Open mike 05/03/2014

Written By: - Date published: 6:41 am, March 5th, 2014 - 197 comments
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openmike Open mike is your post.

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Step up to the mike …

197 comments on “Open mike 05/03/2014”

  1. TightyRighty 1

    MickeySavage – you out there? It’s all right, we all understood you never got it. It makes no difference now

  2. North 2

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/9789717/From-SAS-to-court-boss

    ? ? ? ? ? ?

    “Lieutenant Colonel Karl Cummins began his two year deployment to the Ministry of Justice on Monday – ”

    Two years ? ? ? The cult of “the manager”. Myopic madness is what it is. Perhaps we’ll see the next retiring chairman of the Arts Council heading the Army.

  3. North 3

    The whiff of authoritarianism is all about.

    • greywarbler 3.1

      What is the connection between Karl Cummins and finology?
      Q. What the heck is finology?
      A. So while behavioural finance focuses on the relationship between individuals and the performance of markets, finology describes the relationship between financial planning and individuals and money.
      http://omnimax.typepad.com/omnimax/2012/09/what-is-finology.html

      Talk discussed at financial advice site.
      http://www.strategi.co.nz/business-value/the-journey-to-uniqueness
      (Note the name Michael Porter so beloved by our neo libs.)

      The SAS and Michael Porter have the same advice
      The first was from Lieutenant Colonel Karl Cummins, the current commanding officer of the NZSAS. In his address at the 2012 Finology Conference, he made the point that it is not about being the best – it is all about the pursuit of excellence. It is the journey and the striving for excellence that is more important. If you think you are the best then you are on the slippery slope downwards as there is always someone who will be better than you tomorrow.

      He also made the key point that the NZSAS is not about being the same as other units within the Army. The NZSAS is a specialised unit with a well-defined role and well-defined clients. It is not competing with the capabilities of the larger mainstream Army. Because the NZSAS is so focussed and unique, it is in high demand not just in NZ but also around the world. Governments want to trust the best people to do the job which means the SAS is always top of mind.

      • Murray Olsen 3.1.1

        I wonder what the SAS has been in high demand in New Zealand for? The occupation of the Urewera comes to mind, but what else? What are they doing that we don’t know about?

        As for around the world, they’ll go wherever the seppos or their clients in Canberra and London want them. I hate to think what they get up to.

  4. “..Animal protein-rich diets could be as harmful to health – as smoking..”

    “..People under 65 who eat a lot of meat, eggs and dairy –

    are four times as likely to die from cancer or diabetes..”

    http://www.theguardian.com/science/2014/mar/04/animal-protein-diets-smoking-meat-eggs-dairy

    (ed:..and of course..if having a bacon-buttie and a ciggy r yr brekkie..

    ..you are really going for the doctor..eh..?..

    ..and if bacon and eggs..with some grated cheese on top..?..followed by a ciggie..?

    ..is yr poison..?

    ..whoar..!…

    ..eh..?..

    ..that’s called cancer/diabetes doubling-down..

    ..eh..?..)

    phillip ure..

    • bad12 4.1

      Nearly as bad as pinging the chemical cocktail known as Heroin up your arm i would suggest…

      • phillip ure 4.1.1

        yeah..i learnt…and stopped..

        ..but there are none so blind/dumb as the willfully ignorant..

        ..those who know..but are too piss-weak to stop..so sneer at those who have..as their only means of ‘defence’..

        ..’would you like some cheese-smothered bacon with that..?

        ..need an ashtray..?’

        ..the cigarette smoking bacon necker…hasn’t even got to square one..

        ..so all they can do is shout insults from their fat-smeared ashtray..

        ..kinda pathetic..really..

        ..phillip ure..

        • bad12 4.1.1.1

          Phillis, you didn’t Stop, you simply Swapped, addictions that is, based upon the availability of supply and your personal finances you are in fact as much a filthy Junky as you were when you were pinging the shit up your arm via a needle,

          So gloat on Phillis,your dope smoking as a crutch to overcome your desire for something stronger to remove you from a reality you obviously cannot handle makes you no better nor worse than those you denigrate with your ‘piss weak’ commentary,

          Having through no fault of your own been crippled with a name that makes the Johnny Cash ”a boy named Sue” one pale into insignificance i can well understand your continual flight into drug use as a means to escape such a reality,

          However, anyone with half a brain,having been saddled with such a ‘naming disability’ at birth would have chosen the change by deed poll route rather than that of becoming by self infliction a sniveling Junky…

          • phillip ure 4.1.1.1.1

            good grief..!..

            ..what are you smoking..?

            ..can i have some..?

            ..(and you’d better start puffing furiously on a ciggie..you sound like you need one..

            ..oh..!..you already are..?..want some cheese-smothered bacon with it..?)

            ..and i won’t hear a word said against the ure-clan..

            ..we fought alongside bonnie prince charlie..

            ..didn’tyaknow..?

            ..(te reo speakers will know the word ‘ure’ means penis/power…this is the basis of bads’ considered/intelligent riposte..

            ..he ain’t got much..eh..?..)

            ..and c’mon..it must surely be time for you to give us again yr self-justifying/laughable/ bullshit/sniveling-whine..

            ..that ‘tobacco is harder to kick than heroin’..eh..?

            ..c’mon..!..we all need a laff..)

            ..phillip ure..

            • bad12 4.1.1.1.1.1

              Phillis Penis, exactly my point,by name,by deed, and your drivel spread across the web looks from here like it has contracted sy-philis,(the puns just keep rolling on),

              What was it you said when i provided you links to the science which states that the nicotine addiction is as strong as the Heroin one,

              Oh that’s right wah wah wah, you refuse to read that ‘knowing’ that your Junky brain knows best,pathetic are those who bury their heads in the sand at the first sign that their stupid arguments are based around the two remaining working neurons in their head,

              Time to roll another free smoke….

              • “..Time to roll another free smoke….”

                ..indeed..!..isn’t is always that ‘time’..?

                ..and ‘free’..?..eh..?..

                ..on one level..maybe..

                (and really..being as piss-weak as you are..i wd really advise you go near nothing more addictive than nicotine..(which is pretty much everything else..)..eh..?

                ..(and as for ‘the science’ ‘proving’ yr whinge..?

                ..snigger/snort..!..eh..?..

                ..you mean that article you linked to from ‘smokers’-weekly’..?..)

                ..phillip ure..

                • bad12

                  Not only a Dick-head by name Phillis, a LIAR by nature as well, do these people seem to you to be ‘smokers weekly’,

                  C.Everett Koop, Surgeon General of the USA,”Nicotine declared as addictive as heroin”,
                  http://www.wired.com/…/may-16-1988-nicotine-declared-as-addictive-as-heroin...

