NRT: “The worst of the worst”
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- Date published:
10:43 am, April 30th, 2013 - 176 comments
Categories: crime, law and "order", national -
Tags: 3 strikes, crime, lies, no right t
I/S at No Right Turn on the difference between what was promised of the “3 strikes” law and the way it is being used in practice.
When National passed its “three strikes” legislation in 2010, they promised that it would not be like California’s, and target shoplifters, drug dealers, and other petty criminals. Instead, it would be used on “the worst of the worst”. Throughout the debates (which are linked to from here), they repeatedly referred to “the worst murderers”, the “worst serious violent offenders” and the “worst” sexual offenders. So who are actually they using it on?Dumbarse muggers:
The controversial “three strikes” legislation has seen a young man jailed without parole and warned that if he steals another skateboard, hat or cellphone he will spend 14 years behind bars.
In issuing Elijah Akeem Whaanga, 21, his second strike, Judge Tony Adeane told the Hastings man his two “street muggings” that netted “trophies of minimal value” meant his outlook was now “bleak in the extreme”.
“When you next steal a hat or a cellphone or a jacket or a skateboard you will be sent to the High Court and there you will be sentenced to 14 years’ imprisonment without parole,” Judge Adeane said.
So, it turns out that National were lying. Judith Collins thinks that this is an example of the law working. I guess she’s forgotten all the assurances she gave back in 2010.
If our legal system thinks that this dumbarse is among “the worst of the worst”, or that his crimes merit 14 years imprisonment without parole, then it is fundamentally disproportionate and unjust. If our politicians think it is anything other than a waste of public money, then they are simply insane.
But its hard to see how, if this moron gets to a third strike, the Bill of Rights Act’s affirmation of freedom from disproportionately severe treatment or punishment would not be invoked. Which should see the law being “read down” to include discretion on sentencing where it would be manifestly unjust (something that only exists at present for the parole decision). The politicians will squeal, but if they won’t obey the BORA as they promised, the courts will just have to do it for them.
(I’d suggest that juries simply start refusing to convict people where legislated sentences woudl be unjust, as they did in the C17th in response to the“Bloody Code”, but National deprived most people of the right to trial by jury last year…)
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- Continued progress on reducing poverty in challenging times77,000 fewer children living in low income households on the after-housing-costs primary measure since Labour took office Eight of the nine child poverty measures have seen a statistically significant reduction since 2018. All nine have reduced 28,700 fewer children experiencing material hardship since 2018 Measures taken by the Government during ...2 days ago
- Speech at Fiji Investment and Trade Business ForumDeputy Prime Minister Kamikamica; distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen. Tēnā koutou katoa, ni sa bula vinaka saka, namaste. Deputy Prime Minister, a very warm welcome to Aotearoa. I trust you have been enjoying your time here and thank you for joining us here today. To all delegates who have travelled to be ...2 days ago
- Government investments boost and diversify local economies in lower South Island$2.9 million convertible loan for Scapegrace Distillery to meet growing national and international demand $4.5m underwrite to support Silverlight Studios’ project to establish a film studio in Wanaka Gore’s James Cumming Community Centre and Library to be official opened tomorrow with support of $3m from the COVID-19 Response and Recovery ...2 days ago
- Government future-proofs EV chargingTransport Minister Michael Wood has today launched the first national EV (electric vehicle) charging strategy, Charging Our Future, which includes plans to provide EV charging stations in almost every town in New Zealand. “Our vision is for Aotearoa New Zealand to have world-class EV charging infrastructure that is accessible, affordable, ...3 days ago
- World-leading family harm prevention campaign supports young NZersAssociate Minister for Social Development and Employment Priyanca Radhakrishnan has today launched the Love Better campaign in a world-leading approach to family harm prevention. Love Better will initially support young people through their experience of break-ups, developing positive and life-long attitudes to dealing with hurt. “Over 1,200 young kiwis told ...3 days ago
- First Chief Clinical Advisor welcomed into Coroners CourtHon Rino Tirikatene, Minister for Courts, welcomes the Ministry of Justice’s appointment of Dr Garry Clearwater as New Zealand’s first Chief Clinical Advisor working with the Coroners Court. “This appointment is significant for the Coroners Court and New Zealand’s wider coronial system.” Minister Tirikatene said. Through Budget 2022, the Government ...3 days ago
- Next steps for affected properties post Cyclone and floodsThe Government via the Cyclone Taskforce is working with local government and insurance companies to build a picture of high-risk areas following Cyclone Gabrielle and January floods. “The Taskforce, led by Sir Brian Roche, has been working with insurance companies to undertake an assessment of high-risk areas so we can ...3 days ago
- New appointment to Māori Land Court benchE te huia kaimanawa, ko Ngāpuhi e whakahari ana i tau aupikinga ki te tihi o te maunga. Ko te Ao Māori hoki e whakanui ana i a koe te whakaihu waka o te reo Māori i roto i te Ao Ture. (To the prized treasure, it is Ngāpuhi who ...3 days ago
- Government focus on jobs sees record number of New Zealanders move from Benefits into work113,400 exits into work in the year to June 2022 Young people are moving off Benefit faster than after the Global Financial Crisis Two reports released today by the Ministry of Social Development show the Government’s investment in the COVID-19 response helped drive record numbers of people off Benefits and ...3 days ago
- Vertical farming partnership has upward momentumThe Government’s priority to keep New Zealand at the cutting edge of food production and lift our sustainability credentials continues by backing the next steps of a hi-tech vertical farming venture that uses up to 95 per cent less water, is climate resilient, and pesticide-free. Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor visited ...4 days ago
- Conference of Pacific Education Ministers – Keynote AddressE nga mana, e nga iwi, e nga reo, e nga hau e wha, tena koutou, tena koutou, tena koutou kātoa. Warm Pacific greetings to all. It is an honour to host the inaugural Conference of Pacific Education Ministers here in Tāmaki Makaurau. Aotearoa is delighted to be hosting you ...4 days ago
- New $13m renal unit supports Taranaki patientsThe new renal unit at Taranaki Base Hospital has been officially opened by the Minister of Health Dr Ayesha Verrall this afternoon. Te Huhi Raupō received around $13 million in government funding as part of Project Maunga Stage 2, the redevelopment of the Taranaki Base Hospital campus. “It’s an honour ...4 days ago
- Second Poseidon aircraft on home soilDefence Minister Andrew Little has marked the arrival of the country’s second P-8A Poseidon aircraft alongside personnel at the Royal New Zealand Air Force’s Base at Ohakea today. “With two of the four P-8A Poseidons now on home soil this marks another significant milestone in the Government’s historic investment in ...4 days ago
- Further humanitarian aid for Türkiye and SyriaAotearoa New Zealand will provide further humanitarian support to those seriously affected by last month’s deadly earthquakes in Türkiye and Syria, says Foreign Minister Nanaia Mahuta. “The 6 February earthquakes have had devastating consequences, with almost 18 million people affected. More than 53,000 people have died and tens of thousands more ...4 days ago
- Community voice to help shape immigration policyMigrant communities across New Zealand are represented in the new Migrant Community Reference Group that will help shape immigration policy going forward, Immigration Minister Michael Wood announced today. “Since becoming Minister, a reoccurring message I have heard from migrants is the feeling their voice has often been missing around policy ...4 days ago
- State Highway 3 project to deliver safer journeys, better travel connections for TaranakiConstruction has begun on major works that will deliver significant safety improvements on State Highway 3 from Waitara to Bell Block, Associate Minister of Transport Kiri Allan announced today. “This is an important route for communities, freight and visitors to Taranaki but too many people have lost their lives or ...4 days ago
