Open mike 02/03/2014

Written By: - Date published: 6:54 am, March 2nd, 2014 - 79 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

openmike Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

79 comments on “Open mike 02/03/2014”

  1. Paul 1

    Today, the Herald online continues its daily promotion of a party getting 0% in the opinion polls.
    Does Alan Gibbs sponsor the Herald?

    • Paul 1.1

      And stories of celebrity and entertainment Hosking, Dawson) yet at the time of typing no mention of the Ukraine.
      This is a gossip mag not a paper.
      Biased to the extreme right and attempting to divert the populace with inconsequential celebrity stories.

      • wyndham 1.1.1

        You are right, Paul. But good editors know what sells newspapers (as the old saying goes) and a glance at that “Most Read” column over on the right hand side will show you the truth of that aphorism. It is comprised almost always of 1.Sport 2.Sex 3.Celebrity gossip.

        Unless that column is fictitious and part of an evil plan to divert people from real news, then here is a graphic illustration of how little most people care about more serious issues.

        • Paul 1.1.1.1

          Stories given the greater prominence get read the most.
          Feed people a diet of celebrity nonsense and that’s what is expected.

          • Molly 1.1.1.1.1

            I agree – it’s a self-fulfilling promotion – Most Read.

            It would be interesting to artificially post more weighty issues in that column, and see what happens.

        • Paul 1.1.1.2

          You might want to consider these words of George Carlin
          The real owners of this country “don’t want a population of citizens capable of critical thinking. They don’t want well-informed, well-educated people capable of critical thinking. They’re not interested in that. That doesn’t help them. That’s against their interests.”

          • Chooky 1.1.1.2.1

            +100…critical thinkers…even although sometimes they may get the wrong end of the stick….are crucial to a democracy…and should never be silenced.

            …the oligarchy want a compliant population, especially a compliant working class….who are easily duped….out of their rights as equal citizens…they come down particularly hard on the underclass and women who dare to speak out and question their power and control over their lives and that of their children….because they want to make money out of them and keep them as an underclass…their profits depend on this

            ( that is my political statement for the day …lol..now for some work for this peasant..)

            • Tigger 1.1.1.2.1.1

              Gibbs’ comment in that piece is classic ACT:

              “We in our arrogance or stupidity have … obsessively ignored it – we say the state must run the schools.

              “What is this crazy fixation, love affair, with the the state running things?”

              Worshipping on the altar of the corporate god, that psychotic deity that only acts in its own interest.

            • Draco T Bastard 1.1.1.2.1.2

              +1111

          • swordfish 1.1.1.2.2

            George Carlin….http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rsL6mKxtOlQ (and, yes, he’s not only talking about the Tweedledum Republicans in his final comments but also the Tweedledee Democrat leadership).

  2. Molly 2

    Been directed by someone I’ve just got acquainted with to the story of Marinaleda, a “… social-democratic and cooperative municipality of 2,700 people…” that was established in 1981.

    A fairly recent ( 20/10/2103) Guardian article states that ..“… In spring 2013 unemployment in Andalusia is a staggering 36%; for those aged 16 to 24, the figure is above 55% – figures worse even than the egregious national average…” yet the collective ensures that everyone is employed.

    Not only that but “… The town co-operative does not distribute profits: any surplus is reinvested to create more jobs. Everyone in the co-op earns the same salary, €47 (£40) a day for six and a half hours of work: it may not sound like a lot, but it’s more than double the Spanish minimum wage.”.

    I think I’m going to have to buy the book.

  3. Jenny 3

    In 1939 most people in Britain would have had trouble pointing to Poland on a map.

    War was the last thing on their mind, recovery from the Great Depression the economy, and jobs, were the big issues, nobody wanted to hear about the threat of fascism and the events in Europe. With the Great war barely more than twenty years earlier the last thing Britians wanted was talk of war.

    But one MP dared to go against the trend.

    In New Zealand today in all commentators dismiss climate change as a non-issue. Despite being an existential issue like no other, in my opinion a greater threat to civilisation even than the threat of fascism, climate change appears in no polls as a major issue of concern or as an issue that this election will be fought over. Despite the government’s woeful response to climate change, a matter on which they could really take some big hits, climate change is resolutely ignored as an leading election issue by all the main parties.

    It has been my contention that leadership on this issue is what is missing.

    Witness how Shane Jones can turn Countdown’s buying arrangement’s into a major national issue.