                  Perhaps Phillis, you see the US CDC as a secret hot bed of smokers,”Research says Nicotine is as addictive as Heroin”,
                  http://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/quit_smoking/how_to_quit/you…/nicotine/

                  Same with the University of Minnesota Phillis, all a bunch of closet smokers are they,
                  http://www.1.umn.edu>Didactic Components

                  i didn’t know that they give out arts degrees for bullshit Phillis, a degree in the arts majoring in bullshit, ha ha ha, what an Ure-head…

                  • did you find yr ‘smokers’-weekly’ articles/links..?

                    ..well done..!

                    ..do they come with a commemorative ashtray..?

                    ..and you..!..such an expert on something you know absolutely nothing about..

                    ..(save for yr (kinda self-serving..eh..?..) ‘smokers’-weakly’ articles..’weakly’..heh..!..geddit..?..geddit..?)

                    ..eh..?

                    ..anything else you are equally ‘expert’ on..?

                    ..that you want to share..?

                    ..phillip ure..

                    • bad12

                      Shamefully Dumb Phillis, you have no answer than sniveling abuse which has no effect upon me,

                      Your whole existence is one of denial and the only weakling you see is yourself in the mirror…

            • Blue 4.1.1.1.1.2

              “te reo speakers will know the word ‘ure’ means penis/power” I’d agree with that. Phil you really are a penis.

              • @ blue..

                ..how long have you been a penis-hater..?

                ..what does your therapist say/advise about this..?

                ..or..are you complimenting me..?

                ..if so..?..(blush..!..why..thank you sir..!..(or ma’am..!..)

                ..phillip ure..

                • bad12

                  From head to toe a real Penis, it comes out in the head-strong writing best, which i suppose leaves you with the name of Dick-Head, seems more than appropriate…

              • fender

                I thought it was short for manure 😉

                • the creativity is flowing strong in that one..

                  ..have you thought of auditioning for mensa..?

                  ..(and yes..with that quality of punchline..i wd advise you continue using the emoticon..

                  ..just so people know..it is a joke…eh..?

                  ..best be safe/sure..eh..?

                  ..phillip ure..

                  • fender

                    Dry up manure you sloppy shit 😈

                    • just cursing..?..and so soon..?

                      ..and so anal/human-waste focused..?

                      ..(i wd have a quick-word with yr therapist about that one..

                      ..if i were you..eh..?..)

                      ..and that’s all ya got..?

                      ..ok..you can just carry-on!..also..

                      ..eh..?

                      ..phillip ure..

        • Te Reo Putake 4.1.1.2

          The junk merchant doesn’t sell his product to the consumer, he sells the consumer to his product. He does not improve and simplify his merchandise. He degrades and simplifies the client.

          Old Bill Lee.

        • MaxFletcher 4.1.1.3

          “..’would you like some cheese-smothered bacon with that..?”

          yes.

    • “..If you’re horrified by a flame-roasted dog – you should be shocked at a hog roast..”

      “..It is prejudice that allows us to protect certain species –

      while treating others as mere commodities..”

      (cont..)

      http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/if-youre-horrified-by-a-flameroasted-dog-you-should-be-just-as-shocked-at-a-hog-roast-9163883.html

      ..phillip ure..

      • Zorr 4.2.1

        You keep posting these links to cancer… but you have admitted to smoking pot in these very discussion forums…

        So what is it? Are you worried about cancer? Or just full of shit?

        And yes, I would eat cooked dog.

        • phillip ure 4.2.1.1

          pot smoke doesn’t contain the carcinogens tobacco smoke does..

          ..and anyway..unlike tobacco..it isn’t all about the smoking..

          ..it’s about the ‘high’.. the euphoric – stimulant – muscle relaxing – qualities of/from pot..

          (not something you get from tobacco..and could someone remind me..save from staving off the chills of/from nicotine-addiction-withdrawals..just what you ‘get’ from smoking tobacco..?..

          ..the least ‘paying-out’ of any drug…lucky it is so easy to kick/withdraw from..eh..?

          ..all it takes is a small smidgen of will-power..)

          ..and because it is about the ‘high’..there are many different ways to ingest cannabis..

          ..aside from smoking it..

          ..(hope that helps clarify that for you..if not..?..well….)

          ..and how brave of you..!

          .defiant in yr desire to eat roasted dog..eh..?..

          ..quite the contrarian..aren’t you..?

          ..phillip ure..

          • MaxFletcher 4.2.1.1.1

            “pot smoke doesn’t contain the carcinogens tobacco smoke does..”

            No, it contains carcinogens

            http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12412843

            You could argue it is less harmful but to argue it contains no carcinogens is untrue

            • Zorr 4.2.1.1.1.1

              It actually has a higher rate of cancer amongst users because the tendency is to hold the smoke in for longer (for obvious reasons) thus actually causing a larger cancer rate…

              http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23846283

              Also, as far as tobacco goes, nicotine is quite capable of providing a significant rush.

              I am aware that there are multiple ways to ingest marijuana but you have specifically stated you smoke it so… are you going to make the right choice Phillis and switch to oil?

              • stunningly emphatic conclusion in yr ‘evidence’..eh..?..

                “..CONCLUSION:

                ..after statistical adjustment for baseline tobacco use, alcohol use, respiratory conditions, and socioeconomic status..

                Our primary finding provides initial longitudinal evidence that cannabis use might elevate the risk of lung cancer..”

                (that’s the best you could find..?..really..?..that’s it..?..

                ..’might’..?..)

                ..and oil’..?..mmm!!!…if only..!..i love oil..i just can’t get it..

                ..honey-oil is my favourite form of cannabis..

                ..hands down..!..

                ..just a little spot’ll do ya..!

                ..mmm!!!..20 minute kick-in period..!..warm and toasty..!

                ..and long-lasting..!

                ..what’s not to love..?

                phillip ure..

                • Zorr

                  It’s what I found with a quick Google because it’s been a while since I bothered looking at marijuana.

                  Anecdata against pot:
                  For my wife – sends her in to a major depressive spiral
                  For myself – takes away my life-buzz

                  Dope gets in the way of life… hell, it wastes more time than all my techno cravings combined for anyone that I know that uses it…

                  • MaxFletcher

                    Techno? What kind of techno?

                    • ‘techno-cravings’..?

                      ..now that’s/there’s..a ‘problem’..!

                      ..in anyones’ eyes’..

                      ..all that ‘oonst’ can’t be good for anyone..

                      ..and..do you and the missus ‘oonst’ around the house..?..do you..?

                      ..glowsticks at the ready..?

                      ..how often do you need ‘a fix’..?

                      ..is there any type of ‘real music’ that cd act as a form of methadone for you..?

                      ..to wean you off..?

                      ..phillip ure..

                    • MaxFletcher

                      Sorry, let me rephrase:

                      Techno? What kind of techno, Zorr?

                  • so..it’s clearly not to yr tastes..

                    ..so..?

                    ..does that mean nobody else should imbibe..?

                    ..what are you actually saying here..?

                    ..phillip ure..

