Open Mike 18/07/2018

Written By: - Date published: 5:53 am, July 18th, 2018 - 95 comments
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95 comments on “Open Mike 18/07/2018 ”

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  1. Sanctuary 1
    18 July 2018 at 6:31 am

    One observation about the Spouthern-Molyneux kerfuffle – what is with the absolute obsession of the middle class twitterati with this?

    They have all be strenuously trying to jaw jaw this into an issue with wider cut through, presumably because they have the time, income and social position to indulge in abstract obsessions about freedom of speech.

    But the only people outside twitter and a few blogs talking about this are the wing nut brigade ike Farrar, Slater and the newly minted, self-styled free speech coalition.

    Give it a rest already.

    • tc 1.1
      18 July 2018 at 7:02 am

      Manufacturing consent as per their remit being paid up puppets.

    • DH 1.2
      18 July 2018 at 9:20 am

      It doesn’t surprise me, Goff came across as a right little dictator and that would have really rarked up his ideological yangs. It’s always about power & status with that mob.

      Now they’re pissed because their case probably won’t go anywhere, they thought they had an opportunity to stick it to Goff and it’s slipping away from their grasp. What to do, do they press onwards with the potential of them being harrumphed or do they slink away quietly.

    • patricia bremner 1.3
      18 July 2018 at 11:20 am

      I see that Bob Jones is now writing for Whale oil, very suitable company.

  2. Sanctuary 2
    18 July 2018 at 7:09 am

    I recently got a twitter account to follow a few people and see what all the fuss is about.

    Anyone who takes that platform seriously is a moron who deserves everything they get.

    • DH 2.1
      18 July 2018 at 8:26 am

      “Anyone who takes that platform seriously is a moron who deserves everything they get.”

      Wouldn’t they be a twit?

    • Carolyn_Nth 2.2
      18 July 2018 at 10:09 am

      I prefer Twitter to other social media platforms. The Twitter experience all depends on who you follow.

      I also use tweedeck, which enables me to view various columns of my choice. Sometimes I open a hashtag column when there’s an interesting debate going on in real time using a #xxxx format.

      I follow some journos and news organisations, plus some individuals who tweet links to useful and interesting articles on topics of interest to me.

      Some twitter debates get highly polarised and are best avoided – e.g. I took a quick peek and rightwingers smear hashtag attacking Golriz Ghahraman‏ a couple of days ago, and quickly retreated. There’s no debating that kind of vicious targeting of a politician. Still on the same one note as always against GG, and the righties are so full of a virtue signalling sense of their own correctness and superiority.

      I block any commercial enterprise that tries to follow me purely for commercial reasons, and make selective use of the mute button for one or two tiresome tweeters.

      I don’t read all the tweets in my twitter stream, but it’s a useful source for news and other topic, and usually is a platform where breaking news first shows up.

      • Draco T Bastard 2.2.1
        18 July 2018 at 11:15 am

        About the same as what I do.

        I took a quick peek and rightwingers smear hashtag attacking Golriz Ghahraman‏ a couple of days ago, and quickly retreated. There’s no debating that kind of vicious targeting of a politician.

        Those people aren’t there to debate – they’re there to shout down anybody who doesn’t agree with them.

        …and the righties are so full of a virtue signalling sense of their own correctness and superiority.

        Yep. Completely and totally wrong but absolutely positive that they’re right.

        You simply cannot debate with people like that as their argument always starts and ends with I believe… and facts won’t change those beliefs.

      • greywarshark 2.2.2
        18 July 2018 at 4:28 pm

        Thanks Carolyn-Nth for the twitter cover. I feel the need to be more active with it and your views are helpful.

  3. Historian Pete 3
    18 July 2018 at 7:33 am

    Excerpts from “Return to Moscow”, a book recently written by Tony Kevin, a career Australian Diplomat ,who 48 years ago was posted to the Soviet Union at the height of the cold war.In 2016 he returned. What will he find? How has Russia changed since those grim days? He speaks Russian. He travels beyond the main cities to find out what is really going on. Here is his educated opinion.
    ” I had planned this book simply as a personal travel account , comparing impressions of Russia today with the Soviet Union of my memories.But somehow this book has grown into something more as well:a personal appeal against current locked in hostile Western mis-reading of contemporary Russian reality, and against the insensate Western drive to a new cold war with Russia.
    There is the reality that I saw, of the civilized country in which I enjoyed living for a month. And there is the alternative dark reality of “Putins Russia”, as presented across multiple Anglo- American media, in todays massive information war against Russia.Of these two sharply opposed realities, it is the latter which has firmly colonised Western minds- to the point that most of us no longer know that it has done so.
    There are deep historical undercurrents to the present widening East- West estrangement.. most importantly,Russia is angered by the West having broken the unwritten [ a written copy was discovered last year-my insertion ]Gorbachev-Bush Snr. agreement in Malta in 1991 in which Russia would accept reunification of Germany as a Nato member, if the West undertook not to expand NATO beyond East Germany towards Russia.That promise was set aside by NATO under successive U.S. Presidents Clinton , Bush and Obama.Now there are new members of NATO exercising troops on Russia’s borders, and the likelihood of an invitation to Georgia and Ukraine to join.
    Secondly is the widespread sense in Russia that Western powers used her “time of troubles” in1985-2000 to become heavily interventionist in Russian internal affairs.
    Thirdly, there is a historic anti-Russian sentiment or Russophobia, in the West going back centuries.
    Information warfare has become a major new arena of East-West tension.The fact is that Anglo-American media,now habitually blend together their news and editorial comment about Russia, framing every Russia news story within familiar anti -Putin themes.
    The constant Western pressure on” Putins Russia” today has resulted in Putins approval ratings among the Russian people leaping from 69% to 78%.It seems that Russians have the government that most of them want!
    Against this backdrop we see how the United States and the U.S. led Western alliance are trying to preserve their dominant positions by any available method, including economic sanctions,direct armed intervention,large scale information wars, and launching “colour revolutions.”
    In conclusion,it seems to me that the Western Alliance is now trapped inside its own falsely created alternative reality of “Putins Russia”.Except for a few lonely outliers like Stephen Cohen,Sakwa,Kissinger, the American Committee for East-West Accord, and wiser heads in the Wilson Centre and the affiliated Kennan Institute, the West’s elite thinking about Russia is frozen in hostile prejudice.”

