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Open Mike 12/11/2018

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, November 12th, 2018 - 124 comments
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124 comments on “Open Mike 12/11/2018”

  1. Ed 1

    John Wight

    “Tony Blair’s presence in front of the Cenotaph is grotesque. It’s like having an arsonist attending the funeral of the victims of his fire starting. One million Iraqis dead, ME plunged into the abyss, Blair is a war criminal. ”

    George Galloway.

    “There is no Poppy large enough, no overcoat thick enough to hide the black evil hearts of the War Criminals amongst whom Corbyn was forced to linger in London this morning.”

  2. Ed 2

    Rachel Stewart

    “’ll use Twitter sparingly from now on, and only for either my latest column or when I’ve something I really want to say. Real life awaits. Given the planetary state of things, we’d all likely do better by spending more time with family, friends, animals & nature. Peace out.”

  3. Herodotus 3

    Some could infer that the govt has now moved regarding the teachers, to engaging in the PR war with the voter, placing a wedge between the teachers and the public. The phrasing of the $9,500 is of interest as it grosses 3 annual rises of 3% into 1, and has been used to destroy favourable public opinion towards teachers. That is something you could think another govt would use, the tactic shouldn’t employed by Labour 🤔
    Hipkins said the proposed pay rise exceeded that of many other professions.
    “I think that a $9500 pay rise is a pay rise that many other New Zealanders would certainly appreciate.”

    • Ed 3.1

      Hopkins is just another neoliberal politician.
      He is no socialist.
      He does not represent the working class.
      He is not Labour.

    • dV 3.2

      So that will solve the shortage!!!!
      Yea Right

      • BM 3.2.1

        I can’t see how there can be a teacher shortage, we train thousands of new teachers every year.

        Where do they all go? do they all have teaching jobs?

        • KJT

          Didn’t you see the part where most new Teachers leave in the first few years, due to crippling workloads, unrealistic expectations from their employers, micro-management and the stultifying effect of Nationals dumbing down of education.

          Before you even get into pay, about half of the earnings of a tradesman, or other equivalently educated, skilled trade. I.E. Lawyers, dentists and real estate agents.

          The right wing say we should pay millions to managers and directors to ensure competence. Teachers are supposed to do it for love.

          I know. I was one of them. I didn’t expect to earn the same as my real job, but I expected to earn enough to live on reasonably, and to go to the scale they told me I would be on, before I retrained for Teaching.

          • Gosman

            But hasn’t that all been changed under this Government ? There should be a massive increase in people wanting to train as teachers now.

            • Draco T Bastard

              Nope. Labour are still holding on to the delusional tradition that a new government doesn’t change the policies set by the previous government.

              And the reality is that it’s going to take time to recognise the damage that the right-wing policies are doing and then fix them.

        • Chris T

          Not sure how big an issue it is, but I have heard in interviews and the mighty talk back radio, that one of the issues new teachers have is their obvious lack of experience.

          Some schools being hesitant to hire too many newbies.

          As I say, not sure how prevalent it is, as a lot of it seemed to be anecdotal

          • Stuart Munro

            That’s across a lot of hiring practices – demanding two years experience. It makes things very hard for people who qualify in NZ because the job market is neither large nor extensive. Getting a job near one’s family and friends or your partner’s workplace is hard enough without such nonsense. Teachers used to have some protection in the first two years though – not sure if it’s still there.

            • patricia bremner

              A major problem is the requirement for continued training for the first two years. The Beginning Teacher had to be under a suitable Senior Teacher for two years as part of certification. That senior person was meant to broaden the junior teacher’s curriculum and classroom management strategies.
              Many schools were caused headaches by Boards of Trustees failing to keep a balance of staff, through choosing younger staff… (close to their own age often).
              Older Teachers were seen as costly, harder to manage and not progressive enough. That started a chain of failures and stressed teachers and boards.

              • Stuart Munro

                Yeah, friend of mine did a midlife swap to teaching – gave notice in year one due to stress and was essentially saved by a good mentor teacher & principal. Now much in demand at a highend private school – one of the few who knows the NCEA stuff well enough to coach the younger & foreign imports – on top of her actual job.

                But the systemic prejudice against kiwis is frankly huge, and not confined to teaching. The worthless English buffoons who’ve run the MSA for the last few decades pretty much killed the training path for kiwis – took me till I was thirty to get my coastal masters, not because I failed anything but because the useless deleted expletives wouldn’t recognize my seatime. Teaching in China, one of the blokes who owned the company I worked for had got his master foreign going by the time he was 19. He was from Hong Kong – which had the same UK descended qualification framework but without the obstructive culture that was allowed to ruin NZ’s system. And still does.

                • Antoine

                  > the obstructive culture that was allowed to ruin NZ’s system

                  Do you think this is largely grounded in protectionism – those that are already ‘in’ pulling up the ladder after them?


                  • Stuart Munro

                    In the case of the MSA, yes.

                    Most cultures do this in their own country in fact – it’s a colonial legacy that this strange version of it remains so prevalent in NZ.

                  • KJT

                    In the MSA’s case, now Maritime New Zealand, it was organizational incompetence, which seems to be intergenerational. Governments putting taxi drivers or real Estate agents in charge, and employing ex cops, doesn’t help. There are some good people in MNZ, but they tell me you have to keep your heads well down, if you have any real knowledge.
                    Having experience in New Zealand shipping, is a definite barrier to employment with MNZ.

                    The current international requirement for only one years sea time for a second mates certificate, and the like, is even more pandering to cost cutting shipowners.

                    All NZ companies, hate paying for training.

