Open mike 09/05/2019

Written By: - Date published: 7:00 am, May 9th, 2019 - 165 comments
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Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

165 comments on “Open mike 09/05/2019 ”

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  1. Adrian Thornton 1
    9 May 2019 at 7:52 am

    'Corporate Media Target Gabbard for Her Anti-Interventionism—a Word They Can Barely Pronounce' (not unlike a couple of TS commenters)

    FAIR

    May 8, 2019

    "Presidential hopeful Tulsi Gabbard has not garnered much press coverage since announcing her bid on February 2; she’s the 13th-most-mentioned Democratic candidate on TV news, according to FAIR’s most recent count (4/14/19)…

    When corporate outlets talk about this anti-interventionist position, they primarily use it to negatively characterize the candidates who espouse it. Few in establishment media seem interested in going any deeper or considering the veracity of arguments raised by anti-interventionists."

    Like I said, not unlike a few commeners right here on The Standard who seem to have not to have seen an intervention or war that dosn't give them a boner..

    • Andre 1.1
      9 May 2019 at 9:00 am

      Gabbard's quite the canvas for fantasists to project their dreams onto, while ignoring the ugly realities of her actual views and positions.

      She's not anti intervention, she just doesn't want Americans to be put at direct risk overseas. She's all for droning foreigners she doesn't like, though. She's got quite the soft spot for authoritarian dictators, too. Given her enthusiasm for Hindu nationalists, she's got all the indications of an incipient holy warrior just itching to be let loose.

      Gabbard’s crusade against “extremist Islam” appeared to blind her to this reality. In her statement following her meeting with Assad, she blamed the “regime-change war” led by the United States, Saudi Arabia, Turkey, and “Gulf states” for the deaths of more than 400,000 Syrians and the creation of millions of refugees. Left unmentioned was the real origin of the conflict: the Assad regime’s decision in 2011 to suppress peaceful protests with force, and the radicalization of the opposition through a brutal crackdown, beginning with the arrest and torture of children in the city of Deraa. After the Trump administration struck air bases to punish the Assad regime for a likely chemical attack in 2017, Gabbard accused the government of acting “recklessly” and risking the “strengthening of terrorists.” Left unmentioned was the long, clear and nonpartisan evidenceof the Assad regime’s use of chemical weapons.

      Opposing intervention and regime change was one thing, but Gabbard went much further, adopting Sisi and Assad’s talking points, denying their opponents agency and humanity, and effectively endorsing their systematic abuses of human rights as long as they were directed against the right people.

      https://www.thenation.com/article/tulsi-gabbard-president-foreign-islam/

      For a look at her Hindu nationalist proclivities:

      https://theintercept.com/2019/01/05/tulsi-gabbard-2020-hindu-nationalist-modi/

      edit: sorry, forgot to embed this link in the right place: https://digitalcitizen.info/2019/02/13/is-tulsi-gabbard-really-anti-war-no-shes-pro-drone-and-for-surgical-strikes/

      • OnceWasTim 1.1.1
        9 May 2019 at 10:03 am

        Are you following the Lok Sabha elections @ Andre? Quite interesting how, when people feel (and experience) the political class and the state apparatus fail them, they retreat into various forms of escapism- including religious fundamentalism.

        Modi is a shameless self-promoter (20 foot high posters at every state owned petrol station for example – in "look what I have done for you" style; even posters covering road signs on major highways). All the while, most of the promises made – he's failed to deliver on.

        It's quite interesting to see how in the smaller villages reliant on collective interest for survival, everyone – regardless of religion and social status co-operate and support one another. Also seems to be where the best in 'green practices' and concern for the environment occur.

        I have to say, part of my interest in the elections relates to how things might pan out where they concern 'lil 'ole egalitarian Nu Zull when it goes grovelling for a free trade agreement. (So far I don't like our chances if only because the family of an up and coming politician – whose popularity and jurisdiction is increasing by the day- is really really really pissed at that supposedly sophisticated, 'best practice' immigration system we have)

      • Adrian Thornton 1.1.2
        9 May 2019 at 10:05 am

        Have you actually read that Intercept article?, it never shows Gabbard endorsing the Hindu nationalists whatsoever, as usual it (as with The Nation piece) is full of rhetoric like this "with her support for authoritarians abroad, including Modi, Sisi, and Syria’s Bashar al-Assad".

        But sure she is far from perfect, but still pretty solid IMO, however I am not prepared to get into a debate on her good and bad points today because that was not the point of the FAIR piece, what they getting at is the lack of conversation the MSM are prepared to engage in around her anti intervention stand..and by natural extension her stand against the US Military–industrial complex.

        That is a conversation that is sorely needed, and most especially in the USA, so where ever or by whom ever that conversation originates is actually of little import.

      • joe90 1.1.3
        9 May 2019 at 12:01 pm

        The Jacobian on Gabbard. And Luap Nor reckons she's the one, too,

        If the glowing profiles of Gabbard are right, she stands poised to become one of the leaders of the Democratic Party. If so, progressives will have to drop any starry-eyed admiration, and take a good, hard, honest look at who Tulsi Gabbard really is.

        Her rhetoric about Islam wouldn’t be out of place on a Republican debate stage. Her anti-interventionism is shot through with a pernicious nationalism. Her support for Modi legitimizes a leader with a record of enabling anti-Muslim brutality.

        http://www.jacobinmag.com/2017/05/tulsi-gabbard-president-sanders-democratic-party

        • Andre 1.1.3.1
          9 May 2019 at 12:22 pm

          I s'pose mentioning the way David Duke has the hots for her would just be gilding the lily?

          • Adrian Thornton 1.1.3.1.1
            9 May 2019 at 12:48 pm

            As usual you two not actually answering the primary topic that was the whole reason for the link in the first place…you tell me who else on the US American political stage and who is running for POTUS that is trying to talk about US interventions and bullying around the world in such a direct way?

            Again cos you seem to need things spelt out for you…that is what the FAIR piece was about.

            Like I said there some here who seem to bone up every time the US how a bit of it’s muscle around the world..all very sadomasochistic if you ask me.

            • Andre 1.1.3.1.1.1
              9 May 2019 at 12:58 pm

              The problem here, Adrian, is the way you pay very little attention to what anyone actually says or does, and just project your preconceived ideas onto them.

              • Adrian Thornton …
                9 May 2019 at 1:18 pm

                Thats funny I was thinking that exact same thing about you.

                You might have noticed that I agreed with you and said she was far from perfect, but could debate her good points at a later date, however that was not what the FAIR piece was about, as I pointed out twice. So I would say that it is you projecting your preconceived ideas without addressing the original point of the story once.

                • Andre …
                  9 May 2019 at 2:58 pm

                  One of the many examples of you projecting your preconceived ideas is your repeated offensive claim about commenters here getting boners for going to war.

                  Your original comment reads as a whine that Gabbard isn't getting the fawning attention you think she deserves for being anti-interventionist (which she isn't). I've gone back and re-read it, and it just doesn't read as a comment about lack of media attention about anti-intervention, it reads as a whine that Gabbard's not getting attention.

                  Which lines up with the Commondreams piece you quoted (which you didn't even link to, ya plonker) reading as a whine about Gabbard not getting attention. It too fails to even look at Gabbard's interventionist aspects – her enthusiasm for droning, her rabid anti-Islamism, her enthusiasm for military suppliers (which is enthusiastically reciprocated with donations) etc.

                  Dunno why you even mentioned FAIR. All the piece you linked to does is count up candidate media mentions, without considering the topic of those mentions. Unsurprisingly, Gabbard rates damn near last. Which is only noteworthy if you think (against all evidence and reason) that she deserves much more coverage.

                  BTW, nice work putting your entire second paragraph as an edit. Neatly hiding the link to the FAIR piece where it's very hard to see is pretty outstanding, too.

                  • Adrian Thornton …
                    9 May 2019 at 5:42 pm

                    I just haven't got the time or inclination to bother unpacking that bunch of shit you just dropped above, but I will say this, I notice that you are offended very easily yourself, but.of course never have a problem lacing your comments with as many insults as possible.

