Labour comes up with as a committed policy.

              • bad12 …
                2 October 2013 at 10:33 am

                There appears to be a 3 way split in opinions over ACC, (1) is the fund as you go model which, correct me if i am wrong, Andrew Little favors, (2) being the future funding of all current claims against ACC which ACC claim will mean that for the next 2 years levies would have to remain at present levies and then be able to be reduced,

                (3), Being the call for ACC to be forced back to it’s previous ‘full cover’ of injuries which at a guess would probably mean the levies would also remain at their current levels further out than the currently suggested (by ACC), two years,

                Strangely enough, for such an opinionated big mouth lol, i havn’t really got an opinion on what option i favor,

                Yeah ae Karol, thank the smart New Zealand people we have MMP, while the Green Party is polling high i have the luxury of voting Mana in an attempt to gain that Party a 3 seat bloc in the next Parliament…

              • Ramsay …
                2 October 2013 at 12:32 pm

                Party voting Greens?!

            • miravox 1.2.2.1.1.2
              2 October 2013 at 9:58 am

              Election headline 2014

              …. Labour flipflops on call to axe the ACC tax …

              Just sayin’

        • Paul 1.2.2.2
          2 October 2013 at 9:23 am

          +1

  2. red blooded 2
    2 October 2013 at 7:57 am

    Good point. ACC is a great concept and the service needs strengthening and extending. For example, coverage of Physio costs was slashed a few years ago and if you injure your teeth there’s a bizarre protocol which sees them part funding emergency treatments like root canals and capping of broken teeth. The argument is that your teeth shouldn’t be improved – they probably weren’t perfect before the accident that broke or killed them. Well guess what – not many people throw themselves down stairs in the hope of going through months of pain and having their teeth ‘improved’. Making claimants pay what can be thousands of dollars also has the unsurprising effect of creating a divide between those who can and who can’t pay. That’s pernicious in a society which claims this system treats all equally.

  3. dv 3
    2 October 2013 at 7:59 am

    Two points VTO

    Can you get eqc type insurance?
    From what I have read, insurance companies are so good at paying out either.

    • vto 3.1
      2 October 2013 at 8:07 am

      Q1, I don’t know.

      Q2, the results from dealing with insurance companies in Chch is as variable as the weather over the next week. Some companies have been absolute sparklers (FMG) and others have been virtually criminally negligent (AMI / southern response, which just so happens to be government owned and run now, how surprising (see miravox just above and intentionally poor government service)).

      Overall, dealing with a good insurance company has been better than dealing with EQC by a long shot.

      • dv 3.1.1
        2 October 2013 at 8:34 am

        >>Overall, dealing with a good insurance company has been better than dealing with EQC by a long shot.

        As a person living outside ChCh that is pleasing to hear.

  4. phillip ure 4
    2 October 2013 at 8:17 am

    http://whoar.co.nz/2013/heat-or-eat-or-take-out-a-loan-do-both-and-hope-for-the-best-ed-yoo-hoo-this-is-also-the-case-here-in-nz-we-too-have-gone-back-to-the-darkcold-ages/

    “..It’s back to the bleak 1980s in Liverpool as hard-working people are forced to sit in the dark –

    – to save on fuel bills..”

    (cont..)

    (ed:..i don’t sit in the dark…

    ..but i am just one of many who have just gone thru another winter..

    ..without turning a heater on..

    ..it’s either ‘heat or eat’ around here..

    ..(fucken poor-bashing tory shits..!..eh..?..a fucken pox on all of them..!)

    ..and i wd recommend layering/hoodies/beanies..

    ..(and on really cold days/nights..beanie first then hoodie on top as another layer..)

    ..and of course..always a duvet to hand – to wrap around yr legs/body….

    ..and hey..!..there are a lot who are doing it harder than i am..

    and um..!..is it good and right that so many nz’ers are unable to afford that most basic of human needs..?

    ..in this year 2013..?

    ..i mean..even caves had fucken fires..eh..?

    ..at least they were warm..)

    (cont..)

    phillip ure..

