Open mike 26/03/2013

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, March 26th, 2013 - 204 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Open mike is your post. For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the link to Policy in the banner).

Step right up to the mike…

204 comments on “Open mike 26/03/2013 ”

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  1. AsleepWhileWalking 1
    26 March 2013 at 6:21 am

    NZ$45 ANNUAL RETURN FILING FEE HAS BEEN REINTRODUCED: Fee changes came into effect on 1 August 2012 including a fee of NZ$45 payable when you file your company annual return.

    The sign of a desperate government? Is the filing fee justified when for the most part it is automated?

    • felix 1.1
      26 March 2013 at 7:36 am

      Yet another tax rise under a National/ACT govt.

      • Colonial Viper 1.1.1
        26 March 2013 at 8:09 am

        Increasing the costs and complexity of doing business in NZ.

        • muzza 1.1.1.1
          26 March 2013 at 8:21 am

          Only for the *little guy* though…

        • aerobubble 1.1.1.2
          26 March 2013 at 10:44 am

          Surely one of the problems with the economy is people assume there is only one reason for a decision. When I pay hard cash for something I expect a better quality of service, I expect consumer rights, etc. So sure its a extra cost but it also means the expectation about the handling of information rises. Oh, wait, no, my expectation of government protecting provacy is abysmal….

          …yeah, no, you’re right, it is just a tax grab that targets small businesses who have started up more entities because the cost was lower, and I would not be surprised to see a contraction in business entities…. …so classic National, make changes that make them look ineffective.

          • McFlock 1.1.1.2.1
            26 March 2013 at 11:19 am

            $27mil is a bit light for a tax grab.

            An underfunded government department, on the other hand, would find it very useful.
            So the government underfunds all departments, so they introduce or increase costs like this one. Birth certificates, passports, land information, any official data, fire and ambulance fees, expect them all to rise if they haven’t already, as department heads try to make income equal expenditure.

            National’s brighter future: fucking you over in a thousand little ways and a few dozen big ways since 2008.

            • freedom 1.1.1.2.1.1
              26 March 2013 at 6:00 pm

              paid $48 for a new Driver’s Licence last week and was a little stunned to be honest.

              but at least i discovered that the NZTA and the DL folk don’t share info. The DL folk had an address from six years ago, now a carpark, whilst I updated my NZTA info just last year when i suspended reg on the truck.

            • Colonial Viper 1.1.1.2.1.2
              26 March 2013 at 7:12 pm

              $27mil is a bit light for a tax grab.

              Well this is a government who thought that a -$27M parking tax was a good idea.

    • vto 1.2
      26 March 2013 at 7:59 am

      That is monopoly power abuse. The Commerce Commission should investigate.

      Exactl;y like EQC in Christchurch. The Serious Fraud Office should be investigating EQC over its conduct. Fraud is “misrepresentation for the purpose of pecuniary gain”. You will read in this article here about EQC’s historic privacy breach that, with one example client, the EQC file indicated repairs of $59,000 yet EQC told the client it was only $30,000, so $30,000 was the sum of the payout. That is simple and outright dishonesty.

      http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/business/the-rebuild/8470970/EQC-needs-to-be-more-transparent

      Doing such is outright fraud.

      Dishonesty and misrepresentation for the purpose of financial gain. Simple.

      The Serious Fraud Office must investigate

      (and as soon as our repair is complete a complaint will be made. The approach and ‘mistakes’ have been so bizarre that it could have nothing but intentional)

      Perhaps now people outside of Chch East will understand why no EQC offices have outside signs and instead have security guards and razor wire. It is absolutely unbelievable.

      • Rogue Trooper 1.2.1
        26 March 2013 at 11:27 am

        yes, vto, EQC budgeted more, yet offered less, than what was required in that instance.hmmmm

    • infused 1.3
      26 March 2013 at 4:07 pm

      It’s actually to stop all these bullshit companies being registered.

      • McFlock 1.3.1
        26 March 2013 at 4:09 pm

        how much does it cost to get company accounts done?

        • infused 1.3.1.1
          26 March 2013 at 4:14 pm

          What does that have to do with anything?

          A ‘bullshit’ company will be used and abused within a year. Also, if you don’t trade, but just hold names, like a lot do, then you don’t need your accounts done.

    • KJT 1.4
      27 March 2013 at 9:14 am

      National. The party for business. LOL.

  2. Jenny 2
    26 March 2013 at 6:31 am

    Public Notice:

    This is an invitation to a submission writing workshop to assist with writing submissions on Glencoal’s proposed Mangatangi mine, which is located in Mangatawhiri. It is also open to people who need more information.

    Material available at the meeting will be Glencoal’s resource consent applications and information on concerns about this mine.

    Time:
    You can turn up any time from 3pm onwards today, Tuesday, 26/3/13

    Venue: Mangatawhiri Community Hall, Just Past the famous (though now closed) Ice Cream Castle on the old SH2. (now by passed by the new diversion)

    Directions Coming from Auckland:
    At the Pokeno interchange at the bottom of the Bombay Hill get on to SH2 heading East. Continue on SH2 till you see the Mangatawhiri off ramp.

    Take this exit to remain on the old road.

    The workshop will be led by members of The Mangatawhiri Mine Action Group and Auckland Coal Action.

    Submitters with all points of view are welcome.

  3. Perplexed 3
    26 March 2013 at 7:22 am

    Why now?
    The US Intelligence in the Wellington Embassy would have know of overseas bank account held by a senior UN official who had become the leader of the Labour Party and the non disclosure under pecuniary intetest rules.
    Others would have know about the Shearer bank account and the non disclosure under pecuniary intetest rules.
    So why now?

    • muzza 3.1
      26 March 2013 at 8:48 am

      Always the best question to ask..

      Its not a random release of information, there is always a purpose to the timing.

      • KhandallaViper 3.1.1
        26 March 2013 at 9:26 am

        awayanbileyerheid the pair of you.
        We all make mistakes.
        Shearer is not on teh same planet as Banks when it comes to bad behaviour.

        • muzza 3.1.1.1
          26 March 2013 at 10:39 am

          KV – We all make mistakes, Shearer is not as bad, blah, blah, nonsense!

          Time to grow up son, we are being taken for an outrageous ride.

          What is it with people who refuse to understand the danger their futures have been put in!

        • Murray Olsen 3.1.1.2
          26 March 2013 at 5:40 pm

          When it comes to corruption and lying, I agree that Shearer is not on the same planet as Banks. However, Banks’s failings are widely known and he’s unlikely to be put in a position where he can do much harm. Shearer is going for a position as leader of our government, without any of us really knowing what he stands for. He doesn’t have to be corrupt or dishonest to do a lot of damage – just supporting a corrupt and dishonest system and giving us more of the same is sufficient.
          So yeah, he behaves better than Banks but he is still far more danger to us. Being well behaved is hardly comforting.

      • chris73 acualy is Dolan 3.1.2
        26 March 2013 at 10:03 am

        The question you need to ask is:

        Who has most to gain from the information being made public

        • McFlock 3.1.2.1
          26 March 2013 at 11:47 am

          or who loses least making it public as quickly as possible upon finding it.

          • Perplexed 3.1.2.1.1
            26 March 2013 at 8:20 pm

            Ref 3.1.2.1 McFlock

            …that, hopes Shearer, is Shearer.

            And Shearer says he disclosed the income from the overseas account to the NZ IRD.
            If he has an overseas income he is assessable for tax overseas. That status will cause credits to be available or debits to be payable at certain points in the year. These, depending on timing, should be declated under the rules for all MPs.

            • McFlock 3.1.2.1.1.1
              27 March 2013 at 12:50 pm

              lol
              true enough – but surely only if the tax credits are above $50k? i.e. if the tax paid on the interest in the account was above $50k, then it needs to be declared (at a rough guess that would be a few mill in the account at 30% tax on interest)? Or are tax credits under different criteria in the rules?

  5. millsy 5
    26 March 2013 at 7:56 am

    Good luck to the Black Caps.

    A test series victory against England (and a comprehensive one), would really give me a spring in my step today. Make all the other problems go away, for the moment anyway.

    6 wickets to go….

    • The Al1en 5.1
      26 March 2013 at 8:13 am

      Good luck to England.

      Backs against the wall, bulldog spirit to the front, and fight it out for an against the odds draw.
      Won’t make all the other problems go away, but will give me a laugh all the same.

      Three sessions to battle for…

    • tc 5.2
      26 March 2013 at 8:28 am

      Delicately poised, a win would paper over the cracks in NZ Cricket till we lose to Zimbabwe or similar.

    • Morrissey 5.3
      26 March 2013 at 9:26 am

      Now if only we could GUARANTEE the victory by installing Craig Joubert as (non-) umpire for the day…

      • Chris 5.3.1
        26 March 2013 at 11:38 am

        You always bring up Craig Joubert yet never bring up Wayne Barnes – why is that? Either way is just as pathetic.

        Apologies if this is the first time you have mentioned him but I’ve noticed it a few times on this site and assume if you are bringing him up this long after the world cup it is not the first time.

        • Morrissey 5.3.1.1
          26 March 2013 at 3:06 pm

          You always bring up Craig Joubert yet never bring up Wayne Barnes – why is that?

          That is because there is no valid or credible comparison between the two. Barnes missed a forward pass in the first half and the All Blacks scored a try from that. Then he missed a forward pass in the second half and the Tricolors scored a try from that. In other words: Barnes made a couple of honest mistakes, which cancelled each other out. Joubert on the other hand steadfastly refused to penalise the blatant cheating by the All Blacks, even though the home team was fouling flagrantly and systematically.