                    And of course as usual it seems you haven't read the original piece, as it unpacks quite fully the MSM failure to engage in a serious conversation around the US and it's interventions.

                    As I said already but have to mention again, the only projecting going on around here is from you, but you are in so deep you obviously have little or no self awareness of that plain fact.

      • mauī 1.1.4
        9 May 2019 at 12:17 pm

        You sound just like McCain interrogating her on the View TV show… (link below, from 4:20)



  2. esoteric pineapples 2
    9 May 2019 at 8:32 am

    Based on some of the recent announcements of this government in regards to climate change, cannabis reform etc (with National much worse), if I was to describe New Zealand metaphorically, I would say it is someone who put headphones on to listen to Fleetwood Mac's Rumours album in 1977 and hasn't budged since.

  3. Herodotus 3
    9 May 2019 at 8:37 am

    should the kiwibuild policy be TOTALLY dropped, those shut out of the market will remain shut out no matter how this policy is repackaged. Those within the industry knew that there wasn’t the capacity, and I know that min Twyford was told as much.

    At least our govt. can now use the resources that was dedicated to Kiwibuild and focus these on .. perhaps NZH ?

    • Herodotus 3.1
      9 May 2019 at 8:43 am

      monthly python was aware of Kiwibuild before it was dreamed up 🤣

    • Peter Christchurh nz 3.2
      9 May 2019 at 9:44 am

      Herodotus. I seriously doubt ANY resources were ever directed towards Kiwi Build. It was a fantasy written on the back of a beer coaster after that idiot Tywford had a few drinks. Same as Arderns fantasy about fast rail to Tauranga.

      Sadly, this government' can talk the talk but not walk the walk.

      • Anne 3.2.1
        9 May 2019 at 10:12 am

        How come PCnz it took the first Labour government three years to get the State Housing programme up and running smoothly, yet the Nats have been screaming blue murder because Kiwi Build was still in the process of being set up one year after the govt. came to power.

        And they started way behind the ball game because the previous Nat govt. spent nine years totally ignoring the growing housing crisis.

        • Peter 3.2.1.1
          9 May 2019 at 10:22 am

          There was NO HOUSING CRISIS! Simon and his mates and all their supporters told us so. For years.

          I can't think why the coalition even appointed a Housing Minister.

          • Anne 3.2.1.1.1
            9 May 2019 at 11:10 am

            I can't think why the coalition even appointed a Housing Minister.

            They weren't planning to, but when they discovered what a shambles the building and related industries were actually in they thought they had better appoint one. 😉

        • Peter Christchurh nz 3.2.1.2
          9 May 2019 at 10:56 am

          Anne. Yes but the housing program of the first Labour government was well thought out. The current government seriously had their policy written in a pub late at night. It was transparently obvious it was a fail even before they gained power.

          I have always (mostly) been a Labour voter, but honestly, Twyford is an embarrassment.

          • Muttonbird 3.2.1.2.1
            9 May 2019 at 11:03 am

            Oh, yes. The old, "I was a Labour man, my father was a Labour man, and my father's father was a Labour man".

            Until Twyford.

          • Anne 3.2.1.2.2
            9 May 2019 at 11:04 am

            Rubbish PCnz.

            I personally know Twyford and the last thing you could call him is an embarrassment. You are falling for a Nat inspired line that the media has pounced on and which bears no relationship to the truth.

            • Peter Christchurh nz 3.2.1.2.2.1
              9 May 2019 at 11:11 am

              No, I am judging him on his performance, or lack thereof.

              If you know him and like him that's great, but that on no way is related to his ability. I am sure even Mao was liked by his close circle. Still an idiot though.

              I think greywarsharks comment below is maybe right. This blog is fast descending into subjective likes and dislike, rather than thinking.

            • Peter Christchurh nz 3.2.1.2.2.2
              9 May 2019 at 11:11 am

              No, I am judging him on his performance, or lack thereof.

              If you know him and like him that is great, but that in no way is related to his ability. I am sure even Mao was liked by his close circle. Still an idiot though.

              I think greywarsharks comment in point 8 below is maybe right. This blog is fast descending into subjective likes and dislike, rather than thinking.

              • Molly …
                9 May 2019 at 11:39 am

                Unfortunately, I agree. There was a time when many comments would be a source of new information or perspectives, but many of those who provided those are no longer posting. Although there are a few left.

                I find the lack of critical thinking regarding this coalition government policies a disappointing result of the last election. More time and emphasis is given to the political-nous of non-action, rather than the expectations that change is possible. What would be possible if we expected better? The National-led government unashamedly catered to their constituents, business, farmers and low tax advocates. This new government seems to cater to the same demographic, and those of us who are more diverse than that are left with no discernible option.

                I was always critical of Kiwibuild. For many reasons, primarily that the housing crisis is a housing crisis, not just a "housing affordability" crisis for those wanting to get on the property ladder. And this government had nine years in opposition to get some ideas into shape. However, many criticism of the actions of this government are not discussed, but dismissed.

                I am not surprised that comments regarding the pitiful Zero Carbon bill, are so full of pragmatic acceptance that for political reasons this is the best they can do. Such a difference to the comments that would have been posted if National had been in power for this.

                • The Chairman …
                  9 May 2019 at 11:50 am

                  Well said, Molly.yes

                • RedLogix …
                  9 May 2019 at 11:59 am

                  Yup. Well stated.

                  The reason why the First Labour govt could make progress is likely because it had people who understood the problem, knew the experts, and was able to harness that knowledge into actions that worked.

                  I don't think Twyford is a fool. Privately he must be as frustrated as we are. It's my sense that there are too many layers between him and the action and he's struggling to get traction. Our public sector got lazily accustomed to a decade of inaction under National and it isn't responding competently. It's neither supporting the Minister, nor connecting to the players on the ground effectively.

                  • mikesh …
                    9 May 2019 at 12:36 pm

                    I think the first Labour government found they had a lot of unemployed carpenters sitting round on their chuffs doing nothing.

                  • Anne …
                    9 May 2019 at 12:37 pm

                    "It's my sense that there are too many layers between him and the action and he's struggling to get traction. Our public sector got lazily accustomed to a decade of inaction under National and it isn't responding competently. It's neither supporting the Minister, nor connecting to the players on the ground effectively."

                    Thank-you Redlogix.

                    It is my view that is exactly what is happening but of course Phil can't say so. I've never seen him look so frustrated as he does these days, but he has no choice but to take the flak from people who should be better informed but are apparently not.

                    And for the uninformed:

                    KiwiBuild is only a part of the overall policy of this government. Building lots more state houses and encouraging the creation of more quality rental properties are just as much in the mix. But I guess they are equally hampered by an industry that was left to run down so badly by the previous govt. and a bunch of public servants who don't have the knowledge or apparent capability to run a hen house let alone a mass building programme.

                    That's 30 years of neo-liberalism for you!

                    • Molly …
                      9 May 2019 at 1:26 pm

                      "And for the uninformed: …"

                      A good example of what I'm talking about Anne. The dismissal.

                      Am not so "uninformed" but unimpressed. (As you know from previous conversations on this topic, which you never respond to in such a way as to encourage discussions and solutions.)

                      … maybe, underwhelmed could be added as a descriptor.

                    • Anne …
                      9 May 2019 at 2:36 pm

                      Sorry Molly but I have no idea what you're talking about. The dismissal? What is that supposed to mean?

                      As for my lack of response. If you have challenged something I have said, I can only advise I never saw it. I don't have the time or inclination to read everything here. Nor do I comment according to someone else's dictate.

                    • Molly …
                      9 May 2019 at 4:06 pm

                      You make the comment: " For the uninformed: "

                      As if those disagreeing are not informed. For my part, I have, in the past, in discussions with you, disagreed about the focus, and the scope of Kiwibuild.

                      " As for my lack of response. If you have challenged something I have said, I can only advise I never saw it. I don't have the time or inclination to read everything here. Nor do I comment according to someone else's dictate. "

                      On the contrary, you have often dismissed my criticisms without discussion, even though I have entered them in good faith. I'm not dictating a response, just thinking that discussions lead to better solutions. I guess that expectation is too high.

