Edwards and Latta

Written By: - Date published: 2:18 pm, July 19th, 2009 - 12 comments
Categories: blogs, Media - Tags: , ,

Edwards and LattaThere’s an interesting discussion that’s broken out on brianedwardsmedia between Brian Edwards, who writes a fairly excoriating piece on Nigel Latta’s Politically Incorrect Parenting Show), and Latta who responds at length in the comments.

The show’s title, which frames a recurrent theme, always did strike me as shameless populist exploitation that’s more about vacuous, dog-whistle marketing than informing, and it’s reassuring to see Edwards and some of his commenters pick this apart. Latta also does a brave job of defending himself against some razor sharp ripostes.

Very cat and mouse.

12 comments on “Edwards and Latta”

  1. Ianmac 1

    Yes. Have been following that discussion. It seems to be largely about whether the life experiences esp. awful childhood ones, should be taken into consideration when later crimes are committed. Reasons V Excuses. I can’t see how you can avoid taking note of your childhood conditioning, yet in law it probably isn’t an excuse. Nigel does seem to be working hard in self-justification, but why not?

    • Ag 1.1

      It seems to me that Latta, like many people, has a strange reluctance to give up the idea of free will.

      People say they believe in it, but they really don’t, since virtually everything that human beings do is entirely predictable (imagine society if you couldn’t predict the actions of others with reasonable accuracy).

      My guess is that a lot of people want to hang on to free will for religious reasons, since most religion doesn’t make any sense without it (and therefore most religion doesn’t make any sense period).

  2. RedLogix 2

    Reasons V Excuses. I can’t see how you can avoid taking note of your childhood conditioning, yet in law it probably isn’t an excuse.

    Why does it have to be one or the other? I totally agree with Nigel’s position that violence is never excusable, that the individual who commits it should always held personally accountable. That is what we have Police, Courts and prisons for.

    But at the same time, there is always a reason why violence has occured, and society has an equal duty to determine, and if possible, take measures to mitigate the underlying causes. That is what we are supposed to have a Political system for, but in recent decades it has been captured by an dysfunctional, populist auction on who can be toughest on law’norder.

    It’s not a case of Reasons versus Excuses…. it’s both.

    • Bill 2.1

      “But at the same time, there is always a reason why violence has occured, and society has an equal duty to determine, and if possible, take measures to mitigate the underlying causes.”

      But that might involve a revolution of our political and economic spheres. Might. And liberals don’t want to go there.

      On the other hand it’s far easier for liberals to support and encourage those in power to regulate the behaviours of individuals (legislation, punishment for transgressing ever more narrowly defined norms…in short, unwittingly(?) pushing a bandwagon of fear in the name of caring and safety) while leaving all the political and economic shite untouched.

      BTW Linked off the thread to the paranormal stuff. Latta merely said that he believed the medium was genuine in her belief….not that he believed in the paranormal.

      Similarly I remember comments he made around S59 which I thought were fair enough…that the message would not get to the people society was concerned about. (Makes some middle class liberals feel better about themselves though ’cause ‘something is being done’) The bracketed bit is mine, not Latta’s.

      Back to the point. I have to say that some of Edwards’ underlying assumptions..or what I assume to be his underlying assumptions…start the bile rising. It appears he wants parents directed on risk aversions and all types of shite…he wants cotton candy wool.

      Thankfully, cotton candy wool burns nicely.

      • Ianmac 2.1.1

        I think that you must be thinking of a different Edwards! I am sure Brian is anything but the cotton wool (candy?) sort. Taking risks is the learning ground and the mistakes therefore are the great producers of later judgement and self-confidence. I bet Brian thinks this way.

        • Bill 2.1.1.1

          This Brian Edwards, Ianmac….”The trouble is that when you tell people it’s OK to feel angry with their kids, but don’t say how angry or what they should do with that anger; or when you say it’s OK to tell your children to go out and play, but don’t say for how long or how often; or when you say kids should be allowed to engage in risky activities, but don’t define an acceptable level of risk; or when you categorise aggression as a desirable quality in young people, but without giving any clear definition of what you mean – when you do any of that, you are effectively giving carte blanche to a range of attitudes and behaviours far wider and potentially far more destructive than you may have intended.