            • KJT

              Experience, short term contracts and long trial periods.

              Don’t forget, young. Skilled older tradespeople, who are often better with the stroppy kids, not wanted.

              Only seems to apply to New Zealand trained Teachers?

              • Jack Ramaka

                Useless Management in NZ is systemic throughout the Public Service & Private Companies “the harder you suck the higher you get & it depends on who you know not what you know ?”.

                Most Public Companies here in NZ have either been bankrupted through management incompetence or sold to offshore investors.

                Government Departments and SOE’s run as little fiefdoms ?

                In one word Management in NZ is “Useless” IMHO.

        • Violet

          “I can’t see how there can be a teacher shortage” – are you saying there isn’t one?
          If so, where is your analysis to back that up?
          If you don’t have that analysis – and I’m sure you don’t – or you are not saying there isn’t a shortage, then stop introducing distractions like this to every single discussion.

        • bwaghorn

          A couple from my kids school shot the gap to Dubai as soon as there 1 1/2 ? Probation was up .

    • KJT 3.3

      My dentist has just awarded himself a pay rise, of double that.

      Average pay rises for top managers over 17%.

      Civil service managers are now on hundreds of thousands.

      Teachers used to be on the same as a backbencher.

      I think they are being rather restrained, myself. Especially when you consider the rises are nowhere near that for all Teachers, and they are over several years.

      Lastly. If you want to attract competent people from other jobs, you need to, at least, pay them enough to live in Auckland.

      The time of expecting women with well paid husbands, to do the job for love and peanuts, is over.

      • greywarshark 3.3.1

        Teachers are used as scapegoats, regularly chastised, blamed, painted as unsatisfactory servants just carrying on at a higher level from pre-school education. Their achievements and workload aren’t respected, and for decades also teach mentally unabled childre, those who are disturbed and mind-stressed from unhappy homes and from watching mind-warping television and videos, as well as those who are to be prepared for a regular working life if they can find that.

        Just as government and leaders play games with them, expecting more but also increasing their difficulties, they do the same to the adults who have finished school, and they have difficulties finding that regular working life. All are easured all the time with forms to fill out. This is a society that is built around the idea that people are not good enough to be treated as satisfactory; niggling and fault-finding by those who have managed to climb the ladder is constant but those at the upper level somehow avoid much of it themselves.

    • SaveNZ 3.4

      “A University of Otago study shows CEO pay is increasing at almost five times the rate of the average worker.
      Otago University Business School Accountancy and Finance researcher Dr Helen Roberts’ longitudinal study study, which adjusted for inflation, showed the proportion of CEOs paid over $500,000 per year had also increased approximately five-fold across three different compensation measures.

      It showed chief executives were now paid 30 to 50 times more than the average wage of $60,000.”


      • SaveNZ 3.4.1

        “Chief executive pay packes often do not seem to relate to performance. Fonterra and Fletcher Building are good examples. Or CBL. The troubled insurer’s boss was paid $2.6 million in 2016 and the company was placed in voluntary administration in early 2018.

        For context, the chief executive pay in the top 50 companies in New Zealand averaged average under NZ$2 million. That’s around 35 times the average worker pay.”


      • Bearded Git 3.4.2

        And that same CEO will have large investments in the stock market that has tripled in value in the last 9 years and he/she will own multiple houses that, as everybody knows, have gone up massively in value in the last 20 years.

        The combination of massive salary increases and massive capital gains represents a huge shift in wealth to the top 5-10%.

        We need an asset tax and a land tax.

        • SaveNZ

          at least you did not say capital gains where the ‘family home’ is tax free ha ha.

          Problem with asset tax is, if you are not a CEO how the hell do you pay it on NZ wages? Can you imagine a teacher adding that tax on to their mortgage, rates and other expenses to pay?

          Obviously fine if you work or have income from overseas and therefore can earn money in relation to cost of living. In NZ there is a disparity of wages including those middle class wages i.e. teachers and police which is why there is an issue with ‘asset’ taxes on NZ wages.

          I’d prefer more targeted taxes aka stamp duty on assets over 5 million for example – business/farm/house. Even if it was the ‘family home’ you would still have to pay.

          Also more investigation into ‘minimum’ turnover taxes aka comanies like Google that pay little taxes here have to pay a minimum of tax on turnovers over 10 million for example even if they make a ‘loss’.

          And a financial transaction tax on banks and money coming into and out of NZ to get all those ‘profits’.

          • Bearded Git

            yep agree….like the turnover tax but not set at a pathetically low token level like in the UK

    • AB 3.5

      Some of the people inconvenienced by the teachers this week will be paid even less than teachers and work just as hard.
      I have doubts about how far the model of individual unions seeking improvements for their members alone can be pushed. I would prefer to see increases in the ‘social wage’ that benefit all low and moderate income earners.

      • KJT 3.5.1

        That is how we got descent wages and welfare in the first place. Bit by bit. Mostly by striking. The horror.

        Nationwide strikes in support are illegal. Otherwise you may find that many of the people you are so concerned about, support Teachers.

        Increases in the social wage, means Government share of the economy must increase. Taxes on the rich may have to go up! Horrors.

        Quality Teaching and education, is part of the “social wage”, by the way.

        • Draco T Bastard



          The rich and the powerful are pointing out the minor problems caused by people demanding to be paid enough while distracting from the major problems that they themselves cause such as under paying people.

          • patricia bremner

            Worse DTB, the rich demand private schools and suitable packages to attract the best teaching staff for their children. Further they take the funds from the General Education Budget, thus lowering the money for the rest.

