Key lied to Parliament?

Written By: - Date published: 12:23 pm, February 21st, 2013 - 71 comments
Categories: john key - Tags: ,

Breaking news, but it certainly looks like John Key has (1) made up nonsense, and (2) lied to Parliament:

TVNZ: SkyCity hasn’t asked us for land

TVNZ says it has had no approach from SkyCity to buy its land for the proposed convention centre, contrary to the Prime Minister’s assurances to Parliament yesterday. …

TVNZ’s position is in contrast to statements by John Key to Parliament yesterday when he was quizzed over what discussions he and his staff had with SkyCity about TVNZ’s taxpayer-owned land.

What’s going on here?

Update: Key is publicly backing down. Looks like an apology and explanation to Parliament will be needed.

71 comments on “Key lied to Parliament? ”

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  1. Craig Glen viper 1
    21 February 2013 at 12:38 pm

    John Key being John Key if he’s not planking he’s lying and history seems to suggesting he is good at just making things up and doing figures on the back of a serviette. Why would he stop now the MSM has fallen fall all his crap and even helps him out from time to time.

  2. vto 2
    21 February 2013 at 12:48 pm

    .
    It has been said a million times before but what is going here is John Key making shit up as he goes along (lying) and then simply keeping going and going until each debacle gets lost in the annals of time.

    John Key is a compulsive liar

    • SpaceMonkey 2.1
      21 February 2013 at 1:58 pm

      And if ever he runs out of wriggle room… the brain fade kicks in.

      • rosy 2.1.1
        21 February 2013 at 5:10 pm

        “And if ever he runs out of wriggle room… the brain fade kicks in.”

        I’ve gotta give him a bit of leeway there. When a person lies about so much stuff so much of the time, a person can forget where the truth ended and the lie began, so it gets mixed it up sometimes. In the end the brain fade can be the only thing that has a ring of truth to it.

  3. saarbo 3
    21 February 2013 at 1:01 pm

    Amazingly John Key and National are wriggling out of this scandal. This is the sort of corruption that governments in third world countries get up to.

    I hate to say it but John Key is one of the most adept politicians when he has his back against the wall. There is NO WAY he should be able to wriggle out of this one…but he will, as he did with the Dot Com saga. Mr. Shearer simply cant nail him, he doesnt even get close.

    This leads me to how David Shearer is going to perform in the debates next year, I listened to him on BFM yesterday, not good and student radio shouldnt be the toughest domain in the world for a Labour leader. There is a huge gap between Key and Shearer when it comes to debating, John Key will do anything to get himself out of the shit, he will say anything. David Shearer has to retain a lot of facts and information to nail him. I hope he can improve over the next 20 months.

    • Chris 3.1
      21 February 2013 at 3:59 pm

      key does not debate! He just makes up a lot of shite on the trot.He gets away with not answering questions in parliament because the speaker allows him to (same with hekia parroter) He is allowed to go on with his “and BY THE WAY Labour did this about a hundred years ago yadayada” he is allowed to be personally abusive, he is allowed to call opposition “hypocritical” even though it’s against historical rules of the house.How is Shearer or any opposition able to enter into a true political debate when key has set the bar so low with the enablement of the speaker. Carter would not budge on Tuesday when tackled on keys non answer to Shearers question,and also Meteira Turei’s question.What is the bleeding point of question time? And he is ALLOWED TO LIE without being pulled up and censored.Question time in Parliament is farcical.It just makes me so angry.

      • vto 3.1.1
        21 February 2013 at 4:16 pm

        “It just makes me so angry.”

        Yes, me too as often seems to come out in my posts. It is the complete and utter double standards of these arseholes – making laws and rules and setting and expecting standards of us, while they themselves just waltz all over those laws and rules and standards and shit everywhere stinking up the place, lying and deceiving being fraudulent and dishonest and ignoring people and shit and shit and shit.

        Personally I have nothing but contempt for pretty much the lot of them. [.. insert abusive swear word here…]

        But, you know, we all get our dayin the sun …….

    • Hami Shearlie 3.2
      21 February 2013 at 5:45 pm

      He’s had well over a year already, so I don’t think I’ll be holding my breath waiting. Shearer is the worst Leader that Labour has ever had, end of!

    • Don't worry be happy 3.3
      22 February 2013 at 6:23 am

      I found it revealing (and dispiriting) that it was the leader of NZF who did the research and laid down the ground work for Key to make a right dick of himself to Parliament, again.

