Ministry advised against concurrent referendum/election

Written By: - Date published: 11:15 am, June 26th, 2008 - 43 comments
Categories: child discipline, election 2008, slippery - Tags:

In line with Ministry of Justice advice, the Government has decided not to hold the child discipline referendum at the same time as the election. You can read the entire advice document here:

Holding a referendum at the same time as the general election is not recommended because 

“From 1999, we know that voters would be confused by the additional voting papers and would ask polling place staff questions about the issues and the process. Voters would take longer to mark their papers They would require help to find the right ballot box in which to place them.This would cause congestion and delays in the polling place.. [ and the count]…More polling place staff, including more inquiry officers, would be required to manage the additional workload…Combining CIR with the general election would increase the complexity of election day staff roles, the length and complexity of the training and the risks of staff training being inadequate “

Which is true. I was a Polling Clerk in 1999 and it was a nightmare.

The myth, invented by David Farrar, that holding a referendum separately from the election is more expensive is dispelled:

“To conduct referenda in conjunction with the 2008 General Election… would cost $7.3m… conducting referenda by postal vote in 2009 [would cost] $6.5m to $8.1”

Why isn’t a concurrent referendum cheaper? You don’t need polling place staff for a postal ballot but need more for one held with the election. 

Predictably, National has used this as another hit and run attack, despite the fact that Key himself said on KiwiFm yesterday “we’ve got no intention of changing the legislation unless we see good parents being criminalised for lightly smacking a child, and we don’t see any evidence of that”.

Is this really the level our politics has sunk to? Dishonest attacks over the timing of a referendum on a law that doesn’t affect most people and was never intended to affect most people? Does anyone really think this matters? How about a serious debate about wage levels? Of course, National will do anything it can to avoid a debate on serious issues like that, which is why it fills the void with this pathetic pap.

43 comments on “Ministry advised against concurrent referendum/election”

  1. coge 1

    Steve, would you like me to outline the real reason Clark is fearful
    of this referendum happening on polling day?

  2. Electoral signs are taken down in the last few days to stop swing voters choosing the first sign they see on the way to polls as the party they’ll support. In turn I think a referendum where Family Fist may be writing the question (please correct me if I’m wrong on that) could distort the democratic process.

  3. coge. knock yourself out but don’t pretend that the Chief Electoral Officer hadn’t already advised against it back in April.

  4. Matthew Pilott 4

    IT, they already wrote the question, and it’s as poor as if I forced a referendum saying “Do you think the players of a game of rugby should be made criminals by the 1969 Crimes Act” (as is the case as I understand it). So yeah.

  5. “Should a loving smack be used as part of good parental correction?” – Or something to that effect. Full of rhetoric and I’m sure a professor of semantics like George Lakoff would be able to tear it to pieces.

  6. T-rex 6

    When they send out this referendum paper, is there going to be a 3rd box you can tick which says “That is the most f*cking retarded question I’ve ever heard”?

    I mean come on. “Should a smack as part of good parental correction be a criminal offence in New Zealand?”.

    By definition, no, because you specified “Good parental correction”. It is flat out stating that there are circumstances in which a smack is good, which is contrary to the views of a whole bunch of people.

    “Should a smack as part of good parental correction be a criminal offence in New Zealand?”.

    Damn that makes me mad. It forces a subjective judgement, and it’s leading, and it’s a dirty f*cking trick to play.

    Asking questions as terribly phrased as that should be a criminal offence in New Zealand.

  7. IT. Correct. the question is “Should a smack as part of good parental correction be a criminal offence in NZ”

    Arguably, the question as written doesn’t require a restoration fo the law as it was before the amendment to s59 last year or any law change.

  8. Essentially, the question asks whether something ‘good’ should be illegal. A first principle of any justice system should be that ‘good’ things aren’t illegal.

    Whether there is such a thing as a ‘good smack’ is another question.

    And the question gives us no clue as to whether the current law does an adequate job of seperating ‘good’ smacks from ‘bad’ smacks.

  9. T-rex 9

    Matt/Tiger – Glad I’m not alone here!

    “Do you think murderers should be put in jail, even if they’re great people and it wasn’t their fault and they’re guaranteed never to ever hurt anyone again and there will be a huge social cost to imprisoning them and no good will ever come of it because they’re really good people”.

    How about the REAL question, which is

    “Do you think it should be legal to strike a child in New Zealand if can be argued to be a corrective action”.

  10. Exactly. No where in the amendment to S59 did it talk about smacking. All this law does is stop people like the “Timaru Lady” from getting away with giving their kids the bash with implements and getting away with it.

    The far right found an area which would always be protected by common sense, stripped it and exploited the public with a lie. If we are to have a referendum it should be on whether these groups should be held accountable for not telling the truth.

  11. mike 11

    It’s less about smacking and more about the Government undermining the judgement of good parents and simply reinforces the nanny-state label.
    If Helen had known how much damage this would cause Labour she would not of gone near it.

  12. Anita 12

    Your cost difference discussion is really confused.

    Firstly $6.5m greater than $5.9m – so you have reinforced the point it’s more expensive, not “dispelled the myth”.

    Secondly, I think you’ve used all the wrong figures, with might explain that 🙂

    Concurrent 2008, current legislation – conservative estimate $7.3m
    Concurrent 2008, amended legislation – conservative estimate $5.9m
    Postal 2009 – $4.8m to $6.4m
    Postal 2009, including advertising costs – $6.5m to $8.1m

    So some numbers are bigger than other numbers, and some are smaller 🙂

    It’s worth also noting

    Amended legislation – MoJ are not recommending this, they are saying it’s possible but would be “likely to be controversial”.

    Advertising costs – it’s unclear why they weren’t added to the concurrent cost, perhaps they could/should/might be.

    Ranges for postal – the higher number was the budget last time, the lower number was the actual (both then adjusted for inflation). They never explain why the difference, so it’s not clear whether we should expect the lower or the higher end.

