Changing gears: Cars of tomorrow coming soon?

Written By: - Date published: 10:23 pm, May 16th, 2009 - 26 comments
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Whenever I spot one of the dual electric/petrol cars I always find myself a little fascinated and a little envious. But I have to admit the likelihood of my actually owning one seems remote. Maybe I need to be pushed along, as this article from the Herald Sun suggests:

A proposal to ban sales of new petrol-powered cars in Norway from 2015 could help spur struggling carmakers to shift to greener models, Finance Minister Kristin Halvorsen said.

“This is much more realistic than people think when they first hear about this proposal,” she said, defending a plan by her Socialist Left Party to outlaw sales of cars that run solely on fossil fuels in six years’ time.

“The financial crisis also means that a lot of those car producers that now have big problems … know that they have to develop their technology because we also have to solve the climate criss when this financial crisis is over,” she said.

I know there are many issues around the use of biofuels and that electric cars are still only a small proportion of the market, but change away from what we’re used to (and what’s most affordable) is always going to be difficult. For example if we do end up with electric cars as the dominant type where do we get that extra electricity from? There is no one answer to our future transport needs but we do need to encourage different options (which is why the Meridian/ Mitsubshi trial looks interesting). Any bets on what mode of transport will be moving our grandchildren around?

26 comments on “Changing gears: Cars of tomorrow coming soon? ”

  1. Con 1

    Any bets on what mode of transport will be moving our grandchildren around?

    After the collapse of modern civilisation? Walking.

  2. Pat 2

    Interesting to see that a Chinese company have produced a low cost electric car that can travel 100km on the battery, and can be recharged in the garage overnight. This is ready for mass production as I understand. They are also developing a solar sunroof to recharge the battery as you are driving.

    The company was originally formed 8 years ago to develop and manufacture mobile phone batteries, and it has taken them only 5 years to develop this electric car.

    Just as with the mobile phone and the internet, we will be surprised at the pace of change in the next 10 years.

    • Matha 2.1

      [quote]They are also developing a solar sunroof to recharge the battery as you are driving.[/quote]

      Nothing more than a gimmick. There’s about 1.5M(2) of roof, and with 1000 kW/M(2) at 15% efficiency (which is around average to good for a solar panel) you get 225 Watts, and with 6 hours of peak sun light thats 1.350 kWh. According to this [http://www.carbonrationing.org.uk/fora/threads/electric-cars] it’s about 150 Wh to the kilometre. That’s about 9 kilometres for a six hour charge. Never mind the efficiency loss when taking in weight of the panel, or being parked in shade etc.

      • Con 2.1.1

        9km/day is about 1/4 of the average for vehicles in NZ. For some vehicles, it would be considerably more than 1/4. So no, not a gimmick at all.

  3. If the cars are charged overnight then we may have enough power generation already. Smarter power management, so that the car can be plugged in as soon as you get home but doesn’t actually draw power until 11pm at night would also be good.

    Power demand drops fairly sharply after 6pm even.

  4. George.com 4

    For all the excitement of electirc cars, are we simply not shifting the point of pollution? Until we have 100% renewable power generation, we substitute the burning of fossil fuel in the manner of petrol to burning fossil fuel in the form of coal and gas. I remain a little sceptical until such time.

    • Con 4.1

      Solar panels on the roof of your garage or house. Yes it really is that easy. If you buy an electric car, why wouldn’t you lash out a few grand extra on some solar panels?

      • Lew 4.1.1

        If only it were that simple. It just so happens I’ve researched deploying solar energy recently, and here are a few of my findings.

        PV solar is still much too freaking expensive to be useful except as a last resort – the expense means a high initial cost to deployment, and means that panels must be deployed in optimal places – north-facing flat surfaces on an incline between 15° and 45°. There aren’t as many such places as you might think – most houses don’t have enough roof space meeting those specifications to meet all their energy needs from solar.

        Even in fairly well-suited deployments, the cost per kilowatt-hour amortised over the 25-year life of the panels is still about twice that of regular mains power, so it’s not just a matter of shelling out a couple of grand.

