National must be very afraid

Written By: - Date published: 4:30 pm, September 1st, 2014 - 75 comments
Categories: john key, Judith Collins, national - Tags:

Rawshark has continued his or her terrorism of the John Key government by a further dump of screenshots of emails.

Something interesting struck me about the latest dump which contains a series of emails which were collected in a folder called “Mark Hotchin”.

The emails are fascinating and justify Matt Nippert’s articles on the subject. But Judith Collins is not mentioned once in any of the emails, at least as far as I can see.

When the story was raised National obviously feared the worst and went looking for it. But I wonder if the Cathy Odgers email had not been released to National if they would have dumped Collins. From the look of the emails in the latest whaledump I do not think so. Although the behaviour is sleazy and worthy of a police prosecution there appeared to be no link to Collins in what was happening.

It probably would not have saved her. The Herald has just reported that Collins communicated with Slater via facebook about the impending release of the SFO SIS information concerning the Goff interview to Slater.  Obviously she should be considered as a potential witness in the intelligence inquiry. You get the feeling that there is further information to come out about her and at some stage her tenure would have been untenable. Maybe Mike Smith is right and this particular email was a pretext for Key to get rid of Collins.

They must also be worrying if there is anything to directly leak Key to Slater.

But this does put National in a terrible bind. Either it anticipates what information is going to be released, proactively does something so that Key can show he is in charge, and potentially does more than it could have got away with once the actual information has been released. Or it waits for Whaledump and the media to break a story, loses control of the framing of the issue and looks disorganised and reactive.

It must be a real bugger knowing that there is someone selectively feeding information to the media who can then present the story in the worst possible light. This is the sort of thing that National through Slater has been doing for years. Karma really is a bitch sometimes.

The simple solution of course is to engage in ethical politics, not the sort of politics which is currently being broadcast to the nation leak by leak by leak.

Edit: took a bit of text out of a paragraph that did not make sense.

75 comments on “National must be very afraid ”

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  1. weka 1
    1 September 2014 at 4:42 pm

    Recapping the theories on Collins’ resignation

    1. It’s a distraction, Collins will be found to not have been involved in the SFO affair, and Key will come out vindicated for not sacking her earlier, and will then be able to refocus the election back on Brand Key (Bill’s theory, not sure how that works with the timing of the inquiry)

    2. The email was used as a way of getting rid of Collins because internal polling showed she was a liability.

    3. The email was released by Key’s office because they were afraid that the story was bigger than it was and they wanted to stay ahead of it (their mistake, but you have to wonder what else they thought was going to come out).

    4. It’s all a big right wing conspiracy to make Hooton have a meltdown and/or play all his cards, so they can finally take him out.

    5. Key is really a reptile and we’ve all been brainwashed. The real story is going on behind the screen we can’t see.

    • emergency mike 1.1
      1 September 2014 at 4:53 pm

      I think its 1, 2, 3, and 5 together. 4 sounds a bit far fetched.

    • Anne 1.2
      1 September 2014 at 5:22 pm

      No. 2 – in the main.

      • disturbed 1.2.1
        1 September 2014 at 11:36 pm

        Why did John Key not inform the citizens of this Country in 2011 when he attended a NAZI founded organisation called the Bilderberg group, in Europe?

        This group is well known as one of the most secretive clandestine organisations globally, that specialises in weakening Governments with Black Ops special forces.
        Below he was in attendance as John Key Prime Minister of New Zealand.

