yup, she’s a bubble all night. (just keep shuttin’ out those first home buyers and await the inevitable increase in liabilities; RNZ-landlords trying to get tenants to pay the water and rates bills in addition to rent)
Keep pulling that bow string back, bruv. You’ve still got a fair way to go before you can link DS with EM. Nice try though.
Show the poll that shows if UK Labour had ditched pm Brown before the last election, their losses would have reduced to the point of forming a legitimate coalition with the lib dems.
Yip, elections are popularity contests these days…is there much of a difference between Labour UK & Labour NZ policies?
edit – just read Karol’s comment below…now my question is, if NZ Labour brought in more policies like UK Labour, would Shearer be popular in the polls?
Miliband does have a reasonable amount of parliamentary experience: been an MP since 2005, has been a cabinet minister, was secretary of state for energy and climate change, has experience in student politics, has been an political speech writer and taken a lead in drafting Labour Party policy, is articulate and is very good at delivering speeches. He also has explicitly articulated his political position: he has stated he is a socialist, is for civil liberties, wants to scrap uni tuition fees and implement a graduate tax, is for an FTT, is against welfare cuts.
He still panders to neoliberalism, but I’d position him to the left of Shearer.
karol – both Millibands were raised by seriously socialist parents. IIRC his dad was a published marxist.
He still panders to neoliberalism
Not quite; I would suggest that he panders to capitalists. That is slightly different, and also necessary, given the economic structure the world runs on today.
Interesting that you consider Milliband “indifferent” yet I have a far better idea who he is and what he stands for than I do Shearer.
And that’s despite Milliband living on the other side of the planet and me having only a passing interest in anything he says.
Still, you can prove us all misguided any time you like by publishing the glowing poll results showing that Shearer has mumbled Labour ahead of National here too.
If not, you’re really only highlighting his failure to do so.
Ed Milliband speaking at his old comprehensive, during the UK Labour leadership challenge.
Listen to how he speaks off the cuff.
“My parents taught me something very very simple. Which is a faith really. If you see an injustice in your society you shouldn’t just walk by on the other side, you shouldn’t just get angry, you should do something about it.”
Oooh lads, your ignorance about Ed Miliband’s status in the UK is kinda cute.. He was initially regarded as being hopeless and is often ridiculed as being as being a Mr Bean like character. Like Shearer, he is starting to grow on the voters there. He is also, like Shearer, facing a whispering campaign to unseat him. Like it or not, its an apt comparison.
And, if you are going to claim reasonable knowledge of him and his works, felix, you should at least know how his name is spelled.
Actually, a quick google suggests TRP might be on to something.
Just from the line snapshots in google:
Sep 29, 2012 ā NEARLY half of Labour voters think that Ed Miliband is too WEAK to be Prime Minister, a poll has revealed.
Jun 23, 2012 ā Mr Miliband is used to being told that he is well placed to attract … Ed Miliband got some bad news: A private poll suggested his party’s lead …
Voters cannot see Ed Miliband in power http://www.newstatesman.com/node/40683/Sep 14, 2011 ā The Times has released its annual pre-conference poll (Ā£), and it shows that Ed Miliband is still failing to command the support of his party.
with a year and a half advantage in time – sarc>so, no knives out before 2014, eh? /sarc>
Oh, and I’m not sure there was a Cunliffe grandstanding at Ed’s party conference address, refusing to say whether he’d challenge for the leadership in Feb.
Oh, and Iām not sure there was a Cunliffe grandstanding at Edās party conference address, refusing to say whether heād challenge for the leadership in Feb.
Well, the UK Labour caucus had the sense to put their leadership out to a democratic vote by all members and all affiliates.
12 points, felix, put your glasses on. Itās an apt comparison for the reasons Iāve given above. Feel free to point out the social democratic party leader anywhere in the world more like Shearer than Miliband.
And seeing as you appear to have forgotten what I wrote, here it is again:
āIndifferent Labour leader who nobody much likes in poll shock:ā
My intention was to make people immediately think of Shearer, when the article was actually about Miliband. It’s a jokey juxtaposition of the two leaders, both of whom suffer from a lack of public enthusiasm. It’s a very common form of comedic one liner. Oddly enough, I’m sure you’ve cracked a few jokes along similar lines yourself in the past, so I’m surprised you’ve forgotten how it works.
The others get it, felix*. You used to be pretty funny yourself, back in the day. Why so sad?
*edit: Ok, you and the alien (below) don’t get it. Can I recommend the Guardian’s Fiver to you both? You’ll soon pick up how this comedic reversal stuff works.
You’re no dummy, so it must be my cunning goodness, Al1en! At the heart of it I was comparing Miliband and Shearer and the two Labour Parties. The leaders both got their jobs despite apparently better candidates being available and neither enjoys uncritical support. Both have a long way to go to convince voters to trust them, but UK Labour has found a way to turn disenchantment with the coalition government into positive support for them. NZ Labour have a couple of years to do the same, but the point is, it can be done.
Oh I get how it works. You say the same sort of stuff all the time and usually try to argue it, then every now and then instead of arguing it you say “I was joking, I actually meant the opposite, not just of what I said just now but of what I say all the time.”
Fuck me, you’re really losing it felix! I’m not going to put smiley’s on every mildly wry comment I occasionally make just because you have a cobb on. Cheer up, for fucks sake!
“And seeing as you appear to have forgotten what I wrote, here it is again:
āIndifferent Labour leader who nobody much likes in poll shock:ā”
I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make.
Is it Ed is perceived indifferently by some yet get’s good poll numbers, DS is perceived indifferently by many Labour members and voters, so it’s no surprise he’s continually gets the shit numbers his nothingness deserves?
I don’t get it.
And yet on the old BBC polltracker, despite alleged misgivings, on the numbers, UK Labour have been able to form a government for the past couple of years.
So the poll about dumping Brown pre election equating to reduced parliamentary losses.
Not applicable here?
Would dumping the extremely unpopular Shearer not bounce the polls?
Argue otherwise.
We should aim for indifferent spokespersons, backbench MPs and NZ Council members too.
Hey, why not go the full hog and insist that our canvassers/activists be indifferent and relatively unlikeable. That should do it. We are half way there. All we need now is for National to hang out the white flag, roll over and hand us the keys to the Beehive.
A) One so sure of the rightness of his convictions – and thus that all non-Catholics are bound for Hell* – that he mobilises all the tools available to any wealthy organisation in the 21st Century to assault the great unwashed with his version of the truth (including an all-out assault on the mistaken beliefs of those other misguided People of the Book presently lopping the limbs off non-believers in various parts of the world), or
B) A Pope who declares ex-cathedra that the whole thing is really just a crock of merda, or
C) A Pope who converts Roman Catholicism into its true role as an entertainment business, as “The Church Ltd.” and moves the Vatican to Hollywood, or
D) A Pope who completes his entire Papacy without a single scandal,
E) a lady Pope who manages not to get pregnant.