                      The housing crisis was prioritised as a "home ownership" problem with the implementation of Kiwibuild. The solution was to reinforce the market forces that have created the situation, and provide a select few with a helping hand, (hardly an egalitarian solution). While people continue to be unhoused to cries of but wait….. and wait…

                      Personally, I think housing people is just not a priority for this Labour led coalition. They are not only politically driven to provide "affordable homes" rather than housing, this is – for them – the priority of the housing crisis we are in. So their political behaviour aligns with their personal priorities. And despite many alternative housing models that are possible for government investment we are limited to the same tired, failed solutions.

                    • Anne …
                      9 May 2019 at 4:50 pm

                      Are you mixing me up with someone else Molly because I have no recollection of any discussion with you about the housing crisis. In fact I have no recollection of any discussion with you at all. That is not to say I disagree with your premises. In fact I probably agree with you more than I disagree.

                      Since I honestly don't know what you are referring to, this is my last response.

                    • Molly …
                      9 May 2019 at 4:54 pm

                      Sorry, Anne. Without the search function, I relied on my faulty memory. Apologies for thinking we had had this discussion in the past.

                    • Anne …
                      9 May 2019 at 6:32 pm

                      No probs Molly. Easily done. I have difficulty remembering from one day to the next what I've said and who I've said it to. We need that search function back.

                  • Skunk Weed …
                    9 May 2019 at 4:37 pm

                    The problem is the Banks are not prepared to lend on new home builds unless you have 25-35% deposit and very high income + $120,000.00 with minimal out goings per month. Low to middle class earners do not have a shit show building or owning a new house IMHO ?

            • The Chairman 3.2.1.2.2.3
              9 May 2019 at 11:53 am

              Do you think the Minister (Twyford) will survive the up and coming reshuffle, Anne?

              • Skunk Weed …
                9 May 2019 at 4:57 pm

                The Housing Crisis was caused by Key allowing Asian buyers to buy up NZ and they have pushed prices and rents higher than most Kiwi's can absorb on their miniscule wages ? The Housing Crisis was artificially engineered by National IMHO ?

            • Shadrach 3.2.1.2.2.4
              9 May 2019 at 2:40 pm

              The fact that you personally know Twyford, and yet cannot perceive of the level of failure with KiwiBuild, probably disqualifies you from meaningful comment on the basis of blind bias.

            • Jimmy 3.2.1.2.2.5
              9 May 2019 at 3:35 pm

              Twyford's not an embarrassment? Well he's hardly a star performer is he. Maybe he's been handed the poison chalice but to keep spouting off the dribble he comes out with is embarrassing.

        • Stuart Munro. 3.2.1.3
          9 May 2019 at 11:12 am

          They didn't ignore it – they profiteered off it.

          • Anne 3.2.1.3.1
            9 May 2019 at 11:20 am

            I think we've got a new troll SM, or an old troll with a new identity.

            • Peter Christchurh nz 3.2.1.3.1.1
              9 May 2019 at 12:06 pm

              Anyone who has even a mildly different view is a troll? Guess Anne you must be a big fan of dictatorships then and a hater of democracy.

              • Anne …
                9 May 2019 at 12:42 pm

                We have another concern troll folks. You know it when they finish off with childlike and stupid statements like the one above. 🙄

              • The Chairman …
                9 May 2019 at 2:00 pm

                Anyone who has even a mildly different view is a troll?

                That's pretty much what I've found.

                They do their best to isolate your concern (generally by making out it is a single voice in the crowd) and diminish it (usually by trying to paint the person as being part of the opposition, thus a troll).

                Therefore, any criticism, disappointment or concern thereafter is treated as trolling by some. Which is how my handle has been tarred somewhat. However, those advancing it only tend to appeal to the ignorant.

                • solkta …
                  9 May 2019 at 2:02 pm

                  Give it up couch man.

                • Robert Guyton …
                  9 May 2019 at 2:18 pm

                  "Disappointment" and "The Chairman" are synonymous. Perhaps The Chairman is the embodiment of disappointment? The Angel of Disappointment? Disapointment's lindworm brother?

              • The Chairman …
                9 May 2019 at 2:47 pm

                Take note: solkta and Robert Guyton are another two that advance the troll call. With the latter being a self admitted troll.

                Thanks to solkta and Robert Guyton for highlighting my point.

                • Robert Guyton …
                  9 May 2019 at 2:52 pm

                  A troll! On The Standard???

                  I call you a wet blanket, Chairman, quite rightly, I'm confident.

                  • The Chairman …
                    9 May 2019 at 3:10 pm

                    You pile on in nonetheless, Robert. And you are a self admitted troll.

                    • solkta …
                      9 May 2019 at 3:36 pm

                      you still a troll table man.

                    • Robert Guyton …
                      9 May 2019 at 3:36 pm

                      "Piling on"… to a wet blanket, Chairman?

                      Shiver!

                    • greywarshark …
                      9 May 2019 at 4:00 pm

                      A troll is a repetitive stupid or unbalanced viewpoint repeated. Robert is definitely a Not a Troll. Gabby is not a troll, though at first glance might seem so.

                      The Chairman – Just because you have for once advanced a good point at the appropriate time for it to be heard by the political party doesn't mean that you aren't a troll usually. I praise you for your thought about attending to welfare needs in a timely fashion this time.

                      But usually you don't state your point, then perhaps answer one comment, and leave it you want to hammer it home. You aren't discussing you are just having your arguments on our great blog, or it was till we have been swamped. It's a dismal experience here so often with purposeless people enjoying showing everyone up as lesser beings.

                    • The Chairman …
                      9 May 2019 at 4:57 pm

                      @greywarshark

                      Robert is a self admitted Troll. I've (in the past) pointed this out with a link with him admitting this. Hence there is no denial from him.

                      I come here to discuss political matters and get dragged into arguments, such as you are creating now. It's a dismal experience that you are creating. Yet you point the finger at me, get real.

                      For example, take my post today (beyond Jacinda) and look at the very first reply. A straight out unjustified attack on me was unleashed. And you say I don’t state my point, which clearly I did. So what is this really about?

                    • The Chairman …
                      9 May 2019 at 5:29 pm

                      My reply to you seems to have gone missing, greywarshark.

                    • The Chairman …
                      9 May 2019 at 5:51 pm

                      What's this nonsense you are saying about me, greywarshark?

                      First off, Robert is a self admitted troll (I've posted a link to this in the past) where he himself admits it. Hence there is no denial from him.

                      As for your allegations, I disagree. And my post today is another example. The point was clear, yet the first reply was an attack on me. And I didn't see any condemnation from you directed at them.

                      I come here to discuss politics and get drawn into non political arguments such as this you have started. And you have the audacity to point the finger at me, get real. Therefore, what is this really about greywarshark?

        • Gabby 3.2.1.4
          9 May 2019 at 11:40 am

          The State Housing programme had the advantage of being a Good Idea.

          • gsays 3.2.1.4.1
            9 May 2019 at 12:30 pm

            Joyce invented the ministry of everything.

            Why not have a MOW only with a name that has been through whatever consultation these things have nowadays?

            Running construction trade apprenticeships, able to purchase in bulk, perhaps drive down the rort that is NZ building supply chain.

            Is it a lack of imagination, ideology?

            • Stuart Munro. 3.2.1.4.1.1
              9 May 2019 at 2:31 pm

              If they defund the current structure, where will the consultancies be for the incumbents scuttle off to when they're dismissed for non-performance?

              • gsays …
                9 May 2019 at 2:45 pm

                I think me using consultancy created a red herring.

                What I was getting at was if the private sector is struggling to build the house's needed then perhaps the state could fill the role.

                Aotearoa has proud history of innovation. Borrowing the best of ideas from overseas and adapting to local needs and conditions.

                None of this race to the bottom attitude so enshrined in private sector thinking.

                • Stuart Munro. …
                  9 May 2019 at 3:06 pm

                  The two great flaws of institutions, drift and capture, mean that in spite of the loss of institutional knowledge, fresh startups enjoy certain advantages, not least of which is an ability to recruit to current and developing policy.