      Not the ‘leader’ of the Labour Party…..

      Seriously, we need Key gone, closely followed by Shearer, Robertson et al.

      We’re in for a rocky row, boys and girls. ‘Every man for himself’ (the National Party foundation slogan) is not going to work.

  4. BLiP 4
    21 February 2013 at 2:02 pm

    .

    And, another one for the list. Thanks John, I’m lovin’ it.

    – We seek a 50% reduction in New Zealand’s carbon-equivalent net emissions, as compared to 1990 levels, by 2050. 50 by 50. We will write the target into law.

    – National Ltd™ will provide a consistent incentive for both biofuel and biodiesel by exempting them from excise tax or road user charges

    – I didn’t know about The Bretheren election tactics

    – If they came to us now with that proposal [re trans-Tasman Therapeutic Goods regime], we will sign it

    – 1981

    – Tranzrail shares

    – Lord Ashcroft

    – National Ltd™ would have sent troops into Iraq

    – Standard & Poors credit downgrade

    – I didn’t say I want wages to drop

    – the real figure of inflation is 3.3 percent.

    – the tourism sector has not lost 7,000 jobs

    – I won’t raise GST

    – the purchase of farmland, by overseas buyers will be restricted to ten farms per purchase

    – capping, not cutting the public service,

    – north of $50 a week

    – privatisation won’t significantly help the economy

    – wave goodbye to higher taxes, not your loved ones

    – I never offered Brash a diplomatic job in London

    – Tariana Turia is “totally fine” with the Tuhoe Treaty Claim deal

    – Kiwisaver

    – National Ltd™ is not going to radically reorganise the structure of the public sector

    – tax cuts won’t require additional borrowing

    – 14,000 new apprentices will start training over the next five years, over and above the number
    previously forecast

    – Our amendments to the ETS ensure we will continue to do our fair share internationally

    – we are committed to honouring our Kyoto Protocol obligations

    – we [NZ} have grown for eight of the last nine quarters”

    – National Ltd™ will tender out the government banking contract

    – we will be back in surplus by 2014-15

    – unemployment is starting to fall

    – we have created 45,000 jobs

    – we are likely to create 170,000 jobs in the next 4 years

    – I don’t know if I own a vineyard

    – the Isreali spy killed in the Christchurch quake had “only one” passport

    – the Police will not need to make savings by losing jobs

    – GCSB re Kim Dotcom x 3 (that we know about)

    – I voted to keep the drinking age at 20

    – New Zealand is 100% Pure

    – I’ve been prime minister for four years, and it’s really 24 hours a day, seven days a week, 365
    days a year

    – baseball in New Zealand is attracting more government support

    – the public demanded that we change the labour laws for The Hobbit

    – “The Hobbit” created 3000 new jobs

    – we have delivered 1000 extra doctors in the public service

    – I wasn’t working at Elders when the sham foreign exchange deals took place

    – I was starting School Certificate exams in 1978

    – cutting consent fees and times and opening up land to developers will create affordable housing

    – Labour left the economy in poor shape

    – forecasts show unemployment will fall

    – our [NZ’s] terms of trade remain high

    – the TPP is an example of democracy

    – National Ltd™ will use the proceeds of state asset sales to invest in other public assets, like
    schools and hospitals

    – overseas investment in New Zealand adds to what New Zealanders can invest on their own

    – overseas investment in New Zealand creates jobs, boosts incomes, and helps the economy grow

    – National Ltd™ will build 2000 houses over the next two years

    – Sky City approached TVNZ about the purchase/use of land owned by the latter

  5. The Al1en 5
    21 February 2013 at 2:04 pm

    “I hope he can improve over the next 20 months.”

    Like at least twenty two of caucus do, having ‘secretly’ staked their credibility to the mast, even though they’re not accountable for failing… Except for Grant Robertson, who’s probably more focussed on 2015.

  6. emergency mike 6
    21 February 2013 at 2:11 pm

    Maybe Key will rehash his “I wasn’t at the meeting but I’ve got an email from an mate whose name I’ll keep secret that says I’m telling the truth,” line. Or perhaps we’ll be lucky enough to be graced with an all new one after he turns to the next page in his copy of ‘Bart Simpson’s Big Book of Excuses For Corporate Managers’.

  7. Zaphod Beeblebrox 7
    21 February 2013 at 2:20 pm

    Same as with The Warners execs and then th Kim Dotcom advice he did then did not receive. Is anybody surprised?