                    • Zorr

                      chews off own digits headslams keyboard

                      UA(IPOHREFbnhjgikfeqwAFSPIQK3R1P04JUVMKPASADasdqaeifro[0jq13

                    • is that you done and dusted then..?..there..zorr..?

                      ..is that what you are trying to tell us..?

                      phillip ure..

                • joe90

                  Was that iso or butane with your honey?.

                  • old school..iso..(made by a man obessive with/about his ‘purity’ of product..)

                    ..haven’t yet tried butane..

                    ..i am looking forward to it..

                    ..oil is going gangbusters in america at the moment..

                    ..it is sold in the legal pot-shops ..in wax-form..

                    ..and ‘waxing’ has become big..

                    ..and it is top-shelf pot..

                    ..much like spirits vs beer..

                    ..and with ‘normal’ pot..the maximum thc-content that be achieved is about 25%..

                    ..whereas oil has a much higher thc-content..

                    ..you really can ‘kiss the sky’..

                    ..’scuse me’..!

                    ..phillip ure..

                • David H

                  i love oil..i just can’t get it.

                  Don’t be lazy make yer own.

            • phillip ure 4.2.1.1.1.2

              how about you give us the evidence in support of the health-giving/longevity-qualities

              in/with yr animal-flesh/fat addiction..diet..

              ..eh..?

              ..it could take you a while..

              ..as there is none..

              ..phillip ure..

              • Zorr

                I was making no such claim

                Merely pointing out your hypocrisy – I’ve got no issues with my personal diet as I have made specific choices and eating decisions while keeping in mind the results I want from my eating… shrug

                I’m happy. I am also happy without feeling the need to constantly spout bullshit.

                How about you try just being happy minus the proselytizing crap?

                • ‘happy’..?

                  ..a tenuous/slippery ideal..

                  ..glad for you you are so sure you are there..

                  ..and is it a permanent condition for you..?..

                  ..or one that comes and goes..?

                  ..but as for resolutely ‘cheerful’..?..i’ll stick my hand up for that one..

                  ..i’m the one in the group who is serially cranking out the one-liners..

                  ..laughing at the fucken idiocies of the world/human-condition/myself/others..

                  ..i have children/dogs that love me..

                  ..i have good health/fitness..

                  ..my work is intellectually stimulating..

                  ..and without getting all hubristic..

                  ..is that getting close..?..

                  ..phillip ure..

                  • Zorr

                    And once again I end up wondering why the hell I ever engaged – talking to this creting expecting some semblance of comprehensible intelligence speaks more about my stupidity for engaging rather than his moranicity.

                    He’s all yours bad12/weka/McFlock/et al.

                    I’m out. And next time I catch myself responding to one of his troll posts, I’ll eat my own digits to prevent further typing.

                    • ok..zorr..

                      ..but do see someone about yr ‘techno-issues’..eh..?

                      ..let something good come out of all this..

                      ..eh..?

                      ..heal thyself..’techno-head’..

                      ..(and yr poor/long-suffering neighbours..?..

                      ..there is nothing worse than muffled-‘oonst’..)

                      ..phillip ure..

                    • McFlock

                      lol I’m a bit busy at work today – no time to be a giant for that idiot to tilt at.

                    • a ‘giant’..?

                      ..(snigger/snort..!..)

                      ..thanks for the ’tilt’-opportunity..eh..?

                      ..that’s the funniest thing in this thread..

                      ..phillip ure..

                    • McFlock

                      read your cervantes

                    • MaxFletcher

                      +1

            • bad12 4.2.1.1.1.3

              How dare the pair of you present ‘evidence’ to Phillip to base your argument upon, Phillip as i point out above is uninterested in evidence, the two working neurons in His cranial cavity are all He needs to present the ‘truth’….

              • are you still here..?

                ..i thought you’d gone..

                …and down/resorting to the neuron-argument/slur/’jibe’..eh..?

                ..that’s pretty much yr bag of tricks done and dusted..

                ..eh..?

                ..phillip ure..

                • David H

                  At least talking to Philip is way more fun than the same ol’ same ol’ bullshit trolling from Bruv and his happy band of knuckle draggers.

  5. big bruv 5

    So Cunliffe has his own American bag man. I do hope that Trev is going to ask questions about this in the house.

    • chris73 5.1

      http://www.radiolive.co.nz/Duncan-Garner-Is-David-Cunliffe-a-fake/tabid/674/articleID/40989/Default.aspx

      http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/9789728/Cunliffes-worst-day

      Give the lefties a break, they’re only just realizing what the rest of us already know about Cunliffe (including his own caucus) and that hes simply not as good as he thinks he is

      As an old girlfriend would say, hes all mouth and no trousers

      • bad12 5.1.1

        National seems to have escaped quite well politically any blow back from having used such Trusts as the Waitemata one so while all the hard core ‘wing-nuts’ crow and the will of the soft Left wilts a little in the face of that, Labour need only ride this little speed bump out until the next release of policy,

        If i were David Cunliffe i would at the end of the month hold a press conference and publicly ditch the ‘Raising of the age for Superannuation policy’, promising a referendum at the 2017 election with the two most popular means of future delivery of Superannuation to be put to the people to decide,

        All the ‘wing-nuts’ will then leap about the place in an orgy of glee far greater than they are experiencing at present squealing u-turn, but,out there in the real world where it really matters i would suggest that such a policy of letting the people decide will be worth 2-5% of a bump in the Party vote for Labour…

        • Lanthanide 5.1.1.1

          There are those of us that support raising the age to 67. The longer we delay the decision, the shorter the adjustment period will be, or the farther out it will have to be pushed.

          • bad12 5.1.1.1.1

            Lanthide, what exactly do you base that support upon, David Parker’s ”there is no alternative” perhap’s,

            The doubling of the number of over 65’s leading up to the year 2036 perhaps, its a serious question Lanth, what you are seeming to propose, without giving us a shred of argument as to WHY, is blind faith,

            If you havn’t noticed the vast majority over the past couple of weeks where the issue has been raised here at the Standard have given a definite NO to raising the age of entitlement,

            Care to provide us with your reasons why you support raising the age???…

          • weka 5.1.1.1.2

            “There are those of us that support raising the age to 67. The longer we delay the decision, the shorter the adjustment period will be, or the farther out it will have to be pushed.”

            Not much point in Labour having any superannuation policy if it doesn’t get enough votes to form govt.

            • Colonial Viper 5.1.1.1.2.1

              The “workers party” telling ordinary people that there is no alternative to them working for the capitalist ownership class for even more years of their life, even though we already have a massively excess labour pool and our young people are desperately short of employment.

              Its like a Kafka screenplay.

              • weka

                So what was the story with the membership allowing it through?

                • Colonial Viper

                  Not enough members who understand economics and too many members who defer to MPs and the Labour establishment.

                  Plus what does it tell you about the affiliate unions when most of them voted to give the discretion to caucus to decide.