        On to the problem of cars: first, they suck a lot of energy; and second, they suck it when they’re not in the garage. If you have solar on your garage roof to power your car, you need a storage system, and storage systems are even more expensive and inefficient than the PV themselves. You could drip-feed your power back into the grid, but ultimately any time you’re generating power while it’s not being used, you have storage problems.

        Solar technology and electric storage technology is coming a long way, though – and researchers at the CSIRO in Australia are leading the way. Addressing the three problems here, they have developed cheap, light, flexible, printable solar panels suitable for use as curtains, on the surfaces of rounded or moulded objects, etc; an extremely efficient engine for solar-powered cars (which have the added bonus of looking like Jetsonmobiles); and the – a cheap, high-capacity, high-power-density, long-lasting battery.

        L

        • Lew 4.1.1.1

          For some reason if logged in I can’t edit my comments. Fail. THe last link should read `ultrabattery’.

          L

    • Lanthanide 4.2

      Provided the electrical engine of the car, and all the costs incurred in getting the electricity from the plant to the car still ends up with the same, or higher energy efficiency of using petrol, then electricity is by far the way to go.

      Sure, it might be moving from 1 form of fossil fuel, petrol, to another, coal or gas, but the difference lies in the density of operation. It’s not feasible or cost effective to put pollution mitigating technologies in every single car, due to cost and weight added, but it is very feasible to install pollution mitigating technologies at a dozen power plants, thereby gaining economies of scale.

      So no, even going from petrol-in-cars to coal-in-plants is still a better deal, provided that the electricity has the same efficiency rating as the petrol itself.

  5. That is true George.com.

    However, most of NZ’s power is generated by renewables that do not pollute. We have gone the wrong way in recent years and are increasingly reliant upon Huntly Power Station in winter, but generally most power is hydro generated. That certainly pollutes less than cars do.

    My worry about electric cars is them being used as an excuse to avoid proper investment in public transport. Electric cars may mitigate the effects of peak oil – to some extent – but they don’t solve congestion issues. They are also likely to be very expensive for 10-20 years to come.

    • Phil 5.1

      most of NZ’s power is generated by renewables that do not pollute

      Great! What about the rest of the planet?

    • George.com 5.2

      Most of our existing power is renewable, and a portion of our NEW generation is renewables. However, if we rapidly ramped up our vehicle fleet to run on electricity, we would require a huge expansion in our electricity generation. To replace petrol/diesel with electricity would require a significant increase in power generation. It could feasibly be done yet I see no impetus (political or social) to quickly put in place significant extra power generation. Even then, what type of power generation, renewable or fossil? Petrol to electric is not a zero sum equation using existing resources. It requires a big infrastructure of NEW electricity generation. I might go out and buy an electric car tomorrow yet I have no guarantees that this would render a lower carbon footprint for myself or the nation. A renewable power generation infrastructure will need to be put in place for this to occur. It may appear in the future, I don’t yet see it however.

  6. infused 6

    I’d be for something like this. This is one plan where I think the govt should come in and subsidize the take up of the cars, solar panels, etc. Maybe this is one way NZ could lead as well.

  7. Luxated 7

    I find it interesting and slightly hypocritical that this initiative comes from Norway, seems like they want everyone else to buy more of their oil so as to facilitate them going green.

    Also it is somewhat dubious as to whether the ban will work or not as I would imagine a significant number of Norwegians could just hop into Sweden to buy a petrol powered car. Having said that I wish them all the best with their efforts.

    @George.com
    You are partly correct, you must however remember that power stations are more efficient than internal combustion engines, an exceptional ICE might get 30% while a good combined cycle gas plant can go north of 50%.

    It is also much easier to monitor and control the output of a handful of smokestacks than it is to do so for several million of them.

  8. tsmithfield 8

    There are some really promising developments with compressed-air powered cars. These have the advantage that they do not require batteries, thus the problem with battery development is overcome. Although the motors are not as powerful as conventional cars, the cars are much more lightweight, thus the power-to-weight ratio is quite good. The other major advantage is that they are very cheap to produce, making them much more of a commercial option right now.

    There are now actually commercial versions of these, and I understand are being sold in NZ.

