Labour day

Written By: - Date published: 2:20 pm, October 28th, 2024 - 21 comments
Categories: greens, labour, uncategorized, Unions, workers' rights - Tags:

We’ve written a bit about Labour Day over the years – see the archives for the origins, history, and importance of the day. Enjoying your weekend? Thank a unionist!

21 comments on “Labour day ”

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  1. mickysavage 1
    28 October 2024 at 2:21 pm

    Sorry about the late post and happy Labour day everyone. A good day to spend with whanau and friends but do think about what you can do to change the Government.

  2. unMickysavage 2
    28 October 2024 at 2:51 pm

    If anything, today is a day to celebrate that unions are a throw back to the past.

    Thank goodness they now only account for 15% of the workrkforce and most of that in public sector jobs.

    [Letting this through because it is the weakest attempt at trolling I have seen for a while. Fancy agreeing to celebrate a worker’s hioliday by attacking Unions who created the holiday – the real MS]

    [name updated because we already have a micky savage 😈 – weka]

    • alwyn 2.1
      29 October 2024 at 1:25 pm

      I considered your question quite seriously before I made my comment.

      Credit for the 8 hour day in New Zealand is normally awarded to Samuel Parnell, who, from 1840 in Petone refused to accept jobs that required he work more than 8 hours per day. Labour Day itself has been celebrated since 1890. Does the New Zealand Labour Party deserve any credit? Well no. After all the party wasn't even in existence then and wasn't started until 25 years after the first celebration.

      Was it due to the Unions? Well no. Parnell himself, as far as I am aware was never a Union member and he refused to join a Union in Britain, before he came to New Zealand because they would not campaign for the right.

      He became self-employed and, without getting a Government involved, negotiated his own terms of employment. You didn't have to employ him, and he didn't have to accept work unless an 8 hour day was part of the deal.

      Who did that seem most like? Well the ACT party of course. They most closely follow the way Parnell operated. Negotiate for yourself and work for yourself.

      https://teara.govt.nz/en/biographies/1p7/parnell-samuel-duncan

      • KJT 2.1.1
        29 October 2024 at 1:32 pm

        Except that he and his fellow tradesmen wouldn't allow others, or their staff, to work more than 8 hours, either.

        Acting together as a Comunity, as they did, is a totally foreign concept to the nutters in ACT.

        Noting that if contractors, even the fake ones like actors, Uber drivers, couriers and telecommunications workers, clubbed together to set working conditions, these days, the Commerce Commission can prosecute. One of the reasons why an 8 hour day is no more.

        Note also that ACT supporters, for some strangely cognitively dissonant reason, tend to be the most dependant on the State for their income.

        • Belladonna 2.1.1.1
          29 October 2024 at 2:15 pm

          This is arrant rubbish.

          True self-employed contractors (thinking here of plumbers, IT developers, and lawyers) set their own hours. [Yes, *some* of these are employees, but many are truly self-employed]

          They may do so in consultation with customers (e.g. working late – suitably recompensed for a large project) – but are entirely free to write contracts which stipulate an 8-hour day.

          Indeed, I have an IT developer acquaintance – who only 'works' (i.e. is available to clients) 4 hours during the day. He may, or may not work evenings to his own schedule. Of course, he can afford to do so – because of his swingeing hourly-rate. But the point is that there is no way the Commerce Commission is even slightly interested. It all in the up-front contract.

          The facility to do this, is of course, dependent on the ability of the individual to negotiate a contract (rather than the take-it-or-leave-it contracts routinely offered to Uber drivers – for example). And has more to do with the relative scarcity of the pool of workers (a lot fewer IT developers, than Uber drivers), than it does to do with legislation.