            • bad12 5.1.1.1.2.2

              Exactly weka, its what makes me view this as Dumb politics, i believe Phill Goff who flogged raising the age of entitlement as a policy going into the 2011 election cost Him and Labour at least 2% of the vote in doing so,

              What makes it even Dumber is that had Phill just managed to get the numbers to form a Government it would have had to include NZFirst which would have meant that the entitlement age wasn’t going to change while Winston still draws a breath,

              Labour, on the numbers i have calculated right now could form a Government relying on the Greens and NZFirst,and, it is looking at this stage that this will become apparent at the 2014 vote, so what point is there in continuing to flog such a vote losing policy when its pretty bloody obvious that they are unlikely to be able to implement it after the vote in 2014…

          • Enough is Enough 5.1.1.1.3

            Lanth you mean delay the ACT/Labour/Parjer option of austerity.

            There are options. It is not inevitable that the age will go up. We ccan do other things like ask those people who have more money than they dserve or require to contribute a bit more society and to those most in need.

            • Lanthanide 5.1.1.1.3.1

              Or, we could put the age up, and then use that money from those with more to contribute to other parts of society most in need.

          • Draco T Bastard 5.1.1.1.4

            There’s no need to raise the age of retirement as we’ve been saying since forever.

        • greywarbler 5.1.1.2

          bad12 +1

      • geoff 5.1.2

        An old girlfriend said that about you, chris?

  6. Tautoko Viper 6

    The recent campaign trust incident has actually raised my opinion of David Cunliffe.
    ‘‘I don’t think in hindsight that a trust structure fully represented the values that I would like to bring to this leadership, and that’s why I have encouraged donors to be as transparent as possible,’’ he said. http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/9789728/Cunliffes-worst-day
    This statement shows that the man has integrity and is able to recognise when he has erred.
    In fact it is this statement that has helped me make up my mind to become actively involved in the local Labour Party electorate campaign. I can now door knock and say “our guy has the intelligence to recognise when he has made a mistake and is prepared to deal with the issue unlike John Key who continues to lie, misdirect and fudge.

    • @ tv..

      “..our guy has the intelligence to recognise when he has made a mistake and is prepared to deal with the issue –

      unlike John Key –
      who continues to lie – misdirect – and fudge..”

      • 1..

      phillip ure..

    • Disraeli Gladstone 6.2

      Nope. I’m with NRT.

      “But then there’s this bit:

      “I don’t think in hindsight that a trust structure fully represented the values I would like to bring to this leadership. Decisions that were made to set up the trust could have been better. I have learned form that and am now making sure I do whatever I can to ensure transparency.”

      Which is just sociopathic “sorry I got caught” bullshit. The thing about values is that you live them, and they’re instinctive. Cunliffe’s aren’t. When faced with a choice between transparency and corruption-enabling secrecy, he chose the latter, and then tried to cling to that choice when it was questioned. These are not the actions of an ethical man who believes in open politics – they are the actions of someone trying to get away with something they know is wrong. And actions like this are yet another example of why the New Zealand public thinks all politicians are liars, cheats and scoundrels.”

      http://norightturn.blogspot.co.nz/2014/03/a-win-for-transparency.html

      • weka 6.2.1

        I tend to agree. Although I do wonder if this was part of internal Labour politics. Would there be different incentives to hide donors’ names because this was about DC vs the ABCs? Even so, the amounts of money are sufficiently small that I can’t see how it would be worth it.

    • Sosoo 6.3

      What Cunliffe did does not matter. What matters is that there will be a steady stream of negative “gotcha” stories about him from now until the election. Never mind that Collins’ faux pas was much worse, the topic of discussion is the “evil” of David Cunliffe.

      He’s toast: the entire establishment is against him. They used to be more subtle about it, but now it is more or less open warfare.

    • floyd 6.4

      TV I like this about Cunliffe a lot. He is not afraid to lay it all out there and be judged. Not like our inept spiteful little leader who just cuts and runs, or hides behing the skirts of the msm who meekly allow him never to hela accountable for any of the truly stupid things he has manipulated. Particularly pd off about his non-answer to the media that he did not have to reveal who gave him the information on Winston And Russell. And we all know it wasn’t that rotting carcase of blubber wo. So who then key/ Man up like Cunliffe does. The country has a right to know! You have said so yourself on many occasions.

  7. Blue 7

    It not the fact that Cunliffe has a trust,which is completely within the rules its the galling hypocrisy of it all. Criticising the other side for using trust to protect donors identities, then doing the same yourself to hide your donors names. Like being a millonaire living in a million dollar home and critising another millionare for um, being a millionaire and living in a million dollar home. Like criticising people who use trusts to protect their assests, then having a trust to protect your own assets. There needs to be a change to the law, where you absolutely can, or you absolutely can’t use trusts. Should have backed Jones, at least people like him.

    • bad12 7.1

      Is that the Jones who came a distant third in the democratic leadership contest within the Labour Party,

      National on your reckoning should get rid of Slippery the Prime Minister and replace Him with Gerry Brownlee…

    • Tracey 7.2

      yup its ok to believe in secret trusts while championing transparency it’s not ok to do what Cunliffe did. We get it, and we all understand the hypocrisy even if it

      whoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooosh

      goes over our head

  8. Blue 8

    Democratic or not, isnt the point to win an election ? Why would National get rid of soemone that people like, with someone they dont?

    “National on your reckoning should get rid of Slippery the Prime Minister and replace Him with Gerry Brownlee…” Distance third indeed, but outside of the internal machinations of the Labour Party he’s not a distant third at all, and its a pretty stupid analogy because Key is not as monumentally unpopular as Cunliffe.

    • Pasupial 8.1

      Blue

      You are just spouting gibberish now.

      It’s bad enough that you don’t seem to understand the meaning of “hypocrisy”. But then saying; “isnt the point to win an election”. at the same time as recommending that a political party of which you are not a member replace the winner of a leadership election with the loser, is just idiocy.

    • bad12 8.2

      Perhaps, i will concede your point, but then, how monumentally stupid would it be to get rid of David Cunliffe, it is after all the rank and file of the Labour membership that put Him in the position in the first place,

      To infer Cunliffe is vastly unpopular is a monumental stupidity in itself, the Party membership Doubled at the thought that there could be a Cunliffe lead Labour Party,

      Yes quick, trot out the latest poll result or do a SSLands and direct us all to the gambling site where Cunjliffe attracts half the ‘bets’ of Slippery the Prime Minister,

      Remember all the while that you gloat that befor Helen Clark become a 3 term Prime Minister she rode the polls at 6% of the preference…

      • McFlock 8.2.1

        the Party membership Doubled at the thought that there could be a Cunliffe lead Labour Party,

        And he got 60% of the membership vote. Hmmm.

    • Tracey 8.3

      Democratic or not, isnt the point to win an election”

      Yikes!