            • In Vino

              Exactly. But the media now portray reasonable catch-up as beyond reasonable.. (Thanks, ERA..)
              I have lived many years (I started in 1970) wishing that NZEI and my PPTA could actually work together. It appears that from the start of next year this may actually happen. The foolish promoters of the economy need to be taught that there are many things more important than what they think is good for the economy. Society matters far more than the economy, … the economy has to be a servant, not a master.

            • Incognito

              Worse DTB, the rich demand private schools and suitable packages to attract the best teaching staff for their children.

              Oh yes, the rich believe in performance-based pay and meritocracy; the best get paid better, the better-paid are the best. They would say that, wouldn’t they?

              This feeds into the urban myth that teachers in low-decile schools are generally inferior to teachers in high-decile ones with only the best carefully handpicked for private schools (the elite schools). Consequently, the low-decile schools are inferior too, which is obvious when you look at academic success of the students, now and in future.

              This BS keeps self-perpetuating and even some of the poor are buying into it.


              One’s pay (or wealth) is not a marker of one’s competence as a teacher.

      • greywarshark 3.5.2

        But AB teachers aren’t unskilled and semi-skilled workers, and they are extensions of the socialising and informing role that parents do (if all is going well). Teachers are trained to carry out their role, unlike parents who struggle to get along with or without teachers strikes. Teachers are trying to maintain their numbers with training to expected levels of expertise in these difficult times. While we have teachers who care and try to help children through their school years to a level that enables them to manage in the world, we have some hope that they will be able to negotiate social wages for themselves as adults, if their parents have not learned enough to achieve that themselves.
        ‘Teach your children well, their parents hell will surely go by’.

        • AB

          Grey – I find comparisons between who is ‘skilled’ and ‘unskilled’ a bit odious. And I don’t really like the idea of people’s economic wellbeing coming down to how well they can make the case that they are more skilled than someone else, who therefore deserves less than they do.
          I would like to see a sort of cross-occupational solidarity that assumes the baseline of a decent economic life for everyone, then places some relatively modest skill differentials (insofar as these can be determined) on top of that. If people are in occupational silos trying to do the best for themselves alone, that plays into the individualistic habits of mind that are part of our current predicament.

          • greywarshark

            We aren’t and can’t all be the same AB. Chance to realise the fullness of oneself through work and opportunities and decent conditions in one’s community and the world would be a fine thing. But life and self management has to be learned, just scrambling along, dragging oneself up with no wise and caring help rarely results in a well-balanced and wise person. Teachers are worthy, should be nurtured and respected and have reasonable expectations placed on them in return.

            They, and informed and thinking people, know too well today that they are the first rather than the second stage of support and introduction to life skills for many children in our society. That is why these skilled people need to get more attention than the unskilled, who in turn should get better conditions offered for their living and advancement. I don’t agree with the theory of communism, and everyone getting the same if that is what is behind your thinking.

          • KJT

            Certainly would not get many to do my present job, without a skills and responsibility premium. We offered to train some staff. The response was, “you couldn’t pay me enough to take the responsibility”.
            The lifestyle which made it an adventure for young people in the past, are long gone.
            However there is no justification for jobs that I regard as semi-skilled, such as management in large companies, getting 35 times the average wage.

    • SaveNZ 3.6

      How much did teachers pay rise under the Natz and how much now under Labour would be a good comparison.

      My gut feeling is that maybe the Natz did not give the teachers enough pay rises, and now labour are being blamed for it.

      Plus the neoliberal immigration policies of the last 12 years in particular mean that it sounds like teachers would not have enough pay for even Kiwibuild ‘affordable’ houses up to $180k dual income.

      In addition the glut of spec houses being built in Auckland were based around a Ponzi scheme and Kiwis can’t afford or not interested in 1 million+ dollar McMansions and want/need that 5 bedroom, 3 bathroom house with double garage and tiny section or 2 bedroom apartment with $13,000 a year body corporates and chance of leaks?

      The ‘market driven’ developers have failed to build for the market of NZ and the high paid jobs were never created to keep the migrants or Kiwis in NZ with enough wages to live here without an overseas job to fund it? Aka once people get residency here, they leave their $20p/h insecure NZ job… NZ back where it started the ponzi but with much more liabilities and satellite families earning nothing but kids to teach, kids to give health care to, kids to commute to schools, WFF and tops ups to pay…

      • Wayne 3.6.1

        It would have to be a pretty flash apartment to have $13,000 body corporate fees. I have been looking at apartments around the $700,000 mark for a relative. Body corporate plus rates are around $5,000 to $6,000.

        • aom

          You have got to be joking Wayne! Just the insurance component on many apartments in Wellington exceeds $5000 to $6000. Now add $3000 p.a. for rates and varying amounts for future maintenance charges in the range of $1000 to five times that. One can be sure that $13,000 is not exceptional, particularly for older repurposed buildings. Also, you must realise that there are a number of apartments around that are at give-away prices as owners cannot afford the repair bills for earthquake and structural problems.

    • Pete 3.7

      Hipkins use of that is bullshit and propaganda, an easily used line to be picked up by people like Michael Barnett.

      Last week Hipkins had it at $10,000 so it’s already dropped!

  4. Ad 4

    Congratulations to Rocketlab on their successful launch of their rocket last night.

    In New Zealand; who’da thought?

    • Incognito 4.1

      There are pockets of excellence in NZ in-between vast deserts of doubt and apathy. Many good ideas get buried by bureaucracy and/or suffocated by mediocre managers. Access to funding is like a 3,000-mile pilgrimage carrying a heavy load and with self-flagellation at each and every step, bare feet, I should add. It’s dire.

