This will be my last post on the Standard (and probably any other blog) for a while at least – not too sure when Ill be able to post again, but it wont be until well into the New Year at least (perhaps when everthing has settled down) — my personal circumstances look set to change in a rather dramatic way, and it is because of that I wont be in a position to contribute to this blog. Its been great chatting to you all, and I have enjoyed reading the thoughts of everyone here, though the right wingers always seem to want to put the boot in all the time.
I think the left is in pretty good shape at the moment, and 2014 will see a Sixth Labour government, that is probably more to the left than Clark’s one was, though how far to the left remains to be seen. It all depends on how the asset sales referendum pans out, and the outcome of the PoA dispute. I see both of these as defining issues in this country — public/collective v individual/private, and security v flexibility.
So, on that note, Farewell, Merry Christmas, Happy new year, and hope to catch up with you all in the New Year some time.
Cheers to you, millsy, hope the change in circ’s is not a negative one and I look forward to being amused, bemused and occasionally confused by you again in the near future!
Does this mean the end of posts from EDDIE on pain of his expulsion from the Labour Party?
For this to happen to a loyal Labour Party member who has done nothing but ably stand up for the party on line, while John Tamihere after continually slanging off Labour in the MSM, is welcomed back as a member and embraced as a long lost prodigal son.
Yes kind Lefty souls, I’m bugging out too, returning at some future date (hopefully not too far away). IB has highlighted some reasons why, and the stuff he is talking about isn’t kidding around. The miserable and ill-conceived pressure they are putting on Cunliffe and his supporters in caucus, well they are now turning that on to ordinary party members as well. Organisations which find themselves in this state, well what more do I need to say.
I shan’t be back for a wee while unless there is good reason 😎
It is probably for the best at present CV. My abject apologies for not having the energy/time to talk to you (work is hectic).
Well, as I’m not a member, I guess I remain free…..
I never care.
Quite frankly the party could do with my skills far more than I need the party. I’ve pretty well withdrawn from party activity over recent years as the environment has become more toxic.
But I’d advise anyone who has used a pseudonym on Red Alert that could compromise them in real life to expect problems. The system operators over there are quite compromised, don’t act responsibly, and have been that way for some time. Quite simply they are not operating in a way that makes it safe to leave comments there unless you have cast-iron anonymity. Treat it like you would Whaleoil’s site.
Which incidentally, is why you don’t see Red Alert on our feed
Actually, it wouldn’t ruin my life to be outed, especially as I am semi-retired. It might be a bit tricky at work, but probably not totally damaging. My preference for a pseudonym is partly because, personally I’m a fairly shy person.
Some people see it as a contradiction, that I can be very talkative and confident in a teaching or discussion context. But socially, I am often the quiet person in a group. I don’t enjoy being the centre of attention.
Tempted as I am to suggest that maybe your father in law has finally snapped and told you to log off and go get a job, I’ll restrict myself to saying I too will miss your contributions, CV. You maintained an excellence balance between quantity and quality in your comments and there will be many a chastened rightie feeling relieved that you are signing off. Hope its not for too long.
ps: I’m looking forward to the inevitable post from PG on your departure over at Yawn NZ. What greater tribute could there be?
Nope. This is an actual problem. There was a threat of “outing” by a MP that came up during the lobbying at conference. Subsequently it was raised by the same MP in the NZ Council as part of the lobbying to push Tamihere’s membership through.
It fits the same pattern of behaviour as Shane Jones demonstrates. A caucus that does things less by focused strategy and more by stupid intimidation.
I’d advise people to think carefully before putting comments at Red Alert if your identity can in anyway be traced back to you. I guess that is why the comments are dropping like a stone over there.
To be honest I struggle to see why there is a reticence amongst those in the know to name said MP. Should we not all know the character of those that are possibly going to be representing us next term?
(Sorry, I’m not singling you out Lynn, it was just your post I replied to).
It is quite a specific assertion of fact. To make it you’d have to be fairly confident that you have people who are willing to testify to its veracity. In this case that would probably happen.
There is little point naming the person(s) when what is actually required is a change of collective behaviour by caucus in the way that they handle a blogs and their net presence. In particular the malfeasant transfer of information that should be private out of Red Alert and matching it with other information, like comments on this site.
But there is a rather nice effect in not naming the person(s) concerned. It effectively throws the uncertainty about who did the malfeasance back on the whole of caucus – which is actually where the responsibility lies.
And it is probably a whole lot more effective for caucus to deal with their own.
There was a threat of “outing” by a MP that came up during the lobbying at conference. Subsequently it was raised by the same MP in the NZ Council as part of the lobbying to push Tamihere’s membership through.
You have to be fucking kidding! You’re saying a Labour MP threatened to out Colonial Viper and others because they were writing things the unnamed Labour MP didn’t like… And that the same threat was made to ensure John Tamihere was granted admission by the New Zealand Council of the Labour Party?
Am I missing something here? How exactly is threatening to out Colonial Viper (unless he/she is a Labour party MP which I doubt) going to influence a party decision and why would the New Zealand Council of the Labour Party give a shit?
There is little point naming the person(s) when what is actually required is a change of collective behaviour by caucus in the way that they handle a blogs and their net presence.
Labour has been collectively saying they will out bloggers who are also members of the Labour party if they speak out against the party? I think you have lost it 1prent. That’s ridiculous! Can you actually point to some evidence of this?
It effectively throws the uncertainty about who did the malfeasance back on the whole of caucus – which is actually where the responsibility lies.
I have to disagree there… The responsible person is the one making the threats if that is actually the case?
The problem here is that nothing will be resolved unless you name the person you allege has threatened to out party members and/or bloggers. There’s nothing wrong with saying who this is, because they’re a public person and it will be something they said that’s on the record. Highlight exactly what they said 1Prent and allow the the public to decide.
Seems you have marsman, better go on the run and sleep with one eye open like CV.
This shit STINKS and will really damage the Party once the MSM run with it.
What FOOLS this bunch of Brown Shirts are in conducting a witch hunt. Once Hooten and his ilk put their spin on it I see a new poll showing a low 20% support for Labour very soon.
Don’t stray too far. There’s that old saying “what goes around comes around” and I think there are a few people in the Labour caucus who are going to find out in due course how very true that saying is.
I also think I may know the identity of the person who has turned on you and that person will pay a price for objectionable behaviour…
This is no good CV. I’m sure you have your reasons but this is just not on. If a party can bully it’s members into silence it has no place in a democratic Country.
A damned shame, but highly reflective of the state of affairs with the NZLP currently. I too know the identity of the person involved in this, and there will be future consequences no doubt. Will be interesting to see what happens for me, blogging under my own name, in the future.
Let me say this very clearly: If I wanted a bunch of neanderthal, authoritarian control freaks to govern me I’d vote National.
Seriously, Labour? Targeting and threatening individual party members to silence them?
Anyone on the left who’s been thinking about supporting/voting Labour should be thinking really hard about this. What use are they going to be to us in govt? What good can possibly come from electing them if this is how they respond to criticism when they’re in opposition?
Do you really think this bunch of cunts can be trusted with the full power of the state?
Fuck that. Labour deserve to keep losing if they think this is what democracy looks like.
To be fair to Labour, there is no evidence presented that supports the claim of bullying. A few people are hinting about dark dealings, but nobody’s fronting with the facts. Name and shame, I reckon.
Nah but I’m done with pretending that every. single. one. of these bullshit events is either an isolated incident, part of a teething period, or a mishap unlikely to reoccur, and totally unrelated to a serious cancer embedded in the power structure.
How about you TRP? Are you done with keeping your head up your arse?
What events, felix? All we have is some vague accusations about an unnamed individual MP having a brain fart and possibility unrelated matters concerning a couple of individuals ceasing blogging that are being conflated into the size of a cow. I’m asking for people to put up some evidence to back their claims. The people making the claims are all anonymous, so there should be no comeback on them opening up.
What’s the worst the Labour Party can do to an off-message member anyway? Stop sending the begging letters? Stop asking them to stand on street corners waving signs, or doorknocking, or spending evenings calling for votes? It’s terrifying stuff, indeed.
I’m talking about pretty much everything the Labour leadership has done for the last four years. And at every turn, the refrain is the same: ‘Give them a chance’, and ‘They probably didn’t mean it’, and now your new hilarious one ‘Where’s the evidence that they’re a pack of untrustworthy morons apart from everything they say and do?’
I have no reason to doubt what Irish and Lynn and CV are saying. The Labour leadership, on the other hand…
Thanks for answering the question though, looks like you’re going to need your meals sent up there.
Thanks for clarifying felix. I thought you were talking about the specific events of the day, but apparently you were citing the vibe.
Interesting arse fixation, btw. Are you getting help for it?
You’re in denial, felix. But misinterpreting my position on this matter and the wider question of the leadership of the party over the last four years makes you feel good about yourself, its fine by me. I like to spread a little sunshine everywhere I go.
Apology accepted. For the record, I never denied anything; the whole thrust of my questions was to establish the truth. I now know the facts, via a private source, but I still don’t know why the Standard won’t publish the full story, because it really is appalling behaviour by a half witted bully of an MP.
However, I’m going to assume the lack of detail is to protect the victim/s and leave it at that. But you should know that this incident leaves me very angry indeed and I firmly believe the MP concerned should be de-selected and expelled from the party.
It’s like the marketing department of Hell Pizza. “Oh, what, we gratuitously offended another oppressed group in our quest to look edgy, and it’s blown up in our faces? Oh, that was just one random guy on our team. Honest. A completely different random guy to the random guys we blamed for the last dozen or so gratuitously-offensive fuckups.”
Having once been on the receiving end of bullying behaviour by people in positions of power and/or influence, I know how hard it is to name and shame. These bullies can be in a position to destroy a person’s personal life, career or business and get away with it because others are too scared to stand up to them.
It is up to the Labour leader – or someone else in a very senior position – to swiftly stamp it out.
TRP: There is more than sufficient evidence. At least for me.
The lobbying at the conference which is where this round of it seemed to have started was pretty intense and I’ve had quite a four people independently describing it to me.
The NZ Council debate is something that I have had several direct and indirect sources on.
And the leakage problems from Red Alert were something that I described (ummm) last year in a post after the rumour started flying around that the outing leakages were coming from here.
I’d have to say that Red Alert would have to now be considered to be a complete and utter failure because some numpties never bothered to learn about net culture.
Ok, did I understand that right – the people who run Red Alert are using things like IPs and email addresses to out commenters using pseudonyms? eg the sysop is passing those details on to caucus or other people high up in the Labour party, and that information is being used to harass or in some way control members?
Nah, it’s more that some MPs are spending a large amount of their time trawling through blogs, and Facebook etc, and then intimidating members based on what they say, particularly if it doesn’t agree with them. I don’t know if its an overt strategy or policy of NZ Council, but it’s certainly a policy of about 3-4 core MPs, and there may even be a a rogue one in there who can’t help themselves.
It’s not beyond fixing, but the methods to fix it might be quite challenging.
Nah, it’s more that some MPs are spending a large amount of their time trawling through blogs, and Facebook etc, and then intimidating members based on what they say, particularly if it doesn’t agree with them.
Don’t they have better things to do? Like, say, being an effective opposition?
If you have more than enough evidence, why aren’t you posting it? This guilt by accusation stuff is more suited to WO (or, in recent days, NZF). If there is some substance, lets see it. My apologies to all who don’t get where I’m coming from, but if there is bullying, then the bully needs to be named and shamed. If you do not confront the bully, you are enabling the bully.