  8. Treetop 8
    21 February 2013 at 2:20 pm

    People have got to know whether or not there president is a crook.”

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/longterm/watergate/articles/111873-1.htm

    Nixon was exposed for what he was, a liar. Eventually the lies caught up with him because those who knew the truth would no longer protect him or could not protect him as their lies would be exposed.

    Key is being protected by some of his ministers and unless those ministers are also exposed (by pressure being put on them) the full extent of the public being lied to re SkyCity will not be revealed.

    I reiterate that there will not be a government clause to state that pokie machine numbers will be reduced to pre convention numbers once the convention centre is paid for by pokie addicts. If Key really wants a PAID for convention centre by SkyCity, this is the only deal I would offer SkyCity bearing in mind the damage that the extra machines will do in the interim.

  9. r0b 9
    21 February 2013 at 2:44 pm

    Key is publicly backing down. Looks like an apology and explanation to Parliament will be needed.

  10. burt 10
    21 February 2013 at 2:49 pm

    Following the low level of accountability demonstrated by the last Labour government the privileges committee will determine he misled parliament and the people and his punishment will be that he is required to tell us that we need to move on.

    Lets hope that unlike the untouchable Labour/NZ First leaders that there is actually some accountability. IMHO he should resign. I’m sure if you scan the campaign leaders debates from 2008 you will find that Key said if he is ever found lying he will resign. May be worth taking the time to review the footage and if I’m correct – playing it back to him !

    • emergency mike 10.1
      21 February 2013 at 3:17 pm

      “Key said if he is ever found lying he will resign”

      You are assuming he wasn’t lying about that. To some people promises are just things you say to get something you want in the moment. You can always figure out how to break them later. Am I right Hekia Parata?

      • Puddleglum 10.1.1
        21 February 2013 at 7:55 pm

        I suppose Key could get all definitional about when a lie is a lie, but burt is correct – footage of promising to resign if found lying sitting alongside pretty damning evidence (and general agreement) that he has lied would, at the very least, spell the spluttering end of the shooting star that has been John Key’s political career.

        Forgetfulness (I have so many conversations as PM during my tours of the country as Number One Entertainer …), confusion (Sorry, I was getting it mixed up with the conversation I had over getting DoC to sell Fiordland to Peter Jackson for filming of The Silmarillion…), shoulder-shrugging (OK, yeah, if that’s what you think …) are likely responses from Key.

  11. JonL 11
    21 February 2013 at 2:52 pm

    “Key is being protected by some of his ministers and unless those ministers are also exposed (by pressure being put on them) the full extent of the public being lied to re SkyCity will not be revealed”

    Well, don’t hold your breath that Shearer and co will do anything about it!

  12. The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 12
    21 February 2013 at 3:01 pm

    So, no grand conspiracy to force TVNZ to transfer land to Sky City? Happy now?

    • vto 12.1
      21 February 2013 at 3:06 pm

      No. The Prime Minister of New Zealand is a liar and that is a most unhappy state of affairs.

      • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 12.1.1
        21 February 2013 at 3:13 pm

        Yeah, my hopes weren’t high.

      • Treetop 12.1.2
        21 February 2013 at 3:22 pm

        At the very least a FOOL. He either knew or was misinformed. If he knew yes he lied, if he was misinformed, he was lied to and he needs to publicly expose the liar and fire them.

        Which one?

        • emergency mike 12.1.2.1
          21 February 2013 at 3:43 pm

          He may end up going for ol’ brain fade. Whoops! Got ma facts wrong somehow, I’m human after all. Everyone makes little mistakes now and then right? Move on.

          Or maybe blame an underling? Someone else messed up and gave me some information that was, er, out of date, um, a rough draft, ah… an inter-office prank… just a proposal… Don’t worry he’ll think of something.

          • Treetop 12.1.2.1.1
            21 February 2013 at 4:09 pm

            Key knew he would be questioned in the house re SkyCity and were I the PM I would make sure that I had the correct facts before I addressed the house on something as big as the SkyCity scandal, (it is his job to have checked).

            Immature to give brain fade as an excuse (shows he does not have the capacity to learn from a previous experience).

            • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 12.1.2.1.1.1
              21 February 2013 at 5:05 pm

              …were I the PM I would make sure that I had the correct facts before I addressed the house

              But you’re not the PM, are you Treetop?

    • Pascal's bookie 12.2
      21 February 2013 at 3:59 pm

      So, no grand conspiracy to force TVNZ to transfer land to Sky City? Happy now?