        Attended by most the biggest industrial and richest elite globally their aim is to dominate the globe and control all activities.

        http://twochurchesonly.com/supmat/03/most_influential/bilderberg_group/
        list_of_bilderberg_attendees.pdf

        List of Bilderberg participants 4
        New Zealand
        • John Key (2011-2012), Prime Minister of New Zealand
        http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Bilderberg

        No Bilderberg meeting agenda has ever been made public. “It is the epitome of low-profile dark ops, a shadow government hidden in a doorway.” According to critics and close observers, it’s agenda is to weaken all world leadership but their own. It is also, according to a U.S. law called the Logan Act, [15] illegal:

    • Bill 1.3
      1 September 2014 at 5:48 pm

      Weka, that wasn’t really what I was saying at all. The first bit, (distraction and no involvement) yes. Then it’s all about hoping the media run off in the wrong direction (where he’s pointing to) so the heat comes off him, and so he can, post inquiry, somewhat bury Hager allegations by association, and (I guess he hopes) save his own sorry arse. And as I also said in the post I put up, I don’t think it will work. Regardless, I’d hate the media to get bogged down in the minutiae of a distraction; one that could play out in a way that would see Collins and Key get off the hook to some extent. Cactus, Whale and Hotchin ain’t going nowhere. They can wait.

      • weka 1.3.1
        1 September 2014 at 6:04 pm

        Ok, I’m confused now, because that’s what I thought you were saying and I don’t see a huge difference between that and my off the cuff synposis above. My brain is overloaded though, so I should probably stop reading things for a while.

    • yeshe 1.4
      1 September 2014 at 6:55 pm

      see post #10 below .. collins will need to houdini to escape these …

    • disturbed 1.5
      1 September 2014 at 8:52 pm

      Time for a two track policy as the politicians & black ops are still doing unchecked.

      Penny has laid a compliant to police today over Collins see at 13.

      Woo Goode Penny,

      Can we arrange to get someone to start a global corruption petition to use as backup?

      We get someone to start a site using Global corruption as a theme but use our worst case in history in NZ as the lead charge?

      That way we can hopefully get it to go viral?

      Their is a site already setup where someone could piggy back a Global petition on that site, can you arrange it?

      http://www.thepetitionsite.com/create.html

  2. infused 2
    1 September 2014 at 4:45 pm

    Regardless, Collins was an idiot and had to go anyway. I’m surprised Key didn’t boot her sooner.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 2.1
      1 September 2014 at 4:58 pm

      What’s your theory on how Cameron Slater and Judith Collins came to be discussing confidential SIS information before its official release?

      It’s because John Key told them, eh.

      • infused 2.1.1
        1 September 2014 at 9:59 pm

        Who knows. But hey, why don’t we make up a ton of unsubstantiated theories to show off our superior intellect!

        • McFlock 2.1.1.1
          1 September 2014 at 10:15 pm

          It was SIS information.
          The avenues are either via the responsible minister, or via a security leak so bad (at best unauthorised leaks to a blogger by the intelligence services, at worst third-party spying -of an intelligence agency- to tip off the blogger) that the responsible minister should probably resign.

          Whatever the precise avenue, there is no good excuse for a blogger to have knowledge of classified intelligence agency records.

        • Tracey 2.1.1.2
          2 September 2014 at 7:13 am

          Don’t worry infused, you are safe.

      • Tracey 2.1.2
        2 September 2014 at 7:11 am

        Not Key but someone told Slater before he got the OIA release that the contents would harm Goff and enable Slater to boast that it would end Goff.

        As for who tipped the wink to Slater. It needed to be someone who had seen a previously classified document (not declassified until after OIA received (is that right?), so someone with authority to view classified SIS material told Slater or someone with no authroity illegally obtained access to a classified document and leaked the details. Either scenario warranted a police investigation and Inquiry long before now.

  3. Anonymous NZ 3
    1 September 2014 at 4:53 pm

    John Key – all your bases are belong to us.

  4. Awww 4
    1 September 2014 at 4:53 pm

    Glad there are other people to read this stuff and sum it all up. It’s getting hard to keep up with it all. Cheers.

    • disturbed 4.1
      1 September 2014 at 5:54 pm

      You musy be getting to close to that smart meter microwave UHF frequency

      Those meters are known to cause lowered IQ confusion and derange your thinking capacity.

      Try sleeping away from the wall where outside the meter is mounted.