    Given all that I think the strongest statement one can make is:

    The costs will be dependent on a variety of factors, and neither option looks reliably cheaper or more expensive.

    Perhaps followed by a somewhat facetious:

    If cost is the key driver we should change the law, not advertise the referendum and tell the electoral commission to do more with less.

  13. Liam 13

    I think that a lot of this issue has come through the general public’s poor understanding of what the law actually changes. I think that on this blog we are ‘preaching to the converted’.

    As far as the question goes it is just terrible. I really hope that the question is not placed like this when it comes time to vote.

    As someone that is doing research, formulating the question is no easy task. The question will need to be transparent and ever word needs to be clearly defined. There can be no assumptions.

    The word good is a terrible choice. Even the word smack. We all feel like we know what the words are, but defining them is a tough task.

    The worst thing about this whole bill is that Labour are the ones who are being hammered by it. Despite the greens starting it. National voting for it (and still support it because to change would mean another flip-flop and they have had enough of them). The media are clearly wanting a fresh new government with fresh new faces with fresh new stories. When in reality it is the 2005 policy with 1990’s MP’s.

    But like i said i am just ‘preaching to the converted’.

  14. Anita 14

    The question is completely consistent with the tradition of CIR questions so far.

    Starting with Norm Withers’:

    Should there be a reform of our justice system placing greater emphasis on the needs of victims, providing restitution and compensation for them and imposing minimum sentences and hard labour for all serious violent offences?

    Paraphrased to: Do you love your mum, think summer is warm, wish the All Blacks well, like fluffy bunnies, and want the elderly put through a mincer to make sausages?

    Not to mention the firefighters’ no means yes:

    Should the number of professional firefighters employed full time in the New Zealand Fire Service be reduced below the number employed on 1 January 1995?

    Do you not want the government to not consider not being mean to firefighters (not)?

  15. vto 15

    mike’s onto it at 12.10

  16. Anita, as you point out, the highside numbers for a postal referendum are inflation-adjusted numbers for the amount budgeted for the 1998 postal referendum, the low-side is inflaiton-adjusted actual cost – I went with actual cost.

    You’re right about the amended vs current legislation issue, I’ll correct.

    Basically, the cost of a postal ballot is insignificantly different from the cost of doing it with the election.

  17. Anita 17

    Steve,

    1998 was a local body election year, I did wonder if that reduced the postal ballot referendum cost as some of the electoral role work would’ve been needed for the local body vote. Next year is not a local body election year, so that wouldn’t help.

    That said, it’s pure speculation, MoJ haven’t told us 🙂

  18. vto 18

    Actually, following from mike’s 12.10 post – imo this sort of legislation is at the core of many problems with todays society in that people’s responsibility for themselves and for their family and those around them is removed to a distant unrelated party – namely central govt.

    This legislation says that sorry good parents of NZ but you are not doing the job right and we are going to do part of it for you, by telling you how to raise your kids. Responsiblity is dislocated.

    Less responsibility = more societal breakdown.

    Just like the dpb removed much of the responsibility of dads for looking after their kids.

    It is a fundamental flaw in an otherwise well intentioned approach by those that push these things.

  19. Anita 19

    Steve,

    I think you’ve corrected your post incorrectly – sorry mate 🙂

    $7.3m is under current legislation (not amended).

    I reckon we should write to MoJ and suggest they use tables in future briefings 🙂

  20. bill brown 20

    imo this sort of legislation is at the core of many problems with todays society in that people’s responsibility for themselves and for their family and those around them is removed to a distant unrelated party

    Does this also mean that you don’t believe a “distant unrelated party” should get involved if you lovingly smack your wife for not cooking your tea the way you like it?

  21. Vanilla Eis 21

    vto: where is there less responsibility? The law simply means you can’t make excuses for beating your children – in fact, it makes you more responsible for you actions. Or you think a horsewhip is an appropriate tool for discipline?

  22. Matthew Pilott 22

    mike’s onto it at 12.10

    Good. So the religious nuts can get out of it, we agree. Now the debate’s back to reality.

    What has the law done? No frivolous prosecutions. No criminalised parents. No police state. A huge increase in domestic violence reporting. A massive debate around the ethics of corporal discipline. Increased advocacy of non-violent parenting. A step in the right direction for our children.

    The stats won’t chagnge for years, I’ll be the first to admit. It is a step in the right direction.

    So I’ll question one of mike’s premises – that Labour would not have done it – you might be right, with hindsight it might not be worth it in terms of political expediency. But it was the right thing to do, unpopular or no.

    I’ll settle for ethics over political expediency any day.

  23. mike 23

    “Or you think a horsewhip is an appropriate tool for discipline?”

    That’s the the sort of comment you expect from a socialist, trying to govern to lowest denominator.
    Scaremongering to mask their craving to control everything. Pathetic

  24. vto 24

    ah yes bill and Vanilla, go ahead and assume that I am for the smack. That is not what I said.

    A strongly held opinion of mine is that increasing govt responsibility for much of our lives is a significant part of the cause of much of society’s breakdown. Responsibility for as much of our lives as is possible should rest at the coal face – be it individual, family or local community. Dislocate that and consequences follow. This legislation imo is a prime example of that dislocation.

    The ins and outs of both your points have been debated far and wide and I’m not going into it now. That was not the point I raised.

  25. bill brown 25

    go ahead and assume that I am for the smack. That is not what I said

    So what are you worried about then? You’ll never be affected by any of this.

  26. Renee van de Weert 26

    113/121 MPs voted for the Amendment which repealed the defence of reasonable force in the case of an assault on a child.
    Voting against repealing S59 were NZF, Peters, Paraone, Mark; UF Turner; ACT Hide, Roy; and Ind Copeland, Field.
    For repeal of S59 were Labour 49, National 48, Green 6, Maori 4, Prog 1, UF 1.
    The question as written on the Petition is ridiculous; it’s entirely subjective and achieves precisely nothing.