          Either way is just as pathetic.

          It was and is pathetic and stupid to complain about Barnes’s honest mistakes. And in fact nobody respected and knowledgeable did complain. “Sir” Graham was cajoled by silly old Bob Howitt to insert into in his dull co-written autobiography a ridiculous chapter full of fantastical complaints about Barnes. It is worth noting that nobody—i.e. NOBODY—who knows anything about rugby took Sir Graham’s book seriously.

          The disgraceful display by non-referee Craig Joubert is an entirely different matter, of course.

          • Chris 5.3.1.1.1
            26 March 2013 at 8:12 pm

            He missed a forward pass and didn’t award the all blacks a single penalty in the second half. Which had never happened before in the history of rugby. But yeah obviously no comparison between the two.

            • Morrissey 5.3.1.1.1.1
              26 March 2013 at 9:24 pm

              He missed a forward pass…

              He missed TWO forward passes. One directly led to a try for New Zealand, one directly led to a try for France. In other words, they cancelled one another out. Why are you choosing to say he missed ONE forward pass?

              …and didn’t award the all blacks a single penalty in the second half.

              The Tricolors did not offend in the second half. Please view a tape of the match some time when you are sober.

              But yeah obviously no comparison between the two.

              We’ll ignore your desperate resort to sarcasm, and reiterate what you already know to be the truth: there is no credible case to be made that Barnes’s refereeing “robbed” the All Blacks of victory over France.

              There is ample evidence that Craig Joubert’s egregious display of partiality in the 2011 final was THE crucial factor in the All Blacks’ win….

          • Chris 5.3.1.1.2
            26 March 2013 at 8:30 pm

            To clarify I don’t blame Barnes for the All Blacks losing, the whole thing was ridiculous. Just as claiming Joubert is the reason the French lost is ridiculous.

            You’re right he wasn’t blowing up the All Blacks, but he also wasn’t penalising the French. The penalty count ended up being 7-10 in favour of the All Blacks (for reference 2007 was 7-2 to France). That’s hardly evidence of a huge bias.

            However, now you seem to have moved onto some peoples favourite conspiracy theory that somehow the IRB (which is mainly comprised of Northern hemisphere nations) convinced a South African ref to intentionally gift the game that is meant to be the sports show piece to the All Blacks. Sounds reasonable.

            If that is your belief have fun with that. Meanwhile the rugby loving people in NZ will console themselves with the fact that whatever you believe it still says NZ on the trophy. No matter what you say the fact that you are still bringing up Joubert 18 or so months later shows that that really pisses you off.

            • Morrissey 5.3.1.1.2.1
              26 March 2013 at 9:45 pm

              To clarify I don’t blame Barnes for the All Blacks losing, the whole thing was ridiculous.

              Good. You are a rational human being. That’s good.

              Just as claiming Joubert is the reason the French lost is ridiculous.

              Sorry, but your logic is grossly flawed. There is simply not a case that can be made that equates Barnes’s two honest errors in 2007, one affecting each team, with Joubert’s systematic refusal to penalise the flagrant cheating of the home team in 2011.

              You’re right he wasn’t blowing up the All Blacks, but he also wasn’t penalising the French. The penalty count ended up being 7-10 in favour of the All Blacks (for reference 2007 was 7-2 to France). That’s hardly evidence of a huge bias.

              Abusing statistics like that is misleading at best, utterly spurious at worst. The fact that the final penalty count was roughly even completely obscures the fact that the All Blacks were not penalized, despite the most flagrant fouling, ALL of it committed right in front of the (non-) referee.

              However, now you seem to have moved onto some peoples favourite conspiracy theory that somehow the IRB (which is mainly comprised of Northern hemisphere nations) convinced a South African ref to intentionally gift the game that is meant to be the sports show piece to the All Blacks.

              You are attempting to trivialize this argument by casting me as a conspiracy theorist. I’m not. There is no evidence that Joubert conspired to destroy the final. Whether his failure to do his job was deliberate or due to stage-fright is something that has not yet been, and may never be, determined for sure. What IS certain is that he repeatedly ignored the most outrageously flagrant and systematic cheating ever seen on Eden Park, or any other stadium for that matter.

              Sounds reasonable.

              No it doesn’t. There is no evidence to suggest Joubert colluded, although you can understand why so many French fans are convinced of it.

              If that is your belief have fun with that.

              Again, you are trivializing this issue. It’s not a case of my “belief”; it is an objective fact that Joubert failed grievously to do his job and referee fairly and impartially in the final of the 2011 RWC. That’s not my “belief”; it’s a gruesome truth. Here, see (again) for yourself….

              Meanwhile the rugby loving people in NZ will console themselves with the fact that whatever you believe it still says NZ on the trophy.

              Actually, most rugby fans in this country try not to talk about that final. It’s very much a guilty open secret. They know—as you know—that the All Blacks probably would have been beaten in a fair contest, just as they were in 2007, and 1999.

              No matter what you say the fact that you are still bringing up Joubert 18 or so months later shows that that really pisses you off.

              I don’t like to see the game I love being trashed by the incompetence or corruption of a non-referee. Yes, it does kind of “piss me off”.

  6. vto 6
    26 March 2013 at 8:05 am

    .
    Massive increase in government resources for farming irrigation.

    Massive decrease in government resources for protecting the environment.

    The place is going to shit.

    • Pascal's bookie 6.1
      26 March 2013 at 8:12 am

      Sums it up.

      And it’s a good thing it’s only back office staff that have been cut in the public sector eh? What use are they anyway? The constant parade of fuck ups and privacy snafus are just the new normal, totally unrelated.

    • freedom 6.2
      26 March 2013 at 8:29 am

      on TV3 news it was also mentioned that Fonterra are looking to buy DOC silence on our poisoned waterways with a measely $20 million. Of course they framed the situation a little differently.

      and (from Stuff) Nick Smith , “the cuts would include work protecting endangered species deep in the conservation estate. ” I’m only on coffee #2, but is that not what the DOC is actually for ?
      I mean doesn’t the name kinda give a big hint ?

    • aerobubble 6.3
      26 March 2013 at 11:03 am

      Its worse than that. Joyce is anti-science, by choice, when he ignores the obvious global heating, of increase floods and droughts that would indicate that increasing water intense milk production and cartage costs, is a economically and environmentally unviable. Environment S.Canterbury was inhibiting diary growth…
      …get with the plan, National hate the idea of considering the medium to long term outcomes.

    • Augustus 6.4
      26 March 2013 at 1:46 pm

      A lot of DOC resources spent on pest eradication targets areas around farm land, sometimes exclusively. They call the areas “priority sites”. The purpose is to prevent bovine tuberculosis. No doubt they also target other sites to actually protect native flora and fauna, those ones we see on TV for example.

      A cynic could look at the shift in government resources as being from one area of farm support to another, including in name. It might enable DOC to focus on other areas. Somehow I doubt that it will happen like that, though..

  7. Draco T Bastard 7
    26 March 2013 at 8:24 am

    Now this should piss off libertarians:

    In many ways libertarianism reads like the first third of Marxism: the area which explores methodological questions and the nature of man. Both libertarianism and Marxism are generally fairly agreeable – and in agreement – in this area, but the former never really fleshes out its arguments satisfactorily. Often I find libertarians, after describing some basic principles (non coercion etc.), make the jump to property rights and capitalism being the bestest thing ever, without fully explaining it.

    I bet most libertarians don’t realise that their economic theory is even close to what Marx theorised.

    • kiwi_prometheus 7.1
      26 March 2013 at 9:11 am

      I bet most Marxists don’t realise how close their economic theory is to Libertarianism.

      Though interesting as the History of Philosophy, they are failed theories fixated with 19th Century conceived utopias.

      Of course most Marxists hide their true colours behind intellectually faddish and obscurantist pedantry such as “Post Modernism”, “Social Constructivism”, “Post Structuralism” as can be seen on this site.

      [lprent: The only person I see using most of these terms around here is you. And even then you mostly use them incorrectly. I guess you prefer to assign your own meanings to labels instead of finding out what other people have actually said. Overall you give a distinct impression of being pig-ignorant and rather stupid to boot.

      However that isn’t why I’m noting here. You lack a basic ability to judge the situation or where the bounds are. So I’ll make it easy for you. If I see you ever attack or even mildly criticize my authors again then you will be kicked off this site with no chance of ever returning. To that end, all of your comments will require my personal release out of moderation until I’m sure that you can control yourself. ]

    • Populuxe1 7.2
      26 March 2013 at 10:39 am

      Actually they do for the most part. The Teabaggers are not particularly representative of most Libertarians I know. Quite a few of them identify more with Anarchism than they do with Ayn Rand, some of them are even quite principled (but admittedly have an unrealistic consequence-free understanding of human nature and the world which leads me to suspect most of them are on the Autism spectrum somewhere – ie, they are not neccissarily illogical but they don’t quite grasp that most human beings are not perfect moral beings and are often driven by sentiment).

      • aerobubble 7.2.1
        26 March 2013 at 11:13 am

        Oh, please, like empathic people are incapable of using faith to get what they want. People are not perfect is core to the whole growth of cults and the sentimentality industry. Teabangers are overwhelmingly faith based, and I have no idea how a Christian would square that with anarchism.

        The tea party is a media construct, find some extreme group, give them publicity as their beliefs support right wing extremism, so that your pliant viewers will be motivated to off their couches.