    • Paul 5.1
      2 October 2013 at 8:40 am

      It’s good to see Stephen Joyce and John Key have a hotline to the editor’s room of the Herald.
      You aren’t really saying the Herald reports balanced news, are you?

    • ScottGN 5.2
      2 October 2013 at 8:46 am

      This trend has become established in most western democracies and has little to do with Police, Justice or Corrections really and everything to do with the fact that aging populations mean that there are increasingly less men in the age range of most offenders.
      Also surely only a fool would conflate a Herald editorial with fact.

    • David H 5.3
      2 October 2013 at 9:29 am

      Really A drop in youth crime? Or a drop in the reported youth crime? I really take numbers like these, and political polls, with a huge pinch of salt.

      • Puckish Rogue 5.3.1
        2 October 2013 at 10:41 am

        Well if Labour had announced these numbers it’d be a drop in crime but since its National its a drop in reported crime

        Hope that helps 🙂

        • Rogue Trooper 5.3.1.1
          2 October 2013 at 3:56 pm

          have you ever considered that you may be a ‘Try-Hard’; It’s a freakin weak editorial opinion, for goodness sake, as my Nana used to exclaim.

    • mickysavage 5.4
      2 October 2013 at 9:51 am

      I work in the area. There was a policy decision made by the Police to put even more cases through alternative action. This means that overnight court lists went down so of course the rate of convictions also went down.

      It is a change of approach, a good one in my view, but it is not evidence that this Government is doing anything that has improved things.

      • Seti 5.4.1
        2 October 2013 at 3:41 pm

        This is reported crime, i.e. those the Police have wrritten an Offence Report for, not prosecution rates.

      • Tracey 5.4.2
        2 October 2013 at 3:59 pm

        It was interesting that the police put the increase in sexual violence crimes down to their changed attitudes and better reporting but crime which dropped wasnt attributed to poorer reporting but rather to their skills and application.

        I also agree diversions and alternatives are a better option. However the right wingers ought to be outraged at all the criminals being “let off lightly”.

  6. jcuknz 6
    2 October 2013 at 8:29 am

    What a clueless bunch these Forest and Bird Clowns are as protectors of wild life they don’t know that you simply cannot go on a farm during August through to October because it is lambing and calving time. If the legal process is held up becuase of this then us townies will have to lump it.

    • MrSmith 6.1
      2 October 2013 at 7:43 pm

      “you simply cannot go on a farm during August through to October because it is lambing and calving time”

      Bullshit! This guy is being an asshole, I suppose he just goes on holiday from August till october and leaves the animals to it.

      • Colonial Viper 6.1.1
        2 October 2013 at 7:47 pm

        Apparently no farming contractors or workers come or go from the farm for 3 months either. Basically that farmer, and Conor English, are taking the piss.

        • jcuknz 6.1.1.1
          4 October 2013 at 9:26 am

          Farm workers and contractors are precisely that working with the animals not some idiotic spectators wandinging around disturbing the animals … what a pair of fools.

  7. Morrissey 7
    2 October 2013 at 8:35 am

    WARNING: Latest Hobbit is crap
    Jackson-worshippers will try to put lipstick on this pig, but it’s still a pig
    TV1 Breakfast, Wednesday 2 October 2013, 7:50 a.m.

    Even those cheerful folk on TV1’s Breakfast, the nation’s most dependable cheerleaders, struggled to hide how unimpressed they were….

    RAWDON CHRISTIE: All right, we have a preview of the second part of Sir Peter Jackson’s Hobbit series….

    [Cue two tiresome minutes of ominously deep voices, ominously grey beards, ominously dark shadows, ominously swelling bombastic orchestral soundtrack. It’s only two minutes, but it seems like two hours…]

    RAWDON CHRISTIE: Well, will YOU be going to see it?
    NADINE CHALMERS-ROSS Ahhhh, I haven’t actually seen the first one. So I would have to see that first. Have YOU seen it?
    RAWDON CHRISTIE: Errr, no. I guess you have to see it on the big screen rather than the small screen…

    • phillip ure 7.1
      2 October 2013 at 8:44 am

      @ hobbits..