    Read the book- it may cause the scales to fall from your eyes!!!

    • ianmac 3.1
      18 July 2018 at 9:52 am

      A Western leader gains from being able to point the finger at someone or some place. The plan is to unite the people behind the leader. Putin is such a focus for floundering May.

    • Anne 3.2
      18 July 2018 at 9:59 am

      Interesting comments Historian Pete and I’m sure there’s a lot of truth to it.

      Tony Kevin, a career Australian Diplomat ,who 48 years ago was posted to the Soviet Union at the height of the cold war. In 2016 he returned. What will he find? How has Russia changed since those grim days? He speaks Russian. He travels beyond the main cities to find out what is really going on.

      My late father did the same. In the early 1920s he was part of a group of British Army personnel who were sent to Archangel to rescue a group of high ranking Russians. It was a year long exercise and he traveled to other parts of Russia in the process. In the mid 1970s he returned as a tourist to see what had changed and he also spoke a smattering of Russian. For his efforts, when he returned to NZ he was subjected to surveillance and harassment for some time afterwards. The interesting thing is: it was probably ASIS not NZSIS who were behind it. Another interesting story.

      Not withstanding the current comic book antics of the incumbent US president, it seems the West (read America in particular) can’t overcome their paranoia over Russia.

      • Carolyn_Nth 3.2.1
        18 July 2018 at 10:20 am

        I don’t like the polarised cold war style of anti-Russia propaganda. But I don’t have a very positive view of the dominant authoritarian or rightward leaning politicians and elites in the US, UK or Russia.

        Trump respects or even bows to other aggressively dominant and authoritarian males – he measures himself against them – including Putin. And Trump has a pretty dismissive and sometimes highly misogynistic attitude to women, especially any woman with power or status. Both Trump and Putin are authoritarian, and I think both don’t care that much about the lowest income, least powerful, and minority sections of their countries.

        Obama was nicer and had some better policies, but he was still incorporated into the divisive, militaristic imperial US system.

        The majority in a country are not always correct or commendable, especially when it comes to treatment of minorities and those with relatively little power.

        • Anne 3.2.1.1
          18 July 2018 at 10:47 am

          Don’t get me wrong Carolyn_Nth. I have about as much regard for Putin as I have for Trump which is zero. My comments were more general than the leaders and based on the overall perceptions each seem to have for the other.

    • weston 3.3
      18 July 2018 at 6:42 pm

      actually in my experience online communities at least are overwhelmingly anti american and as far as us natives go only the particularly brainwashed ones swallow the official narrative although having said that within that deeply polarized nation that would mean an awful lot of cognitive dissonance !!Ditto uk communities loath despise and mistrust their representatives . Take a look at any recent interview with lavrov the russian foreign minister for example and read the comments .

  4. Hooch 4
    18 July 2018 at 7:41 am

    Obama has given a speech decrying leaders who are caught lying and “just double down and lie some more.”

    Yet he’s best buddies with key.

  5. marty mars 5
    18 July 2018 at 8:51 am

    All sorted, the demented tangerine dummy ‘mispoke’ – lol run Donald run

    https://i.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/105562371/trump-says-he-misspoke-on-russian-meddling

    That slam dunks all the peace in our time pushers.

    • Robert Guyton 5.1
      18 July 2018 at 9:29 am

      Testing the water with poisonous crap to see if people will still swallow it – as Key did here; trial runs.

      “To grasp what is going on in the world right now, we need to reflect on two things. One is that we are in a phase of trial runs. The other is that what is being trialled is fascism – a word that should be used carefully but not shirked when it is so clearly on the horizon. Forget “post-fascist” – what we are living with is pre-fascism.

      It is easy to dismiss Donald Trump as an ignoramus, not least because he is. But he has an acute understanding of one thing: test marketing. He created himself in the gossip pages of the New York tabloids, where celebrity is manufactured by planting outrageous stories that you can later confirm or deny depending on how they go down. And he recreated himself in reality TV where the storylines can be adjusted according to the ratings. Put something out there, pull it back, adjust, go again.

      Fascism doesn’t arise suddenly in an existing democracy. It is not easy to get people to give up their ideas of freedom and civility. You have to do trial runs that, if they are done well, serve two purposes. They get people used to something they may initially recoil from; and they allow you to refine and calibrate. This is what is happening now and we would be fools not to see it.”

      • ianmac 5.1.1
        18 July 2018 at 9:57 am

        Probably right Robert. Why else would our governments over the years “leak” an idea? Confirm if well received or Deny if goes sour. And Key refined the deniability to a amazing degree. Contrast that with Jacinda’s straight shooting.

        • Robert Guyton 5.1.1.1
          18 July 2018 at 10:10 am

          When Key called the Labour Party “The Devil Beast” in the House I thought, “He’s just pushing the envelope to see how far he can go with previously un-sayable things” and was doing it not from his own desire to know, but for someone else.
          I reckoned.

      • Draco T Bastard 5.1.2
        18 July 2018 at 12:04 pm

        Forget “post-fascist” – what we are living with is pre-fascism.

        Otherwise known as corporatism. It is the inevitable end result of a capitalist society.

        Fascism doesn’t arise suddenly in an existing democracy. It is not easy to get people to give up their ideas of freedom and civility. You have to do trial runs that, if they are done well, serve two purposes. They get people used to something they may initially recoil from; and they allow you to refine and calibrate. This is what is happening now and we would be fools not to see it.”