      • Blue 8.3.1

        What Tracey? That refered to the oh so proud anouncement that the leadership contest was “democratic”. So what. Internal Party processes are the party not for the public. You believe that a democratic internal party election for a leader, which the caucus didnt want and who has not made any traction with the public, is an important part of winning the general election? From my observation very few outside the party faithful gave a rats arse about it, it was a bloody circus. Do you not think the point is to win an election? Perhaps a noble defeat is what you’re aiming for?

  9. “..Warren Buffett: Here’s What We Need More Than A Minimum Wage Hike..” (+ comment@whoar:..ed:..the ideological-mote that so blinds the right..)

    (excerpt:..)

    “..and that is an aspect of rightwing logic-fail that i just can’t get my head around..

    ..these supposed business/economics-’experts’..

    ..have such an ideological-mote in their eyes/minds..

    ..that they seem unable to see/understand an economics 101-fact..

    ..namely..that one of the most efficient/effective ways to stimulate an economy..

    ..is to increase the incomes of the poorest/working-poor..

    ..and this for the fact that virtually all of that increase in income for the worst-off..

    ..churns straight back into the economy..

    ..goes into retailers/service-providers’ tills..”

    (cont..)

    http://whoar.co.nz/2014/warren-buffett-heres-what-we-need-more-than-a-minimum-wage-hike-commentwhoar-ed-the-ideological-mote-that-so-blinds-the-right/

    phillip ure..

    • bad12 9.1

      Linking us to your rubbish website Ure-head is a waste of our precious time, we get force fed a diet of your disjointed rubbish all day long here at the Standard, i doubt there are many that can stand a whole web-site full of it…

      • phillip ure 9.1.1

        it’s not for the likes of you..

        ..phillip ure..

        • MaxFletcher 9.1.1.1

          Serious question – what is the deal behind your…unusual prose?

          • phillip ure 9.1.1.1.1

            i try to write as we speak..

            ..to get those cadences..that pace/flow..

            ..it’s as simple as that..

            ..it gestated from a combination of lots of writing for radio..and a liking for the ‘look’ of the poetry of..

            ..e.e. cummings..

            ..and a general disdain/questioning of the ‘norms’ of lots of things..

            ..i mean..!..capital-letters..?..w.t.f. is that particular artifice all about..?

            ..phillip ure..

            • MaxFletcher 9.1.1.1.1.1

              Capital letters signify the start of a sentence or a proper noun. It so the reader can tell if you are talking a bush or a person named Bush for example.

              And I can’t imagine anyone ‘speaking’ the way you write. I would think they were suffering some sort of mild retardation based upon how your writing ‘sounds’ in mine head.

              • oh..ok..!

                ..you clearly don’t ‘get it’..

                ..(and ‘serious question’..eh..?..you got me there..!..eh..?..silly me..!..)

                ..never mind..

                ..you just carry on..!..there..eh max..?

                ..and you do want cheese-smothered bacon with that..?..

                ..didn’t you say..?

                ..putting the ‘ray’ in braying-fool..eh..?..

                ..phillip ure..

            • bad12 9.1.1.1.1.2

              You might think and speak in small bursts of gibberish Phillis, the rest of us choose English as the medium of communication…

              • Disraeli Gladstone

                Your English is quite bad as well.

                I’d stay quiet during this conversation.

            • Te Reo Putake 9.1.1.1.1.3

              While I’ll admit I can sometimes decipher the nuggets from the gibberish, Phil, I think the main issue is that your writing style is is a huge turn off for the reader, which limits genuine communication.

              As someone said about Kerouac, that’s not writing, that’s typing. In your case, it’s closer to an infinite number of monkeys occasionally and unintentionally writing Shakespeare by bashing random keys.

              You often have interesting things to say, but you choose to express them in a way that is not inclusive and, in the case of the drug threads, undermines your case significantly. No point saying you’re a functioning drug user, if your writing style suggests the exact opposite.

            • bad12 9.1.1.1.1.4

              Can you dig the hole much deeper any faster Phillis, so that’s where you plagarize your lack of a writing style from,

              It figures, from the wikipedia, E. E. Cummings,”Despite His radical and bohemian public image,He was a republican, and later, an ardent supporter of Joseph McCarthy”,unquote

              Further into the wiki biography we find that E. E. Cummings wasn’t above penning the odd poem with racial overtones,

              That’s you to a T is it Phillis, a closet Nazi with hidden racist leanings???,

              http://www.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E._E._Cummings

              • and p.g. wodehouse broadcast for the nazi from berlin in ww2..

                ..that doesn’t alter the fact that there are few writers better..

                ..and yep..!..you got me..!..

                ..a ‘racist nazi’..

                ..clearly that is me..

                ..phillip ure..

                • Te Reo Putake

                  “and p.g. wodehouse broadcast for the nazi from berlin in ww2..”

                  Nope. He was accused of it, but it was easily disproved. What he did do was record stories about his capture and internment by the Germans in the early years of WW2 for an American audience not yet in the war. It probably wasn’t a good idea, but it wasn’t propaganda for the Germans by any means.

                  • i haven’t seen transcripts..have you..?

                    ..and i guess bad puts every artist..musical as well..thru his/her political-correctness filter..(to avoid having to call him/herself names like ‘nazi’..eh..?..)

                    ..if you knock out bad behaviour with drugs..(except ciggies..)..and non p.c. behaviour..

                    ..there wouldn’t be that many on bads’ playlist..eh..?

                    ..phillip ure..

            • Blue 9.1.1.1.1.5

              If thats how your speak Phil, I’d get a scan – I think you’ve had a stroke.

        • bad12 9.1.1.2

          Always on the look-out to provide a bit of help Phillis, can i make the suggestion that you change the sites name, ‘Attention Whoar’ seems far more appropriate…

          • Tiger Mountain 9.1.1.2.1

            Whoar! thats enough for me. I don’t like Bad’s pushiness towards Phil, but enough is enough really some days, the double line spacing is really bad typography given the absence of leading.

            And Phil has his own forum unlike most of us commenters here so I am adding him to the Penny Denny (in joke) scroll on by list.

            • bad12 9.1.1.2.1.1

              You might not like my ‘pushiness’ toward Phillis, but then, i do not like Phillis’s use of ‘piss weak’ as a descriptive for those who cannot quit the smoking addiction,

              i further do not like Phillis’s continued use of such abuse despite His being repeatedly told that i like my tobacco use and have no intention of even trying to quit,

              To add to that i do not like Phillis’s abuse when He is linked to web-sites of Government, Government officials and Universities which proves a point He has attempted to make is utter bullshit,

              ‘Pushy’ i might be, but, only because Phillis keeps giving me every reason to be so…

              • but bad you don’t want to give up so…

                phil is phil you are you good luck to both of you. Fuck at least you both have personalities and are not gnatbots.

                I went through a time with vto where we were nasty-feuding on this site and someone said they’d prefer it if we didn’t – I remember rhino and mcflock recently getting into it and i found that series of exchanges to be very sad. I’m finding the same thing with you two – just my view and fair enough if you say “walk your walk mate…” or just butt out. 🙂

                • George D

                  Could..?.. the … moderators !…p…l…e…a……..

                  se…b…an..!.this.