      ..maybe this could be a variation on court sentences..?

      ..you are sentenced to watch every rings/hobbit-movie..

      ..and all in one sitting..

      ..panicked-defendants would be pleading for incarceration instead..

      ..phillip ure..

    • Paul 7.2
      2 October 2013 at 9:21 am

      You’re a brave man to be watching that Breakfast T.V. dross Morrissey!

      • David H 7.2.1
        2 October 2013 at 9:34 am

        I watch the TV3 brekkie news, keeps my bullshit meter pegged.

        I read Scoop. And funnily enough Open Mike, as it usually points me in the right direction for the ‘real’ news.

    • Puckish Rogue 7.3
      2 October 2013 at 10:46 am

      Oh well because they say its not good I won’t see it…no wait I liked the the lord of the rings series and I liked the first movie in the hobbit series (except for the goblin king) so I’ll be going to see it

      And enough people must have liked it because it grossed: $1,017,003,568 (thanks wikipedia :))

      Sir Peter Jackson: one of the finest talents NZs produced

  8. Colonial Viper 8
    2 October 2013 at 8:36 am

    Auchinvole not re-standing.

    Rats. Sinking. Ship.

    • vto 8.1
      2 October 2013 at 8:47 am

      so that cements another seat more firmly labour’s way ya?

      • ScottGN 8.1.1
        2 October 2013 at 8:55 am

        I’d say Damien O’Connor is pretty safe in that seat now, especially if there’s a nationwide swing to Labour at the election. Auchinvole’s going isn’t going to make much of a difference.

      • karol 8.1.2
        2 October 2013 at 8:56 am

        Auchinvole is a list MP – just Key trying to re-vitalise the list. Doesn’t mean a seat more likely to go to Labour.

        • ScottGN 8.1.2.1
          2 October 2013 at 9:14 am

          Auchinvole used to be the Member for West Coast-Tasman though and was narrowly defeated by O’Connor (against the swing) at the last election. That’s one reason I think O’Connor is now safer in this seat.

    • ScottGN 8.2
      2 October 2013 at 8:52 am

      Stuff also reporting that Eric Roy is probably going to bail out of Invercargill (which before MMP changes saw its boundaries pushed further out into Southland was a Labour leaning seat). Also the guy who holds Hunua (can’t remember his name – which says it all really) is going too.

      • karol 8.2.1
        2 October 2013 at 8:57 am

        Hunua: Paul Hutchison

        Stuff article.

        • Molly 8.2.1.1
          2 October 2013 at 9:44 am

          Paul Hutchinson is likely making way for another National Party member who indicated that he would like to run as National MP in the next election – the current Franklin Local Board chairman, Andy Baker. Hunua is a fairly blue electorate.

    • Ennui 8.3
      2 October 2013 at 9:45 am

      I think not CV, Chris is a young man no longer, he moved to the Coast for family reasons years ago. I suspect he has had more than enough of any kind of work, has his business to run etc, and more importantly may want some form of retirement. If you ever have the pleasure to meet him, amongst the amusement you should ask him why he is going…I suspect the answer wont be sinking ships, not his style.

    • Watching 8.4
      2 October 2013 at 10:04 am

      CV – you must be a tough bas…

      Isn’t Auchinvole about 70 years & being an MP from the West Coast a huge ask.

      Expect more white over 60’s Nats MPs to go. Look at the Nats list of anyone who was there in 2005, not in cabinet & over 60 – gone. It will be interesting to see what type of candidates replace list MP’s like Auchinvole – I am expecting to see Asian and Maori names become more dominate in the Nats team?

      Labour didn’t do a heavy cull in in 2005 & paid the price in 2008 – as the voters just saw the same faces. So anyone who didn’t make Cunliffe’s recent top 20 & was an MP in 2008 needs to stand down or be culled for 2014.

      • Colonial Viper 8.4.1
        2 October 2013 at 11:47 am

        Ahhhright sorry guys, I didn’t realise that the man has done his time. But yes, I am expecting several more similar announcements before the end of the year. And word of a new younger group of Nat candidates appearing.

