Written By:
Eddie - Date published:
8:45 pm, October 17th, 2012 - 69 comments
Categories: john key, Minister for Photo-ops, slippery -
Tags: GCSB, kim dotcom, lies
One of the fishy elements of the GCSB-Dotcom-Key saga (along with the literally unbelievable ineptitude of the GCSB, the timing of Key’s visit to the White House coinciding with the denial of Dotcom’s OIO application, time timing of the ministerial certificate when Key was again out of the country in the US, and the ‘oversight’ of Neazor) is Key’s suddenly very faulty memory. This is a guy who will quote you stock and exchange prices from 25 years ago but can’t remember basic facts in this major issue. Here’s a partial list of things Key can’t recall, isn’t sure about, or doesn’t know – just from his answers in the House and just the last 3 days he has answered questions.
Dotcom Case—Actions of Government Communications Security Bureau – 26 September 2012
David Shearer: Is he aware of any involvement by staff from the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet, the SIS, or the National Assessments Bureau in the Dotcom case; if so, what involvement was that?
Rt Hon JOHN KEY: I am not sure about the latter two, the SIS and the National Assessments Bureau. The Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet may have been advised. I do not know that—I would have to go and check that—but it is possible it would have known in that period when I was told on Monday the 17th.
Dotcom Case—Actions of Government Communications Security Bureau – 26 September 2012
David Shearer: Did he receive any advice from those agencies in the past 12 months in relation to the Kim Dotcom case?
Rt Hon JOHN KEY: Not in relation to this issue. I was informed of that only on 17 September. Whether there was earlier advice on extradition and other matters, I am not sure. I do not think so.
Government Communications Security Bureau—Prime Ministerial Responsibility – 26 September 2012
Rt Hon Winston Peters: When was his chief of staff first informed about the Deputy Prime Minister signing a ministerial certificate on 16 August, which withheld information from the public regarding Government Communications Security Bureau operations in the Dotcom raid?
Rt Hon JOHN KEY: I do not exactly know, but to the best of my knowledge it was on Monday the 17th when I knew.
Dotcom Case—Government Communications Security Bureau Briefings – 16 October 2012
Rt Hon JOHN KEY: I seek leave to make a personal explanation to correct answers I gave to oral questions during the last sitting week.
Mr SPEAKER: Leave is sought for that purpose. Is there any objection? There is no objection.
Rt Hon JOHN KEY: A number of oral questions put to me and the Minister answering on my behalf in the House between 25 and 27 September were based on public statements by me that the first I knew of the Government Communications Security Bureau’s involvement in the Dotcom matter was on 17 September. That response was based on my recollection. It was shared by the director of the bureau.
A subsequent review of all material held by the bureau found that on 29 February I had viewed a presentation that was not related to the Dotcom file, during a visit to the bureau. I am advised that the talking points for the presentation included a short reference to the Dotcom arrest as an example of cooperation between the bureau and the police. The cover slide was a montage of 11 small images, one of which was of Dotcom. Neither the presentation nor the talking points were provided to me in hard copy. Neither the director of the bureau or I can recall the reference to the Dotcom matter during the visit, but I accept that it may well have been made.
I wish to make it clear that I was not briefed by the bureau on its role in the Dotcom matter, nor any issues of potential illegality, until Monday, 17 September. This information affects the answers to three specific supplementary questions during oral question No. 1 and oral question No. 10 on 26 September, and oral question No. 2 on 27 September, but I also accept that it did impact on the questions that were asked during the course of the week. My answers to questions were based on my recollection at the time and the view of the director. There was no intention to mislead the House.
Dotcom Case—Actions of Government Communications Security Bureau – 16 October 2012
David Shearer: On what date did the Government Communications Security Bureau first become aware that its surveillance of Kim Dotcom was illegal?
Rt Hon JOHN KEY: The first day that I was briefed by the Government Communications Security Bureau about it being illegal was likely to be the 17th.
David Shearer: Point of order—
Mr SPEAKER: I think I can predict the Leader of the Opposition’s point of order. The member actually asked on what date the Government Communications Security Bureau became aware that its investigation may have been illegal, not the date on which the Prime Minister was advised of that.