        QFT

      • patricia bremner 5.1.3
        18 July 2018 at 2:32 pm

        Robert, I believe this is a tactic. One right wing personality or journalist will begin a meme and the others”pass the parcel”.

        If the left respond “It must be true”. If the left ignore it they slightly change it and begin again!!

    • veutoviper 5.2
      18 July 2018 at 10:16 am

      Unbelievable! Does he really think he can get away with that … probably.

      Ps – sorry for lack of reply to yours the other day. Have managed to get myself highly involved (by accident) in coordinating resolution of a local neighbourhood issue, which has become very time consuming. Glad to hear that things are going well. Kia kaha

      • cleangreen 5.2.1
        18 July 2018 at 2:43 pm

        Wow Grenwald support for trump; good for him.

        Try the other side of the story folks.

        While watching Fox at 2.30pm today and Glenn Greenwald is supporting President Trump as a lone voice in an ‘Anti Russia be-partision hate campiagn’ against Russia at the whitehouse scene today.

        So the interview was between Laura Ingraham on her show, “The “Ingraham angle”

        The hawks are out wanting another war the bloody fools, wanting more blood shed.

    • mauī 5.3
      18 July 2018 at 10:51 am

      I think it’s quite a clever move, he seems to be playing to two different audiences. It’s a pity CV isn’t here to explain. Instead the depth of analysis we’re getting from too many on the left is ridicule and outrage.

      What I fear is that while the hilarity and anger rages on, Trump will have shifted things away from a neoliberal world order and the left will end up chasing shadows on the sidelines. Locked out from substantial power.

      • marty mars 5.3.1
        18 July 2018 at 11:13 am

        It shows he is morally bankrupt, a liar, a coward, and an abuser of the gift of the presidency. How anyone can turn the pile of shit into a positive spin is beyond my understanding but those that do that are not left, not even close. CV wasn’t left proudly, and a lot here profess some new made up political position – good. I AM a leftie and PROUD of that heritage and position and I’m glad fake lefties are disowning the ‘left’ label.

        • cleangreen 5.3.1.1
          18 July 2018 at 2:22 pm

          Marty; Are you ‘proudly’ holding onto that ‘Right wing” banner?

          Give iit a break; – See Obama in his South African speecxh now trying to look llike an leftie, which he was not.

          He said “I am not rich as many are” What a bloody liar as he is selling his speeches for $2 million dollars US a pop, he always was and now is a corporate stool pidgeon..

          • McFlock 5.3.1.1.1
            18 July 2018 at 3:15 pm

            Funnily enough, he didn’t say that in his Mandela speech. Full text here.

            But the passage I think most closely fits your fantasy(my italics):

            And Madiba understood this. This is not new. He warned us about this. He said: “Where globalization means, as it so often does, that the rich and the powerful now have new means to further enrich and empower themselves at the cost of the poorer and the weaker, [then] we have a responsibility to protest in the name of universal freedom.” That’s what he said. (Applause.) So if we are serious about universal freedom today, if we care about social justice today, then we have a responsibility to do something about it. And I would respectfully amend what Madiba said. I don’t do it often, but I’d say it’s not enough for us to protest; we’re going to have to build, we’re going to have to innovate, we’re going to have to figure out how do we close this widening chasm of wealth and opportunity both within countries and between them. (Applause.)
            And how we achieve this is going to vary country to country, and I know your new president is committed to rolling up his sleeves and trying to do so. But we can learn from the last 70 years that it will not involve unregulated, unbridled, unethical capitalism. It also won’t involve old-style command-and-control socialism form the top. That was tried; it didn’t work very well. For almost all countries, progress is going to depend on an inclusive market-based system — one that offers education for every child; that protects collective bargaining and secures the rights of every worker — (applause) — that breaks up monopolies to encourage competition in small and medium-sized businesses; and has laws that root out corruption and ensures fair dealing in business; that maintains some form of progressive taxation so that rich people are still rich but they’re giving a little bit back to make sure that everybody else has something to pay for universal health care and retirement security, and invests in infrastructure and scientific research that builds platforms for innovation.
            I should add, by the way, right now I’m actually surprised by how much money I got, and let me tell you something: I don’t have half as much as most of these folks or a tenth or a hundredth. There’s only so much you can eat. There’s only so big a house you can have. (Cheers and applause.) There’s only so many nice trips you can take. I mean, it’s enough. (Laughter.) You don’t have to take a vow of poverty just to say, “Well, let me help out and let a few of the other folks — let me look at that child out there who doesn’t have enough to eat or needs some school fees, let me help him out. I’ll pay a little more in taxes. It’s okay. I can afford it.” (Cheers and applause.) I mean, it shows a poverty of ambition to just want to take more and more and more, instead of saying, “Wow, I’ve got so much. Who can I help? How can I give more and more and more?” (Cheers and applause.) That’s ambition. That’s impact. That’s influence. What an amazing gift to be able to help people, not just yourself. (Applause.) Where was I? I ad-libbed. (Laughter.) You get the point.

            Who’s the liar?

      • Andre 5.3.2
        18 July 2018 at 2:40 pm

        Since you appear to be feeling somewhat bereft – here’s the 37-dimensional chessmaster explanation CV would have given us. Hope it makes you feel better.

        https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/trump-putin-theory-mike-rounds_us_5b4e49e7e4b0de86f4879ecd

      • Bill 5.3.3
        18 July 2018 at 3:19 pm

        When there are two peas in a pod, what possible tack can one take with regards the other, bar some vacuous bullshit about what a terribly awful pea the other is, in the hope of becoming the next preferred pea…while – understandably given some “my turn next” mentality – consistently voting in favour of extra powers for the currently favoured pea? 😉

  6. Rosemary McDonald 6
    18 July 2018 at 9:09 am

    Yet again an intrepid reporter from the NZ print media produces an article which attempts to describe the lives of disabled New Zealanders.