          The ‘ear flick’ man was angry and punched his kid in the face. OK? ‘Why don’t you go out and play?’ is a common parental mantra disguising lack of interest in the kids, their interests and ideas. OK? High-risk activities among young New Zealand men are responsible for a disproportionate number of fatal accidents in that demographic. OK? And aggression – is aggression ever really OK?”

          quick edit. Note Edwards confounds aggression and violence? Two completely different things, but hey.

  3. BLiP 3

    I – sort of – know Nigel and, yes, he’s a helluva nice chap. When he’s “on” he is one of those lively people who thrive with banter, agrument, pushing buttons, and the enlivening of animated conversation. I’ve watched as he takes views opposed to his own fundamental beliefs just for the devil of it.

    His persona has become a little puffed up since his emergence as a bit of a tv star. I imagine it must be incredible flattering being on the telly – what, with all that recognition and having an input into the national discourse and so on, not to mention hours in makeup and being with the “creatives”. Perhaps, for Nigel, having the his real message skewed downwards so as to appeal to the very bottom of the lowest common denominator, the advertisers, is a price he is prepared to pay. Long gone are the days when television feel obliged to inform and educate and cemented into place is the profit motive. It seems to me that

    Edwards’ criticism seems to me disingenuous and exploitative. Disingenuous because he is attacking the person and not the fact, which he knows full well himself, that the message has been filtered through the sewer of corporate greed. And, exploitative because in attacking the latest darling of the white-trash twittering middle class he is bound himself to receive considerable attention.

    Its also another example of the media feeding off the media – see further Naom Chomsky – which we see every night when one journalist on the news turns to another journalist (“live”, even) for comment as if the answering journalist is some sort of oracle worthy of attention when really the media corporation just wont fund the resources to contact and interview the real players in the drama. I’d rather The Standard just highlighted it with considered criticism rather than also fed at the trough,

  4. Ianmac 4

    In society at large we have to grapple with the myriad forms of abuse, especially in the formative years, as preventions of later violence. True. But how do you address the particular event which comes before the court? Should the Court be blind to causitives when suppose the lad was repeatedly sexual abused as a kid who then goes on to carry out the same acts himself? If he does so to someone in my family, I would want revenge no doubt, but …..

  5. Bill 5

    “Should the Court be blind to causitives when suppose the lad was repeatedly sexual abused as a kid who then goes on to carry out the same acts himself?”

    Yes.

    But in considering the sentence, no.

  6. Really shows who the audience of that show is when they have to have a lightbulb appear on the top left-hand corner of the screen indicating sarcasm.

    • Bill 6.1

      Gee, I thought that was subliminal advertising to do with global warming and my duty as a consumer to turn off some lights when watching TV!

      Worked too, so it did.

  7. Love to see Latta ‘do’ Gay Oakes and her crime.

    But that wouldnt fit the soap powder/Harvey Norman viewer demographic that they are going for .
    I didnt see all the episodes but they seemed to be men killing women and children with scrubbed clean victims. No hookers or gang girls
    A sort of CSI without the who- dunnit