      How do you make that out?

      The negotiation seem to be along the lines of:

      You wanna build a convention centre?

      Maybe, how much you putting in?

      Nothin. But yknow, got any problems we could make go away?

      We aren’t allowed anymore pokies :(. More pokies would be nice.

      Right. It would have to be a big convention centre.

      We’d need more land to build it, but how does this look? *shows design of centre incorporating TVNZ land*

      Looks nice. *Doesn’t tell TVNZ*

      • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 12.2.1
        21 February 2013 at 5:08 pm

        In that conversation (which you invented, but we’ll accept as gospel) there’s no conspiracy to arrange the transfer of TVNZ’s land to Sky City.

        • Pascal's bookie 12.2.1.1
          21 February 2013 at 6:46 pm

          Yet.

          But without the transfer, there’s no deal on offer. And the deal is in play.

          And I had to make up the actual words, as the numbers guy from New York didn’t keep notes when he had his sit down with the Casino boss, strangely enough.

          But if you read the report, or even the reporting on it, I’m pretty sure you’ll find that that’s the best estimate we have about how negotiations went.

          • the pigman 12.2.1.1.1
            22 February 2013 at 1:34 am

            Exactly – exactly. This is the point that someone actually needs to nail John Key on. I think the extent of his knowledge of the expansion plans onto TVNZ land speaks to the depth of his involvement in the deal.

            The key to making him lose some sleep over this lies there.

            • Treetop 12.2.1.1.1.1
              22 February 2013 at 10:58 am

              Now let me see what SkyCity wants

              1. More land to be acquired

              2. 500 extra pokie machines

              3. Government subsidy once the convention centre is built.

              When it comes to the other so called expressions of interest the deal is off the table because all Key can see is a building. He needs to see the hidden costs/liabilities/embarrassament to the government and the damage which pokie addiction causes.

              There is to be a category in the DCM V which is to be printed in May 2013 on online gaming addiction. Key has given the argument that people can go online to gamble. Key does not have to be responsible for any other casino as he is not doing a deal with them. When it comes to SkyCity he is and he needs to be responsible and accountable for the outcome of pokie addics who use SkyCity.

    • DH 12.3
      21 February 2013 at 6:42 pm

      “So, no grand conspiracy to force TVNZ to transfer land to Sky City? Happy now?”

      AO report seems to suggest it was a done deal and since TVNZ now state they never agreed to it then it’s a safe assumption it going to be forced on them……

      5.47 “However, before making a recommendation to Ministers to that effect, officials
      wanted to be sure that there would be no “show-stopping” barriers to the
      proposed convention centre being built on the Hobson Street site, and that the
      design met the international standards for a convention and exhibition centre
      that could take conferences of 3500 (and more) people. Therefore, officials began
      a range of detailed work to explore a full range of potential practical issues,
      including:

      • a “walk-through” of planning and consent aspects for the centre and site
      (carried out by Auckland Council in April 2011);
      • being clear (with the Offi ce of Treaty Settlements) about any Treaty of Waitangi
      claims on the TVNZ land needed for an expanded centre;
      • valuation of the TVNZ land;

      ……………

      One can reasonably assume they wouldn’t go to that trouble without first confirming the TVNZ land was actually available.

  13. bad12 13
    21 February 2013 at 3:42 pm

    Slippery being Slippery what we would all really expect of our Prime Minister, the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the aforementioned,

    It is obvious that the Prime Minister mislead the New Zealand Parliament, He,(Slippery), cannot have mislead that Parliament from having gained wrong advice form His Ministers, Craig Foss, the Minister of Broadcasting, and therefor the Minister in charge of Television New Zealand has already said that He knows nothing of any proposal for TVNZ to sell any land or buildings to Sky-City,

    The board of TVNZ have also said that they know nothing of any such proposal and have not been approached by Sky-City,

    SO, who then advised the Prime Minister that the deal was to be done between Sky-City and TVNZ, and, Has Slippery the Prime Minister got a shred of evidence that could have lead Him to the belief that such a deal had already been put to TVNZ by Sky-City,

    The answer to that is a resounding NO, the Prime Minister letting His Slippery little mouth get the better of Him has simply made up a story which He has then foisted upon the New Zealand Parliament and on the people of New Zealand,

    He, the Slippery little Shyster we have as Prime Minister should be made to stand befor the Privileges Committee of the Parliament charged with deliberately misleading the Parliament and face censure over what is best described as another LIE in a long series of them glibly Slipped from the mouth of the Prime Minister over the past 4 years…

    • freedom 13.1
      21 February 2013 at 3:57 pm

      +1
      ” has simply made up a story which He has then foisted upon the New Zealand Parliament and on the people of New Zealand,”

      and we were once a Country with such promise

  14. One Tāne Huna 14
    21 February 2013 at 3:45 pm

    It could be that he’s lying because he’s corrupt. On the other hand it could be that he didn’t bother to verify the information because he’s bored and doesn’t want the job. Or that he was drunk.

