Newshub’s incredibly bad gang take

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1. Anne 1

   6 September 2022 at 9:24 am

   One of the replies on the twitter link:

   Some women feel more Dominant than other women…and find it necessary to impose that dominance on the other woman..a feeling of superiority… But ends up exposing their own inferiority…

   Sadly there are quite a few Kiwi women who practice this technique. In this case, Meliissa Chan Green only made an ass of herself. Some women also take it way beyond just sneers and jibes. We don't get to hear the answer to the Dad's day gift to Clarke Gayford. I hope Jacinda kept her mouth firmly shut. She is head and shoulders above all of them and they know it. It's called jealousy.
2. Sanctuary 2

   6 September 2022 at 9:38 am

   The fantasy bubble of journalism as an exercise in manufactured political dadaism on full display. The MSM is in a dire state.
   • rod 2.1

     6 September 2022 at 4:31 pm

     Newshub is the voice for the National Party, it will never change. imho.
3. Shanreagh 3

   6 September 2022 at 9:55 am

   Newshub has gone completely off the boil these days, assuming it was ever on the stove!

   I look at it daily as I do Stuff but NH takes are seriously weird sometimes and their stories are often repeated ad nauseum down the home page
4. Patricia Bremner 4

   6 September 2022 at 10:14 am

   This is typical of how some journalists are behaving. In their tiny minds NZ has already voted this Government out. The dismissive nasty rhetoric is rife. Media watch tries to show bad examples, but they need teeth and fines imo.

   Polls actually show a steady state or show a small shift back to the left spoiled by the navel gazing of some on the left, and so Dirty Politics is going gang busters. Pun intended!!

   The cabal of nasties in National has not gone. We are getting opinions from Chris Bishop et al again. The fact that the Pandemic has stretched and made tired Ministers who have worked at entrenched problems while being vilified by a portion of the press dangerous elements of the public and lazy or plain nasty press is lamentable.

   I remember right wing politicians discussing with business people whether sprinklers in shop doorways would prevent the homeless sleeping there during the last Government. Paula Bennett put some in motels because the social home building had failed badly.

   So this Government has found implementation difficult and slowed by the stripped back Government Departments left to them by National. It is hard to build the vehicle while using it!! The constant pressure of decisions under new unusual situations has given room for critics to poke holes in plans and efforts.

   Some very difficult situations are being politicised to gain power at all costs. Rotorua is one imo. Wrap around care for difficult people is hard, and sadly we have poor accommodation and poor staff in some cases, which needs attention, like all the social ills which have ever only been solved by proper housing.

   When 2000 homes are needed and 200 are provided it gets difficult in Rotorua. When 1500 building consents are given over years, and a full on fight about using small sections of some reserves to provide social housing brings out the nimbies.

   We all are involved, the armchair critics who do more damage than good unless we are informed considered and fair, the journalist who behave like influencers or opinioneers, the politicians desperate to win…. the truth and perceptions get bent way out of shape.

   Perhaps Chan Green was extra nasty about Clarke to Jacinda as 30 000 had gone on face book to wish the Dad and family well, while many of the 700 odd on Chris Luxon’s page were querying the veracity of his statements in view of past tax behaviour.
   • Tony Veitch (not etc.) 4.1

     6 September 2022 at 11:56 am

     
   • alwyn 4.2

     6 September 2022 at 2:16 pm

     " the stripped back Government Departments left to them by National".

     "The public sector employed around 436,700 people in 2021, 18.9% of New Zealand’s total workforce (2,313,400), as measured by Stats NZ’s Business Demography data. The majority (88%) work central government* (384,400) and 12% in local government (52,200).

     Over the last five years, the overall public sector workforce increased by 13.7% (with central government up 13.9% and local government up 12.4%). This compares with an 8.9% growth in the private sector over the same period."

     This was an increase of about 100,000 from 2017.

     "The New Zealand public sector employed around 348,000 people (known as public servants) as at 30 June 2017, about 13.8% of the country’s total workforce."

     If an extra 100,000 people and a rise from 13.8% to 18.9% of the workforce being in the public sector is still not enough to satisfactorily meet any of the Government policy promises just how many people do you think will be needed?

     https://www.publicservice.govt.nz/our-work/workforce-data/public-sector-composition/workforce-size/

     https://www.publicservice.govt.nz/assets/Legacy/resources/public-service-workforce-data-2017-v2.pdf
     • Ad 4.2.1

       6 September 2022 at 3:38 pm

       Public servants don't build houses.
     • Patricia Bremner 4.2.2

       6 September 2022 at 3:52 pm

       13.8 % or 340 000 under National in 2016 Alwyn.