                  .. id…i….o….t…?

                  “Drugs are

                  good for you,

                  whoar!!!!!”

            • Murray Olsen 9.1.1.2.1.2

              Penny Denny – very good. A blast from the past.

          • phillip ure 9.1.1.2.2

            you left out the exclamation-points ..and the ‘pause’..

            “..attention..!..(pause..)..whoar..!..”

            ..there you are..that’s better..

            ..phillip ure..

  10. BM 10

    Not looking too good for Dave
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/9789728/Cunliffes-worst-day

    They’re running a poll in that article rating Cunliffes performance as leader, lets just say if he decides not to get out of bed tomorrow, I wouldn’t be surprised.

    • fender 10.1

      Is there a poll showing approval of Collins’ corruption?

      • Tracey 10.1.1

        it’s not corruption ,it’s entrepreneurial spirit.

        Like banks as Executive Direct of Huljich, and Vrash as Director of Huljich and Graham on Lombard and so on and on… but sign a painting for harity or email your ideas to the wrong person.
        \
        “OFF WITH THEIR HEADS”

    • speaking of ‘bad days’..

      ..how about keys upcoming/soon-to-be snowden-spooking-revelations ‘bad day’..?

      ..eh..?

      ..whoar..!

      ..that’ll be a right doozie..!

      ..of a ‘bad day’..

      ..eh..?

      ..somehow i think this will all be a distant memory..and very soon..

      ..overtaken by keys’ soon-to-be mother-of-all-bad-days..

      ..so gloat on..little rightwing-booster..

      ..while you still can..eh..?

      ..while you still can..

      ..(and as an aside..i kinda imagine mccarten grabbing various entities by the shirt-front..about now..

      ..asking/demanding:..

      ..’is there anything else..?..is there anything else..?’..)

      ..phillip ure..

      • Chooky 10.2.1

        lol.philip ure

        ..looking forward to this ‘soon-to-be mother-of-all-bad-days’! …..”that’ll be a right doozie”….for one Mr Shyster John Key

        …”Vengence is mine!”….thus spake the fat angel DOTcom as he flew above the courthouse
        trumpets blaring Handel’s Messiah.( and The Trumpet Shall Sound.!!!!!).

        …..and Dotcom smited the little toadie from above with his mighty legal THUNDER BOLTER…and all New Zealanders stood back in awe and gaped …..

    • Hayden 10.3

      And here it is being “rigged”:
      http://www.trademe.co.nz/Community/MessageBoard/Messages.aspx?id=1399243&topic=7

      Stuff polls are about as worthless as you can get.

      PS Don’t read too much of that message board unless you want to start hating everybody.

      • weka 10.3.1

        How can you rig a Stuff poll?

        • Hayden 10.3.1.1

          Not exactly rigged, which is why I put it in quotes, but it’s hardly scientific when people are being encouraged to vote it down.

          Plus the fact that it’s self-selecting in the first place.

    • Enough is Enough 10.4

      By definition everyone has a “worst day”.

      So it is a brainless statement.

      Cunliffe’s worst day is still a lot better than Key’s worst.

      Blip has a nice list of lies and fuck ups from the Prime Minister that beat Cunliffes worst day.

    • felix 10.5

      Keep refreshing the page BM, you need something to keep your other hand busy.

  11. Chooky 11

    Very good interview by Kathryn Ryan this morning on dealing with people…and trying to help them…ie walk with them , be with them , dont treat them as objects , dont think you know what is best for them, respect their wishes and opinions….and LISTEN to them!.

    …Very good advice for people in the ‘helping’ professions…

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/ninetonoon/audio/2587882/feature-graham-long-pastor-and-ceo-of-the-wayside-chapel

    .(imo…people who should especially listen to this are doctors and other know-it-alls on imunisation…… a must for all kiddies …and the Catholic Church on contraception and what is best for women…they should butt right out and let women and parents make their own decisions based on the evidence )

  12. captain hook 12

    it was apretty good day for shifty key when he walked out of Merill Lynch with $90,000,000 in his bank book. How does one man make that much money without actually producing anything?
    I’d like to know that.

    • fender 12.1

      How unfair, he got RSI from ticket-clipping!

    • Cancerman 12.2

      He produced liquidity but then I don’t expect you to understand that.

      • greywarbler 12.2.1

        Is that when your knees go to water after you discover that your financial investments have turned to custard despite getting the best financial advice you could buy? Has that sort of liquidity happened to you Cancerman?

      • One Anonymous Bloke 12.2.2

        Unfortunately, his “liquidity” turned out to be nothing but smoke when the creditors came a calling and the house prices started falling, and the results are still being experienced by the victims of his and others’ complicity and incompetence, as the IMF (late to the party) has finally realised.

  13. greywarbler 13

    There is an interesting Russian-connected auction on Trade me for a Russian Tube Clock
    Listing #: 701347390 – Start price: $950.00 No reserve Closes: Thu 6 Mar, 11:13 pm
    It’s interesting and must have been hand-crafted.

    I went down to the Q and A and loved the first one and its bland answer.
    Hi, I believe the clock is set to Russian Trotsky Time. Is it possible to adjust it to NZ Lambing Season Time? ocker999 (152 ) 4:40 pm, Sun 2 Mar
    Hi, I am not sure about your question sorry? The clock can be manually adjusted as needed. thanks.
    Sorry if I confused you! Could you please double-check that it can be changed from Socialist to Capitalist time? ocker999 (152 ) 5:15 pm, Sun 2 Mar
    Given that the PCB (electronics) were made in the UK I would think so. Thanks!

  14. bad12 14

    Out of control electricity retailers???, would seem like it, news from RadioNZ National warns wellington electricity users that their prices will rise by as much as 7.5% in coming months,

    The retailers cite the local lines company as the reason for these price rises, However, interviewed on the radio a spokesperson for the lines company says that they will only be raising their charges by 4%,

    What this gives every appearance of being is the cozy Cartel that are the electricity retailers simply using the lines company as a convenient excuse to rack-raise their prices while pointing the finger of blame at the lines company,

    It’s way past the time for Labour/Green to ‘only’ be thinking about fixing the pricing of the Generators of electricity,

    Labour/Green need come up with a solution to the profit gouging of the electricity retailers, the simple fix would be to establish a Government owned national retailer of electricity at the same time as the single desk buyer of wholesale electricity is established…

  15. sometimes ya just hafta give credit where credit is due..

    ..(and the opposite..)

    ..it came out in questiontime today..

    ..that last yr national/govt treated over 3,500 prisoners..who are/were addicts..rising to over 4,000 this yr..

    ..and guess how many addicted prisoners the clark/labour govt provided treatment for..

    ..in their final year in office..?

    ..230..

    ..that’s right..two hundred and thirty..