*Pope Boniface VIII: “We declare, say, define, and pronounce that it is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff.
Yup! (according to RNZ report; he just could not reconcile all this kiddy-fiddlin’ and there is a lot more to come out of the woodwork in this pornocratic age)
Prime TV has taken on 60 Minutes. Last night they did a great (?) Public Relations job for Mr Key and Sir Peter Jackson. The happily used the 3,000 employed and the saving of the Hobbits thanks to clever, brave action by Key and Jackson, leading to billions (!) of dollars for needy NZ.
Especially telling given the current wait for the emails.
They still categorise that program as “current affairs”, I just wonder “whose” “current affairs”?
“The Nation” on TV 3 has also struck me as having a “kind inclination” towards presenting the government in good light (remember the live cast from the National Party Conference and lengthy interviews with Ministers and co-hosted with selected media personalities).
This all calls for a solid return to fair, balanced public broadcasting, so turn TVNZ into something like the ABC in Australia. As for advertising “paying” for private or semi private broadcasting, in reality consumers pay for the broadcasting through buying the products advertised.
Only pay per view or so is acceptable, competitive “private” broadcasting.
Good skills, i love the Maori electorate seats, in my view an actual physical expression of Tinorangatiratanga within the Parliament,
Maori who deserve a central and pivotal role in the central decision making process are given that with the Maori electorates where they can at once vote for a candidate from within the rohe and if they so choose Party vote for who they see as being the major party of Government,
Speaking from Wellington i believe the Maori Party burned a lot of young people when it went into coalition with the National Government,
i was highly impressed having young Maori knocking on my door at the 2008 election seeking my vote for the party,(as i explained then i had to decline as Tariana’s motivation for foriming that party in the first place, no matter how justified She was in doing so, precluded the Maori Party from supporting a Labour lead Government),
It only took 18 months here for the Maori Party flags to all but disappear and the window stickers to be hastily scraped from the back windscreens of the waka,
2011 brought no canvassers for the Maori Party to the door round here and i can only assess the damage done to all those young Maori that once so proudly trod those miles supporting ‘their’ party against my own experience of having trod similar miles on behalf of the Labour Party which helped elect Sir(spit)Roger Douglas into a Government, which provided me a serious imperative to view myself as a fool for having been fooled by those people,
Good luck with inspiring your young voters we need them involved, not only as voters but as activists who have a voice in the political process…
It makes you wonder about the suggestion that Tamihere was going to get West Auckland Whanau to go over to the European roll. This would weaken the case for another seat so that he could try and take Bennett on. He would be better off going up against Pita Sharples.
Using Treasury figures Nick Smith is claiming that Labour’s KiwiBuild will not bring down the cost of housing in Auckland,(RadioNZ National news),
I have yet to see this Treasury report but it’s obvious from what Nick Smith has been saying that the Treasury has started from the point of a ‘false’ initial premise,(that the entire ‘build’ is a one off 10,000 homes), and then extrapolated their conclusions upon that false premise, in other words created for it’s own purposes a ‘strawman’ argument with which to attempt to discredit Labour’s ‘KiwBuild’ program,
Treasury of course get everything right in their advice to Minister’s like getting right the assertion that the GST rise to 15% along with the associated shuffling of the tax burdon to the detriment of those reliant on the lower income brackets for their daily needs by the Slippery lead National Government would be ‘fiscally neutral’,
Such a getting of it’s advice right to Government blew a billion dollar annual hole in the Government’s revenue from taxation, not that Slippery and Co gave a big one about that as their only intent with such a ‘tax switch’ was to ensure the loyalty of the current National Party vote,
The new Minister of un-Housing NZ Nick Smith tho thrives on such ‘strawman arguments'(if the truth were known it’s possible that He dictated the contents of the Treasury report to those who wrote it),and the 2009 settlement of Nick’s defamation of a South Island building supply company settled by over 200 grand of your and my monies shows that Nick hasn’t yet realized that mostly what is ejected from His mouth turns out to be s**t…
Did anyone read the Richard Prosser column in investigate magazine, where he refers to all muslims as being from “wogistan”, and states that anyone looking even vaguely “muslim” shouldnt be allowed on western airlines.
“In his latest column he refers to certain people as coming from āWogistanā and also declares that no young male who is a Muslim, looks like a Muslim or is from a Muslim country should be able to fly on a Western airline.”
That rules out Temuera Morrison and Cliff Curtis ever flying again š
What does a Muslim look like anyway? I think Prosser means Arab. What a dick.
Looks like pretty clear grounds for a Race Relations complaint. I guess he is after the publicity.
If they are happy with “White Mother Fuckers” – since it was an opinion (of somebody that is generally popular on this forum) – then Prossers opinion (as messed up as it is) should be ok also.
Private emails and published magazine columns are completely the same thing! Using a naughty word and advocating institutional oppression are completely the same thing!
God, could white dudes get over what a meany-pants Hone Harawira is already?
Messers felix and QoT, I aint diving into this one except to put this to your good minds…. this is exactly where the left misses huge portions of the population. Either the left has the wrong end of the stick in defending one disparaging racist comment and supporting the other disparaging racist comment, or the left is totally useless in explaining what is wrong with the point james makes. It just leaves the population shaking its head and dismissing it. QoT’s explanation comes across as splitting hairs to support personal preferences in the political realm.
This is what they see. I mean, what is going on when the two “sides”, left and right, just cannot understand each others points. Especially on issues as basic as this. It just comes across as two sets of rules for two different groups to the rightish types…
Yeah – Hone isnt a rasist – he is taken out of context. :Tui:
Its people like you – and the fact that labour will die in the ditch with Mana / NZ First if you needed that are driving your voters away in droves.
So dont worry about poor James – Felix Viper, worry about your own party who are sinking and will continue to do so. After all you are judged by the company you keep.
If you ever needed an example of why a Labour-Green-NZFirst coalition will never work you only have to look at the stupidity and racist bigotry contained in Richard Prosser’s (or is that Tosser’s) article. And fancy writing for Investigate magazine!
If you ever needed an example of why a Labour-Green-NZFirst coalition will never work …
This, exactly this.
Nobody on the (broad) left has to pander to the likes of Prosser. A Labour/Green majority is achievable. Now we just need Labour to say they really want one. And mean it.
Completely agree micky and gobsmacked. It scares me everytime I see someone here talk about a threeway coalition that included NZF as if it’s a good thing. And yeah, Labour really need to get their shit together on who their allies are.