       Beginning your count in 2017/ 2021??

       An increase of 5.1% to deal with MIQ, Health needs, and ongoing problems does not seem excessive.
       • alwyn 4.2.2.1

         7 September 2022 at 9:32 am

         It isn't and increase of 5.1% in the people working in the public sector Patricia. It was 5.1% more of the entire workforce in the country who were now in the public sector who had been in the private sector.

         It was an increase from about 348,000 to 437,000 which is an increase of just over 28% in the public sector workforce. Given that none of the problems seem to have been solved, and most of them have got worse it seems greatly excessive to me.
         • Incognito 4.2.2.1.1

           7 September 2022 at 10:34 am

           Given that none of the problems seem to have been solved, and most of them have got worse it seems greatly excessive to me.

           Flawed logic
           • Jimmy 4.2.2.1.1.1

             7 September 2022 at 1:14 pm

             You refute the premise of the question is the correct wording.
             • Incognito …

               7 September 2022 at 1:23 pm

               You had me at you.
         • Tricledrown 4.2.2.1.2

           7 September 2022 at 2:50 pm

           alwynger back at your false equivalencies again National were spending the same amounts on high priced consultants nearly $ 800 million per year infact,where labour bring those in house for a much cheaper price. ie Jenny Shipley getting $600,000 for 8 meetings a year appointed by Gerry Brownlee.Many of the high priced consultants being National Party hacks.
           • alwyn 4.2.2.1.2.1

             7 September 2022 at 4:41 pm

             And what precisely were these 8 meetings in a year for which Ms Shipley was paid $600,000 by the taxpayer? Facts please.
     • roblogic 4.2.3

       6 September 2022 at 4:06 pm

       Depends on how much you value having capable staff in schools, hospitals, police, and the fire service.
       • Patricia Bremner 4.2.3.1

         6 September 2022 at 6:30 pm

         Yes quite so robologic.
       • gsays 4.2.3.2

         6 September 2022 at 9:28 pm

         The Health Minister is good at hiding the value he holds for the capable staff in the health workforce.
5. tc 5

   6 September 2022 at 10:38 am

   You reap what you sow. The absence of reforms to attempt a reset from dirty politics for a start before we look at what they've done to tvnz/rnz or not as the case may be.
6. AB 6

   6 September 2022 at 10:40 am

   A rational gang member should vote National. National will provide a much larger pipeline of desperate, mentally scarred people who have tremendous potential as new clients for illegal drug sales.

   I'm picking it as a bluff. By saying that people shouldn't vote National, the gangs hope that they will.
7. Adrian 7

   6 September 2022 at 10:48 am

   Years ago I heard ( privately ) a senior editor say that his job was to change the government, ostensibly because it sold papers, well before the term “ click bait “ was even heard of. I was also in a campaign room when Mike Moore returned from a meeting with Michael Horton, owner of the Herald, Mike was grumpy and in reply to a how did it go question said “ He’s difficult, but he’s a man of principle, unfortunately they are not our bloody principles! “.
   • Patricia Bremner 7.1

     6 September 2022 at 5:47 pm

     That is so correct Adrian. When I visited my husband's work at The Daily Post, I was greeted by a huge portrait of Muldoon. Smithy the owner treated his Staff well, and wrote protections into the sale to Wilson and Horton, but he was right leaning.
8. newsense 8

   6 September 2022 at 10:54 am

   Newshub owned by the lot gutting CNN and dictating a RW editorial line from the CEO?

   Batten down the hatches.
9. Reality 9

   6 September 2022 at 11:58 am

   For some time I have thought the vitriol and venom heaped on Jacinda was nothing more than plain old jealousy. She has many qualities that people like. A leader needs to have appeal and personality. Chris Luxon in comparison is dull, shifty and unappealing, so to overcome these deficiencies he has, Jacinda gets ever more criticised.
10. Stephen D 10

    6 September 2022 at 12:08 pm

    Not Newshub, but this explains a lot as to why the major players in the media prefer right wing governments

    https://www.nzme.co.nz/investor-relations/major-shareholders/
    • Patricia Bremner 10.1

      6 September 2022 at 1:25 pm

      utterly revealing. Follow the money.
      • Macro 10.1.1

        6 September 2022 at 1:41 pm

        Certainly is revealing, and in case you haven't read this, here is an OP by Robert Reich in The Guardian – in particular wrt the recent fate of 2 reporters on CNN and reporting on one of the most pressing issues in the US right now – the fate of Democracy in the US.