        • Populuxe1 7.2.1.1
          26 March 2013 at 12:02 pm

          Yes, well you’ve just demonstrated a fairly dramatic lack of understanding of Libertarianism, Randian Objectivism, Anarchism, Christianity, American politics, Teabagger appeal to the American Revolution, and anything I was in fact saying.

          Libertarians actually for the most part seem to be motivated by a genuine belief in thier philosophy, despite it being completely contrary to most people’s experience of the world – this is because they can’t quite understand how normal people actually think or are genuinely in denial about themselves – which is actuall fairly close to the psychology of religious fundementalism. Protestantism and Anarchism are in fact very closely related. Also you should compare the US Bill of Rights and Constitution with a few Anarchist manifestos – the similarities are startling. And I think you’ll find that the Tea Party is the tip of the iceberg as far as US conservative politics go – they are merely the most extreme bit. Behold the popularity of mingbats like Palin and Bachmann. I’m not even sure how to categorise a psycho like Rand Paul.

      • Rogue Trooper 7.2.2
        26 March 2013 at 11:37 am

        which reminds me of a particularly clever “post-modern” episode of “Community” last night; very clever!
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_%28TV_series%29
        (Abed, the “messiah”) 🙂

      • Draco T Bastard 7.2.3
        26 March 2013 at 3:52 pm

        Actually they do for the most part.

        None of the ones I’ve met have. When you mention Marx they point to the USSR and scream force completely ignoring that Marx would never have endorsed either of the political systems in the USSR or China.

        As the article I linked to points out, Libertarians have a tendency to ignore the human relations that are part and parcel of interacting with other humans and thus ignore human rights in favour of property rights. I’ve even had one, Tribeless whom you may remember, tell me that democracy was bad because it prevented him doing whatever he wanted. He even kept that notion after agreeing that people had the right not to be affected by anyone else without their permission.

        • Populuxe1 7.2.3.1
          26 March 2013 at 4:40 pm

          To be faire they point at any kind of government and scream force. The smart ones recognise the Anarchist connection.

      • Murray Olsen 7.2.4
        26 March 2013 at 5:47 pm

        Surely you mean that libertarians don’t understand that most human beings are not perfect amoral beings?

  8. freedom 8
    26 March 2013 at 8:32 am

    And seeing the report on the Sultan of Brunei visiting I would like to know why is the PM having dinner tomorrow with a super rich prick who has no belief in Civil Rights, Free Speech, or Democracy, oh hang on I think I just answered my own question

    • Populuxe1 8.1
      26 March 2013 at 11:21 am

      Probably because he’s the head of state of one of our wealthiest neighbours, but hey.

      • felix 8.1.1
        26 March 2013 at 11:32 am

        …who has no belief in Civil Rights, Free Speech, or Democracy. But hey.

        • Populuxe1 8.1.1.1
          26 March 2013 at 12:06 pm

          And yet you think he should have gone to Chavez’ funeral…. Hmmm.

          • felix 8.1.1.1.1
            26 March 2013 at 12:33 pm

            Do I think the PM, while in South America to build NZ trading relationships, should turn up at the biggest event on that continent knowing it will be attended by every leader of every nation on the continent?

            Hmm, tough one.

            • Populuxe1 8.1.1.1.1.1
              26 March 2013 at 12:54 pm

              Therefore you shouldn’t have a problem with the PM having one dinner with the head of state of one of the riches nations in the region given the trade potential and following on from last year’s drive to promote trade with Indonesia… Or did I just imagine all that? Seeing as you’re not morally squeamish about authoritarian and opaque regimes with questionable records for Civil Rights, Free Speech, or Democracy, when there’s trade involved.

              • felix …
                26 March 2013 at 1:10 pm

                Please show where I’ve expressed a lack of squeamishness “about authoritarian and opaque regimes with questionable records for Civil Rights, Free Speech, or Democracy”

          • Morrissey 8.1.1.1.2
            26 March 2013 at 6:38 pm

            I see you are still doggedly repeating official U.S. regime black propaganda. This time the target you are obediently attacking is Hugo Chávez; if you’d been around fifty years ago, you would have been telling lies about Jawarhalal Nehru.

            No doubt a generation ago you were spouting such inane crap against Nelson Mandela.

            • DJ 8.1.1.1.2.1
              27 March 2013 at 8:13 am

              “No doubt a generation ago you were spouting such inane crap against Nelson Mandela.”

              So as long as you have a cause you have reason to commit murder? You have reason to plant bombs in trash cans in busy malls? You have reason to mame, rape and destroy lives and families.

              From someone who was caught in the cross fire and lost family and friends ……

              FUCK YOU with a captial F.

  9. tc 9
    26 March 2013 at 8:42 am

    NACT fanboy armstrong runs the line in Granny today that Blinglish and Ryall were stymied by process and SOE structure over SE, the ‘it’s not their fault whine’ completed with a swipe at the opposition.

    When the F has due process and structure ever stopped these clown stomping in and doing what they please Johnny fanboy ? ECAN, ChCh, SkyCity convention centre etc etc

    • muzza 9.1
      26 March 2013 at 8:53 am

      Armstrong is a foolish, scared old man clinging to the bastian of self importance,

      He likely has no concept of the damage he is playing a part in, or perhaps he does, but is told by his editor what is *acceptable*, and needs the pay cheque!

      Either way, the likes of roughman, armstrong et al, are liars, spinning yarns , getting paid to commentate on the destruction for our country!

      • Morrissey 9.1.1
        26 March 2013 at 9:24 am

        Armstrong made a fool of himself last year when he unwisely attacked the far brighter and sharper Gordon Campbell. Not a good idea, as Graham Bell and Richard Griffin, among many others, will attest.

        • muzza 9.1.1.1
          26 March 2013 at 11:15 am

          Armstrong also has no skin the the game right now , being elderly he is clear of the damage his writings support!

          He will get his turn experiencing the results of his work, next time round!

  10. phillip ure 10
    26 March 2013 at 9:24 am

    what has happened in cyprus will be making very many people very nervous..

    ..the broken-bank-bailout-model seems to have changed from taxpayer-funded..

    ..to depositor-funded..

    ..which will be of much alarm/concern to large depositors..anywhere…

    ..and could well lead to runs on banks..

    ..both now and in the future..

    ..phillip ure..

    • kiwi_prometheus 10.1
      26 March 2013 at 9:28 am

      The Max Keiser report sums it up – his “Jamie Dimon [ ceo of JP Morgan ] the Tape Worm” rant is hilarious:

      [lprent: see my note. ]

    • kiwi_prometheus 10.2
      26 March 2013 at 9:31 am

      They should be nervous anyway, the whole Global Financial System is a swirling cesspool of fraud, lawlessness and 100s of trillions in paper/electronic “securities” etc while the rest of us are steadily corralled into debt serfdom.

      [lprent: see my note. ]

  11. kiwi_prometheus 11
    26 March 2013 at 9:24 am

    Well, well, well, looks like the social constructivist pro gay marriage propaganda machine is losing traction – with any luck the wheels will pop right off!:

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10873630

    Virtually neck and neck for and against.

    So much for the pro camp chortling about having the overwhelming backing of NZ society. They simply don’t.

    And a couple of lesbians make some bizzare statement about “burning red faces” with a photoshopped posy pic issued by their publicist with fake painted faces, smiles and way way too much lip gloss.

    What a circus act.

    [lprent: see my note. ]

    • Colonial Weka 11.1
      26 March 2013 at 12:02 pm

      * Source: Herald DigiPoll survey of 750 people, March 11-17. Margin of error 3.6 per cent.

      • QoT 11.1.1
        26 March 2013 at 5:26 pm

        But CW, the Digipoll is totally accurate. It predicted the neck-and-neck battle between John Banks and Len Brown, you know.

    • millsy 11.2
      26 March 2013 at 10:45 pm

      If those ladies want to marry each other, then a) they should be allowed to and b) it really is none of your business, your probably just jealous because they wont have a threesome with you.

      I suppose you want them thrown in jail for their abhorrent and filthy lifestyle.

      They probably will be when Micheal Laws becomes PM with Bob MCroskie as minister for families and Garth McVicar as justice minister, all hauled off to the death camps.

  12. AsleepWhileWalking 12
    26 March 2013 at 9:25 am

    Watched Bomber + Marama Davidsonon Native Affairs last night

    http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2013/03/16/native-affairs-tv-review/
    http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2013/03/25/in-the-wake-of-the-devoy-appointment-hrc-to-see-20-30-redundancies/

    20-30 redundnacies? How can Devoy possibly do her job now? Are there enough left over to bring her up to speed or is this the HRC version of training your replacement with the replacement being on four to seven times your salary?

  13. travellerev 13
    26 March 2013 at 9:28 am

    I feel no satisfaction in being able to say I told you so. The system is collapsing and in order to keep it going they have to steal beg and borrow to keep it going. Such is the nature of the fiat currency beast. What is the evil part if that all of the proceeds do not go into making the life of the ordinary man easier. The proceeds go into the pockets of the the hidden 0,01 % who own the federal reserve system and that includes the New Zealand Reserve Bank.

    For those of you who did not watch the Creature of Jekyll Island about how this usurious and evil system came into existence here is Edward G Griffin’s excellent presentation again about how the New York Federal Reserve came to be exactly 100 years ago.

    • Lanthanide 13.1
      26 March 2013 at 9:33 am

      Where’s your evidence that “the system is collapsing”?

      • travellerev 13.1.1
        26 March 2013 at 9:46 am

        L, You’re either funny, stupid or a shill. None of these options makes me laugh.