    Or maybe all three.

  15. Afewknowthetruth 15
    21 February 2013 at 5:52 pm

    Tony B Liar, the Mafia boss beginning with B who wants to get back into power, Nickel arse Sarkozy, Hi Liar Clinton and her ‘I didn’t have sex with her’ husband, Jonny -they’re hurling babies into the water- How hard, O’Bomber, the Macaroon man ……. they all lie continuously. Lying is what politics all about: he/she who can lie most successfully while looting the till and enriching his/her mates wins.

  16. tracey 16
    21 February 2013 at 6:41 pm

    John banks

  17. The Al1en 17
    21 February 2013 at 6:52 pm

    Just a little aside.
    Would it be consensus that Key lying to parliament is a golden opportunity for the opposition parties to score a long waited for blow on behalf of us over here on the left?
    And would it be a fair assumption that these unfolding events will feature heavily in the the opinions of those sought for next months round of polling?
    And if so, will this be considered the first real, proper chance for DS to show his position is indeed his own and he really is the man to beat the man who would be king?

    If its all about numbers, which it is, what are we looking at here next moon?
    If you’re not into crystal ball gazing, come at it from what you expect from Labour that will show they’ve got it right? And seeing many here are posting quite correctly that key done wrong, what do they expect to see from the new lanky number nine with an open goal in front of him?

    Make or break? Probably not given current circumstances, but should it be?

    • gobsmacked 17.1
      21 February 2013 at 7:28 pm

      Just what I was thinking, Allen.

      Here’s the question for the Labour leadership – are you going to make Key pay for this, or are you going to let it slide by? The 6 pm TV news shows aren’t running hot with this yet (sure, they covered it but only as a minor story, and with the weekend coming, it could just disappear). Will Key get off the hook … again?

      So here’s what you could do: co-ordinate with the Greens and Peters, dedicate the whole of the next QT in Parliament to putting the heat on Key, tag-team as much as possible, delete all other questions (never mind whose turn it is to ask in their portfolo, you gotta be flexible and smart here), let the others share in the attack (i.e. don’t waste all your chances on Shearer), and be ready for all the follow-up: every release and interview and blog and tweet dedicated to your one goal …

      Yes, you can blame the usual suspects (the Speaker will be biased, the MSM will be trivial, the Tories will be devious, all and any distractions will be used, you KNOW how it works, surely?). But in the end it’s up to you. You can continue your disjointed and lethargic ways, and maybe the polls will keep moving up, and everything will be fine. Or you can act like a hungry and determined and bloody ruthless opposition. Like we’ve been asking for years.

      I’m sure most of us couldn’t give a toss who gets the credit for nailing Key. Just nail him.

      • Anne 17.1.1
        21 February 2013 at 8:40 pm

        So here’s what you could do: co-ordinate with the Greens and Peters, dedicate the whole of the next QT in Parliament to putting the heat on Key, tag-team as much as possible,…blockquote>

        That’s pretty much what they did today gobsmacked. I was watching and it was my impression there was a coordinated effort on behalf of the 3 Opposition parties. They can’t stop govt. MPs trying to derail the attempt by asking patsy questions on other issues but they did a good job today. It started with a long session from Robertson, that was followed 15mins later by a session with Peters and towards the end of QT another lengthy session with Norman. Each of them came at it from a different angle. It was Joyce who had to do the batting back, but you can be sure there will be another session next Tues.

      • MrSmith 17.1.2
        21 February 2013 at 9:18 pm

        Labour would rather spend 4 more years on opposition GobS…. than share, haven’t they made that obvious already.

  18. tracey 18
    21 February 2013 at 7:11 pm

    Its much harder to remember lies than the truth. I think key forgot that sky and tvnz werent supposed to have talked.