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/105423637/disabled-wellington-man-spirals-into-poverty-depression-after-acc-axes-support

    Yet again, in order to try and garner just a tiny little bit of genuine engagement and concern, an affected person allows the cameras to invade their already fragile space… gathering the remnants of their dignity and laying bare their suffering.

    Yet again, there will be a flurry of comments declaring outrage and support.

    Yet again, nothing will change.

    This is yet another decent piece of work on this issue and it deserves respectful reading and listening.

    It includes comments from one of our better disability advocates, Dr Woodbury, and from an author of one of the many, many pieces of research that accurately describes the situation for many in the disability community.

    So when this Gummint announces that it will ‘look into these issues’…that shouldn’t take more than a few hours as the work has already been done. (I have Sarah Derrett’s work plus the work of others on my hard drive if that helps???)

    The much trumpeted System Transformation is so much SSDD that I could weep for the waste of time and precious resources.

    And sadly, tragically, since Catherine Delahunty left the House there isn’t a single sitting MP who gives a shit.

    • SaveNZ 6.1
      18 July 2018 at 9:48 am

      Lets hope to get Catherine Delahunty, back into parliament.

    • The Chairman 6.2
      18 July 2018 at 10:22 am

      While Labour acknowledges the discrepancy in support was unfair, their Budget Responsibility Rules has left them fiscally constrained to correct little more than National. As the nurses dispute, further double-bunking and lack of funding for cochlear implants have widely highlighted.

      • Rosemary McDonald 6.2.1
        18 July 2018 at 10:51 am

        TC.

        One day, when I have absolutely nothing better to do with my time and attention, I just might try to quantify how much of the Disability Budget…both ACC and MOH…is spent on devising new and even more sociopathic methods of preventing the $$$ from being allocated to the person who needs the support.

        This is not about lack of $$$. It is about how the $$$ are spent. Family carers were told way back in 2012 that if we demanded to be paid for the care we provide (that the Appeal Court determined it was a breach of the Human Rights Act not to pay us) then there would be no $$$ left for wheelchairs for disabled children. This was complete and utter bullshit, and typical bullying from the Ministry of Health.

        Hopefully, you and others here have no idea of the hoops the cripples have to jump through and the mazes those who struggle with simple everyday tasks are expected to negotiate before some petty-minded megalomaniacal bureaucrat concedes to pry open the coffers and part with some brass to fund for supports.

        You’d swear it was their own personal money that they were parting with.

        And when I think about it….so much of the work is contracted out it is very possible that bonuses accrue if allocations are restricted.

        I sympathize with the nurses…I really do…but having to be with my partner 24/7 should he be unfortunate enough to require hospitalisation because the nurses refuse to perform what to them are invasive procedures but to us are routine daily cares leaves me feeling just ever so slightly hard done by.

        But this is our lives. Every day.

        The Disability Support System in New Zealand is a shambles, no amount of tweaking will fix it.

        Twenty years of crap management in a system was set up to keep people from the supports they need.

        And we have yet another Government who simply doesn’t give a shit.

        • SaveNZ 6.2.1.1
          18 July 2018 at 11:25 am

          @Rosemary +1000

          “This is not about lack of $$$. It is about how the $$$ are spent.”

          I think this should be looked at throughout many of the government’s problems from housing to disability. It’s where the money is going and how much of it is NOT getting to source the actual recipients or solve the problems in the fastest and cheapest way, but instead feeding a bloated system that acts against effective end results.

          For example, millions being pumped into new housing and giving away public prime land while vulnerable people have been evicted and housing NZ should be hiring teams of people to fix up the guttering and upgrade existing housing of all their state houses from day 1 the Labour government got into office.

          Instead say, 19 million is allocated to build 12 apartments for temporary housing. The majority of the money going to private construction not solving the poor state house repair, situation and the vulnerable people who live there including children in poverty.

          That helps 12 people temporarily, what about the majority of state housing that could easily be upgraded at a fraction of the cost, aka what they expect the private sector to do, but seem reluctant to start on mass themselves?

        • cleangreen 6.2.1.2
          18 July 2018 at 2:28 pm

          Rosemary said; – “The Disability Support System in New Zealand is a shambles,”

          Yes you are 100% correct there as a disabled person this agency has given me very little assistance in 18 years so I am left to ‘fend for myself’ still today.

          We need a compassionaste leader to give proper services to the disabled quickly.

          • Rosemary McDonald 6.2.1.2.1
            18 July 2018 at 2:47 pm

            With all due respects cleangreen…what disabled NZers need, especially those not covered by ACC, are rights and entitlements. Enshrined in law.

            Then it wouldn’t matter what numpty leader we were blighted with.

            My partner and I do the fend for ourselves thing too. Our NASC has ascended to heights of incompetency that have been literally breathtaking.

            Much safer to stay out of their way.

        • The Chairman 6.2.1.3
          19 July 2018 at 6:36 am

          The self imposed fiscal constraint limits funding, thus how much can be spent. How it is spent is largely up to the Government and its overseeing departments.

          The lack of funding further adds to the human rights breaching, penny pinching complexities faced by those attaining it. Laying ground for a culture of disentitlement as staff are encouraged to cut back.

    • AsleepWhileWalking 6.3
      18 July 2018 at 11:20 am

      Sepuloni is focusing on housing for disabled. And other stuff (ODI ezine/newsletter)/

      That’s one MP,I hope…time will tell.

      “I just might try to quantify how much of the Disability Budget…both ACC and MOH…is spent on devising new and even more sociopathic methods of preventing the $$$ from being allocated to the person who needs the support.” – the amount seems to increase by a few million every couple of years imho

      • Rosemary McDonald 6.3.1
        18 July 2018 at 12:13 pm

        Sepuloni has the unenviable portfolio of Minister for Disability Issues.