Dude, that is beyond weak. Put up the evidence, if it exists. I’m starting to think it doesn’t, because I can see no logical reason why it has to be hidden. There is no downside to having the courage of your convictions, Peter. and the last time I looked at the policy of The Standard, making assertions without being able to substantiate them is considered poor form.
Nope, the ball is in your court. You’re the one making the claim, its up to you to back it up. You won’t, or, more likely, you can’t.
And the name on your passport is not ‘Peter’. That may be one of your names, but only Cher, Madonna and God can claim to be recognized on a single name. And the latter can’t even do that, because He doesn’t exist. So yes, your excuses are weak, ‘Peter’, but as you say the name of the MP has been mentioned already, you can show us how not weak you are by confirming it.
Just for the record: my response above was to a comment from ‘Peter’ that he had the evidence, but he wasn’t go to release it and that the the ‘ball was in their court’. He has since chickened out and deleted the statement, replacing it with the ‘religion’ comment instead. So, it appears that Peter is both a semi-anonymous coward and a fantasist.
Hilarious. Most people who’ve hung around the Labour Party know who I am. But for the record, my name is Peter Wilson, I was a former party member, LEC member, Otago University youth branch founder and president, Otago/Southland Labour regional council chairman for three years. I’ve chaired list conferences, fought on four campaign committees, including two as campaign manager in tough tory blue country. I have also worked in paid employment for a number of MPs, including the MP in question today.
If you do not confront the bully, you are enabling the bully.
Don’t mind if I do, TRP. You called Peter a “semi-anonymous coward”, attacking him for being anonymous and inferring that such cast doubt on his credibility. He told you exactly who he is, and that he has the credentials to know what he is talking about.
Peter, you, IB and LP are all credible people as far as I’m concerned. And that makes your inability to back up your claims all the more puzzling.
You pretend to have faith in their credibility while calling them all liars? Sweet. All the people you have named have told you the situation – they are reluctant for a variety of reasons to post what they know publicly.
You might disagree and think there is no legitimate reason for withholding this information, but last time I checked trying to bully people into doing things that make them uncomfortable is a bad thing.
I’ll tell you why I think this is nothing more than fantasy Blue…
The lobbying at the conference which is where this round of it seemed to have started was pretty intense and I’ve had quite a four people independently describing it to me.
That’s a damn slow grape vine 1prent has got growing there… Wasn’t the conference like three weeks ago?
and that he has the credentials to know what he is talking about.
There’s an unwritten rule in blogging, and moreso in journalism, that you need to be able to verify and back up your claims. That’s the basic difference between good journalism and propaganda.
Without some evidence of these claims, they remain mere speculation and therefore best ignored.
Being that the MSM hasn’t picked up this story either confirms that there’s no actual evidence to base these claims on, being that Labour would likely make a formal complaint to the Press Council if such claims were published in the MSM and were untrue. They don’t have the same opportunity with blogs though because those publication laws don’t apply. However there’s such a thing as good ethical standards with blogs, and I have to agree with Te Reo Putake that such baseless claims are more suitable to WO. Slater might have a large readership, but how much credibility does he actually have? Hint: the answer is not a lot.
Te Reo Putake is correct, IB, LP and PW are all credible commentators… However they do their credibility no favours at all by making claims they cannot back up with evidence. The blogger’s who have posted on such things as if they’re fact are also in danger of losing their credibility. Clearly attempting to damage Labour with unsubstantiated gossip isn’t worth the damage caused to your own standing.
Point missed, blue. There is no reason why the evidence should be suppressed. Therefore, it is possible, even likely, that the evidence does not exist. IB, LP and PW are credible people, hence my amazement at their singular failure to back up their position. It’s not bullying to ask people who are slagging off the Labour Party by claiming bullying to prove it. It’s their claim and at the moment, it looks like total BS.
If, as you say, there are a variety of reasons why their claims cannot be substantiated, they should say so. Peter wasn’t a coward for his anonymity, he was a coward for deleting a comment he wrote, then later regretted. He remains a credible person, in my eyes, just not as credible as he was a few hours ago.
I pulled that last comment on reflection actually, I had already received cease and desist messages privately. I don’t have the time for a legal battle, and I know that the people involved might push it that far. There are other ways of handling it.
Should this actually be what is happening, it would seem to indicate there is much deeper problems flowing through those who masquerade, and so called NZ’ers!
I have to agree with Felix, this stinks, its not isolated, nor is it in anyway in the interests of NZ, or its people!
Why would you be a member anyway? I’ve noticed a change of tone/content of your posts over about the past month or so, and actually wondered if someone else was writing for you…
Just when I thought NZ cricket had the most retarded governance in NZ, Labour appear to have trumped even them with this latest buffoonery.
CV just come back under another handle you did it post loota do it again and keep applying the blowtorch I don’t agree with you most of the time but you are entitled to your opinion – damn their eyes one and all the troughing sacks of shit.
CV just come back under another handle you did it post loota do it again and keep applying the blowtorch I don’t agree with you most of the time but you are entitled to your opinion – damn their eyes one and all the troughing sacks of shit.
Yep. Please do, but take a while first. In fact I’ll give you permission to use as many pseudonyms as you wish.
but I’d suggest a few things to do. You’ll have to shift your writing style between the identities. Your IP’s are quite distinctive, it’d pay to get them changed.
In the meantime there are a few people who just made it to my rather short shit-list for damage to the local net.
Perhaps we show solidarity with CV by including Viper in new pseudonyms.
Clare has him in her sights and Tim Barnett et al will execute on her wishes.
Don’t doubt the seriousness of the behaviour of Curran Hipkins Robertson and Ardern.
They are all graduates of the Parliamentry Party offices.
Controlling from the centre is what they were trained to do.
That is why they found the membership’s behaviour at conference so repugnant.
That is why they have failed to develop RedAlert.
That is why they cannot cope with the Standatd.
That is why they choose Shearer as their Leader.
That is why we are loosing out in electorates associated with them.
That is why we will loose the 2014 election unless we put matters right immediately.
Knives knives everywhere where to hide our friend CV but amongst his friends.
I fictional poem…
I knew a girl called um Clare.
All fat and old and well a haggard wellywood drunk was she.
Played with her raincoat and and her pet duck.
Upto no good, just one of the old hasbeen.
Fly here there and even to pari on a whim.
Tooted jee me lucky.
Well she was nt that bright and um um ahhhh a lot
But at the start it was no I’m not interested in knives and now after years trained by the best of the left poor dear Clare come back for the rest.
Rest in peace cv.
CV, come back alive and well, have enjoyed you over the years. I killed Bored for a different reason (but very similar: got fed up with fighting totalitarians on my own side), his spirit is allowed out of Purgatory for very limited haunting opportunities. Have a superb Christmas.
Isn’t it funny though, only last week people were talking about how bloggers were cowards for not giving their real name and here we have a situation in which a political party is bullying its members into silence and threatening to “out” them in an attempt to stifle dissent. What’s next? You can only vote if you give your name of the party or person you will be voting for?
What it proves is that in order for a democratic society to function it is of the utmost importance to get this dissent out regardless of the manner in which this is done and that includes anonymity.
We vote anonymously because that safeguards us from being manipulated into voting the preferred candidate from the biggest bullies and we should be free to criticize anonymously for the very same reason because that is the only way we can voice our concerns when there are idjits like this “anonimous” MP throwing their weight around trying to bullyi everybody into compliance and I for one hope someone will out the bastard because he has no place in a democratic party
I’d like to think we could get to a place where it’s free to criticize or praise, within reason, without the need for anonymity for fear of repercussions or censure.
Yes, that would be nice but seeing as you don’t use your own name either it seems to me you are realistic enough not to wait until such times come to pass
Recent news in the Guardian, and elsewhere, about how trade union members. left wing bloggers and others who do not have the right political views, in the UK, have been blacklisted and denied employment.
CV leaving us – Nooooooooooooooooooooo. And what is the good reason pray? You can’t desert us making vague comments like that. First Bored and now you. I keep hoping that someone will read and accept some microcosm of what I say so I keep on throwing my pearls before the troops, or should I say rose petals for them to trample on? (My opinion.)
You have been part of a revolt trying to puncture the complacency of centrist Labour, no wonder they find us revolting. The punctured balloon is now rushing round the room making a loud farting noise. Someone needs to be around to blow up a new balloon. Keep some breath for after Christmas and New Year and start the 2013 fun CV.
The “madness” is coming from the other side of the fence.
There are enough democratically inclined MPs in the Labour caucus to put this loopy behaviour to rest once and for all. Please do it? Then members will have little to complain about – including me.
The alleged Labour caucus mole/s need to go away and have a good hard think about freedom of speech and what democracy is.
I have been outspoken regarding wanting Cunliffe to be leader and Shearer to be deputy leader because this is my personal view on the Labour party easily winning the next election. Shearer needs to come out and say that intimidating bloggers is intolerable and to sort out the caucus mole/s.
I have always supported the Labour party on election day and the Labour party needs to learn that they have my loyality even though the leadership issue has not gone as I wanted it to.
It is going to be a bit lonely without CV and Millsy and I miss Vicky32.
I ‘m pretty appalled by this LP caucus leadership behaviour. I will continue to vote Green until Labour become a truly democratic left wing party again. It’s a bit worrying, though, as to what sort of government leadership the Green Party could end up in coalition with.
Indeed, sorry to see you go CV and Millsy – hope you’re back soon. And my sympathies for you in what you seem to appear to be implying you might hypotheically – so to speak – be enduring. Or not.
Why not just adopt a new moniker til the heat is off? I recently switched from using my real name in protest against the criticism of “anonymous bloggers” 😀
Be prepared for some ritualised “jumping in” though – this place is a bit like the Headhunters, after all 😉
This is frankly shit, CV. Not your decision, but being made to feel it’s one you have to make because some people who should be champions of democracy (since they live and die by it) have decided they can’t handle criticism.
There’s plenty we don’t agree on but you’re usually (i.e. when not disagreeing with me :P) a damn fine commenter on this blog and your presence will be missed.
Once legitimacy is lost no matter what tactics are employed whether bureaucratic or violent. For leaders who lose their legitimacy in the eyes of their people it is only a matter of time.
Such desperate tactics are not those of strong leadership, (no matter what the MSM tell us) but of weak leadership.
Kia kaha CV. Ka whawhai tonu matou, Ake Ake Ake
I know that you will heed the words and example of Rewi Maniapoto and continue fighting on the battle ground of your choosing.
More like on the barracades.
Wave the standard fly it high.
Here come all the vipers united and determined.
A collective you will see, a movement of justice of faith of friends and of power.
Once small growing big,
Live long cv and prosper
Quite possibly. I see that Labour Party Mayor Len Brown and his council are still determined to evict the Maritime Union from the Ports of Auckland. This despite the union making massive concessions in wages and conditions.
Oh did they now.
well if we get a oil induced big mother crunch it might be the barricades to get some progress.
Can’t see any of this shower ( labour ) working thru a crisis.
Another angle is that upon the TS it would appear that most um members are agreeing on one main thread – that we need a new direction focused on real and meaningful change and betterment for people that is a holistic systematic approach…a new way.
A new way forward, progress that is linked to green, brown and red ideology. Blue is dead.so
This is our barricade where we have raised the flag and where our voices get heard.
We learn as a group, we debate and comment freely, and in a growing manner we are becoming more heard.
History and recent event have shown that united voices, a movement, can cause change.
So to the barricades I say.