    We desperately need this sort of lead this sort of leadership over climate change. In the face of this crisis both major parties and even the Greens seem determined to continue political business as usual

    But while the Churchillian type leadership that alerted Britain and the world to the danger of fascism is currently missing in New Zealand

    It seems the Churchill spirit is alive and well in Montana

    “Coal is Dead”

    “Coal is no longer viable as a long term source of energy, or a reliable source of jobs in Montana … The 700 million tons of coal in Montana will be left in the ground … We must both mitigate climate disruption and build new infrastructure.”

    Dirk Adams educator, banker, rancher, and Democratic Candidate for the Montana Senate

    Even the unions, the state’s AFL-CIO leader said he appreciated what Adams says about coal “because the guys need to hear that.”.
    (This is the sort of leadership on coal that we need to hear from union leader Helen Kelly)

    Dirk Adams said he talks about climate change “in every conversation” with voters. “It’s one of my two campaign points. I talk about women’s issues and I talk about the environment and climate change.”

    Dirk Adams honesty about climate change is a risky strategy:

    Out of the 26 coal producing states in the U.S., Montana ranks 8th, with production last year totaling more than 36 million tons from six mines. While employment, around 1,200, is not that significant compared to other industries, a proposed new mine in southeast Montana would more than double total employment to about 2,900.

    Since 2009, Montana coal exports abroad have grown six-fold to 13 million tons. The state receives about $48 million in coal royalties.

    Whether Adam’s leadership on climate change will be appreciated by voters won’t be known until the election in June.

    Without Dirk Adam raising it, like New Zealand climate change is pretty much a non-issue, and low ranked in Monatans list of concerns.

    A 2012 poll showed that a majority of Montana voters favoured relaxing environmental laws to allow more coal and gas developments. And another poll showed that almost 50% felt that concerns about global warming had been exaggerated and more research was needed before they would support action to combat it.

    But Adams claims this is a plus:

    “People understand that politicians who speak the truth are a value, and by and large in the Democratic primary, voters understand,”…
    “It will probably hurt with some of the union guys, but it’s important to tell people the truth …

    “I will not be dishonest about this for political gain. Lying isn’t going to help those [coal industry] workers. Instead, I have a plan for retraining and job growth. I’m going to serve the impacted citizens by dealing with reality, rather than serving myself by hustling concerned workers for votes with promises no candidate will keep.”

    Dirk Adams educator, banker, rancher, and Democratic Candidate for the Montana Senate

    Source: Climate Progress

    • Draco T Bastard 3.1

      War was the last thing on their mind, recovery from the Great Depression the economy, and jobs, were the big issues, nobody wanted to hear about the threat of fascism and the events in Europe. With the Great war barely more than twenty years earlier the last thing Britians wanted was talk of war.

      War may have been the last thing that they wanted but most of them knew it was coming.

      Despite being an existential issue like no other, in my opinion a greater threat to civilisation even than the threat of fascism

      I’m of the opinion that the two are intertwined. The more fascism that we get, the more climate change denial.

  4. bad12 4

    So the imported train set is now said to have Asbestos in the locomotives along with the alleged faulty copy/fraud wheel-bearings,

    Wonder who pays to remedy all these faults as they become identified, the manufacturers or the taxpayer, along with the cost as up to half the fleet will have to be removed from service for what is going to be a hell of a job removing the Asbestos as it is said to be in the paint,

    We could i suppose beef up employment in the railway workshop to get the job done a lot quicker, except for the fact that Slippery’s National Government have decided having workshops capable of carrying out major work on our trains is a luxury so closed them,

    Imported train sets with major manufacturing faults occurring too frequently to enable the Railway to run a proper service would seem a luxury that we cannot afford…

    • Herodotus 4.1

      We want low inflation and to allow our limited wages to ” go further”
      The consequence is transferring poor wages, working conditions & poor environment outcomes off shore, conditions that would not be tolerated or allowed to operate within NZ.
      but out of sight out of mind. Eg the ferries being built in Bangladesh , manning our fishing fleet with cheep labour. China trains, allowing people to work within NZ for low wages.

    • PapaMike 4.2

      The Trains are under full Guarantee by the Chinese Manufacturer.

  5. here ya go..!

    ..kick off yr day with some vid of springsteen doing royals..

    ..in that stadium..

    ..in the third best city in the world to live in..

    ..last nite..

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/03/01/springsteen-royals-bruce-lorde-video-cover_n_4880871.html

    phillip ure..