      • RedLogix 4.1.1

        There are pockets of excellence in NZ in-between vast deserts of doubt and apathy.

        Dear God is that such a true statement.

        I’m sorry to say this; but it’s the one thing that becomes vividly apparent the moment you get on a plane and leave. If only NZ would learn to believe in itself the way our best rugby players and our world class sailors do … the country would be unstoppable.

        And yes big congrats to RocketLab !!

        • Sacha

          Elite NZ athletes ‘learn to believe in themselves’ through expensive ongoing coaching and psychological support. Let’s invest in the equivalent for everyone else and reap the benefits.

      • greywarshark 4.1.2

        Perhaps we could make lemonade out of something sour? The long spiritual walk of Spain the Carmino de Santiago is a selling point to meditative visitors and bucket-list tourists;, a spiritual and physical task that attracts thousands.

        Our pain and spiritual exercise of effort obtaining resources to try and save what is good in NZ from destruction and to nurture, build and develop better things in NZ, could be sold as a journey that attracts sympathetic tourists. Sell ourselves as a small green jewel in the world being threatened by the twin hazards of neoliberal freemarketing and runaway climate change. ‘Join us in our fevered attempts to rise above this tide’; better than an epic blockbuster.

        /sarc or is it a step outside the square that could be the floating something that we grasp to save ourselves from drowning? I’ll leave you to conjecture what the something would be!

    • Fireblade 4.2

      The Rocket Lab launch is interesting.

      In 2010, Rocket Lab worked on a project for the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency or DARPA, a US Department of Defense agency. The result of this work was passed on to the US military in 2012.

      In 2013, Rocket Lab received funding from Silicon Valley venture capitalist Vinod Khosla. Around this time Rocket Lab moved its company registration to the US and opened a corporate office in Los Angeles. In a recent TV interview, Peter Beck stated that he now spends his time betwwen LA and NZ.

      In 2014, the US military and aerospace giant Lockheed Martin invested an undisclosed amount in Rocket Lab. Lockheed Martin is one of the US largest defence contractors, $35.2 billion in US military contracts last year. Rocket lab have refused to discuss the amount of funding they recieve from Lockheed Martin.

      Is naive little NZ developing military and surveillance technology for the US?

      • Wayne 4.2.1

        I don’t think cube satellites are of much interest to the military. Way too small for serious comms and data use, and way too small for aerial surveillance. The camera lens needs to at least 30 cm is diameter to be of any serious military use. Way too big for a cube sat.

        LM will just want Rocket Lab to be in its overall portfolio. After all LM won’t want to be completely reliant on military contracts. For instance the F35 project (largest single military contract in the world) will be complete in 10 years, and that probably accounts for 30% of current LM revenue.

      • greywarshark 4.2.2

        Fireblade that is what concerns me. One thing to notice is that every new finding and invention gets looked at by ‘defence’ to see if they can use it to advantage. And they very likely be funding the tech.

        And the othr thing that anything is moral if it makes a profit to these things parading themselves as people. So what if we are dependent for jobs on making butterfly bombs, rocket parts with impregnated mine material into every sq cm. etc?

  5. greywarshark 5

    How come the Opposition is doing all this quizzing of every meeting of some Ministers? It is as if they have taken over the snooping job of those detectives Thomson and Clark? What is the task they should be doing in their role?

    • tc 5.1

      Deflecting away from their 3 terms of damage and the car crash that is bridges and Bennett’s handling of bagman JLR.

      A full time job.

    • Rapunzel 5.2

      3000 questions they asked of just Shane Jones, let alone anyone else, and that was a ploy they signalled early in the term of the new government. I would like to know exactly what the questions were? Clearly by dint of the number of questions there would be “gaps”. Likewise when you see the range of people he spoke to that seemed entirely normal, I doubt the same can be said of opposition “meetings” both during this term and prior.
      The more people in NZ meet and talk with genuine intention the better off the country will be in the longterm.
      One thing that has been absent other that weasel worded, relentless and empty badgering from the entire opposition party is what they would do to improve NZ and the lives of NZers, prior, within this term by positive example and if they ever, god forbid, got themselves back on the government side of the house without a major shift in dedication and intentions for NZ.

      • Jack Ramaka 5.2.1

        Goldsmith is obsessed with trying to hang something on Shane Jones, it appears to be an obsessive delusional trait with the National Party at present, maybe they have private investigators following all the Government MP’s, National have plenty in their coffers from their Asian Backers ?

        Goldsmith appears to be working from the John Key & Crosby Textor Dirty Tricks Handbook ?

    • gsays 5.3

      I was scratching my head as to what a good/easy issue to practice bipartisanship.
      Treaty of Waitangi settlements.
      Ongoing, big budget (not one term fiscal responsibility) fairly apolitical.
      Who knows what could come of it?
      Every human is better when we cooperate.

    • Puckish Rogue 5.4

      Well when you proclaim to wanting the most open and transparent government ever then you have to expect the opposition will hold you to that

    • Stuart Munro 5.5

      They are trying to build an impression of holding the government to account – severely handicapped by their own cavalier behavior in office. They may fool some of their base by it, but not much more.

    • Jack Ramaka 5.6

      Goldsmith is obsessed with trying to hang something on Shane Jones, it appears to be an obsessive delusional trait with the National Party at present, maybe they have private investigators following all the Government MP’s, National have plenty in their coffers from their Asian Backers ?

      Goldsmith appears to be working from the John Key & Crosby Textor Dirty Tricks Handbook ?

    • Shadrach 5.7

      Clare Curran was an incompetent Minister whose downfall in part brought about by questioning about her ‘meetings’. It might be unpleasant, but it is a legitimate part of opposition.