        For those of you interested to keep up with the day to day progression of the global financial collapse here is but one of the many excellent alternative news sources on exactly what is happening around the globe in the international financial world and here are some figures you might find compelling even if against all hope you thing the financial system will survive the mathematical certainty of collapse.

        • Colonial Weka 13.1.1.1
          26 March 2013 at 9:49 am

          “You’re either funny, stupid or a shill”

          Or someone with critical thinking skills who is sick of henny penny (and for what it is worth, I do believe the sky is falling in many ways, but I also believe it’s reasonable for people to be given actual evidence).

          • travellerev 13.1.1.1.1
            26 March 2013 at 10:01 am

            Suit yourself CW,

            I took my money out of the bank a long time ago! And so did this lady but the Orthodox church on Cyprus didn’t. I know which I’d rather be.

            Oh, and check the second link in my previous comment. You might find some figures you might find compelling and leaning towards my assertions.

            Have a nice day!

            • Jackal 13.1.1.1.1.1
              26 March 2013 at 4:09 pm

              I have to agree with Lanthanide here, your claim that “the system is collapsing” travellerev just looks like baseless fear mongering, especially when you supply such weak corroborative evidence to back up your assertion.

              It’s true that many economies continue to languish, but that’s not a recent occurrence… The causes of a decline in growth have been in place for a very long time, in fact the cycle of boom and bust is inherent within the capitalist system, with the recent global recession (that ended in september 2009) simply being worse than usual.

              Holding up Cypris as some sort of example of worldwide economic disaster is akin to saying you’re unhappy so the rest of the world must be as well. Comparatively speaking, 91% of the world’s economies continue to grow… So how does that percentage fit with your predictions of doom?

        • Lanthanide 13.1.1.2
          26 March 2013 at 12:19 pm

          “L, You’re either funny, stupid or a shill. None of these options makes me laugh.”

          No, I’m asking why you posted this today, and therefore why you didn’t post it yesterday. Or why you didn’t post it last week. Or last month. What is it that has changed that makes you post this today and not those other days?

          Either something has changed, in which case please inform me of this. Or nothing has changed, and you’re just stirring.

          Which is it?

          Also, I don’t really buy into anything ZeroHedge says, because it’s always basically talking about conspiracy theories and “what’s really going on”, yet there’s no evidence anything it’s ever talked about has come true. Also according to them, the world financial system has crashed the last 4 Octobers in a row, and yet here we are…

          • travellerev 13.1.1.2.1
            26 March 2013 at 12:42 pm

            ROFL! Yep your typical shill (stupid, funny) behavior. Confusing issues and tarring the messenger and of course the biggy: Calling everybody and their dog “conspiracy theorists”!

            For those of you interested in where Zero hedge is coming from. Zero hedge are a group of Finance guys working in the field and totally up and running with what is happening not unlike Max Keiser. Max Keiser and his wife Stacey Herbert where nominated the most dangerous journalists in international finance while Zero Hedge made it to the second place. Their articles come from their own writers as well as from the most prominent finance, trading and gold traders. Follow them for a while and see if their predictions and revelations about the inner workings of the international finance world match up to what is happening in the real world. I did as from about 5 years ago and so far I have not been able to fault them.

            Oh, and I almost forgot, you will find link to every high profile financial website and blog there too in case you want to start making money in this scary market.

            • Lanthanide 13.1.1.2.1.1
              26 March 2013 at 12:51 pm

              So you chose not to answer the question. How surprising.

              • travellerev …
                26 March 2013 at 2:13 pm

                Yep, Your typical shill, obfuscating and manipulative and not reading up on links given because those are “not reliable”.

                Good thing I wasn’t targeting you because who was it again oh, yep Tomas Paine who said that “trying to argue with a man who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead”.

                But even a guy like you has his uses in that out there are people who do check out the links I give and you know what I reckon some of them helped along by those links will make up their own mind and maybe even think I actually did respond to your question.

                Have a nice day!

      • kiwi_prometheus 13.1.2
        26 March 2013 at 9:53 am

        What planet have you been living on the last 4 or 5 years?

        [lprent: see my note. ]

      • vto 13.1.3
        26 March 2013 at 10:02 am

        Lanthanide

        Cyprus, for just one small example.

        • Lanthanide 13.1.3.1
          26 March 2013 at 12:43 pm

          Cyprus is an example of what is being done so that the system doesn’t collapse.

          They’re making the depositors take a haircut, rather than the bond-holders, because if the bond-holders take a haircut on Cyprus, it’s a signal that the next dominos to fall (Spain, Italy) will also force the bond-holders to take a cut. This in turn will push up the price of borrowing for Spain and Italy and precipitate the very thing that the EU doesn’t want to happen. If Spain and/or Italy fall over, there’s a very big chance that the system truly will collapse. So the EU are doing everything they can to avoid that outcome.

          • vto 13.1.3.1.1
            26 March 2013 at 12:49 pm

            “Cyprus is an example of what is being done so that the system doesn’t collapse.”

            Are you serious? You are putting the egg before the cart young fulla. It is collapsing, that is why it needs rescuing. Sheesh….that is out there that one

            • Lanthanide 13.1.3.1.1.1
              26 March 2013 at 12:53 pm

              Did you read the rest of my post? If bond-holders took the hit in Cyprus, which is the other alternative to the depositors taking the hit, then it’d put Italy and Spain in much more precarious position.

              • vto …
                26 March 2013 at 12:56 pm

                Yes that is right, and that is more evidence that the collapse, which began in 2007, is now well underway (and gaining momentum I would suggest).

                The argument you are using is akin to saying, during an earthquake, that there is no earthquake because our house isn’t falling down. Backwards.

                If the system wasn’t collapsing then clearly all this rescue shit wouldn’t be needed.

                You baffle me with your logic here lanthanide

                • Lanthanide …
                  26 March 2013 at 1:02 pm

                  Please quote where I said no collapse was happening.

                  I think you’ll find I have said no such thing. I simply asked ev for evidence, which she hasn’t yet provided.

                  You provided an example perhaps of how “in order to keep it going they have to steal beg and borrow to keep it going”.

                  But really it depends how you define “collapse”. Personally I think functioning global market in which commodities such as oil and food are freely traded shows that the system has not “collapsed”. Similarly in Cyprus you’ll still be able to go down to the local market and buy imported goods as well as food.

                  • vto …
                    26 March 2013 at 1:08 pm

                    But this is what you said “Where’s your evidence that “the system is collapsing”?” which indicates you were looking for evidence that the system is collapsing, not that it had collapsed.

                    There is ample evidence of the system collapsing, including the situation in Cyprus.

                    • Lanthanide …
                      26 March 2013 at 1:15 pm

                      Right, as I said, I think the continued existence of a global market to freely trade in commodities is evidence against the system having collapsed.

                      There have been meltdowns of national economies in the past and yet the global economy didn’t collapse: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argentine_economic_crisis_(1999%E2%80%932002)

                      Cyprus can fall over without being a symptom of systemic collapse. We won’t really know except in hindsight. Just as everyone was saying 2008-2010 was the end of the system, it’s still going now, and although the troubles are not completely gone they have subsided.

                    • vto …
                      26 March 2013 at 1:17 pm

                      Unfortunately gotta fly. Lets agree to disagree. Imo the system is playing out its end-game.

                      Think about it – the world banking system is a clear cut ponzi scheme due to the existence of interest. Have you ever known a ponzi scheme to last forever?

                      Out (for now…)

                    • Colonial Weka …
                      26 March 2013 at 1:57 pm

                      “Imo the system is playing out its end-game.”

                      I tend to agree. But I can’t provide evidence that that is true, only evidence that it might be true or is likely to be true.

                    • Colonial Viper …
                      26 March 2013 at 2:09 pm

                      I think there’s quite an easy way to understand Lanth’s perspective. He believes that the airbags going off to protect Cyprus (well, in reality protecting the international creditors) is evidence that the car isn’t crashing.

                      Clearly he is correct in one point, the system has NOT catastophically collapsed (unless you live in Cyprus please note), and you can expect that it will do no such thing. Humans are great at propping systems up and keeping the walking wounded on their feet.

                      A bit like running a car into a wall at 20km/h probably won’t completely destroy the car. It just fucks the transmission and the steering, but it might still “go”. With a lot of grinding of machinery.

                      And so we all get used to a general, gradual deterioration in system expectation and performance…the new normal, in other words.

                      Welcome to Peak Debt, Peak Climate Change and Peak Energy. All rolled into one.

          • travellerev 13.1.3.1.2
            26 March 2013 at 3:50 pm

            By stealing from the depositors? Guess that will make the depositors in Italy (Which has already been earmarked for the next round of looting) want to keep their savings in the bank. Yeah right!

            Oh ,and the Dutch finance minister and head of Group of European finance ministers has announced that stealing from the depositors is the new normal

            Nope this is the last round of trying to steal as much as they can before the shit truly hits the fan!

      • muzza 13.1.4
        26 March 2013 at 11:21 am

        Lanth you are being a complete fool, you need to spend some more time on financial sites laddy!

        Try zerohedge with Ev links to.

        Weka, below – Seriously you are contesting that the explanation of the forming of the Reserve Bank (as it currntly is) vis the Reserve Bank Act 1913, is not a good enough starting point

        Your support of Lanthanide makes you look rather ill-informed, and frankly appears you are taking a pot shot at Ev, just for the sake of it.

        Leave that sort of nonsense for those here with little else to offer!

        The financial systems are collapsing, quickly, no more evidence is required, its a done deal!