- Ginny Andersen appointed as Minister of PolicePrime Minister Chris Hipkins has today appointed Ginny Andersen as Minister of Police. “Ginny Andersen has a strong and relevant background in this important portfolio,” Chris Hipkins said. “Ginny Andersen worked for the Police as a non-sworn staff member for around 10 years and has more recently been chair of ...5 days ago
- Government confirms vital roading reconnectionsSix further bailey bridge sites confirmed Four additional bridge sites under consideration 91 per cent of damaged state highways reopened Recovery Dashboards for impacted regions released The Government has responded quickly to restore lifeline routes after Cyclone Gabrielle and can today confirm that an additional six bailey bridges will ...5 days ago
- Foreign Minister Mahuta to meet with China’s new Foreign MinisterForeign Minister Nanaia Mahuta departs for China tomorrow, where she will meet with her counterpart, State Councillor and Foreign Minister Qin Gang, in Beijing. This will be the first visit by a New Zealand Minister to China since 2019, and follows the easing of COVID-19 travel restrictions between New Zealand and China. ...5 days ago
- Education Ministers from across the Pacific gather in AotearoaEducation Ministers from across the Pacific will gather in Tāmaki Makaurau this week to share their collective knowledge and strategic vision, for the benefit of ākonga across the region. New Zealand Education Minister Jan Tinetti will host the inaugural Conference of Pacific Education Ministers (CPEM) for three days from today, ...5 days ago
- State Highway 5 reopens between Napier and Taupō following Cyclone GabrielleA vital transport link for communities and local businesses has been restored following Cyclone Gabrielle with the reopening of State Highway 5 (SH5) between Napier and Taupō, Associate Minister of Transport Kiri Allan says. SH5 reopened to all traffic between 7am and 7pm from today, with closure points at SH2 (Kaimata ...5 days ago
- Special Lotto draw raises $11.7 million for Cyclone Gabrielle recoveryInternal Affairs Minister Barbara Edmonds has thanked generous New Zealanders who took part in the special Lotto draw for communities affected by Cyclone Gabrielle. Held on Saturday night, the draw raised $11.7 million with half of all ticket sales going towards recovery efforts. “In a time of need, New Zealanders ...6 days ago
- Government delivers a $3 million funding boost for Building Financial Capability servicesThe Government has announced funding of $3 million for providers to help people, and whānau access community-based Building Financial Capability services. “Demand for Financial Capability Services is growing as people face cost of living pressures. Those pressures are increasing further in areas affected by flooding and Cyclone Gabrielle,” Minister for ...1 week ago
- Education New Zealand | Manapou ki te Ao – new Chair and memberMinister of Education, Hon Jan Tinetti, has announced appointments to the Board of Education New Zealand | Manapou ki te Ao. Tracey Bridges is joining the Board as the new Chair and Dr Therese Arseneau will be a new member. Current members Dr Linda Sissons CNZM and Daniel Wilson have ...1 week ago
- Scholarships honouring Ngarimu VC and the 28th (Māori) Battalion announcedFifteen ākonga Māori from across Aotearoa have been awarded the prestigious Ngarimu VC and 28th (Māori) Battalion Memorial Scholarships and Awards for 2023, Associate Education Minister and Ngarimu Board Chair, Kelvin Davis announced today. The recipients include doctoral, masters’ and undergraduate students. Three vocational training students and five wharekura students, ...1 week ago
- Appointment of Judge of the Court of Appeal and Judge of the High CourtHigh Court Judge Jillian Maree Mallon has been appointed a Judge of the Court of Appeal, and District Court Judge Andrew John Becroft QSO has been appointed a Judge of the High Court, Attorney‑General David Parker announced today. Justice Mallon graduated from Otago University in 1988 with an LLB (Hons), and with ...1 week ago
- NZ still well placed to meet global challengesThe economy has continued to show its resilience despite today’s GDP figures showing a modest decline in the December quarter, leaving the Government well positioned to help New Zealanders face cost of living pressures in a challenging global environment. “The economy had grown strongly in the two quarters before this ...1 week ago
- Western Ring Route CompleteAucklanders now have more ways to get around as Transport Minister Michael Wood opened the direct State Highway 1 (SH1) to State Highway 18 (SH18) underpass today, marking the completion of the 48-kilometre Western Ring Route (WRR). “The Government is upgrading New Zealand’s transport system to make it safer, more ...1 week ago
- Briefings to Incoming MinistersThis section contains briefings received by incoming ministers following changes to Cabinet in January. Some information may have been withheld in accordance with the Official Information Act 1982. Where information has been withheld that is indicated within the document. ...1 week ago
- Teaming up for a stronger, more resilient FijiAotearoa New Zealand Foreign Affairs Minister Nanaia Mahuta reaffirmed her commitment to working together with the new Government of Fiji on issues of shared importance, including on the prioritisation of climate change and sustainability, at a meeting today, in Nadi. Fiji and Aotearoa New Zealand’s close relationship is underpinned by the Duavata ...1 week ago
- Investment in blue highway a lifeline for regional economies and cyclone recoveryThe Government is delivering a coastal shipping lifeline for businesses, residents and the primary sector in the cyclone-stricken regions of Hawkes Bay and Tairāwhiti, Regional Development Minister Kiri Allan announced today. The Rangitata vessel has been chartered for an emergency coastal shipping route between Gisborne and Napier, with potential for ...1 week ago
- Next steps developing clean energy for NZThe Government will progress to the next stage of the NZ Battery Project, looking at the viability of pumped hydro as well as an alternative, multi-technology approach as part of the Government’s long term-plan to build a resilient, affordable, secure and decarbonised energy system in New Zealand, Energy and Resources ...1 week ago
- Statement from the Prime Minister on Stuart NashThis morning I was made aware of a media interview in which Minister Stuart Nash criticised a decision of the Court and said he had contacted the Police Commissioner to suggest the Police appeal the decision. The phone call took place in 2021 when he was not the Police Minister. ...1 week ago
- CPTPP Trade Ministers coming to AucklandThe Government’s sharp focus on trade continues with Aotearoa New Zealand set to host Trade Ministers and delegations from 10 Asia Pacific economies at a meeting of Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership (CPTPP) Commission members in July, Minister for Trade and Export Growth Damien O’Connor announced today. “New Zealand ...1 week ago
- Govt approves $25 million extension for cyclone-affected businesses$25 million boost to support more businesses with clean-up in cyclone affected regions, taking total business support to more than $50 million Demand for grants has been strong, with estimates showing applications will exceed the initial $25 million business support package Grants of up to a maximum of $40,000 per ...1 week ago
- The Week in Detail: Top authors, lobbying, and Muriwai
Every weekday, The Detail makes sense of the big news stories. This week, we looked at how our top authors make a living writing books, the sky-high fares coming from independent taxi drivers, how the people of Muriwai are putting their lives back together post-Cyclone Gabrielle, why a Levin chocolate maker is ...3 hours ago - The Week in Detail: Top authors, lobbying, and MuriwaiEvery weekday, The Detail makes sense of the big news stories. This week, we looked at how our top authors make a living writing books, the sky-high fares coming from independent taxi drivers, how the people of Muriwai are putting their lives back together post-Cyclone Gabrielle, why a Levin chocolate maker is ...3 hours ago
- Why we enjoy the excruciating miseries of the super-rich
The popularity of stories about unhappy rich people says more about our need to view them that way than it does about how they experience their lives Opinion: Succession is returning to Aotearoa’s television screens. It joins other portrayals of the emotional traumas that come from having far, far too ...3 hours ago - Why we enjoy the excruciating miseries of the super-richThe popularity of stories about unhappy rich people says more about our need to view them that way than it does about how they experience their lives Opinion: Succession is returning to Aotearoa’s television screens. It joins other portrayals of the emotional traumas that come from having far, far too ...3 hours ago
- The Detail's Long Read: What's Up With ADHD?