Rt Hon JOHN KEY: I do not have that date to hand.
Dotcom Case—Actions of Government Communications Security Bureau – 16 October 2012
David Shearer: In light of his answer to written question No. 8353, where he confirmed that he discussed the Government Communications Security Bureau’s illegal surveillance of Dotcom with the Attorney-General but was unable to recall which other two Ministers he raised the issue with, can he now recall and tell the House who those other Ministers were?
Rt Hon JOHN KEY: No.
Dotcom Case—Government Communications Security Bureau Staffing – 17 October 2012
Rt Hon Winston Peters: Is he saying as Minister that a member of the Prime Minister’s protection squad with a record of 15 years’ service to Prime Ministers, including himself, never told him as Prime Minister of his intention to leave the Diplomatic Protection Squad to go to work for Kim Dotcom?
Rt Hon JOHN KEY: The member is referring to a chap whose last name I do not know; his first name is Regan. He does not work for the Diplomatic Protection Squad; he works for—or he used to work for—VIP Transport Services in Auckland, and, no, I was not aware that he went to work for Kim Dotcom.
Dotcom Case—Actions of Government Communications Security Bureau – 17 October 2012
David Shearer: Which of his ministerial colleagues, other than the Attorney-General, did he discuss the Government Communications Security Bureau’s unlawful surveillance of Mr Dotcom with prior to the bureau’s actions being made public?
Rt Hon JOHN KEY: I do not know the answer to those questions.
Dotcom Case—Actions of Government Communications Security Bureau – 17 October 2012
David Shearer: How, then, can he be sure he actually spoke to Ministers if he cannot actually recall who they were?
Rt Hon JOHN KEY: I remember having a discussion; I think it was with the Attorney-General. I am sure there were another couple of Ministers there, but I do not recall who they were.
Dotcom Case—Actions of Government Communications Security Bureau – 17 October 2012
Rt Hon Winston Peters: How can the Prime Minister possibly give an assurance that that matter was not raised by the Hon Simon Power with him back in June 2011, as he just did, when in his formal writing to me in a written answer he said: “There is no record of what was discussed … and I have no recollection of the discussion.”? How can he reconcile those two statements: the one today and the written one in the House?
Rt Hon JOHN KEY: Quite easily because I do not recall the exact conversation of why Simon came to me on that particular occasion, but I know for a fact it was not about Kim Dotcom.
Income Tax (Universalisation of In-work Tax Credit) Amendment Bill—Prime Minister’s Statements – 17 October 2012
Metiria Turei: Is the Prime Minister aware that my bill is an opportunity to lift 100,000 children out of poverty, but would have no effect at all on millionaires and the rich, who would remain ineligible for the in-work tax credit, just as they are now?
Rt Hon JOHN KEY: Yes, broadly I am aware of it, although I am also advised that if the in-work tax credit equivalent was paid to beneficiary families, it would cost more than $1.5 billion over 4 years. I do not know the financial costs of the member’s payment.
11 memory lapses in 3 question times. So, what do you think: does the Prime Minister have a serious memory problem that is impairing his ability to do his job, or is he lying to you?
Update: got to tip my hat to Te Reo Putake’s name for the PM: DunnoKeyo
The server will be getting hardware changes this evening starting at 10pm NZDT.
The site will be off line for some hours.
I guess the #JohnDotBanks disease is contagious.
And Key has caught it big-time.
I think we have a case of the ‘rat brain’ taking over of Keys memory functions from the normal ‘reasoning brain’. Doesnt sound like the same person who rose to the top of his profession, in a highly competitive and intellectually demanding role in the heart of Wall St.
DunnoKeyo is my word of the day. Feel free to use it liberally, Standardistas.
Cute!
Don Key becomes DunnoKeyo. Very nice.
Cheers, r0b, Cv and eddie. I’m hoping Dunnokeyo sticks, it nicely combines both his supposed memory loss and his actual lies. A chocolate fish to the first MP to use it in question time!
just slipped it quietly onto on a friend’s wall (a Nat fan) and got one hellofalot of nasty noise back for doing so before it got firmly deleted so I guess it works a treat! Yay you!