  6. KJT 6

    National think that being in opposition involves getting back power at all costs..

    Their MP’s are tasked as being snipers, taking endless shots at the coalition, in the hope of winging as many as possible.

    Representing New Zealanders in Parliament is obviously not part of their job description.

  7. Chris T 7

    Am I the only that is slightly cynical and amused that the teachers strikes “just happen” to give both Auckland and Wellington teachers a long weekend?

  8. Good article on the t.rump debacle.

    “The whole weekend was supposed to be a show of western solidarity, and ended up proving its absence. Trump showed himself ill at ease with most of his European counterparts and the fleeting encounter with Putin was a reminder of his much greater affinity for autocrats.

    He has claimed warm, even affectionate, relations with Putin, Kim Jong-un, Xi Jinping, Mohammed bin Salman, Rodrigo Duterte and now Brazil’s president-elect, Jair Bolsonaro.

    Trump may have cut a lonely figure in Paris, but on the world stage, he is less and less isolated.”


    • RedLogix 8.1

      Yes. This has been apparent from the outset and is alarming. The man is a god-awful lout and his election symptomatic of a deeply divided and troubled society.

      Having said that, there may well be another side to this. In a world now increasingly dominated by dangerously authoritarian figures in places like Russia, China, Saudi, Brazil and so on … the liberal instincts of the west have proven an inadequate response.

      It’s possibly worth remembering that just prior to WW2 Churchill was widely regarded with similar disdain by almost the entire educated, leadership class in Britain. They saw him too as an erratic, uncouth man with a patchy record. (The ‘appeasers’ were by no means confined to Chamberlain; if events had transpired just a little differently there is no doubt that Rudolf Hess’s attempt at a peace treaty might well have succeeded.)

      Events play strange tricks with us, the leaders we need in peacetime are not necessarily the ones we need in times of trouble. I’m not trying to compare Trump with Churchill directly; but there are some parallels between the two men and their place in history that are worth thinking about.

      • marty mars 8.1.1

        I do think trump is a manifestation of his society, a consequence and predictable. To me he is dangerous, not just because of his ideas and beliefs but more because of the company he enjoys. He is like them and them ain’t good.

        Churchill was the man of the times as was Hitler as is t.rump. The hardest thing for me in some ways is knowing that he is just the beginning and he will be far from the worst as the Empire crumbles little bit by little bit. T.rump is funny in some ways, amongst the carnage – other ones coming won’t be funny.

        • RedLogix

          Yes. If I’m reading you correctly then I agree wholeheartedly. The potential for utter catastrophe is chilling and stalking us daily.

          My optimism pivots on this one thing; that for fear of the consequences these leaders of the world will soon agree to set aside some portion of their unconstrained national sovereignty in favour of a wider common good. Events in Paris more than hint at this possibility:

          Dozens of leaders, except Mr Trump, gathered in Paris later in the day for a peace forum.

          Opening the event, Mrs Merkel said: “Most of the challenges today cannot be solved by one nation alone, but together. That’s why we need a common approach.

          “If isolation wasn’t the solution 100 years ago, how can it be today in such an interconnected world?”


          Another link:

          With US President Donald Trump and Russian President Vladimir Putin sitting in the nearby audience, Macron said that “old demons are reawakening” and warned against ignoring the past as a lesson to the danger of nationalist sentiments.


          • marty mars

            Yes there does appear to be attempts to bring people together as per macrons speech. T.rump is diametrically opposed to that and him and his supporters are proud of that. This is their agenda. Thus the delusions perpetuate.

            There is a coalescing occurring around very fundamentally different ways of looking at things.

    • Bearded Git 8.2

      Thanks for posting that marty-superb article. What a nasty prat Trump is.

      I think the mid-term results have been poorly reported. The democrats now look like taking 35-36 seats in the House where early results showed more like 25. This is close to the “blue-wave” 40-seat gain they were after. The Democrats won 7 important Governor races.

      In Florida the Senate race is now within 0.14 percent where the Republican spent $60 million (NZ$90m) of his own fortune on trying to get elected. The recount will be interesting.

      Meanwhile there was a massive increase in young voters. Bodes well for 2020.

      Sanders for president? (Corbyn for PM?).

  9. greywarshark 9

    A good thought from Alphonse Mucha 1860-1939

    “The purpose of my work was never to destroy but always to create, to construct bridges, because we must live in the hope that humankind will draw together and that the better we understand each other the easier this will become.”
    Alphonse Mucha

  10. Peroxide Blonde 10

    Ideas matter.

    As he was inaugurated for a second term this evening, President Michael D Higgins said “ideas matter” and “history tells us that anti-intellectualism” is the “the weapon of authoritarian and anti-democratic forces in so many parts of our shared, vulnerable planet” .

    “Our choice must be to actively extend and deepen democracy, to express it in wider forms and in new ways,” he said.

    Not alone was “the very existence of our planet in its bio-diversity threatened but we have not yet slowed the pace of that destruction. We live with ongoing violence against women which must be ended.

    “We must confront and challenge any excuses offered for the denial of the irreducible rights, of women who make up, let us not forget, a majority of humanity on this planet. It is important that we recognize the rights and culture of indigenous peoples. It is also important that each person is free to express their sexuality, gender or relationship,” he said.


    When is New Zealand going to have its own President. ?

  11. greywarshark 11

    There should be a set curriculum at all schools in NZ with schools able to add to these, but not to forego important factual stuff we should all know and understand.
    And religion should not be taught, it should be part of a philosophy based curricu,um teaching about culture and how values are established.