  6. Jim Nald 6

    Fantastic piece by Matt McCarten!

    And great stuff giving it directly, honestly and fearlessly:

    “I’m bemused that the Prime Minister calls my appointment in a non-policy-making role a lurch to the left. Some in the unthinking media joined in about my public positions. When did it become so outrageous to call for the hourly minimum wage to be raised to $15, or argue that the breadwinners of a family deserve a living wage for a decent day’s work? When does affordable housing for all, a decent job and support for families to support children get a good start in life become so unreasonable?”

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11212265

    That makes me love da man. Will miss him on Herald on Sunday but darn keen to walk alongside him and Cunliffe to win the 2014 General Election.

    • ianmac 6.1

      Sadly, once Matt settles into his job behind the scenes, little will be heard from him. Will miss him. A great advocate.

      • Jim Nald 6.1.1

        Agree that “once Matt settles into his job behind the scenes, little will be heard directly via H.O.S. from him”.

        And take heart that we will hear his voice and messages in many other ways. 🙂

    • Hayden 6.2

      Is it just me, or does Matt McCarten’s photo on the Herald look like it’s been lightened somewhat?

      • Jim Nald 6.2.1

        Hmm. Interesting. I wondered if it was my screen, with new look browser, operating system installed, etc on my reformatted hard drive after a trojan attack.

        • Danske 6.2.1.1

          Mr Mccarten photograph should be given the darker hue of red treatment. In fact, Leninist red will suit him perfectly.

    • freedom 6.3

      “Of course, it isn’t appropriate for me to write a column when I officially nail my colours to the fortunes of one political party. ”

      Wonder if John Armstrong reads that bit
      and feels just a little queasy when he next presses the publish button

      • rhinocrates 6.3.1

        Akshullee, I use Armstrong as an example in my writing classes of how not to write. His tendentious, simpering gibberish devoid of anything resembling structure is a perfect storm of bad writing.

  7. freedom 7

    http://rt.com/usa/low-corporate-tax-rates-275/

    What is our PM calls it?
    “legitimate Tax avoidance”

    Why use so many syllables?
    Theft rolls of the tongue a lot easier.

  8. freedom 8

    (a repeat posting from yesterday because I feel it is an image that should be shared and a message that should be heeded)

    Of late, I have been mulling on what past generations, if they could, might want to say to us today.
    I think this message would be a fair summation.

    p.s.
    for the train spotters of NZ politics, I took some artistic license within the image, four times actually 🙂

    choccy fish for anyone who names all four pole bearers 🙂

    • greywarbler 8.1

      No choccy fish for me. But I notice how many women are there dotted thickly through the taller men and their hats. A very well dressed serious group of people, and with watchers at the side who had climbed on verandah roofs.

    • JK 8.2

      Can I have a quarter of the choccy fish please ? I think I spotted Mickey Savage

      • freedom 8.2.1

        a strong start out of the box for JK, well done

        now for the more challenging faces

        hint: all of the era

        and in case you don’t recognise the original image,

        it is not thousands celebrating a rugby match
        it was Election night 1931

  9. Morrissey 9

    I’VE BEEN THINKING
    by JAMIE WHYTE

    Thought No. 1: INCEST. Good idea. Why not?

    Coming up soon: My thoughts on identity theft.

    END OF PRESS RELEASE

    Jamie Whyte is ACT’s exciting new leader. If you are a National voter in Epsom, you are instructed to vote for him.

    “When you have got a great product but a terrible image, you have to rebrand, refresh and start again.”—Richard Prebble

    • Lanthanide 9.1

      Why would a voter in Epsom vote for Jamie Whyte when he isn’t standing in Epsom? Their candidate will be that Seymour clown.

      • freedom 9.1.1

        I imagine Morrisey meant when instructed to vote for ACT you are instructed to vote for its leader blah blah

        National ran a whole campaign like that last time remember

        “I am a Key person !”

      • Hami Shearlie 9.1.2

        Don’t think he’s called Seymour because Epsomites will want to “see more” of him – A very strange little fellow, surrounded by many more strange little fellows in Act – including Alan Gibbs who wants all roads, hospitals and schools privatised, he’ll want the air we breathe privatised next!. This incest stuff sure does seem to turn up some odd little spawn doesn’t it?

      • ianmac 9.1.3

        According to Jamie they expect to get numerous MPs in and isn’t he number 2 on the List?