  5. Bill 5
    1 September 2014 at 4:56 pm

    If Key had acted against Collins due to anything contained within ‘Dirty Politics’, then his long running denial that it contains anything of substance would have fallen over. Then he would have been more or less bound to accept that other allegations contained in the book were credible.

    The problem is that he had to dump Collins. (Was it 70%+ in opinion polls saying she had to go?)

    The solution then, is to ‘dump’ her (temporarily…he most definitely did not rule her out of cabinet at some future date) on the pretext that she may have been involved in something very specific and serious that is not contained in the book. Better, something that comes from emails by the same person as in the book. This way he gets to mollify public concern (to a degree), get her out of the picture with regards the media and, later, to slam everything in ‘Dirty Politics’ as conspiratorial crap off the back of her not being involved in some serious shit to do with the SFO etc…. that he always knew she had no dealings in.

    The whole thing is a feint, a dummy pass….call it what you will.

    • emergency mike 5.1
      1 September 2014 at 6:12 pm

      Bill’s theory has a lot of credibility. Key hopes that the Collins issue can now go away until after the election. Then later when the inquiry finds no evidence linking Collins, Key can say, “See, I told you that Hager book was BS. Welcome back to cabinet Judith.”

      In this scenario Collins still thinks she can be PM, she just has to wait a bit longer than planned.

      Hager thinks that Whaledump is about done. I hope he’s wrong. If not it’s up to our journos now to dig for the truth about Key, Ede, and Slater. God help us. I hope Dotcom’s got something on the 15th.

    • Tracey 5.2
      2 September 2014 at 7:19 am

      I agree. He thinks she willbe cleared by the Inquiry SO he has said she’s out for now (mollify the polls and gets he and she re-elected and doesn’t piss off her strong faction too much) and then when she is cleared she is back in Cabinet (but certainly not as Minister of Justice or Police or Corrections).

      Cathy Odgers is ACT aligned and wanted Nats in to get David Seymour in and prolly hoped that any spill from nats would go to ACT, cos she doesn’t think having 17% of your MPs convicted of crimes of deceit is a bad thing.

  6. karol 6
    1 September 2014 at 4:56 pm

    Isn’t the Herald story by David Fisher about Goff about the SIS, not the SFO?

    [Yep my bad now corrected]

    • One Anonymous Bloke 6.1
      1 September 2014 at 4:59 pm

      Collins and Slater discussing information it was illegal for either of them to have. Who told them?

      • Tracey 6.1.1
        2 September 2014 at 7:20 am

        it really IS that simple. Labour? Greens? Mana? Dunne (he of the family morals)? Peters? start putting it THAT simply.

        Mr Slater and Ms Collins are discussing information which at that time was CLASSIFIED

  8. One Anonymous Bloke 8
    1 September 2014 at 5:10 pm

    It’s pretty obvious that Hager was telling the truth (well duh!) when he said he hadn’t published everything.

    National will wish he had by the time Rawshark is finished with them.

  9. disturbed 9
    1 September 2014 at 6:00 pm

    Rawshark is drawing them into her/his net bit by bit.

    PM is cocky tonight, guess he wont be sleeping to well with all the stuff ahead plus someone snitching on his dealings ?

  10. yeshe 10
    1 September 2014 at 6:52 pm

    Rawshark has new dump to the Herald only; published at 4.25

    Damning Collins, poor wee daisy.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11317385

    • karol 10.1
      1 September 2014 at 7:06 pm

      Denial from Collins on Twitter.

      I have no record of any FB conversations with Whaleoil. Cam Slater has advised that he had no FB conversations with me. Forgeries?

      • Tigger 10.1.1
        1 September 2014 at 7:31 pm

        Well of course she has no ‘records’ – she deleted them.

        Collins should be staying quiet. That she’s not speaks volumes. About her state of mind. Her guilt. Her isolation (she’s clearly out of National’s control).

        • karol 10.1.1.1
          1 September 2014 at 8:15 pm

          Good point. Didn’t WO go through his FB after the hack and delete a load of stuff?