    ..anyone from then who is here..care to justify/explain/excuse that one..?

    http://whoar.co.nz/2014/new-zealand-parliament-list-of-questions-for-oral-answer-wednesday-5-march-2014/

    phillip ure..

  16. big bruv 17

    Is Cunliffe about to resign?

  17. RRM 18

    PhailUre- it gives me some hope for the future of the Labour Party to see that you’re every bit as liked here as you were on kiwiblog.

    Applied for any jobs yet?

    Got any paid advertising on whoallyshitthissitesucksballs.co.nz yet?

    Or are you still content to have people who get off their arse in the morning and work to support themselves, support you too?

    Enjoy your next joint of MY dope, Phailure!

    • Skinny 18.1

      Hey Punk Phil has set the bar so the likes of myself can rant.

      Phil keep it coming I enjoy plenty of your comments 🙂

    • felix 18.2

      Is kiwiblog offline or something? How come these mutants are spilling over here with nothing at all to say?

  18. big bruv 19

    Outstanding!

    Both Micky and Cunliffe right in it now. Get ready for another leadership election lefties.

  19. Belladonna 20

    What is with the bullying of Phil on this site? Not a good look. Why not direct your anger to the tories and focus on getting rid of the Nats instead of this childish antagonism. In fact I also find it hard to understand why Brian Edwards, Josie Pagani and Mike Williams seem to forget what side they are on.
    All of you need to grow up in my opinion.

    • floyd 20.1

      Belladonna. Exactly. What phil does phil does. Let it go. We need to find a way to shut gower down. the look on his face when he was allowed to do a whole demolition job on Cunliffe said a lot .Pure malice. A political journalist he is not. If he wants to find dirt on anybody he wouldn’t have to look far past our very own pretender johnkey. But he chooses not to. Does he not realise that sooner or later ther pendulum will swing and he could find himself jobless. NZ deserves much more from our media than what we are getting. God knows how we are going to get it.

      Think,henryhosking,espiner,dann,gower,armstrong,young,fran whatsername,mora and so on and so on. The bias is overt but nothing is done about it because the media is running the country. Waiting for the polls. Media will do their job and orchestrate weekly damming polls against Labour to instill in people the apathy not to vote. I had it with my own son. “What’s the point he asked?” God help us.

      • idlegus 20.1.1

        yep +1

      • RedBaronCV 20.1.2

        Get the all the left parties to leak an internal email of theirs discussing foreign media ownership rules and taxing the crap out of Fairfax. Might slow them down a bit. Winston might be very happy to assist with one of hios soundbites.

  20. big bruv 21

    “What is with the bullying of Phil on this site?”

    Other than the fact that he chooses not to work and prefers to live on the back of hard working tax payers?

    • One Anonymous Bloke 21.1

      Thank goodness he hasn’t sunk to Capill/Garrett levels.

    • fact-check:..

      ..i start working @ approx 5.30 am most mornings..and work 12-15 hrs each day..

      ..and i post 40-50 links/stories each/every day..

      ..do opinion-pieces/commentaries on parliament..

      ..this is how i have built the reasonably large audience/readership/subscribers i have @ whoar….

      ..the obese-sibling drives a cab in some provincial hellhole..(hamilton..i think..?..)

      ..and divides his time between being a denizen of kiwiblogswamp..and talkback radio..

      ..meh..!

      ..eh..?

      ..phillip ure

      [lprent: You too. I have a tendency to close down both sides of a flamewar. ]

      • big bruv 21.2.1

        The difference being that I earn a living and you don’t.

        • lprent 21.2.1.1

          I suspect I creatively make a living for quite a few others. But I suspect (from your previous comments) that you are merely what I call an economic parasite. What is the bet that you’re in something like local sales? Probably selling imports by appealing to peoples perceptions of their dick sizes.

          Gee we can make this one-up-manship wankfest extend everywhere. Of course if you make a habit of it, then I may really start tearing into you, your inadequacies, and exactly how pathetic you really are…

          Bores the crap out of everyone, then we moderate it out. Of course since we know that is where it leads, then we could simply cut out the flame war and take it to its penultimate conclusion. Your choice.

        • felix 21.2.1.2

          No you don’t, you’re just a pseudonym on a blog.

          No-one knows who you are, so no-one can verify anything you claim about yourself and your life, so none of it counts for shit unless you choose to identify yourself ( and don’t have a cry, I’m not suggesting you do that).

          Made-up pseudonyms are simply incapable of having jobs. It’s just not possible. Just like it’s not possible for you to pay up the $100 you owe BLiP.

        • RedLogix 21.2.1.3

          bb really does have a job felix. Trolling.

          Of course no actual cash is harmed in the course of his work – that’s the beauty of performance pay.

        • greywarbler 21.2.1.4

          big bruv
          But you don’t work hard enough at your earning. You should be working more and getting more and then you wouldn’t have any energy left to be popping up all the time with your outof sightful words. But you are addicted to the blog aren’t you. And you’re lucky they haven’t found a test that will show up when blog addiction that seriously impedes your work ability. Pity.

  21. big bruv 22

    How long before McCarten decides he has had enough of the laughable Labour party?

  22. ianmac 23

    Novo Pay again. And by the way that English/Joyce are speaking they will announce “Bulk Funding” is the answer. They say that Teacher salaries are far to hard for them to organise and soon they will say each school will be given a bulk sum and each BOT will sort their own pay system. So you see it is all the teachers’ fault. Watch this space!

    • big bruv 23.1

      Sounds like a great idea to me. This on the back of John Morris’s comments re performance pay for teachers. Performance pay is something we will see in the next term of this National party government.

  23. Draco T Bastard 24

    How a Libertarian Capitalist Became a Libertarian Socialist

    Although I favored free markets, I did so because I considered them to be necessitated by the principles that I held. Principles always came *first* for me — not economics. However, around the time that I quit working at the software corporation, it finally truly sank in that businesses couldn’t *care less* about principles. The questions “Is it right?” or “Is it just?” do not even enter the minds of the decision makers of capitalist businesses — such questions are beside the point in their eyes. Although I was a right-libertarian at the time, I held my views because I genuinely believed that they followed logically from my beloved principle of self-government. Even though I knew that *many* capitalist businesses were completely lacking in principles, I did ignorantly believe that this was only true of large government aided corporations. It was very disheartening to learn over time that this fact applies to *most* businesses, regardless of whether or not they happen to be corporations that profit from state favor. If they don’t actually receive favors from the state, then it is typically their *aim* to receive them.

    And interesting story of enlightenment. I’d say he’s still got a bit to learn but haven’t we all?

  24. Pascal's bookie 25

    Crikey tho ‘ol Cunliffe not declaring that trust.

    Still, at least he didn’t forget about 3 houses and a farm that fell down behind the couch there or anything.

    http://www.parliament.nz/en-nz/mpp/mps/fin-interests/00CLOOCMPPFinInterests2013additional1/register-of-pecuniary-and-other-specified-interests-of

    • Ad 25.1

      After phone-banking for the Labour Party this evening, this shit from Cunliffe isn’t helping. It’s corrosive especially to older European voters.