    Here is an article and a couple of youtube videos for anyone who is interested. The first video is of about the commercially available versions. The second video is about an even more promising motor being developed in Australia:

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2009/may/14/air-powered-car-hybrid-france
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-A3XHFT5qc
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dq8aZVLpf-c

  9. burt 9

    I think one of the key factors for a successful paradigm shift in personal transport is that we need to give up the ‘status’ attachment of our vehicles. I jump on a bike to ride to work, it’s a bike – nothing flash. My personal car is noting to write home about. Sure in my younger days I had my share of trophy vehicles.

    The increasing prevalence of scooters suggest a changing mindset. Back to basics of getting from A to B rather than show pony in the latest flash harry device.

    The article about compressed air vehicles is interesting. Combine that thought with this idea: Wind plus compressed air equals efficient energy storage in Iowa proposal.

    Compressed air storage from excess capacity during windy low use times (overnight every night in Wellington 🙂 ) seems like such a simple solution to shift wind power more toward base load generation. I wonder if it’s been investigated for NZ?

    • RedLogix 9.1

      I think one of the key factors for a successful paradigm shift in personal transport is that we need to give up the ‘status’ attachment of our vehicles.

      It’s a real pleasure to say for once that I totally agree with you on this Burt. To my mind this is the big unspoken hurdle behind much of the resistance to many progressive changes that we need to make as a society.

      Personal cars have been in many ways the ultimate enabler and emotional token of the way our modern world has been shaped in so many ways, from the schools we go to, to how we date and mate in our youth, to the shape of our suburbs and cities. They create an immediate sense of movement and freedom that no other tool does, a sense of achieving something, when much of the time it amounts to spinning around in pointless loops.

      Yet what is a private benefit, is at the same time a public detriment. Cars cut us off from each other; a friend once called them ’emotional Faraday cages’, we cruise along in social and emotional isolation from people just meters aways from us, with no need of any human contact at all. It is a mode of being that fosters individualism, the atomisation of the person, deluded into believing in the perfection of their own self.

      And of course they are the perfect status/sex symbol. Ever noticed the correlation between the price of the car, and the trophy wife driving it? There are some pretty potent and basic human emotions tied up in these 2 tonne blocks of metal and plastic we get so attached to, and unravelling them is not going to come so easily to many.

      It’s been years since I owned a bicycle Burt, but if you can do it so can I. I’m taking that on as a personal commitment to you.

      • Phil 9.1.1

        Cars cut us off from each other … we cruise along in social and emotional isolation from people just meters aways from us, with no need of any human contact at all.

        Oh, come on!
        How about all those journeys we make specifically to enable social and human interaction?

        I sure hope you don’t have freinds and relatives in another city – they’d be waiting an awful long time for you to come and visit.

        • RedLogix 9.1.1.1

          That’s a pretty weak argument. For a start it assumes a car-centric culture in which friends and family necessarily live in other cities, or distant suburbs… and that cars are the only means to reach them.

          For a second I suspect you have not lived in a culture where strangers and/or acquaintances ordinarily interact with each other when using public transport of one form or another. Private cars have their place, but when we become exclusively dependent on them, with no other choices… our lives often become very insular, shuttling between home, workplace and a narrow circle of friends.

          In my experience I enjoy trains and buses, not just because of the occasional unexpected conversation with others, but sense of being unconditionally together with my fellows for the purpose of this small journey, however daily and mundane it’s purpose might be.

  10. infused 10

    Well I’ve just read a whole bunch of stuff on the air car. From what I can see it really is a load of crap. Anyone good articles about these things actually being used?

  11. Rich 11

    This is one reason why we need to aim for quite a bit more than 100% of our current electricity usage being generated from renewables. Apart from an increasing population, we need to look at replacing direct use of fossil fuels.

    But, sensibly, the first area to reduce fossil fuel usage is in current electricity, then fixed direct users (furnaces and the like), then cars and buses.

    There needs to be a plan. Labour almost had one, and National are tearing it up.