                  In the defunded ossuaries the Key Kleptocracy made of essential services there is so little left worth preserving creating new structures from the ground up is highly desirable. It would have spared Curran an encounter with a worthless kleptocracy remnant at least.

    • greywarshark 3.3
      9 May 2019 at 10:49 am

      You didn't need to be in the industry to know that the resources weren't available to match the aspirations for housing by Twyford and Labour Coalition, it was all out there in the news in open view for everyone to read and comprehend. I wondered how Twyford would cope when one day he met Reality and had to shake hands with it.

    • SPC 3.4
      9 May 2019 at 1:16 pm

      You will not develop the capacity to increase supply (such as small factory built homes ideal for infill on smaller sized sections currently not sub-divided) without finance for more new building.

  4. Andre 4
    9 May 2019 at 9:23 am

    Charging electric trucks on the move – overhead electric wires and pantographs on the cabs that can be raised or lowered as need be.

    https://edition.cnn.com/2019/05/07/tech/e-highway-a5/index.html

    • WeTheBleeple 4.1
      9 May 2019 at 10:59 am

      Much smarter to recharge truck drivers at the rest stop. No need for this tech unless it is for driverless trucks.

  5. ianmac 5
    9 May 2019 at 9:37 am

    The Herald has those online "Premium" columns.

    Do they print those columns in the paper version? (No Heralds down our way.)

  6. The Chairman 6
    9 May 2019 at 9:55 am

    Labour beyond Jacinda

    Are Labour doing enough to future proof the party leadership?

    Lets face it, Labour were headed for a miserable defeat last election if it wasn't for Little standing down and Jacinda stepping up. But Jacinda won't be here forever and her stardust appeal will eventually wear thin.

    So what depth has Labour got? Kelvin won't cut it as party leader. Therefore, are they doing enough to bring a new leader through?

    • mac1 6.1
      9 May 2019 at 10:22 am

      The Chairman, I thought Ten Year Plans were part of political history.

      If anyone ever doubted that you were a concern troll, The Chairman, then this comment of yours is a classic in that form.

      Seriously, succession planning should be a part of a leader’s thinking. But for a leader polling as high as she is, against a forlorn leader at 5% popularity who was mocked in the House by Winston Peters for not attending an overseas conference for fear of being rolled in his absence? A leader who can’t control himself in the House but, poor lad, resorts to claims of victimisation. A leader who is not able to control his caucus when two more got booted from the House after a very distasteful political set-up using a grieving mother?

      This is the very revealing video of that cynical ploy? Or was it more planned than that? Is the Opposition in its disarray employing a tactic it used before in calling the Speaker a bully, as Brownlee with a smirk on his face clearly intimated in this video?

      Question 12 Wednesday 8 May Dr Nick Smith

      If I were really being concerned, I’d be worried about the quality and direction of that opposition in a parliamentary democracy.

      • The Chairman 6.1.1
        9 May 2019 at 10:50 am

        The Chairman, I thought Ten Year Plans were part of political history.

        I don't see the party doing any succession planning in the short-term or over ten years.

        Yes, Jacinda and the party are doing so-so in the polls, but still not enough to take it on their own. But like I said, Jacinda won't be here forever and it takes time to bring MPs up through the ranks and allow the public to get to know and resonate with them.

        Therefore, it's a totally legitimate question which the party should be thinking about. So your crap about it showing I'm a troll is just that, total crap.

        Moreover, one assumes the last thing Labour will want is a repeat of the constant leadership changes in the short term before Jacinda.

        Jacinda has shown that a leader with appeal (largely alone as there was little policy change if any between her leadership and Little's) can save a dying party. Therefore, once she has gone or her appeal wears off, Labour will be in serious trouble.

        And if one can't come onto a site such as this and discuss this without being called a troll, we (the left) are in far more trouble than you think.

        • mac1 6.1.1.1
          9 May 2019 at 11:59 am

          'So-so' meaning: moderately well : tolerably: neither very good nor very bad : middling.

          April 2019 poll:Labour 48% (2017 election 37%), National 40% (44) Greens 6% (6) NZF 4% (7) Act 1%.

          Preferred leader: Ardern 51% Bridges 5% Collins 5% Peters 3%

          The Chairman, we know you don't prefer Labour, and granted, that's still a majority view in NZ, by some 2%. But calling those figures "so-so" is just a mite miserly.

          Mind you, if they are 'so-so' or 'middling', then Labour has much higher to go then? Wahoo! The ten year plan much beloved of that former Chinese chairman might indeed need to be invoked.

          Be easy on yourself, and park your concerns for another two elections minimum! Or at least until things start to look a bit wobbly.

          • The Chairman 6.1.1.1.1
            9 May 2019 at 12:15 pm

            When one is in a race, the goal is to win 100%. Except if you are Labour, where 48% is something to rave about. At 48% it's so-so, thus moderately well. But they still couldn’t win it alone.

            Jacinda could opt to leave at any given time, or worse her appeal could wear off. Touting families package and energy payments will only work for so long.

            And you forget, succession planning takes time.

            Can you list any potential successors within the party?

            • mac1 6.1.1.1.1.1
              9 May 2019 at 12:22 pm

              The Chairman, 100% Do you understand reality? Do you understand MMP?

              You are prone to a combinations of doomsaying and exaggeration.

              You of course can tout your views here. Just accept that those who disagree might actually say so, and also upon significant repetition of concern troll views cast comment on your intrinsic motivation.

              greywarshark at #8 below pertains as well.

              • The Chairman …
                9 May 2019 at 12:52 pm

                Do you understand reality? Do you understand MMP?

                Of course. You can't win an MMP election outright with only 48%.

                “You are prone to a combinations of doomsaying and exaggeration.”

                Rubbish. I asked about Labour's succession planning and put forward some reasoning for that.

                You of course can tout your views here. Just accept that those who disagree might actually say so…

                I totally accept that and welcome the debate on the issue. But I don't respect where you are taking it, talking shit and playing the man and not the ball.

                And also upon significant repetition of concern troll views cast comment on your intrinsic motivation.

                Upon significant repetition of you playing the man calling me a concern troll, not only should you give thought to greywarshark at #8 but also to Molly's at 11:39 am today. The relevant part being this: “However, many criticism of the actions of this government are not discussed, but dismissed.”

            • Psycho Milt 6.1.1.1.1.2
              9 May 2019 at 12:31 pm

              Failure to get 100% of the vote is just failure, huh? That certainly explains your alleged "disappointment" with the current government – those saps couldn't even get 100% of the vote!

              • The Chairman …
                9 May 2019 at 1:03 pm

                Failure to get 100% of the vote is just failure, huh?

                That's not what I said nor implied. What was being implied was Labour should be entering the race with a goal/aim (albeit ambitious) to win outright.

                You mistaking it goes a little way further in explaining your largely flawed views.

                • SPC …
                  9 May 2019 at 1:19 pm

                  The ambition of National to be a one party government is why they are in opposition.

                  It's bizarre how you want Labour to burn off its partners and go for 100% while also claiming good government requires a strong opposition.

                  A simple question – do you support Labour trying to win the centre to maximise its share or to be a genunine left wing party even if that means losing votes in the centre to a partner like NZF?

                  • The Chairman …
                    9 May 2019 at 1:23 pm

                    Don't be silly. One can aim for an outright win and still leave the door open to work with partners. It is MMP after all.

                  • The Chairman …
                    9 May 2019 at 1:27 pm

                    A simple question – do you support Labour trying to win the centre to maximise its share or to be a genunine left wing party even if that means losing votes in the centre to a partner like NZF?

                    I've said this before and I will say it again, Labour can win over a good number of the right and the centre while remaining left.

                    • solkta …
                      9 May 2019 at 1:30 pm

                      and you can say it as many times as you like, but it will still be bullshit.

                    • The Chairman …
                      9 May 2019 at 1:33 pm

                      Not at all. I win them over all the time. You’d be surprised, most of us largely want the same things.

                      Housing, health education, safety, money and freedom are common features we share and require.

                      The right tend to look after the top end of town while us socialists on the left go for a wider fairer society. And there is more people in that category than at the top end.

