Don’t get angry, get organised

Written By: - Date published: 10:58 am, October 23rd, 2023 - 87 comments
Categories: election 2023, labour, national, uncategorized - Tags:

Happy Labour day everyone.

This is a good day for progressives to reflect on the recent election result and to plan on countering the rather draconian plans this Government has talked about and to start planning for the next progressive Government.

My father, who was an ardent Trade Unionist as well as a Labour Party activist used to say “don’t get angry, get organised”.

He spent a lifetime in the Union Movement and in the Labour Party.  My family have been steeped in the Trade Union movement for generations and we have all had grilled into us the importance of understanding history and planning for the future.

So now is a good time for all progressives to reflect on what happened at the last election and to plan for the next one.

So what happened?

Clearly the national mood was against us.  But the effect was particularly magnified in the Auckland Istmus and out west.  In South Auckland the drop in turnout was cataclysmic.  In the Istmus and West Auckland the results were unprecedented.  I never thought I would see the election day where we lost Mt Roskill and New Lynn and Te Atatu and almost lost Mt Albert.

I believe that Labour will hold Mt Albert and gain back Te Atatu and possibly New Lynn on specials.  But these are seats where Labour should be banking significant numbers of party votes, not struggling to hold on the electorate vote.

Why did it happen?

The effects of Covid linger and Auckland’s extended lockdown did not help.  The cost of living crisis clearly had its effect as did fuel prices and high interest rates.  It does not matter how many times you explained the national causes of the problems or the number of lives saved by the lockdown people were over it.  And in Auckland the January floods and the continuous wet weather have made us all grumpy.

Derek Cheng in this article highlights that the slip in support and the reversal of the right track wrong track started during the second Auckland lockdown.  And the Parliamentary sit in only emphasised the feeling that things were changing for the worse.

And National had a plan.  A badly costed plan that was panned by everyone who could count and who actually looked at it but it had a plan and kept talking about it.  And its voice was amplified by significant donations from very wealthy people afraid that their privilege may be affected.

I don’t know why they worried.

Because Labour’s offering by contrast was timid.  There were no transformative policies. GST off fresh fruit and vegetables and no tax reform excited no one.

And areas where Labour had a good story to tell, such as in climate change, child poverty, the construction of new homes and the covid response were only timidly talked about.  We should own those gains, not be timid about them.

The Greens did not perform as well as I thought.  Winning seats is fine but it is the party vote that is all important and I thought they would get an extra couple of percentage points in support over what they achieved.

Special votes should change things.  I expect us to pick up at least three electorates and overall improve our seat count by one.  This is important because without that extra seat National and Act could have a field day.

So where to from here?

Out west I thought the local campaigns were all good and volunteers excelled themselves.  The issue was there were not enough of us and the same people were doing more and more.  Strengthening the membership is vital.  We can match National and its uber donors when we are united and strong.  When we are weak their resources can be too much.

Leadership clearly needs to be talked about.  I agree with Neale Jones that unity is vital and the factionalism from ten years ago needs to be avoided at all costs.

But the discussion is warranted and is necessary.

What I think should happen is that Chris Hipkins should seek a mandate from the caucus and the membership and affiliates and vacate the leadership so that a leadership contest is triggered.

The candidates can then tour the country and speak to the membership and we can have a real contest of ideas and may the best person win.  The membership will be energised and we can have a deep and meaningful discussion about the future of the Party and of the country.

Such a contest is not to be feared.  Labour received a bump in the polls after each of the two leadership contests.

We do need to have a discussion about what needs to be done in the future both for the party and for the country.  And we need to work out what it is that we stand for.

To all party members now is not the time to get angry with the result but to get organised.  And to get prepared to start running campaigns against all the counterproductive and negative changes that National and Act are currently working on.