  19. bad12 19
    21 February 2013 at 7:57 pm

    I doubt whether the truth of the assertion Slippery was making over TVNZ and Sky-City having already started negotiations over land issues even entered that ones mind,

    The Slippery little Shyster we have as Prime Minister is a ‘compulsive’ and under fire from the opposition over His claims that He wasn’t at the center of the Sky-City deal and this wasn’t a ‘done deal’ right from the time that Key and His officials dined with Sky-City executives on a number of occasions befor attempting to cover their tracks by seeking expressions of interest from other party’s, He has simply done what all compulsive’s do when put on the spot of their previous dishonesty,

    Tell an even bigger one to distract attention form the last batch of BS, the last batch of course having at it’s heart the actual ‘corruption’ of and within the whole process,

    Today Slippery gets to back off from the lie used as the ‘smokescreen’ to hide that corruption of process with the ‘thinking’ being that being caught with a minor piece of BS will satisfy the circling sharks of the opposition, entertain the media for a day, and then all will be forgotten,

    Not only should the Prime Minister be getting a date to appear befor the Parliament’s Privileges Committee, He also should be getting an ongoing and substantive grilling over the coming months from the combined Opposition questioning every aspect of this ‘process’ right down to the details of digging out ‘who’ paid for the dinner dates between the Prime Minister,His officials and the Executives from Sky-City…

  20. One Tāne Huna 20
    21 February 2013 at 7:58 pm

    When it comes down to it it’s the National Party’s responsibility. A responsibility to itself. Do they want to give up the pretence that they are a modern democratic organisation, committed to the rule of law and answerable to New Zealand, or are they prepared to acknowledge that they are little more than a criminal organisation, committed to graft and corruption.

    Your call, National.

    • muzza 20.1
      21 February 2013 at 9:45 pm

      Good stuff Bloke – You won’t get an answer though, and should spread it wider than National, like perhaps parliament, local govt and take it from there…

      Do they respresent NZ, or are they criminal organisations, answerable to criminal organisations..

      Loving the new attitude, hot stuff!

  21. BrucetheMoose 21
    22 February 2013 at 12:05 am

    Key caught lying? Noooooo

  22. BLiP 22
    22 February 2013 at 1:54 am

    .

    If it turns out that John Key is corrupt and has been for some time and has been arrested a charged with theft, will his spouse/partner also face criminal liability? Just askin’.

  23. tracey 23
    22 February 2013 at 8:20 am

    The tvnz thing is confusing, they say they have not been approached by sky BUT they do say when they “heard” sky was looking at their land they engaged an architect to see how they could better use their building. Or have I misunderstood?

    • Anne 23.1
      22 February 2013 at 10:01 pm

      The left hand didn’t know what the right hand was saying tracey?

      Can’t remember their names, but my impression was that the TVNZ bloke interviewed tried to cover up for Key but the woman interviewee was telling the truth. She stated categorically that there had been no approach from Sky City for the land – end of story as far as she was concerned.

  24. irascible 24
    22 February 2013 at 9:09 am

    As a Money speculator the art of dissembling and lying has been so well embedded in the brain of its arch practioner that he sees no difference as the PM of a country when launching yet another unresearched speculation onto the market. He, of course, doesn’t recognise the damage such behaviour causes as he would’ve long left the scene with hispurse well lined.

    • tracey 24.1
      22 February 2013 at 1:53 pm

      I agree. I have seen it alot over the last 24 years in law. There are people to whom lying is second nature (probably started when as kids they got caught and tried to wriggle out). Interestingly it seems that the more they repeat the lie the more they begin to believe it is true. It is much easier to continue the lie with a sort of sincerity because they now actually believe it is the truth.

      Mr Key has been VERY honest about his ethics, without meaning to of course. By saying he wouldn’t lose any sleep he revealed the Machiavelli in him (even if he doesn’t know how to pronounce it).

      “Abilities

      Due to their skill at interpersonal manipulation, there has often been an assumption that high Machs possess superior intelligence, or ability to understand other people in social situations. However, research has firmly established that Machiavellianism is unrelated to IQ. Furthermore, studies on emotional intelligence have found that high Machiavellianism actually tends to be associated with low emotional intelligence as assessed by both performance and questionnaire measures. Both empathy and emotion recognition have been shown to have negative correlations with Machiavellianism. Additionally, research has shown that Machiavellianism is unrelated to a more advanced theory of mind, that is, the ability to anticipate what others are thinking in social situations. If high Machs actually are skilled at manipulating others this appears to be unrelated to any special cognitive abilities as such.” wikipedia