Links to post

Leave a Comment

Show Tags

Recent Comments

Recent Posts

  • Urgent action needed on dirty rivers
    The Our Fresh Water Environment 2017 report re-confirms that we need urgent action to clean up our rivers. Meanwhile, National is standing by as our rivers get even more polluted, says Labour’s Environment spokesperson David Parker. “This report is yet ...
    10 hours ago
  • Where there’s smoke and mirrors, there’s Steven Joyce
    Steven Joyce’s much vaunted pre-Budget speech is simply an underwhelming response to the infrastructure deficit National has created, says Labour’s Finance Spokesperson Grant Robertson. “Steven Joyce has belatedly come to the realisation that everyone else has a long time ago, ...
    10 hours ago
  • Time to stamp out cold, mouldy rentals
    New figures show a small number of landlords are letting down the sector by renting cold, mouldy rentals. These houses need to be brought up to a decent standard for people to live in by Andrew Little’s Healthy Homes Bill, ...
    1 day ago
  • Time for fresh approach on immigration
    Latest figures showing another record year for immigration underlines the need for an urgent rethink on how this country can continue to absorb so many people, says Labour Leader Andrew Little. “New Zealand needs immigrants and is all the better ...
    2 days ago
  • Bring back the Mental Health Commission
    The People’s Mental Health Review is a much needed wake up call for the Government on mental health, says the Leader of the Opposition Andrew Little.   “I applaud their proposal to restore a Mental Health Commission and their call for ...
    3 days ago
  • And the band played on…
    Making Amy Adams the Housing Minister five months out from the election is just the orchestra playing on as National’s Titanic housing crisis slips below the waves – along with the hopes and dreams of countless Kiwi families, says Labour’s ...
    3 days ago
  • Hotel no place for children in care
    ...
    7 days ago
  • Maybe not, Minister? Nick Smith’s housing measure suppressed
    Sir Humphrey: Minister, remember the Housing Affordability Measure work you asked us to prepare back in 2012? Well, it’s ready now.Minister Smith: Oh goodie, what does it say?Sir Humphrey: Nothing.Minister Smith: Nothing?Sir Humphrey: Well, sir, you asked us to prepare ...
    7 days ago
  • Inflation data shows many New Zealanders are worse off under National
    The latest inflation data from Statistics New Zealand shows that too many New Zealanders are now worse off under the National Government, said Labour’s Finance Spokesperson Grant Robertson “Consumer Price Inflation (CPI) is now running at 2.2 per cent, and ...
    1 week ago
  • Another emergency housing grant blow out
      Emergency housing grants data released today show another blow out in spending on putting homeless people up in motels, says Labour’s Housing spokesperson Phil Twyford.   ...
    1 week ago
  • Families struggle as hardship grants increase
    The considerable increase in hardship grants shows that more and more Kiwi families are struggling to put food on the table and pay for basic schooling, says Labour’s Social Development spokesperson Carmel Sepuloni. ...
    1 week ago
  • More tinkering, no leadership from Nats on immigration
    National’s latest tinkering with the immigration system is another attempt to create the appearance of action without actually doing anything meaningful, says Leader of the Opposition Andrew Little. ...
    1 week ago
  • Suicide figures make for grim reading
    The 506 suspected suicides of Kiwis who have been in the care of mental health services in the last four years show that these services are under severe stress, says Labour’s Health spokesperson David Clark.   “If you do the ...
    1 week ago
  • Pay equity deal a victory for determination and unions
    The pay equity settlement revealed today for around 55,000 low-paid workers was hard-won by a determined Kristine Bartlett backed by her union, up against sheer Government resistance to paying Kiwis their fair share, says Labour Leader Andrew Little. “Labour welcomes ...
    1 week ago
  • DHB’s forced to make tough choices
    The Minister of Health today admitted that the country’s District Health Boards were having to spend more than their ring fenced expenditure on Mental Health, says Labour’s Health spokesperson David Clark.   “The situation is serious with Capital and Coast ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Nats break emergency housing pledge – deliver just five more places
    Despite National’s promises of 2,200 emergency housing beds, just 737 were provided in the March Quarter, an increase of only five from six months earlier, says Labour’s Housing spokesperson Phil Twyford. ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Research underlines need for KiwiBuild