Disclaimer. TS is a blog, has no opinion or motive but solely as a vehicle for individual to express themselves in a legal and considered manner.
But like minded individual historically have shaped events, challenged the status quo and there works deeds and action in a collective manner created a focal point of change.
CV – I am bothered! This is a shocker to me. Your posts have been amongst the most respected ones I read on TS. I know I am not at all easy, and I have my health and other issues too, deservedly at times having been criticised by some.
I am shit worried about what is going on in Labour and the left as such.
Yes, I find it hard to believe what is going on.
Hang in there, same as millsy and others, never give up, as the challenge must be taken on the bloody chin. They are bloody asking for it.
I repeat: It is time for a NEW left party, inclusive enough and robust enough, to take on the challenge from the rotten right of spectrum NatZies. Take a break and think about it, all yours that have politics of fairness and justice at heart. It must be dared and done, we get nowhere with the present lot!
Thanks for your comments the other day. I’m pleased you’re having a better day. Hang in there.
I’m thinking the option may not necessarily a party in the traditional sense but a coalition of independent left wing politicians where each vote is similar to every vote being a conscience vote.
This might allow a much more diverse range of left-wing views in parliament.
I’d be happy to have such left-wing diversity in parliament.
A headline gleaned off of this morning’s National Radio, Starbucks the international coffee chain have agreed to pay more tax in Britain,
The interesting bit here is that Starbucks have ‘agreed’ to pay more tax, what this is really highlighting is that the Neo-Liberal thieves of international business are sharing the bed with the Neo-Liberal weaklings of British politics,(guess who’s on top),
Wouldn’t the proper headline be that Starbucks had had all it’s profits of the past decade seized by the British Government and had been ordered to pay it’s fair share of taxation in the future,(you can bet the same rorts have been, and are, happening here in New Zealand),
Yesterday’s headline from the same place, (Radio NZ), told of a couple of the bigger electronic manufacturers who had been spanked by the European Union for ‘price fixing’ on Cathode Tubes, (apparently the most expensive bit in ya TV or laptop),
The participants in that particular rort have apparently been for the past decade artificially bumping up the price of that particular piece of electronic gear in a little closed shop price fixing scam much the same as the banks were ‘fixing’ the interest rates they charged,
We are all as consumers effected by these multi-national rorts from tax avoidance to price fixing, its you and me that pay for this criminality, this is the true face of so called ‘self regulating’ business be it local or international…
The report I saw on Al Jazeera this morning, identified customer feedback as the reason for the change: meaning, I guess, Starbucks are afraid of losing customers and will pay as little extra tax as they can get away with.
The revelations led to calls for a boycott of the store and protests at its branches, and the company’s Chief Financial Officer Troy Alstead was called to give evidence to a parliamentary committee.
Starbucks repeated on Sunday that it had always complied with British tax laws and blamed its low tax payments on a tough operating environment in the UK.
However, a spokeswoman added in an emailed statement that the public mood had caused the company to reconsider its tax arrangements, which include intercompany royalty and interest payments that reduce the UK unit’s taxable profit.
“We have listened to feedback from our customers and employees, and understand that to maintain and further build public trust we need to do more,” she said.
bad12
Further to that google was implicated. They and other similar coys do not intend to change their payment regime as it is legal. The politicians trying to encourage big business to their shores!
And big business will just fill up their longboats with loot and return to their bases with it. And do what? They have visions like Kubla Khan no doubt – In Xanadu did Kubla Khan, A stately pleasure-dome decree:
Yeah, i am sure that far more than just Google and Starbucks are involved in that particular tax-scam,
Here we have the Neo-liberal apologists doing the hand wringing thing describing tax-avoidance as ‘immoral’ but not illegal so what can they do,
The above was basically the ‘Hairdo from Ohariu’s’ response to questions put to Him recently on New Zealand’s estimated 7 billion dollars of annual avoidance and evasion of due taxation which Dunne as Revenue Minister in quite a few Governments has happily overseen,
When faced with such an attitude from Government Ministers anyone suddenly robbred of the power of speech except for the muttered word f**k would have to be forgiven because when you count the numbers we would have NO Government debt problem if those involved in the ‘immoral’ avoidance of taxation were criminalized and made to pay their due taxation….
The commonsense man sure has a lot of people fooled. The electorate think he tries to make commonsense decisions about policy, in fact the commonsense all relates to the question ‘Is this good for P Dunne?’. It’s commonsense to look after No.1, who else will?
Smart trick St Peter.
(you can bet the same rorts have been, and are, happening here in New Zealand),
Considering the fact that NZ has become a tax haven we’ll be one of the countries that all those taxes that the multinational’s aren’t paying are going through.
DTB
Going through. Sounds like diahrroea and that leads to malnutrition because the food doesn’t stay long enough to be absorbed and used by the body. Fast money passing through tax havens has much the same effect on the country I should think.
What effect would such fast money have on our exchange rate? Would it be an advantage to the financial guys here to have a high exchange rate or not I wonder? Would this be one of the reasons why we can never play around with our exchange rate? Presumably if it wasn’t so stable it wouldn’t be so attractive.
The Cullen fund is the most innovative sovereign fund in the world. Why does that not make me feel confident about the fund? Could be because of this for starters:
Neil Williams, Chief Investment Advisor and Head of Strategic Tilting
Neil joined the Guardians in 2008 from UBS Global Asset Management in London where he was Global Head of Asset Allocation and a Managing Director in Global Investment Solutions. Neil was previously Chief Global Strategist, Executive Director for Goldman Sachs International (London).
Use of the words innovate/innovative can be found all over the various sectors these days, and concerningly the public sector, having been taken over by consultants, is using them braordly.
One can take it as finding new ways to steal, rip off and deceive the public, is all those words mean.
The fund will be in serious trouble, like everything else where the words innovate/innovative, can be seen, heard or read!
When people start using the words innovate.innovative in conjunction with finance then I’d expect that company/sovereign fund to be headed for a crash. The innovation in the finance sector was, after all, a major cause of the GFC.
If you are like me and trying to get your head around the TPP scam, the past two episodes of Citizen A have been worth a watch. Bomber has had Jane Kelsey on, as well as other new guests.
The 29th Nov & the 6th Dec episodes have focused solely on the TPP – stream them here
Also, the last issue of Werewolf focuses on the TPP…Gordon Campbell & Co doing their thing (real journalists)
In my own experience, the lack of instinctive democracy among the Labour hierarchy was demonstrated by Jim Anderton’s approach to running the NLP and the Alliance. Jim and a few others seemed far more interested in building a monolithic authoritarian structure than in actually changing anything. The activists found themselves either burned out or making accomodations, and an opportunity was lost. This behaviour is why the only hope I have for Labour is that they will become a junior coalition partner in a Green/Mana government and learn once again why they exist. My fear is that many of those at the centre of things would prefer going into a government of “National Unity” or some other Bonapartist rubbish in order to keep the radicals at bay.
Anything else I might say on this would purely be idle speculation and possibly highly defamatory. I have no knowledge – directly or indirectly – of the case, but I feel the story itself is important to take note of. I would caution against any speculation here.
Piss off. I reckon it could be Bob the Builder, that ex-MP. Or maybe even that ding-dong Simon Bridges. Or what about Winston Peters or isn’t that goofy weatherman MP Brendan Horan from the Mount?
Ffs, I know some secrets too but I couldn’t possibly tell anyone…..
just as well the internet only exists in the ether eh what.
I did not realise that a 12 year old was assaulted and that they have physical injuries and nightmares, I apologise for my comment as I am against physical violence especially when children are harmed.
personally I don’t see the point to your comments.
Either the guy gets done for something serious and we find out in good time, or he’s not found guilty of anything serious and keeps name suppression because there’s no public interest in knowing that he did or didn’t do something that’s not serious in the first place. And by the nature of name suppression, the guy might just be a provincial used car salesman or gp.
Methinks your linking and thinking is a touch premature.
I remember talking to one of my best friends (a Russian jew) about 12 years ago about the fact that I was anti-Zionist but that it didn’t make me an anti-Semite. He immediately dismissed it and lumped me in with the drive-the-Israelis-into-the-sea brigade (which I am increasingly seeing as more of a figment of Israel’s collective imagination than a genuine goal of Arabic people).
I think though that it’s important that people realise that it’s OK to be anti-Zionist and that they shouldn’t feel guilty about speaking out against the Zionist expansionism of the Israeli state. Succinct but articulate article, unlike this post 😉
Weka previously when I asked you if the Greens would continue to ignore Climate Change during the next election as they had in the previous one. After quoting back to me, my original question, here, after a long winded preamble, you gave your answer stating:
……I just don’t think it’s the job or responsibility of the GP to do this at this point. Time for others to step up.
weka
In response to your answer. I asked you another, and even simpler question:
Who?
Jenny
Weka it’s a simple question. Why won’t you answer?
Weka, if, it is not “the job or responsibility of the Green Party to do this at this point.”
Whoops. I think, in the last half hour, I accidentally published a post I am typing up – report on this evening’s demo in Auckland. Sorry if I caused any confusion.
The hereditary peer, who is not a member of the House of Lords, took the chair of Myanmar and spoke into the microphone against UN climate change protocols.
After a short speech, in which he was booed, he was escorted out of the meeting by UN guards.
He is understood to have claimed there is no global warming in the last sixteen years, and therefore the science needs to be reviewed.
This has me worried, Labour must be very confident if it can start removing members willy-nilly…but seriously as much as I enjoy watching the looney left eat itself (and I do) this turn of events is startling.
One of the things I like about this blog is you can (more or less) say what you think as opposed to redalert which, lets face it, is pretty dull
I’m just not sure whether its more Stalinist or 1984ish in what this un-named MP wants
Not wanting to go into crystal ball gazing but if this goes ahead when Labour are in opposition (I don’t think it will because of the publicity) what would be the next logical step when Labour gets back into power?
Targeting all those who support right wing policies?
Targeting all those who don’t support left wing policies? (but dont support right wing policies)
Targeting all those who dont support the Leaders policies?
And once they target those people what will they do then?
Whispering in the bright bright sun labour elites want a quiet capture of the centre area but the rebellious ignorant shrill members are perceived to be upsetting the plan by speaking freely putting up remits and questioning the established structure and it’s power cliques.how dear they say the elites…we know best you bleet bleet and are sheep sheep sheep but pay your dues cause we need the cash cash cash to bribe the dog so we can drink from the trough trough trough.
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Extinction Rebellion takes a tour of downtown Wellington to point out the coal industry stalwarts and ask why they’re still there in the face of a climate emergency. “There are coal companies in Wellington??”That’s the incredulous response every single time we mention taking the public on a tour of the biggest ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Rachel A. Ankeny, Professor of History and Philosophy, and Deputy Dean Research (Faculty of Arts), University of Adelaide The South Australian government recently announced its intention to lift the long-standing statewide moratorium on genetically modified (GM) crops, following a statutory six-week consultation ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Vicki Sentas, Senior Lecturer, UNSW Law, UNSW Being strip searched by the police can be intrusive, humiliating and harmful. Typically, strip searches involve being required to strip naked in front of police officers, who often give the direction to “squat and cough”, ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Louise Remond, Clinical Psychologist, University of Technology Sydney Hi, I was just wondering if something’s wrong with me because I’m never happy and never want to do anything and I’m getting really lazy and I really hate school. Thanks – Anonymous ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Luke Zaphir, Researcher for the University of Queensland Critical Thinking Project; and Online Teacher at Education Queensland’s IMPACT Centre, The University of Queensland From as early as Grade 3 teachers start teaching children how to put across their own points of view. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Richard Holden, Professor of Economics, UNSW It’s four years since then Prime Minister Tony Abbott warned Australia had been heading to “a Greek-style economic future”. He was referring to what he said had been happening under the previous Labor government. When Labor ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Samia Khatun, Senior Lecturer, SOAS, University of London Some 1,000 kilometres inland from Sydney, over the Blue Mountains, past the trees that drink the tributaries of the Darling River, there stands a little, red mosque. It marks where the desert begins. The ...