Noice, Te – was playing round with Keynesian Misfit for the arty set but….nah, Dunnokeyo rocks.
Fabulous!
Beats Shonkey Johnkey and Key John Il hands down. 🙂
Then we had better sprinkle this word liberally amongst the general population in the hope that is sticks in the minds of a few.
HAHAHA I just Googled it
https://www.google.co.nz/search?q=DunnoKeyo&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a
It’s like a mudslide, once it’s started…
Fantastic, David, so this is how meme’s start, eh? Great that Ianmac has used it on Red Alert, the offer of a choccy fish still stands for any MP’s who want to pick it up!
DunnoKeyo is perfect Te Reo! Hat off to you. Have put the pic with the name on Facebook.
Hahaha
That is brilliant Te Reo.
Everyone should use it here and hopefully the MSM cottons on to it and starts referring to him as that as well.
He is becoming a comedy act. The whole country is laughing
Reminded me of this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rd1rXB0rGiE
In fact, I think Key is using some direct quotes.
Hahaha The Puppet/Muppet
It’s quite simple, he’s a liar.
he doesnt remember how he voted on the drinking age either. perhaps he and banks can get a discount on a brain scan
It is very obvious isn’t it some people call it porkies
Winston referred to it as lying on National Radio today!
And Winston said it on the news last night – ‘He’s a liar and he can sue me if he wants’ (paraphrasing).
Interesting he’s the only one to really call him out!
Keep up the good work guys. Hours banging away and getting nowhere. You are almost close to nailing John Key. Please keep up the posts.
the epmu and the opposition parties just had anAWESOME jobs summit, the public are responding to the jobs issue, the education issues, the issues around the fuck up at MSD, and all labour want to do is try and score some minor points on an issue no one cares about. They can’t even do it right but have vested so much in this outcome that cheerleaders like eddie are ordered to keep waving the flag, even if it has become a stone round their necks.
[lprent: I think that I or mike might be able to order Eddie to do something if it involved the good of the site like litigation. I don’t think anyone else could. And we don’t do it for editorial direction.
And you are banned for two weeks. Reread the self-martyrdom offenses in the policy. ]
TR shows clearly his intelligence when he describes a flag as being a stone!
[lprent: I think he showed it when he attacked an author not for what they had said but for something that is his pure speculation about the motivations of an author. He was just damn lucky I saw it after breakfast and couldn’t be bothered seeing if he’d been banned or warned about it before.
If I’d seen it right now then he could have gotten 2 months. I’m much more cranky, have a better memory, and am more assiduous after programming for while. ]
Keep up the transferrance young fisssi……(or is that hissy)…You must have spent YEARS banging away for no more reward than to be publicly humiliated, and exposed as an ignoramus….
Any day now, you will have nailed the title of “most incurable sociopathic tory dittohead” … And believe me, the competition for that particular gong is intense….There are a LOT of tory meatheads around trying to pretend they know things….
Indeed, if they start checking all the “Tabled” documents, they should be able to slaughter JK on anything.
He’s always done this, for some reason it’s only starting to be “apparent” mainstream, although some media/journalists/reporters have highlighted it for some time.
QA/Accountability is the real problem.
I enjoyed Gerry Brownlee’s unusually astute comments in yesterday’s urgent debate:
I was rather amused, astounded-yet relieved-that he would take a moment to be so frank in reference to his Dear Leader and Co…disappointing that he felt the need to add: “… and I speak about Ministers from other Governments in the past.”
I guess this was to be expected in order to keep up [delusional] appearances, although I like to think that the first part of his comment really must have been his inner truth-speaker coming out uncontrollably for a few moments…
That he felt the need to add a qualifier is telling enough.
+1
Another very recent Brain Fade for DunnoKeyo reported on Red Alert.
Key said on TV3 that he voted for 20 Drinking Age.
He must have forgotten that he voted for the 18 option.
http://blog.labour.org.nz/2012/10/17/another-john-key-brain-fade/#comments
.