    However, University of Canterbury School of Teacher Education senior lecturer Dr Richard Manning …
    Difficulties arose because of “perceived white backlash”. He had encountered history teachers who pushed back on teaching Māori history saying it was “all political correctness”.

    • Antoine 11.1

      > There should be a set curriculum at all schools in NZ with schools able to add to these, but not to forego important factual stuff we should all know and understand.

      Sorry dude, schools have taught very little ‘factual stuff’ of any sort for some time.

      You have to teach your own kids facts, or hope they pick it up in books.


      • McFlock 11.1.1

        Maybe they just don’t teach “alternative facts”?

        • Antoine

          Have you got school age kids??


          • I feel love

            I do, a 10 year old, she gets taught facts, thanks for your concern though.

            • Antoine

              Wasn’t talking to you,

              Besides, I also have a primary school age kid and not a lot of facts going on. More emphasis on doing their own research…


              • McFlock


                Because possession grants more expertise than merely knowing a few through friends, maybe?

                Most of the kids these days seem pretty onto it. Maybe the poor influence on your kids isn’t at school?

                • Antoine

                  Well, I don’t think kids learn a lot of facts at primary school, even compared to in my day (the 80s).

                  This is based on a sample size of 1 (my kid) plus what I hear from others and read in the media.

                  If you have information to the contrary I would be pleased to hear it.

                  > Most of the kids these days seem pretty onto it.
                  I never said they weren’t ‘onto it’! I said they don’t learn a lot of facts at school! It doesn’t actually seem that controversial of a statement. I do not think many modern educators would seriously contend that they try to stuff kids’ heads with facts nowadays.

                  >Maybe the poor influence on your kids isn’t at school?
                  You seem like a decent bloke overall, I don’t know why you act like an asshole towards me. Should I just stop trying to engage you in conversation?

                  To sum up, I think Cleangreen thinks that the Ministry of Education in Wellington sets a list of information (not skills, not competencies, but facts) that kids must learn. I respond that if this was ever the case, it has not been so for decades.


                  • McFlock

                    “Onto it” as in knowing stuff. Facts. Their math seems pretty good. Same with basic NZ history and plants and stuff. Most of the sprogs I know love to interrupt discussions with vaguely-relevant crap they picked up somewhere.

                    Sure, there’s not so much rote learning, but this isn’t a bad thing. And in my day they just hit us if we didn’t remember whatever shit was being taught at the time.

                    • bwaghorn

                      Heel yes I wish I was taught the new way . ..
                      Imagine being taught to think rather than remember .

                    • Antoine

                      > Most of the sprogs I know love to interrupt discussions with vaguely-relevant crap they picked up somewhere.

                      Bet it wasn’t at school


                    • McFlock

                      Unless it’s about dinosaurs or superheroes, you’d probably lose that bet.

                    • gsays

                      I had a chat to a modern teacher in regards to rote learning vs enquiry learning (not sure what correct terminology is).
                      This was after watching my son get to a level at maths ok then largely struggle. From about year 8.

                      I came through with the times table, rote learnt in the 70s.
                      With that foundation, I found it easy to hold 2or 3 parts of the solution in mind before getting answer.

                      I don’t think the answer is one or the other but a combo, but we have a habit of throwing out all of the old when we have a new.

                  • KJT

                    Yep. We have gone away from simply regurgitating long lists of facts, without understanding!

                    Rote recitation only works for times tables and the alphabet.

    • Pete 11.2

      The NZ curriculum for those who haven’t looked at it.



      One interesting element is the ‘Key Competencies.’ Calls for teacher performance pay usually mention testing kids for how much the kids ‘know’ in subjects and paying teachers accordingly not on how essential competencies have been achieved and to what level.

  12. WeTheBleeple 13

    Here’s a needle in a haystack, but it’s a start. Headline acknowledging climate change:


    Skyrocket consciousness. When your ass is on fire, you’ll move.

  13. Observer Tokoroa 14

    It’s A Pity

    In front of the world, America has shown everyone what a piss weak president they have. He would not walk a step to honour the American soldiers WWI. Because of rain drops.

    In front of the great State of California the same piss weak president has poured out his piss weak insults on the devastated, the dead and dying in the fierce hell fires – fiddling like a mad man with his insipid tweets.

    America is at its Weakest. Surely they can rid themselves of the current Whitehouse Fool.

  14. Eco maori 15

    Kia ora The Am Show It is alarming that the Pola Ice Cap’s could be melting faster than previously thought that will raze sea levels by mtr and not just cm there will be stronger storm and Hurricanes smashing the coastal community’s.
    .Christina its cool that we are talking about Human Caused Climate Change its about time I have worked out what has happened a BLUE Tsunami thank’s for your word’s Christina.
    Kiwi are kind when the telephon 24 hour TV fun razing money for to aid 3 world country’s was running Kiwi donated million’s we were one of the highest for donation’s per capital time’s were much easier in those day’s we had spear money.
    That the internet correcting thing’s again the fuel community price app is a cool Idea that will keep the gas company’s honestest may be you could have other consumer good’s and services listed to your app will pump.
    With our teachers strike they mone about there work load .
    I will give a example of the kicks and work smarter theory its fact actually.
    I was part of a organization that milked 5000.00 cow’s twice a day through one 80 bale shed the neighbour and the newbees could not milk 3500 2 80 bale sheds it was a finely run farming group .
    Point the teacher have heap’s of tool at there disposal to teach tamariki with the internet at there disposal they just have to look outside of the square to come up with smart efficient teaching solution’s.
    Also these strikes will hit the common poor tamariki the most if the parents have to take time off work to care for there tamariki the wealthy will just hire a carer
    There is a glut of oil on the market and we have hundred’s of thousands of electric vehicles coming on stream and millions of solar panels wind turbines displacing oil Thanks to China’s manufacturing muscle and people like Mus .
    Its good that the Anglican Church is backing the public inquiry into child abuse of
    state care tamariki and the Religious groups that cared for tamariki . Ka kite ano P.S no flash video links I need some DIMP for my computer the sandflys keep attacking it