In my activist career I have witnessed three previous changes from a Labour Government.  In 1978 the party won a pluarility of votes, only the vagarities of FPP stopped us from being returned.  The 1993 result was lost by a whisker and  in 2011 while National picked up a seat its coalition partners lost six seats.  One term governments are possible.  But you have to be prepared and well resourced.

Now is the time to start getting organised to making this Government a one term National government.  And for Labour to work out its future.

87 comments on “Don’t get angry, get organised ”

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  1. Bearded Git 1
    23 October 2023 at 11:30 am

    I'm not angry or disorganised because I voted Green. Vote up 42%, number of electorates won tripled.

    Labour could learn a lot by looking at how the Greens ran their campaign. Solid and consistent left wing social and environmental policies simply and well communicated to the public. It hurts that the Greens aren’t in government with them.

    • Mike the Lefty 1.1
      23 October 2023 at 2:38 pm

      Yes, I agree that the Greens ran a good campaign. What I liked most about it was that their messages were clear and concise, but also honest – lacking the crass populist mechanics of ACT, the negativity of National, the nihilism of NZ First and the vacuity of Labour.

      The Greens' success in Wellington should be an eye-opener to Labour. You wouldn't back the kind of democratic socialist policies that we wanted so we went to the Greens who DID.

      • Bearded Git 1.1.1
        23 October 2023 at 4:26 pm

        The Greens and Labour polled really well in Dunedin as well as Wellington (there is a paywalled ODT editorial that bemoans the poor performance of the Nats in Dunedin) and I'm guessing in CHCH too (I haven't checked). The real problem was Auckland.

        • DS 1.1.1.1
          23 October 2023 at 5:02 pm

          Dunedin is an interesting one.

          The Dunedin electorate saw vast numbers of Green voters party voting Green and electorate voting Labour. So Rachel Brooking emerged with a comfortable majority. In fact, National's result was so poor that it actually looks like something out of South Auckland. But there is one major problem – Labour only won the party vote over the Greens 32% – 26%. With zero threat from National, Dunedin is now next on the Green Electorate Hit List, and if Dunedin were to go Green in 2026 or 2029, Labour would have a devil of a time trying to get it back.

          (A major problem for Labour: Dunedin is uniquely dependent on tertiary education and the health sector. Chris Hipkins at Education did not cover himself in glory, while there is copious Dunedin anxiety over the Hospital. Hence the Green inroads. Rachel Brooking needs to rehabilitate Labour on the University campus).

          As for Taieri: here there was also a Green surge (interesting, because hitherto, Taieri has never been that Green friendly). But these Greens two-ticked Green, rather than propping up Ingrid Leary, so Labour's electorate margin was closer than it really should have been. That said, Taieri remains the only semi-rural general electorate in the country where Labour won the party vote, and even in rural Clutha Leary did not do badly. She actually won a booth in Balclutha (in addition to the time-honoured Kaitangata), and overall the rural Clutha part of Taieri actually looks (in party vote terms) like Mount Roskill. Yes, really.

          Leary's problem longer term is the boundaries. If Taieri were to take in more farmers, those farmers would not be the soft blue of Clutha, but the really hard blue of rural Southland.

          Saving Taieri in the long term means the Dunedin electorate has to be redrawn back north towards Oamaru (which provides an additional bonus – the places north of Dunedin don't vote Green). That would free up more of Dunedin city to be put back into Taieri.

  2. Rolling-on-Gravel 2
    23 October 2023 at 11:37 am

    Already done – I am embedded in some political organisation, actually. I am an activist and now going to go fully political soon.

    This is going to be my only comment for a while.

  3. Mac1 3
    23 October 2023 at 11:45 am

    Well said, MickeySavage. We must not be afraid of a good internal debate. One point you make that resonates in rural NZ- "the issue was there were not enough of us and the same people were doing more and more."

    Organisation with funding and resources, volunteers to do the ground work and policy that captures not only what needs to be done but attracts votes and people to the cause.

    What you wrote is far simpler and direct than my extended gardening metaphor on yesterday's open mike. Again, well said.