    • Aww 9.2

      I think it is a very smart strategy. That way all the abusers not currently in prison will vote Act. This may take them over 1%, and if they’re lucky will build the party base.

      Just remember not to let the kids out if the Act conference is in town.

    • felix 9.3

      LOL Morrissey. Good summation.

  10. Tim 11

    There ya go @ PU:
    Wayne Brittendon’s Counterpoint of Wealth Addiction – you and I could both reinvent ourselves as counsellors.
    Whoar! – money to be made eh? AND a growth industry. I reckon it’d take off. It could become the new Betty Ford Clinic.
    I’ll take care of the truly pathetic (the Rik Pebbles, the Lamb-burgers, the Whytes et al – I’ll just recycle them – as in Soylent Green – they’ll make OK fertiliser)). You can have the cushy numbers.

  11. tricledrown 12

    Jamie Whyte is Ok with polygamy as well I suppose he is trying to get the exclusive bretheren ,Mormon and Muslim vote as well.

  12. tricledrown 13

    Jenny Apple CEO lambasts climate change deniers.
    That sums up NZ National ACT UF govts 18th century approach to running our economy.
    While Apple have just bought the tesla electric car company and gone into partnership with panasonic to make lithium batteries.
    Meantime Key and cronies are stuck down a coal mine.
    Another failed policy from short sighted greedy dumarses.

  13. aerobubble 14

    Ukraine. So let’s see, a bunch of ethnic Russians who are members of a provincial Ukrainian parliament decide it would be better to be yet another province of Russia.

    Now I don’t get that. Why would anyone give up the power to Putin when they themselves have far more power holding Ukraine to ransom. Become just another province in Putins empire.

    Is this why Putin is precipitously sending troops over, because every Russia is not necessarily a fan of Putin.

    Remember the Russians there want autonomy, not to become part if greater Russia. And Putin wants at-least a navy base, but will take more if the local Russians give to him.

  14. greywarbler 15

    John Pilger has revisited the question of Australian aborigines position in that society,.
    He made a doco some years ago and now another called Utopia. And is saddened at how little is changed. There are a few high profile successes but so many are unable to meet their own needs, and the government action often ends with negative consequences. There are millions of dollars allocated to helping aborigines. Which has been spent on bureaucracy and with some large amounts on computer technology that is useless. So the players have got most of the benefits, the supposed recipients just get pennies and prejudice. Pennies from heaven indeed.

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/sunday
    John Pilger on Utopia  21′ 36″ 
    9:40 Journalist and documentary maker John Pilger on Utopia
    Thirty years ago, investigative journalist John Pilger exposed the plight of
    Indigenous Australians in his landmark documentary ‘The Secret Country.’
    The documentary exposed the shameful treatment Aboriginals received at the hands of successive governments and exposed a darker side of the so-called lucky country. Now, John Pilger has returned to the subject in his new documentary ‘Utopia: an Epic Struggle of Resistance’ – but just what has changed in the intervening years?

    And we should look at what Pilger says about the ingrained denial that Oz has about this and realise it can apply to anything else that is an annoying problem. Like us for instance and how we are treated. And the way that they are sucking us dry of money and then treating us as poor relations, which they have caused. It’s a good scam – they won’t change. And we have such credulous politicians n league with businesspeople so venal in their desire to feather their own nests, they will continue and pollies will not jerk on the leash.

    We are being made into a state of Australia with the government matching everything even co-ordinating with Australian law and actions, but we aren’t able to be Australian citizens, not there or here. We should be able to have dual citizenship if we have long enough residence there, jobs, and a reasonable record.

    What we need is people to do a wake up call here. Or we will give us the ‘abo’ treatment. Oa politicians might even give us the soft soap speech sometime, but that won’t bring real action, just wallpaper over any cracks, then on as before.

  15. amirite 16

    What’s with the super rich and their desire to stick it to everyone who is not well off? Is that some kind of mental illness? You’d think all that money would make them happy, but they keep bitching and moaning like they don’t have enough to live on.

    From Alan Gibbs’ latest brainfart:
    “I’d privatise all the schools, all the hospitals and all the roads,” he told the conference. “We’ve had a 20-year siesta so I think Act should get out there and shake the market.”

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11212270

    And an announcement for another round of beneficiary bashing from Whyte. So predictable.

    • felix 16.1

      They’re not interested in having “enough to live on”.

      They want to own everything.