  27. Quoth the Raven 27

    vto – I’ve said it before about this hollow personal responsibility mantra of National supporters; if National acutally believed in personal responsibility they would call for an end to drug prohibition they would have voted for, instead of against prostitution reform, they would have voted against parental notification for abortions, for civil unions, etc, etc. The National party does not actually believe in personal responsibility, many of their conservative members views and their voting records show that.

  28. Matthew Pilott 28

    Renee – I think you’ll find Copeland was outside giving a press conference – or have I mixed events up?

    Agreed, I’d like to see if they’d be able to ask a useful question by changing it from its present form, but I guess that’s not what people signed for (though if you signed that petition without calling them out for a loaded and meaningless question, you’re not likely to be aware of what you were signing for in the first place).

  29. Vanilla Eis 29

    Mike, vto:

    Read my post again. The law, as written, allowed one person to successfully defend themselves for beating a child with a horsewhip. Removing this defense was, in my opinion, a credible reaction to such a ruling.

    I’m not accusing you of anything. I’m querying whether you think that it is appropriate to have such a defense available in the law.

    As has been stated, no one has been charged for simply smacking a child. When National agreed to vote in favour the bill, it was widely accepted that the police would use discretion whenever applying the law. What the bill did was remove the defense of ‘discipline’ to hitting a child.

    So, without attacking me for being a dirty socialist who just wants to interfere with the lives of good parents: Do you think that it was appropriate to have a legal defense for beating a child with a horsewhip?

    edit:

    MP: Copeland was outside at the time of the vote, but they allowed him to retrospectively have his vote against the bill added to the record. If it had been the difference between the bill passing or failing, I imagine they wouldn’t have.

  30. vto 30

    Quoth you have a point. It is a matter of degree of course. My opinion is that this govt goes too far. nats as you say arent a lot different. But that doesn’t detract from my point. The growth of central govt is an internationally slowly expanding bubble that I think has a way to go yet before it starts to leak and reduce its reach.

    Vanilla, I agree the law needed changing. To this? I am not convinced it was the best solution.

  31. Vanilla Eis 31

    Why, when it simply removed any possible defense? The problem really arises in the execution of the law – and the fear is that we will see a spate of frivolous assault charges laid against parents. I can understand that, but that doesn’t mean that there should be a legislated line of ‘allowed disciplinary measures’ in the sand that parents can’t cross. Isn’t that just interfering even more?

    My biggest problem right now is that I don’t think the question in the referendum accurately reflects the nature of the bill, and I fear that we will end up with the same backwards law we just managed to get rid of.

  32. Matthew Pilott 32

    The growth of central govt is an internationally slowly expanding bubble that I think has a way to go yet before it starts to leak and reduce its reach.

    Allow me to say the same of capitalism and unfettered power of corporations. I know which I prefer.

  33. Scribe 33

    illuminatedtiger,

    I think a referendum where Family Fist may be writing the question (please correct me if I’m wrong on that) could distort the democratic process.

    First off, it’s Family First, not Family Fist. (Do you complain about people calling Labour “Liarbore”? I think they’re equally childish and unfunny.)

    And I will take you up on the offer to correct you, because FF had nothing to do with the drafting of the question. They did encourage people to support the CIR, though, which (please correct me if I’m wrong on this) is their right.

  34. dave 34

    Steve has got a good handle on this, and for a change, is remarkably balanced as well.

    Essentially, the question asks whether something ‘good’ should be illegal. A first principle of any justice system should be that ‘good’ things aren’t illegal.

    Whether there is such a thing as a ‘good smack’ is another question.

    And the question gives us no clue as to whether the current law does an adequate job of seperating ‘good’ smacks from ‘bad’ smacks.
    Neither did the old law. but if a first principle of any justice system should be that ‘good’ things aren’t illegal, those “good things”, should most consider them to be good, are defined as good in the eyes of the public and should not be illegal, not just unprosecutable. Because we have police discretion, the lighter end of the scale of smacking has been unprosecutable for political rather than legal reasons.

    But a third principle is that upholding a law should not be based on police discretion – it should be based on clear law. The law isnt clear. It’s not good law.

    And the final principle is that if something is good, and most people, including the politicians and police, think it is good, it shouldn’t be illegal/unlawful and people shouldn’t be dobbed into the police for breaking that law. But as leaders have made it illegal, citizens should have a democratic right to confront it, and that’s what the referendum is trying to do.

  35. had enough 35

    So this government is confused. In the advice document about the CIR it says,

    “26. Finally, holding the CIR with the general election will compound the already difficult questions which are arising around the relationship between the different election finance rules set out in the Citizens Initiated Referenda Act 1993 and the Electoral Finance Act 2007.”

    So the Government has admitted that their own EFA is confusing them and is using this as an excuse about not having the referenda at the election.

    It will not cause voter confusion it will only cause government confusion and headaches.

  36. Draco TB 36

    But a third principle is that upholding a law should not be based on police discretion – it should be based on clear law. The law isnt clear. It’s not good law.

    The law can’t be that black and white because then you end up with too many loopholes and the law not working at all. It was this ‘black and white’, ‘letter of the law’ type thinking that allowed large anonymous donations to the National party in 2005 even though they were illegal. The answer to this method of getting around the law is to make the law as general as possible so that everything is caught up in it and then legislate for the few exceptions that are expected.

    The legislation that repealed s59 is excellent law because it’s flexible enough to be enforceable. An example of bad law is the 1993 electoral act that was so rigid as to be worked around effectively nullifying the intent of the law. It may as well not have been there.

  37. KK 37

    Had enough? “So the Government has admitted that their own EFA is confusing them and is using this as an excuse about not having the referenda at the election.”

    As pointed out over and over on the Standard, the EFA will inevitably run into problems. It’s not a simple act. I don’t how anyone can try to make this EFA/S59 connection … clearly just like your mates on the right in Parliament just make stuff up like any good reactionary.