    • Johnr 3.1
      23 October 2023 at 4:56 pm

      Dammit MS you've nailed it yet again. I'm an old tradie and words aren't my thing.

      Have to admit that for the first time in my 77 years I didn't vote. Lost my way, although I have a lot of sympathy with greens and TPM regarding working class issues.

  4. adam 4
    23 October 2023 at 2:42 pm

    You have many ways to organise and options in relation to who and how you want to support.

    If you over the labour party and their timid form of liberalism you could try the greens of Te Pāti Māori.

    Join here https://www.maoriparty.org.nz/join

    I'd also point out that many local councils swapped over to the hard right last election, and are a good places to cut your teeth.

    Also, join a union whilst you can. You will need the support.

    • Darien Fenton 4.1
      23 October 2023 at 4:54 pm

      Adam ; TPM won four seats and around 2.5% of the party vote which means Meka Whaitiri will not be back in Parliament. Labour won the party vote in all seven Maori electorates. Greens won three electorate seats, but won the party vote only in one electorate ; Wellington Central. In Rongotai Labour won the party vote, in Auckland Central, National won the party vote. And on it goes.

      • adam 4.1.1
        23 October 2023 at 10:43 pm

        But don’t count the seats till the specials are in – good chance of two more for Te Pāti Māori.

        Face facts, Te Pāti Māori voters are smart. They party voted labour or green after giving their electorate vote to Te Pāti Māori. If labour voters had been smarter they would have not voted for Kelvin, and had three MP’s from the North. But you know.

        Face reality labour are in a shit mess and it’s their own fault. Mansplaining seems to be another of their problems.

      • adam 4.1.2
        23 October 2023 at 10:57 pm

        Meka should have jump waka sooner.

        She was tainted from being a cabinet minister in the do as little as possible lino government.

        • Louis 4.1.2.1
          24 October 2023 at 4:32 am

          Or voters didn't like the way Meka left Labour. Congratulations to Cushla Tangaere-Manuel.

          adam, it seems you are parroting Martyn Bradbury.

          • adam 4.1.2.1.1
            24 October 2023 at 3:19 pm

            Mana as was Martyn

            Still think helen clark was a land thief

          • adam 4.1.2.1.2
            24 October 2023 at 3:37 pm

            Or voters didn't like the way Meka left Labour.

            The polling I read says other wise, as did Maori TV on election night.

            Totally agree, heart felt cheer all round

            Congratulations to Cushla Tangaere-Manuel.

            • Louis 4.1.2.1.2.1
              24 October 2023 at 8:04 pm

              Meka lost. What part of that did you not understand? I don't think Meka is cheering that she was defeated by Labour's Cushla Tangaere-Manuel.

              • adam …
                24 October 2023 at 9:19 pm

                Meka lost. What part of that did you not understand?

                What is wrong with you? I congraulated Cushla on her win – or did you miss that.

                And you think and feelings are the opposite of reality. Meka congratulated Cushla live on Maori TV more than once.

                So let me reiterate what I was talking about, it was on Maori TV, and internal polling I've seen

                Meka was tainted from being a cabinet minister in the do as little as possible lino government.

      • Louis 4.1.3
        24 October 2023 at 4:46 am

        yes Darien

  5. Darien Fenton 5
    23 October 2023 at 4:50 pm

    Thanks Micky. I've been thinking a lot about this as you can imagine. Organising is the best tool of the working class (as many old mates used to say). This is a Labour Party discussion, and it's for us to work through it. I am unsure about an open leadership contest at this stage ; My experience of those was different to yours perhaps because of who we supported. If we build back better (as they say) that will come. Most important thing in the coming weeks is we listen to members and supporters but encourage positive input about the future; there are many theories about what Labour did wrong and those are the easy questions. For those who don't know Labour Party history (this party formed more than 100 years ago), go read Labour Party 1916 – 2016 by Peter Franks and Jim McAloon. We've been down this road before, even during M J Savage's day when John A Lee formed a new party because "Labour wasn't socialist" enough. The fact is voters decided this time round they wanted a NACT government. I agree we have some major organising ahead of us, starting with the abolition of Fair Pay Agreements and bringing back the 90 day trials. That needs to be a major part of our discussion and that will energise the membership and unions.