      Including us.

      As serfs.

  16. Tiger Mountain 17

    Having not yet read David Grant’s new “The Mighty Totara: The Life and Times of Norman Kirk” I am at a disadvantage;
    – See more at: http://www.randomhouse.co.nz/books/david-grant/a-mighty-totara-a-life-of-norman-kirk-9781775535799.aspx#sthash.L8usr7yj.dpuf

    And his interview on RNZ Sunday today… http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/sunday/audio/2587522/david-grant-on-norman-kirk; did not instill great hopes for further investigation into Big Norms final hours as alluded to in Margaret Haywood’s “Dairy of the Kirk Years”.

    In todays era of the Five Eyes snooping on any old world leaders private conversations with impunity it is still of interest why Norm Kirk barely two years in office died a lonely death at a base hospital after receiving secretive medical treatment for some time. The suspicion lingers that there was medical misadventure intended or not at the time he and New Zealand were well and truly on the world stage.

  17. Molly 18

    Despite the fact that it is a local government legislation change, and drafted by bureaucrats … somehow it seems that the blame lies with the iwi in this Herald article Maori veto on water.

    … late edit. Just thought to check the name on LinkedIn and Amy Maas is a graduate of Rhodes University. Apologies to all those SA born who don’t have this same bias, but have come across many in NZ that do. Including the SA doctor that asked me if I was their nanny when taking my blonde, blue eyed children to the clinic.

    • JK 18.1

      And to add to Molly’s post – there appears to be no thought as to the source of the bore water these homeowners are using, and whether it is big enough for all their needs into the future. So – of course – there needs to be a review of their use, and a sensible council would have the local hapu or iwi assisting in that review, not all of the supposedly 19 iwi of the whole Auckland City region.
      What is more – Puhoi is rural – so why don’t these people also have rainwater tanks as a matter of course ? This story is more “blame the Maori” than a real look at household water use of an underground bore in a rural area.

      • Visubversaviper 18.1.1

        And the story is just plain wrong. This statement is not the truth – “Under the draft Auckland Unitary Plan, all applicants for resource consent for new or existing developments must apply to iwi for them to assess whether it would have an adverse effect on mana whenua.”

        Most applications do not have to consult with Iwi, only those which are in or within 50m of a site of significance or value, or which involve certain actvities such as taking of water or removal of trees in certain strategic areas.

        It is as bad as the TV1 news on Thursday night saying that Iwi consultation would add $100,000 to the price of a new home. Totally untrue.

    • Murray Olsen 18.2

      The most disgusting thing about that story is how Sealord Jones plays up to the bigots with his talk of taniwha down holes. He must be really proud of arriving near the top of the list for the racists’ favourite mowree. If McCarten can shut him up, or even get him to stick to supermarkets, he needs to do it soon.

  18. i just had to point you all at this..so cool..!

    “..Incredibly dirty R&B: gloriously filthy music from the 50s..”

    “..Best of all – the filth didn’t come just from men.

    There was wonderful Julia Lee –

    • with ‘My Man Stands Out’ –

    ‘I Didn’t Like It the First Time –

    • and ‘Don’t Come Too Soon’.

    The inimitable Helen Humes has a live version of ‘I’m Gonna Let Him Ride’ –

    • that’s as glorious for her singing –
    • as it is for the way the crowd roars her train on..”

    (cont..)

    ..enjoy..!..

    phillip ure..

    http://boingboing.net/2014/03/01/incredibly-dirty-rb-glorious.html

  19. Jepenseque 20

    Shocking lie in The Nation cunliffe interview. DC claimed Mighty River Power and Meridian “are the worst performing shares on the sharemarket”. Which is just a straight out lie. Not a man we want as PM.

    • Colonial Viper 20.1

      The MRP and Meridian shareprices collapsed straight after listing.

      Annualised, the loss to ma and pa investors is huge.

      DC as usual is spot on. No idea what you are on about though.

      • Jepenseque 20.1.1

        Sorry CV with all due respect on this you are willfully ignorant. Meridian is at $1.07, it listed at $1.
        https://www.nzx.com/markets/NZSX/securities/MELCA

        Mighty River Power is down on the list price but there are worse performers on the NZX in the last 12 months (FSF, CNU, DIL etc). Cunliffe just made something up (lied). Its a matter of mathematics unfortunately for him and you.

        • Colonial Viper 20.1.1.1

          How many minutes into the Nation interview is your claim that Cunliffe said what he did?