Online gambling is growing fast in New Zealand, but critics say new government ideas for regulating websites focus on what's good for the industry, rather than protecting people from harm. ...
An "extreme pro-Beijing" writer has caused controversy in the Chinese community and awkwardness for the Labour Party by standing for political office in Auckland. ...
Good morning, and welcome to The Bulletin. In today’s edition: Concern about slow progress for major transport projects, smoking researcher under pressure over funding, and hikoi marches from Ihumātao to Ardern’s office.NZTA is struggling to get spending out the door, so the money isn’t flowing through the economy, reports Thomas Coughlan ...
Speaker of the House Trevor Mallard will look at whether people making submissions on proposed law changes should be forced to disclose conflicts of interest. ...
Rugby and league legend Honey Hireme has put all her careers on hold - including her Warriors debut - to take care of her mum, who has terminal cancer. ...
In the ongoing battle to prevent 480 houses being built on ancestral land, a petition with more than 26,000 signatures was delivered to the Prime Minister’s Mt Albert office yesterday. Leonie Hayden was there.Lead by the inimitable Pania Newton, about 100 kaitiaki set off from Ihumātao near Māngere yesterday morning ...
Every scholarship exam and approximately every two external assessments are wrapped in their own single-use plastic bag. We’re asking the NZQA to cut it out, writes year-13 student Sophia HoneyEvery year after an exam, I see the same conversation happen. Friends turn to each other, talk about how difficult that ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra Even Scott Morrison, with his abundant self-belief, couldn’t have imagined that on Saturday’s first anniversary of his seizing the prime ministership, he’d be winging his way to France for a G7 meeting, where Australia has ...
A group of students, including some Youth MPs, have been banned from Parliament for a year, after singing a waiata in the public gallery in support of the Ihumātao hīkoi. ...
National MP Nick Smith has lodged a serious accusation against Parliament's Speaker calling him "biased" after once again being booted out of the debating chamber. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Sunanda Creagh, Head of Digital Storytelling Last weekend, hundreds of thousands of people again took to the streets in Hong Kong to protest against the government – the 11th straight weekend of demonstrations that began in June over a proposed extradition bill. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Scott Hamilton, Strategic Advisory Panel Member, Australian-German Energy Transition Hub, University of Melbourne Australia’s primary federal renewable energy target – to have 33 terawatts of renewable energy by 2020 – has essentially been achieved. There is much uncertainty as to what is ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Lewis Mitchell, Senior Lecturer in Applied Mathematics, University of Adelaide I swear by Hypatia, by Lovelace, by Turing, by Fisher (and/or Bayes), and by all the statisticians and data scientists, making them my witnesses, that I will carry out, according to ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By John Blaxland, Professor, Strategic and Defence Studies Centre, Australian National University Just when we thought Australia was getting serious about shifting priorities away from the Middle East to its own neighbourhood, the prime minister has announced another Middle East step up. Australia ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Brendan Keogh, ARC DECRA Fellow, Queensland University of Technology In the last three months, the Australian Classification Board has “refused classification” for at least four video games – effectively banning them in Australia. The latest is zombie-survival shooter DayZ. Despite being previously ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Clare Collins, Professor in Nutrition and Dietetics, University of Newcastle The Heart Foundation now recommends full-fat milk, cheese and yoghurt or reduced-fat options as part of its updated dietary advice released yesterday. This moves away from earlier advice that recommended only reduced-fat ...
Business is Boring is a weekly podcast series presented by The Spinoff in association with Callaghan Innovation. Host Simon Pound speaks with innovators and commentators focused on the future of New Zealand. This week he talks to Paris Georgia co-founders Paris Mitchell Temple and Georgia Cherrie.This week’s podcast features a ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra Former deputy prime minister Tim Fischer, who has died aged 73 of cancer, leaves a political and personal legacy as a man of courage, conviction and congeniality. The support that Fischer as National Party leader ...
One part telenovela, one part family drama, one part addictive love story. Sam Brooks reviews Jane the Virgin, the great show with an unfortunate name that should be your next Netflix binge.The following piece contains very mild spoilers for Jane the Virgin.While watching the last season of Jane the Virgin, ...
Before Zumba, before Just Dance, before it was cool again to move in public group settings, there was Jump Jam. Madeleine Chapman reflects.Jump Jam entered the lives of New Zealand kids in 2001, a year filled with historic cultural movements. Harry Potter and the Philosopher’s Stone was released in 2001; ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Felicity Jensz, Research associate professor, University of Münster Donald Trump is not the first US President to make an offer of buying Greenland from Denmark – but he might be the last. Home of some 56,000 people and around 80% covered by ...
We review the entire country and culture of New Zealand, one thing at a time. Today, Tara Ward taste-tests the best hot chips in the country. Everyone loves a hot chip because they’re a) hot, and b) a chip, but there’s nothing more disappointing than a bad chip experience. A ...
Sky Network Television has written down the value of large parts of its business and scrapped paying a dividend as it changes direction to counter falling pay TV subscribers. ...
Open mike 07/12/2012 
Nothing from me tody - I'm off to Christchurch to pretend to be other people for a weekend. Normal bloggage should resume on Tuesday. ...24 mins ago
Spark is bracing for a customer backlash as rugby fans all across the country struggle to get a picture on their wireless router. With the Rugby World Cup fast approaching, an elderly Taranaki couple are furious after being told that they still won’t be able to watch the tournament, even ...13 hours ago
Several explosions have been reported across Auckland, as well-meaning environmentalists have already begun purchasing too much petrol Starting from next week, customers will no longer need a car to purchase petrol directly from the pump, a development that two major fuel providers are billing as an opportunity to help fight ...14 hours ago
A new study claims to find that a mother’s exposure to fluoridated water during pregnancy may decrease the IQ of male children – but is it correct? (Photo: Getty Images) Anti-fluoride campaigners are promoting ... 16 hours ago
Television advertising has a huge impact on our lives. Even if we don’t recognise that, we know it has to be true, since otherwise why would advertisers spend so much on it? Its significance, however, is greater than simply the influence it has on what we purchase and consume. It ...2 days ago
by Jan Rivers More than 30 years ago a Commission of Inquiry was held in New Zealand to investigate, amongst other things, whether women with cervical cancer were aware that they had been part of a research project and whether they were properly informed of the treatment options ...3 days ago
Everyone Wants To Be Fuhrer: When fascist groups are discussed, the image conjured-up in the minds of most New Zealanders is one of pathetic misfits. This negative impression is reinforced by the latter’s idiotic embrace of the swastika. Even in the second decade of the twenty-first century, the baleful legacy ...3 days ago
In the previous two posts, I laid out the context and set the theoretical framework to answer a question: whether indigenous economies should take the LEAP. This final part outlines ways to conceive of practicing mana motuhake within the existing legal system by carving out special jurisdictions that enable Indigenous ...5 days ago
Fully Informed? Labour’s 2017 promises raised expectations that were little short of revolutionary. Unfortunately, they were never adequately shaken through the fiscal sieve. The hard economic work was not done – and it shows. Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern’s critics have long complained that her grasp of the way the New ...5 days ago
You cannot expect to pound communities into the ground day after day, year after year, decade after decade and just expect them to take it lying down. There’s a point at which the place will explode. And we’re faced with some very big ructions on both sides of the Atlantic ...7 days ago
7 days ago
Going Down? Once truth and propaganda become fused in the minds of one’s followers, debate and discussion become redundant. If one’s opponents are all outrageous liars, then engaging with them in any way is pointless. Rather than waste its time, a political party should, instead, target all its messages at ...7 days ago
We need to fundamentally reframe our systems settings to address the drivers causing and underpinning inequality; structural change in systems especially financial. The Equality Network Hui was held in Wellington on 27 June 2019. The hui covered important topics such as child poverty; a living wage; taxation; public health; mental ...1 week ago
The views-per-page for some of my recent postings:Depressing, isn't it? Provide thoughtful and wise commentary on the mainstream of British politics and no-one notices. Make a passing reference to Tommy DICKHEAD Robinson in a thread title and you get hundreds of views. Write something about anti-Semitism and you get another ...1 week ago
The government has announced plans to move the Treaty of Waitangi and other taonga to a new site. Great news! So where are they going? Right next to the old one:The new plan will see a new 22,000-square-metre archive built on the former site of Defence House - the former ...1 week ago
Back in June, StatsNZ went public about a project to track population data on an hourly level by using people's cellphones. It wasn't as bad as it initially looked - they were receiving no individual data, only counts by suburb - but there was still a huge consent problem, so ...1 week ago
I did an interview on the TVNZ Breakfast Show about the situation in Hong Kong. I tried to frame the issue as a collective action problem between two sides with very different end games. The video is here. Because of time constraints we could not discuss the fact that the ...1 week ago
Image Credit: Wild Rose College A new study reporting the ranges of values for kidney and liver parameters in a healthy population is being actively misrepresented by anti-fluoride campaigners. The Fluoride Action Network’s (FAN) latest ... 1 week ago
Alone, Alone. All, All Alone: Will it be a good or a bad thing, when humanity’s bright blue spacecraft is stricken by the civilisation-destroying problem of Climate Change, that no Huston Control will be standing-by to rescue the crew?“WE HAVE A PROBLEM, HUSTON.” These were the words used by the ...1 week ago
Divided Loyalties: Can the Prime Minister, Jacinda Ardern, be relied upon? That’s what the boys and girls at Foggy Bottom and the Pentagon needed to be reassured about. Because, from the perspective of Washington, it’s looking more and more like Jacinda Ardern and her Labour Party comrades are getting ready ...2 weeks ago
This handy Queer Theory Glossary is from thetranswidow.com In case you’ve had trouble keeping up with the spate of new queer theory terms, here’s a handy glossary for your reference. Queer – A straight person with an interesting haircut. Non-binary/genderqueer – A chubby young female, typically 16-28, who has ...2 weeks ago
The winter grazing issue is becoming a highly sensitised one that I hope will not become so politicised that it delays solutions and results in the suicides of some very stressed farmers.Winter grazing has hit the headlines after a determined campaign, including the release of a video of some very ...2 weeks ago
The Green Part has been accused of lack of transparency in two recent situations. The first was the claimed media lockdown during Green's annual conference and the second was Julie Ann Genter's refusal to release a letter she had sent to Phil Twyford.I do get frustrated when journalist's succumb to ...2 weeks ago
Opportunities to dodge tax are shrinking with the completion of a new tax agreement with Switzerland, Revenue Minister Stuart Nash announced today. Mr Nash and the Swiss Ambassador David Vogelsanger have today signed documents to update the double tax agreement (DTA). The previous DTA was signed in 1980. “Double tax ...2 weeks ago
The excuses about a reportedly unwanted $57,000 payrise for Dunedin City Council CEO Sue Bidrose are laughable, says the New Zealand Taxpayers’ Union. ...28 mins ago
Editor’s Note: Here below is a list of the main issues currently under discussion in New Zealand and links to media coverage.