        The ODI is window dressing. Expensive PR to present the image that the government of the day is actually doing something to improve the lives of disabled Kiwis.

        https://www.odi.govt.nz/about-us/our-minister/

        It seeks input and opinion from Disabled Peoples’ Organizations (DPO) as part of its charter and calls this consultation. It actuality those DPOs are dependent on government funding. They play by the rules and are slow challenge the status quo.

        Those of us not representatives of these organsations were effectively excluded from regional discussion on revising the Disability Strategy. I asked the

        Thee is no kudos in being the Minster for Disability Issues….look at the previous incumbents….Nicky Wagner, Tariana Turia….

  7. dV 7
    18 July 2018 at 9:36 am

    NAH You’ve all got it wrong

    Free speech,
    they mean they WANTED the VENUE to be FREE!!!!

  8. SaveNZ 8
    18 July 2018 at 10:05 am

    Councils waving through non compliant resource consents making up 20% of regional and 14% of council consents… when non compliant now means compliant… When No means yes… anything goes…

    “National Monitoring System data shows that 14 per cent of resource consents monitored by all councils in 2015/16 were non-compliant. This figure was 20 per cent for regional councils.”

    Time for MAJOR stop of the wrecking of our environment and resources for private profit and actually STOPPING bad and unfair resource consents from even going through in the first place, before they become non compliant and cost a fortune in monitoring and legal costs to the ratepayers as well as the social and environmental costs!

    Wonder how many consents were cancelled after this was found, my guess, zero.

    http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA1807/S00141/new-guidelines-to-assist-rma-compliance.htm

    • Gosman 8.1
      18 July 2018 at 11:51 am

      And then housing affordability will get worse.

      • Draco T Bastard 8.1.1
        18 July 2018 at 12:09 pm

        Having non-compliant buildings will cost more.

        But you do understand that what you’re actually saying is that the profit motive doesn’t work right? It obviously has the wrong incentives built in.

        • Gosman 8.1.1.1
          18 July 2018 at 1:04 pm

          If you think enforcing or making regulations harder to get through will not lead to a reduced building activity you are in disagreement with numerous people involved in the building industry. Talk to someone from that sector. Gaining resource consent is a big factor in their job.

          • Draco T Bastard 8.1.1.1.1
            18 July 2018 at 1:21 pm

            If you think enforcing or making regulations harder to get through will not lead to a reduced building activity you are in disagreement with numerous people involved in the building industry.

            Which just proves, yet again, that the profit motive is not fit for purpose.

            Gaining resource consent is a big factor in their job.

            It’s a part of their job that they don’t get to complain about.

            • Gosman 8.1.1.1.1.1
              18 July 2018 at 2:13 pm

              Ummm… if regulations are causing problems for business they DO get to complain about it. Indeed they should be actively encouraged to compleain about it otherwise government will start to think they can regulate anything they want without push back.

              • Tricledrown …
                18 July 2018 at 2:24 pm

                So not having regulations Gooseman work’s really well Pike River SCF leakey buildings bio security under funding

                Gooseman give up the Deranged Dogma you push back to Dickensian days.
                Which if you lived then you would have no say no education not that the education you have seems to have narrowed your view’s.
                Being a narrow minded fool can’t be easy to keep up appearances as you have proved yourself wrong in excess of 90%.
                Keep barking at wheels if that floats your boat.
                Gossipboy!

                • Gosman …
                  18 July 2018 at 2:34 pm

                  I have no problems with regulations. I am just not foolish enough to think increasing regulations around building has no flow on effect on the rate of building that will occur. Given the most significant issue facing the country is housing affordability (unless you don’t believe there is a housing crisis) I would suggest anything that restricts more houses being built is not ideal.

                  • Crashcart …
                    18 July 2018 at 3:08 pm

                    Surely you understand that it is a balance. What others are saying is that if regulation were decreased then yes the initial cost of building those homes would go down. However the cost of another leaky building fiasco would far exceed any savings. All it does is increase the profit made by private sector and shift the cost to this public.

                    If builders could prove that reduction in regulation didn’t result in the cutting of corners then I would be all for reducing it. The fact that so many projects are not up to code shows that it would only be worse if they didn’t have to meet those standards.

                    This is where DTB’s argument comes from I believe. For a housing market to operate successfully on a profit motive it appears that it has to be done in such a way that the public wears the cost. This is clearly not a healthy market.

              • Draco T Bastard …
                18 July 2018 at 9:28 pm

                We need regulations else the fuckwit business people go off and do whatever they want and there’s no accountability for their fuckups.

                So, no, the businesses do NOT get to complain about regulations because those regulations are there to stop them from screwing everybody else over.

          • SaveNZ 8.1.1.1.2
            18 July 2018 at 1:30 pm

            Yes numerous people in the building industry are not trying to increase their profits… but actually giving wonderful independent advice (sarcasm).

            The government listening to industry and pandering to their every deregulation and low wage employment whim, must mean that is why we now have a major housing crisis shortages as well as affordability and not meeting building standards and needing constant remedial work and people don’t want to work in that industry full of cowboys and exploitation…

            • Gosman 8.1.1.1.2.1
              18 July 2018 at 2:31 pm

              Yet to meet the target of 100,000 additional houses over and above the current build rate in the next 10 years YOU require the same industry to massively expand.

              • Blazer …
                18 July 2018 at 9:39 pm

                33,000 empty houses in Aukland…all being renovated ..and other assorted excuses..houses are for people to live in…theres a
                1/3rd of ‘supply..right there.

      • SaveNZ 8.1.2
        18 July 2018 at 12:11 pm

        How is renovating state housing to an acceptable standard making affordability worse?

        Since the government started to ‘solve’ affordability by bringing in 500,000+ low wage workers under the Natz, to solve the crisis, that could be what’s keeping the problems going while increasing conditions for private landlords to rent houses while seemingly removing as many vulnerable people out of state housing so they can be developed into ahem ‘affordable housing’ for $120k – $180k earners and then private housing to be sold off?