Wait a minute…
“The surname of his driver who went to work for Dotcom last year and, Peters says, told Key about it”
Watch the video: http://inthehouse.co.nz/node/15538
Key never said the “VIP Transport Service”. He said “VIPs in Auckland”. I thought he was referring to the VIP Protection Squad – see: http://www.policeassn.org.nz/newsroom/publications/featured-articles/-day-life-diplomatic-protection-service
Bear in mind that a ‘serving police officer’, said to have served with the DPS, was working for Dotcom’s security team at the time of the raid: http://www.smh.com.au/technology/technology-news/dotcom-in-prang-as-over-the-top-raid-scrutinised-20120810-23y6k.html
There has to be something more to this story. For a start, why would the NZ Police be providing Dotcom with personal protection? And second of all, how did Key know the person Peters was referring to? This just gets murkier.
Its called moonlighting, cops especially do it all the time
Simon Powers resignation came at an unusual time in the electoral cycle. It is very convenient for Key that it was Power who prevented Dotcom from buying the Coatsville property, and it is possible Powers was more involved in the Dotcom case than we currently know.
Interestingly one of Keys first responses to questions about What Powers knew was ” I dunno, and he’s gone now”…………..(Campbell Live)
Good thinking. Would DotCom have bought his way into NZ, against Simon Power’s objections, and then the US pressure would have come on?
This case is all about money, and political influence at the highest level, via Banks and Key. DotCom got legal residence and been law abiding. His legal problems are with the US. The NZ illegal surveillance is just that – illegal. And DotCom has the money to hire serious lawyers. He can’t be intimidated like Bennett’s Bennies.
Hard to believe that Key would not have been involved in this case, possibly right from DotCom’s arrival onwards. People like him do not arrive in NZ every day.
And people like DotCom, arriving in spectacular fashion right in your electorate, and raising a ruckus with the locals and the FBI – to be ‘unaware’ of this is truly unbelievable.
A carefully crafted scenario of ‘plausible deniability’ for Key is falling apart.
The next chapter will be what ‘Agent CX’ has to say. Presumably the Official Secrets Act does not apply to acts of illegality in NZ?
Certainly a space to watch.
Power left way to early and also look where he ended up Westpac. Well bugger me fancy that. Simon Power a junior lawyer that became a MP and Cabinet minister ends up with a high flying job in Finance? How convenient!
John Campbell also said all enquiries to John Keys Helensville office reagarding anything to do with Dotcom was referred to Simon Power (before the bust). So Powers was def involved in the loop(s).
Its also incredible John Key can get away with not remembering who the other 2 ministers were that he talked to with Chris Finlayson.
I thought Key would go with the BMW lies, seems a long time ago now…
In Key speak, “I dunno”, has a different meaning to “I don’t know”. The latter is statement of fact. The former an arrogantly dismissive, I have decided not to tell you what I know.
Look at the body language when he says it. The shoulder shrug, the dismissive glance away.
I am lying and I don’t care if you know it.
I think the Prime Minister has things that he knows privately that he doesn’t know officially – it’s all about wiggle room.
Thus “I dunno” translates as “The Prime Minister has received no official advice on this matter.”
What he’s forgetting to do is advise himself.
He’s going to say anything rather than give open and honest answers to these questions. The answers must be pretty bad.
Either that or the rumours he wants out and has been refused permission are true, so he’s deliberately doing the worst job he possibly can in the hope they’ll sack him.
PS: I see old Harry Palfrey’s been put out to pasture.
Yes I’ve been thinking this lately too. He’s riding on the idea that as the prime minister he doesn’t necessarily know about all the things that John Key knows about.
Robertson’s next question time: Does the Prime Minister have any confidence in the competence of John Key?
Key does not care a damn who knows that he is always lying. The only thing that matters is that the constant lying seems to be working so well for him. His supporters ethical values do not embrace the sin of lying.
Key has an agenda, it is being pushed through – in fact most of the his plans are already completed if we look back – so he couldn’t care less what anyone thinks.
He just sips in another breath, shrugs his shoulders and slithers away. No one has really laid a glove on the man – and it won’t until after he’s gone and there is an enquiry that will take 3 years to complete (ala Blair).
Seriously, Key will complete this term and disappear to a top job at a bank somewhere – he couldn’t give a toss. Perhaps he will end up in the US (if civil war hasn’t broken out).