    Your mates BE and TR yesterday, in criticizing the Settlement yesterday pretty much said exactly the same thing. One second it was settlement critique, then watssup! watssup! watssup! (sorry spelling haven’t seen the badge) (that was their best argument), then moved into govt waste and arrogance (too predictable) and concluded with their reactionary, hit and run, referendum attack.

    Simplistic, unrelated …

    “It will not cause voter confusion it will only cause government confusion and headaches.”

    Not even worth arguing with, especially the former – I think that SP made this pretty clear

  38. Lew 38

    Just ignoring the very good reasons not to hold a referendum on election day (and there are very good reasons in political theory, as well as those given by MoJ), only one factor needs to be taken into account: electoral advantage.

    The government is free, like it or not, to hold the referendum at any time within the next 12 months. The calculation it has to make is whether the number of people who would typically not vote but would vote against Labour if given a strong reason to go to the polls (ie, the referendum) are greater in number than those who would be so incensed by the government’s refusal to hold the referendum and the election together that they would vote against Labour on that basis alone.

    I’m sure the government is taking other factors such as logistics into account, but ultimately nobody would have any recourse against them if they held it on the 364th day after the petition was presented, except recourse to the ballot box. Since National-aligned moral minority lobbies like Family First, the Sensible Sentencing Trust and parties like the Kiwi Party and the Family Party are all counting on the referendum to call out their mostly apathetic, politically unaware constituencies, Labour would have to be facing a fairly bloody big backlash against delaying the referendum for them to even consider holding it on election day.

    It’s DPF’s and the aforementioned moral minorities’ and others’ jobs to create this backlash and they are presently setting about doing so. But when an electorate isn’t worried that the main opposition party has declined to release any meaningful policy, that’s hoping for quite a lot.

    National is playing smart politics by holding off on policy; Labour will be playing smart politics if it delays the referendum. You and I and some others might see either or both courses of action as undemocratic, cynical or just plain wrong – but ultimately the final arbiter on these questions is the electorate.

    L

    Captcha: `preaching yes’. This thing is scary smart.

  39. KK 39

    Well, depends how well informed they are

    “Should a smack as part of good parental correction be a criminal offence in NZ’

    A subjective question like that certainly does not help.

    I don’t think that you really can compare labour’s decision not to hold a referendum with national’s policy strategy.

  40. Lew 40

    KK: “A subjective question like that certainly does not help.”

    What doesn’t it help? Accurately gauge the views of the electorate on the matter of child discipline? That’s not the purpose of a Citizen-Initiated Referendum, as Anita has explained.

    “I don’t think that you really can compare labour’s decision not to hold a referendum with national’s policy strategy.”

    I could and I did. I’m open to persuasion as to why my comparison is invalid.

    L

  41. Anita 41

    Lew,

    I think that it should be the purpose of a CIR, we just don’t seem to be very good at them 🙂

    I reckon MoJ (or whoever’s job it is to approve CIR questions) should have a broader remit to reject bad phrasing and suggest better phrasing.

    Should the law be changed to explicitly allow parents to use physical force to discipline their children?

    We’d probably all vote the same way, but at least we’d know what we were voting for/against.

    [Pedant request – if the plural of referendum is referenda, what is the plural of CIR? I had to mangle one of my sentences to avoid CIRs :]

  42. Lew 42

    Anita: “I think that it should be the purpose of a CIR, we just don’t seem to be very good at them”

    An important distinction, yes, but doomed in my somewhat jaded eyes. This is of course why CIRa (see what I did there?) shouldn’t be binding.

    L

  43. Anita 43

    Lew,

    Indeed! Although I kinda love the idea of a binding referendum about loving smacks – just imagine someone trying to draft legislation including a definition of love 🙂

    CIRa – awesome! (but probably wrong 🙁 )