  12. Walter 12

    There are viable EV alternatives available in NZ today – electric scooters and Green Machines are a couple of obvious ones:
    http://www.greenmachines.co.nz

    The trouble is they are not conventional ‘cars’. Even though they fulfil our transport needs, we’re not using them (like public transport!).

    Goes to show there’s more to our fossil fuelled cars than just transport – we need to determine exactly what the driver is (excuse the pun) and work toward changing that.

  13. jagilby 13

    “A proposal to ban sales of new petrol-powered cars in Norway from 2015 could help spur struggling carmakers to shift to greener models, Finance Minister Kristin Halvorsen said.”

    Absolutely typical socialist hypocrisy.

    Norway has around half of western europe’s oil reserves – Does this mean Norway will stop exporting oil?

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    4 days ago
  • Bernard’s six stack of substacks at 6pm on March 15
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    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    4 days ago
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    Point of OrderBy Bob Edlin
    4 days ago
  • National’s clean car tax advances
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    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    4 days ago
  • Government funding bailouts
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    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    4 days ago
  • Two offenders, different treatments.
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    KiwipoliticoBy Pablo
    4 days ago
  • Treaty references omitted
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    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    4 days ago
  • The Ghahraman Conflict
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    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    4 days ago
  • Bernard's Top 10 @ 10 'pick 'n' mix' for March 15
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    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    4 days ago
  • The day Wellington up-zoned its future
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    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    5 days ago
  • Weekly Roundup 15-March-2024
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    Greater AucklandBy Greater Auckland
    5 days ago
  • That Word.
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    Nick’s KōreroBy Nick Rockel
    5 days ago
  • The Hoon around the week to March 15
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    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    5 days ago
  • Labour’s policy gap
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    PolitikBy Richard Harman
    5 days ago
  • Skeptical Science New Research for Week #11 2024
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    5 days ago
  • Melissa remains mute on media matters but has something to say (at a sporting event) about economic ...
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    Point of OrderBy Bob Edlin
    5 days ago
  • The return of Muldoon
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    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    5 days ago
  • Will the rental tax cut improve life for renters or landlords?
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    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    5 days ago
  • Geoffrey Miller: What Saudi Arabia’s rapid changes mean for New Zealand
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    Democracy ProjectBy Geoffrey Miller
    5 days ago
  • Racism’s double standards
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    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    5 days ago
  • It’s not a tax break
    Ele Ludemann writes – Contrary to what many headlines and news stories are saying, residential landlords are not getting a tax break. The government is simply restoring to them the tax deductibility of interest they had until the previous government removed it. There is no logical reason ...
    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    5 days ago
  • The Plastic Pig Collective and Chris' Imaginary Friends.
    I can't remember when it was goodMoments of happiness in bloomMaybe I just misunderstoodAll of the love we left behindWatching our flashbacks intertwineMemories I will never findIn spite of whatever you becomeForget that reckless thing turned onI think our lives have just begunI think our lives have just begunDoes anyone ...
    Nick’s KōreroBy Nick Rockel
    5 days ago
  • Who is responsible for young offenders?
    Michael Bassett writes – At first reading, a front-page story in the New Zealand Herald on 13 March was bizarre. A group of severely intellectually limited teenagers, with little understanding of the law, have been pleading to the Justice Select Committee not to pass a bill dealing with ram ...
    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    5 days ago
  • Gordon Campbell on National’s fantasy trip to La La Landlord Land
    How much political capital is Christopher Luxon willing to burn through in order to deliver his $2.9 billion gift to landlords? Evidently, Luxon is: (a) unable to cost the policy accurately. As Anna Burns-Francis pointed out to him on Breakfast TV, the original ”rock solid” $2.1 billion cost he was ...
    5 days ago
  • Bernard's Top 10 @ 10 'pick 'n' mix' for March 14
    TL;DR: My top 10 news and analysis links this morning include:Today’s must-read: Jonathon Porritt calling bullshit in his own blog post on mainstream climate science as ‘The New Denialism’.Local scoop: The Wellington City Council’s list of proposed changes to the IHP recommendations to be debated later today was leaked this ...
    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    5 days ago
  • No, Prime Minister, rents don’t rise or fall with landlords’ costs
    TL;DR: Prime Minister Christopher Luxon said yesterday tenants should be grateful for the reinstatement of interest deductibility because landlords would pass on their lower tax costs in the form of lower rents. That would be true if landlords were regulated monopolies such as Transpower or Auckland Airport1, but they’re not, ...
    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    5 days ago
  • Cartoons: ‘At least I didn’t make things awkward’
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  • Solving traffic congestion with Richard Prebble
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    Greater AucklandBy Patrick Reynolds
    6 days ago
  • I Think I'm Done Flying Boeing
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    6 days ago
  • Invoking Aristotle: Of Rings of Power, Stones, and Ships
    The first season of Rings of Power was not awful. It was thoroughly underwhelming, yes, and left a lingering sense of disappointment, but it was more expensive mediocrity than catastrophe. I wrote at length about the series as it came out (see the Review section of the blog, and go ...
    6 days ago
  • Van Velden brings free-market approach to changing labour laws – but her colleagues stick to distr...
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    Point of OrderBy Bob Edlin
    6 days ago
  • Why Newshub failed
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    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    6 days ago
  • Māori Party on the warpath against landlords and seabed miners – let’s see if mystical creature...
    Bob Edlin writes  –  The Māori Party has been busy issuing a mix of warnings and threats as its expresses its opposition to interest deductibility for landlords and the plans of seabed miners. It remains to be seen whether they  follow the example of indigenous litigants in Australia, ...
    Point of OrderBy Bob Edlin
    6 days ago