Based on this article, will Shearer have the balls to ask Winston that he either dumps Prosser or Labour will not go into coaliation win NZF?, or does getting into power trump everything else?
Excellent, Winston has just about passed His used by date, Brendon Who has been kneecapped and bundled off to Siberia along with His leadership aspirations,
Prosser, the loose cannon in this little game of ‘Texas holdem’ has not only jumped off of the 17th floor in an act of political suicide far grander in scale than that of Brendon Who, Prosser has also managed to introduce the possibility that NZFirst wont feature in the next Parliament,
Bravo Richard Prosser lets have you on the TV news for a week raving about muslims and ‘Wogistan’ a guaranteed provocation that should have the left arm of NZFirst walking away in droves…
Winston was just on RadioNZ National distancing Himself from Richard Prosser’s comments, saying that there are zillions of law abiding Muslims and he knows a few personally as they are Party members,
Richard Prosser’s political future in NZFirst=Zero, NZFirst’s chances of returning to the Parliament in 2014= Fading fast…
Yet again, Mike W agrees with almost everything that Hooton says and so yet again the seemingly
only leftwing voice comes from the bloody presenter. (Hint Mike: It’s not Kathryn’s job to call Mathew out on his shit, it’s yours)
Lowlights: When asked why NZ doesn’t have enough sailors to operate its vessels, Hooton bizarrely goes into a rant about how the Green party are hypocrites because they aren’t pushing for a strong military given their position on climate change. (Hooton apparently thinks that consequences of climate change for NZ will be millions of Indonesians trying to invade us.)
After this Kathryn, once more, called him on his shit of not answering the question.
Then….
Right at the end Hooton, like a love-sick puppy, can’t sing enough praise for David Shearer, ‘oh David’s so savvy, oh David’s fought off three leadership challenges, oh David oh David….etc’
I used to think the problem with the show was hooton but it’s not, it’s Williams.
He’s too bloated (in all senses of the word) to do the job properly. Too close to the beltway. He’s spent too many years on the good paddocks, getting fat on the very system he should be railing against. I hear him speak and I feel, as he nods along with Hooters, that his mind is straying to the pasta and beer he’s going to have for lunch, or the afternoon nap in a comfy chair.
Please step down Mike. Please let someone with vitality and enthusiasm do the job properly.
The problem is the Nine to Noon producers. Maybe they need a few emails of alternative suggestions and encouragement to change, or at least trial some different people. Maybe making complaints would help.
Yeah I understood that it was a 10 vote abstention as well. In otehr words, 70% of caucus decided that there was no need to give a voice to the members and affiliates.
Don’t just blame the 70%, CV! The other 30% of caucus also decided that there was no need to give a voice to the members and affiliates and bottled it by abstaining.
And, encouragingly, 100% of caucus endorsed the democratic process the members and affiliates wanted and voted in at conference.
Even if this report was true, and I seriously doubt it, so what? The minority didn’t have the courage of their convictions., Shearer is endorsed and we move on …
The next government will be a Shearer led Labour /Green coalition.and Shearer will prove to be an excellent Labour PM. I just wish some of you so called Labour Supporters would just start to fully support the LP, party . I think a lot of you are just Tories in drag if you are not well join the Nat’s and moan and groan to those Po faced creeps or better still join NZ 1st and join the Muslim bashers At least they give the Jews and Asians a break. from their Racist utterances .
Ha, it’s “Muslim” now. I noticed earlier in the day though that it was “Moslem” except for the name of the NZ Muslim Association. So who do you reckon the numpty is, Kurt Bayer or Matthew Theunissen?
Labour leader David Shearer said the remarks were ”completely inappropriate for this Parliament”.
“It’s not something that came off the top of his head as a mistake, it was calculated. I think MPs… should act responsibly. And in this case I think it could lead to inciting violence.”
Other nations – particularly in the Middle East – will look on New Zealand “with some disdain”, Shearer said.
His instincts. are ‘OMG what will people think’ rather than the principle. And he includes a weird little aside about how he thinks Muslims might riot if he’d said it in the middle east. At least he didn’t call it wogistan I guess.
No, his instincts were to say Prosser’s comments were offensive and completely inappropriate for Parliament.
THEN to look into the further problems with them, and the impact they could have locally and internationally. And that the comments were premeditated, not just a slip of the tongue.
incorrect for two reasons: firstly, Shearer doesn’t do “ladsy” very well. Using the patois of the gutter wouldn’t be convincing from him – it would be patronising. And referring to “my government” at this stage would be fodder for key and yourself (seriously – if he’d said what you just typed, are you seriously saying you wouldn’t call him something like “try-hard and deluded”?).
So Shearer needed to go to the second characteristic of leadership: show decorum and geopolitical competence. Which he did.
Hone’s line was best, Peters did the minimising self-serving statement, and key was pretty noncommittal until fed the angle by the journalists.
Was he incorrect to start blathering about how he reckons Muslims might have reacted (hint Violent muslims)? Yes.
the point isn’t that what he said might hurt us internationally, the point is he’s a bigoted halfwit. How hard is it to say:
āItās outrageous and he wonāt be a minister in any government I leadā ?
If he needs to follow up on that go with how he wouldn’t have future in the party if he was a Labour MP but that’s a matter for Winston.
Or talk about how this is the sort of nonsense we last heard when Bush was in power, and the National party wanted to join in on the stupid war in Iraq, where John Key said we were missing in action.
My fault, should’ve been clearer. I just meant all he needs to do is strongly disagree and NOT waffle on about how you shouldn’t piss muslims off ‘cos they get a bit stroppy, or anything else.
Trouble is the more he does this sort of thing, the more I think he’s just saying what he really thinks.
And that’s way worse than what I was giving him credit for.
Shearer did strongly disagree with Prosser’s comments.
I disagree with your interpretation of Shearer’s comments relating to civil stability in the Middle East. I think they were valid, especially given his extensive experience in the area. But feel free to correct him. I suggest repeating Prosser’s statements in downtown Cairo. Let us know how you get on.
“I suggest repeating Prosserās statements in downtown Cairo. Let us know how you get on.”
Ah, so you mean if you just take Shearer’s literal words, squnting away all context and subtext, you could say he was factually accurate in that you shouldn’t actually go to the middle east and be all anti-muslim.
Does that make it a smart thing to say? I suppose it depends what message you’re trying to send.
A bit like Hone’s ‘white motherfuckers have been raping our land for centuries.’ Factually accurate if you allow a little poetic license, but potentially highly offensive, mainly to those with no grasp of basic set theory.
Many thought at the time that it was politically naive of him to say such things, but again, it depends who the message is for. Who do you think Shearer’s message about muslims being prone to violence was for?
“Many thought at the time that it was politically naive of him to say such things, but again, it depends who the message is for. Who do you think Shearerās message about muslims being prone to violence was for?”