        • Colonial Weka 13.1.4.1
          26 March 2013 at 12:08 pm

          “Weka, below – Seriously you are contesting that the explanation of the forming of the Reserve Bank (as it currntly is) vis the Reserve Bank Act 1913, is not a good enough starting point”

          No, I’m not contesting that. I’m saying that it’s reasonable for people to ask for evidence when such claims are made and not be ridiculed for asking.

          “The financial systems are collapsing, quickly, no more evidence is required, its a done deal!”

          The problem is that people have been saying this for a while now and it still hasn’t happened. Please reread my comment above, where I say that I do believe that the sky is falling. I also believe that there is alot of opinion presented as fact, which obscures reality. This works against the cause IMO.

          There are very large, complex systems changing at the moment, some of them over long time frames. As soon as someone starts putting predictive timeframes on change that is by its very nature not predictable, I raise my eyebrows (same goes for CC and PO).

          • Colonial Weka 13.1.4.1.1
            26 March 2013 at 12:10 pm

            “The financial systems are collapsing, quickly, no more evidence is required, its a done deal!”

            And thinking more about what you have just said, of course more evidence is required. Otherwise we would have a general consensus on what is going on. Or are you suggesting that we should just believe you or Ev and not engage our own thinking processes? Take it on faith?

            • Colonial Weka 13.1.4.1.1.1
              26 March 2013 at 12:12 pm

              If you feel frustration at how people respond to your ideas and beliefs, perhaps you might to look at how you present them.

          • vto 13.1.4.1.2
            26 March 2013 at 12:46 pm

            Weka “The problem is that people have been saying this for a while now and it still hasn’t happened”

            Sure they have been saying it since the early 2000s, that is right. And it has happenned.

            Evidence example no. 1: the GFC in 2008.
            Evidence example no. 2: sub-prime implosion in 2007.
            Evidence example no. 3: appointment by the EU of Italy’s nominated Prime Minister (only one of the biggest most pwerful countries in the world, no less).
            Evidence example no. 4: Bank runs in Spain over the last 12-18 months.
            Evidence example no 5: Cyprus theft of people’s property.

            There are plenty plenty more.

            Do you mean evidence of the financial collapse being completely done and over and the only way left is up again? Or do you mean evidence that the financial collapse is underway and we are mid-stream now?

            Methinks you are bit lost at sea on this one matey

            • Colonial Weka 13.1.4.1.2.1
              26 March 2013 at 1:55 pm

              “Do you mean evidence of the financial collapse being completely done and over and the only way left is up again?”

              No, because after the collapse would be self-evident.

              “Or do you mean evidence that the financial collapse is underway and we are mid-stream now?”

              Maybe. If you read what I am actually saying you will understand that I agree that a financial collapse is underway. What I don’t agree with is people like muzza saying that it’s happening quickly now. That’s the kind of prediction that we’ve heard repeatedly (and which Lanth refers to), and when it doesn’t come true, people turn off (sick of the boy crying wolf).

              Thus, my response to

              “The financial systems are collapsing, quickly, no more evidence is required, its a done deal!”

              is to ask, does that mean that by the end of 2013 the banks in NZ won’t be operating any more, we will have all lost our savings (those that have any), and we will be experiencing all the flow on effects like not being able to buy petrol or food regularly? Or does muzza mean next week? Or in the next five years?

              • Colonial Viper …
                26 March 2013 at 2:30 pm

                No, because after the collapse would be self-evident.

                Sometimes many years afterwards. During, not necessarily so. People have phases in their lives like this too.

                Also, a slow grinding deterioration resets peoples expectations lower on the way. Things become the ‘new normal’.

                • Jackal …
                  26 March 2013 at 4:32 pm

                  The question is whether the “new normal” is the economic system collapsing?

                  Although a further recession was predicted in 2012, actual indications are that there’s no worldwide financial collapse, which makes travellerev’s statement incorrect.

                  Furthermore, I’m pretty sure people were fully aware of what was happening during the Great Depression for instance Colonial Viper. Having low expectations because of economic decline is clearly different to a total global economic collapse.

                  • Colonial Viper …
                    26 March 2013 at 6:25 pm

                    I subscribe to Greer’s synthesis: a gradual, grinding, stepwise deterioration of the real economy. It’s been going on for a while now. The GFC was just another stage.

            • travellerev 13.1.4.1.2.2
              26 March 2013 at 3:59 pm

              Add to that the collapse of MS Global and the theft of $ 2 billion US. The rising price of gold only kept down by the manipulation of gold prices. The wish of many countries to repatriate its gold and the Dutch Central Bank announcing just today it wont deliver gold to people who actually bought the stuff anymore but will keep it save in their safes! Rofl!

              Next by the way is Slovenie! But don’t worry Slovenians. Your President will have a visit of a couple of Jackals by the name of LaGarde, Borrosa, Darghi and Rompuy and over dinner they will give him the conditions for a bailout! And you don’t have to worry about those pesky democratic voting thingamajigs because we’ll call it a restructuring!

              • Colonial Viper …
                26 March 2013 at 6:28 pm

                This shit is over 100 years old. Bankers in the mid west used to lend farmers way too much during good seasons. The inevitable drought or price down turn would come, mortgage payments would be missed, and the bank would foreclose, taking entire farming counties for cents on the dollar.

                The more things change the more they stay the same.

          • muzza 13.1.4.1.3
            26 March 2013 at 12:56 pm

            Weka, generally speaking you make sense with your comments here, and I respect your points of view, which are usually pragmatic.

            My opinion of the financial systems are broadly these points.

            1: The financial systems have already collapsed – They are being propped up in an artificial way, which means they have failed, this is not conjecture!

            2: Unless there is a debt jubilee or similar, or countries decide they are going to repudiate their debt, then we will all continue to be asphyxiated, as the pile of crumbs dwindles away – Thats private monetary supply, in short!

            3: Banking reform – Where/what/when – Nothing has happened which is going to alter the deterioration of living standards. Stealing money from bank accounts is one of the final steps in the process of relieving the plebs of their ability to support themselves. Once account raids are green lighted (and they have been), what is stopping the grab until the accounts are empty, nothing! And empty they will be, because the interest payments, and the casinos the banks operate inside of, are set to continue, and the bill being paid by the 99.9%.

            There is not enough *money* in the system, to cover the interest payments, or to support the capital requirements, as long as banks are still operating/running casino style derivative markets, which are used to corner the worlds commodities, among other nefarious activity. Why do you think banks continue to register improved profits and the like, they are stealing the lives of other people.

            4: Timeline – It’s been happening for 100 years already, I’m not one to make predictions, they serve little purpose. What I will say is that because there has been no structural changes which alter the direction of the breakdown, and with ever accelerating levels of debt at individual, household, company, town, city, country etc level, something has to break, and recently we have seen, Greece, Ireland, Portugal, Spain, Italy and now Cyprus go to the wall. The artificial life support of the centrally controlled monetary systems, which in turn control, the commodities, equities, insurance, health at al markets, is not a long term solution, it has to break, it can’t/won’t be supported perpetually, I won’t say when, it’s pointless.

            I understand why people put their heads in the sand on such issues, because they feel helpless to control what is going on, which is by and large the reality of the financial systems.

            Presenting the topic in a user friendly way is long since over, there is no shortage of information about what’s going on, how to protect yourself, align your finances etc, it’s an individual choice on how educated they want to become, and thus how they are able to decide what.

            Ev is actually doing people a favour, she does not have to do any such thing, and she will be proven to have been correct on most of what she posts here. I would prefer it all to be BS, fabricated/fantastical conspiracy , as would Ev I’m sure, but the events in the world, which both her and I, do little more than observe closely and comment on, are unfolding, and negatively influencing billions of people, while destroying the planet which underpins the man made structure/systems, we are using to kill ourselves off with.

            What I find odd, is that people continue to discuss other topics, and seek to understand why institutions and so on are broken, some even offer their ideas forward with solutions. The problem is that no solution is workable (regardless of the topic), until the monetary/financial situation is addressed.

            • Colonial Weka 13.1.4.1.3.1
              26 March 2013 at 11:29 pm

              Fair enough muzza 🙂

              For myself, I don’t believe that NZ will rise up and make radical changes. So, many of us are working to create what will be needed once it all falls over (or as it falls over). In this instance I’m thinking two things. CV refers to Greer, I’ll refer to Orlov: put your resources into things that will offer future security: tools, land, sustainable/resilient food and energy systems, skills for survival and trade, building relationships and communities and systems that will survive the outside chaos. Fuck the banks and the bankers. Trust people you actually know.

              The other things is support alternative currencies and trading systems. If these get set up now, outside of control of the authorities, then they will be more resilient than later when it will be much harder to be creative.

              In this sense, I’m not sure of the value in scaring people about the financial systems. What is it you are wanting to have happen? Most people cannot cope with the bald reality and will instead retreat into whatever holds comfort for them. If instead you can give them tangible solutions alongside reality, they will be much better placed to take it on board.

              • Colonial Viper …
                26 March 2013 at 11:35 pm

                I’ll refer to Orlov: put your resources into things that will offer future security: tools, land, sustainable/resilient food and energy systems, skills for survival and trade, building relationships and communities and systems that will survive the outside chaos.

                Spot on. The other thing both Orlov and Greer agree on – the mindset and the attitude is one of the most crucial things to prepare.

              • muzza …
                27 March 2013 at 1:31 pm

                put your resources into things that will offer future security: tools, land, sustainable/resilient food and energy systems, skills for survival and trade, building relationships and communities and systems that will survive the outside chaos. Fuck the banks and the bankers. Trust people you actually know

                Agree with that 100%, Weka!