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    3 days ago
  • National is now the party of climate arson
    So, Judith Collins has done a Facebook rant about climate change, peddling the same shit National has been shovelling for the past twenty years: the impacts are overstated, there's no need to do anything about it, and its too hard anyway (oh, and its so unfair that people who peddle ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    3 days ago
  • The environmental footprint of electric versus fossil car
    Climate Explained is a collaboration between The Conversation, Stuff and the New Zealand Science Media Centre to answer your questions about climate change. If you have a question you’d like an expert to answer, please send it to climate.change@stuff.co.nz There is a lot of discussion on the benefits of ...
    SciBlogsBy Guest Author
    3 days ago
  • “Manifest” by Andrew Bird – A Song For The Times.
    I came across this song quite by accident. If it isn't one of Greta Thunberg's favourites - it should be.Video courtesy of YouTube.This post is exclusive to Bowalley Road. ...
    3 days ago
  • Passing the buck
    Last month, NZDF's shoddy coverup of what it knew about civilian casualties in Operation Burnham began to fall apart, with the revelation that a report on the matter, which NZDF claimed not to have, had been sitting in an NZDF safe for the past nine years. Yesterday, the man responsible ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    3 days ago
  • India a major player in Earth observation satellites
    While many imagine that countries like the USA and Europe dominate space activities, in fact India is now a major player on this stage. It launches satellites for its own purposes and also commercially, and has constellations orbiting our planet and returning data of vital importance to that nation in ...
    SciBlogsBy Duncan Steel
    3 days ago
  • The rot at the top (2).
    Thanks to a report from the Acting Inspector General of Intelligence and Security following a complaint by Nicky Hager, we have come to find out that the SIS illegally spied on Mr. Hager on behalf of the NZDF after publication of Hager’s 2011 book, Other People’s Wars. The NZDF justified ...
    KiwipoliticoBy Pablo
    3 days ago
  • Common misconceptions about “Global Warming”
    COMMON MISCONCEPTIONS ABOUT GLOBAL WARMING MYTH 1: Global temperatures are rising at a rapid, unprecedented rate. FACT: The HadCRUT3 surface temperature index, produced by the Hadley Centre of the UK Met Office and the Climate Research Unit of the University of East Anglia, shows warming to 1878, cooling to 1911, ...
    An average kiwiBy admin@averagekiwi.com
    4 days ago
  • A climate of tyranny
    For the past week, Extinction Rebellion has been peacefully protesting in London to demand action on climate change. The British government's response? Ban their protests:Police have banned Extinction Rebellion protests from continuing anywhere in London, as they moved in almost without warning to clear protesters who remained at the movement’s ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    4 days ago
  • Collins crushes climate
    An essay by Judith Collins MP reported on Carbon News yesterday seems to show an alarming shift in attitude within the National Party. Collins argues against the Zero Carbon Bill, the Paris Agreement, and downplays the magnitude of climate impacts. The Paris Agreement was adopted in December 2015 and ratified ...
    SciBlogsBy Robert McLachlan
    4 days ago
  • More disappointment
    When they were running for election, Labour promised to overhaul the Employment Relations Act and introduce fair pay agreements to set basic pay and conditions on an industry level, preventing bad employers from undercutting good ones. They followed this up by establishing a working group, which reported back in January ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    4 days ago
  • What do these mother-child studies really say about fluoridation?
    A list of indicators of bad science – many of these are found in articles promoted by anti-fluoride activists. Anti-fluoride activists have been pouring money into a scaremongering campaign warning pregnant women not to drink fluoridated water. They claim fluoride will lower the IQ of their future child. Fluoride ...
    4 days ago
  • Losing Labour’s Mills-Tone.
    Nothing Left To Say: Labour's pollster, Stephen Mills, remains swaddled-up in the comforting myths of the 1980s. As if the experience of Roger Douglas’s genuinely radical post-Muldoon policy agenda was literally a once-in-a-lifetime thing – as much as the party could possibly absorb for at least the next 50 years.MEMO ...
    4 days ago
  • Speaker: Disability and the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Historical Abuse
    The Royal Commission on abuse in care is very significant for the disability community. For many decades last century, thousands of disabled children, and adults who managed to survive, were locked away from families and communities. This was not for anything they had done, but for the perceived threat their ...
    4 days ago
  • Spain is not a democracy
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    4 days ago
  • UK Conservatives hate democracy
    With an unfair voting system, uneven electorates and an un-elected upper house, the UK's "democracy" is barely worthy of the name. But now the government wants to make it worse:The government has been accused of suppressing voters’ rights with the potential disenfranchisement of tens of thousands of people after plans ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    5 days ago
  • What is wrong with our building industry?
    Back in the 90's and early 2000's, the building industry was building leaky homes which should never have been granted consent. Now it turns out they've been building dodgy office blocks as well:New imaging technology has revealed hundreds of major buildings nationwide have defective or missing concrete or reinforcing steel. ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    5 days ago
  • Local bodies
    Local body election results were released over the weekend, to joy or despair depending on where you live. In Auckland, Phil Goff trounced John Tamihere, who is muttering darkly about running for Parliament again (but which party would want him?) Wellington is now a wholly-owned subsidiary of Weta Workshop, except ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    5 days ago
  • A future of government
      How could government evolve over the next decades? Reports of democracy’s imminent demise are greatly exaggerated.  However, satisfaction with political systems in many countries is low, so there is much to do for governments of all political stripes to improve relevance and trust. Digital technologies are seen as one ...
    SciBlogsBy Robert Hickson
    7 days ago
  • Speaker: Catalonia, interrupted
    Two years have now gone by since the Friday afternoon when my university-student son and I headed out of our Barcelona flat to a nearby primary school, designated as a polling station for the vote that was to be held the following Sunday: the referendum on Catalonia’s independence from Spain ...
    7 days ago
  • Sage Decisions Unwisely Over-Ruled.