That wasn’t the message I detected. So I guess is wasn’t for people who generally try to see if there’s any realistic reason for outrage before displaying it.
Maybe Shearer was simply pointing out that having a racist MP won’t make us friends in the Middle East, and might make us a few enemies? But once again Shearer can’t mention an issue without it apparently being an intentional dogwhistle.
Option B is that people are going well out of their way to detect cause for offense.
It’s all very well saying Shearer will led a Labour/ Green coalition but he’s not exactly shining when it comes to actually having some talent on the front benches – still the same old, same old. Even Key has managed to gain the march on him when it comes to bold moves (and that’s saying something). The vindictive way he has treated Cunliffe is rediculous. When Shearer starts pulling the party together, we will start winning!
Can someone who really knows what the Labour Constitution changes were please explain one thing for me.
Did Shearer have to get 60% of the caucus to vote for him to keep his position without a party-wide vote or did 40% have to vote against him to force a vote?
In the first case an abstention would be just the same as a no vote wouldn’t it?
In the second case it wouldn’t but there would surely have to be another candidate who stood against him.
Er, Shearer did get 100% support, if this lie is true. 100% support from those with the courage to vote. The interesting thing in this beat up is how low opposition to Shearer now is. Ok, it’s not true, but if its down to just ten, Shearer’s here for the long run.
Assuming you’ve replied to the wrong comment there, but anyhoo…
“for all the reasons I’ve given above” would seem to me to include the bit about how Ed is starting to grow on voters, and how the polls are showing it.
No?
edit: This was a response to a comment from TRP which appears to be missing.
[lprent: He probably deleted it. It can be done in the editing window. ]
I replied in the wrong place, felix, and deleted it. It’s now a bit further down the page.
And in answer to your question, a qualified yes. Both leaders are starting to gain some small traction in the preferred PM polls, but both have a long way to go. In terms of the UK poll support for Labour, it really has a lot to do with voter disgust with both the other parties, rather than anything Miliband is doing. But then, its probably easier to gain support in a 3 way, FPP contest where the other 2 parties form the current Government than it is in a 7 way MMP contest. In the UK situation, Labour is the default depository of the anti-coalition vote, though UKIP are also hurting the Tories by taking the important taxi driver, white van man and Little Englander vote.
A pondering… one tane huna and meself just had another ding dong over when someone becomes a hater rather than a person with simply a different view.
When does someone become a hater? You know, like a hater of homosexuals. A hater of old white men. A hater of the yellow peril. A hater of pakeha. When? Because as far as I can see there remain so many issues where there is blanket hypocrisy e.g. supporting of separate institutions… is this bigotry of a form? Or is it not? Or another example, supporting of inclusive institutions … is it this that is a form of prejudice? Or does it depend on what side of the political specturm your view apparently stems from according to political fashion of the day?
When does racism exist? When does ageism exist? When does any form of bigotry exist? It is such a mish-mash of varying rules and determinants that it renders so many of these accusations and labels empty and useless. There is no consistency. Or is there? Where is it? Who has it?
Peters’ response ain’t far from what Shearer said really. All that stuff about how the muslims would turn violent if you said that in the middle east etc, that’s pretty much just another way of saying there’s an element of truth to it.
I disagree. Peters was saying that there was an element of truth that muslim males pose a significant risk to air transport (when apparently Boeing batteries are more dangerous). Basically the only non-Muslim terrorist he knew of was McVeigh.
Shearer was simply pointing out that sometimes cartoons can clock off riots in the MidEast.
But Shearer should know that cartoons that insult the prophet have sparked riots. This is not like that. All he did was reinforce that those crazy Muslims riot at the drop of a hat over there in wogistan.
But this perfectly illustrates Shearer’s problem. He’s hopeless at politics.
I am quite certain that David Shearer the person – the guy who has worked in all those places, alongside so many people of different faiths, ethnicities etc – would be genuinely offended by Prosser’s comments. He’s thinking “What a racist sh*t”.
But Shearer the politician thinks he has to second-guess and run it by whoever the handlers are and generally dilute and diminish his own real response. He condemns, but … as always, with qualifiers. Every time he speaks, he qualifies.
According to NRT he couldn’t even say that he wouldn’t have Prosser in his team. But I bet he wouldn’t have Prosser in his team … he’s just been brainwashed into thinking he mustn’t say so. Or say anything that would interfere with the Sleepwalk Strategy.
FFS David, stop this. You lose both ways. The liberals and left only think less of you, the so-called centre (conservatives?) just think you’re a wimp.
Projection.
Just because you or I think in obscenities it doesn’t mean Shearer does.
And did KEY say Prosser couldn’t be in HIS government? If Shearer had said it he would be arrogant and delusional. He doesn’t so he gets flak. Key doesn’t, not a whisper. Shearer’s already losing both ways, right here.
Shearer can’t determine what Key says. Or what the media say about what Key says. But (and this really, really isn’t hard …) –
Shearer can determine what HE says. Jessica Mutch asked him a question. It wasn’t a fair question, it was a “Gotcha” if you like, but if Shearer can only cope with what’s fair, he should quit politics right now.
Do you seriously have any difficulty in deciding on the spot how to answer a question about standing Prosser down? Of course you don’t. Nor do I. Nor would anybody with an ounce of political smarts.
He is lost.
[lprent: I am getting concerned about your head banging. Is there anything we can do to help? š Personally at present I find that standing directly in front of te aircond….]
Who in the blogosphere has criticised key for not ruling prosser out of government, was my point. But it seems to be a drumbeat against the guy the drum-circle seem to think will never be IN government, anyway.
Mutch with a gotcha? What are you referring to? The only searches I’ve found that quote Shearer are print – got a link? Or am I to wait for 6pm?
Which still means issuing statements about who he’d govern with is arrogant to the point of delusion. Or it’s a serious omission by a probable future prime minister. Damned both ways.
He doesn’t have to issue statements. He simply has to respond to questions. Exactly what he’ll be required to do in the election campaign, without benefit of minders 24/7.
For the Twitter reaction, here’s a good starting point:
The relevance here is that this is part of a consistent pattern. Shearer is not faced with a tough challenge, condemning Prosser. But he can only deal with the prepared line (Stage 1), not follow-ups (Stage 2). That tells us a lot about both his political instincts, and his underlying principles. Both are found wanting, frequently.
There’s no “drum beat” from many of those (like Russell Brown) who were annoyed on Twitter. The idea that Shearer’s critics are only a Standard few is a delusion.
Yeah, on current polling it probably would be arrogant.
But that’s where he should be now: Being taken seriously as a contender for the top job, articulating an alternate vision for the country, describing the kind of govt he’ll lead.