  6. Mike the Lefty 6
    23 October 2023 at 5:23 pm

    I will fully expect the Labour Day public holiday to be one of ACT's first targets. That would be fully in keeping with a party whose predecessors in the Rogernome government helped turned our weekends into just another two working days and thinks the working day should be 24 hours.

  7. Steve Bradley 7
    23 October 2023 at 5:23 pm

    Random Questions & Thoughts

    The list below is that written in my head during 2023.

    During this year I and many others sleep-walked to defeat.

    After becoming PM and, of necessity needing to fulfill prior international obligations, (of virtually zero concern to voters), Chippy and advisors failed then to plan a months-long progress around Aotearoa to meet members and Labour voters right up to the election. [Loads of media exposure – photo ops, talking policies and issues with citizens and engaging with media questions].

    Quote from a successful Maori-seat winner: “Show up; listen; follow through”.

    After several years of work by David Parker and department, the decision to not progress the 'wealth tax' . How many billionaires with how many yachts do we need?

    The continuation of neo-liberal hands-off government – so strikes by nurses, teachers, doctors and others dragged on virtually to election day. Better to open the taps of cash to begin to fix desperate needs by first paying the workers who will do the job?

    Failure to incrementally restore the state apparatus to provide direct control of re-building infrastructure – especially in disaster situations. Bring back the Ministry of Works to provide the Rapid Response Capacity and Capability?

    .The seemingly endless series of 'own-goals' committed by M.Ps including ministers.

    The propensity for announcing mad-cap schemes costing billions before building rock-solid foundations that by their investment and durability leave later governments little room to wriggle away?

    Capture by group-think politico-bureaucratic cliques inside Wellington bubble. “Daddy knows best” combined with 'beans in your ears'?

    Ham-fisted blundering management of hot-button wedge issues like 'co-governance' (racism), three waters (local 'control') …

    Local poor results in 'safe' Labour seats in West and South Auckland. Huge reductions in turnout – due to lack of canvassing? Itself due to lack of motivation by activists turned off by some or all of the above?

    I hope you'll add your own thoughts so we can face the future better informed.

    The mark of a great team is how to effect culture change at pace taking every one

    along. We'll need members, relatives, friends and neighbours to actively engage in a

    debate around fundamental social democratic principles – still the best antidote to

    the over-blown capitalist catastrophe we're facing.

    Cheers

    • gsays 7.1
      24 October 2023 at 4:38 pm

      Good wee missive, thanks Steve.

      The neo liberal thing can be at the root of so many of Labour's short-comings.

      I don't know who the advisors are, whether they are on staff or sub-contracted, but they give advice from an out-of-touch position to equally out-of-touch ministers. Hipkins, in a media session said from their polling, wealth tax wasn't supported by enough people. I may be old fashioned but I expect leaders to lead. To look at an issue and decide on a solution based on your principles, not fanny about asking a bunch of randoms what they might like.

      I don't think Hipkins is to blame for the loss per se, but he comes across as atypical of the attitude common among Labour politicians.

      I am yet to have anyone circle the square of Labour's attitude to workers wages and conditions and the record migration they allowed to occur. Then the following issues of modern slavery worker expolitation and under strain infrastructure that come with lots of new arrivals.

      I've asked a similar question elsewhere here about what Labour can do to start distancing themselves from the neo-lib orthadoxy. You may have touched on it with developing a modern Ministry of Works. Trade training, good wages, bringing knowledge back in-house.