    Overruled: The joint decision of Finance Minister, Grant Robertson (Labour) and his Associate Minister, David Parker (Labour) arguably the two most powerful ministers in Jacinda Ardern’s government, to grant OceanaGold the consents which Land Information Minister, Eugenie Sage (Greens) had earlier denied them, offers bitter proof of how hard fighting ...
    7 days ago
  • Government may ban voting in effort to get more people to do it
    More than double the number of people who will vote in this year’s local body elections have tried marijuana or urinated somewhere they shouldn’t have. As local elections look set for the lowest turnout in decades, with many regions falling well short of 40%, the Government is exploring a number ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • Woman: Deleted.
    A Statement on Abortion Law Reform by the Council of Disobedient Women   On the eve of bringing an end to antiquated, anti-women abortion laws Green MP Jan Logie intends to write women out of the Bill. With a stroke of the pen, the woke are aiming for total erasure ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • The Hollowest of Men Ride Again… SURPRISE!
    Musings continue apace about “the experienced businessman!” soon to be taking up a National Party MP position. Or to be more accurate, being parachuted into a seat to shut down their former MP Jamie-Lee Ross, who despite his own shortcomings shed at least some more light on the inner workings ...
    exhALANtBy exhalantblog
    1 week ago
  • Barbaric
    The Ugandan government wants to murder gay people:Uganda has announced plans to impose the death penalty on homosexuals. The bill, colloquially known as “Kill the Gays” in Uganda, was nullified five years ago on a technicality, but the government said on Thursday it plans to resurrect it within weeks. The ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Fighting Monsters.
    Freedom Of Speech? The Säuberung (cleansing by fire) was the work of the German Student Union which, on 10 May 1933, under the watchful eye of the Nazi Reichminister for Propaganda, Joseph Goebbels, consigned 25,000 books to the flames in a ritual exorcism of “un-German thought”. According to the logic of the ...
    1 week ago
  • The next wave of kaupapa Māori politics: its constitutional, it must be.
      “There can be no such thing as kaupapa Māori political parties or politics in Aotearoa” (Willie Jackson, Labour Party (2017). Māori TV, General/List Election Special) I begin with that claim because at the time, I was confounded at first that it fell out of Willie Jackson’s mouth, and then ...
    EllipsisterBy Ellipsister
    1 week ago
  • Night lights of NZ from orbit
    New Zealand has prided itself for decades with regard to its lack of pollution, and all will be aware that the ‘100% Pure New Zealand‘ meme is under threat through land, water and air pollution of various causes. There is another type of contamination that the country also faces: light ...
    SciBlogsBy Duncan Steel
    1 week ago
  • Reporters deliver uplifting news to fleeing Japanese residents: they won’t miss any rugby
    New Zealand’s media is doing its part in Japan, reassuring those in the path of the storm that they won’t miss any rugby while away from their flooded homes. New Zealand sports reporters stationed in Japan for the Rugby World Cup have had the rare and heartwarming opportunity to inform ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • Government in contentious discussions about whether to put surplus on red or black
    Regional Development Minister Shane Jones is the only Cabinet member in favour of putting it all on green. As Finance Minister Grant Robertson finds himself with an enormous $7.5 billion surplus, the Government has begun intense, at times contentious conversations about whether to put the money on red or black at ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • Jordanian teachers’ successful strike has lessons for here
    by Susanne Kemp At the start of September close to 100,000 school teachers went on strike in Jordan.  They demanded a 50% pay rise.  A pay rise actually agreed to by the regime back in 2014. In early October, however, in the face of government repression and threats, the teachers’ ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    1 week ago
  • Why some people still think climate change isn’t real
    Climate Explained is a collaboration between The Conversation, Stuff and the New Zealand Science Media Centre to answer your questions about climate change. If you have a question you’d like an expert to answer, please send it to climate.change@stuff.co.nz Why do people still think climate change isn’t real? David ...
    SciBlogsBy Guest Author
    1 week ago
  • The SIS unlawfully spied on Nicky Hager
    Back in 2011, journalist Nicky Hager published Other People's Wars, an expose on NZDF's activities over the previous decade of the "war on terror". NZDF didn't like this, and especially didn't like the fact that it was base don leaks from their own. So, they had the SIS investigate him ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • October 2019 – Newsletter
    https://mailchi.mp/7d9133add053/closing-the-gap-october-2019-newsletter ...
    Closing the GapBy Tracey Sharp
    1 week ago
  • And they wonder why we think they’re environmental vandals…
    The Zero Carbon Bill is due back from select committee in two weeks, and will likely pass its final stages in November. So naturally, farmers are planning a hate-march against it. But they're not just demanding lower methane targets so they can keep on destroying the planet; they're also demanding ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Climate Change: Paying the price in California
    Last year, California burned. This year, to stop it happening again (or rather, to stop themselves from being found liable if it happens again), Pacific Gas and Electric is cutting power to half the state for a week:Schools are closed. Traffic lights down. Tunnels dark. Businesses unopened. Hospitals running on ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Let’s Hear It For Up-Close-And-Personal, Hard-Copy Democracy!
    The Best Way: Missing from the on-line voting debate is any reference to the voting system that produces turn-out figures ranging from 77 to 93 percent of registered voters. The voting system used to collect and count the votes cast in our parliamentary elections. The system that involves citizens making ...
    1 week ago
  • 10/10: World Day Against the Death Penalty
    Today, October 10, is the world day against the death penalty. Out of 195 UN member states, 84 still permit capital punishment. Today is the day we work to change that. This year's theme is children. Having a parent sentenced to death or executed causes long-term trauma and stigmatization which ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Talking Freer Lives: a Marxist gender-critical perspective from Australia
    Among the great new bunch of political friends we have been making recently is the excellent Australian-based Marxist gender-critical site, Freer Lives.  So we asked the comrade who set up that blog to write something for Redline on the blog, himself, his analysis of the rise of gender politics and ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    1 week ago
  • Government spin accepted by union leadership