@gobsmacked: I’m sure it’s just a one-off stumble, he won’t be like this all the time, he’s stared down warlords, his media training will kick in any day now, he’s only like this when there are cameras or people around etc etc.
You could point out how my characterisation is completely inconsistent with the measured and rational tone with which issues are logically discussed whenever Shearer’s name is mentioned. Good luck with that.
Yes, it’s getting quite difficult to criticise anything Shearer (or Labour) says without inviting quite irrational and emotional responses from certain commenters here.
Oh I think there’s been plenty of decent criticism. You’re bound to get a bit of mad barking when all the decent criticism goes so unheeded for so long though.
Cannot see anything wrong with the Shearer comment myself, if such a story became a feature of news in many of the Arab Muslim countries there is a likelihood of demonstrations being provoked…
I thought you wound up that little ding dong rather well!
Seems like the ground is always shifting as to what’s ‘a different opinion ‘ and what’s ‘enter derogatory name here’. I get fed up with the race to label someone and box them into a place where they have no choice but to hold their ground. What do you (as in anybody) want – to “win the contest” ? Have a frank exchange of views? Learn something? Bring someone round to your point of view? If you want to alter someone’s perception, giving them no option but to defend themselves at all costs results in a ‘not achieved.’
It’s interesting how one’s own views get challenged in unexpected ways. A couple of years ago, I was in a large workplace where I was one of the 5% minority by ethnicity and gender. That place fractured in ways I never expected, much of it was destructive, cut-throat and detrimental to the people it was meant to serve. It was very ugly and a timely warning that greed, ambition and egotism reside everywhere. And that for me is the crux of the matter – the best ideals can be subverted by ugliness.
I like authenticity. Where the walk matches the talk.
I’m very fond of the word ‘and’. Like, I think there’s room in the Labour Party for Louisa Wall AND John Tamihere. Personally, neither is my cup of tea, but both voices need to be heard. Room in the Green Party for Russel Norman AND David Cunliffe – yeah, I know, in my dreams.
Indeed, thanks for the feedback. You are especially right about the race to pigeonhole someone and the effect, often cumulative, that that has on healthy debate and inclusiveness – it does the opposite, as it did. For no gain.
This entire issue around pigeonholing and labelling and hypocrisy is on the watch list …..
Been trying to find an online copy of Tom Scott’s cartoon of Steven Joyce sicking a turtle onto Novopay in Sat 9 Feb DomPost. Stuff have conveniently not shown it, nor is it on their Tom Scott page. It’s sad/funny and spot on. Can anyone supply a link please?
Rob Oram, one of my favorites when commenting on either business or economics got around to being really circumspect when discussing the Mainzeal collapse on His regular RadioNZ National nine to noon spot today,
Rob got as far as pointing out that RichinaPacific the Richard Yan investment vehicle which was the majority shareholder in the collapsed Mainzeal had been de-listed from the New Zealand share-market
along with Mainzeal and RichinaPacific was then registered in the Bahamas,(a known tax haven),
Here’s one for Rob, and would tend to suggest RichinaPacific in the guise of a company registered in an extremely low tax jurisdiction being the depository for the monies from Mainzeal construction being a vehicle for claiming losses in a higher taxed jurisdiction,
December 2012, Revenue Minister, (the Hairdo from Ohariu), Peter Dunne publicly announces that He will be closing the loophole in the New Zealand tax laws which allows multi-national companies to declare losses in New Zealand and ship the profits off-shore to be declared in a low tax inviroment,
December 2012,Jenny Shiply along with a number of others quit the board of Mainzeal Construction…
If Johnny smart arse had worked in NZ for any great length of time before his need for greed completely took over and became Shylock he might have a small idea as to what NZ is loosing thru his tight wad policies
Crown Law spent $441,000 fighting Susan Couch suing corrections; as if the woman has not been through enough already nearly dying. RNZ put in an OIA request.
Yes and the awful affair has been going on since 2005!
It appears to have been settled only because the Corrections department got a new boss.
For a change I am on the side of Garth McVicar on this one.
Ok. Starting to get close. Two bugs, one (minor) enhancement, and a occasional repaint issue to go on the project. At 32 months, one product already released, a heart attack, and more than 4500 revisions in svn – I might be able to slow down from coding for a while and actually write some posts….
I’m sure that politicians will be looking forward to that. š
But congrats … I never picked up on what the project was but I imagine it’s been all consuming. In my own technical space I’ve been pretty committed and full on myself this last year or so… finally got to a decent break myself this week.
But how the hell did you do all that and run this place too Lynn?
Mostly over the last two years by steadily dropping everything that sucked up too much time. The Labour work I dropped. Effectively stopped writing posts and cut back on comments here, but maintained tech and moderation. Driving to work rather than buses/walking (saves about an hour a day but drops the exercise way back). And above all, using an iPad in bed for blogging and reading (kicked reading speed up by about 50%)
In a moment we explore the question: What is Andrew Bayly wanting to tell ACC, and will it involve enjoying a small wine tasting and then telling someone to fuck off? But first, for context, a broader one: What do we look for in a government?Imagine for a moment, you ...
As expected, Donald Trump just threw Ukraine under the bus, demanding that it accept Russia's illegal theft of land, while ruling out any future membership of NATO. Its a colossal betrayal, which effectively legitimises Russia's invasion, while laying the groundwork for the next one. But Trump is apparently fine with ...
This is a guest post by George Weeks, reviewing a book called ‘How to Fly a Horse’ by Kevin AshtonBook review: Ā āHow to Fly a Horseā by Kevin Ashton (2015) ā and what it means for Auckland. The title of this article might unnerve any Greater Auckland ...
In this world, it's just usYou know it's not the same as it wasSongwriters: Harry Edward Styles / Thomas Edward Percy Hull / Tyler Sam JohnsonYesterday, I received a lovely message from Caty, a reader of Nick’s Kōrero, that got me thinking. So I thought I’d share it with you, ...
In past times a person was considered “unserious” or “not a serious” person if they failed to grasp, behave and speak according to the solemnity of the context in which they were located. For example a serious person does not audibly pass gas at Church, or yell “gun” at a ...
Long stories short, the top six things in Aotearoa’s political economy around housing, climate and poverty on Thursday, February 13 are:The coalition Government’s early 2024 ‘fiscal emergency’ freeze on funding, planning and building houses, schools, local roads and hospitals helped extend and deepen the economic and jobs recession through calendar ...
For obvious reasons, people feel uneasy when the right to be a citizen is sold off to wealthy foreigners. Even selling the right to residency seems a bit dubious, when so many migrants who are not millionaires get turned away or are made to jump through innumerable hoops ā simply ...