  • Government moves to quickly ratify the NZ-EU FTA
    "The Government is moving quickly to realise an additional $46 million in tariff savings in the EU market this season for Kiwi exporters,” Minister for Trade and Agriculture, Todd McClay says. Parliament is set, this week, to complete the final legislative processes required to bring the New Zealand – European ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 hours ago
  • Positive progress for social worker workforce
    New Zealand’s social workers are qualified, experienced, and more representative of the communities they serve, Social Development and Employment Minister Louise Upston says. “I want to acknowledge and applaud New Zealand’s social workers for the hard work they do, providing invaluable support for our most vulnerable. “To coincide with World ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    9 hours ago
  • Minister confirms reduced RUC rate for PHEVs
    Cabinet has agreed to a reduced road user charge (RUC) rate for plug-in hybrid electric vehicles (PHEVs), Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. Owners of PHEVs will be eligible for a reduced rate of $38 per 1,000km once all light electric vehicles (EVs) move into the RUC system from 1 April.  ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    11 hours ago
  • Trade access to overseas markets creates jobs
    Minister of Agriculture and Trade, Todd McClay, says that today’s opening of Riverland Foods manufacturing plant in Christchurch is a great example of how trade access to overseas markets creates jobs in New Zealand.  Speaking at the official opening of this state-of-the-art pet food factory the Minister noted that exports ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    11 hours ago
  • NZ and Chinese Foreign Ministers hold official talks
    Minister of Foreign Affairs Winston Peters met with Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi in Wellington today. “It was a pleasure to host Foreign Minister Wang Yi during his first official visit to New Zealand since 2017. Our discussions were wide-ranging and enabled engagement on many facets of New Zealand’s relationship with China, including trade, ...
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    1 day ago
  • Kāinga Ora instructed to end Sustaining Tenancies
    Kāinga Ora – Homes & Communities has been instructed to end the Sustaining Tenancies Framework and take stronger measures against persistent antisocial behaviour by tenants, says Housing Minister Chris Bishop. “Earlier today Finance Minister Nicola Willis and I sent an interim Letter of Expectations to the Board of Kāinga Ora. ...
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    1 day ago
  • Speech to Auckland Business Chamber: Growth is the answer
    Tēna koutou katoa. Greetings everyone. Thank you to the Auckland Chamber of Commerce and the Honourable Simon Bridges for hosting this address today. I acknowledge the business leaders in this room, the leaders and governors, the employers, the entrepreneurs, the investors, and the wealth creators. The coalition Government shares your ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Singapore rounds out regional trip
    Minister Winston Peters completed the final leg of his visit to South and South East Asia in Singapore today, where he focused on enhancing one of New Zealand’s indispensable strategic partnerships.      “Singapore is our most important defence partner in South East Asia, our fourth-largest trading partner and a ...
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    4 days ago
  • Minister van Velden represents New Zealand at International Democracy Summit
    Minister of Internal Affairs and Workplace Relations and Safety, Hon. Brooke van Velden, will travel to the Republic of Korea to represent New Zealand at the Third Summit for Democracy on 18 March. The summit, hosted by the Republic of Korea, was first convened by the United States in 2021, ...
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    4 days ago
  • Insurance Council of NZ Speech, 7 March 2024, Auckland
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    4 days ago
  • Five-year anniversary of Christchurch terror attacks
    Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and Lead Coordination Minister Judith Collins have expressed their deepest sympathy on the five-year anniversary of the Christchurch terror attacks. “March 15, 2019, was a day when families, communities and the country came together both in sorrow and solidarity,” Mr Luxon says.  “Today we pay our respects to the 51 shuhada ...
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    4 days ago
  • Speech for Financial Advice NZ Conference 5 March 2024