    New research showing the social and fiscal benefits of homeownership underlines the need for a massive government-backed building programme like KiwiBuild, says Labour’s housing spokesperson Phil Twyford. ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Social data security review too little, too late
    The independent review into the Ministry of Social Development’s individual client level data IT system is too little, too late, says Labour’s Social Development spokesperson Carmel Sepuloni. “The Minister of Social Development has finally seen some sense and called for ...
    2 weeks ago
  • More questions raised on CERA conflicts
    With the admission that three more former CERA staff members are under suspicion of not appropriately managing conflicts of interest related to the Canterbury rebuild, it’s imperative that CERA’s successor organisation Ōtākaro fronts up to Parliamentary questions, says Labour’s Canterbury ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Labour to tackle Hutt housing crisis
    Labour will build a mix of 400 state houses and affordable KiwiBuild homes in the Hutt Valley in its first term in government to tackle the housing crisis there, says Leader of the Opposition Andrew Little. “Housing in the Hutt ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Farewell to John Clarke
    This wonderfully talented man has been claimed by Australia, but how I remember John Clarke is as a young Wellington actor who performed satirical pieces in a show called “Knickers” at Downstage Theatre. The show featured other future luminaries like ...
    GreensBy Catherine Delahunty
    2 weeks ago
  • Valedictory Speech
    Te papa pounamu Aotearoa NZ Karanga karanga karanga; Nga tupuna Haere haere haere; Te kahui ora te korowai o tenei whare; E tu e tu ... tutahi tonu Ki a koutou oku hoa mahi ki Te Kawanatanga; Noho mai noho ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Buck stops with Gerry Brownlee
    The fact that the State Services Commission has referred the CERA conflict of interest issue to the Serious Fraud Office is a positive move, but one that raises serious questions about the Government’s oversight of the rebuild, says Labour Canterbury ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Teachers deserve a democratic Education Council
    Teachers around New Zealand reeling from the news that their registration fees could more than double will be even angrier that the National Government has removed their ability to have any say about who sits on the Council that sets ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Free trade backers are simply out of touch
    Are the backers of free trade out of touch with public opinion? This was the question asked when the Chartered Accountants launched their Future of Trade study. I was astonished by the answer in a room of free trade enthusiasts ...
    GreensBy Barry Coates
    2 weeks ago
  • John Clarke aka Fred Dagg will be missed by all Kiwis
    The man who revolutionised comedy on both sides of the Tasman, John Clarke, will be sadly missed by Kiwis and Aussies alike, says the Leader of the Opposition Andrew Little.   “I grew up with Fred Dagg and I am ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Labour’s modern approach to monetary policy
    A commitment to full employment and a more transparent process to provide market certainty are the hallmarks of Labour’s proposals for a new approach to monetary policy, says Labour’s Finance spokesperson Grant Robertson. ...
    3 weeks ago
  • Greens back Labour’s plan for monetary policy reform
    Labour plans to change the way we do monetary policy in New Zealand and the Green Party supports them fully. We’re now of a single mind on this. Labour will move away from our reliance on a single, unelected person ...
    GreensBy robert.ashe
    3 weeks ago
  • Greens back Labour’s monetary policy reform
    Labour plans to change the way we do monetary policy in New Zealand and the Green Party supports them fully. We’re now of a single mind on this. Labour will move away from our reliance on a single, unelected person ...
    GreensBy James Shaw
    3 weeks ago
  • Govt drops ball on Masters Games housing squeeze
    Families currently living in emergency accommodation face being forced out onto the street as motel accommodation in Auckland is filled up by contestants and visitors of the World Masters Games in coming weeks, says Labours social development spokesperson Carmel Sepuloni. ...
    3 weeks ago
  • State inquiry for Nga Morehu – The Survivors of State Abuse
    The Prime Minister must show humanitarian leadership and launch an independent inquiry into historic claims of abuse of children who were in State care, says Labour’s Deputy Leader Jacinda Ardern. ...
    3 weeks ago
  • Coleman – ‘overwhelmed by disinterest’ and ‘conked out’
    Today’s trenchant criticism of the Government’s health policy by Ian Powell the executive director of the Association of Salaried Medical Specialists must trigger action by the Minister, says Labour’s spokesperson for Health David Clark. ...
    3 weeks ago