A community representative in Auckland says she's been sidelined by her peers after posting photos online with Green and Labour party MPs. ...44 mins ago
Extinction Rebellion takes a tour of downtown Wellington to point out the coal industry stalwarts and ask why they’re still there in the face of a climate emergency. “There are coal companies in Wellington??”That’s the incredulous response every single time we mention taking the public on a tour of the biggest ...49 mins ago
Dairy's huge role earning export dollars for New Zealand is facing a threat some say could bring it to its knees. ...2 hours ago
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Vicki Sentas, Senior Lecturer, UNSW Law, UNSW Being strip searched by the police can be intrusive, humiliating and harmful. Typically, strip searches involve being required to strip naked in front of police officers, who often give the direction to “squat and cough”, ...3 hours ago
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Louise Remond, Clinical Psychologist, University of Technology Sydney Hi, I was just wondering if something’s wrong with me because I’m never happy and never want to do anything and I’m getting really lazy and I really hate school. Thanks – Anonymous ...3 hours ago
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Luke Zaphir, Researcher for the University of Queensland Critical Thinking Project; and Online Teacher at Education Queensland’s IMPACT Centre, The University of Queensland From as early as Grade 3 teachers start teaching children how to put across their own points of view. ...3 hours ago
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Richard Holden, Professor of Economics, UNSW It’s four years since then Prime Minister Tony Abbott warned Australia had been heading to “a Greek-style economic future”. He was referring to what he said had been happening under the previous Labor government. When Labor ...3 hours ago
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Samia Khatun, Senior Lecturer, SOAS, University of London Some 1,000 kilometres inland from Sydney, over the Blue Mountains, past the trees that drink the tributaries of the Darling River, there stands a little, red mosque. It marks where the desert begins. The ...3 hours ago
Online gambling is growing fast in New Zealand, but critics say new government ideas for regulating websites focus on what's good for the industry, rather than protecting people from harm. ...3 hours ago
More than 100,000 Chinese citizens have studied in New Zealand in the past 20 years. ...3 hours ago
An "extreme pro-Beijing" writer has caused controversy in the Chinese community and awkwardness for the Labour Party by standing for political office in Auckland. ...4 hours ago
Good morning, and welcome to The Bulletin. In today’s edition: Concern about slow progress for major transport projects, smoking researcher under pressure over funding, and hikoi marches from Ihumātao to Ardern’s office.NZTA is struggling to get spending out the door, so the money isn’t flowing through the economy, reports Thomas Coughlan ...4 hours ago
New Zealand's only national book sales chart, as recorded by Nielsen BookScan New Zealand and described by Steve Braunias. ...5 hours ago
A ban on fossil fuel vehicle imports from 2035 was set to go to Cabinet, before a change of heart. ...5 hours ago
Rugby and league legend Honey Hireme has put all her careers on hold - including her Warriors debut - to take care of her mum, who has terminal cancer. ...5 hours ago
The IPCC's Mark Howden speaks to Eloise Gibson about Aussie farmers' growing acceptance of climate change and his take on NZ’s methane debate. ...5 hours ago
NZ can't spare naval ships to help a US-led mission near Iran - but there's a good chance we don't need them at all. ...5 hours ago
In the ongoing battle to prevent 480 houses being built on ancestral land, a petition with more than 26,000 signatures was delivered to the Prime Minister’s Mt Albert office yesterday. Leonie Hayden was there.Lead by the inimitable Pania Newton, about 100 kaitiaki set off from Ihumātao near Māngere yesterday morning ...6 hours ago
Every scholarship exam and approximately every two external assessments are wrapped in their own single-use plastic bag. We’re asking the NZQA to cut it out, writes year-13 student Sophia HoneyEvery year after an exam, I see the same conversation happen. Friends turn to each other, talk about how difficult that ...6 hours ago
Polls world wide suggest the Holocaust is being forgotten. A NZ survivor is working to make sure it isn't. ...6 hours ago
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra Even Scott Morrison, with his abundant self-belief, couldn’t have imagined that on Saturday’s first anniversary of his seizing the prime ministership, he’d be winging his way to France for a G7 meeting, where Australia has ...12 hours ago
By distorting the climate truth Federated Farmers is making its members complacent about their performance and blind to the threats they face. ...13 hours ago
ANALYSIS: By Camellia Webb-Gannon of the University of Wollongong Last weekend, the Indonesian police took 43 West Papuan students into custody for allegedly disrespecting the Indonesian flag during an independence day celebration (an allegation the students deny). Police stormed the students’ dorm and used teargas to force them out, ...14 hours ago
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Scott Hamilton, Strategic Advisory Panel Member, Australian-German Energy Transition Hub, University of Melbourne Australia’s primary federal renewable energy target – to have 33 terawatts of renewable energy by 2020 – has essentially been achieved. There is much uncertainty as to what is ...17 hours ago
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Brendan Keogh, ARC DECRA Fellow, Queensland University of Technology In the last three months, the Australian Classification Board has “refused classification” for at least four video games – effectively banning them in Australia. The latest is zombie-survival shooter DayZ. Despite being previously ...18 hours ago
Government agencies are taking an unconventional approach to family violence solutions. ...18 hours ago
Sky Network Television has bought the rights to put its name on Wellington's Westpac Stadium. ...20 hours ago
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Clare Collins, Professor in Nutrition and Dietetics, University of Newcastle The Heart Foundation now recommends full-fat milk, cheese and yoghurt or reduced-fat options as part of its updated dietary advice released yesterday. This moves away from earlier advice that recommended only reduced-fat ...20 hours ago
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Libby Porter, Professor of Urban Planning, Centre for Urban Research, RMIT University The Victorian government has announced it is seeking heritage listing for parts of the Eastern Freeway in Melbourne. We heard this news on Wednesday as we sat under a grandfather ...20 hours ago
A flood and a botched insurance job has left a Howick couple out of their home for almost two years. But it's a story with some strange twists. ...20 hours ago
One part telenovela, one part family drama, one part addictive love story. Sam Brooks reviews Jane the Virgin, the great show with an unfortunate name that should be your next Netflix binge.The following piece contains very mild spoilers for Jane the Virgin.While watching the last season of Jane the Virgin, ...21 hours ago
Before Zumba, before Just Dance, before it was cool again to move in public group settings, there was Jump Jam. Madeleine Chapman reflects.Jump Jam entered the lives of New Zealand kids in 2001, a year filled with historic cultural movements. Harry Potter and the Philosopher’s Stone was released in 2001; ...22 hours ago
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Felicity Jensz, Research associate professor, University of Münster Donald Trump is not the first US President to make an offer of buying Greenland from Denmark – but he might be the last. Home of some 56,000 people and around 80% covered by ...22 hours ago
Live updates: Around 150 are taking part in the hīkoi to the PM's electorate office from Ihumātao in a bid to get her to visit the site. ...22 hours ago
We review the entire country and culture of New Zealand, one thing at a time. Today, Tara Ward taste-tests the best hot chips in the country. Everyone loves a hot chip because they’re a) hot, and b) a chip, but there’s nothing more disappointing than a bad chip experience. A ...23 hours ago
Sky Network Television has written down the value of large parts of its business and scrapped paying a dividend as it changes direction to counter falling pay TV subscribers. ...23 hours ago
This will be my last post on the Standard (and probably any other blog) for a while at least – not too sure when Ill be able to post again, but it wont be until well into the New Year at least (perhaps when everthing has settled down) — my personal circumstances look set to change in a rather dramatic way, and it is because of that I wont be in a position to contribute to this blog. Its been great chatting to you all, and I have enjoyed reading the thoughts of everyone here, though the right wingers always seem to want to put the boot in all the time.
I think the left is in pretty good shape at the moment, and 2014 will see a Sixth Labour government, that is probably more to the left than Clark’s one was, though how far to the left remains to be seen. It all depends on how the asset sales referendum pans out, and the outcome of the PoA dispute. I see both of these as defining issues in this country — public/collective v individual/private, and security v flexibility.
So, on that note, Farewell, Merry Christmas, Happy new year, and hope to catch up with you all in the New Year some time.
Cheers to you, millsy, hope the change in circ’s is not a negative one and I look forward to being amused, bemused and occasionally confused by you again in the near future!
Sorry to see go millsy. Take care. Haere ra.
Eek come back soon Millsy.
Kia kaha millsy
All the best Millsy…What ever the circumstances, you will be well served having has a break from the boards.
Good luck Millsy, hope it all works out well. Having a break is very liberating.
All the best Millsy – I will miss your astute comments.
Merry Christmas Millsy. Hope all goes well.
Ok….
dont bend over for the soap.
just putting it out there.
Kiaora millsy
Look forward to your return. Take care.
Does this mean the end of posts from EDDIE on pain of his expulsion from the Labour Party?
For this to happen to a loyal Labour Party member who has done nothing but ably stand up for the party on line, while John Tamihere after continually slanging off Labour in the MSM, is welcomed back as a member and embraced as a long lost prodigal son.
Yes kind Lefty souls, I’m bugging out too, returning at some future date (hopefully not too far away). IB has highlighted some reasons why, and the stuff he is talking about isn’t kidding around. The miserable and ill-conceived pressure they are putting on Cunliffe and his supporters in caucus, well they are now turning that on to ordinary party members as well. Organisations which find themselves in this state, well what more do I need to say.
I shan’t be back for a wee while unless there is good reason 😎
Good hunting to you all!
Fuck. Sorry to hear that. Take care CV.
Goodness. It’s sounding like a Purge. Well, as I’m not a member, I guess I remain free…..
Take care,CV.
To those considering how to respond to something like a Purge, reflect on this:
“In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends.”
It is probably for the best at present CV. My abject apologies for not having the energy/time to talk to you (work is hectic).
I never care.
Quite frankly the party could do with my skills far more than I need the party. I’ve pretty well withdrawn from party activity over recent years as the environment has become more toxic.
But I’d advise anyone who has used a pseudonym on Red Alert that could compromise them in real life to expect problems. The system operators over there are quite compromised, don’t act responsibly, and have been that way for some time. Quite simply they are not operating in a way that makes it safe to leave comments there unless you have cast-iron anonymity. Treat it like you would Whaleoil’s site.
Which incidentally, is why you don’t see Red Alert on our feed
Actually, it wouldn’t ruin my life to be outed, especially as I am semi-retired. It might be a bit tricky at work, but probably not totally damaging. My preference for a pseudonym is partly because, personally I’m a fairly shy person.
Some people see it as a contradiction, that I can be very talkative and confident in a teaching or discussion context. But socially, I am often the quiet person in a group. I don’t enjoy being the centre of attention.
Tempted as I am to suggest that maybe your father in law has finally snapped and told you to log off and go get a job, I’ll restrict myself to saying I too will miss your contributions, CV. You maintained an excellence balance between quantity and quality in your comments and there will be many a chastened rightie feeling relieved that you are signing off. Hope its not for too long.
ps: I’m looking forward to the inevitable post from PG on your departure over at Yawn NZ. What greater tribute could there be?
Nope. This is an actual problem. There was a threat of “outing” by a MP that came up during the lobbying at conference. Subsequently it was raised by the same MP in the NZ Council as part of the lobbying to push Tamihere’s membership through.
It fits the same pattern of behaviour as Shane Jones demonstrates. A caucus that does things less by focused strategy and more by stupid intimidation.
I’d advise people to think carefully before putting comments at Red Alert if your identity can in anyway be traced back to you. I guess that is why the comments are dropping like a stone over there.
It is quite unacceptable net behaviour.