  8. Obtrectator 8
    23 October 2023 at 9:41 pm

    Suggestions please for how a precariatchik working three jobs just to keep their (and their family's) heads above water is going to secure the time, energy and money to help with any meaningful organising.

  9. Thinker 9
    23 October 2023 at 10:30 pm

    For the record and not sure your reasoning behind wanting Hipkins to foment a leadership debate, but I for one don't blame Labour's loss on him.

    I thought, overall, he fought a good fight, especially towards the end, and let's not forget that NACT has been fed a s**t sandwich largely through Hipkins campaigning.

    Granted, it's not a great idea to go to the 2026 election with Hipkins' 2023 election baggage, but I'm in no rush to see him vilified.

    • weka 9.1
      24 October 2023 at 12:17 am

      A leadership contest of the kind micky is talking about is an opportunity for Labour to sort out issues like a wealth tax. Which in turn speaks to a wider direction issue.

      I don't think Hipkins should be vilified either, and I agree with micky that Labour shouldn't be afraid of an open and transparent process arising from the failure.

      I've yet to see an explanation for why Labour didn't go harder on the things it has done well in the past two terms, now the lack of policy. I wonder how much of it is exhaustion from having to manage pandemic.

      • Louis 9.1.1
        24 October 2023 at 4:52 am

        "how much of it is exhaustion from having to manage pandemic" That has crossed my mind and I would say it has a lot to do with it.

        • Belladonna 9.1.1.1
          24 October 2023 at 6:04 pm

          I think that the Covid management is a significant factor in the Labour Government looking tired.

          However, knowing that – and knowing from their internal polling that they were highly unlikely to get back into Parliament – they missed an opportunity to structure their list to maximise the next generation.

          By all means stack the top end with people like Little, Ruwhare, Jackson and Parker – just in case Labour pulled off a miracle. But, if they lost, and many of those senior MPs are taking retirement (Little has already announced, and Jackson hasn't committed to a full term) – *then* the next tranche down needed to be those MPs who can lead the regeneration of Labour.

          People like Kieran McAnulty and Ginny Anderson – have made their presence felt in the last government – they are young enough and passionate enough to be in Labour for the long term. And absolutely needed to be in high list places.

          But the next level down…. hoo boy!

          Does anyone think that Camilla Belich, Tracey McLellan, Shanan Halbert, Glen Bennett, Vanushi Walters, and Georgie Dansey – are the brightest and best hope for Labour in 2026? They are the candidates who will be elevated off the list as/when senior Labour MPs retire.

          And, even those higher up. Rino Tirikatene – surely it's time for him to retire; Willow Jean Prime has made no impact at all in her minor portfolios (Youth, etc.).; Jo Luxton apparently Minister of Customs…. They're not exactly inspirational leaders.

          They look much more like a curated list to balance every demographic factor – as well as protection for those who were at risk of losing an electorate seat.

    • Doogs 9.2
      27 October 2023 at 1:49 pm

      👏🏽. Thinker

  10. Ian B 10
    24 October 2023 at 10:13 am

    When I came home in 2011 after living in America, I joined the Labour Party in the hope that it would push back against Key's neoliberal regime. What a bitter disappointment it has been.

    Almost the entire political landscape has been captured by the neoliberal hegemony. Labour's unwillingness to decouple itself from neoliberalism despite admitting neoliberalism has been a failure, is exasperating. Why would I want to help organise for a Party like that?

    The latest campaign was an exercise in mediocracy of the worst order- but a perfect metaphor for where the Labour Party is. The really sad thing is that I see no indication that Labour can see their way out of the fly bottle (Wittgenstein).

    • pat 10.1
      24 October 2023 at 7:14 pm

      Difficult for a small agrarian economy to thumb its nose at the international paradigm….well perhaps not so much difficult but rather, self defeating….we will not abandon 'neoliberalism' until such time as the worlds major economies determine a change is needed.