This is The Detail's Long Read - one in-depth story read by us every weekend This week, it's What's Up With ADHD?, written by Mirjam Guesgen and published in North & South's April 2023 issue. You can find the full article, with illustrations by Rachel Salazar, in this month’s issue of North & South. Once a condition ...3 hours ago - The Detail's Long Read: What's Up With ADHD?This is The Detail's Long Read - one in-depth story read by us every weekend This week, it's What's Up With ADHD?, written by Mirjam Guesgen and published in North & South's April 2023 issue. You can find the full article, with illustrations by Rachel Salazar, in this month’s issue of North & South. Once a condition ...3 hours ago
- Short story: The Islands of Arthur Trimble
"He imagines the rattling windows of his bach": a sad seaside saga by Majella Cullinane Màiri watches him as he walks down the hill next to her house. The man appears gradually – first his head covered in a tweed cap and earphones, then the unkempt hair and beard, ...3 hours ago - Short story: The Islands of Arthur Trimble"He imagines the rattling windows of his bach": a sad seaside saga by Majella Cullinane Màiri watches him as he walks down the hill next to her house. The man appears gradually – first his head covered in a tweed cap and earphones, then the unkempt hair and beard, ...3 hours ago
- Inside the radical plan to build ‘the new state house’ and change renting forever
Not content with transforming KiwiSaver, Simplicity is now planning to out-build Kāinga Ora. Duncan Greive meets a pair of of unlikely revolutionaries trying to fix housing – a task which seems impossible, even for the state itself. In September of 2020, a builder named Shane Brealey sat down and typed ...3 hours ago - What not to miss at the Auckland Writers Festival 2023The Auckland Writers Festival has just launched its 23rd programme, the first since Covid to include its signature line-up of visiting international writers. With 160 events to choose from, here’s books editor Claire Mabey’s top 10 to help you navigate your way through the lit fest universe. Straight Up: Ruby ...4 hours ago
- Family tree key to Twigg's fifth Olympic bid
Taking her her young family around the world as she rows is a key factor in Emma Twigg's decision to defend her Olympic single sculls title at next year's Paris Olympics. And, Andy Hay writes, the next Emma Twigg could be waiting in the wings at the Maadi Cup next week. ...4 hours ago - Fijian Drua and Moana Pasifika looking for 80min performances
The Fijian Drua will need to start and finish well, while Moana Pasifika’s coach wants to see a full 80-minute performance this weekend as the two regional teams continue their Super Rugby Pacific campaigns. The Drua tackle the Highlanders in Dunedin today and Pasifika face the Hurricanes at Mt Smart ...6 hours ago - PNG contractors plead for government to pay up after 12-year waitBy Todagia Kelola in Port Moresby A number of small contractors in Papua New Guinea are still waiting for positive feedback for money owed to them by government agencies after 12 years. A 2015 Post-Courier front page picture showed a man, David Goli, who chained himself at the then headquarters ...6 hours ago
- A new review into how teachers are educated should acknowledge they learn throughout their careers (...Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Beryl Exley, Professor, Griffith Institute for Educational Research, Griffith University, Griffith University Shutterstock Last August, the federal government set up an expert panel to look at the continuous improvement agenda in teacher education in Australia. The panel, led by ...14 hours ago
- Analysis: Teachers need a lot of things, another curriculum 'rewrite' isn't one
We all clearly want the best learning outcomes for our nation's children, but there are deep ideological divisions, writes Cathy Buntting. ...15 hours ago - The Winston Peters greatest hits hourThe New Zealand First leader took to the altar of an East Auckland church today to set out his 2023 election agenda. It was, as Stewart Sowman-Lund found out, pretty much what you’d expect. Winston Peters rolled into Howick today with a state of the nation speech that, he claimed ...15 hours ago
- Woolworths is getting into telehealth – but patients need to be treated as more than customersSource: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Jon Wardle, Professor of Public Health, Southern Cross University Shutterstock Earlier this week, Australian retail giant Woolworths announced a move into health-care delivery via development of its subsidiary HealthyLife’s online portal. Through this portal, Australians can book a same-day ...15 hours ago
- Winston Peters rails against secret 'woke agenda' in campaign speechNew Zealand First leader Winston Peters - eyeing a political comeback - has used a scene-setting speech in Auckland warning against a "conceited, conniving, cultural cabal". ...16 hours ago
- At the 2023 Adelaide Festival, the best works shimmer with a brutal honesty on incarceration, exile ...Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By William Peterson, Adjunct Associate Professor, Auckland University of Technology The Sheep Song. Tim Standing/Daylight Breaks/Adelaide Festival Few Adelaideans remember a time before the Adelaide Festival. Formed in 1960 as a civic enterprise and financed against loss by prominent Adelaide businessmen, the ...17 hours ago
- Week in Politics: Minor parties could hold unprecedented influence post-electionAnalysis - The Greens lay down a challenge as the minor parties approach an election in which both National and Labour are going to need coalition partners to form a government, writes Peter Wilson. ...17 hours ago
- Repeal Fiji’s media law and start with ‘clean slate’, says CFL chiefBy Arieta Vakasukawaqa in Suva Communications Fiji Ltd (CFL) chair William Parkinson has called for a repeal of Fiji’s Media Industry Development Act 2010 and more discussion on the proposed Media Ownership and Registration Bill 2023. He said this during a public consultation on the review of MIDA Act 2010 ...17 hours ago
- Posie Parker wins the beautiful freedom to make an ugly argument
High Court Justice David Gendall regretfully allows anti-trans activist to enter New Zealand, but warns the expression of her views may be harmful to our vulnerable rainbow community. Jonathan Milne does his best to be civil. Opinion: Kellie-Jay Keen-Minshull calls herself Posie Parker. And that's what I'm going to call her. Because she is ...17 hours ago - Guy Montgomery’s Guy Mont Spelling Bee is an absolute joyIt’s about time somebody made a wacky TV show about how bonkers spelling is. Enter comedian Guy Montgomery and his Guy Mont Spelling Bee. The three years since Covid-19 began have been pretty rocky, but one of the best things to come out of the chaos was Guy Montgomery’s Guy ...18 hours ago
- Psychologists Condemn Anti-trans Hate Speech And Urge The Government To Put Hate Speech Laws Back On...
Te Rōpū Mātai Hinengaro o Aotearoa, The New Zealand Psychological Society (NZPsS) stands beside LGBTQIA+ and Takatāpui communities rallying against anti-trans rhetoric in light of the impending visit of Kellie-Jay Keen-Minshull (Posie Parker). We are ...18 hours ago - Shocking and controversial: MAFS Australia has outrated 1NewsEarlier this month, everybody’s favourite Monster of the Week series Married at First Sight Australia toppled 1News to become the highest rating television show for New Zealand viewers aged 25-54. The controversial reality series garnered an average audience of 137,000, or 6.7% audience share from March 5 until March 11. ...18 hours ago
- Ingredient of the week: FeijoasIt’s the most wonderful time of the year for feijoa lovers – here’s how to make the most of it. Fragrant and sweet, with a delicate jelly centre surrounded by gritty, tangy flesh, all encased in a green sour skin. My parents’ feijoa tree has just dropped its first fruit, ...18 hours ago
- The Friday Poem: ‘Bang a Drum’ by Maggie Rainey-SmithA new poem by poet and novelist Maggie Rainey-Smith. Bang a Drum We’ve hit Gentle Annie passed the pub at Okaramio and on the left, at Wakapuaka there’s Sunnybank where parents left their children An oddly named orphanage manned (ha) by Nuns childless women in black habits, scapula, cowls and ...18 hours ago
- Teachers need a lot of things right now, but another curriculum ‘rewrite’ isn’t one of themSource: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Cathy Buntting, Director, Wilf Malcolm Institute of Educational Research, University of Waikato Getty Images Less than a fortnight after teachers staged a national strike, education was back in the headlines with the National Party’s release of its curriculum policy – ...18 hours ago
- The Unity Books bestseller chart for the week ending March 24The only published and available best-selling indie book chart in New Zealand is the top 10 sales list recorded every week at Unity Books’ stores in High St, Auckland, and Willis St, Wellington. AUCKLAND 1 Birnam Wood by Eleanor Catton (Te Herenga Waka University Press, $38) Number one in both ...19 hours ago
- High Court Decision The Only Right Result For Nation That Values Free SpeechThe Free Speech Union welcomes the decision of the High Court to reject the application to overrule the decision of the Minister of Immigration to allow Kellie-Jay entry into New Zealand. This was the only right result for a nation that ...19 hours ago
- AI chatbots with Chinese characteristics: why Baidu’s ChatGPT rival may never measure upSource: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Fan Yang, Research Associate at RMIT and Alfred Deakin Institute, Deakin University Baidu’s ERNIE Bot was launched to considerable disappointment. Ng Han Guan / AP On March 16, Baidu unveiled China’s latest rival to OpenAI’s ChatGPT – ERNIE Bot (short for “Enhanced ...19 hours ago