                Its not about scaring people, its about informing them, in the hope that they might head in a direction, such as what it reads like you’re heading in.

                Excellent work, if so!

    • Draco T Bastard 13.2
      26 March 2013 at 3:04 pm

      Such is the nature of the fiat currency beast.

      It’s not fiat currency that’s the problem – it’s the private banks being able to print it, essentially without limit, and then charge interest on it. That combined with capitalism’s inherent propensity to accumulate wealth in the hands of the few and the end result must be financial collapse.

      • travellerev 13.2.1
        26 March 2013 at 4:02 pm

        Read up on the reasons for the French revolution and their adventures with Fiat money or better still watch Max Keiser and James Turk on the subject

        • Draco T Bastard 13.2.1.1
          26 March 2013 at 11:09 pm

          All money is fiat – even gold has to be declared as money by, get this, the bloody government. As I said, there’s nothing wrong with it. What’s wrong is the way it’s created which only benefits the already rich and helps cause the collapse of the economy by bringing about the collapse of the financial system.

  14. Morrissey 14
    26 March 2013 at 9:56 am

    DON’T MENTION THE HOOKERS OR THE COCAINE!!!!
    Cleansing the TV3 News
    TV3 Firstline, Tuesday 26 March 2013

    7:00 a.m. News….

    RACHEL SMALLEY:Prince Harry will travel to the United States to help promote rehabilitation for American and British troops. [significant pause] Just last year, on a private visit to Las Vegas, the Prince triggered headlines around the world when he was photographed NAKED in his hotel room. [meaningful silence of several seconds.]

    Was it simply that Prince Harry was “photographed naked in his hotel room” that “triggered headlines around the world”? Surely there was more to it than that?

    I seem to recall that there were several other people naked in the room with him. I think most of those naked people were prostitutes. Surely that was significant? Why did Rachel Smalley not mention that? Obviously she wanted to say more, but someone higher up than her would not allow it.

    Why would they want to protect the reputation of the “Big H” like this?

    • chris73 acualy is Dolan 14.1
      26 March 2013 at 10:12 am

      Prince Harrys great

      Fights battles, parties with chicks…like the english kings of old! Rule Britannia!

      • Morrissey 14.1.1
        26 March 2013 at 10:32 am

        He doesn’t fight battles, moron. He drops bombs on civilians from a position of perfect safety.

        • chris73 acualy is Dolan 14.1.1.1
          26 March 2013 at 10:47 am

          Kind of a thing I’d expect a discksmack like you to say. Go away, read up on warfare and come back when you have something to say that doesn’t sound like it comes straight from 4th form social studies.

        • Populuxe1 14.1.1.2
          26 March 2013 at 10:59 am

          Your evidence that these women were sex workers? Your rush to demean them as human beings speaks volumes about your misogyny, Morrissey. And in any case, who cares if he has a good time? I certainly don’t. As for your assertion that he is “perfectly safe” – bollocks, he’s prize target number for one for any Talibani and Al Qaeda insurget with a rocket launcher because of his Royal status.

          • fender 14.1.1.2.1
            26 March 2013 at 11:15 am

            And yet he still made it out unscathed to have a Charlie Sheen celebration, guess its just ‘near perfect safety’ then, considering he was the prize target but the bleeding nose was just from self inflicted snorting exercises.

            • Populuxe1 14.1.1.2.1.1
              26 March 2013 at 11:27 am

              Having been out on the town with some of our boys posted to Afganistan (sans Bolivian booger sugar or ladies of negotiable virtue) – given the shit they see and the risks they are exposed to, I would indulge in some generous hedonism in my downtime too. It’s all very well to sneer and pass judgment if you’ve never actually been in that situation.

              • felix …
                26 March 2013 at 11:41 am

                Dude.

                It was a suite in a ritzy hotel in Vegas, not a tent on a base in Kabul.

                Drop the “war-hero r&r” bullshit.

                • chris73 acualy is Dolan …
                  26 March 2013 at 11:43 am

                  Something about walking a mile in their shoes springs to mind

                  • fender …
                    26 March 2013 at 11:53 am

                    Something about running 10 miles without shoes while evading helicopters overhead springs to mind.

                    • chris73 acualy is Dolan …
                      26 March 2013 at 11:59 am

                      Not to sound cold hearted but so what. You think civilian casualties have only ever happened in this war?

                      Maybe you think Afghanistan should be left to its own devices? Yeah you probably do.

                    • vto …
                      26 March 2013 at 12:17 pm

                      Well, we leave the USA to its own devices and look at the shit they pull.

                      Can’t be any worse than leaving the Afghanis alone.

                    • felix …
                      26 March 2013 at 12:23 pm

                      “You think civilian casualties have only ever happened in this war?”

                      Damnm you’re right. Here we are, fully supporting the killing of civilians in almost every instance, and only when it’s a prince doing it we get all upset about it.

                      Totally got me there dude.

                    • fender …
                      26 March 2013 at 12:26 pm

                      Still sounds cold hearted no matter how much you fart over it.

                      Just like Iraq, Afghanistan will soon be left to it’s ‘own devices’.

                    • Populuxe1 …
                      26 March 2013 at 3:52 pm

                      Given chris73 acualy is Dolan has said elsewhere he was in Timor, assuming of course that’s true, he would definitely know more about it than you. I only know from the changes I’ve seen in friends and family who have seved in Kuwait, the Balkans, and Afganistan.

                    • felix …
                      26 March 2013 at 4:25 pm

                      You’re so lost, Pop.

                      What exactly would Dolan know about hookers and coke from visiting Timor?

                    • Populuxe1 …
                      26 March 2013 at 4:48 pm

                      Easy left-wing pseudo-intellectual tactic two, blame or otherwise disrespect the military and/or police.

                    • felix …
                      26 March 2013 at 6:05 pm

                      Where I do that, Pop? Be specific.

                    • Colonial Viper …
                      26 March 2013 at 6:09 pm

                      Talk about “pseudo-intellectual”.

                • Populuxe1 …
                  26 March 2013 at 12:08 pm

                  Pretty sure I wasn’t in a tent in Kabul either.

                  • felix …
                    26 March 2013 at 12:27 pm

                    So what? What the fuck has that got to do with you trying to paint Harry as some war-weary victim in desperate need of hedonism?

                    Fuck off with your meaningless irrelevant anecdote.

              • fender …
                26 March 2013 at 11:50 am

                And yet others get a date with the Judge for drug use.

                Harry wouldn’t have faced the same dangers ‘our boys’ were exposed to.

                • Populuxe1 …
                  26 March 2013 at 12:15 pm

                  (1) you have no evidence for cocaine.
                  (2) the drugs are entirely a side issue as I would think most of us would favour decriminalisation of many anyway.
                  (3) You have absolutely no knowkedge of how or where Harry was deployed, nor do you seem to have any understanding of military culture.

                  • fender …
                    26 March 2013 at 12:33 pm

                    With you being privy to information about Harrys deployment why don’t you share these facts?

                    Harry is no Willie Apiata, and I’m sure the Palace INSISTED he return unharmed.

                    • Populuxe1 …
                      26 March 2013 at 1:10 pm

                      They don’t NEED him, he’s a SPARE. They need him even less now that Kate is up the duff. I know about as much about his deployment as you do, but unless he was tucked away in Kabul in the embassy bunker, nowhere in Afganistan is entirely safe. You’re sure about a lot of stuff you can’t possibly know because it suits your confirmation bias.

                      The military wouldn’t have given Harry special treatment in the field anyway – it would be bad for morale, military culture doesn’t operate that way, the Royals generally speaking don’t work like that, (especially after the flak from Harry being prevented from going to Iraq)and it would be completely contrary to established precedent – Prince Andrew as a pilot in the Falklands for example, the Queen driving at the age of 19 while serving with the Auxiliary Territorial Service during WW2.

                    • fender …
                      26 March 2013 at 1:22 pm

                      So that will explain why there is now no security for Harry /sarc, he’s ‘spare’ and ‘unneeded’, that’s ridiculously funny.

                    • Murray Olsen …
                      26 March 2013 at 6:04 pm

                      Half of these people probably believe the Palace killed Diana, so they’re unlikely to accept that the Palace would insist on Harry’s safety.

                    • Colonial Viper …
                      26 March 2013 at 6:22 pm

                      Harry is no Willie Apiata, and I’m sure the Palace INSISTED he return unharmed.

                      The Royals are damn serious about their military service. Are additional precautions taken? No doubt. But Royals in the service have been under enemy fire, exposed to IEDs, survived hostile missile attack, carried out out routine patrols and combat SARs. They get on with serving Queen and Country.

                      Is it an excuse for anything else? Who knows, but they’ll surely have days where they want to simply let off steam with the rest of the lads.

          • Morrissey 14.1.1.2.2
            26 March 2013 at 2:27 pm

            Your evidence that these women were sex workers?

            Let’s see… a Las Vegas hotel room, a room full of naked young women cavorting with Dionysian abandon, naked young men cavorting in like manner, enough alcohol to keep Brendan Horan going for a month, bowls full of cocaine, and most importantly (this one is the clincher) the august presence of one Prince Harry.

            One need not be a Leonhard Euler to do the math….

            • Populuxe1 14.1.1.2.2.1
              26 March 2013 at 3:32 pm

              So you don’t think liberated young American women might me intrigued enough by the glamour of royalty to engage of their own free will, in Vegas? They have to be sex workers (or whores and hookers as you insist on denegrating them)? And even if they were, so long as they’re not being coerced against their will, who actually gives a flying fuck?