                    • Psycho Milt …
                      9 May 2019 at 1:34 pm

                      You're free to hold whatever highly unorthodox views you like. However, there's no obligation on Labour to choose your ignorance-based assertions over the the conclusions to be drawn from the assessments of political scientists, their activists in the field and their internal polling.

              • The Chairman …
                9 May 2019 at 2:52 pm

                Of course Labour has no obligation to listen to just me.

                But as I've often shown, I'm by far not the only one expressing, concern, disappointment and criticism. Which, is largely drawn from the assessments of political scientists, their activists in the field and polling. And which, you, continually, mistakenly (or is that willingly) overlook.

                • Incognito …
                  9 May 2019 at 4:03 pm

                  Indeed, you are not the only one but your overabundance of comments here and your idiosyncratic style set you apart from the rest.

                  • The Chairman …
                    9 May 2019 at 4:28 pm

                    overabundance of comments here

                    Merely shows my effort partaking in democracy, taking political interest beyond just voting.

                    We all have our own style and I've always stuck out from the crowd. So what? You keep forgetting we are here to talk politics and not about me.

                    • In Vino …
                      9 May 2019 at 6:17 pm

                      Chairman, methinks thou dost protest too much. Some of us write a certain amount – you write screeds, 99% of it beckoning us to the slough of despond. Be more subtle – contribute less.

                    • Incognito …
                      9 May 2019 at 11:04 pm

                      I applaud you for making an effort and I mean this. However, you complain that you are wrongly accused of being disingenuous (or misunderstood?) and that the comment threads often appear to be about you rather than about politics. You want political debate and discussion but you are not achieving this here on TS. Others have also made similar comments, today even, and not necessarily about or because of you …

                      Anyway, you don’t seem to realise or be willing to accept that you are your own worst enemy. Your commenting frequency and style combined often become the obstacle and the reason why the ‘debate’ never takes off or gets past you. In my view, if you really want to achieve what you claim, you’ll have to modify your style.

                      Einstein had something to say about repeating the same behaviour and expecting different outcomes. Only you can modify your style and only you know how much you want to achieve your goals. So, the way I see it is that it is really up to you.

                      I’m pretty sure I’ve said something along these lines to you previously but here we are again facing the same dilemma. What you gonna do?

                    • The Chairman …
                      9 May 2019 at 11:56 pm

                      “You want political debate and discussion but you are not achieving this here on TS.”

                      That’s not completely true. Political discussion is achieved, but there are a small number of mostly repeat offenders that like to make it personal.

                      Playing the man and not the ball isn’t unique to TS, it’s a common occurrence wherever there is public discussion/debate and a clash of ideas.

                      What is a little more unique to the standard (which others have mention today and you seem to have acknowledged) is there tends to be a bit more downplaying of criticism and protection of Labour. Resulting in playing the man and others being called trolls, which was also displayed today.

                      So it is this little group of protectors that exacerbate the problem here on the TS.

                    • Incognito …
                      10 May 2019 at 7:46 am

                      You are correct in that you are getting some traction sometimes, but more often than not the comment threads descend down the familiar path, don’t they? You have completely ignored the main point, which is to acknowledge and own your own role in all of this. All you do is point to others who “exacerbate the problem here on the TS”. As I said, you cannot control the behaviour of others except your own but from your response I conclude that you are either unwilling or unable to modify your own behaviour. This is something you have in common with a few others here on TS, IMO.

                      So, in a nutshell, it will be BAU here on TS thanks to commenters who like to dish it out in spades but refuse to look into the mirror. For some reason, we expect politicians and our leaders to be and do any better!?

                    • The Chairman …
                      10 May 2019 at 1:11 pm

                      According to you, my role in this is I comment to frequently and have a distinctive style. Which is a far cry from being a sin.

                      What you've overlooked is that regardless of how I frame my posts, discussing Labour shortfalls (which is what I largely come here to discuss as it's one of the biggest problems the left have to face) is like holding out a red flag to a bull when it comes to Labour's defenders on here.

                      Therefore, other than remaining silent there is no way to reframe a Labour failure, disappointment etc without this negative response being unleashed.

                      Therefore, you're right, it will be BAU.

                    • marty mars …
                      10 May 2019 at 1:21 pm

                      "… I frame my posts, discussing Labour shortfalls (which is what I largely come here to discuss as it's one of the biggest problems the left have to face)…"

                      Your unrelenting approach is a testament to your dislike of labour and the left not the other way around imo

                      There are lots of ways to reach the same objective – your approach imo is very similar to rwnj's and is offensive for many of the same reasons which is why you get so much blowback – but you think everyone else has the problem thus you continue and the cycle revolves.

                      You like the attention which is why you continue doing the same old stuff you did 2 years ago. You seem a little stuck to me but I've also got a worry that you may be a next generation bot.

                    • The Chairman …
                      10 May 2019 at 1:48 pm

                      @marty mars

                      I am part of the left, it's Labour that is largely abandoning representing us.

                      And with all Labour's shortcomings of late I'm shocked you still fail to see this. Thus, blame me. Turning on me won't encourage Labour to up their game. In fact, it does the opposite.

                      My unrelenting approach is a testament to my dislike of Labour's failures and the social harm it leaves floundering.

                      Of course, pointing out a Labour shortfall always attracts suspicion that it is coming from the right, but the reason my criticism hits harder is its coming from the left.

                      Coming onto here to discuss Labour's shortfalls shouldn't be seen as a problem, surely you don't want this place to be a mere echo chamber. And the fact that some see it as a problem is in fact the problem. We can't sort out our problems with Labour if we can't mention and discuss them.

                      Everything starts from talking and when we start calling for political talk to be shutdown, we are in big trouble. So ponder that.

                    • marty mars …
                      10 May 2019 at 2:57 pm

                      The problem is you are not congruent. There is something that doesn't jell and you know this by the reaction you get. Leaning bot a bit more now I have to say but we'll see if you have learned from the last response eh 🙂

                    • Incognito …
                      10 May 2019 at 11:05 pm

                      OMG! Who mentioned sin? [intentional pun]

                      You are the red flag and then complain about the raging bulls charging at you!

                      Indeed, BAU, because that is your choice.

                      QED

                    • McFlock …
                      10 May 2019 at 11:21 pm

                      Coming onto here to discuss Labour's shortfalls shouldn't be seen as a problem, surely you don't want this place to be a mere echo chamber.

                      But it is a problem because that is your only purpose for coming here: discussing "shortfalls" of the leftish parties in parliament. There is no criticism of the right wing parties, barely any recognition of the achievements of the parties of the left, just an incessant drone about "shortfalls" (some real, some exagerrated).

                      You're just a constant drone of mediocre negativity focused entirely in the direction you claim to support. This is, allegedly, so they can "up their game", but when has a constant grind of dreary, insipid whinging ever helped anyone improve?

                      At least serve us a shit sandwich once in a while… but then that would entail you thinking of at least two good things to comment on. Maybe start with an egg on pre-digested rye: one comment that includes a credit for decent work, slipped in between two slices of your usual fare.

                    • The Chairman …
                      11 May 2019 at 2:38 am

                      It's not my only purpose albeit it is a main and important one.

                      And there is good reason for that. Which I'll lay out.

                      As I previously highlighted, one of the largest ongoing problems the left face is a lack of decent political representation.

                      This shortfall (which Labour and the Greens have both displayed well and which Labour has a long history of) is holding back the long overdue progress required.

                      And without better representation that progress will come far too late for the planet and the growing number being left to flounder and perish being told to wait for progress that may never be delivered.

                      This failure to deliver is tarring the left in general. Labour talked a big game and the wheels are starting to fall off. When their time is done, the trail of disappointment, fiscal neglect/damage and social harm will scar the left for generations.

                      Hence, my vigorous persistence in this matter and (largely) non public focus on National. Moreover, where is it written criticism of right wing parties is a prerequisite for me to vigorously pursue this serious problem?

                      The sad thing is this could largely be averted if they only did more now. And the timing couldn't have been better, Jacinda has the political capital, a largely accepting public and the capability to sell it.

                      She is a leader that could really make a difference if she really wanted too. A lost opportunity indeed.