  15. Eco Maori 16

    Here is the reason our fuel prices have dropped trump’s tricks have been countered
    the world woke up to his moves to inflate oil prices his oil baron supporters net worth went up by billions

    Also, the weekly estimates are not as accurate as the monthly figures, which are published on a roughly 2-month lag. As such, they should be taken with a grain of salt. However, the massive increase comes just days after the EIA reported a huge increase in production in the monthly data – at 11.346 mb/d in August, the U.S. oil industry has clearly been producing a lot more than previously thought. That lends some weight to the weekly figures.

    Another previously-bullish factor was Iran. With Iran’s oil exports spiraling downwards at the end of the summer and into September, the oil market grew very concerned about adequate global supply and the rapidly dwindling volume of spare capacity. U.S. waivers on countries importing Iranian oil removed that threat. Washington still wants to tighten the screws – and in fact, the sudden bearishness in the market gives the Trump administration more leeway to do just that – but in the near-term, Iran will continue to export.

    A third factor is OPEC+ production. Saudi Arabia, the UAE, Iraq, Russia and Libya have all increased production in recent months, offsetting the losses from Iran. Now, the group has a different problem on its hands. A technical committee to the OPEC+ coalition is set to meet this weekend where it will take stock of the oil market. They will also consider options going forward for managing the market, including the potential for a production cut in 2019 to avoid another market downturn. The 180-degree turn – from adding supply just a few months ago to now considering a cut – is a remarkable indicator that demonstrates how quickly the sentiment has turned.
    Ka kite ano

  16. Eco Maori 17

    Plunging Battery Costs To Trigger Energy Storage Boom YEA YES KA PAI

    Bloomberg New Energy Finance has forecast a veritable boom in energy storage installations in the coming years with investments hitting US$1.2 trillion by 2040. Falling battery costs will be the driver behind this boom, with BNEF projecting a 52 percent drop in utility-scale lithium-ion systems by 2030. .

    It is a fact that the cost of producing batteries for energy storage is falling. Cost reduction, after all, is a top priority for everyone from EV makers to utilities betting on energy storage as a future source of revenues

    But what about energy storage installations’ effect on the grid? That should be all-round positive, except for utilities that generate power from non-renewable sources. They better start preparing because BNEF’s analysts projected energy storage may rise to 7 percent of the world’s total installed power generation capacity by 2040.

    In more good news for renewables, while until about 2030 most energy storage installations will be utility-scale from about 2035 behind-the-meter facilities will begin to take over, which means they will probably be affordable by then, and Elon Musk’s concept of a household featuring a solar roof, a household battery pack, and an EV could become a reality not just for billionai Ka kite ano link below . P.S I could build a offgrid solar power system for a small family for $4000 all up .


  17. Eco Maori 18

    I decided to wait and see what happened when I first seen reports on China lifting Ban on trade in endangered animal parts
    The Chinese government announced on Monday that it would postpone a plan to lift the 25-year ban on the endangered animals, following a storm of international protest.
    It’s important to send the strongest message that the value of wild populations of tigers and rhinos and their ecosystems is much greater than the value of their bones and horns. Ka pai China they get the big picture its te tangata its te tangata and we need Papatuanuku and all her creatures to be respected to have a prosperous future for all.
    Link below ka kite ano


  18. Eco Maori 19

    We need to protect OUR worlds forest and start planting billions of trees for our future
    decedents to have a good life .There are many cases in OUR History that show’s a complete collapse of the environment and the society all because we did not respect mother nature .
    The UK, France and Germany have called on the European commission to launch tough new action to halt deforestation by the end of the year.

    A long-delayed EU action plan should be brought forward “as soon as possible”, says a letter to the commission sent by the Amsterdam Declaration group of countries, which also includes Italy, the Netherlands and Norway.

    To help meet a UN goal of halting deforestation by 2020, the EU should show “a leadership role, mobilising its political and market leverage, and promoting broader international dialogue and cooperation”, the letter says.
    Link below ka kite ano


  19. Eco Maori 20

    Its people like Stan Lee who have provided us with fantastic comic books he has ignited
    the imagination of billions of people and a lot have gone on to become the worlds greatest inventors condolences to his whano/family he will be missed he is in a higher place now
    Stan Lee: Spider-Man, X-Men and Avengers creator dies aged 95
    Born Stanley Martin Lieber on Manhattan’s Upper West Side in 1922, Lee’s childhood was marked by the Great Depression. In his 2002 autobiography Excelsior!, Lee described how his father’s struggle to find a steady job had forever affected him: “It’s a feeling that the most important thing for a man to do is to have work to do, to be busy, to be needed,” he wrote.

    At 17, Lee landed a job at a publishing company owned by his relative Martin Goodman, and began writing scripts for superhero and mystery comics. When Goodman fell out with his editor in 1941, Lee found himself editor-in-chief at just 19.
    Link below ka kite ano. P.S my eldest grandson has a flash suit


  20. Eco Maori 21

    Our Pacific cousins have a positive influence on Aotearoa society culturally and financially
    “The [NZ Pacific Economy] report reveals Pacific peoples are contributing significantly to the economy despite some of the poor health, housing, education and employment outcomes experienced by many in their communities,” Robertson said.
    Pasifika families and businesses are big contributors to NZ economy: Finance Minister Assets from about 1500 Pacific business employers and almost 500 not-for-profit organisations totalled up to $8.3b and, from those assets, the total value added was thought to be $3.1b annually. Ka kite ano link below.