      We are a ‘trading nation that supports the international bodies that administer it’….and that means the overwhelming majority of citizens, like it or not.

      • left for dead 10.1.1
        25 October 2023 at 9:22 am

        yes

      • KJT 10.1.2
        27 October 2023 at 2:02 pm

        Except we did it in the past. And it didn't result in disaster. In fact the opposite.

        I seem to remember something about "One of the highest standards of living in the world".

        What, in fact, has pandering to peoples worst instincts, banks, the FIRE economy, speculators and assett strippers achieved?

        • pat 10.1.2.1
          27 October 2023 at 5:21 pm

          We may have done so in the past, but as Muldoon discovered, the world changed and we were unable to row against the tide…..when the predominant paradigm changes then we will change, not before.

          And that is not support for the current paradigm (indeed it is the opposite) it is simply an analysis of the situation.

          Unfortunately any alternative will not be led by a relatively insignificant economy such as NZ.

          • KJT 10.1.2.1.1
            28 October 2023 at 10:45 am

            "There is no alternative".

            Where have I heard that before?

            • pat 10.1.2.1.1.1
              28 October 2023 at 11:08 am

              I have no idea where you have heard "there is no alternative" before….however if you read closely you will note I wrote…."Unfortunately any alternative will not be led by a relatively insignificant economy such as NZ."

              Not TINA.

              • KJT …
                28 October 2023 at 5:22 pm

                That is exactly what it is.

                On the contrary, NZ was one off the world leaders in the Neo-liberal charge, albeit in the wrong direction in the 80's and 90's. We had the architects from NZ as "Gurus" lecturing other Governments on how to boil their people alive without them climbing out of the pot.

                It was the smallness and cohesiveness of NZ that , unfortunately, made rapid change possible.

                Saying we cannot similarly be an example of positive progress, instead of destructive neo-liberal regressiveness, is a copout.

                • pat …
                  28 October 2023 at 5:45 pm

                  "Saying we cannot similarly be an example of positive progress, instead of destructive neo-liberal regressiveness, is a copout."

                  As much as it may pain some the fact is we didnt lead the world into neoliberalism, we were rather fast followers…Thatcher was PM from 1979 and Reagan President from 1981…Douglas (and Treasury) had to wait until 1984 for their chance….after the course for international trade was set.

                  We can attempt to lead the world in a new direction but you may wish to ask yourself what an economy that represents roughly 0.25% of the world output risks by doing so…..an economy that produces virtually nothing of that which it requires to maintain its existing systems and has no strategic importance.

            • pat 10.1.2.1.1.2
              28 October 2023 at 12:32 pm

              There is a variation on this theme covered by Brian Easton this morning that may be of interest.

              https://www.pundit.co.nz/content/how-much-influence-do-governments-have

  11. Visubversa 11
    24 October 2023 at 11:42 am

    I know a lot of people who are basically just out of love with the Labour Party. Many of us have given the Party a lot of their $$$, time and energy for decades. We have been office holders, election day organisers, deliverers and candidates.

    We are not going to vote for anybody else, we still pay our VFL etc, but this year we just gave the whole election process a big fat miss.

    Most of our alienation has been caused by the arrogance and entitlement shown by some senior MP's, Deborah Russell suggesting that some submitters should "just fuck off" is a prime example.

    Add to that the daily begging emails from Party HQ which got to the stage where they were redirected to Junk Mail, and although we knew how important is was to have a Labour government – we had no confidence that our assistance would be valued, so we did not go that extra mile.

    • Obtrectator 11.1
      24 October 2023 at 12:19 pm

      "Deborah Russell suggesting that some submitters should "just fuck off" is a prime example"

      Obtrectatrix and I have met Ms Russell, and she didn't strike us as the type to behave like that. Link, please.

      • Visubversa 11.1.1
        24 October 2023 at 12:36 pm

        I presume you can use Google.