              • Morrissey …
                26 March 2013 at 6:51 pm

                They have to be sex workers (or whores and hookers as you insist on denegrating them)?

                Ha! This is kinda funny! An exacting lesson in sensitive terminology from someone who has just spent several hours advocating for and defending the reputations of people who drop bombs on civilians.

                You have defended, indeed championed the “right” of creeps like Big H and his bomber pals to use those women as they see fit, and you have the nerve to upbraid me for not using your P.C. terminology to refer to the women. (Or were they girls? Or is that another word that transgresses against your byzantine code of appropriate terminology?)

                And even if they were, so long as they’re not being coerced against their will, who actually gives a flying fuck?

                Suddenly the sensitivity vanishes! The show of concern for these young women—we have to watch the very words used to refer to them—is abandoned.

                “Who actually gives a flying fuck?” Well, the “Big H” obviously does not, and neither do you. That’s useful for the rest of us to know.

                • felix …
                  26 March 2013 at 7:19 pm

                  Pop makes a fair point though: Who does actually give a fuck that Harry likes to party?

                  Pop is an offensive tool when he suggests that Harry parties because he’s a war hero with PTSD, but that aside, what’s the problem?

                  • Morrissey …
                    26 March 2013 at 8:17 pm

                    I too have no problem with Prince Harry partying, but unlike our good friend “Pop”, I object to his participation in the destruction of Afghanistan, and the way he is lionized by the establishment media for this.

                    I also object to the sanctimonious lecture about terminology from someone who “doesn’t give a fuck” about what brutes like the “Big H” do to these young women.

        • dumrse 14.1.1.3
          26 March 2013 at 8:56 pm

          Drops bombs ? I’m not too sure bombs are included in the weapon systems of his machine.

          • Morrissey 14.1.1.3.1
            26 March 2013 at 9:14 pm

            Yes I think you’re correct, my friend. There was an recently a barrage of adulatory articles about “Big H” after he had scored his first kill in Afghanistan. He did kill someone, but not with a bomb.

            I haven’t got the stomach to crawl into the archives to look it up right now.

    • prism 14.2
      26 March 2013 at 10:17 am

      And what about the invasion of privacy of Prince Harry and his companions. I bet that wasn’t mentioned on the news item. Did those at the party take the photos themselves? And were they naked actually? That word seems to be used carelessly to spice up items about people who are actually down to their undies. If they are caught with their undies down on photo what a bunch of exhibitionists and voyeurs we are to want to see this stuff.
      I

      • kiwi_prometheus 14.2.1
        26 March 2013 at 10:28 am

        So we are suppose to go along with the Palace pr machine of squeaky clean royals, their ‘good works’ and fairytale weddings?

        Give us the dirt!

        [lprent: see my note. ]

      • Morrissey 14.2.2
        26 March 2013 at 10:34 am

        Did those at the party take the photos themselves?

        They were taken by one of Big H’s “mates”. I think it was one of those heroes who bombs Afghan peasants when he’s not chasing whores in Vegas.

        And were they naked actually?

        I think so. Hookers generally are at orgies, I believe.

        • Populuxe1 14.2.2.1
          26 March 2013 at 11:28 am

          Maybe you should try it – it might loosten up the stick in your arse.

          • McFlock 14.2.2.1.1
            26 March 2013 at 11:55 am

            lol
            doubtful.

          • Rogue Trooper 14.2.2.1.2
            26 March 2013 at 11:58 am

            that is funny Pop (reminds me of a scene from the written version of King’s The Stand, which in turn reminds me of the NZ Right Wing Resistance on Seven Sharp last night; some very sad individuals huddling together there in there pseudo-Waffen SS uniforms; some of them looked like THEY should get out of the gene pool; which reminds me, if the Joker is a pseudo-intellectual, as you claim, does that make you a pseudo-arch-critic? 😉

            • Populuxe1 14.2.2.1.2.1
              26 March 2013 at 12:23 pm

              The Standard has policies about posters making guesses about the identities of other posters – even with little winking smileys. And I wouldn’t piss on a National Front member if they were on fire.

  15. Morrissey 15
    26 March 2013 at 10:46 am

    Trying to get a straight answer from Key is not easy
    TV3, Firstline, Tuesday 26 March 2013

    Every Tuesday morning, the Prime Minister comes in to be interviewed by Rachel Smalley on TV3’s “Firstline” program. He’s a pretty slippery character, and although she did have a go, it’s obviously hard to pin him down to an honest answer to any question…

    RACHEL SMALLEY: Under National, we’ve had massive leaks with Novopay, the EQC and WINZ. It looks to be systemic.

    JOHN KEY: Oh, I think it’s pretty much under control.

    RACHEL SMALLEY: But they keep happening!

    [Smalley could have—should have—confronted Key by reminding him of other, nastier leaks of private information by two of his own ministers. Unlike Novopay, EQC and WINZ, there was nothing accidental about the deliberate, vindictive leaks by Hekia Parata or Paula Bennett. Again, the question has to be asked: Why would Rachel Smalley NOT confront the Prime Minister with these embarrassing facts?]

    JOHN KEY: [speaking slowly to indicate seriousness] I think that now we live in a very different world. [brightening suddenly] To show you what I mean, we got an e-mail from a journalist that we should never have got, but we have a constructive working relationship with that journalist so we deleted it! [smiles magnanimously]

    RACHEL SMALLEY: [beaming smile] Oh now I’m intrigued! Who was it?

    JOHN KEY: Ha ha ha ha ha!

    RACHEL SMALLEY: Okay, to the Department of Conservation cuts. You are cutting frontline staff, aren’t you.

    JOHN KEY: Oh, we expect these agencies to operate in a more efficient way.

    [He rambles on for an extended time, while the camera cuts to RACHEL SMALLEY, frowning, clearly unconvinced.] …

    JOHN KEY: ….so we will have more doctors and nurses and teachers, and less administrators.

    RACHEL SMALLEY: [clearly annoyed] Okay, we’re going to have to leave it there.

    JOHN KEY: Okay, sure!

    RACHEL SMALLEY: And now it’s sports news with Huw Beynon.

    HUW BEYNON Firstly I’d like to apologize to the Prime Minister for those texts I sent!

    RACHEL SMALLEY: Oh! Ha ha ha ha ha!

    • framu 15.1
      26 March 2013 at 12:30 pm

      its so close to those parodies where the slice and dice the responses to make it look absurd, that its hard to tell that its not.

    • fender 15.2
      26 March 2013 at 1:01 pm

      Getting an article to proof read before its publication is hardly the same thing ShonKey boy.

  16. Penny Bright 16
    26 March 2013 at 10:49 am

    “Why does all this ‘growth’ have to come to Auckland Minister?”

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/2550212/government-and-auckland-council-at-odds-on-housing-land.asx

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/regional/131212/mayor,-minister-still-not-one-on-auckland-housing

    ‘Open Letter/ OIA request to Minister of Housing Nick Smith, from 2013 Auckland Mayoral candidate Penny Bright

    1) Please provide the information which confirms why all this ‘growth’ has to come to the Auckland region.
    ie: Which sectional groups are promoting Auckland ‘growth’ and why.

    2) Please provide the information which confirms that this National /Act Government has a ‘national growth strategy’, which extends south of the Bombay Hills.

    3) Please provide the information which confirms how ordinary New Zealanders benefit from Auckland ‘growth’, as opposed to property developers, speculators and overseas investors.

    4) Please provide a copy of National/ACT Government’s national ‘immigration’ strategy, which outlines planning for total numbers of future immigrants to New Zealand over the next 30 years.

    5) Please provide a copy of National/ACT Government’s national ‘immigration’ strategy, outlining how new migrants to New Zealand are/ will be encouraged to settle in parts of New Zealand, south of the Bombay Hills.

    6) Please provide a copy of the information upon which predictions of naturally-occurring population growth, both New Zealand-wide, and Auckland region-wide are based.

    Yours sincerely,

    Penny Bright
    Anti-corruption campaigner
    2013 Auckland Mayoral Candidate

  17. aerobubble 17
    26 March 2013 at 11:27 am

    So misconduct where a person reasonably could believe
    leads to the death of others is not a criminal offense????

    China, Turkey, had earthquates that exposed bad building
    practices and people were held account. But in NZ nothing!

    Key says he can’t do anything, its with the Police.

    Government can do something, pay for lawyers to
    start a civil case, against the developer, builder, council
    and engineer, wrongful death – civil damages.

    Professional groups need to know that the civil damages
    will be very high, so high that it pays their membership to
    get in early to manage negligence of their members.

  18. Rogue Trooper 18
    26 March 2013 at 12:09 pm

    from the tele;
    while many of the Filipino workers attracted to the CHCH rebuild are extorted for up-front “agency” fees to secure work, they are returning a proportion of re-insurers funds back offshore to support their families. Excellent! (having worked with tradesman from S.E Asia, I found them to be, generally, very hardworking, efficient and conscientious; similarly, tradesmen from Samoa, while rudimentary in their approach at times, were very versatile and able to improvise as required.)

    Ha! EQC leaked the data to one of their worst critics.

    “An ageing population will hit us all in the pocket”
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/8470727/Ageing-population-will-drive-up-wages-report
    (more “haircuts”)

    “We do not do what we want, and yet we are responsible for what we are that is the fact.”
    -Jean-Paul Sartre
    (sure is a great writer that Mark Story; a man after my own beating heart.)