          But, it's not illegal in any way, for Uber drivers (for example) to agree together to set minimum standards (an informal union) for their contracts. It may be ineffective (as in, they won't get the contract), but it is not illegal. The part that they can't do is negotiate collectively (although, this seems to no longer be true for actors), or take collective industrial action (strike)

          The Commerce Commission is interested in price fixing. Not in individual working conditions. If every plumber in NZ got together and decided to have a minimum charge-out rate of $500 per hour (and was silly enough to broadcast the decision) – then the CC might be interested. Note that Equity (the Actor's union) is neither illegal nor has been prosecuted by the CC. And, in fact, since the 2022 law change, negotiated collective conditions for it's members.

          https://equity.org.nz/siwapedia/

          But if they are simply bench-marking charge-out rates on each other, or deciding to only work an 8 hour day – the CC is demonstrably uninterested (petrol and supermarkets are examples here)

          The real issue for most of the 'fake contractors' (who are really employees under another name) – is that they need to work more than 8 hour days, in order to make a living.

          I've never understood why everyone is so outraged about actors coming under contract employment law. They are (pretty much by definition) employed on time-limited projects (just like an IT contractor).

          I think that ongoing contracts (like Uber drivers, are a lot more 'iffy' – they are treated like employees, but without any of the benefits).

          • KJT 2.1.1.1.1
            29 October 2024 at 2:23 pm

            Replying with "arrant rubbish" which shows a lack of knowledge of both employment law and the commerce Act.

            And. Uber drivers cannot legally take collective action to enforce working hour limits as “independent contractors”.
            The only reason that their hasn't been a legal action under the commerce act, for "independent contractors" "colluding" to set working hours is because no one bothers to do it, apart from Unions such as lawyers. Ha. Obvious why you don't take lawyers to court.

            BTW. The commerce commission has taken an “interest” in service stations/oil companies, “colluding” with pricing.

            • Belladonna 2.1.1.1.1.1
              29 October 2024 at 4:01 pm

              I never said that Uber drivers could take collective action

              My quote "The part that they can't do is negotiate collectively (although, this seems to no longer be true for actors), or take collective industrial action (strike)"

              And, it is arrant rubbish to claim that no one sets minimum standards because of fear of the CC prosecuting. Any evidence that the CC has ever prosecuted contract parties for 'collusion' or 'price setting' – when they're benchmarking price and conditions against the 'market'?

              The closest I can find it a prosecution against a construction cartel for 'bid rigging' – an entirely different section of the law.

              In order for a prosecution to succeed, you'd have to prove that parties were actively colluding, rather than simply benchmarking against current prices/conditions. Good luck with that in court!

              If you want to take aim at the practice of 'fake' contracting (people employed as contractors, when they are actually employees) – then make that case. It should be easy enough.

              Which has absolutely nothing to do with the 8 hour day – and Parnell (who was certainly not an employee – and had nothing to do with Trade Unions).

              For someone claiming familiarity with both employment law and the commerce act – you seem to be spouting a lot of mis-information.

              • KJT …
                29 October 2024 at 5:42 pm

                Contractors "cannot take collective action". Exactly what I said.

                Purnell and most other tradesmen in Wellington, could and did.

                Tradespeople (and other contractors) now cannot legally take collective action.

                My point.

                Said it yourself. "The part that they can't do is negotiate collectively (although, this seems to no longer be true for actors), or take collective industrial action

                • Belladonna …
                  30 October 2024 at 9:47 am

                  Yes, so why are you arguing with me?

                  Tradespeople and other contractors can (and most certainly do) benchmark their hours, pay and conditions against 'the market' (i.e. other contractors).

            • Drowsy M. Kram 2.1.1.1.1.2
              29 October 2024 at 5:22 pm

              KJT, please understand that when a reply from B begins with "This is arrant rubbish", they are endeavouring to be "a respectful centrist." Hope this helps.

              P.S. Not sure why B was so ticked off – might be something to do with your disparaging remark about ACT supporters wink

  3. Mountain Tui 3
    28 October 2024 at 3:13 pm

    This anti-worker, anti-Labour party?

    Mm ACT – the only party who is explicit about not caring if Kiwi workers die:

    [youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DN7-DNJY3Q%5D

  4. Patricia Bremner 4
    29 October 2024 at 6:52 am

    Mountain Tui, reminding us of their agenda. No worker rights.

  6. roblogic 6
    30 October 2024 at 10:49 am

    This got me thinking, if this is "Labour" day, what's "National" day?

    It would probably be ANZAC day, in which hundreds of lives were wasted in a pointless exercise of empire building by a useless upper class twat (Churchill directing operations at Gallipoli)