        • Ennui 8.4.1.1
          2 October 2013 at 4:27 pm

          All good CV, I really struggle to think that some people I know well are sitting and voting on the Nat side of the table. I question how could x or y vote that way on this or that issue? When it gets too incongruous I normally look for commonalities we share (otherwise you feel obliged to entirely disown the person). Sometimes it is worse when somebody I know from “our” side says or does something I entirely disagree with, of that I find it far more difficult to forgive.

          Maybe it is easier to put ourselves in the shoes of any politician and ask every time they vote, say or decide something how many of their friends, acquaintances or associates they are offending? It cant be easy.

    • Rogue Trooper 8.5
      2 October 2013 at 3:58 pm

      the Nats need all the discards they can dispose of; that man, what a poser.

  9. karol 9
    2 October 2013 at 9:07 am

    Gareth Hughes on government’s privatisation of Solid Energy by stealth.

    Four foreign-owned banks – ANZ, BNZ, ASB and Westpac – will take a $75 million ownership stake in Solid Energy in return for writing off debt. The Government will commit a further $155 million believing Solid Energy’s core business model is sound.

    “With the stroke of a pen, National has sold a large chunk of Solid Energy into foreign ownership,” Green Party energy spokesperson Gareth Hughes said today.

    “The National Government is proposing to give the big four Australian-owned banks approximately 14 percent of Solid Energy, at the very least.

    “This is a conversion of debt into ownership; not a true debt write-off, but the detail is still to come.

    • Colonial Viper 9.1
      2 October 2013 at 9:11 am

      Good on Gareth Hughes for spotting this. Our MSM was dead useless on it yesterday.

      • Paul 9.1.1
        2 October 2013 at 9:15 am

        The MSM is owned by foreign corporates.
        They are actually very good at their job..which is the dumbing down of NZ so these same corporates can go about their looting of NZ without people noticing.

        • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 9.1.1.1
          2 October 2013 at 12:31 pm

          How’s this work? The government is obliged to keep in its ownership anything it happened to own in 1983? Must we really own the shit companies as well?

          • Lanthanide 9.1.1.1.1
            2 October 2013 at 2:16 pm

            No, the media is obliged to inform the public about what the government is doing so that the public can be informed on what is happening.

            Then the public can make their will known to those in government.

            • Draco T Bastard 9.1.1.1.1.1
              2 October 2013 at 2:47 pm

              I think it’s time that we stopped relying on the MSM to do that and legislated that the government would do it. Full transparency.

          • Colonial Viper 9.1.1.1.2
            2 October 2013 at 2:23 pm

            Must we really own the shit companies as well?

            Odd that sharebrokers and banks are lining up to buy these so-called “shit” companies.

            Maybe they know something a little more about it than you do?

          • Draco T Bastard 9.1.1.1.3
            2 October 2013 at 2:45 pm

            Nothing wrong with Solid Energy – until Blinglish told them to go into far more debt so as to pay out higher dividends to the government to try and cover the large hole in governmental income due to the tax cuts for the rich that he instituted.

            • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 9.1.1.1.3.1
              2 October 2013 at 3:32 pm

              “Odd that sharebrokers and banks are lining up to buy these so-called “shit” companies.”

              Sharebrokers aren’t lining up to buy Solid Energy.

              The banks are converting debt to equity. Their other option was to enforce their security and sell the assets in a fire sale (and probably get nothing).

              No-one wants to own it. Some people just have fuck all other options.

              • Ennui …
                2 October 2013 at 4:31 pm

                Their other option was to enforce their security and sell the assets in a fire sale (and probably get nothing). Ah, so it is worth sweet fuck all?