    by Don Franks  The Auckland City Mission is struggling with a 40 percent increase in demand for food parcels this year. A total of 23,020 were needed by June. Last month Missioner Chris Farrelly told the Herald the “cupboards are bare” and without an emergency food drive, he can’t see ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • Forbidden Thoughts
    by The Council of Disobedient Women   Massey Wellington Student Association had a sit-in today. Imagine a sit-in. On a campus. Against a women’s rights meeting. Did the ’60s really happen or did we fucking dream it? They gathered in the student square, an echo chamber. Sitting on soft pillows ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • Much love to my loyal Ukrainian readership
    For some reasons, my post about the mystery message from inside the Downing Street bunker seemed to catch people's attention.  Quite a lot of hits from NZ (unsurprisingly) and the USA (a bit more puzzlingly, but hi there, USAians!!) and 76 views from the Ukraine.I've celebrated my Ukrainian readers in ...
    1 week ago
  • Another day of bonkers GNUmours (again, sorry)
    First, almost a score of Labour MPs seem to have sent a letter to the EU basically begging them to accept a deal - any deal - just so Britain can get the Heck on with Brexiting instead of being trapped in limbo:
    To avoid no deal, deliver on the ...
    1 week ago
  • Labour vs working class immigrants – again!
    by Phil Duncan In 2016 the National-led government suspended the Parent Visa Category, through which migrants were able to bring their parents into New Zealand.  Since then over 5,700 people have been in immigration limbo, stuck on the visa wait list. Labour is now bringing back the scheme.  Well, sort ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    1 week ago
  • Speak Up for Women press statement: on Massey University and Feminism 2020
    The following was released yesterday (Tues, October 8) by the women’s liberation organisation Speak Up for Women. On 23 September Speak Up For Women announced that we would be holding an event at the Massey University Theaterette in Wellington. The event is called Feminism 2020. The intention of the event ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    1 week ago
  • Farmers support dirty rivers
    The government is currently consulting on plans to improve freshwater quality. So naturally, farmers oppose it:South Taranaki farmers are preparing to fight proposed national freshwater changes that some fear will bankrupt them. The Government's proposed National Environment Standard on Freshwater Management, released in September, rated the Waingongoro River as one ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • No-one cares about local government
    Yesterday was the last day for (reliably) posting your vote away in local body elections. Turnouts are mostly much lower than the equivalent time last year (Palmerston North is down 2.3%), and so naturally people are pushing their online-voting snake oil again. Because the online census worked so well, lets ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • The political ghosts of eugenics may matter more than the genetic
    This essay, on the political legacy of the eugenics movement, by Kenan Malik was originally published in the Observer on 6 October 2019, under the headline ‘The spirit of eugenics is still with us, as immigrants know to their cost’. Birth control. Intelligence tests. Town planning. Immigration controls. It’s striking how ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • “Surplus” again
    Another year, and the government has announced another enormous government "surplus". And just like last year, its nothing of the sort. When we have people homeless and sick and hungry, when we have schools and hospitals still falling down, when we have underpaid public servants and infrastucture unmaintained or unbuilt, ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Inside the Downing Street bunker
    James Forsyth at The Spectator (I know, I know) has tapped one of his contacts inside Number Ten for an insight into the Johnson administration's thinking and strategy.It is fascinating, unsettling and quite, quite mad.  Some key points:Negotiations have stalled and the Johnson administration are keen to blame the EU: ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Taking Control Of The Nation’s Story.
    Fatal Contact: With the arrival of captain James Cook in October 1769, the islands of what would become New Zealand ceased to be the preserve of Polynesian navigators and settlers and became a part of both the world’s map and the world’s history.THE MAORI NATIONALIST assault upon the historical meaning ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Are GNUs extinct?
    Another round of tactical talks about forming a Government of National Unity have come to nothing with the Liberal Democrats still refusing countenance putting Jeremy Corbyn into Downing Street:Opposition talks on Monday made little headway over when to try and vote down Boris Johnson's government and who might succeed him as ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Labour chickens out again
    When the government was elected, it promised to lead the way on electric vehicles, and specifically to make the government vehicle fleet emissions-free where-practicable by 2025.They lied:There are 15,473 vehicles in the government fleet and only 78 are electric. When the coalition Government came into power in late 2017, the ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Transgender extremism, violence at work against feminist meeting at British Labour Party conference
    by Nick Rogers The debate around the meaning of sex and gender made an appearance at this year’s British Labour Party conference in Brighton. Women’s Place UK – an organisation that questions the demand that biological males who self-identify as woman should have access to women’s spaces, to all-women shortlists, ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    2 weeks ago
  • Rebelling in Wellington
    Yesterday I went down to Wellington to participate in the Extinction Rebellion protest. Its part of the latest global wave of XR actions, with actions happening all over the world. Some of those protests are massively disruptive: in Canada, XR is blocking major bridges, stopping people from getting to work. ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • ‘The Workshop’ – Report: Talking about Poverty and Welfare Reform: A Guide to Strategies that ...
    The Workshop is a charitable trust for public good. The Workshop undertake research to find ways of communicating that will build support for the solutions that work to solve complex social and environmental problems. See their Report on Talking about Poverty and Welfare Reform below. ...
    Closing the GapBy Tracey Sharp
    2 weeks ago
  • Exclusive language
    What is language? We generally assume that it a facility unique to humans, allowing us to share what’s in and on our minds. We can tell of our plans, our past exploits, our knowledge. It also allows us to lie. And yet there are vast numbers of people we can’t ...
    SciBlogsBy Michael Corballis
    2 weeks ago
  • April 2018 – Submission to the NZ Govt Tax Working Group
    You can read our submission HERE ...
    Closing the GapBy Tracey Sharp
    2 weeks ago