My first thought when I read about Key not trying any more was “whatever reward he was expecting, he got it while overseas, and doesn’t have to maintain the facade”. I think he got US Citizenship. (no proof or evidence at all to back that up, by the way). I can’t think what else his US masters could do for him?
I also think he’d be gone by lunchtime, but he needs to cover up the Dotcom thing or his knighthood might be in danger.
There seem to be two direct and well documented challenges this week to government credibility.
1. Bennett’s statement to parliament that she had not released any personal data on beneficiaries, when the Privacy Commissioner found that she had.
2. Peters’ accusation of Key’s lying, on the TV news last evening. Breathtaking stuff.
Difficult to see how these can be avoided. And if they can’t be refuted, what then?
It is not often in NZ that there are (serious) calls for the government to resign. Perhaps the time has come.
Maybe someone can supply chapter, verse and the links for the above?
Get it right. Paula Bennett was accused in parliament of leaking information. She did NOT leak it, She was quite upfront about correcting a the wrong impression given by the media.
The terminology in the question was “release”, not “leak”.
She answered that she didn’t “leak”, which to an idiot sounds like she answered the question.
She did that because she’s a deceptive person. And you fell for it because you’re an easily deceived person.
Wow, it’s like you think we’re foolish for not being as stupid as you are.
Re the GCSB Camera in the cafe- cameras these days are computers- with internal memory
1. Has it been confirmed the there was a camera present?
2. Is the location of the camera right now known?
3. If so it may be possible to look at the internal (non removable)memory of the camera to look at the log and see when it was recording- not this would mean that someone had set the clock correctly on the camera in the first place-
So if the camera exists and if the camera’s clock had been set when they got it then the camera could be easily analysed to see when it was used- i.e. when it was recording.- even if the clock is wrong it would still be able to be determined when it was recording
Ok some big ifs in there. Maybe worth getting it checked out by an expert
The National government has one Minister with onset Alzheimers and a Prime Minister with brain fade….
One would think both medical conditions would rule them out for being the offical carers of a country of four and a half million souls in the year of 2012.
What is going to be the future of our country, souless leaders will create a souless nation- perhaps a souless nation is easier to control and that’s the plan.
It’s broken, souless people who are easiest to control.
That’s why they smash away at employment and housing security, smash away at education and training prospects, smash away at the job market and at wage levels, smash away at peoples’ sense of self worth and self confidence.
After todays revelations I’m gonna soberly finish up here Viper.
Thanks
(beware entrapment in the net)
🙂
The Prime Minister has today apologised for misleading the public after comments in a 3 News story last night on the drinking age.
Read more: http://www.3news.co.nz/Key-apologises-for-drinking-age-brain-fade/tabid/1607/articleID/273258/Default.aspx#ixzz29dF0odyF
At least Key is learning to take ownership of when he is made aware that on a few occasions he gets it wrong/caught out
Makes you wonder about this.
http://auckland.scoop.co.nz/2012/08/national-mp-admits-about-alcohol-industry/
“Following the purchase age debate last night, expect a government charm offensive to begin, aimed at convincing everyone that the government remains serious about alcohol-related harm and the urgent need for reform.”
Or as in the S59 petition the question that was asked in parliament was ambiguous and many politicians were thinking that they voted one way (increasing the drinking age) and in fact were voting against their intentions (status quo)???
At least Key is becoming very predictable in his behavior, we know what we are getting now !!
At least Key is learning to take ownership of when he is made aware that on a few occasions he gets it wrong/caught out
Lol.
Yes, he is exceptionally honest when clear evidence of a barefaced lie has caught him like a rat in a trap.
At least the John ‘brain-fade’ Key meme is catching on in the MSM. Once that starts happening you don’t get many strikes before you’re out. Which has do be a worry for ol’ memory lapse since that been his go to card lately.
A you tube clip of a yes minister piece on the confused memory of politcians and how civil servants manage the taking of minutes of meetings. Sir Humphrey instructs Bernard, and asks what he wants from the exercise. Bernard says ‘A clear conscience’. Sir Humphrey asks seriously “And when did you get such a taste for luxury?’