        Prior to the interest in ‘affordable’ housing by government and only about 4 years ago there actually used to be $200k apartments and $350k family homes in Auckland, now suddenly with the right wing strategies that make no sense but taken up by the Blairites in Labour as gospel…affordability has never been worse!

        • SaveNZ 8.1.2.1
          18 July 2018 at 12:49 pm

          And the $200k one bedroom apartment from 4 years ago, used to be in the CBD not $500k with free land from government and free money for private construction to create the sold off “affordable” one bedroom, a much greater distance away from the centre and travels costs to be added now being the new affordable!

          If you want affordable then legislate a certain amount of housing aka 10% per apartment build has to be developed to be under a certain price and available to people who live and work in the city and a percentage available to the state to buy for vulnerable people to live in the city.

      • Tricledrown 8.1.3
        18 July 2018 at 12:36 pm

        Like the developments in Auckland which will need demolishing because they were built with out consent with one developer discharging raw sewage into a stream.
        Leaky schools hospitals homes cost $35 billion plus due to building deregulation 1991.
        Yeah Gooseman.

  9. SaveNZ 9
    18 July 2018 at 10:22 am

    Some questionable consents granted or about to be….

    New seabed mining project threatens endangered species
    http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PO1807/S00150/new-seabed-mining-project-threatens-endangered-species.htm

    Kaipara Community Association Fights Tegel Foods 9 Million Bird Factory Farm
    https://givealittle.co.nz/cause/kaipara-community-fights-tegel-foods-9-million

    “Marama Davidson, Betty Shine, and Professor Margaret Mutu discussing the weak legislation that allows foreign buyers and business models such as Tegel are proposing to take advantage while locals bear the costs financially, culturally, socially and environmentally.”

    https://www.facebook.com/pg/Dargaville-Chicken-Farm-Community-Information-Group-1558525184261906/posts/

    Even going past all the major social and environmental effects on locals including a Marae so a multinational can profit further, taking the chickens from Dargaville to Auckland on a regular basis is adding to congestion of Auckland!! Practically every day there is another truck crash blocking traffic into Auckland.

    ACC should also do statistics on how many people are being injured via Truck accidents in particular in Auckland because it is increasing and the hospitals and police and victims are having to pick up the pieces after these accidents.

    Trucks of course they can fill up in Dargaville and avoid the fuel tax that the Aucklander’s have to pay for…

    When are resource consents going to stop the practise of adding to truck congestion into Auckland via bad consenting practises?

    • Gosman 9.1
      18 July 2018 at 11:53 am

      Unemployment in Northland is high. If you get rid of these businesses do you have any suggestion what the people employed in them will do?

      • Draco T Bastard 9.1.1
        18 July 2018 at 12:11 pm

        I’d really prefer them to sit on their arse and do nothing than continue to destroy the environment.

        But, isn’t finding something else to do without government intervention what the free-market’s all about?

      • SaveNZ 9.1.2
        18 July 2018 at 12:17 pm

        Actually develop tourism and sustainable industries there, not destroy the towns and communities and Maraes and the heart of the community with short term, high negative impact and smelly industry that will mean they can’t develop other venture (aka tourism) there, and actually starts to gut the town when people leave due to the smell and lack of opportunities there.

      • Tricledrown 9.1.3
        18 July 2018 at 12:42 pm

        So businesses who are affected by one industry which destroy’s their income because of the pollution and environmental damage have a right to Deny consent
        Like wise Gooseman you wouldn’t want a chicken farm in your back yard.
        Even though birds of a feather Flock together.

      • SaveNZ 9.1.4
        18 July 2018 at 12:58 pm

        Hopefully the unemployed can break into the chicken factory and make sure that the so called ‘free range’ is not pulling the wool over consumers eyes like the fake free range of a few years ago and have decent humane animal standards.

        Makes more sense to me, to put these factories in the middle of nowhere and prove no odour is going off the farm (aka by buying enough land to contain the odour or other measures) and have the processing nearby (not Auckland), away from people and towns, not on the edge of one, destroying the town which stench, noise and ugly buildings and trucks going in and out, in particular is going to do.

        The problem with big farms as well, is if something goes wrong then it multiplies. Aka if the chickens get a disease much greater impact than smaller farms spread around, or if the power goes off there are massive deaths of chickens to burn etc. As well as food shortages from having all the eggs in one basket when things go wrong.

        They can not predict what might happen with that amount of birds in one place.

      • Tricledrown 9.1.5
        18 July 2018 at 2:32 pm

        Blindly following all business must be good.
        Is a really dumb idea asbestos mining in Australia was an example no profit govt subsidies.
        Then the govt has to pick up the bill for asbestosis sufferers.
        James Hardie has been given the all clear to start a silica mine in NZ.
        Silica is just as dangerous as asbestos.
        Who allowed this.

  10. gsays 10
    18 July 2018 at 10:35 am

    I have been highly aware of ‘single use’ plastic.
    I work in hospitality and the industry is riddled with single use plastic.

    Vege crates lined with a big blue bag, the spinach in plastic bags.
    The box in the freezer with gluten free pizza bases, in a plastic bag with plastic sheets between each base.

    We put some meats into vacuum pack bags and then sous vide the fold.
    (Cook at a lower temperature in a water bath).
    This is a quite heavy wall plastic that will take ages longer than a supermarket bag to break down.

    Other food preparations get vac packed and stored for longer shelf life e.g. onion jam, beetroot chutney, fish.

    My point is, for sure phase out, (why not banish next month, week or tomorrow) supermarket bags.
    However it is barely scratching the surface of the issue, and what is worse, the sacrifice the middle class thinks it is making.

    Like so many consequences of unfettered free market capitalism, it will take radical actions to correct the ‘right course’ we are on.

    • SaveNZ 10.1
      18 July 2018 at 10:44 am

      The government need to just ban plastic for packaging or ensure it is only biodegradable within 6 months and tax it. We used to have paper bags and time to return to them.