- Ask Fiji military about ‘guns on plane’ claims, says Sayed-KhaiyumBy Meri Radinibaravi in Suva Former attorney-general Aiyaz Sayed-Khaiyum has told The Fiji Times to ask the Republic of Fiji Military Forces about claims that his bodyguards were allowed to take guns on to Fiji Link flights without proper authorisation. “I understand that there’s some enquiries going on regarding that ...19 hours ago
- Melbourne Now: a vast, sprawling and inspiring exhibition that seems to burst out of its architectur...Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Sasha Grishin, Adjunct Professor of Art History, Australian National University Installation view of Troy Emery’s work Mountain climber 2022 on display as part of the Melbourne Now exhibition at The Ian Potter Centre: NGV Australia, Melbourne from 24 March – 20 August ...20 hours ago
- KPIs are for businesses and boardrooms, not children and schoolsNational’s education policy reinforces an old-fashioned and hierarchical curriculum that does lasting harm to many students, writes educational specialist Dr Sarah Aiono. Announcing the National Party’s new education policy this week, leader Christopher Luxon cited a recent NCEA pilot in which two-thirds of students were unable to meet the minimum ...20 hours ago
- Last ditch attempt to stop anti-trans speaker from entering NZ failsAttempts by rainbow groups to stop an anti-trans campaigner entering the country have failed. The High Court has dismissed a judicial review application from Gender Minorities Aotearoa, InsideOUT Kōara and Auckland Pride, aimed at the immigration minister for allowing Kellie-Jay Keen-Minshull into New Zealand. As part of the application, the ...20 hours ago
- Urgent hearing under way to determine if anti-trans speaker can enter NZThe High Court is this morning considering an interim order that would prevent an anti-trans campaigner from making it into New Zealand. Kellie-Jay Keen-Minshull is expected to arrive on our shores today ahead of two planned rallies in Auckland and Wellington over the weekend. After immigration officials deemed her safe ...21 hours ago
- Statement From Mayor Paula Southgate: Hamilton’s LGNZ MembershipI was disappointed to see yesterday afternoon’s announcement that Auckland has chosen to leave Local Government NZ (LGNZ). Hamilton’s membership of LGNZ is one of collaboration and sharing. Being a member gives us important views from other ...22 hours ago
- Review: The Unruly Tourists is fun, but facileIt’s the most talked about local opera production in years – but does it live up to the chatter? The lowdown You’ve probably heard of the “unruly tourists”, the British family who created a media firestorm as they toured around the country leaving trash and turmoil in their wake. You’ve ...22 hours ago
- Ministry of Health removed trans advice after pressure from activistsAs reported by Newsroom’s Marc Daalder this morning, correspondence released under the Official Information Act shows advice about puberty blockers was removed from the Ministry of Health website “in the hopes it creates fewer queries” from anti-trans campaigners. The line that was removed from the site said puberty blockers “are ...22 hours ago
- Bryce Edwards’ Political Roundup: NZ needs to distance itself from Australia’s anti-China nucle...Analysis by Dr Bryce Edwards. Political Roundup: NZ needs to distance itself from Australia’s anti-China nuclear submarines The New Zealand Government has been silent about Australia’s decision to commit up to $400bn acquiring nuclear submarines, even though this is a significant threat to peace and stability in the Asia Pacific. The ...22 hours ago
- Secondary teachers confirm next strikeSecondary teachers will strike again next week after an agreement on improved pay and working conditions was not reached. The strike will take place on Wednesday, less than two weeks after thousands of educators took to the streets across the country. “PPTA Te Wehengarua members have shown they are serious ...22 hours ago
- Share Your Views On Human Rights Progress In Aotearoa New ZealandTe Kāhui Tika Tangata Human Rights Commission is encouraging organisations and individuals to share their views on human rights in Aotearoa New Zealand for the government’s upcoming report to the United Nations. The report informs a process ...22 hours ago
- Secondary And Area School Teachers Plan More Industrial ActionSecondary and area school teachers around the country have voted overwhelmingly in favour of more industrial action, including a one day national strike next Wednesday, in support of their collective agreement negotiations. “PPTA Te Wehengarua members ...23 hours ago
- Aaron Hawkins: Auckland Council has turned its back on the rest of the countryAt a time when our need for collective action is stronger than ever, Auckland Council has opted out to save each of its residents just 25c a year, writes former Dunedin mayor Aaron Hawkins. I grew up in rural Southland, in the shadows of the Cut The Cable movement. In ...23 hours ago
- Fishing for data: commercial fishers help monitor rising temperatures in coastal seasSource: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Julie Jakoboski, Oceanographic Data Scientist, Moana Project’s Te Tiro Moana Team Lead, MetService — Te Ratonga Tirorangi Moana project, CC BY-ND The world’s oceans are buffering us from the worst climate impacts by taking up more than 90% of the ...23 hours ago
- Political editors panel: Schools, lobbying, and trans rightsMorning Report - RNZ and Newsroom's political editors consider National's education pitch, and the political responses to lobbying revelations and Posie Parker. ...23 hours ago
- Free Speech Union Granted Intervening Status In Posie Parker Judicial ReviewThe Free Speech Union will be an intervener this morning as the High Court considers whether Immigration New Zealand's decision to allow Posie Parker (Kellie-Jay Keen-Minshull) entry into New Zealand was legal, says Jonathan Ayling, Chief Executive of the Free ...23 hours ago
- Why is this Auckland club clinging to a ‘discriminatory’ dress-code rule?For over a decade, Manurewa Cosmopolitan Club has come under fire for denying entry to people wearing religious headwear. Despite the Human Rights Commission getting involved, it seems the rule remains unchanged. One of the definitions given by the Oxford dictionary for the word cosmopolitan is: “including people from many ...24 hours ago
- Listen: How Labour just hurt the Emissions Trading SchemeChris Hipkins’ dump of Ardern-era policy has potentially jeopardised a major part of the government’s climate change response. In this week’s episode of When the Facts Change, Bernard Hickey talks to climate policy expert Christina Hood from Climate Compass to find out why this month’s Emissions Trading Scheme auction failed and ...24 hours ago
- LGNZ head confused by Wayne Brown’s claim about drunken conferenceThe head of Local Government NZ, the group representing councils across the country, has hit back at claims made by Auckland mayor Wayne Brown. It was his casting vote that saw Auckland Council leave the representative group yesterday evening, with councillors divided on whether or not it was the right ...1 day ago
- A new study on Australian volcanoes has changed what we know about explosive ‘hotspot’ volcanismSource: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Al-Tamini Tapu, Geoscientist, The University of Queensland Warrumbungle national park. colinslack/Shutterstock Our new study published in Nature Geoscience on an ancient chain of Australian volcanoes is helping to change our understanding of “hotspot” volcanism. You may be surprised to learn eastern ...1 day ago
- Time to grow up: Australia’s national security dilemma demands a mature debateSource: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Matthew Sussex, Fellow, Strategic and Defence Studies Centre, Australian National University There’s been a lot of recent shouting about Australia’s national security policy. It began with the Nine newspapers’ “Red Alert” extravaganza, spread over multiple articles. Featuring a graphic of warplanes ...1 day ago
- Want an easy $400 a year? Ditch the gas heater in your home for an electric split systemSource: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Rachel Goldlust, Adjunct Research Fellow, School of Archaeology and History, La Trobe University Shutterstock Earlier this month, regulators flagged electricity price rises in Queensland, New South Wales, Victoria and South Australia. Like many people, you’re probably wondering how you can ...1 day ago
- 4-day work week trials have been labelled a ‘resounding success’. But 4 big questions need answe...Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Anthony Veal, Adjunct Professor, Business School, University of Technology Sydney Shutterstock A little more than a century ago, most people in industrialised countries worked 60 hours a week – six ten-hour days. A 40-hour work week of five eight-hour days ...1 day ago
- The gaming audience is ‘queerer than ever’ – so how are game creators responding?Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Xavier Ho, Lecturer in Interaction Design, Monash University Sony Entertainment Mainstream games are embracing openly queer characters – and so are many of their players and fans. The Last of Us, the prestige HBO adaptation of the critically lauded ...1 day ago
- The Bulletin: Let’s Get Wellington Moving consultant costs in the crosshairsThe capital’s transport overhaul will have spent $130 million on consultant fees by the end of next year, Stuff reports. Let’s Get Wellington Moving (LGWM) expects to spend $60 million on outside experts in the coming year, after already spending $38.5m in the past three years and $35m this year. Greater ...1 day ago
- How Labour just hurt the Emissions Trading SchemeChris Hipkins’ dump of Ardern-era policy has potentially jeopardised a major part of the government’s climate change response. Bernard Hickey talks to climate policy expert Christina Hood from Climate Compass to find out why this month’s Emissions Trading Scheme auction failed and how she feels cabinet have destroyed confidence in ...1 day ago
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Garth McViagra practically came in his pants praising the judge.