Yes Prism. Very apt. Pity about emails and video cameras and archives these days. Must make a Prime Minister like ours sleep poorly at night. Tough John.
EDDIE and others: Who gives a damned crappy whatever, this what you clearly and well present here MATTERS NOT!
You are still a “fringe media”, “social media”, of which maybe a few hundred or a couple of a thousand “informed” and hopefully “intelligent” people know and bother to look up on.
The MAINSTREAM dumbing down media continues with their agenda, and they are what still 3 quarters of the population rely on for “news”, like it or not. They listen to the propaganda from “ONE News”, “TV3” and other channels, under the regime of modern day “Goebbels” like media professionals in the background.
So you raise valid points, but it does not reach enough, and it never will, with this approach, no matter how sincere and well-meaning it all is.
This does NOT work I am afraid! It is a lost battle. More needs to be done.
Maybe have initiative groups established to “re-claim” and occupy the public media that is supposed to be in public hands. What about an occupation of TVNZ? Throw the corrupt lot out and take over what is supposed to be the people’s broadcaster?
But of course, you live in gaga land, the youth are all coward, busy to plan uni and other careers and their eventual OE exit (some for good). There are racial, ethnic, religious and political, certainly social divisions, which do not help. All are number one focused, so how are you going to change this.
You have NO answers, I am afraid. Time for a REAL REVOLUTION! That takes more than talking and writing, I am afraid!
Your numbers are somewhat low. According to google analytics, there have been 28 thousand plus unique people reading the site over the last 30 or 31 days. Bots are excluded. Well over 95% from within NZ. It is somewhat lower than an election year, but a damn sight more even with some double counting by google than a few thousand.
Preparations for the revolution are in their final stage. For more details go to http://www.burnitalldown.com/
He’s the only adult in NZ in 1981 who can’t remember what view they held on the Springbok Tour…
He’s waiting for the next TV3 Poll before he commits M8!
http://www.DunnoKeyo.com and http://www.DunnoKeyo.co.nz are both available. They could be useful next election.
I’ve registered the Twitter account. Nothing up on it yet, though.
Is that nose growing bigger by the day, or is it my vivid imagination?
I can feel a musical coming on…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TxJ2sy299eg (you probably have to be over 40 to appreciate this)
Do you love me Dunnokeyo?
Tell me lies and your nose will grow
With that poor wooden part
That you call a heart
Do you love me Dunnokeyo?
You are just a Dunnokeyo boy
In the shape
Of a marionette toy
But if I cut the strings
And let your heart sing
Will you give me life full of joy?
Do you love me Dunnokeyo?
Tell me lies and your nose will grow
With that poor wooden part
That you call a heart
Do you love me Dunnokeyo?
You are just a Dunnokeyo man
In the grip
Of Gupetto’s hand
But if I cut the twine
Will you say your mine
And share all the things that we planned
Do you love me Dunnokeyo?
Tell me lies and your nose will grow
With that poor wooden part
That you call a heart
Do you love me Dunnokeyo?
And then there is this 👿
Pinocchio does excellently in school and passes with high honors. The Fairy promises that Pinocchio will be a real boy next day and says he should invite all his friends to a party. He goes to invite everyone, but he is sidetracked when he meets a boy named Romeo—nicknamed Lampwick because he is so tall and skinny. Lampwick is about to go to a place called Toyland, where everyone plays all day and never works. Pinocchio goes along with him and they have a wonderful time in the land of Play—until one morning Pinocchio awakes with donkey ears. A Squirrel tells him that boys who do nothing but play and never work always grow into donkeys.
Within a short while Pinocchio has become a donkey. He is sold to a circus and is trained to do all kinds of tricks. Then one night in the circus he falls and sprains his leg. The circus owner sells the donkey to a man who wants to skin him and make a drum. The man throws the donkey into the sea to drown him—and brings up a living wooden boy. Pinocchio explains that the fish ate all the donkey skin off of him and he is now a marionette again.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Adventures_of_Pinocchio#As_a_donkey
@ Weka
hmm..do you think that Toyland is a suburb of Planet Key by any chance? Sounds related somehow…
Billy Thorpe & The Aztecs – Most People I Know Think That I’m Crazy