      Funny how government can put in plenty of new taxes for people aka fuel tax, but nothing against business destroying the planet… the only weak thing is to ask people (again just the people not the business) to pay for the bag which is not really banning the plastic or stopping the business using it.

      Plastic is now reaching Antartica, time to act at source, the business themselves.

      Like e waste, maybe just make the manufacturers responsible for recycling it and ensuring it can not enter the ocean, as a starting point before a ban.

    • cleangreen 10.2
      18 July 2018 at 2:54 pm

      gsays

      well said but when you drive your car don’t forget that tyres are made from plastic too!!!

      So tyre dust is being spread all around the roads and into our watwer as we drive.

      https://portals.iucn.org/library/sites/library/files/documents/2017-002.pdf
      quote;

      3. Tyres: abrasion while driving
      Tyres get eroded when used. The particles are formed from the outer parts of the tyre and
      consist of a matrix of synthetic polymers, namely Styrene Butadiene Rubber (approximately
      60%), in a mix with natural rubber and many other additives (Sundt et al., 2014). Tyre dust
      will then either be spread by the wind or washed off the road by rain. In this study, losses of
      synthetic rubber are considered but losses of natural rubber are not.
      There is no reliable information on the transfer of microplastics from tyres to the world’s oceans. Both
      Norwegian and Swedish researchers have pointed out that a large fraction of particles found in the sea
      seem to originate from car tyres (Essel et al., 2015; Sundt et al., 2014).

  11. SaveNZ 11
    18 July 2018 at 10:39 am

    Auckland council just approved this one, consent to remove 23,000 cubic metres of sand a year for 35 years trucks going 5 truck and trailer movements per day between Kaukaupaka and Penrose which is a crazy distance across very congested traffic and along country roads with no footpaths and kids walking it.

    I guess risk and safety does not come into it under our Rogernomics RMA, when competing against supplying ex asbestos player multinationals private profits…

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/auckland/local-news/nor-west-news/104973877/silica-sand-quarry-given-green-light-much-to-residents-dismay

    • Draco T Bastard 11.1
      18 July 2018 at 12:17 pm

      According to the resource consent, all truck operators were to travel at a 30km speed within the site, and 50km on any unsealed sections of McLachlan Rd.

      That road’s going to ruined in no time. Wonder if the council took into account the costs of continuous repair for it.

      • SaveNZ 11.1.1
        18 July 2018 at 12:19 pm

        When the public can pay to prop up multinational industry, who cares Draco, about the costs of the road repairs!

        • cleangreen 11.1.1.1
          18 July 2018 at 3:49 pm

          SaveNZ. you asked; Who cares about the costs of the road repairs!

          I can add;
          All taxpayers do I asume as they pay in registration and fuel taxes as wellas subsidsing the truck freight industry as they only pay half (54%) of their wear caused; – while every car user pays 66% of their wear according to the IPENZ reports.

          Truck freight should pay their full share and assist the upgrades of the roads to overseas standards to carry those heavier trucks that NZTA has allowed to increase ‘weight and dimension’ size, once in every three years in the last 12 yrs.

    • greywarshark 11.2
      18 July 2018 at 4:56 pm

      Sand removal, (to where? for what? and how does that prepare the coastline for sea level rise and storm and tide disasters). And what is this business about 35 years that permits get issued for? I have read this figure before I think referring to irrigation or water extraction contracts.

      The right wing in government like to preach about paying up front for things so that future generations don’t have to carry the excesses of the present blah blah. Yet they like to sequester resources that will be needed for future generations, if they can survive… to 2025 etc.

  12. marty mars 12
    18 July 2018 at 10:54 am

    Good article – song cool although I’m not really a metal fan – worth it to hear racist icon don.b.ash expose how utterly pathetic he is.

    https://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/nat-music/audio/2018653960/alien-weaponry-s-new-video-features-controversial-comments-made-by-don-brash

    • Carolyn_Nth 12.1
      18 July 2018 at 11:10 am

      Agree. I had to read the lyrics because I couldn’t make out the words with all that thrash metal noise. The visuals for the video are excellent.

      The government’s words
      Are like whispers in our ears
      Telling us lies
      To hide away our fears

      Hikoi taku tai moana te take ō te wā
      The foreshore and seabed (protest) march the issue of the day
      …
      He tiriti nā Amerika, John Key te waha mōkai
      The agreement from America, John Key the puppet mouthpiece
      Ehara i te koha, TPPA he tūtae
      This is no gift, the TPPA is a turd
      He hui toropuku, he kōrero huna
      Secret meetings, hidden words
      Nga iwi Māori awere, te Tiriti takahia
      Māori interests excluded, the Treaty (of Waitangi) disregarded

  13. Rosemary McDonald 13
    18 July 2018 at 11:09 am

    Please, tell me this isn’t so….

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/105432129/labour-brings-in-gender-intelligence-consultants

    That these people are telling Labour how to present to the public….https://www.doubledenim.nz/who-we-are

    ….because goodness, gracious me….if I were a financial supporter of the Labour Party I’d be mightily pissed off.

    “Not everyone can turn online buzz into real-world results, and vice versa. These two can by knowing how to make the right noise with the right people. They’re in the business of making corporate cool with a track record for innovative, behaviour-changing strategies.

    Reason for being? Many of Angela’s personal projects are about helping women realise how ace they are; she started the Real Hot Bitches international dance troupe. Ange’s happy place is in nature, and she will fight fiercely to defend it.

    Claim to fame? Ange is known for having wild adventures – like that time she and her husband, along with their one year old baby, bought a boat in the Caribbean and sailed it through the Panama Canal and into the Pacific. Things didn’t end so well.

    Anna Dean can. By knowing how to make the right noise with the right people, she’s in the business of making corporate cool.

    Reason for being? Anna cut her teeth in the art world – helping friends’ projects get the attention they deserved. A Golden Bay girl at heart, she also has a deep connection to the land and is never afraid to plunge into the sea. Social issues, like the gender pay gap, also get Anna fired up.