  19. prism 19
    26 March 2013 at 12:19 pm

    Another acronym that’s going to be important to know. DSRNA. Heard radionz 12.15pm.

    wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RNADouble-stranded RNA

    Double-stranded RNA (dsRNA) is RNA with two complementary strands, similar to the DNA found in all cells. dsRNA forms the genetic material of some viruses (double-stranded RNA viruses). Double-stranded RNA such as viral RNA or siRNA can trigger RNA interference in eukaryotes, as well as interferon response in vertebrates.

    It has just been approved by ‘responsible’ food authorities in Oz and of course NZ, now dinghy NZ bobs along in its wake. It is cleared to be in soybeans that will be used for human food though there isn’t sufficient research to understand what effect this will have on our functions.

  21. Draco T Bastard 21
    26 March 2013 at 3:24 pm

    Good read on journalism and how it dehumanises people.

    Most grandmothers in NewZealand are highly likely to be superannuitants, which is to say beneficiaries, but you wouldn’t call them that. There is politics, too, in such decisions, which however for the professional soon cease to be decisions and become automatic reflexes. Mother, grandmother, immigrant, beneficiary, Maori youth, unemployed: these isn’t who we are, but who we become when reality needs to be described in dispassionate shorthand. As if it were that simple. As if that human taxonomy didn’t contain, in highly compressed form, an entire ideology. As if the function of those common nouns weren’t to ensure that all of those stories – from the most trivial to the most tragic – taken together will reproduce, in mosaic form, the society we have come to believe in.

  22. Rogue Trooper 22
    26 March 2013 at 3:51 pm

    excellent analysis from BBB; some of the freakin’ people who pass themselves off as journalists in this country should be “shot with a ball of their own crap” (and that includes you Rachel Wise; LIVE)

    • Rogue Trooper 22.1
      26 March 2013 at 4:01 pm

      sorry Draco. That should read “shot with a ball of their own “self-important, middle-class, bourgeois, life-style, block, crap.”

  23. Rogue Trooper 23
    26 March 2013 at 4:14 pm

    anyway, from QT
    English-taking economy at “face value”; “lets just see how it unfolds” (must have taken a spare hand from his gambling colleague John).

    Smith, on DoC- “not happy to have DoC “advocating on behalf of land-scape values when jobs may be at stake.”
    yet,

    a small country like NZ has “2800 threatened species”-Sage. (excluding the poor, of course).
    -the push for “volunteerism” in DoC as well is just another systemic signal; intention is to reduce the number of Conservancy Boards.
    -Amy Adams-“Minister who wants to lower environmental standards.”-Guy Salmon

    meanwhile,
    Tolley cannot help bringing her thumb to her mouth, anticipating a chewing of her own quick; suggesting…

    Parata appears to be a lame duck now, just a matter of time.

    watched (Northern) “Territory Cops” (kinda like the old Australian Post / People magazines).How primal can humanity get, yet they discriminate against the “black fellas”.Interestingly, coppers defer to the Angels, even associates; it’s an Angels World. 😉

    http://www.hells-angels.com/ Red and White Forever

  24. Rogue Trooper 24
    26 March 2013 at 4:20 pm

    speaking of Heckyeah;
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10873729
    Ombudsmans Investigation

  25. karol 25
    26 March 2013 at 4:33 pm

    Watching committee stage of the Social Security (Benefit Categories and Work Focus) Amendment Bill.

    Tell me again why the Labour caucus switched from Goff to Shearer? Sharp and passionate speech, Phil.

    • just saying 25.1
      26 March 2013 at 6:17 pm

      Thank you for the alert Karol. I’ve been watching.

      I may be a wildly overoptimistic fool, but I believe the Standard is having a small positive effect on some of our parliamentarians. I know the LP caucus loathe us on the whole, but I feel we may be stirring long dormant consciences in some members, and reminding those members what and who they they got into politics to support and foster. I think they too may have been affected by the almost complete loss of the left-wing narrative and may be affected by exposure, even despite themselves.

      Nothing radical, just little things.

      Callout to Xtasy, did you see Ardern finally taking Dr David Bratt’s nasty bullshit to task? I know you sent her the ammunition, and were beginning to despair of her ever using it.

      • karol 25.1.1
        26 March 2013 at 6:36 pm

        js, are you talking about Ardern’s speech to part 2?.

        I don’t think she mentioned Bratt by name, but referred to the dodgy way people are selected to make assessments of people on invalid/sickness benefits.

        :). The immaculate conception memo re- women beneficiaries seem to have given birth without the contribution of a man.
        She also delivered quite a passionate speech for part 1.

        PS; listening again – yes she does mention Bratt by name.

  27. freedom 27
    26 March 2013 at 6:11 pm

    meanwhile the big guy’s story carries on, largely ignored and they slip this through hoping no-one will notice, well of course no-one will notice when the story is buried in soft peat for three months and recycled as firelighters. (apologies to mr adams)

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10873386

  28. Murray Olsen 28
    26 March 2013 at 6:16 pm

    What action do those who gain enlightenment from youtube and know things that the rest of us don’t suggest we take to head off the impending doom? Apart from watching more youtube videos of dubious accuracy and proclaiming that we subsequently know some deep truths, I have never seen any practical suggestions.
    All I have seen is “Don’t vote Green because Mugabe”, which could equally have come from Roger Douglas or Milton Friedman, and without any suggestion as to positive and useful actions, is just laughable.

  29. freedom 29
    26 March 2013 at 8:42 pm

    (this started over at QOT’s piece but I didn’t want to go off topic so much, so moved it here)

    said with all the love in the world:

    if the kids aren’t yours, you are a foster parent, blood no blood,
    it is semantics like that which got us all into this mess

    let me jump straight to the most extreme example i can think of

    ‘stop violence against women’ this is wrong, it should read
    ‘stop violence’

    maybe a bit more simple direct unambiguous communication would show up the solutions we are all cowering from? Don’t ask me why this particular post is tweaking a nerve but probably just a small stress fracture from recent events. Like many, I am sick to the back teeth I barely have with all the softshoe bs of this grand and expansive hunt for solutions the world is meandering from when the reality on the ground has the suave disregard of a drunk on a bulldozer loose in a theme park

    we know the banks are corrupt
    we know the system is rigged
    we know civil rights are dissapearing
    we know poverty can be fixed tomorrow
    we know we have poisoned the waters and the skies and the earth between
    we know greed has replaced gravity as the principal law of action on earth

    in short we all allow it to continue
    and unless we all decide to lose something that we each hold dear then nothing will change
    what that is? differs for us all

    but we all know one thing in our individual lives that we can forfeit
    for the betterment of others

    • muzza 29.1
      26 March 2013 at 9:22 pm

      Well written Freedom, you are on the correct path.

      but we all know one thing in our individual lives that we can forfeit
      for the betterment of others

      This I am not so sure about, as to me it feels like people have lost their way, or more accurately had their compass buried under all the crap, which passes for modern life!

      I do not believe that people have it in them to accept they are going to have to give up some things now, in order that there is a future, its just not registering on any level which will reveal an opportunity for change.

      It matters not in the greater scheme of things, because the systems need to blow out, they need to break completely, and those same people who have had their compass buried, will be forced to give something up. Sadly for those who understand this, they too will get similar treatment, but its ok because it now has to be that way for people to learn and understand, what was lost by them being complacent, apathetic, and lazy!

  30. Morrissey 30
    26 March 2013 at 9:11 pm

    Here’s an idea for the S.S. Trust

    Looks like that ranting, violent halfwit Curtis Sliwa is spawning more hate groups. I wouldn’t be surprised if Herr McVicar is working on something like this….

    http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2013/03/25/1772141/racist-hate-group-to-conduct-nighttime-patrols-on-college-campus/

  31. millsy 31
    26 March 2013 at 11:12 pm

    Hey Chris73, out of curiousity:

    What is your opinion on the My Lai massacre?

    Would you do the same? If you knew you would get away with it.

    Honest answers please.

    • Morrissey 31.1
      27 March 2013 at 6:41 am

      Since Chris73 lacks the moral fibre to give an honest answer, I will answer for him.

      millsy: What is your opinion on the My Lai massacre?

      chris73 acualy is Dolan: Shit happens. It’s war. I’d be cool if the Vietnamese had sent troops into, say, the unprepossessing little town of Gig Harbor, Washington and machine-gunned and bludgeoned nearly every one of its citizens to death, then thrown their corpses into ditches, as well as burning down every building in the town. That’s because shit happens.

      millsy: Would you do the same? If you knew you would get away with it.

      chris73 acualy is Dolan: [long pause, indicating serious thought] Yes.

      ….[millsy is silent for several seconds, to emphasize how appalled he is.]….

      millsy: [incredulous tone] How could this BE?

  32. Draco T Bastard 32
    26 March 2013 at 11:19 pm

    On the Loss from Trade

    Here is the abstract:

    Consider models of international trade in which capital goods are produced, not given as an unproduced endowment. A positive interest rate, in such a model, acts as a price distortion. Consequently, the gains of trade, when comparing stationary states with and without trade, can be negative. Previous authors have drawn this result in models with production depicted as a circular process, even though their point does not depend on this modeling choice. The principle contributions of this paper are to provide a demonstration of the possibility of such a loss from trade in a simplified model with “a one-way avenue … lead[ing] from ‘Factors of production’ to ‘Consumption goods'” and to illustrate the model with a concrete numerical example. The theory of comparative advantage is not sufficient to justify the advocacy of free trade in consumer goods, even under textbook assumptions.

    And yet another support of neo-liberalism collapses.