This kid needs help, not jail. Meanwhile today Hanover crooks go free…
Oh, NRT I really appreciate your generosity in sharing posts. Like most I’m time poor and can only check so many blogs. You work tirelessly for justice and I appreciate the Standard carrying some of your posts.
McVicar is an idiot, information can be used for good or bad. So the idea that he would out judges who gave lite sentences, if judges were to alter their sentence as a result, could possibly lead to judges being targeted… …or even a judge calling McVicar into their court and locking them up for interference in justice.
Sentence McVicar just before lunchtime. 🙂
No mention of the 72 previous convictions.
No mention of the indecent assault or aggravated (ie: beat the crap out of the victim) robberies.
Just a fine upstanding citizen.
The real question is: Why does Labour love cuddling up to crims?
“aggravated (ie: beat the crap out of the victim) ”
You should probably do some homework on that one there chap.
Someone walks aup to you in the street and robs you : Robbery
Does same thing but has a mate standing next to him: Aggravated robbery.
Nonetheless 72 convictions is a fair bit, no? Which has already included jail time and indecent assault.
Not really the example I would have chosen in order to highlight the perceived absurdity of this law.
(for the record I am not a supporter of the 3 strikes law)
“I am not a supporter of the 3 strikes law”
You just vote for the party that passes it into law, then wash your hands of the consequences. Classy.
“You just vote for the party that passes it into law, then wash your hands of the consequences”
Rather a big assumption there.
That’s not a denial.
You should be a Detective
Did you really vote Labour?
He doesn’t know. He might have said he did but he doesn’t remember that. And what of it? Can’t he just make anecdotes up to suit the conversation at the time?
etc.
Say, that’s great.
Thought you’d like it.
@ Contra “Not really the example I would have chosen in order to highlight the perceived absurdity of this law.”
lol, you just made an argument “NeilM” has been using, I’d almost rather find myself doing a Pete George. Almost, but it’s pretty close.
What’s a NeilM?
A thing no one in good standing would want to resemble.
The real question is: where does a low-life piece of trash like Ruobeil get off pretending that a call for a rational approach to penal policy equates to “cuddling up to crims”?
Sub-moronic scum like Ruobeil, Graham Capill and David Garrett have distorted this discussion for too long. Enough is enough: it’s time to get tough on right wing cretins.
Still haven’t been to those anger management classes yet Knucklehead?
Glad to see you defending crims – then again anything for a few votes eh?
It’s very very simple Ruobeil: you support policies that increase crime rates. Are you saying anger isn’t a perfectly valid response to your making things worse?
Independent research shows that 73 out of every 72 convictions are based on torture, police perjury, and the denial of human rights.
On the other hand, John Banks is being fairly prosecuted at the moment, Hutton was an upstanding gardener, and GCSB operatives have boasted of their law breaking ways. When will Tories stop cuddling up to crims?
What do the 72 previous convictions have to do with the three strikes law?
Presumably, that law refers to convictions of a particular severity rather than any old convictions (e.g., multiple parking fines). Or are you implying that the three strikes legislation is actually just cover for getting at petty criminals rather than the ‘worst of the worst’? (i.e., just as NRT argues).
Unless, of course, the 72 convictions were all for murder, rape or grievous assault. Were they?
That’s right; indecent assault is petty.
Wonder whether the victim believes that?
Using the victim as a human shield won’t help your argument. The policies you support have led to a 50% recidivism rate when other countries achieve 20%. That’s 30% more victims, all to gratify your twisted vigilantism.
Enough is enough.
I am no fan of this law but in this case I think his from the same article is relevant…
Whaanga’s offending stretches back to 2006, including burglary, theft, resisting arrest and indecent assault. He served a short prison sentence in early 2010.
In July that year, he and an accomplice committed aggravated robbery. Whaanga punched the victim in the head multiple times before taking $68. For that he earned his first strike in December 2010 and was sentenced to jail for two years and one month.
He was freed on parole in April last year. The Parole Board said he had behaved well in prison, where he had resided in the Maori Focus Unit. He had completed a drug programme and a Maori therapeutic programme and was released on a number of conditions for six months.
Four months later he committed two aggravated robberies with two separate accomplices.
The first involved taking a skateboard, hat and cigarette lighter from the victim after trying unsuccessfully to remove the victim’s jacket. The second involved Whaanga kicking the victim in the back of his leg and taking his hat and cellphone.
Whaanga pleaded guilty to two charges of aggravated robbery and was sentenced in Napier District Court on April 18.
And jail will do nothing to change him. Certainly not Jail Inc.
FOR. FUCK’S. SAKE.
He needs HELP. He DOES NOT NEED JAIL.
Yes, he’s this and he’s that. Dammit, you made me write in caps and I hate doing that.
It’s our system that is broken, our society, not this kid.
Agreed get him out now. Let him thump the next innocent kid so hard he falls and dies. Then what? Your fucking spots gonna change.
Your fucking stupidity certainly isn’t.
I’m sure there are better people to ‘help’.
I think we have to bear in mind that he has a significant record, and we’re not just talking about nicking an unattended skateboard, there’s far more evil behavior involved. From Stuff:
“Whaanga’s offending stretches back to 2006, including burglary, theft, resisting arrest and indecent assault. He served a short prison sentence in early 2010.
In July that year, he and an accomplice committed aggravated robbery. Whaanga punched the victim in the head multiple times before taking $68. For that he earned his first strike in December 2010 and was sentenced to jail for two years and one month.
He was freed on parole in April last year. The Parole Board said he had behaved well in prison, where he had resided in the Maori Focus Unit. He had completed a drug programme and a Maori therapeutic programme and was released on a number of conditions for six months.
Four months later he committed two aggravated robberies with two separate accomplices.
The first involved taking a skateboard, hat and cigarette lighter from the victim after trying unsuccessfully to remove the victim’s jacket. The second involved Whaanga kicking the victim in the back of his leg and taking his hat and cellphone.
Whaanga pleaded guilty to two charges of aggravated robbery and was sentenced in Napier District Court on April 18.”
The way I see it is that he knows what is expected of him, and what the consequences will be if he misbehaves. Bear in mind that all we’re asking is that he DOESN’T BREAK THE LAW, it’s not that hard…..
Snap! 🙂
“it’s not that hard…”
Do you understand the significance of the phrase “neuro-disability”? I guess not.
Sh!t even I’ve never heard of that. Get him a benefit quick. Better still I will work harder and longer and you can just take some more tax from me. He’s a fucking criminal, when will he learn, more importantly when will the left learn.
Learn what? How to reduce recidivism rates, or how to reduce crime in general? Solutions abound, mostly provided by the Left, but what I don’t understand is why you want to make things worse, and why not one wingnut can produce a single substantive contribution.
Go on, call me soft on crime again you witless gimp.
Even more tax will be taken off you to keep him in prison. You are asking the wrong people to raise taxes in this case, and NAct will only raise them if you’re earning the sort of lowish income that your abilities deserve. If you’re earning heaps, NAct will tax someone else anyway, and any party which cut down prison numbers would be spending less, so don’t worry, be happy……….
So that explains your problem with anger management?
I’m not sure. Does it explain your weird vigilante fantasies?
ok – so he deserves to go in front of the court – i dont think anyones saying he should get off scott free
but seeing as three strikes is meant to be reserved for the worst of the worst how does any of those facts relate to the three strikes law?
its not a law that says, “do lots of crime and well lock you up for ages” – its meant to be for the most despicable violent offenders going.
yes he robbed people – yes he was violent, but is three strikes the right answer here? Has it been applied in the circumstances we were sold?
Its his previous record of violence that is the factor with three strikes, not his previous record of offending as a whole
Do you understand the three strikes law? All it means is that IF Mr Whaanga commits another of the crimes under the three strikes law he will receive the maximum sentence applicable for the crime, no parole.
It DOESN’T mean that if he shoplifts that he’ll get slammed with a life sentence. It DOESN’T mean that if he gets caught drunk driving that he’ll get a life sentence.
It DOES mean that if he commits sexual assault he’ll get 7 years no parole. It DOES mean that if he commits an indecent act on a child he’ll get 10 years no parole. It DOES mean that if he assaults with intent to rob he will get 7 years.
For reference a list of the offences and applicable non-parole sentences can be found here: http://news.tangatawhenua.com/archives/5230
“its not a law that says, “do lots of crime and well lock you up for ages” – its meant to be for the most despicable violent offenders going.”