To be honest I struggle to see why there is a reticence amongst those in the know to name said MP. Should we not all know the character of those that are possibly going to be representing us next term?
(Sorry, I’m not singling you out Lynn, it was just your post I replied to).
Figure it through in legal and political terms.
It is quite a specific assertion of fact. To make it you’d have to be fairly confident that you have people who are willing to testify to its veracity. In this case that would probably happen.
There is little point naming the person(s) when what is actually required is a change of collective behaviour by caucus in the way that they handle a blogs and their net presence. In particular the malfeasant transfer of information that should be private out of Red Alert and matching it with other information, like comments on this site.
But there is a rather nice effect in not naming the person(s) concerned. It effectively throws the uncertainty about who did the malfeasance back on the whole of caucus – which is actually where the responsibility lies.
And it is probably a whole lot more effective for caucus to deal with their own.
“And it is probably a whole lot more effective for caucus to deal with their own.”
Yes, because they’re not just a bunch of self interested troughers……………
1Prent
You have to be fucking kidding! You’re saying a Labour MP threatened to out Colonial Viper and others because they were writing things the unnamed Labour MP didn’t like… And that the same threat was made to ensure John Tamihere was granted admission by the New Zealand Council of the Labour Party?
Am I missing something here? How exactly is threatening to out Colonial Viper (unless he/she is a Labour party MP which I doubt) going to influence a party decision and why would the New Zealand Council of the Labour Party give a shit?
Labour has been collectively saying they will out bloggers who are also members of the Labour party if they speak out against the party? I think you have lost it 1prent. That’s ridiculous! Can you actually point to some evidence of this?
I have to disagree there… The responsible person is the one making the threats if that is actually the case?
The problem here is that nothing will be resolved unless you name the person you allege has threatened to out party members and/or bloggers. There’s nothing wrong with saying who this is, because they’re a public person and it will be something they said that’s on the record. Highlight exactly what they said 1Prent and allow the the public to decide.
Sayonara.
What is to stop ‘Colonial Viper’ simply changing his or her name to
‘Post Colonial Viper’ .. or ‘Battlestar Galactica’ ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Madame_Hydra_Viper.JPG
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colonial_Viper
What? Have I just joined a fa**ist Party?
Sorry to see you go CV. Haere ra.
Seems you have marsman, better go on the run and sleep with one eye open like CV.
This shit STINKS and will really damage the Party once the MSM run with it.
What FOOLS this bunch of Brown Shirts are in conducting a witch hunt. Once Hooten and his ilk put their spin on it I see a new poll showing a low 20% support for Labour very soon.
Hope you can return soon CV, you will be missed.
Hi CV
Don’t stray too far. There’s that old saying “what goes around comes around” and I think there are a few people in the Labour caucus who are going to find out in due course how very true that saying is.
I also think I may know the identity of the person who has turned on you and that person will pay a price for objectionable behaviour…
This is no good CV. I’m sure you have your reasons but this is just not on. If a party can bully it’s members into silence it has no place in a democratic Country.
Double eek. Come back soon CV.
A damned shame, but highly reflective of the state of affairs with the NZLP currently. I too know the identity of the person involved in this, and there will be future consequences no doubt. Will be interesting to see what happens for me, blogging under my own name, in the future.
Kia kaha cv
Let me say this very clearly: If I wanted a bunch of neanderthal, authoritarian control freaks to govern me I’d vote National.
Seriously, Labour? Targeting and threatening individual party members to silence them?
Anyone on the left who’s been thinking about supporting/voting Labour should be thinking really hard about this. What use are they going to be to us in govt? What good can possibly come from electing them if this is how they respond to criticism when they’re in opposition?
Do you really think this bunch of cunts can be trusted with the full power of the state?
Fuck that. Labour deserve to keep losing if they think this is what democracy looks like.
To be fair to Labour, there is no evidence presented that supports the claim of bullying. A few people are hinting about dark dealings, but nobody’s fronting with the facts. Name and shame, I reckon.
I’m about done with “fair to Labour”, sorry.
Are you also done with innocent until proven guilty, felix?
Nah but I’m done with pretending that every. single. one. of these bullshit events is either an isolated incident, part of a teething period, or a mishap unlikely to reoccur, and totally unrelated to a serious cancer embedded in the power structure.
How about you TRP? Are you done with keeping your head up your arse?
What events, felix? All we have is some vague accusations about an unnamed individual MP having a brain fart and possibility unrelated matters concerning a couple of individuals ceasing blogging that are being conflated into the size of a cow. I’m asking for people to put up some evidence to back their claims. The people making the claims are all anonymous, so there should be no comeback on them opening up.
What’s the worst the Labour Party can do to an off-message member anyway? Stop sending the begging letters? Stop asking them to stand on street corners waving signs, or doorknocking, or spending evenings calling for votes? It’s terrifying stuff, indeed.
lol,what events?
I’m talking about pretty much everything the Labour leadership has done for the last four years. And at every turn, the refrain is the same: ‘Give them a chance’, and ‘They probably didn’t mean it’, and now your new hilarious one ‘Where’s the evidence that they’re a pack of untrustworthy morons apart from everything they say and do?’
I have no reason to doubt what Irish and Lynn and CV are saying. The Labour leadership, on the other hand…
Thanks for answering the question though, looks like you’re going to need your meals sent up there.
Thanks for clarifying felix. I thought you were talking about the specific events of the day, but apparently you were citing the vibe.
Interesting arse fixation, btw. Are you getting help for it?
Sure TRP, nothing to see here.
Nothing has happened in the last few days or the last few years that would cause anyone any concern about the Labour party leadership.
Keep telling yourself that mate. I’ll have your usual breakfast sent up right away.
You’re in denial, felix. But misinterpreting my position on this matter and the wider question of the leadership of the party over the last four years makes you feel good about yourself, its fine by me. I like to spread a little sunshine everywhere I go.
Oh good, I was hoping I was misinterpreting you and you hadn’t really spent the whole thread denying the bleeding obvious.
Glad to hear it.
Apology accepted. For the record, I never denied anything; the whole thrust of my questions was to establish the truth. I now know the facts, via a private source, but I still don’t know why the Standard won’t publish the full story, because it really is appalling behaviour by a half witted bully of an MP.
However, I’m going to assume the lack of detail is to protect the victim/s and leave it at that. But you should know that this incident leaves me very angry indeed and I firmly believe the MP concerned should be de-selected and expelled from the party.
I didn’t apologise, but that’s only because I’m not the one who was wrong and kind of a dick about it.
It’s like the marketing department of Hell Pizza. “Oh, what, we gratuitously offended another oppressed group in our quest to look edgy, and it’s blown up in our faces? Oh, that was just one random guy on our team. Honest. A completely different random guy to the random guys we blamed for the last dozen or so gratuitously-offensive fuckups.”
Name and shame, I reckon.
Having once been on the receiving end of bullying behaviour by people in positions of power and/or influence, I know how hard it is to name and shame. These bullies can be in a position to destroy a person’s personal life, career or business and get away with it because others are too scared to stand up to them.
It is up to the Labour leader – or someone else in a very senior position – to swiftly stamp it out.
Ha, I know of what you speak, all too well. The out of court settlement was veeeerrry nice, but damn it was hard.
(and this is making Brian Edwards look a right tosser now.)
Blinded by the obvious are you or are you looking at the rising son.
TRP: There is more than sufficient evidence. At least for me.
The lobbying at the conference which is where this round of it seemed to have started was pretty intense and I’ve had quite a four people independently describing it to me.
The NZ Council debate is something that I have had several direct and indirect sources on.
And the leakage problems from Red Alert were something that I described (ummm) last year in a post after the rumour started flying around that the outing leakages were coming from here.
I’d have to say that Red Alert would have to now be considered to be a complete and utter failure because some numpties never bothered to learn about net culture.
Ok, did I understand that right – the people who run Red Alert are using things like IPs and email addresses to out commenters using pseudonyms? eg the sysop is passing those details on to caucus or other people high up in the Labour party, and that information is being used to harass or in some way control members?
Nah, it’s more that some MPs are spending a large amount of their time trawling through blogs, and Facebook etc, and then intimidating members based on what they say, particularly if it doesn’t agree with them. I don’t know if its an overt strategy or policy of NZ Council, but it’s certainly a policy of about 3-4 core MPs, and there may even be a a rogue one in there who can’t help themselves.
It’s not beyond fixing, but the methods to fix it might be quite challenging.
Nah, it’s more that some MPs are spending a large amount of their time trawling through blogs, and Facebook etc, and then intimidating members based on what they say, particularly if it doesn’t agree with them.
Don’t they have better things to do? Like, say, being an effective opposition?
But I/S, how can they be an effective opposition if people keep pointing out that they’re not being an effective opposition?
The answer is clearly to silence all critics. Then no one will say they’re not an effective opposition, ergo they’ll be the best opposition ever!
There are increasingly effective search engines out there, these days ..
Hi, LP.
If you have more than enough evidence, why aren’t you posting it? This guilt by accusation stuff is more suited to WO (or, in recent days, NZF). If there is some substance, lets see it. My apologies to all who don’t get where I’m coming from, but if there is bullying, then the bully needs to be named and shamed. If you do not confront the bully, you are enabling the bully.
I have the evidence, as do others. It exists, and if the behaviour doesn’t stop, it may just come out.
Dude, that is beyond weak. Put up the evidence, if it exists. I’m starting to think it doesn’t, because I can see no logical reason why it has to be hidden. There is no downside to having the courage of your convictions, Peter. and the last time I looked at the policy of The Standard, making assertions without being able to substantiate them is considered poor form.
You are free to believe whatever you like, that’s one of the privileges of living in a country that values religious freedom.
Nope, the ball is in your court. You’re the one making the claim, its up to you to back it up. You won’t, or, more likely, you can’t.
And the name on your passport is not ‘Peter’. That may be one of your names, but only Cher, Madonna and God can claim to be recognized on a single name. And the latter can’t even do that, because He doesn’t exist. So yes, your excuses are weak, ‘Peter’, but as you say the name of the MP has been mentioned already, you can show us how not weak you are by confirming it.
Just for the record: my response above was to a comment from ‘Peter’ that he had the evidence, but he wasn’t go to release it and that the the ‘ball was in their court’. He has since chickened out and deleted the statement, replacing it with the ‘religion’ comment instead. So, it appears that Peter is both a semi-anonymous coward and a fantasist.
Hilarious. Most people who’ve hung around the Labour Party know who I am. But for the record, my name is Peter Wilson, I was a former party member, LEC member, Otago University youth branch founder and president, Otago/Southland Labour regional council chairman for three years. I’ve chaired list conferences, fought on four campaign committees, including two as campaign manager in tough tory blue country. I have also worked in paid employment for a number of MPs, including the MP in question today.
That should be enough.
Nope, not even close to enough. I wasn’t asking for your name, or bone fides, I was asking for the evidence. Which you still haven’t provided.
Peter, you, IB and LP are all credible people as far as I’m concerned. And that makes your inability to back up your claims all the more puzzling.
Don’t mind if I do, TRP. You called Peter a “semi-anonymous coward”, attacking him for being anonymous and inferring that such cast doubt on his credibility. He told you exactly who he is, and that he has the credentials to know what he is talking about.
You pretend to have faith in their credibility while calling them all liars? Sweet. All the people you have named have told you the situation – they are reluctant for a variety of reasons to post what they know publicly.
You might disagree and think there is no legitimate reason for withholding this information, but last time I checked trying to bully people into doing things that make them uncomfortable is a bad thing.