A new season of White Lotus is nearly upon us: more murder mystery, more sumptuous surroundings, more rich people behaving badly.Once more we get to identify with the experience of the pampered tourist or perhaps the poorly paid help; there's something in White Lotus for all New Zealanders.And unlike the ...
In 2016, Aotearoa shockingly plunged to fourth place in the Transparency International Corruption Perceptions Index. Nine years later, and we're back there again: New Zealand has seen a further slip in its global ranking in the latest Corruption Perceptions Index (CPI). [...] In the latest CPI New Zealand's score ...
1. You’ve started ranking your politicians on how much they respect the rule of law2. You’ve stopped paying attention to those news publications3. You’ve developed a sudden interest in a particular period of history4. More and more people are sounding like your racist, conspiracist uncle.5. Someone just pulled a Nazi ...
Transforming New Zealand: Brian EastonBrian Easton will discuss the above topic at 2/57 Willis Street, Wellington at 5:30pm on Tuesday 26 February at 2/57 Willis Street, WellingtonThe sub-title to the above is "Why is the Left failing?" Brian Easton's analysis is based on his view that while the ...
Salvation Armyās State of the Nation 2025 report highlights falling living standards, the highest unemployment rates since the 1990s and half of all Pacific children going without food. There are reports of hundreds if not thousands of people are applying for the same jobs in the wake of last year’s ...
Mountain Tui is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.Correction: On the article The Condundrum of David Seymour, Luke Malpass conducted joint reviews with Bryce Wilkinson, the architect of the Regulatory Standards Bill - not Bryce Edwards. The article ...
Tomorrow the council’s Transport, Resilience and Infrastructure Committee meet and agenda has a few interesting papers. Council’s Letter of Expectation to Auckland Transport Every year the council provide a Letter of Expectation to Auckland Transport which is part of the process for informing AT of the council’s priorities and ...
All around in my home townThey're trying to track me down, yeahThey say they want to bring me in guiltyFor the killing of a deputyFor the life of a deputySongwriter: Robert Nesta Marley.Support Nick’s Kōrero today with a 20% discount on a paid subscription to receive all my newsletters directly ...
Hi,I think all of us have probably experienced the power of music — that strange, transformative thing that gets under our skin and helps us experience this whole life thing with some kind of sanity.Listening and experiencing music has always been such a huge part of my life, and has ...
Business frustration over the stalled economy is growing, and only 34% of voters are confidentNicola Willis can deliver. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāLong stories short, the top six things in Aotearoa’s political economy around housing, climate and poverty on Wednesday, February 12 are:Business frustration is growing about a ...
I have now lived long enough to see a cabinet minister go both barrels on their Prime Minister and not get sacked.It used to be that the PM would have a drawer full of resignations signed by ministers on the day of their appointment, ready for such an occasion. But ...
This session will feature Simon McCallum, Senior Lecturer in Engineering and Computer Science (VUW) and recent Labour Party candidate in the Southland Electorate talking about some of the issues around AI and how this should inform Labour Party policy. Simon is an excellent speaker with a comprehensive command of AI ...
The proposed Waimate garbage incinerator is dead: The company behind a highly-controversial proposal to build a waste-to-energy plant in the Waimate District no longer has the land. [...] However, SIRRL director Paul Taylor said the sales and purchase agreement to purchase land from Murphy Farms, near Glenavy, lapsed at ...
The US Foreign Corrupt Practices Act has been a vital tool in combatting international corruption. It forbids US companies and citizens from bribing foreign public officials anywhere in the world. And its actually enforced: some of the world's biggest companies - Siemens, Hewlett Packard, and Bristol Myers Squibb - have ...
December 2024 photo - with UK Tory Boris Johnson (Source: Facebook)Those PollsFor hours, political poll results have resounded across political hallways and commentary.According to the 1News Verizon poll, 50% of the country believe we are heading in the “wrong direction”, while 39% believe we are “on the right track”.The left ...
A Tai RÄwhiti mill that ran for 30 years before it was shut down in late 2023 is set to re-open in the coming months, which will eventually see nearly 300 new jobs in the region. A new report from Massey University shows that pensioners are struggling with rising costs. ...
As support continues to fall, Luxon also now faces his biggest internal ructions within the coalition since the election, with David Seymour reacting badly to being criticised by the PM. File photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāLong stories short, the top six things in Aotearoa’s political economy around housing, climate ...
Not since 1988 when Richard Prebble openly criticised David Lange have we seen such a challenge to a Prime Minister as that of David Seymour to Christopher Luxon last night. Prebble suggested Lange had mental health issues during a TV interview and was almost immediately fired. Seymour hasnāt gone quite ...
Three weeks in, and the 24/7 news cycle is not helping anyone feel calm and informed about the second Trump presidency. One day, the US is threatening 25% trade tariffs on its friends and neighbours. The reasons offered by the White House are absurd, such as stopping fentanyl coming in ...
This video includes personal musings and conclusions of the creator climate scientist Dr. Adam Levy. It is presented to our readers as an informed perspective. Please see video description for references (if any). Wherever you look, you'll hear headlines claiming we've passed 1.5 degrees of global warming. And while 2024 saw ...
Photo by Heather M. Edwards on UnsplashHere’s the key news, commentary, reports and debate around Aotearoa’s politics and economy in the week to Feb 10 below. That’s ahead of live chats on the Substack App and The Kākā’s front page on Substack at 5pm with: on his column in The ...
Is there anyone in the world the National Party loves more than a campaign donor? Why yes, there is! They will always have the warmest hello and would you like to slip into something more comfortable for that great god of our age, the High Net Worth Individual.The words the ...
Waste and fraud certainly exist in foreign aid programs, but rightwing celebration of USAID’s dismantling shows profound ignorance of the value of soft power (as opposed to hard power) in projecting US influence and interests abroad by non-military/coercive means (think of “hearts and minds,” “hugs, not bullets,” “honey versus vinegar,” ...
Health New Zealand is proposing to cut almost half of its data and digital positions – more than 1000 of them. The PSA has called on the Privacy Commissioner to urgently investigate the cuts due to the potential for serious consequences for patients. NZNO is calling for an urgent increase ...
We may see a few more luxury cars on Queen Street, but a loosening of rules to entice rich foreigners to invest more here is unlikely to “turbocharge our economic growth”. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāLong stories short, the top six things in Aotearoa’s political economy around housing, climate ...
Let us not dance daintily around the elephant in the room. Our politicians who serve us in the present are not honest, certainly not as honest as they should be, and while the right are taking out most of the trophies for warping narratives and literally redefining “facts”, the kiwi ...
A few weeks ago I took a look at public transport ridership in 2024. In today’s post I’m going to be looking a bit deeper at bus ridership. Buses make up the vast majority of ridership in Auckland with 70 million boardings last year out of a total of 89.4 ...