  21. Eco Maori 22

    ASB has joined the fray in the latest round of mortgage rate wars – dropping its one year fixed rate to match the record low 3.95 per cent offered by ANZ.
    Its good to see ANZ bank start to the one year fixed interest rate drop that’s cool.
    But I will still be after one of there board members /shonky but if you can save money go for it put all the saving on the mortgage .The low rate specials offered by ANZ, BNZ and Westpac are only available to home owners with a deposit or 20 per cent equity stake in their homes.
    Its a buyers market now and about time thanks to the moves of our new Coalition Government. ka kite ano P.S we have other’s banks competing for your custom and the interest rate battle begins link below.


  22. Eco Maori 23

    Kia ora Te Kaea I have to use my phone to get the post out the sandflys are attaking my other computer.
    It will be a good trip for our Prime minister meeting all the heads of states talking about the Pacific relations and Climate change impacts on the Pacific and Aotearoa.
    It been good seeing Te IWIs helping there tangata into housing that’s the best way to escape the poverty trap a lot of our tangata fall into.
    Son of Zion are a cool banned music is good for te Wairua.
    It would be nice if our government did advocate for Indigenous people consern.s at the gathering of our world leaders.
    Ka kite ano P.S I will get some dimp tomorrow

  23. Eco Maori 24

    Kia ora Newshub Paddy Andrew is letting the people go into the Pike River mine that will be of great relief for Berne and the family of all the people who have lost love ones in the mine.
    Kate I have a post early on for the Great Comic writing legend Stan Lee.
    Those fires in Northern Calafornia is a great desaster condolences to the people who have lost.
    I say that the Shane Jones NZFirst billion tree program has had a minor hick up its what could happened to anyone when you have Papatuanukue and Tawhirirmate one can not pradict the weather.
    It looks like they had a good day at the Addington race way in Christchurch Ra is shining to.
    That’s what I wanted Sukieanne get her houners taken away for the atrocities that her government is doing to those poor people in Mayna.
    We get half our meat from my sons they buy a beef so I dive into their freezers.
    I do like my veggies to but I have to have some meat unprocessed we don’t eat as much meat as we used to.
    That must have been a shock to SUE she is doing a fine job the new Auckland Prison told her that she needs to have a photo ID and finger print to she helps people who are having proroale problems we have seen a lot of people can’t get prole no fix abode if they can’t read a write
    . Plastic water bottles leaching toxins well. I say know one has tested them for the effects on the fetus and the long term effects on anmials humans one to.
    Ka kite ano P.S mind the spelling sandflys muppets

  24. Eco Maori 25

    Some people try and play ECO MAORI they get the benefit of doubt they believe the lies the sandflys are spinning about ECO MAORI to them they get one chance.
    I should listen to my instinct it’s always correct Ana to kai

  25. Eco Maori 26

    The Crowd goes Wild Mulls and James.
    Manu and Butterbean fight will be interesting. Monty ECO a South paw.
    Mulls you lost weight can you still shuffle my moko is good at the shuffle they get their groove from the Wife my children give me shit when I have enough cups of tea to start to fluffel LOL.
    The Addington races NZ trotting Cup was Winston there.
    Butterbean has to get the message out drop the sugar us Pacific Islanders body’s are to effect at storing fat and sugar stuff up our health.
    Ka kite ano P.S that’s the way guys support the Bowls teams and Showing heaps of Wahine Sports Stars on The Crowd goes Wild

  26. Eco Maori 27

    Good morning The AM Show Azzes is having fun at the AMP Show.
    There you go Winston Peters and Andrew Little The Coalition Government has helped the Pike River family to find the truth about the explosion.
    This all happened because shonky made a unwise bet on COAL/Carbon. I have story that links shonky to Aotearoa losing 1 billion dollars of assets will tell when the time is right.
    The road accidents =not enough investment in roads and a xtra 1 million people and cars = more accidents.
    Lloyd the britexit I say it’s a can of worms they wish they never opened.
    Robots are the future and AI Is a big threat to human kind and the World take it seriously one just. To see how the sandflys are behaveing with the technology tools help you to understand part of my concern of Artifical Intelligents every single thing we do will have computers integrated into it and if one App has that power we’ll people who make movies about this subject are warming US.
    IF a person like trump gets the power of total control that AI can have we are in the SHIT.
    It will be cool if Israel gets a title fight at the UFC.
    There you go Berne Monk you want justice and accountability shonky was covering up the big mistake they made with the health and safety prosses at Pike River mine. Because the familys of the people who died are common people it’s worth the massive effort yous have put into getting justice a big WIN for the common tangata.
    Ka kite ano

  27. Eco Maori 28

    Kia ora The AM Show. The Pike River scandle is just one issue from shonky
    The Britexit don’t count your chickens May I have read that Nigal Farr has been linked to the Muler Russian investorgation I smelt that far right money all over his actions.
    I East Asia summit Tova I bet Mike Pence wanted to talk about more issues that the dumb trade tariff.??????????
    It has been the reward of a lot of people’s hard work that has paid off with the Mountain Grilla coming of the most endangered list.
    The Black Ferns are getting heaps of game time and coverage on TV
    Ka kite ano. P.S flip flop

  28. Eco Maori 29

    You can talk muppet puppet

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