  • Methane reducing cattle feed one step closer
    The Government today announced its support for a project that could substantially reduce agricultural greenhouse gas emissions from cattle. The announcement was made as part of Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern’s and Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor’s visit to Nelson’s Cawthron Aquaculture Park. The Cawthron Institute will receive $100,000 from the Government’s ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    13 hours ago
  • Bill to refresh superannuation system passes first reading
    Social Development Minister Carmel Sepuloni has welcomed the first reading of the New Zealand Superannuation and Veteran’s Pension Legislation Amendment Bill. “Every New Zealander has a stake in New Zealand Superannuation and Veteran’s Pension,” says Carmel Sepuloni. “They are our most common form of social assistance – nearly 800,000 New ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    16 hours ago
  • Government announces next steps in fight against measles
    Babies in Auckland aged six months and over can receive a free vaccination and children will all have access to vaccines, Associate Minister of Health Julie Anne Genter announced today at Papatoetoe High School.   The move comes as part of Government efforts to step up the fight against measles. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    16 hours ago
  • Speech to the New Zealand Institute of International Affairs, Pacific Futures: Connections, Identity...
    ***Check against delivery*** Good morning. It is a pleasure to be here, and to have the honour of opening this important conference on behalf of the New Zealand Institute of International Affairs. Let us take the opportunity to acknowledge all the people who have helped make today possible, including our special ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    17 hours ago
  • Police trial new response to high risk events
    Police Minister Stuart Nash says the safety of frontline officers and members of the public will be the focus of a new trial of specialist Police response teams in three of our largest urban centres. Police have this morning released details of an initiative to be trialled in Counties Manukau, ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    18 hours ago
  • New awards celebrate fisheries sustainability
    The Minister of Fisheries is calling for entries for a new public award to celebrate innovation in our seafood sector. “I have established the Seafood Sustainability Awards to recognise and celebrate those throughout industry, tangata whenua and communities who demonstrate outstanding dedication and innovation towards the sustainability of New Zealand’s ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    19 hours ago
  • More progress for women and we can do more
    Minister for Women Julie Anne Genter welcomes leaders in the private sector taking action on closing their gender pay gaps to ensure a fairer workplace for all New Zealanders. Ms Genter today launched a new report, Addressing the gender pay gap and driving women’s representation in senior leadership, from the Champions for ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    23 hours ago
  • Proposals to curb environmental damage help our coasts and the oceans
    Government Ministers today welcomed the release of a marine environment report highlighting the four key issues affecting our oceans, estuaries and coastlines.  The release underlines the importance of government proposals to combat climate pollution, ensure clean freshwater, protect biodiversity, make land use more sustainable, and reduce waste and plastic.    Environment ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • New mental health facility for Waikato
    The Government has approved funding for a new acute mental health facility for Waikato which will provide better care and support to people with mental health and addiction issues. Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern and Health Minister Dr David Clark announced the $100 million project to replace the aging Henry Rongomau ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • 500 new te reo Māori champions in our classrooms
    The Government is making progress on its goal to integrate te reo Māori into education by 2025, with over 500 teachers and support staff already graduating from Te Ahu o te Reo Māori,  Associate Education Minister Kelvin Davis announced today. Kelvin Davis made the announcement at an awards ceremony in Waikanae today, for ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Minister James Shaw welcomes 2018 Census first release
    Statistics Minister James Shaw has welcomed the first release of 2018 Census data. The first release of data today, 23 September, includes key data on population, regional growth, the number of homes and the size of different ethnic groups in New Zealand. Data from the 2018 Census will support the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Driving transparency, ethics and accountability in government use of algorithms
    Minister for Statistics James Shaw today announced a public consultation on a proposed algorithm charter for government agencies. The charter has been developed by the Government Chief Data Steward in response to growing calls for more transparency in government use of data. Computer algorithms – procedures or formulas for solving ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • New Zealand and the Netherlands working together on climate change
    Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor, Climate Change Minister James Shaw and visiting Dutch Prime Minister Mark Rutte co-hosted a business roundtable in Auckland this morning focused on working together to address climate change.  “The Netherlands is an important partner for New Zealand. We share a strong agricultural history. Sustainable agribusiness and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Protecting fairness for workers and businesses
    The Government is taking action to build an inclusive economy where more of us receive our fair share at work and businesses can compete on great products and services, not undercutting wages and conditions, Immigration and Workplace Relations and Safety Minister Iain Lees-Galloway says. Two consultations launched today seek feedback ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Indigenous Freshwater Fish Bill Passes
    The future for New Zealand’s threatened indigenous freshwater fish looks brighter with the passing of the Conservation (Indigenous Freshwater Fish) Amendment Bill in Parliament today said Minister of Conservation, Eugenie Sage. “Until now, our freshwater fish legislation has been 20 years out of date. We have lacked effective tools to ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Kiwis to take part in world’s biggest earthquake drill
    At 1.30pm tomorrow, hundreds of thousands of Kiwis will join about 65 million people around the globe in ShakeOut, the world’s biggest earthquake drill. The annual drill is to remind people of the right action to take during an earthquake which is to Drop, Cover, Hold, and to practise their ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Rising wages and low inflation supporting Kiwis
    Kiwis are benefiting from higher wage growth and low inflation under the Coalition Government. Stats NZ data out today shows the rise in the cost of living remains low, as annual Consumers Price Index (CPI) inflation fell to 1.5% in September from 1.7% in June. “The low inflation comes as ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • NZ economy strong amid global headwinds
    New Zealand’s economic strength and resilience has been recognised in a major update on the state of the global economy. The IMF’s latest World Economic Outlook released overnight shows a reduced global growth forecast over the next two years as issues like the US-China trade war and Brexit take hold. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Keeping New Zealanders safer with better counter-terrorism laws
    Justice Minister Andrew Little has today introduced a new Bill to prevent terrorism and support the de-radicalisation of New Zealanders returning from overseas. The Terrorism Suppression (Control Orders) Bill gives the New Zealand Police the ability to apply to the High Court to impose control orders on New Zealanders who ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Improved succession and dispute resolution core of Ture Whenua changes
    A Bill that proposes targeted changes to simplify the processes for Māori land owners when engaging with the Māori Land Court has had its First Reading today. “The approach taken by the Government is to ensure that the protection of Māori land remains a priority as we seek to improve ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Speech to CTU Biennial Conference
    Let me first thank all the new unionists and members in the room. There is nothing more important to improving people’s working lives than people making the decision to care, to get on board and help, to take up the reins and get involved. Congratulations to you. You bring the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Minister ensures continued Whenuapai flight operations
    Minister of Defence Ron Mark has signed a certificate exempting the activity of engine testing at Whenuapai Airbase from the Resource Management Act 1991. The Act gives the Minister of Defence the power to exempt activities for the purposes of national security.  The certificate will mean the recent Environment Court ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • NZ joins Coalition of Finance Ministers for Climate Action
    Finance Minister Grant Robertson has announced New Zealand will join the Coalition of Finance Ministers for Climate Action while attending APEC meetings in Chile. The objective of the 39 member Coalition is to share information and promote action to tackle climate change. It was formed in April this year, in ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Feedback Sought – Section 71 – Lyttelton Parking
    Feedback sought– Lyttelton commercial zone parking  The Associate Minister for Greater Christchurch Regeneration, Poto Williams, is seeking feedback on a proposal to remove on-site car parking requirements for new developments in the Lyttelton commercial zone.  The proposal, by Christchurch City Council, asks that powers under section 71 of the Greater ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Feedback Sought – Section 71 – Hagley Oval
    Hon Minister Poto Williams Associate Minister for Greater Christchurch Regeneration   MEDIA STATEMENT       Tuesday 15 October 2019 Feedback sought – Hagley Oval The Associate Minister for Greater Christchurch Regeneration, Poto Williams, is seeking feedback on a proposal about Hagley Oval. The proposal was developed by Regenerate Christchurch ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • CTU speech – DPM
    Ladies and gentlemen, NZCTU President Richard Wagstaff, members of respective unions – thank you for the invitation to speak to you today. This might be preaching to the choir, but the importance of trade unions in New Zealand’s historical arch is difficult to understate. And it is my belief that ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Police Association Annual Conference
    "Let’s start by acknowledging that it has been a huge year. " Police Association Annual Conference James Cook Grand Chancellor Hotel Wellington Nau mai, haere mai. Tēnā koutou, tēnā koutou, ka nui te mihi, ki a koutou katoa. President of the Police Association, Chris Cahill; Members of the Association and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
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  • New Zealand announces a further P-3 deployment in support of UN sanctions
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