“Do you understand the three strikes law? All it means is that IF Mr Whaanga commits another of the crimes under the three strikes law he will receive the maximum sentence applicable for the crime, no parole.”
yeah – thats exactly my point.
i said “yes he robbed people – yes he was violent, but is three strikes the right answer here? Has it been applied in the circumstances we were sold?
Its his previous record of violence that is the factor with three strikes, not his previous record of offending as a whole”
read it again
I think it is the right answer here. He has a proven record of violent offending. Pretty simple……. he should be stepped up to maximum sentence for future crimes.
I’d argue that punching someone MULTIPLE times in the head before taking their money is pretty despicable.
People have died from being punched in the head……
Then get yourself admitted to the bar, get yourself selected as a High Court judge, and pass harsh sentences. Otherwise get your filthy hands off our justice system.
Well if you don’t agree with the three strike rule than get yourself elected to parliament, present a bill, get the support to get it passed into law.
Otherwise stop moaning about the law.
Nah, I think I’ll carry on treating your delusions with the ridicule and contempt they so richly deserve, but thanks all the same.
O.A.K
You are a crim cuddling fuckwit of the first order.
This guy has committed 5 strike offences that we know of and he is 21?
His SOP is to conscript young people with little or no criminal background to help him. So this POS drags gulible but otherwise pretty ok “kids” into a life of crime with him.
Yeah not worth 14 years behind bars. Maybe a couple.
Be easier just to shoot the useless fuck.
Or at the least sterilize him so he can’t pass on his scummy genetics
Ah, genetics. Do go on…
We should give up judicial independence because some people commit crime? I don’t think you’re seeing this clearly. Oh, and by the way, the policies you support lead to increased crime. Yes, they do: read the links provided below.
So which one of us is the fuckwit?
CV.
If your kid lay in hospital braindamaged by this POSwould you still say its worth just a couple of years? Get real.
Giving someone a beating one to one is 7 years max, there is a reason that making is a team event is 14 years. That is what this piece of human scum does time after time, when he is not commiting indecent assult of course.
Anyone got a list of his 70 previos offences?
Brain damage to kids now?
Fuck me this is good. We pretend this one person has done something so we can have a knee-jerk emotional response to it.
Then we fantasise a punishment sufficient for our own gratification.
Then we extend and apply that punishment to the general case. And it’s appropriate in the general case because it was appropriate in our made-up one.
Felix.
I assume your crawling comment was aimed at me.
You do realise if you punch someone in the head enough to actually knock them over there is a very real chance of doing lasting damage.
This isnt the movies where you hit someone and they spring back up after a 15 second nap.
Pretend what?
Care to list a violent offence this cunt hasnt perpetrated on society? rob a bank? no not yet. But still he is only 21.
Don’t you mean ‘eugenics’, Felix?
I’m always reminded of the Sopranos episode ‘Boca’ in these debates. Where Tony has to be reminded that Coach Hauser’s offending isn’t all about him. It’s just unfortunate that our resident wingnuts don’t even have the minimal understanding that a fictional mafioso can muster.
Here’s big tough DavidC to call everyone names though.
David C: I know this is hard for you to follow, but you either said or implied that CV was unsympathetic to an imaginary child with brain damage only because it wasn’t his child.
I was simply pointing out that it’s far more likely that CV’s lack of sympathy for the brain-damaged child stems from the fact that he didn’t know you were imagining one.
TheContrarian: No, I’m pretty sure Blue said “genetics” before disappearing in a cloud of sense-of-humour.
Felix..
CV said not 14 yrs but 2.
I questioned his imaginary piety it it were his child that had been beaten down and damaged by this person that you want to walk free.
Who said he should walk free? Are you lashing out because it’s been pointed out to you that you support policies which increase crime rates? Get over it.
O.A.K
Its pretty hard for scum like Whaanga to cause more crime while his is locked up. (other than crime on other crims of course)
Care to explaim how he can beat CVs kids up while behid bars?
Care to acknowledge that “get tough” policies create more crime? Care to address the way increased economic inequality leads to a rise in violence? Or are you still jerking off over your wet-dreams of vengeance?
Ah, so David means to lock him up forever. Why didn’t he say so?
And presumably he doesn’t just mean this one guy – cos that’d be really dumb, basing all this on one guy – so I guess we’re going to need a hell of a lot more prisons.
ps David, thanks for admitting (9:39) that it was all in your head.
True.
But if everybody who punched other people in the head more than once got a three strikes warning, the prisons would overflow (and mcvictim would get a pay bonus, if you believe the SS funding theories).
This guy isn’t a serial rapist or murderer. He’s a dumb kid who likely needs psych care rather than prison. And more importantly, the longer we ignore the poverty and social neglect large sectors of this country face, the more dumb kids in need will be wandering the streets, alienated and unemployable.
But that’s a bit sophisticated for folk who can only understand issues around criminal justice by way of american sporting analogies.
“I’d argue that punching someone MULTIPLE times in the head before taking their money is pretty despicable.”
so would i – but one of these strikes appears to be because he kicked someone in the back of the leg
dont get me wrong here, i hate theives, and ive been burgled, assaulted and mugged before. But i dont think its up there with the graham bells and tony dicksons of this world.
sure we need to do something, but is jumping straight to full volume actually solving anything in the long term? Couldnt we get a better, long term result here?
“sure we need to do something, but is jumping straight to full volume actually solving anything in the long term? Couldnt we get a better, long term result here?”
For example?
I’m not trolling or attacking your statement, I’d just like to hear some ideas….
I’d just like to hear some ideas…
Yeah right. The right-wing reaction to Blameless Babes says different.
Reason and wingnut sentencing policy said goodbye long ago.
Case response: throw social workers at him, rather than other more practised criminals. Restorative justice meetings. Supervision.
Strategic prevention:
Boost resources to health (including/especially mental health), social welfare and education. Cheaper than prisons.
do i need to give you an example for you to evaluate the question?
“is jumping straight to full volume actually solving anything in the long term?”
Saccharomyces, you can understand the undigested grains and cellulose in this piece of shit as much as you like, it’ll still be a piece of shit.
It removes judicial discretion, and is therefore an attack upon society, and represents yet another example of how low intelligence is a gateway to conservatism.
This little shit wandering around beating people up and stealing their stuff is the attack upon society.
His behaviour is a symptom. Low quality right-wing penal, economic and social policy is the disease.
His offending goes back to when there was a left-wing government was in power, so was it their policies that were the disease?
The fifth Labour government reduced inequality but nowhere nearly enough: without the benign effects of the introduction of lead-free petrol I expect things would be much worse.
Get a clue about penal policy. Our recidivism rate is over 50%. Norway’s is around 20%. Did they achieve that with “get tough” policies? Of course they did, and then you woke up.
50% recidivism means that people like you and Graham Capill have caused more crime with your witless vandalism. Own it.
“people like you and Graham Capill”
Classy, reeeeal classy.
I’m referring to his advocacy for tougher sentencing policy that resulted in the 1999 referendum, and yes, if I were keeping that kind of company I’d reassess my opinions.
Sure you were, dear, sure you were.
😆 ok ok it’s a fair cop guvnor.
Leaving aside the Capillesque nature of “get tough” policies, they’ve failed. It’s time to do something that actually reduces recidivism.
@Saccharomyces
Do you understand the three strikes law? All it means is that IF Mr Whaanga commits another of the crimes under the three strikes law he will receive the maximum sentence applicable for the crime, no parole.
That’s for the second strike. The third strike means, as the judge said, he will go away for 14 years no parole.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/8569913/Your-kid-could-be-killed-next-dad-says
Meanwhile this timebomb will be released in a few short weeks and will very likely kill again. At the very least anyone who looks at him sideways will get hammered. He is a chronic violent alcoholic and is basically illiterate. He refused all rehab and education opportunities inside, yet still gets parole?
I know a victim of this criminal very well. The guy is currently living in fear of this violent thug’s release. Real tangible fear that this maniac will discover where he moved to and succeed in his promise to finish him off. The really crazy part with this law is that despite the decades of relentless offending, another death would only qualify as his first strike.
Sentencing is only a part of the justice problems facing NZ.
The idiot Right Wingers will celebrate when this young guy gets put away for 14 years for his next petty crime.