I’ll tell you why I think this is nothing more than fantasy Blue…
That’s a damn slow grape vine 1prent has got growing there… Wasn’t the conference like three weeks ago?
There’s an unwritten rule in blogging, and moreso in journalism, that you need to be able to verify and back up your claims. That’s the basic difference between good journalism and propaganda.
Without some evidence of these claims, they remain mere speculation and therefore best ignored.
Being that the MSM hasn’t picked up this story either confirms that there’s no actual evidence to base these claims on, being that Labour would likely make a formal complaint to the Press Council if such claims were published in the MSM and were untrue. They don’t have the same opportunity with blogs though because those publication laws don’t apply. However there’s such a thing as good ethical standards with blogs, and I have to agree with Te Reo Putake that such baseless claims are more suitable to WO. Slater might have a large readership, but how much credibility does he actually have? Hint: the answer is not a lot.
Te Reo Putake is correct, IB, LP and PW are all credible commentators… However they do their credibility no favours at all by making claims they cannot back up with evidence. The blogger’s who have posted on such things as if they’re fact are also in danger of losing their credibility. Clearly attempting to damage Labour with unsubstantiated gossip isn’t worth the damage caused to your own standing.
Point missed, blue. There is no reason why the evidence should be suppressed. Therefore, it is possible, even likely, that the evidence does not exist. IB, LP and PW are credible people, hence my amazement at their singular failure to back up their position. It’s not bullying to ask people who are slagging off the Labour Party by claiming bullying to prove it. It’s their claim and at the moment, it looks like total BS.
If, as you say, there are a variety of reasons why their claims cannot be substantiated, they should say so. Peter wasn’t a coward for his anonymity, he was a coward for deleting a comment he wrote, then later regretted. He remains a credible person, in my eyes, just not as credible as he was a few hours ago.
I pulled that last comment on reflection actually, I had already received cease and desist messages privately. I don’t have the time for a legal battle, and I know that the people involved might push it that far. There are other ways of handling it.
Peter, how could you get cease and desist messages when the LP MP’s don’t read The Standard anyway?? 😉
Rhetorical question mate – just joshing 🙂
TRP.
Some things are better not debated publicly.
So a little bird tells me, MS.
A tolleybird?
It isn’t really Labour that has the problem – the party is trying valiantly to update its century old structures. It is the Labour caucus.
So this is how democracy operates does it!
Should this actually be what is happening, it would seem to indicate there is much deeper problems flowing through those who masquerade, and so called NZ’ers!
I have to agree with Felix, this stinks, its not isolated, nor is it in anyway in the interests of NZ, or its people!
CV, I’d love to have a 101 on this subject. Off the record off course!
Something does not add up here…
Why would you be a member anyway? I’ve noticed a change of tone/content of your posts over about the past month or so, and actually wondered if someone else was writing for you…
Yes, I am CV.
Most of the time it is better to fix a structural problem than to have to try and reinvent the structure. The usual problem is to find a fulcrum.
Just when I thought NZ cricket had the most retarded governance in NZ, Labour appear to have trumped even them with this latest buffoonery.
CV just come back under another handle you did it post loota do it again and keep applying the blowtorch I don’t agree with you most of the time but you are entitled to your opinion – damn their eyes one and all the troughing sacks of shit.
Yep. Please do, but take a while first. In fact I’ll give you permission to use as many pseudonyms as you wish.
but I’d suggest a few things to do. You’ll have to shift your writing style between the identities. Your IP’s are quite distinctive, it’d pay to get them changed.
In the meantime there are a few people who just made it to my rather short shit-list for damage to the local net.
I can help with adding gratuitous expletives to future comments in the name of identity-protection.
+1
Perhaps we show solidarity with CV by including Viper in new pseudonyms.
Clare has him in her sights and Tim Barnett et al will execute on her wishes.
Don’t doubt the seriousness of the behaviour of Curran Hipkins Robertson and Ardern.
They are all graduates of the Parliamentry Party offices.
Controlling from the centre is what they were trained to do.
That is why they found the membership’s behaviour at conference so repugnant.
That is why they have failed to develop RedAlert.
That is why they cannot cope with the Standatd.
That is why they choose Shearer as their Leader.
That is why we are loosing out in electorates associated with them.
That is why we will loose the 2014 election unless we put matters right immediately.
Good idea AV. Lets all be vipers for a day 🙂
Good idea but only a day?
I predict a viral video titled “Labour have lost the plot” doing the rounds shortly.
How about a sort of music video from that swing band of eloquent bloggers Colonial Viper, Bored and Marty G. Perhaps some rap or purloined Tom Lehrer.
signing in………..
Me too.
+1
Have a relaxing break, CV. 5pm Fri 7 Dec 2012 and missing you already.
It just astounds me how dumb these MPs have been.
Labour 2012 = Liberal 1912 ?
Knives knives everywhere where to hide our friend CV but amongst his friends.
I fictional poem…
I knew a girl called um Clare.
All fat and old and well a haggard wellywood drunk was she.
Played with her raincoat and and her pet duck.
Upto no good, just one of the old hasbeen.
Fly here there and even to pari on a whim.
Tooted jee me lucky.
Well she was nt that bright and um um ahhhh a lot
But at the start it was no I’m not interested in knives and now after years trained by the best of the left poor dear Clare come back for the rest.
Rest in peace cv.
Colonial Viper
Hopefully your battlestar is simply parked up awaiting new rims.
CV, come back alive and well, have enjoyed you over the years. I killed Bored for a different reason (but very similar: got fed up with fighting totalitarians on my own side), his spirit is allowed out of Purgatory for very limited haunting opportunities. Have a superb Christmas.
Isn’t it funny though, only last week people were talking about how bloggers were cowards for not giving their real name and here we have a situation in which a political party is bullying its members into silence and threatening to “out” them in an attempt to stifle dissent. What’s next? You can only vote if you give your name of the party or person you will be voting for?
What it proves is that in order for a democratic society to function it is of the utmost importance to get this dissent out regardless of the manner in which this is done and that includes anonymity.
We vote anonymously because that safeguards us from being manipulated into voting the preferred candidate from the biggest bullies and we should be free to criticize anonymously for the very same reason because that is the only way we can voice our concerns when there are idjits like this “anonimous” MP throwing their weight around trying to bullyi everybody into compliance and I for one hope someone will out the bastard because he has no place in a democratic party
I’d like to think we could get to a place where it’s free to criticize or praise, within reason, without the need for anonymity for fear of repercussions or censure.
Yes, that would be nice but seeing as you don’t use your own name either it seems to me you are realistic enough not to wait until such times come to pass
Recent news in the Guardian, and elsewhere, about how trade union members. left wing bloggers and others who do not have the right political views, in the UK, have been blacklisted and denied employment.
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread868934/pg1
Maybe we are not anonymous enough.
It common for some employment Agencies here to ask subtle question about unionism etc.
Very sad.
I will miss you.
I too am feeling that chill wind of public outing.
Truly hope you and Millsy come back.
This is just alarming! I hope you are not silenced for too long CV.
CV leaving us – Nooooooooooooooooooooo. And what is the good reason pray? You can’t desert us making vague comments like that. First Bored and now you. I keep hoping that someone will read and accept some microcosm of what I say so I keep on throwing my pearls before the troops, or should I say rose petals for them to trample on? (My opinion.)
You have been part of a revolt trying to puncture the complacency of centrist Labour, no wonder they find us revolting. The punctured balloon is now rushing round the room making a loud farting noise. Someone needs to be around to blow up a new balloon. Keep some breath for after Christmas and New Year and start the 2013 fun CV.
Late to the party, but adding my 2c, hoping you’ll make it back sometime soonish.
Very seldom see eye to eye with CV but his comments are always worth reading, unlike the dead arse policy repeaters often found here.
Kia kaha CV.
Will look into when a particular polly is having her electorate clinic………
I have these wild, radical, ideas about freedom of speech and democracy. Madness, I know but i can’t seem to give them up.
The “madness” is coming from the other side of the fence.
There are enough democratically inclined MPs in the Labour caucus to put this loopy behaviour to rest once and for all. Please do it? Then members will have little to complain about – including me.
Perhap I will accompany you if you wish.
I have my tshirt printed now and a tattoo tut says free CV.
suck. You’ll be missed.
Although my blood pressure might improve 😉
The alleged Labour caucus mole/s need to go away and have a good hard think about freedom of speech and what democracy is.
I have been outspoken regarding wanting Cunliffe to be leader and Shearer to be deputy leader because this is my personal view on the Labour party easily winning the next election. Shearer needs to come out and say that intimidating bloggers is intolerable and to sort out the caucus mole/s.
I have always supported the Labour party on election day and the Labour party needs to learn that they have my loyality even though the leadership issue has not gone as I wanted it to.
It is going to be a bit lonely without CV and Millsy and I miss Vicky32.
I ‘m pretty appalled by this LP caucus leadership behaviour. I will continue to vote Green until Labour become a truly democratic left wing party again. It’s a bit worrying, though, as to what sort of government leadership the Green Party could end up in coalition with.
Indeed, sorry to see you go CV and Millsy – hope you’re back soon. And my sympathies for you in what you seem to appear to be implying you might hypotheically – so to speak – be enduring. Or not.
Good luck, CV.
Oh, and please keep the education on 911 up where you’re going too!
Why not just adopt a new moniker til the heat is off? I recently switched from using my real name in protest against the criticism of “anonymous bloggers” 😀
Be prepared for some ritualised “jumping in” though – this place is a bit like the Headhunters, after all 😉
Will miss you CV. Looking forward to reading your comments again when all this craziness is over. Take care.
This is frankly shit, CV. Not your decision, but being made to feel it’s one you have to make because some people who should be champions of democracy (since they live and die by it) have decided they can’t handle criticism.
There’s plenty we don’t agree on but you’re usually (i.e. when not disagreeing with me :P) a damn fine commenter on this blog and your presence will be missed.
this is the end
beautiful friend
this is the end
my only friend , the end
Once legitimacy is lost no matter what tactics are employed whether bureaucratic or violent. For leaders who lose their legitimacy in the eyes of their people it is only a matter of time.
Such desperate tactics are not those of strong leadership, (no matter what the MSM tell us) but of weak leadership.
Kia kaha CV. Ka whawhai tonu matou, Ake Ake Ake
I know that you will heed the words and example of Rewi Maniapoto and continue fighting on the battle ground of your choosing.
Good luck habibi.
See you on the picket line.
More like on the barracades.
Wave the standard fly it high.
Here come all the vipers united and determined.
A collective you will see, a movement of justice of faith of friends and of power.
Once small growing big,
Live long cv and prosper
Quite possibly. I see that Labour Party Mayor Len Brown and his council are still determined to evict the Maritime Union from the Ports of Auckland. This despite the union making massive concessions in wages and conditions.
Oh did they now.
well if we get a oil induced big mother crunch it might be the barricades to get some progress.
Can’t see any of this shower ( labour ) working thru a crisis.
Another angle is that upon the TS it would appear that most um members are agreeing on one main thread – that we need a new direction focused on real and meaningful change and betterment for people that is a holistic systematic approach…a new way.
A new way forward, progress that is linked to green, brown and red ideology. Blue is dead.so
This is our barricade where we have raised the flag and where our voices get heard.
We learn as a group, we debate and comment freely, and in a growing manner we are becoming more heard.
History and recent event have shown that united voices, a movement, can cause change.
So to the barricades I say.