Oh, you know I did itIt's over and I feel fineNothing you could say is gonna change my mindWaited and I waited the longest nightNothing like the taste of sweet declineSongwriters: Chris Shiflett / David Eric Grohl / Nate Mendel / Taylor Hawkins.Hindsight is good, eh?The clarity when the pieces ...
Photo by Towfiqu barbhuiya on UnsplashHere’s what we’re watching in the week to February 16 and beyond in Aotearoa’s political economy around housing, climate and poverty:Monday, February 10The Kākā’s weekly wrap-up of news about politics and the economy is due at midday, followed by webinar for paying subscribers in Substack’s ...
A listing of 23 news and opinion articles we found interesting and shared on social media during the past week: Sun, February 2, 2025 thru Sat, February 8, 2025. This week's roundup is again published soleley by category. We are still interested in feedback to hone the categorization, so if ...
Today, I stumbled across a Twitter Meme: the ending of The Lord of the Rings as a Chess scenario: https://x.com/mellon_heads/status/1887983845917564991 It gets across the basic gist. Aragorn and Gandalf offering up ‘material’ at the Morannon allows Frodo and Samwise to catch Sauron unawares – fair enough. But there are a ...
Last week, Kieran McAnulty called out Chris Bishop and Nicola Willis for their claims that Kāinga Ora’s costs were too high.They had claimed Kāinga Ora’s cost were 12% higher than market i.e. private devlopersBut Kāinga Ora’s Chair had already explained why last year:"We're not building to sell, so we'll be ...
Stuff’s Political Editor Luke Malpass - A Fellow at New Zealand IniativeLast week I half-joked that Stuff / The Post’s Luke Malpass1 always sounded like he was auditioning for a job at the New Zealand Initiative.Mountain Tui is a reader-supported publication. For a limited time, subscriptions are 20% off. Thanks ...
At a funeral on Friday, there were A4-sized photos covering every wall of the Dil’s reception lounge. There must have been 200 of them, telling the story in the usual way of the video reel but also, by enlargement, making it more possible to linger and step in.Our friend Nicky ...
Skeptical Science is partnering with Gigafact to produce fact briefs — bite-sized fact checks of trending claims. This fact brief was written by Sue Bin Park from the Gigafact team in collaboration with members from our team. You can submit claims you think need checking via the tipline. Is methane the ...
The Government’s idea is that the private sector and Community Housing Providers will fund, build and operate new affordable housing to address our housing crisis. Meanwhile, the Government does not know where almost half of the 1,700 children who left emergency housing actually went. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāLong ...
Oh, home, let me come homeHome is wherever I'm with youOh, home, let me come homeHome is wherever I'm with youSongwriters: Alexander Ebert / Jade Allyson CastrinosMorena,I’m on a tight time frame this morning. In about an hour and a half, I’ll need to pack up and hit the road ...
This is a post about the Mountain Tui substack, and small tweaks - further to the poll and request post the other day. Please don’t read if you aren’t interested in my personal matters. Thank you all.After oohing-and-aahing about how to structure the Substack model since November, including obtaining ...
This transcript of a recent conversation between the Prime Minister and his chief economic adviser has not been verified.Weāve announced we are the āYes Governmentā. Do you like it?Yes, Prime Minister.Dreamed up by the PR team. Itās about being committed to growth. Not that the PR team know anything about ...
The other day, Australian Senator Nick McKim issued a warning in the Australian Parliement about the US’s descent into fascim.And of course it’s true, but I lament - that was true as soon as Trump won.What we see is now simply the reification of the intention, planning, and forces behind ...
Among the many other problems associated with Musk/DOGE sending a fleet of teenage and twenty-something cultists to remove, copy and appropriate federal records like social security, medicaid and other supposedly protected data is the fact that the youngsters doing the data-removal, copying and security protocol and filter code over-writing have ...
Jokerman dance to the nightingale tuneBird fly high by the light of the moonOh, oh, oh, JokermanSong by Bob Dylan.Morena folks, I hope this fine morning of the 7th of February finds you well. We're still close to Paihia, just a short drive out of town. Below is the view ...
It’s been an eventful week as always, so here’s a few things that we have found interesting. We also hope everyone had a happy and relaxing Waitangi Day! This week in Greater Auckland We’re still running on summer time, but provided two chewy posts: On Tuesday, a guest ...
Queuing on Queen St: the Government is set to announce another apparently splashy growth policy on Sunday of offering residence visas to wealthy migrants. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāLong stories short, the top six things in our political economy around housing, climate and poverty on Friday, February 7:PM Christopher ...
The fact that Waitangi ended up being such a low-key affair may mark it out as one of the most significant Waitangi Days in recent years. A group of women draped in “Toitu Te Tiriti” banners who turned their backs on the politicians’ powhiri was about as rough as it ...
Hi,This week’s Flightless Bird episode was about “fake seizure guy” — a Melbourne man who fakes seizures in order to get members of the public to sit on him.The audio documentary (which I have included in this newsletter in case you don’t listen to Flightless Bird) built on reporting first ...
This is a re-post from Yale Climate Connections by Karin Kirk The 119th Congress comes with a price tag. The oil and gas industry gave about $24 million in campaign contributions to the members of the U.S. House and Senate expected to be sworn in January 3, 2025, according to a ...
Early morning, the shadows still long, but you can already feel the warmth building. Our motel was across the road from the historic homestead where Henry Williams' family lived. The evening before, we wandered around the gardens, reading the plaques and enjoying the close proximity to the history of the ...
Thanks folks for your feedback, votes and comments this week. I’ll be making the changes soon. Appreciate all your emails, comments and subscriptions too. I know your time is valuable - muchas gracias.A lot is happening both here and around the world - so I want to provide a snippets ...
Data released today by Statistics NZ shows that unemployment rose to 5.1%, with 33,000 more people out of work than last year said NZCTU Te Kauae Kaimahi Economist Craig Renney. āThe latest data shows that employment fell in Aotearoa at its fastest rate since the GFC. Unemployment rose in 8 ...
The December labour market statistics have been released, showing yet another increase in unemployment. There are now 156,000 unemployed - 34,000 more than when National took office. And having thrown all these people out of work, National is doubling down on cruelty. Because being vicious will somehow magically create the ...
Boarded up homes in Kilbirnie, where work on a planned development was halted. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāLong stories short, the top six things in our political economy around housing, climate and poverty on Wednesday, February 5 are;Housing Minister Chris Bishop yesterday announcedKāinga Ora would be stripped of ...
This week Kiwirail and Auckland Transport were celebrating the completion of the summer rail works that had the network shut or for over a month and the start of electric trains to Pukekohe. First up, here’s parts of the press release about the shutdown works. Passengers boarding trains in Auckland ...