        It is dangerous to believe that “balanced journalism” gives equal weight to liars and to truth-tellers, to those intent on destroying democracy and those seeking to protect it, to the enablers of an ongoing attempted coup and those who are trying to prevent it.

        Two Sundays ago, CNN’s Brian Stelter, host of the show Reliable Sources, put it well:

        “It’s not partisan to stand up for decency and democracy and dialogue. It’s not partisan to stand up to demagogues. It’s required. It’s patriotic. We must make sure we don’t give platforms to those who are lying to our faces.”

        Not incidentally, that was Stelter’s last show on CNN.

        On Friday, CNN’s White House reporter, John Harwood, said:

        “The core point [Biden] made in that political speech about a threat to democracy is true. Now, that’s something that’s not easy for us, as journalists, to say. We’re brought up to believe there’s two different political parties with different points of view and we don’t take sides in honest disagreements between them. But that’s not what we’re talking about. These are not honest disagreements. The Republican party right now is led by a dishonest demagogue.”

        Harwood went on to say:

        “Many, many Republicans are rallying behind his lies about the 2020 election and other things as well. And a significant portion – or a sufficient portion – of the constituency that they’re leading attacked the Capitol on January 6. Violently.”

        Shortly after making these remarks, Harwood announced he was no longer with CNN.
        • Stephen D 10.1.1.1

          6 September 2022 at 1:56 pm

          Fascism suits big business. The further right media can drag the Overton Window, the better.
11. Ad 11

    6 September 2022 at 12:23 pm

    Does anyone disagree that this is a too-late response to an explosion of gang-related crime that this government hasn't come anywhere near fixing?

    Firearms offences committed by gang members on the National Gang List increased by 26.3 per cent from 2018 to 2020.

    Murders by gangs are off the scale over the last 2 years.

    Gang numbers have gone up over 50% since Labour started in 2017.

    In just 1 month in Auckland there were 109 gang crimes with guns.

    Auckland gang warfare – city sees 109 reported gun crimes in a single month – NZ Herald

    The Prime Minister herself has admitted the trouble we are in on her watch, with gangs.

    Gangs: NZ has 'a clear escalation at the moment' – PM (1news.co.nz)

    In July the PM chucked her Police Minister for being ineffective on gangs.

    Why on earth would Labour expect the media to give it a free ride on a policy disaster?
    • Nic the NZer 11.1

      6 September 2022 at 1:04 pm

      Harsh, your saying she should hardly have been short of actual questions to ask the PM?
      • Ad 11.1.1

        6 September 2022 at 1:54 pm

        Ardern can't add anything, and Hipkins is the most successful and tactically astute politician in NZ right now.

        But they can't spin out of this one.
        • Nic the NZer 11.1.1.1

          6 September 2022 at 5:57 pm

          I doubt Ardern even for a second thinks spin should be applied here. No doubt chippie asked all your questions during interview prep and she was well prepared to answer. But apparently the strategy was to ask a question Ardern could hardly have expected and rehersed for in advance. This appears to have got a smirk out of the PM at least.
    • AB 11.2

      6 September 2022 at 3:31 pm

      Don't disagree. It's too late. The response should be a calculated combination of punitive, aggressive chest-beating (which doesn't work but plays well with the public) and really hard policy work such as a demand-reduction focus on meth use, poverty alleviation, jobs guarantees, better mental health care and so on (which will work but takes a long time – possibly generations- and would be hideously expensive).

      Neoliberal Labour is capable of neither, whereas National is capable only of the first, which may be worse than neither. No extant party is capable of both.
      • Ad 11.2.1

        6 September 2022 at 3:36 pm

        Aye
      • roblogic 11.2.2

        6 September 2022 at 4:11 pm

        We can still blame Australia for sending their 501 gangsters over here. And Labour can boast about huge police numbers.

        I wonder if legalising cannabis would have at least reduced some criminal activity.
    • adam 11.3

      6 September 2022 at 4:54 pm

      Come on Ad, that's bullshit.

      This is a long festering problem that was set into motion by the most stupidest Tory prick to ever walk the earth – Scomo.