Until he comes out of prison having become a hardened, criminally well connected inmate in his 30’s, turning up on a street near you.
Boy this country just has no idea on crime and punishment, and both National and Labour are responsible.
No I think the victims of his crimes might celebrate. You do remember them don’t you?
You fucking worm, using crime victims to peddle your disgusting hateful shite.
Not at all. I would have thought that you would have considered them as a matter of human decency, but no, you clearly don’t care. The victim to you is clearly the criminal. Stop being hysterical and pull your head out of your arse.
What part of my concern for our 50% recidivism rate are you having trouble with, you tiresome cretin?
The fact that you show more concern for the recidivism rate than the victims. Thought that was clear, you terminally unemployable dullard.
Hey shit for brains
OAK is concerned about a high recidivism rate in part because a high recidivism rate by definition creates a lot of new, avoidable victims. Lower the recidivism rate, avoid creating new crimes and new victims.
Meanwhile you are busy looking in the rear view mirror at yesterday’s victims while you continue driving ahead with a system ploughing through more new ones.
You really haven’t thought this through, have you, “dullard”.
Much laughter
“Unemployable”? I must see that my employer and clients get the memo.
Wanting fewer victims ≠ no concern for victims. I should have thought that was obvious, but I guess I just over-estimated your ability. English comprehension 101, perhaps?
PS: Oh, and while I’m on the subject, my concern for the victims is what generates my contempt for your use of them as crime porn, Blue.
Forgotten to take your anger management medication again Knucklehead?
1. Lose the argument.
2. Attack the messenger.
3. Pretend (1) never happened.
Aren’t you all assuming he hasn’t already had (repeatedly) social workers, social agencies, youth workers ” thrown at him” ad nauseum up to this point? I think it can be reasonably assumed he has, to no effect. Getting upset about a serialviolent offender and thief , who also enjoys indecently assaulting people, is just being precious for the sake if it
Capital punishment. Why not line him up against the wall and shoot him then.
Oh for goodness sake stop being hysterical. Why don’t you have him round for tea CV ? You clearly think he’s a lovely misunderstood boy. If he misbehaves you can talk him through his problems.
Why don’t you have me ’round for tea and we can have a civilised discussion about Mr. Strawman and why you don’t seem to be able to construct an argument without his help.
No thanks
Yeah, that’s what I figured.
What. You were serious? FFS how lonely are you ?
Serious? On the contrary, I was illustrating how utterly moronic your response to CV is.
He swings aaaaaaaand he misses.
Drop the 3rd person stuff mate, it’s not you.
Blue, in your mind it’s all about this one offender. In reality we’re discussing judicial independence and the long-established separation of powers. Can you see the difference?
Judicial independence is a crock, why do you think there is mandatory life sentence for murder ? It is a deterrent, you’re clearly getting confused, but Ill explain it to you. If … he… doesn’t …assault….rob….or sexually assault ….any ….innocent people he will stay …out…..of …jail. Do you believe this idiot should have 2,3,10 more opportunities to prey on the public? What number of chances did you have in mind ?
“Judicial independence is a crock”.
Paging Dr. Dunning-Kruger. It’s nice of you to attempt a substantive argument, sweety, but I think you may need to expand on it a little.
So unlimited chances then? Ok
No. You need to read what I wrote and respond to that, as opposed to constructing cretinous strawmen.
I asked you how many chances and you did not respond. How many chances should criminals get for repeating the same crime before getting the maximum sentence?
One more time. Ju. Di. Ci. Al. In. De. Pen. Dence.
I want you to lift your game, get out of the gutter, so I’m not answering your bullshit leading questions, I’m not in the slightest bit interested in your false frames and ridiculous strawmen.
They stupidise the discussion, but thanks all the same.
Hilarious
Feeble; mired in ignorance.
No it’s not. At least, not an effective one.
How do you know it’s not effective ? Are you using this horrible boy as an example ? He has been warned now, if he ignores the warning that is a choice he has made. I imagine most people would agree that the removal of a criminal who violently preys on innocent people and clearly doesn’t care about the harm he does, would benefit society.
How do we know it’s ineffective? Research, my dear fellow: too many examples of reduced sentences and reduced crime going hand-in-hand.
In other words, we checked your ideas against reality and there’s no correlation between the two.
maybe if the USA chucked another million black people into prison, black people would finally get the idea of deterrence?
CV, to some people there is no deterrent so all that can be done is put them where they cannot maim more of civil society.
Even if that were true, it doesn’t apply to a punk who steals skateboards.
you think this is about a skateboard?
Its about this persons lack of abilty to control himself.
How many offences on women or offences of violence do you need to rack up before a shit head like you McFlock says that this piece of flotsam should not be walking free.
Obviously you want him to rape and murder someone first huh?
Or just kill a child? most of his offences are against young people. brave bastard that he is.. Tag teaming against young weak oppisition.
drop him is a deep dark hole forever.
Who said a Judge shouldn’t send him to jail?
And if you know exactly what he has done, why were you asking for a list of his convictions?
And why can’t you argue this rationally rather than just ranting like the sort of loon we invented courts to protect our society from?
Questions abound.
he has offences for violence and indecent assult. He has 5 strike offences which is quite an amazing feat given he is 21 and spent 2 years inside.
70 isnt enouf.? Is 100 the number? 150? 500?
Nah you’re asking the wrong question so no number will be correct.
The moment you chuck a young person in a prison for the first time, chances are you’ve fucked them permanently and made them into a multi-million dollar repeating over a lifetime guest of her Royal Majesty.
You’ve been kinda clear on the loony ranting part David, it was the other parts I was seeking info on, thanks.
Nice illustration.
You are quick to get aggravated, lack any ability to look beneath the surface of the situation, and immediately leap at the solution of getting medieval on a yoof.
I suggest that with a couple of lucky tweaks to life story you and he are largely interchangeable.
Maybe tories should be given three nact votes then mandatory imprisonment. /sarc
yoof? he is 21 years old.
Yeah lucky tweaks.. I have self control.
He is a rare beast. 1 in 300,000.
A deep hole is probably too good.
[lprent: As an observation after reading your comments tonight. There is little evidence on this site that you have much self-control. You certainly don’t appear to think before writing. ]
If we dropped you in a deep hole would you come back with enough brain cells to muster an argument that can pass a basic reality test?
You knew it all by 21, eh.
18-20 is the peak of at risk behaviour, not the tail end. For that you need to go for 25 or even 30 year olds.
The fact is that this guy has greater chance of not reoffending if he stays in the community with social workers and education, rather than making his peer group consist entirely of criminals.
Where did you get 1:300k, by the way?
O.A.K
Here is a question for yhou..What would you do for this dear soul that hasnt already been done to stop his assault on society.
Do enlighten us you crim cuddling fuckwit.
Answer: your question is self-serving and irrelevant, and since you obviously lack the cognitive capacity to recognise the multitude of approaches I have referenced this evening, what is the point of repeating them?
“What would you do for this dear sould that hasnt already been done”
Still pretending you know anything about what’s “already been done” in this particular instance I see. And still pretending it’s relevant.
In short. You want to suck his cock and beg him to not beat you down afterward. You are at least his equal.
Imagine whatever you like; it’s your wet-dream, not mine.
David’s fantasies might seem a little odd, but at least now he’s just imagining a consensual cock suck.
Before it was all brain-damaged children. That was weird.
I like the one where David gets to be the executioner, and we let him choose his own methods, but the leaky roof on the Deth-O-Matic shorts out the circuits and InspectiCorp turns out to have been subcontracting the job to HireACrim, so everyone escapes.
Why is it that scratching the surface of a “tough on crime” tory almost always reveals some hyper-sexualised obsession?
They do know that “penal” doesn’t always refer to willies, right ?
Wasn’t DavidC recently talking about people who just can’t control themselves 😈
I have self control.
How, revealing.
David C
Its about this persons lack of abilty to control himself….
..rack up before a shit head like you McFlock says that this piece of flotsam should not be walking free.
Your choice of description of those opposing you shows your lack of ability to control yourself, potty mouth.
I didn’t realise those cops down in the BOP had been thieves as well. I only knew about the serial violent offending, indecent assaults, and rape. What sort of sentence did you think was appropriate for them?
Life
Next question. Why wasn’t a huge fuss made in favour of life sentences in those cases?