          • Rogue Trooper 9.1.1.1.4
            2 October 2013 at 3:59 pm

            Like commentors (#88, again, in case anybody was wonderin’)

      • Chooky 9.1.2
        2 October 2013 at 12:31 pm

        .+1

  10. ianmac 10
    2 October 2013 at 9:10 am

    “Prime Minister John Key has been accused of lying about the Trans-Pacific Partnership Agreement, the day after the launch of a campaign calling for the details of the controversial deal to be released.” -TV3 News

    Surely not! Not our PM!
    http://www.3news.co.nz/Key-accused-of-spreading-TPPA-mistruths/tabid/1607/articleID/315300/Default.aspx

  11. karol 11
    2 October 2013 at 9:11 am

    Sorry I can’t get to this today at Auckland Uni – would have liked to. Protest about government treatment of Unis at Auckland University 1pm today.

    he lack of serious Government investment in the tertiary sector; and the disturbing centralized style of management and the attack on student democracy and academic freedom at this university. Why staff aren’t being paid a living wage will also be noted.

    Professor Jane Kelsey, Hannah Williams, Campbell Jones, Vernon Tava, Nigel Hayworth, Chrs Shore, Alastair Shaw, Jow McCrory, David Cunliffe, John Minto, Curwen Rolinson, Dan Haines and I [Martyn Bradbury] will be MCing it.

  13. cardassian 13
    2 October 2013 at 11:23 am

    Was looking through the local body candidates for my area this morning and seeing a lot saying they were members of CHANGE! (Not a Party). Could someone please enlighten me as to what/who this is?

  14. greywarbler 14
    2 October 2013 at 11:24 am

    I heard Dr William Rolleston make some comment on the effects of climate change and the need for action and thought that is very encouraging.

    Then I heard him say that farmers need to provide themselves with more water storage. And I felt that doesn’t mean doing anything that will assist in limiting climate change excessive effects to the planet, or in assisting the general population in some way, more likely just draining rivers of the water that is needed for the environment and sequestering it to keep otherwise unsustainable agricultural practices viable.

    I found the item at Homepaddock which has some useful items on initiatives in farming and also right wing political stuff and this item will reveal more. I may be wrong, I’ll know when I’ve read it.
    Federated Farmers vice president Dr William Rolleston has been calling for more water storage systems for some time. http://homepaddock.wordpress.com/2013/09/30/prevent-reverse-andor-prepare/

    Some comments on other aspects of this on-line publication.
    One item on the Greens describes what NACTs might like to do to Russel Norman – ‘Neutralising Norman’. It may be that the Greens co-leader is demanding thought from farmers that is taking them to uncomfortable places in their heads.

    Before the item on the referendum on asset sales, a word is offered that has relevance to NACTs today, meaning litigious – Barratry.
    Then – This politicians’ initiated referendum is a very expensive publicity exercise for the opposition. (But there is comfort to be drawn from -) The partial float will be done and dusted with the money banked before the referendum begins.

    A quote from Chris Tremain’s announcement on his decision to leave NACTs –
    “I am proud of the significant achievements of this government led by Prime Minister John Key. Under his leadership New Zealand is now one of the strongest growing economies in the western world and has a very bright future. I intend to continue to contribute to this exciting future but now in the commercial sector of our economy.

    And an interesting example of how RW people view social research. It apparently must be seen in context of the individual’s own experience, not whether it is relevant to others, today.
    One item on Hyundai survey that families are under work stress, and one headed ‘ House ownership has never been easy’.
    The comments indicate a reluctance to face today’s difficulties. Instead it’s ‘In my youth we had to.. or my grandfather had to put up with…’

    • Tracey 14.1
      2 October 2013 at 3:40 pm

      “A quote from Chris Tremain’s announcement on his decision to leave NACTs –
      “I am proud of the significant achievements of this government led by Prime Minister John Key. Under his leadership New Zealand is now one of the strongest growing economies in the western world and has a very bright future. I intend to continue to contribute to this exciting future but now in the commercial sector of our economy.”

      Simon Power mark II

    • Rogue Trooper 14.2
      2 October 2013 at 4:03 pm

      Excellent Post greywarbler. 😎

      • greywarbler 14.2.1
        2 October 2013 at 10:01 pm

        Thanks RT. Adding to the standard’s overview of the flow of info and misinformation to make sure whether it’s 100% Pure. Hah.

  15. Puckish Rogue 15
    2 October 2013 at 11:29 am

    So has the destabilising of David Cunliffe begun all ready or was this just sheer incompetence?