      That our near equivalent, the royal ponytail fetishist himself, did next to nothing to stop the explosion of Aussie gang members being exported here, started this mess.

      I agree labour have done bugger all – with one great exception, getting this flow of Aussie thugs stopped.

      Also the whole, a gang member saying to vote labour on social media is SNAFU journalism. It's just one more example of a media which are nothing more than cheap propagandists for a greedy cabal.
    • newsense 11.4

      6 September 2022 at 5:28 pm

      How are you measuring gang numbers?

      And which government has solved gangs? Has anyone been asking about trusts and beneficiaries?

      Poto Williams got moved for failing to manage optics.

      There’s plenty of wolf pack out there Ad. They don’t need you too.
    • tadlet 11.5

      10 September 2022 at 8:03 pm

      Covid lockdown and border closures immediately throttled much gang income from drugs. The police could put more resource into anti-gang action, as their usual workload was lower. Also, Aussie police worked a sting where they infiltated a whats app type comms system used by drug gangs including NZ ones.

      Just look at the weekly reports of high-level drugs busts and gang leader arrests in the last year. Police have been very effective at shutting down supply and picking up organisation heads.

      When drug sellers can make their dosh without catching the eye of police or the public they keep a low profile, as business is sweet. Now they are being squeezed, they have reacted by increasing social disturbances which skirt the law (noisy cars circuiting the streets for hours; pack drives on busy roads).

      To extend their business, it's clear to me that drug gangs are also encouraging youth offenders to terrorise small businesses, in order to soften them up for protection rackets. The burglaries are not the point, the threat of targetted destruction is. I hope the police are developing strategies to kill this new line of business off at the start, as extra community programmes for vulnerable young people are only part of the solution.
12. Psammead 12

    6 September 2022 at 1:02 pm

    The 501s coming back here and setting up Comancheros and other new gangs are not Labour's creation, but Australia's. The saturation of the community with methamphetamine coming in from Asia is not a Labour initiative either. but has also contributed to growth in gangs with the easy money to be made from addiction and poverty of mind and spirit. Both have contributed to gang growth along with Covid plus world wide economic down turn. It's simplistic to lay it at the government's door. I havent seen any real policies from the Nats and can't imagine from their poor showing so far they have any real policies. Just bash the poor and dispossessed.
    • Patricia Bremner 12.1

      6 September 2022 at 5:57 pm

      Agreed Psammead Scomo and Dutton have no morals, and did damage with little help for Fire and flood victims in Aus, and sending 501's here on the flimsiest of pretexts.
    • gsays 12.2

      6 September 2022 at 9:33 pm

      Hard to argue with what you say.

      Labour has done little to change the environment that makes joining gangs and consuming meth attractive.
13. higherstandard 13

    6 September 2022 at 1:31 pm

    'Is this how turgid our media has become? Do they really think that Fox News is a model to follow? That instead of reporting on issues our media should engage in cheap shots against the Prime Minister that are reality and substance free?'

    Are you taking the Mickey MS ? The NZ media are and have been woefully for decades. True investigative journalism is almost non existent in NZ(I except the likes of the excellent Barbara Dreaver).

    As per Ad's summary above why these kind of stats can't be fired at the PM, minister of police and police commissioner with a demand for a substantive response is astonishing.

    Much like the rather pathetic job stuff is doing at the moment with local body hopefuls

    I'm less interested in where these people stand on vaccination and would prefer a more full review of all the local body politicians views on rates increases, three waters, urban intensification, public transport etc etc.
    • Anne 13.1

      6 September 2022 at 4:05 pm

      As per Ad's summary above why these kind of stats can't be fired at the PM, minister of police and police commissioner with a demand for a substantive response is astonishing

      Except that Ad's summary is off-topic to mickysavage's post.

      mickysavage was bringing to attention a very disingenuous interview where the interviewer was running a bullshit line. Imo it was a pathetic attempt to distract from the government's just announced substantive measures to curb gang crime, and get a nasty, uncalled for dig at Jacinda Ardern in the process.

      If Ad wants to discuss the pros and cons of the announced measures then it is up to him to do a post on the subject.
14. Stuart Munro 14

    6 September 2022 at 3:47 pm

    The arguments for a thorough shake up of businesses pretending to offer journalism are stronger every day.