                      Labour and the Greens have done a good job of highlighting the problems, but when you go though the list of everything they have done to date, just about everything falls extremely short. Explaining why there is barely any recognition of the achievements. In fact, most things are expected to worsen due to their minimal input. A decision that comes not only with a large fiscal cost but also extensive social harm. And this from a so-called left led Government.

                      The right within Labour are more harming to the left than National as they hamstring our political capability.

                      They like to blame MMP and Winston and to an extent, that is valid.

                      But when taking that into account, we find (via the policy they have gotten through and funding allocated) it's money and Labour's unwillingness due to their adherence to neo-liberalism that are the main constraints.

                      Just about all political change first comes from people speaking out.

                      In fact, there was an example on the news just last night that seems to have struck some success, re drug testing drivers.

                    • McFlock …
                      11 May 2019 at 4:56 pm

                      Hey, pursue the "problem" all you want. Just don't be surprised when your pleas of being a left wing voter are faced with mocking disbelief because of your unflinching negativity towards the left, on a leftish site.

                    • The Chairman …
                      11 May 2019 at 5:14 pm

                      My "unflinching negativity" isn't directed towards the left. It's aimed at the shortfalls largely created by the right within the left. And shared by many others genuinely on the left.

                    • McFlock …
                      11 May 2019 at 6:48 pm

                      keep telling yourself that.

    • Fireblade 6.2
      9 May 2019 at 10:49 am

      It's a shame National had no succession plan. Key gave up when it got too hard and left the party with stale old Bill.

      Now they're stuck with Simon. What a fuck up.

      National desperately need to clear deadwood like Nick Smith and Brownlee, to make way for more talented people.

      • The Chairman 6.2.1
        9 May 2019 at 11:04 am

        It's a shame National had no succession plan

        Yes, having a strong opposition is healthy for democracy. Thus, we wouldn't want to see Labour revert back to where they were polling with Little. That's why they've got to start thinking what are they going to do when Jacinda goes or her appeal wears off.

        Do you see any up and coming potential in their (Labour’s) ranks or front bench for that matter?

    • Siobhan 6.3
      9 May 2019 at 11:37 am

      They lack the finesse of National in this regard..certainly taking 9 years to position Simon Bridges as leader was a master stroke. Yup.

      Though to be fair to both political Parties..thinking up and committing to a plan more than 6 months ahead is not the forte of Neo Liberal Centrists.

      • The Chairman 6.3.1
        9 May 2019 at 11:43 am

        When it comes to neo liberal plans such as the TPP, the commitment and planing is certainly there. And it's amazing how fast they can move when it suits.

    • Incognito 6.4
      9 May 2019 at 3:56 pm

      What about Neve?

      • The Chairman 6.4.1
        9 May 2019 at 4:17 pm

        As in a reason for Jacinda's departure (at some stage)?

        • Incognito 6.4.1.1
          9 May 2019 at 4:27 pm

          Succession planning. Please keep up 😉

          • The Chairman 6.4.1.1.1
            9 May 2019 at 4:40 pm

            Can't see the public falling for Jacinda for that extent of time. She will probably be still trying to deliver on policy, lol. It will be years before she (Neve) comes of age. Let alone whether or not she wants to follow down Jacinda's path. She might grow up and become a right winger, money wise she will be coming from that side of town. Perhaps she will be National’s succession plan lol.

  7. Reality 7
    9 May 2019 at 10:36 am

    Anne, so good to read your comment about the housing programme taking time to be implemented. If nothing more, at least the government will try to improve the number of houses built even if the original number hoped for does not happen. I really despair at the unrealistic, hyper-critical views of some commenters here. No matter what the topic, they chime in moaning and whining. Huge changes in any field take time. It is only 18 months since the change of government. It took National nine years to run things down. It could take nine years to fix things up.

    The moaning and whining here is really off-putting.

    • Rosemary McDonald 7.1
      9 May 2019 at 11:29 am

      Hmm….with all due respect, twas not us who shouted '100000 Kiwibuild houses in a decade!!!' and made a faux show of implementing that particular policy in a somewhat cynical ploy to secure the vote from muddle NuZild.

      Twas not us who promised loving kindness to all then told those at the very, very bottom….'just wait another five to ten years'.

      But it is us who remember that much if the misery some endure today was initiated and/or perpetuated by previous Labour governments.

      There was cautious optimism, and I believe a genuine willingness to forgive, if not forget Labour's history.

  8. greywarshark 8
    9 May 2019 at 10:51 am

    This blog must be losing credibility to a wide number. It seems to be dominated by RW and LW conservatives and obsessives . They argue abstruse points and fill the posts with their opinions which often combine to be totally unhelpful, impractical, ideological and impenetrable, and basically uncaring about people's and society's welfare. Therefore they have nothing hopeful and possibly efficacious to contribute. Yet they go on and revel in their poisonous vein. Does it drive people to despair; there seem to be less thinkers and strivers commenting here.

    • Peter Christchurh nz 8.1
      9 May 2019 at 11:06 am

      I would disagree, but with Ardern constantly pushing out puff pieces about baby, engagement and next thing a wedding, political discussion in the real world has also taken a dive towards Kardashian territory. Not good.

      So that is my contribution, and not as a rw conservative or a lw obsessive, but as a serious comment to something which is turning me away from this government.

      Ardern was brilliant in handling the ChCh crisis, but with 1.5 years to go, let's hope the budget offers something real, tangible and not puffery or more studies.

      • Anne 8.1.1
        9 May 2019 at 11:16 am

        For Christ's sake get your brain cells sorted. It's not her pushing out the puff pieces, it's the media. She's constantly trying to close them down on personal matters but just because she is not in the habit of being rude doesn't mean she is glorifying in it.

        Ignorance is bliss isn't it PCnz. Or are you just another troll?

        • Peter Christchurh nz 8.1.1.1
          9 May 2019 at 12:08 pm

          She poses for the photo shoots. You are an idiot Anne.

          • rod 8.1.1.1.1
            9 May 2019 at 4:42 pm

            John Key was the biggest poser this country has ever seen, and didn't the media and Natz love it.

            • Skunk Weed 8.1.1.1.1.1
              9 May 2019 at 5:10 pm

              Most New Zealanders fell in love with John Key – the most popular PM ever ?

        • Rapunzel 8.1.1.2
          9 May 2019 at 12:25 pm

          That is true and is evidenced months after the event it being reported that she told he MPs to retain some decorum and not make remarks regards the National Party/JLR that says everything that the hierachy of the National is not especially now, they will make gain of any scummy little thing they can latch.

          Two weeks ago it was targetted adverts on obituary pages, today it is supporters beside themselves with glee because an MP's relative has been charged with a crime – in fact a similar crime as befell another MPs family but which was treated with consideration when media reported that.

          That lack of core values and common decency is why they are not fit to be in government, until some of their voters apply some thought they are no better.

      • Psycho Milt 8.1.2
        9 May 2019 at 12:32 pm

        Funny how right-wingers only have a problem with media puff pieces when we have a female PM.

        • Anne 8.1.2.1
          9 May 2019 at 4:37 pm

          Yes. I can recall John and Bronagh – and kids – turning up in women's magazines on a near fortnightly basis. Since I never buy them it didn't bother me, except I used to see their faces on the front covers at the supermarket.

          Don't remember the local rwnjs getting hot and bothered about puff pieces then.

      • Herodotus 8.1.3
        9 May 2019 at 12:33 pm

        I would like to say re the mass murders in Chch our pm was faultless, and raised NZ’ s international profile/reputation. we hear how well NZ is doing (many indicators “ tell” us)

        But time marches on and in large individuals/families day to day issues/struggles remain as they were.😢.

        Both Key and Adern were to lead transformational change, but for me nothing really has changed, and if these 2 pm’s couldn’t make the changes what will a steady as he/she goes on do 😢

    • SPC 8.2
      9 May 2019 at 12:53 pm

      Stuff has limited comments, thus those National influencers (which can include inciting division amongst the left) have to make work elsewhere.

      However there is probably a little disillusion after the CGT decision and increasing awareness of the coalition budgetary constraints.