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/comment/editorials/9231556/Editorial-Labour-misses-its-chance

  16. greywarbler 16
    2 October 2013 at 11:43 am

    Just to put this on your radar.
    Wednesday 30 October, 6.30pm, 2013 Bruce Jesson Lecture: The Rt Hon Sir Edmund Thomas “Reducing Inequality: A Strategy for a Cause”

    The speaker, a Distinguished Fellow at the Law School at The University of Auckland, argues that the gross inequality in income and wealth which besets New Zealand is the outcome of the neo-liberal economic measures of the mid-1980s and early 1990s and the culture of liberal individualism and unfettered free market ideology which it spawned. A breakdown in social cohesion and a sense of community is the result.

    Reforms to counter this inequality are widely mooted. But increasing focus and discussion on the topic is confronted by a plethora of mantras and myths purveyed by the rich and powerful. The stimulus for change is deadened. The speaker advances a strategy designed to provide a coherent impetus to reduce the rank inequality that now prevails.
    Maidment Theatre, Alfred Street, The University of Auckland, The Maidment Bar will open from 5.30pm

  17. captain hook 17
    2 October 2013 at 12:10 pm

    so the little tory dweebs think they are already one up on DC. nup. Them and their whoole cohort of criminally negligent nitwits and neanderthals will be gone next november if not sooner.

  18. Clement Pinto 18
    2 October 2013 at 12:30 pm

    QUESTION :
    WHICH DO YOU PREFER, OBAMA CARE or AFFORDABLE CARE?

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/world/9234163/Jimmy-Kimmel-wades-in-on-Obamacare

    Shows how the public perceive things. Is it prejudice, ignorance, bias, easy manipulation or something else. Fascinating stuff, isn’t it!

    • ianmac 18.1
      2 October 2013 at 1:33 pm

      S’pose it is a point against Referenda Clement. Or it indicates that constant repetitions of anti anything seeps into the subconscious. Hope it works for anti-Asset Sales.

      • Draco T Bastard 18.1.1
        2 October 2013 at 3:35 pm

        S’pose it is a point against Referenda Clement.

        Nope, it’s a point against the private MSM which is purposefully misinforming people.

    • greywarbler 18.2
      2 October 2013 at 10:20 pm

      Thinking about the USA and medicare or Obamacare or Don’t care. It’s hard to understand the reason for ordinary not well off people to regard public health as a communist plot or an attempt to mass poison or tranquilise them or whatever comes out of the mouths of hysterical people that get filmed at rallys.

      Lynley Hood in A City Possessed on the child abuse case in Christchurch examines outbreaks of fervour about various concerns that arise en masse at times. She quotes from Stanley Cohen from a study Folk Devils and Moral Panics:
      Societies….A condition…become[s] defined as a threat to societal values and interests; its nature is presented in a stylised…fashion by the mass media….Sometimes the object of the panic is quite novel and at other times it is something which has been in existence long enough but suddenly appears in the limelight….at…times it has more serious and long-lasting repercussions and might produce such changes as those in legal and social policy or even in the way society conceives itself.

      This might explain why people who have the most to gain apparently, have turned against the practical medical help that could be available through the government in one of the most expensive private/profit ridden medical care systems in the world. Irrationality Rules Okay!
      Need some special Anti-Septic against this poisonous thinking.

  19. Ad 19
    2 October 2013 at 4:23 pm

    Hopefully this scale of profit is the first step towards getting rid of ACC levies altogether – except for those foolish industries with high accident rates.

  20. wtl 20
    2 October 2013 at 6:13 pm

    lprent: Not sure if someone has already mentioned it but there is an issue rendering the ‘feeds’ on the right of the page, which is causing a mismatch between article titles and their sources.

    Specifically, the article source is being placed below the gray horizontal line, effectively placing it next to the title of the following feed article, e.g. the source ‘frogblog’ for the article “Monorail project risky for environment and investors” is being drawn next to the title of the following article “U.S. Government resumes five-year shutdown” (making it seem that the latter article is from frogblog when it is actually from The Civilian).

    Same issue on both Firefox and Chrome (Windows).