      Doesn’t matter what other pollies did or didn’t do. OK the MSM are unfair, boo hoo so is life.

      For fuck sake Cunliffe give us a new speech and some policy, change the public discourse, and give our supporters something worth arguing about at work, home, radio, and here.

      • bad12 25.1.1

        Ad, i truly sympathize, In David Cunliffe’s defence the best thing to be said is He appears to have been getting some really atrocious advice,(sorry MS if it was you that provided this advice),

        Hell, why would anyone try and hide a fucking investment in some vehicle after the stick was taken to David Shearer over much the same thing,

        As a Green Party member i hardly expect the Party’s MP’s or leaders to dress in sack cloth and reside in caves eating raw mung beans and lentils and as someone i see as upper middle class i would expect Cunliffe to have a nice enough house and as he and His Partner were high earners outside of the world of politics a bit of a stash put away,

        Still, albeit a late declaration,it was declared, but, that’s 3 leaders in a row from Labour that have created the birch with which the likes of TV3’s Alfred E. Nuemann happily whip up a climate where by their own actions they give the public a perception of dishonesty,

        i truly know how you feel Ad, having had the odd why do i bother moment in the past few days…

        • RedLogix 25.1.1.1

          Still, albeit a late declaration,it was declared, but, that’s 3 leaders in a row from Labour that have created the birch with which the likes of TV3′s Alfred E. Nuemann happily whip up a climate where by their own actions they give the public a perception of dishonesty

          Victim blaming some?

          How different is this to asking a rape victim what she was wearing?

          • bad12 25.1.1.1.1

            What’s this shit RedLogix, are you suggesting that Goff with the Wellington apartment,Shearer with the stash in a US bank account, and Cunliffe’s use of the trust to hold His leadership attempt funds and His late declaration of having a stash in an investment fund were not self inflicted wounds giving an impression of dishonesty which the likes of Gower and Garner happily exploit,

            You might think the above to be victim blaming,good for you.

            But,

            To then equate what i have written to the horrors of what many rape victims face i would suggest is slightly sick,

            (You would be far better off to wait for me to use the word She in a comment and then accuse me of sexism than start waving round the horror that rape victims have suffered in an effort to point score against me)…

            • RedLogix 25.1.1.1.1.1

              Nah – I’m not drawing a moral equivalence with rape .. but the pattern of behavior is not dissimilar.

              Cunliffe is being taken down by a group of privileged, powerful people who are actively his enemies.

              It doesn’t matter what he does, they WILL find something to attack him on. If he had not used the TR trust and declared the donations on the Parliamentary Register, they would have had a go at him for breaking Labour Party rules.

              That’s how enemies behave bad12. You cannot appease them, you cannot ‘behave’ well enough to avoid their attacks, and they will always make it your fault when they get you.

              And when you buy into their narrative- then you are well and truly screwed. (Metaphorically that is.)

              • It is poor taste red and non-equivilant, metaphorically or otherwise.

                I don’t think cunliffe can afford too much ‘poor me’ stuff – he needs to turn it around and start pointing his own finger. He can’t do any ‘right’ so time to go hard in the other direction. He isn’t a victim – he’s the leader of the labour party, a top politician and son of a preacherman – he knows how to get through shit and if he doesn’t…

                • RedLogix

                  Frankly I don’t give a rat’s patui if the metaphor is in poor taste. It’s meant to be provocative because we are in a battle with people who fear and loath us.

                  The point is you are all tentatively flirting with buying into the bs. We have to understand how enemies behave – and niceties like balance, restraint, a sense of proportion, the truth or even basic decency mean nothing to these people. They are going to pile shit on.

                  Understand who is responsible here. Focus you energies on them.

                  • bad12

                    ???, Really Red???, your latest comment is suggestive of two things,(1),in your mind rape victims are to be given scant regard, and (2),rape victims are ‘fair game’ for you to ‘use’ in any way you see fit,

                    Seems you might like to ask the same question of yourself that you asked me in closing your comment at 12.10am…

                    • RedLogix

                      Obviously the metaphor pressed a button for you because now you are just making shit up.

                      I was being provocative for a reason. You have a clear picture of how victim blaming works in the context of rape.

                      Now understand that rape is not the only context in which the same behaviour occurs. It happens very frequently in bullying, smears and this kind of political assassination.

                      You understand how vital it is not to buy into victim blaming in one context – maybe you could calm down and see how it might apply in this.

                    • bad12

                      ”Making shit up” Red would be the original question you put to me where you use a question to make a claim, obviously looking for the support of those with strong feminist beliefs here at the Standard,

                      This claim that i am buying into the right’s narrative and that Cunliffe in this instance is a ‘victim’ are both absurd when you consider the sum total of the comment i made which we are discussing,(Cunliffe Himself has admitted His actions were unwise),

                      The fact that you feel the need to equate your claims of victimization with that of questions that many rape victims have in the past had used as an accusation against them vis a vis clothing and then asked a question which in intent is actually an accusation masked as that question against me points in a direction that it is not me that would ever stoop to such victimization of the victims of such a horrible crime,

                      However, i for one cannot, in light of your casual linking of what i have said in the original comment being discussed here, find any justification what-so-ever for your USING rape victims in an attempt at petty point scoring,

                      David Cunliffe is not an innocent victim in light of the mistaken use of the trust used to collect donations, David Himself has said as much, in light of David having made the rod for His own back would we expect the ‘wing-nuts’ to do anything else but use it against Him,

                      Equating rape victims in anyway with my discussing this in light of Ad’s previous comment which i was replying to probably hs a twelve letter word which could be attached to it, i simply see it as bizarre…

              • bad12

                Fair enough Red, but,you like many make the mistake of taking a paragraph of what i wrote in total in that particular comment and then, in the point you are trying to make, come to the conclusion that i am buying into the narrative of the ‘right’ in their attacks upon Cunliffe,

                Read as a whole, the comment tho suggests that i do not buy into such a narrative at all and we still cannot escape the fact that the ammunition for this particular attack upon Cunliffe was of His own making,

                Hell i didn’t suffer a higher education, the 4th form, whatever that equates to in today’s modern lingo’ is as far as i got befor being shown the door,

                But, even i have a clear understanding of the rules, which to me simply say ”Declare everything you have received while an MP with a value of 500 bucks or more, and,declare everything with a value of 500 bucks or more that you hold an interest in”,

                To attempt to fudge,to attempt to interpret in any way, to make a judgement call on which rules apply is to simply hand the likes of Alfred E. Nuemann a whip which we all know He is more than happy to use,

                As Ad points out in the original comment to which i replied, it just makes the job of all those involved in the backroom activism when anyone in the Party’s of Opposition hands TV3’s Alfred E. Nuemann,(Gower), the means to whip up the storm…

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  26. swordfish 27

    Testing yyy ttt iii. mmmmnmmmm

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