I don’t know, do you? Perhaps you should direct your questions to the judge in the case. You asked what I thought was appropriate for those filthy rapists and I told you. Violent sexual offenders are on the bottom of the humanity heap as far as I’m concerned. It was a long time ago and I can’t recall the sentences, but I’ve given you my view.
Whereas depriving kids families of income and warmth is OK
No it’s not
A clear majority of serious violent criminals come from highly troubled, unstable and poverty affected homes.
Sort that out, you won’t need your gulags at the bottom of the cliff.
The judge didn’t make a huge fuss. Neither did Garth McVicar, nor any of the usual suspects.
On the one hand, we have a young guy who’s got real problems and insists on making them other people’s as well. He comes from the bottom of society. Heaps of people want him locked up forever, or maybe a bit longer.
On the other, we have members of the establishment, the iron fist in the not so velvet glove, who abuse their positions to rape almost with impunity. They were given enormous powers by the state and used these to commit the most atrocious crimes. Even the PM at the time was unable to do much to change prevailing attitudes.
Why the difference? I’d say institutionalised racism explains it pretty well.
“Aren’t you all assuming he hasn’t already had (repeatedly) social workers, social agencies, youth workers ” thrown at him” ad nauseum up to this point? I think it can be reasonably assumed he has, to no effect. “
I don’t see how that can be reasonably assumed at all. Especially if you’re not willing to lay out the reasoning.
It is reasonable to assume that a chap with a long history of offending has been offered and directed to rehabilitation more than once. Are you saying that he has received no rehabilitation, social worker intervention in his time in the system ? It is not reasonable or logical to suggest otherwise. I’m struggling to see why you defend someone who preys on the public.
There’s your problem, you see: you have somehow formed the stupid idea that we are defending this individual, when what we’re defending is judicial independence. Can you see the difference between a basic tenet of law that goes back at least to the Magna Carta, and a person?
Are you suggesting that laws should not be changed in response to changes in society
, to changes in the type and severity of crimes being commited or to the prevalence of repeat offenders? There is also the reducing level of tolerence of criminals to account for. Three occasions committing the same crime means you’re either an unbelievable cretin or a psychopath. Rather than waxing lyrical about the poor souls, what is your solution to these criminals?
Solutions? Simple: look at other countries to see who has the lowest recidivism rates (50% of our crims re-offend) and do what they do.
Of course laws change, but judicial independence isn’t a law, it’s a necessity. Public opinion-based “justice”? Not so much.
That’s not a solution that’s pointing and saying “look what they did” ( because I’m out of ideas).
*laugh*
because three strikes isn’t exactly an example of ACT seeing a US policy and having a wank into a sock about it.
Like all their other policies.
Yep good call, I never said the idea was an original
And you forgot to check its utter failure to produce results too.
Results? Who said anything about stinking results?
This is about gratification.
Bored now my dear lefties. Have to go and oil my capitalist machine with my staffs blood, eat some puppies and close down an orphanage. Ciao.;)
Thanks, it’s been tiresome and underwhelming; a valuable test of our patience.
The cure is a sense of humour.
Yes, laughter is a great aid to patience.
The judiciary are a part of the well-heeled power elite of this country, well connected to the business and political brokers. They generally live lives somewhat isolated from the economic and social realities for a great part of our society. We should be careful that they equally do not simply assume to impose judge law with primary concern a repeat offender’s liberty to further offend without ramification. The sentencing changes were made in response to public concern about repeat offenders re-offending too often. I didn’t mind the three-strikes law when I saw the list of offences. I think judges were too bad at picking which offenders should not be released on bail too often. I don’t mind three strikes being applied in this case. I would hope it is applied equally to any offender of similar background regardless of race or station. But I support it only because it removes an immediate problem from the streets. It’s a screaming shame & indictment that there are no alternatives, and nothing in the way of useful intervention in prison.
The sentencing changes were made in response to public concern about repeat offenders re-offending too often.
1.Says who? Citation needed.
2. If recidivism were the problem, why implement policy that makes it worse?
The policy was made in response to deliberate demagoguery and atrocious media ethics.
I seem to recall that the party promoting ‘three strikes’ got fuck all votes, and exactly one MP, and he only got there because he had a cup of tea with the PM.
1. Says who? My opinion only – but based on following media and public commentary at the time the legislation was introduced and passed. The 1999 CIR, even though it was appallingly worded, got a 91% yes vote for stronger penalties and better victim support from NZers.
2. If recidivism were the problem, why implement policy that makes it worse? I’m not convinced that it’ll necessarily make it worse, and not in this offender’s case. Seems to me he stands a good chance of getting worse left free to roam on his own initiative anyway.
Well the important point about this case is that his record of 70+ offences is not in any way relevant to his sentencing. I agree that it ought to be.
But the only offences that are relevant to his sentencing are the strikes. And they would be just as relevant, and in the same way, if those strike offences were the only ones he had.
So his record is just a big old red herring, actually.
I’m not convinced…
Clearly. Confused would be a better description. I expect it’s because you’ve been letting Garth McVicar do your “thinking” for you.
Well, no, Garth could be wrong. Or right in some cases. So could you. What’s your alternative solution to prevent this young man reoffending and anyone else becoming a victim, from the available alternatives at the moment?
Oh for fuck’s sake! Are you incapable of reading the thread, the links provided therein? In the context of judicial independence what possible Earthly relevance is my opinion of the appropriate sentence for this individual?
Like Tony Soprano, I have come to realise that crime isn’t all about me and my teenaged vigilante fantasies. Can you please make an attempt to grasp that?
“What’s your alternative solution…”
Sorry, I don’t follow. Has there been something proposed that might stop him reoffending?
All I’ve seen is calls for him to be locked up, which demonstrably fails in that respect.
Well if he’s locked up it stops the offending for now. Judicial independence is never unconstrained.
Ah sorry, I had thought you might be unaware of the facts.
I didn’t realise you’d actually made a conscious decision to ignore all the available evidence, all of which tells us that your approach increases recidivism
My bad.
When we consider penal policy, or social, financial or anything else, considering them solely on their effect on one person is very misleading. It’s easy to lock this guy up, or even torture him to death. Sure, he wouldn’t reoffend, but plenty of others would take his place. Concentrating on one person just makes more of the victims that McVicar pretends to support.
Exactly the same thing happens with unemployment – Paula Bennett can always take one beneficiary and get them a job. She can’t get jobs for 200,000, so instead she wants to belittle and punish them.
These are not individual problems – they are systemic to society, even if they impact at the individual level. The answers must be found at the societal level, but those who don’t believe in society are left with their creepy prison rape fantasies. We cannot let them win.
“These are not individual problems – they are systemic to society, even if they impact at the individual level. ”
Come on Murray, you know these people with the rape fantasies want no money spent on ensuring kids from dysfunctional homes have absolutely no support from society to improve their health, education and living conditions – parental responsibility and all that – yet when these kids grow up and violently offend, as some are bound to do, they quite forget they were willing to leave them in the mire and are eager as hell to spend the taxpayer dollar on their prison homes.
Apart from the fact that harsh punishment policies never seem to work and are often promoted by the likes of Cappill, I support equal treatment under the law for all. As it is, it’s full on racism which begins when the Police decide to have a look at someone and doesn’t stop until the brown guy is in prison and Garth McVicar has inadvertently left another stain in his leather knickers.
When a white guy is as likely to be stopped by the police, then arrested, then charged, then convicted, then imprisoned, as a young Maori, then and only then will I discuss sentencing. Until that day, I have as much interest in discussing the details of a racist system of oppression as I have in discussing recipes for whale meat.
Saw an excellent film that looks at the drug war in America and makes a link with the private prison industry there. It’s called ” The House I live in’ directed by Eugene Jarecki. Shows what happens when there is a financial motive behind locking people up.
This.
http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/NewJim
Michelle Alexander talked about her book, The New Jim Crow: Mass Incarceration in the Age of Colorblindness, in which she argues that the “get tough on crime” policies that began in the early 1970s were enacted in an effort to push back the gains of the Civil Rights Movement.
http://newjimcrow.com/
I notice that this young law-breaker is in Hastings. I seem to remember that all the judiciary in the wider area have adopted a get tough policy and are setting their own precedents for crimes with the result of escalating the punitive options.
What a cluster fuck. Wore me out reading all this garbage. Interesting to see peoples real views come out in this thread.
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The road ahead for Aotearoa . . .