      The thing is that only if Labour is in the 2020 position to form coalitions with either Greens and NZF will Labour have the power to do more (Greens will move from the 30% GDP max spending committment and NZF never bought into it).

  9. Reality 9
    9 May 2019 at 11:20 am

    Peter Christchurch NZ – Please note it was not Jacinda who announced her engagement to the media. It was the media who asked about the ring and again at the post cabinet press stand up. And it is entirely her business to have her wedding to suit herself and Clarke whenever they choose. She is entitled to a personal life.

    What a "grumpy old uncle" you are to not enjoy some of these happy events in her life. It is what makes her the interesting and appealing person she is.

  10. Molly 10
    9 May 2019 at 11:58 am

    A documentary for all, (but most particularly Robert Guyton if he hasn't seen it yet):

    The Battle against Climate Change, featuring Paul Kingsnorth from Dark Mountain.

    • Robert Guyton 10.1
      9 May 2019 at 1:33 pm

      Thank you, Molly. I hadn't seen it but was familiar with every word. From 41:00 on, that's me smiley

  11. Prickles 11
    9 May 2019 at 12:26 pm

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/112544834/waimea-water-boss-pumped-to-be-part-of-legacy-dam-project

    But not a mention of the fact that in the construction of the road they have found substantial amounts of asbestos and that Work Safe have actually shut things down. Or that two ship loads of serpentenite that was sent to Taranaki were rejected because of the asbestos content.

    There is a Council meeting happening today – it will be very interesting to see how much of the bad news actually makes it as far as the media. They are certainly doing a good job currently of keeping this information under wraps.

    • Robert Guyton 11.1
      9 May 2019 at 1:38 pm

      Thanks, Prickles. I swam in the Lee when I was an elver. This is a dam disgrace.

    • Prickles 11.2
      9 May 2019 at 5:20 pm

      Oh dear – my apologies for not waiting for the full story.

      The serpentine rock was sent to Tauranga and not Taranaki. The second shipment was quarantined then sent back to the quarry Lee Valley – the same valley as they are planning to dam. It was the quarry that was closed by Work Safe – as was the store in Tauranga where the first shipment was taken.

      The serpentine is used to create fertiliser that the farmers use to put magnesium into the soil.

      Discussion was attempted at the TDC Council meeting today but was very quickly shut down by the mayor.

  12. A 12
    9 May 2019 at 3:30 pm

    Collins looks like the type to ask for someone's head so that it is Twyfords is unsurprising. * yawn *

    • Skunk Weed 12.1
      9 May 2019 at 4:51 pm

      Problem is the Banks are not lending as the Real Estate market in NZ is cooked ?

  13. Kevin 13
    9 May 2019 at 3:49 pm

    How dare the Venezuelan Government arrest those responsible for trying to overthrow it:

    "The dictatorship has kidnapped [Edgar Zambrano],” Juan Guaidó, the opposition leader who commanded that botched revolt, tweeted, attacking what he called political persecution typical of authoritarian regimes.

    Zambrano was on the scene on Tuesday last week when Guaidó tried unsuccessfully to spark a pre-dawn mutiny against Maduro outside an airforce base in the Venezuelan capital.

    On Wednesday night, Zambrano was detained by intelligence agents who transported him to Venezuela’s most notorious political prison, El Helicoide, inside his vehicle after he refused to get out."

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/09/venezuela-maduro-regime-has-kidnapped-national-assembly-vice-president-says-guaido

    • Skunk Weed 13.1
      9 May 2019 at 5:11 pm

      Most New Zealanders fell in love with John Key – the most popular PM ever ?

    • Skunk Weed 13.2
      9 May 2019 at 5:13 pm

      Lucky Juan Guaido has not been shot, however it might aggrevate the US as he is a US Puppet.

    • Morrissey 13.3
      9 May 2019 at 5:17 pm

      Wonder how long it would take to arrest a violent insurrectionist in Britain?

  14. A 14
    9 May 2019 at 3:58 pm

    Three Maori babies each week are taken from their families by Tamariki Ora. F***n disgusting. If this isn't profiling I dunno what is.

    • The Chairman 14.1
      9 May 2019 at 4:08 pm

      Has there been an investigation into this?

      An associate a while back said similar was happening in the UK, but it was the lower class overall that was shown to be targeted.

      Could targeting the lower class also be the case here too?

      • McFlock 14.1.1
        9 May 2019 at 4:51 pm

        What if it is? Keep walking that one through. If the focus is strictly on the"lower class overall", why do Maori have an uplift rate double that of "Other"?

        Then consider what you mean by "lower class", and the meanings bound up in that language choice.

        • The Chairman 14.1.1.1
          9 May 2019 at 5:13 pm

          Sorry, you lost me on your point.

          Maori make up a high number of NZ's lower class – i.e. the poor.

          • McFlock 14.1.1.1.1
            9 May 2019 at 5:22 pm

            So…

            google the term “structural racism” for a hint.

            • The Chairman 14.1.1.1.1.1
              9 May 2019 at 5:59 pm

              So you're saying it is racism and not classism?

              • McFlock …
                9 May 2019 at 6:05 pm

                Just how different do you think the two really can be when one ethnicity is so disproportionately represented in the target class? Do you think that over-representation happened by accident?

                • The Chairman …
                  9 May 2019 at 6:12 pm

                  I was just trying to establish whether or not it was classism or racism because as you acknowledged, one ethnicity is disproportionately represented.

                  Do you think that over-representation happened by accident?

                  Of course not.

  15. The Chairman 15
    9 May 2019 at 4:03 pm

    Dutch tourist board to stop advertising Netherlands as a destination

    The reason behind the move is simple: over-tourism.

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/travel/news/112578048/dutch-tourist-board-to-stop-advertising-netherlands-as-a-destination

  16. newsense 16
    9 May 2019 at 4:26 pm

    Collins-Dann at Morning Report? Rather a TV news type start

  17. Morrissey 17
    9 May 2019 at 5:08 pm

    The Gaza Ghetto Uprising

    by TONY GREENSTEIN, 6 May 2019

    If Israeli journalist Gideon Levy were in the British Labour Party he would be expelled for comparing Israel's actions to those of the Nazis….

    https://azvsas.blogspot.com/2019/05/the-gaza-ghetto-uprising.html

  18. Morrissey 18
    9 May 2019 at 5:19 pm

    The always excellent Larry David has no time for bullshit.

  19. Eco Maori 19
    10 May 2019 at 3:55 pm

    Whanau it's not just tangata whenua O Atoearoa that are suffering from colonialism syndrome all cultures that have been colonisaed have very similar PROBLEMS. I feel for OUR Native American cousins as they have it a lot harder than Maori

    This isn’t just a theory; it can be shown epigenetically. We suffer from some of the lowest life expectancies in the entire western hemisphere. The current average life expectancy for men born on Dakota reservations is 40 to 50 years of age, as compared to the US average for men of 76.1. According to the Indian Health Service’s Trends in Indian Health (2014), diabetes causes death in American Indians at a rate 177% greater than other Americans. As a nurse in the Indian Health Service (IHS) in New Mexico, I lost count of the incidents of amputation, dialysis, blindness and death I witnessed firsthand as a result of the disease; my mother died at age 69 from diabetes complications. Alcohol-related deaths occur at a rate 520% greater; chronic liver disease and cirrhosis 368% greater; tuberculosis 450% greater; pneumonia and influenza 37% greater; suicide 60% greater. And the list goes on.

    Yet, as a nurse academic who has attended national professional conferences for decades, I’ve come across few if any papers focused on American Indian health. There are only a handful of health professional schools in the United States that offer indigenous health courses. These are usually elective, rarely mandatory. There is a resounding silence in the medical world when it comes to all things American Indian. Structural blocks to Indian health persist through uninformed policy, inequitable funding, and lack of representation. Relevant legislation is barely existent, there is no Indian Affairs Committee on the House side, and Congress appropriates funding for the IHS

    Ka kite ano link below.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/may/09/trauma-lives-on-in-native-americans-while-the-us-looks-away

    https://youtu.be/FFAQBUCNEtg

  20. Eco Maori 20
    10 May 2019 at 6:25 pm

    Kia ora Newshub.