  22. amirite 22
    2 October 2013 at 6:20 pm

    Roy Morgan: Nat 42 (+1), Lab 37 (+4.5), Gre 11.5 (-3.5) NZF 4.5 (-2).

    http://www.roymorgan.com/findings/5221-new-zealand-voting-intention-october-2-2013-201310020458

  23. TonyP 23
    2 October 2013 at 8:58 pm

    Holy shit could TV3 get any more fawning and offensive than what they have on at the moment with their puff piece on Alasdair Thompson.

  24. The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrel 24
    2 October 2013 at 10:26 pm

    Doesn’t it all feel a bit empty without Felix? Thinking of you bro’.

    [lprent: I saw that he’d picked up a ban. Makes his second one from memory. I think he got one back in 2009. He’ll be back the day after Jenny. On the same day as BM. They’re both good whilst banned. They don’t comment and risk the double ups.

    Jenny has been incredibly lucky. None of the daily comments she has been writing over the last six weeks has been released by a moderator that I have seen until this one. My policy is to warn on any visible comment and if repeated to then double the ban to discourage repetitions and more work for us. Have to say that that her comment writing has improved markedly… 😈 ]

  25. Draco T Bastard 25
    2 October 2013 at 10:51 pm

    A Question for Economists

    Generally, economists favourite policies actually don’t have much evidence behind them. ‘Free trade’ deals have ambiguous effects on growth. The issue of whether the minimum wage produces unemployment is famously controversial, with any of the effects predicted being undeniably small. Estimates of the Keynesian multiplier also vary widely, and are generally easy to predict based on the political biases of who is doing the estimation. There is also a surprising lack of evidence to support the contention that fiscal stimulus alone can ‘kick start’ a flailing economy. Sure: the New Deal created growth, but it didn’t end the Great Depression. Japan has had a lot of monetary and fiscal stimulus but has remained in a ‘lost decade‘. Countries that have used stimulus and done well in the recent crisis generally had strong institutions and financial sectors (Sweden, Germany) or are simply at an earlier stage of development and therefore their growth is far more resilient (China). What’s more, you get as many arguments against stimulus coming from economists as you do for it, so even if it were the case that stimulus were the ‘right’ policy, the discipline hasn’t been a beacon of scientific truth concerning the matter.

    Have “economists” got anything right in the last two centuries? As far as I can make out, nope, not a single thing. Where they appear to have got something right is, IMO, more often than not pure serendipity.

    • Draco T Bastard 25.1
      2 October 2013 at 11:02 pm

      Dammit, that last paragraph isn’t a quote – can someone please fix it.

      [lprent: done (eventually) ]

    • Colonial Viper 25.2
      3 October 2013 at 1:10 am

      Economists tend to create and support theories which benefit those in power at any given time.

  26. Draco T Bastard 26
    2 October 2013 at 11:36 pm

    Krugman: The 1 percent has created a monster

    “[M]y working theory,” he writes, “is that wealthy individuals bought themselves a radical right party, believing … that it would cut their taxes and remove regulations.” What the .01 percent didn’t realize is that “eventually the craziness would take on a life of its own, and that the monster they created would turn on its creators as well as the little people.”

    An interesting comment by Krugman.

    • Colonial Viper 26.1
      3 October 2013 at 1:09 am

      The US keeps doing this over and over again. The oil billionaire Kochs funded and directed the extremist Tea Party.

      In the 1950’s Texas oil millions funded Senator McCarthy in his extremist “Reds under the Bed” witch hunts.

  27. red rattler 27
    3 October 2013 at 1:04 am

    US Economy in Shutdown | Michael Roberts Blog | http://thenextrecession.wordpress.com/2013/10/02/us-economy-in-shutdown/

    also comments on widening income gaps and the rich subsidised to buy up housing In US and Britain:

    We get the same approach to recovery in the UK where the Conservative coalition has launched a plan to help home buyers by providing government money and guarantees for mortgages with as little as 5% deposit down for residential property worth up to £600k. Speculative investors are piling in to take advantage of this government scheme. In London, house prices are rising at near 10% a year and buy-to-let purchases are booming.

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