Disclaimer. TS is a blog, has no opinion or motive but solely as a vehicle for individual to express themselves in a legal and considered manner.
But like minded individual historically have shaped events, challenged the status quo and there works deeds and action in a collective manner created a focal point of change.
.
Sorry to see you go . . . also this.
CV – I am bothered! This is a shocker to me. Your posts have been amongst the most respected ones I read on TS. I know I am not at all easy, and I have my health and other issues too, deservedly at times having been criticised by some.
I am shit worried about what is going on in Labour and the left as such.
Yes, I find it hard to believe what is going on.
Hang in there, same as millsy and others, never give up, as the challenge must be taken on the bloody chin. They are bloody asking for it.
All the best!
I repeat: It is time for a NEW left party, inclusive enough and robust enough, to take on the challenge from the rotten right of spectrum NatZies. Take a break and think about it, all yours that have politics of fairness and justice at heart. It must be dared and done, we get nowhere with the present lot!
Thanks for your comments the other day. I’m pleased you’re having a better day. Hang in there.
I’m thinking the option may not necessarily a party in the traditional sense but a coalition of independent left wing politicians where each vote is similar to every vote being a conscience vote.
This might allow a much more diverse range of left-wing views in parliament.
I’d be happy to have such left-wing diversity in parliament.
Sorry to hear this CV, you & Millsy will be missed, hurry back.
A headline gleaned off of this morning’s National Radio, Starbucks the international coffee chain have agreed to pay more tax in Britain,
The interesting bit here is that Starbucks have ‘agreed’ to pay more tax, what this is really highlighting is that the Neo-Liberal thieves of international business are sharing the bed with the Neo-Liberal weaklings of British politics,(guess who’s on top),
Wouldn’t the proper headline be that Starbucks had had all it’s profits of the past decade seized by the British Government and had been ordered to pay it’s fair share of taxation in the future,(you can bet the same rorts have been, and are, happening here in New Zealand),
Yesterday’s headline from the same place, (Radio NZ), told of a couple of the bigger electronic manufacturers who had been spanked by the European Union for ‘price fixing’ on Cathode Tubes, (apparently the most expensive bit in ya TV or laptop),
The participants in that particular rort have apparently been for the past decade artificially bumping up the price of that particular piece of electronic gear in a little closed shop price fixing scam much the same as the banks were ‘fixing’ the interest rates they charged,
We are all as consumers effected by these multi-national rorts from tax avoidance to price fixing, its you and me that pay for this criminality, this is the true face of so called ‘self regulating’ business be it local or international…
The report I saw on Al Jazeera this morning, identified customer feedback as the reason for the change: meaning, I guess, Starbucks are afraid of losing customers and will pay as little extra tax as they can get away with.
Or, oooops we got caught rorting the British taxman,(and every English person who HAS to pay tax),
Better roll over and pretend contrition and when the heat dies down we can get back to business as usual…
bad12
Further to that google was implicated. They and other similar coys do not intend to change their payment regime as it is legal. The politicians trying to encourage big business to their shores!
And big business will just fill up their longboats with loot and return to their bases with it. And do what? They have visions like Kubla Khan no doubt – In Xanadu did Kubla Khan, A stately pleasure-dome decree:
Yeah, i am sure that far more than just Google and Starbucks are involved in that particular tax-scam,
Here we have the Neo-liberal apologists doing the hand wringing thing describing tax-avoidance as ‘immoral’ but not illegal so what can they do,
The above was basically the ‘Hairdo from Ohariu’s’ response to questions put to Him recently on New Zealand’s estimated 7 billion dollars of annual avoidance and evasion of due taxation which Dunne as Revenue Minister in quite a few Governments has happily overseen,
When faced with such an attitude from Government Ministers anyone suddenly robbred of the power of speech except for the muttered word f**k would have to be forgiven because when you count the numbers we would have NO Government debt problem if those involved in the ‘immoral’ avoidance of taxation were criminalized and made to pay their due taxation….
The commonsense man sure has a lot of people fooled. The electorate think he tries to make commonsense decisions about policy, in fact the commonsense all relates to the question ‘Is this good for P Dunne?’. It’s commonsense to look after No.1, who else will?
Smart trick St Peter.
Considering the fact that NZ has become a tax haven we’ll be one of the countries that all those taxes that the multinational’s aren’t paying are going through.
Don’t start, I am struggling to not vomit already. 😉
DTB
Going through. Sounds like diahrroea and that leads to malnutrition because the food doesn’t stay long enough to be absorbed and used by the body. Fast money passing through tax havens has much the same effect on the country I should think.
What effect would such fast money have on our exchange rate? Would it be an advantage to the financial guys here to have a high exchange rate or not I wonder? Would this be one of the reasons why we can never play around with our exchange rate? Presumably if it wasn’t so stable it wouldn’t be so attractive.
Our currency is one of the most traded in the world and thus one of the most unstable. Does that answer your question?
4th……
The Cullen fund is the most innovative sovereign fund in the world. Why does that not make me feel confident about the fund? Could be because of this for starters:
Neil Williams, Chief Investment Advisor and Head of Strategic Tilting
Neil joined the Guardians in 2008 from UBS Global Asset Management in London where he was Global Head of Asset Allocation and a Managing Director in Global Investment Solutions. Neil was previously Chief Global Strategist, Executive Director for Goldman Sachs International (London).
And perhaps this
Use of the words innovate/innovative can be found all over the various sectors these days, and concerningly the public sector, having been taken over by consultants, is using them braordly.
One can take it as finding new ways to steal, rip off and deceive the public, is all those words mean.
The fund will be in serious trouble, like everything else where the words innovate/innovative, can be seen, heard or read!
When people start using the words innovate.innovative in conjunction with finance then I’d expect that company/sovereign fund to be headed for a crash. The innovation in the finance sector was, after all, a major cause of the GFC.
If you are like me and trying to get your head around the TPP scam, the past two episodes of Citizen A have been worth a watch. Bomber has had Jane Kelsey on, as well as other new guests.
The 29th Nov & the 6th Dec episodes have focused solely on the TPP – stream them here
Also, the last issue of Werewolf focuses on the TPP…Gordon Campbell & Co doing their thing (real journalists)
The garden can be soothing and productive for fevered polly watchers but you should watch your back! No-one but you will do the damage here if you aren’t careful of strenuous exercise.
Some good advice –
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/gardening/5011927/Spring-gardening-is-a-dangerous-sport-claim-doctors.html
In my own experience, the lack of instinctive democracy among the Labour hierarchy was demonstrated by Jim Anderton’s approach to running the NLP and the Alliance. Jim and a few others seemed far more interested in building a monolithic authoritarian structure than in actually changing anything. The activists found themselves either burned out or making accomodations, and an opportunity was lost. This behaviour is why the only hope I have for Labour is that they will become a junior coalition partner in a Green/Mana government and learn once again why they exist. My fear is that many of those at the centre of things would prefer going into a government of “National Unity” or some other Bonapartist rubbish in order to keep the radicals at bay.
And themselves in the House they get paid to feel comfortable in, along with their slippers and tots of alcohol or lattes.
Yes, I love that: “Junior partner”, that is how it perhaps rather should be with the lot that sit on their backsides and cushioned chairs now.
Prominent Tauranga man charged with assault.
Anything else I might say on this would purely be idle speculation and possibly highly defamatory. I have no knowledge – directly or indirectly – of the case, but I feel the story itself is important to take note of. I would caution against any speculation here.
Why is it important to take note of if we don’t know who the man is?
Legally, I can’t even drop hints on what my line of thinking is.
Piss off. I reckon it could be Bob the Builder, that ex-MP. Or maybe even that ding-dong Simon Bridges. Or what about Winston Peters or isn’t that goofy weatherman MP Brendan Horan from the Mount?
Ffs, I know some secrets too but I couldn’t possibly tell anyone…..
just as well the internet only exists in the ether eh what.
You missed the GCSB on the list or an alien from planet Key!
I did not realise that a 12 year old was assaulted and that they have physical injuries and nightmares, I apologise for my comment as I am against physical violence especially when children are harmed.
personally I don’t see the point to your comments.
Either the guy gets done for something serious and we find out in good time, or he’s not found guilty of anything serious and keeps name suppression because there’s no public interest in knowing that he did or didn’t do something that’s not serious in the first place. And by the nature of name suppression, the guy might just be a provincial used car salesman or gp.
Methinks your linking and thinking is a touch premature.
Methinks your linking and thinking is a touch premature.
Except that it has been reported on the NZ Herald website which suggests the man is also prominent outside of Tauranga.
Goodness me, Paul Mabey QC representing two prominent Tauranga professionals in one week!
Unless… ?
Well, as the recent slaughter in Gaza drops off the MSM narrative completely, I thought it might be timely to share this link: http://mondoweiss.net/2012/12/its-time-for-the-media-to-talk-about-zionism.html regarding the distinction between anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism.
I remember talking to one of my best friends (a Russian jew) about 12 years ago about the fact that I was anti-Zionist but that it didn’t make me an anti-Semite. He immediately dismissed it and lumped me in with the drive-the-Israelis-into-the-sea brigade (which I am increasingly seeing as more of a figment of Israel’s collective imagination than a genuine goal of Arabic people).
I think though that it’s important that people realise that it’s OK to be anti-Zionist and that they shouldn’t feel guilty about speaking out against the Zionist expansionism of the Israeli state. Succinct but articulate article, unlike this post 😉
Apparently, the sole purpose of capitalism is to make a few people better off while impoverishing everybody else.
Ooooh, look, the GP talking about climate change in a press release. What is the world coming to?
http://www.greens.org.nz/press-releases/nz-criticised-international-climate-change-talks
Wonders never cease
Weka previously when I asked you if the Greens would continue to ignore Climate Change during the next election as they had in the previous one. After quoting back to me, my original question, here, after a long winded preamble, you gave your answer stating:
In response to your answer. I asked you another, and even simpler question:
Weka it’s a simple question. Why won’t you answer?
Weka, if, it is not “the job or responsibility of the Green Party to do this at this point.”
Whose do you think it is?
Whoops. I think, in the last half hour, I accidentally published a post I am typing up – report on this evening’s demo in Auckland. Sorry if I caused any confusion.
British peer ejected from UN climate talks for denouncing protocol
Guess who.
A Green, Labour and New Zealand First coalition has real potential: http://localbodies-bsprout.blogspot.co.nz/2012/12/the-southland-economic-debate.html
This has me worried, Labour must be very confident if it can start removing members willy-nilly…but seriously as much as I enjoy watching the looney left eat itself (and I do) this turn of events is startling.
One of the things I like about this blog is you can (more or less) say what you think as opposed to redalert which, lets face it, is pretty dull
I’m just not sure whether its more Stalinist or 1984ish in what this un-named MP wants
Mate whole point I think is NO repeats of 84.
bang goes the drum.
Not wanting to go into crystal ball gazing but if this goes ahead when Labour are in opposition (I don’t think it will because of the publicity) what would be the next logical step when Labour gets back into power?
Targeting all those who support right wing policies?
Targeting all those who don’t support left wing policies? (but dont support right wing policies)
Targeting all those who dont support the Leaders policies?
And once they target those people what will they do then?
Whispering in the bright bright sun labour elites want a quiet capture of the centre area but the rebellious ignorant shrill members are perceived to be upsetting the plan by speaking freely putting up remits and questioning the established structure and it’s power cliques.how dear they say the elites…we know best you bleet bleet and are sheep sheep sheep but pay your dues cause we need the cash cash cash to bribe the dog so we can drink from the trough trough trough.