    Other countries have faced comparable issues however. In Korea the excesses of the regime led by Chun Doo-hwan, and in particular the violent suppression of the Kwan Ju uprising, led to public demand for a media organ that offered an alternative to the wretched lies that passed for reporting in more established media.

    The answer was The Hankyoreh – a paper with a large popular base and left liberal focus.

    I'm afraid NZ media have reached the point most papers are barely fit for barrier mulch – which at least puts their toxicity to use. TV remains irredeemable, and I am at a loss to explain why any proportion of my taxes should support its biased and ignorant banality. Close them all, and start again from scratch – there's nothing worth saving.
    • Anne 14.1

      6 September 2022 at 4:17 pm

      No need to start from scratch. Re-instate the perfectly good model we had before the advent of neoliberalism which forced the mindless and unholy scrapping of everything that had gone before. Perhaps with a few tweaks to bring it into the 21st century is all that is needed.
      • Stuart Munro 14.1.1

        6 September 2022 at 7:17 pm

        It's a good model – but leave in place one neoliberal mandarin and they will wreck it.

        A clean rebuild avoids that pitfall – there will be some experience loss, but mistakes will be honest – not sabotage.
15. roblogic 15

    6 September 2022 at 4:45 pm

    Another example of incompetent reporting: just mindlessly repeating extreme distortions from right wing economist/nut job Eric Crampton of the NZ Initiative. RNZ, Stuff, and Newshub all claiming that the Health reforms are costing $11 billion. Directly contradicting the Minister's own statement that the reforms are $1.8b in year one and $1.3b in year two.

    Do these clickbait trolls (or noob journalism grads) even know how to check spurious claims or use Google?

    OK I appreciate that NZ is not ruled by Fox News or Murdoch Media, but we are still poorly served.

    Stuff

    Radio NZ

    Newshub

    The imperative of "news" isn't to inform, it is to shock and surprise the audience, to drive "engagement".

    https://twitter.com/ClintVSmith/status/1566615141265080320?s=20&t=tMmp_A1jv0M_2vlCzm68Mg
    • aj 15.1

      7 September 2022 at 12:48 pm

      https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/opinion-analysis/300678845/excessive-government-is-it-time-for-labour-to-rein-it-in

      A typical 'correction' to this article appeared on a couple of stuff newspapers yesterday, sorry can't link because it's not on-line.

      Typical correction, tiny article, buried about P4,5,6, perhaps 6 lines, but damage (intended job) done.

      In this article (National/ACT aligned) Eric Crampton repeats the nonsense that the health reforms are costing $11b.

      That's 150,000 work/years and obviously not the reforms, which have a budget of $77m

      $11b is actual total cost of health services, formerly purchased by DHBs, now HNZ & MHA. In other words, it includes ongoing operational costs which are already budgeted for annually.
      • Incognito 15.1.1

        7 September 2022 at 12:56 pm

        Clarification: The $11b figure cited by Danyl Mclauchlan included operational expenditures that would have occurred regardless of the restructuring. Budget 2022 overview documents had also cited $11.1 billion for “Reforming the health system”, but had also rolled together new initiatives including the health system restructuring with ongoing programmes. The cost of the reform programme, on its own, would need to be tallied across multiple years of appropriations, but will be much lower than $11 billion. (Amended at 4.02pm, September 5, 2022)

        At the bottom of the article you linked to.
      • Incognito 15.1.2

        7 September 2022 at 1:08 pm

        Quite possibly Steven Joyce approved [of] the draft version of the article mesmerised by the multi-billion dollar hole that opened up in his imagination.
        • aj 15.1.2.1

          7 September 2022 at 2:22 pm

          Thank you. I should have gone back to that article to check.
          • Incognito 15.1.2.1.1

            7 September 2022 at 3:04 pm

            All good, I pre-empted you.
16. roblogic 16

    6 September 2022 at 5:36 pm

    Another example. Bad takes abound.

    https://twitter.com/DailyIndgnation/status/1566957312014958593?s=20&t=tMmp_A1jv0M_2vlCzm68Mg
17. newsense 17

    7 September 2022 at 7:31 pm

    Because right wing causes are charities that need sponsorship. A handout of you will.

    Wonder if we will get a breakdown of suburbs with most fraud, highest density of trusts, highest tax avoidance/evasion/cheating, highest number of gastropubs, BMW dealerships etc
18. RP Mcmurphy 18

    8 September 2022 at 3:45 pm

    newshub is a disgrace to the profession of jornalism.

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