    Claim to fame? TV3’s David Farrier described Anna as a “marketing genius” after she changed Wellington to “Vellington” for the launch of What We Do in the Shadows.”

    My god, I was hoping the rabbit hole would close once the Natz had been relegated.

    Please…someone tell me Vance has this wrong.

    • AsleepWhileWalking 13.1
      18 July 2018 at 11:37 am

      *Face, palm*

      At times like this there is no suitable emoji

    • Puckish Rogue 13.2
      18 July 2018 at 11:49 am

      ‘Double Denim claims it “can turn online buzz into real-world results” to shake up its image.’

      This seems to be the holy grail for politicians even though there’s probably where examples of it not working then there is for it working

  14. marty mars 14
    18 July 2018 at 11:38 am

    A wee reminder – as I walked home from visiting a mate last night – the moon a bright cresent with the brilliance of Venus beside her and then above Jupiter bright leaning away from Scorpio and further over Saturn and then mars so red and bright.

    I’m in the dark country and I hope you get a chance to look up at the sky – inspiring.

    • veutoviper 14.1
      18 July 2018 at 3:34 pm

      Absolutely agree. The sky has been magnificent the last few nights in Wellington. Over the last few months many street lights in Wellington have been out and not fixed. While this is a safety/security issue, etc, OTOH it has been/is great for sky watching.

  15. Morrissey 15
    18 July 2018 at 6:48 pm

    We should be saluting the Gaza Strip
    The spirit of Gaza is unbroken by any siege and breathing life into the desperate and lost cause of the Palestinian struggle
    by GIDEON LEVY, July 15, 2018

    Were it not for the Gaza Strip, the occupation would have been long forgotten. Were it not for the Gaza Strip, Israel would have erased the Palestinian problem from its agenda and continued on blithely with its crimes and annexations, with its routine, as if 4 million people were not living under its heel. Were it not for the Gaza Strip, the world would also have forgotten. Most of it already has. This is why we must now salute the Gaza Strip — mainly the spirit of the Gaza Strip, the only one that is still breathing life into the desperate and lost cause of the Palestinian struggle for liberty.

    The resolute struggle of the Gaza Strip should also spark admiration in Israel. The handful of people with a conscience who still remain here should give thanks to the unbroken spirit of the Gaza Strip. The spirit of the West Bank crumpled after the failure of the second intifada, as did the spirit of the Israeli peace camp — most of which shattered long ago. Only the spirit of the Gaza Strip stands steadfast in its struggle.

    Read more….
    http://normanfinkelstein.com/2018/07/17/truth-2/

  16. eco maori 16
    19 July 2018 at 8:39 am

    Good morning The Am Show Simon Mannering is a great role modle for all Kiwis 14 years at the club and nearly 300 games ka pai.
    Julie Anne Genter Eco maori thanks the Green party for advocating for Papatuanuku clean green environment I hope we do have subsidies for electric cars in Aotearoa ka pai.
    Mark the chargeing stations could be located in commercial car parks it would be worth it for the owners of these parks mainly councils as this would draw in more customers win win for all.
    That picture of Angela Merkel show’s me the lefties have to be vigilante keep a gard up against the neo libreal smear campaign thats what they do the camera person would have seen this distraction .
    With the free speech thing it should be factual free speech one does not let lairs or people that are going to teach te mokopuna’s bad habits can’t you see that these people have decided to come to Aotearoa to rock our Waka because we are heading down the left path .
    Ka kite ano

    • solkta 16.1
      19 July 2018 at 8:56 am

      Why is someone who plays Rugby League automatically “a great role modle for all Kiwis”? I had to google the name to know what you meant by “the club”, so certainly not a role model for me. A lot of us Kiwis just think this thugby stuff is crap that stunts men’s development with toxic masculinity. Rather than a positive role model such people, in my view, are causing much harm.

  17. eco maori 17
    19 July 2018 at 10:11 am

    Here you go two people who care about what they leave behind to there mokopuna’s a sustainable environment ka pai link below P.S If all farmers invested some effort in to looking after there on farm environment one can do this with out spending much money this would help improve our water quality .

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12091292

  18. eco maori 18
    19 July 2018 at 10:48 am

    Kiwis have just about used up all the advantages that Aotearoa has been blessed with on Papatuanuku .The other big advantage we have is Tangaroa to be exact Deep Sea fish farming Aquaculture we are in a prime location for Aquaculture we can do this deep sea fish farming with minimum negative environmental impact fish farming could easily become our biggest export prouduct . Yes I know theirs the argument that the wild fish stocks are taken to feed the stock on these fish farms . but we could find alternative feed stock for the fish like meat waste maybe havesting sea weed many different options to feed these fish farms fishes we are in a prime location for Aquaculture if we grow Aquaculture we will reduce the presser on Tangaroa wild fish stock and this is another reason for Eco Maori to champion this industry .Ka pai
    Ka kite ano link below.

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12091217

  19. eco maori 19
    19 July 2018 at 12:25 pm

    We cannot let thee neo librail bone heads get there hands on this technology that would be a catastrophe for all beings Artificial Intelligent killing machines .
    Link below ka kite ano

    https://www.theguardian.com/science/2018/jul/18/thousands-of-scientists-pledge-not-to-help-build-killer-ai-robots

  20. eco maori 20
    19 July 2018 at 6:57 pm

    Good evening Newshub Congratulations to Te Uroa Flavell for his new job as CEO of Te Wanganga O Aotearoa I am sure you will look after our tangata whenua education Ka pai E hoa
    There you go What a real man does he admits he is wrong and apologizes Ka pai Elon Mus
    There you go AI is there in Australia nimbo robotics security help is a reality now we have to keep this technology on a tight leash or it will have us on the leash.
    There we go Andrew Britain is experience heat waves the Scottish golf couse is dry Global Warming is here and now. ka kite ano

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