          I’d like to check out what he actually said for myself, thanks.

          • Jepenseque 20.1.1.1.1

            All good, its right near the end last major topic they discuss? I know what he was trying to get at basically the MRP float has not being very good for investors, but Meridian and Air NZ have been satisfactory performers. But to just make up a stat is lazy at best. There is no need to mislead to make a point. Pols on both sides should do better. Cheers

    • One Anonymous Bloke 20.2

      Definitely a good idea to destroy the share price before the compulsory return of New Zealand’s stolen property.

      Personally I think it’d be better to offer nothing in return when our property is taken back, but I can see the political advantage in pretending to compensate the shareholders rather than overtly punitive action.

      An incentive for Tories to create something for a change, rather than just leeching off the hand that fed them.

  20. tricledrown 21

    Juped en esque
    The list price of Merdian power.
    $1.50
    Now $1.07
    Loss of 43cents
    Nearly 30%

    • Jepenseque 21.1

      Sorry TD you are wrong on this one. Meridian float made up of two payments $1 for an instalment reciepts, 50c later to complete to complete the deal. So the correct comparison is between $1.07 and $1. So it is up 7% or about 21% on an annualised basis (although on a 4 month timeframe anualised measure are a little meaningless). Cheers

      • McFlock 21.1.1

        Um, but to sell the shares and make the 7c profit, you still need to complete the deal by paying the additional 50c? So the cost to you is $1.50?

        Otherwise, I’m not sure how the law feels about folk who sell what they don’t actually own.

        • Jepenseque 21.1.1.1

          Hiya, no if you sell you don’t pay the 50c, the new owner does. Cheers

          • McFlock 21.1.1.1.1

            Ah.
            weird.

          • felix 21.1.1.1.2

            Semantics really.

            In order to sell now, you need to find a buyer willing to pay $1.57 in a market that says they’re only worth $1.07.

            Good luck with that.

            • Murray Olsen 21.1.1.1.2.1

              Sounds like great Tory economics to me. Get the government to sell you something cheap, play games with the price, then sell it on for half as much again as the market says it’s worth.

              Jesus H Christ, we shouldn’t even be thinking of taking these shares back for free. We should nationalise and charge the pricks $1 a share as rent for our property. After all, that’s pretty much what they do with rental housing.

  21. felix 22

    Josie Pagani. The fucking turnip.

    She’s on The Nation yesterday discussing Matt McCarten’s appointment, and she reckons there are two valid strands of left policy, one of looking after working people and one of looking after business and development, and she reckons hiring McCarten shows that Cunliffe is putting all his eggs in the “looking after workers” basket, and that that’s a mistake because Labour’s opponents will call him a leftie.

    And so Ralston says yeah nah actually, he’s employed in a strategic role not a policy role, and it’s actually a pretty smart move getting him in there cos, well, he’s good etc, and so Josie says yeah but PERCEPTION IS EVERYTHING, and the risk now is that his opponents will MISREPRESENT SHIT and deliberately CREATE THE PERCEPTION that he’s leftie.

    ffs Josie, that’s you. You’re you’re the one misrepresenting the situation, and you’re the one saying it’s no good having lefties in the frickin LABOUR party of all places. That makes you the very opponent you were describing.

    Just join National and be done with it you spanner. You nonce. You whispering serpent.

    Video, about 44 mins in: http://www.tv3.co.nz/tabid/3692/MCat/2910/Default.aspx

    • Draco T Bastard 22.1

      Actually, I think both Pagani’s would be better off in United Future as they’re both Sensible Centrists.

    • Puddleglum 22.2

      Well spotted felix.

      You put clearly what I’ve often noticed but not articulated – commentators often talk about ‘how bad this will be perceived’ without noticing their role in forming perceptions.

      Where do they think people get their perceptions from? Don’t they understand that most of these kinds of ‘perceptions’ are largely people trying to find out what everyone else thinks and then falling into line to avoid looking like an outlier?

    • Morrissey 22.3

      My attention has just been drawn, belatedly, to this outstanding post. Congratulations, felix—you’ve summed up the Pagani phenomenon perfectly.

      • Anne 22.3.1

        Thanks Morrissey. I also missed that pearl of felix’s…

        Perfect description of Ms Pagani. She reelly, reelly, reeeeelly likes socialising with celebrity commentators and the ‘perceived’ toffs. Makes her feel like she’s one of them.

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