        • disturbed 10.1.1.2
          1 September 2014 at 8:36 pm

          Get Karol to invite Judith for a cup of tea in Epsom, maybe she will spill all?

        • Tracey 10.1.1.3
          2 September 2014 at 7:23 am

          As Minister of Justice (former) and former high standing law Society Representative Ms Collins has an easy option to sort all of this out. Surrender all her IT devices to an independant and supervised IT specialist. Let them go through everything, including retrieving deleted stuff and tell us if she is telling the truth. She won’t mind will she?

      • Huginn 10.1.2
        1 September 2014 at 9:40 pm

        This denial from Collins is troubling.

      • Chrissy 10.1.3
        1 September 2014 at 10:38 pm

        [Collins] said she had ” no record of any Facebook conversations” with Slater. “Cameron has advised me that he has now gone through all his Facebook conversations and there are none with me. I am now considering lodging a complaint to Police regarding what I believe to be forgeries.”

        Hager, Dirty Politics pg 45: “[Collins and Slater] talked often by phone, and in the evenings and weekends they chatted via Facebook’.

        Now, who do you believe?

    • Bill 10.2
      1 September 2014 at 7:40 pm

      Good to see they are focusing on that OIA request. That be the Big Red Button. This other stuff that Collins isn’t involved in, absolutely serious as it is, isn’t party political material. It needs to be separated out entirely.

  11. Flipnz 11
    1 September 2014 at 7:58 pm

    What are the chance that SIS are trying to figure out who Rawshark is and find him? Odds?

  12. kenny 12
    1 September 2014 at 8:00 pm

    Why did Cathy Odgers send that letter/email to the beehive?

    • Anne 12.1
      1 September 2014 at 8:06 pm

      It was either a heads up for Key or it was utu. I’m inclined to go with the former and if it was, then there was likely more people involved in the decision to send it to the ‘PM’s Office’ than just Odgers.

      • Chrissy 12.1.1
        1 September 2014 at 8:40 pm

        I’d say Key/ Nats were desperate to get some control back over the issue (which they didnt have as the emails were being dripfed, and they were fearful about what was out there), and put out a call to those involved (including Cactus) to go and look for any awful emails that Rawshark might be holding. This one- the smoking gun as Cactus called it- was retrieved and proferred, and they acted. Would it have been more devastating if it had come out a week closer to the election, after further denials from Key etc. Dunno. The simpler answer that they wanted an excuse to get rid of Collins and asked for help? could be.

    • disturbed 12.2
      1 September 2014 at 8:39 pm

      Hissy fit?

    • Kev 12.3
      1 September 2014 at 9:22 pm

      Interesting question Kenny. Maybe she is Whaledump or Rawshark or knows who that person is.

  13. Penny Bright 13
    1 September 2014 at 8:27 pm

    FYI today I have emailed the Auckland District Commander, Michael Clement, making a formal complaint to Police against former Minister of Justice Judith Collins for alleged violations of s. 116 and s. 105 of the NZ Crimes Act 1961.

    The evidence upon which I am relying to support this complaint is the same evidence upon which Prime Minister John Key was purportedly relying to remove Judith Collins from her Ministerial responsibilities.

    Penny Bright

    • Tigger 13.1
      1 September 2014 at 10:38 pm

      Good work, Penny. Always appreciate you plugging away for democracy – goodness know it needs people fighting for it at the moment.

  14. disturbed 14
    1 September 2014 at 8:48 pm

    Woo Goode Penny,

    Can we arrange to get someone to start a global corruption petition to use as backup?

    We get someone to start a site using Global corruption as a theme but use our worst case in history in NZ as the lead charge?

    That way we can hopefully get it to go viral?

    Their is a site already setup where someone could piggy back a Global petition on that site, can you arrange it?

    http://www.thepetitionsite.com/create.html

  15. philj 15
    1 September 2014 at 9:22 pm

    xox
    Thank goodness for bloggers and hackers to expose the corruptocracy of Kiwi MSM and the present government. Bless em.