        People exercising their legal right to make a submission were treated very badly by several Labour/Green MPs because they expressed a contrary opinion to the prevailing ideology.

        https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/09/david-seymour-decries-labour-mp-deborah-russell-s-disgraceful-tweet-voicing-frustration-after-sex-self-id-submission.html

        • SPC 11.1.1.1
          24 October 2023 at 12:47 pm

          He's opposed to the law change.

          "We've said that we're going to oppose it. We're very sensitive towards matters of gender identity. People should be able to identify the way that they feel and prefer.

          "But the idea that we need to make that a simple box ticking exercise we think is wrong. We think that the current arrangement of going through the Family Court is the right way to resolve a serious matter."

          In the end ACT voted for the legislation.

          • Visubversa 11.1.1.1.1
            24 October 2023 at 3:44 pm

            Does not change the fact that Ms Russell behaved very badly towards submitters.

            • Louis 11.1.1.1.1.1
              24 October 2023 at 8:21 pm

              From your link @11.1.1 "But Russell told Newshub the tweet was a reaction to being disappointed at being accused of not listening to a submitter on a Zoom call, when she was just standing up to stretch her back after sitting for a long time"

        • Obtrectator 11.1.1.2
          25 October 2023 at 12:00 am

          You presume correctly, Visubversa. But I thought it was the policy of this site to require some form of confirmation – via links or otherwise – of potentially controversial assertions.

          And now I’ve followed the link and read through the material, it looks as though you’ve completely misrepresented the situation by reporting it as “Deborah Russell suggesting that some submitters should “just fuck off”.

          • Thinker 11.1.1.2.1
            25 October 2023 at 6:19 am

            Just read the link. Seems more to me like Russell being frustrated by not being able to stand up and stretch without some hater using it against her, then holier-than-thou Seymour blowing it up out of all proportion.

            Let's see if Seymour can do the next three years without a moment of frustration.

            It probably speaks for Russell that this is all the trolls can find to hate her with.

  12. Stephen D 12
    24 October 2023 at 1:18 pm

    Thank you MS.

    Yes, it wasn't the result we wanted.

    As they say in sports, don't get angry, get even.

    There is plenty we can do. If you want to get even with the party for letting you down, join your local LEC. Submit remits, email your nearest MP. Argue your point. You may find you are not the only one.

    Join your local LEC, get involved in fundraising. Help lift the profile of both the party and your possible candidates in your electorate. Be prepared to knock on doors, deliver leaflets, man phone banks. With the coalition if chaos we may be called upon to run a campaign sooner rather than later.

    As the Boy Scouts say: Be Prepared.

  13. Bruce 13
    24 October 2023 at 2:54 pm

    I agree that now is the time to organise. The only way the left is going to defeat the right is that all three parties should band together and form a common policy platform, say , three things that all agree on, a wealth tax, basic income and state housebuilding and campaign together. Each party can also campaign on other policies that they wish to pursue. This requires Labour to change the most but if it doesn't it's just plain dog tucker.

  14. Tricledrown 14
    24 October 2023 at 3:17 pm

    Bruce Jesson did exactly that back in the day.. The Greens need the young voters to build support over 3 years using local body politics to build strong local teams in electorate to motivate voters build campaign finances .Labour the same to beat dark money and big donors.

  15. Ad 15
    24 October 2023 at 9:06 pm

    Never before in the history of New Zealand politics, has so many, done so little, with so much (ahem). What an appalling Cabinet. Neal Jones calling for unity when there hasn't been dissent for 10 years is absurd.

    Thankfully the electorate at large knows how to hold Labour to account better than its own members and its own caucus.

    If Labour members are not angry, check your pulse because the great majority of the electorate were.

    We are in the worst place we've been for funding, MPs, membership, electorate seats, policy, and enthusiasm since 2014 when we got 32 seats. A decade wasted.

    There is no chance of an open membership contest until Chippie resigns, because no one in there now has the political gumption to challenge anything.