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    4 days ago
  • Early visit to Indonesia strengthens ties
    Foreign Minister Winston Peters held discussions in Jakarta today about the future of relations between New Zealand and South East Asia’s most populous country.   “We are in Jakarta so early in our new government’s term to reflect the huge importance we place on our relationship with Indonesia and South ...
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    5 days ago
  • China Foreign Minister to visit
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    5 days ago
  • Minister opens new Auckland Rail Operations Centre
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    5 days ago
  • Celebrating 10 years of Crankworx Rotorua
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    5 days ago
  • Government delivering on tax commitments
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    5 days ago
  • Significant Natural Areas requirement to be suspended
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    5 days ago
  • Government partnership to tackle $332m facial eczema problem
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    5 days ago
  • NZ, India chart path to enhanced relationship
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    6 days ago
  • Ruapehu Alpine Lifts bailout the last, say Ministers
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    6 days ago
  • Govt takes action to drive better cancer services
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  • Govt takes action to drive better cancer services
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    6 days ago
  • Work begins on SH29 upgrades near Tauriko
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    6 days ago
  • Work begins on SH29 upgrades near Tauriko
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    6 days ago
  • Fresh produce price drop welcome
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    6 days ago
  • Statement to the 68th United Nations Commission on the Status of Women
    Tēnā koutou katoa and greetings to you all.  Chair, I am honoured to address the sixty-eighth session of the Commission on the Status of Women. I acknowledge the many crises impacting the rights of women and girls. Heightened global tensions, war, climate related and humanitarian disasters, and price inflation all ...
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  • Speech to the 68th United Nations Commission on the Status of Women (CSW68)
    Tēnā koutou katoa and greetings to you all.  Chair, I am honoured to address the 68th session of the Commission on the Status of Women. I acknowledge the many crises impacting the rights of women and girls. Heightened global tensions, war, climate related and humanitarian disasters, and price inflation all ...
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    6 days ago
  • Government backs rural led catchment projects
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  • Speech to Auckland Business Chamber
    Good evening everyone and thank you for that lovely introduction.   Thank you also to the Honourable Simon Bridges for the invitation to address your members. Since being sworn in, this coalition Government has hit the ground running with our 100-day plan, delivering the changes that New Zealanders expect of us. ...
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    1 week ago
  • Commission’s advice on ETS settings tabled
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    1 week ago
  • Government lowering building costs
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    1 week ago
  • Trustee tax change welcomed
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    1 week ago
  • Minister’s Ramadan message
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    1 week ago
  • Minister appoints new NZTA Chair
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    1 week ago
  • Speech to Life Sciences Summit
    Good morning all, it is a pleasure to be here as Minister of Science, Innovation and Technology.  It is fantastic to see how connected and collaborative the life science and biotechnology industry is here in New Zealand. I would like to thank BioTechNZ and NZTech for the invitation to address ...
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    1 week ago
  • Progress continues apace on water storage
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    1 week ago
  • Government agrees to restore interest deductions
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    1 week ago
  • Minister to attend World Anti-Doping Agency Symposium
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    1 week ago

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