  16. Harry Holland 16
    1 September 2014 at 9:58 pm

    However, poll results suggest that Nat support is so far largely undented. Key has been a hugely polarizing influence in NZ politics and so far this issue has just polarized people more. I’m not sure even a smoking gun would be enough to deter his supporters – he is their champion. They won’t cut left although maybe some will drift to ACT, Conservative, or NZF. Disarray on the right does not necessarily mean more votes for the left.

    • Olwyn 16.1
      1 September 2014 at 10:47 pm

      I recently heard from someone who has been working with poor people in Spain and Italy that even under the conditions of austerity, people are not as wretched there as they are in New Zealand. Key’s government has created a deeply divided society, and I think a lot of middle class people fear that any attempt to address this will cost them. They feel bad about it, but cannot get much past wringing their hands, putting a packet of weetbix into the food bank collection and voting for the status quo. At the same time, the people who have drawn the short straw are getting more politicised, and last election, when Key was at the height of his popularity, the right won by a whisker. So much depends on this election, but it is very hard to see how it will go.

    • Tracey 16.2
      2 September 2014 at 7:25 am

      Colmar had him shedding 2% and labour gaining 2%. And remember that as an historical guide Nats shed up to 5% on election day from poll results and labour gains about 3% (Greens lose about 1-2%)

  17. Penny Bright 17
    1 September 2014 at 10:30 pm

    It would help if folks vote sensibly and strategically in the Helensville electorate and all possible parties encourage their members and supporters to give me their ELECTORATE vote and focus on their PARTY vote – so I can take John Key’s Helensville seat off him.

    How can YOU help make this happen?

    Penny Bright

  18. Inky 18
    1 September 2014 at 10:44 pm

    They stick to Key like dog poo on your shoe heel. Is it total greed or total stupidity among Nats supporters?

  19. tricledrown 19
    1 September 2014 at 10:46 pm

    Put something in the water penny!
    stop people from voting!
    have bogus voting papers in each booth!
    good luck with that penny
    how big is his majority!
    you would be better trying the reverse and get some National Party list voters to change their vote !
    If every electorate had a small change that would change govt!
    you would be better off trying to change Epsom or Ohariu!

  20. Inky 20
    1 September 2014 at 10:46 pm

    (I don’t expect you to answer that, Penny, lol)

  21. Penny Bright 21
    2 September 2014 at 6:51 am

    The fact is that I polled 4th in the Auckland 2013 Mayoral campaign with 11,723 votes.

    The Helensville electorate fits within the boundaries of the Auckland not-so ‘Supercity for the 99%’ .

    Many Helensville folk whom I have met HATE the Auckland ‘Supercity’ and a number have told me that they voted for me.

    Going out and about in the electorate, I’m getting a very positive response from most folk I’m meeting and it was a KING hit finally getting to speak as an Independent candidate at the meeting held at the Kumeu Baptist Church on 11 August 2014.

    History has already been made with the resignation from Parliament of dodgy John Banks, the resignation of Minister of Corruption Judith Collins, so why can’t the trifecta be won with my taking of him the seat of shonky John Key ?

    I’m GOING FOR IT and I need YOUR help!

    Most important is WORD of mouth / email / text.

    It’s time to get the proven anti- corruption / anti-privatisation Public Watchdog INSIDE the House, asking the stinking HARD questions no one else does under Parliamentary privilege!

    Cheers!

    Her Warship 😉

  22. philj 22
    2 September 2014 at 7:59 am

    How will the election go? Who would’ve picked 7 – 1 to. Germany v Brasil. This election could be a rout. It’s really a test of this countries collective wisdom. Here’s hoping ….

  23. Rodel 23
    2 September 2014 at 10:21 am

    Anyone noticed how John Key’s shrill voice is starting to sound linguistically similar to David Farrar? Same nasal inflections, consonant blurring and vowel imperfections. Is it the same panic response or is it a DNA thing?

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