    The police will use anything to grab power that's what that is same as them wanting to hang guns on there hips it about power over the common person .

    I say it's about time a employer got jail for robbing there staff I have seen to many get away with ripping there staff off.

    There you go another child suffering from vegetables only diet that is why I say NZ farming just has to become organic not totally vegetarian the oil barron are using farming issues with climate change as a blind on the real issue of dumping carbon.

    That's cool find A Moa footprints found in NZ could be millions of years old

    Condolences to Malcolm Blacks whanau he has had a positive effect on Aotearoa music industry.

    Its good that some prison are going to have a Tangata Whenua O Atoearoa culture based in prison teach them our great culture Kia ora. Ka kite ano P.S I don't trust the justice system and coroners are part of that system.

  21. Eco Maori 21
    10 May 2019 at 6:46 pm

    Kia ora Te ao Maori News.

    It looked like a good tangi for Te Wharehuia Milroy today Tawhirirmate was having a tangi this morning to?.

    Its cool celebrating a War the west promoted with millions what about the NZ wars A O its embarrassing they could not have won any wars without tangata whenua help they also lost a few with their fancy superior weapons its not about the power its about the intelligence they underestimate tangata whenua.

    Ka kite ano

  22. Eco Maori 22
    11 May 2019 at 10:17 am

    Kia ora Newshub Nation.

    Its good that our government is using intelligent intervention with OUR high Maori jailbirds. They are going to have our corrections use Maori culture to lower the rate Maori end up back in jailbirds. It will help the careers of Maori understand there raurau and fix there Wairua.

    I agree with the minster our Maori Wahine prison rates are a sorry state all those Mokopuna with no Mothers is a big stuff up 60 % we need someone to champion this huge problem.

    Fedarated farms is a national blue outfit they will always have a negative attitude to our zero carbon goals. I say it is cool were are making changes to our carbon based Economy if national was still in power we would be like the aussies climate change DENIERS.

    21 century prosperity for all is needed EQUALITY is needed the Papatuanukue needs to become services based and not COMMODITY Based money will change to likes and dislike hits on your profile to.

    The way I see it is all the money flows to the 00.1 % WHY because of the WORLD’S JUSTICE SYSTEM are OWNED by the 00.1 % they can do what ever they want then they use there get out of jail FREE CARD money to by freedom hence the 00.1 % allways WIN in what ever they do RICH CHEATS ALLWAYS PROSPER is the correct saying they mold the laws to suit themselves first and formost.

    This is the Phenomenon that handed trump the White House that's a fact.

    I agree the weed law is one reason Maori have a high prison population there are other reasons.

    Ma te wa the Green Party will get the Mana to install laws that will punish organizers for not meeting their carbon reduction targets I say the Greens have achieved Alot have the targets and find ways to incentives the positive changes

    I agree a incentive base system to get everyone to dump carbon is the smart way to go use te carrot not the stick Kia ora.

  23. Eco Maori 23
    11 May 2019 at 11:44 am

    Some Eco Maori Music for the minute.

    https://youtu.be/oLoXFmJBvlk

  24. Eco Maori 24
    11 May 2019 at 2:22 pm

    We need to change the Papatuanukue culture to a culture that love and cares for OUR FUTURE and our Papatuanukue and her creations. To do that we must stop all the dumb stuff we are doing now. OUR obsession with growth is ruining the planet. A Green New Deal can save us

    We seem to be caught between parallel universes. You may have caught a glimpse of the first last week, when GDP was announced to have grown by 3.2% in the first quarter of 2019, a “blockbuster” result that the White House economic adviser Kevin Hassert told CNBC is “absolutely” sustainable in the coming months and years. With unemployment at its lowest levels since 1969, Democrats eyeing the 2020 elections are starting to worry the economy might even be too good, making it more difficult to beat Trump next year.

    How to fix capitalism: nine expert solutions for America's broken system

    Steven Pearlstein, Heidi Shierholz, James P Ziliak, Lane Kenworthy, Oren Cass, Robert Doar, Isabel Sawhill and Abigail Wozniak, Nell Abernathy, Darrick Hamilton and Julie Margetta Morgan

    The other universe made itself known on Monday, with the publication of a new report on global biodiversity from the UN Intergovernmental Science-Policy Platform on Biodiversity and Ecosystem Service (IPBES). Nature, researchers found, is in its worst shape in human history. As one scientist put it: “We are eroding the very foundations of economies, livelihoods, food security, health and quality of life worldwide.

    Properly designed, a Green New Deal could go a long way toward righting humanity’s relationship with the non-human nature around us. Beyond decarbonizing our economy, a federal job guarantee could put people to work through a federal job guarantee to restore wetlands and other endangered ecosystems, rewild our surroundings and care for the land, not unlike the Civilian Conservation Corps of the original New Deal. Investments in public transit, housing and leisure could create the conditions for not only a lower-carbon society but a less resource-intensive one, where people have more time to enjoy the outdoors instead of working 60-hour weeks just to pay rent and fill up their gas tanks.

    This new burst of activity is likely to grow the economy in the short term – what sociologist Daniel Aldana Cohen has called The Last Stimulus – but in the long term it’ll set us up to value real measures of human and ecological wellbeing over arbitrary metrics like GDP.

    Critics have smeared the Green New Deal as a colossal waste of money, involving a level of spending sure to crater the economy and pass an unnecessarily cruel financial burden down to future generations. They seem to be confusing it with business as usual

    Ka kite ano links below

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/may/10/green-new-deal-economy-ecology

    https://youtu.be/3xtf9QE-lME

  25. Eco Maori 25
    11 May 2019 at 2:29 pm

    Iprents it would be nice to have a bit of a warning about what I m doing wrong I have noticed a lot of positive changes because of the eco Maori effect the sandflys harassing me every were I got so of course I going to be pissed at the systems. Ka kite ano

  26. Eco Maori 26
    11 May 2019 at 2:58 pm

    It is awesome to finally see some positive news on OUR plastic waste problems. The reason we have ended up with this huge mess in our Tangaroa is because the ruling class have controlled our Papatuanukue media but not anymore with the 21st century commutation DEVICE.

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/may/10/nearly-all-the-worlds-countries-sign-plastic-waste-deal-except-us Ka kite ano

    https://youtu.be/_6xlNyWPpB8

  27. Eco Maori 27
    11 May 2019 at 4:26 pm

    Some Eco Maori Music for the minute.

    https://youtu.be/0TYMz3mmAKw

  28. Eco Maori 28
    11 May 2019 at 6:23 pm

    Kia ora Newshub.

    Condolences to Tua whanau he has entertain us for years.

    I see that and it gives Eco Maori a sore face new marine conservation reserves. Its just in time and just a start to protect Tangaroa and his creations the commercial fisherman will gain from the creation of marine reserves.

    MPI has a huge task in reigning in the bovine mycoplasma dease its huge its not going to be conducted to keep smiles on faces its going to save the industry. MPI have to know that to some people who have been farming all their lives treat their animals like their tamariki.???

    That gun fight on the highway show me what will happen if we had gun laws like America having the public and cops armed is only going to have more people shot.

    Ka kite ano

  29. Eco Maori 29
    11 May 2019 at 6:51 pm

    Kia ora Te ao Maori News.

    Kia ora to the tangata whenua protesters protesting the whenua that fletchers is trying to develop some people need to respect tangata whenua views on the loss of whenua – – – – -.

    Ka pai for celebrating Hecks houners he is our Waka building taonga and a tohunga looks like he has released a book to his Mana will lift all Maoridom Mana Wairua.

    I think tangata whenua should be aloud to farm trout we are still in the past on this issue .How well the elites is the only opinion that counts

    The tangata whenua business awards is a great positive phenomenon that should be shown ON all of Atoearoa media not just the negative stories plastered EVERYWHERE Eco has run a few business I will succeed in the near future Ma te wa.

    Its cool that Hukurangi tourism is get good publicity from Maori TV and telling the stories of te tairwhiti and our Maunga Hukurangi

    Ka kite ano

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