    More than likely it will be the same as 2017 where the leadership waits until the very last moment, sidelines the membership and unions in any constitutional appointment choice, and just pulls someone in.

    The scale of this loss is such that "organising" and reviving will be done in the NGOs and volunteer sector for years before the Labour Party feels it. It will be a slow revival over many years.

    • adam 15.1
      24 October 2023 at 9:41 pm

      Well said Ad, I think a few here are totally in their own bubble, and not facing the reality of the public response to the last government at all.

      Te Pāti Māori is already in the process of organising and expanding. The support the MP's will have, is being added too. Its a growing movement with very many young people at the forefront. Those same young Te Pāti Māori voters, on the whole, voted smart. Shame in Te Tai Tokerau the labour party voters did not return 3 MP's on the night. But smart voting also seems lost on some.

      I also think the greens are in a good position going forward. But I'm not a member of the greens, so I won't talk for them. Time will tell.

      • Ad 15.1.1
        25 October 2023 at 8:04 am

        I'll be on the Heaphy tomorrow but once I come back I'll put something up on the re-alignment of the left and centre-left in New Zealand. I know what Bruce Jesson would say at least.

  16. Corey 16
    25 October 2023 at 4:33 pm

    How can we get organized?

    Labour as a vehicle has proven it's incapable of progressive change, even with an insane mandate.

    The membership of the Labour party from the grassroots are all wannabe politicians who think towing the party line and butt kissing will get them on a community board or low party list ranking and look at any constructive criticism of the party as basically treason.

    The people who ran the campaign Woods and Munroe aren't resigning and the party is genuinely alergic to working class or poor people.

    I don't think Norman kirk would be allowed to even be a candidate these days, he was a high school drop out who worked in a factory instead of a university lecturer or lawyer..

    Nothing will change the candidate selection process we will continue to have robotic unlikable geeks who seek in Ai style pol nerd waffle that Noone understands being parachuted into electorates they have no history or knowledge of from accross the country.

    Labour and it's activists are still listening to Neal Jones and Clint Smith. Good lord.

    Labour activists are already learning all the wrong mistakes and talking about how the party needs to be MORE of a clone of the National party.

    Jacinda Ardern papered over the cracks of a tired decaying party, she was the only thing it had going for and without her everyone was reminded about the useless incompetent upper middle class robotic organization Labour has become. She wasn't it's savior she was it's last breath.

    Labour hates the poor and working class and deeply distrusts them getting involved with the party beyond door knocking and pamphlet dropping, they don't wanna hear our opinions.

    And if we do get involved and do manage to get policies put through the manifesto the leadership can just do a captains call and rule out all the unpaid work we put into policies.

    I hope you all fight the good fight but I think Labour needs to be put out to pasture, after the 2020 majority I'll never believe anything they say about transformation or policies.

    I ticked two ticks green, reluctantly, and will do so again until social democratic party emerges and third way labpur managerialism ain't social democracy.

  17. Craig Glen Eden 17
    25 October 2023 at 10:14 pm

    I agree with you Corey. Sadly Labour is no longer a party whose MPs represent working people. Its MPs are in many cases useless achieving nothing for the people in those electorates. They often don’t come from the electorates they stand in and so have no drive or sense of being local.
    In the case of Mt Roskill Mr Wood did none of the advocacy work or press the flesh work that the likes of Phil Goff did for that electorate, Mr Wood was totally out of touch. The same can be said for Phil Tywford in Te Atatu he was not a touch on the likes of Chris Carter.
    I also totally agree that many Labour Members and past MPs are not brave enough to admit the failings of their Party even though they are plainly obvious to those who would like to see Labour succeed but have left the party through frustration.

  18. Adam - please use another user name 18
    25 October 2023 at 10:25 pm

    Great article. Agreed with everything you said. Onwards and upwards!!

    [Please use a different name, as this one is already in use by another regular commenter, thanks – Incognito]

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