Through its austerity measures, the coalition government has engineered a rise in unemployment in order to reduce inflation while ā simultaneously ā cracking down harder and harder on the people thrown out of work by its own policies. To that end, Social Development Minister Louise Upston this week added two ...
This year, we've seen a radical, white supremacist government ignoring its Tiriti obligations, refusing to consult with MÄori, and even trying to legislatively abrogate te Tiriti o Waitangi. When it was criticised by the Waitangi Tribunal, the government sabotaged that body, replacing its legal and historical experts with corporate shills, ...
Poor old democracy, it really is in a sorry state. It would be easy to put all the blame on the vandals and tyrants presently trashing the White House, but this has been years in the making. It begins with Margaret Thatcher and Ronald Reagan and the spirit of Gordon ...
The new school lunches came in this week, and they were absolutely scrumptious.I had some, and even though Connor said his tasted like “stodge” and gave him a sore tummy, I myself loved it!Look at the photos - I knew Mr Seymour wouldn’t lie when he told us last year:"It ...
The tighter sanctions are modelled on ones used in Britain, which did push people off ‘the dole’, but didn’t increase the number of workers, and which evidence has repeatedly shown don’t work. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāLong stories short, the top six things in our political economy around housing, ...
Catching you up on the morning’s global news and a quick look at the parallels -GLOBALTariffs are backSharemarkets in the US, UK and Europe have “plunged” in response to Trump’s tariffs. And while Mexico has won a one month reprieve, Canada and China will see their respective 25% and 10% ...
This post by Nicolas Reid wasĀ originally published on Linked in. It is republished here with permission. Gondolas are often in the news, with manufacturers of ropeway systems proposing them as a modern option for mass transit systems in New Zealand. However, like every next big thing in transport, itās hard ...
This is a re-post from The Climate BrinkBoth 2023 and 2024 were exceptionally warm years, at just below and above 1.5C relative to preindustrial in the WMO composite of surface temperature records, respectively. While we are still working to assess the full set of drivers of this warmth, it is clear that ...
Hi,I woke up feeling nervous this morning, realising that this weekend Flightless Bird is going to do it’s first ever live show. We’re heading to a sold out (!) show in Seattle to test the format out in front of an audience. If it works, we’ll do more. I want ...
The Whangarei District Council being forced to fluoridate their local water supply is facing a despotic Soviet-era disgrace. This is not a matter of being pro-fluoride or anti-fluoride.Ā It is a matter of what New Zealanders see and value as democracy in our country. Individual democratically elected Councillors are not ...
Nicola Willisā latest supermarket announcement is painfully weak with no new ideas, no real plan, and no relief for Kiwis struggling with rising grocery costs. ...
Half of Pacific children sometimes going without food is just one of many heartbreaking lowlights in the Salvation Armyās annual State of the Nation report. ...
The Salvation Armyās State of the Nation report is a bleak indictment on the failure of Government to take steps to end poverty, with those on benefits, including their children, hit hardest. ...
New Zealand First has today introduced a Memberās Bill which would restore decision-making power to local communities regarding the fluoridation of drinking water. The āFluoridation (Referendum) Legislation Billā seeks to repeal the Health (Fluoridation of Drinking Water) Amendment Act 2021 that granted centralised authority to the Direct General of Health ...
New Zealand First has introduced a Memberās Bill aimed at preventing banks from refusing their services to businesses because of the current āEnvironmental, Social, and Governance (ESG) Frameworkā. āThis Bill ensures fairness and prevents ESG standards from perpetuating woke ideology in the banking sector being driven by unelected, globalist, climate ...
Erica Stanford has reached peak shortsightedness if todayās announcement is anything to go by, picking apart immigration settings piece by piece to the detriment of the New Zealand economy. ...
Our originating document, theĀ Treaty of Waitangi, was signed on February 6, 1840. An agreement between MÄori and the British Crown. Initially inked by NgÄ Puhi in Waitangi, further signatures were added as it travelled south. The intention was to establish a colony with the cession of sovereignty to the Crown, ...
Te Whatu Ora Chief Executive Margie Apa leaving her job four months early is another symptom of this governmentās failure to deliver healthcare for New Zealanders. ...
The Green Party is calling for the Prime Minister to show leadership and be unequivocal about Aotearoa New Zealandās opposition to a proposal by the US President to remove Palestinians from Gaza. ...
The latest unemployment figures reveal that job losses are hitting MÄori and Pacific people especially hard, with MÄori unemployment reaching a staggering 9.7% for the December 2024 quarter and Pasifika unemployment reaching 10.5%. ...
Waitangi 2025: Waitangi Day must be community and not politically driven - Shane Jones Our originating document, theĀ Treaty of Waitangi, was signed on February 6, 1840. An agreement between MÄori and the British Crown. Initially inked by NgÄ Puhi in Waitangi, further signatures were added as it travelled south. ...
Despite being confronted every day with people in genuine need being stopped from accessing emergency housing ā National still wonāt commit to building more public houses.Ā ...
The Green Party says the Government is giving up on growing the countryās public housing stock, despite overwhelming evidence that we need more affordable houses to solve the housing crisis. ...
Before any thoughts of the New Year and what lies ahead could even be contemplated, New Zealand reeled with the tragedy of Senior Sergeant Lyn Fleming losing her life. For over 38 years she had faithfully served as a front-line Police officer. Working alongside her was Senior Sergeant Adam Ramsay ...
Green Party co-leader Marama Davidson will return to politics at Waitangi on Monday the 3rd of February where she will hold a stand up with fellow co-leader Chlƶe Swarbrick.Ā ...
Te PÄti MÄori is appalled by the government's blatant mishandling of the school lunch programme. David Seymourās ācost-savingā measures have left tamariki across Aotearoa with unidentifiable meals, causing distress and outrage among parents and communities alike. āWhatās the difference between providing inedible food, and providing no food at all?ā Said ...
The Government is doubling down on outdated and volatile fossil fuels, showing how shortsighted and destructive their policies are for working New Zealanders. ...
Green Party MP Steve Abel this morning joined Coromandel locals in Waihi to condemn new mining plans announced by Shane Jones in the pit of the townās Australian-owned Gold mine. ...
The Green Party is calling on the Government to strengthen its just-announced 2030-2035 Nationally Determined Contribution (NDC) under the Paris Agreement and address its woeful lack of commitment to climate security. ...
Today marks a historic moment for Taranaki iwi with the passing of the Te Pire Whakatupua mÅ Te KÄhui Tupua/Taranaki Maunga Collective Redress Bill in Parliament. "Today, we stand together as descendants of Taranaki, and our tÅ«puna, Taranaki Maunga, is now formally acknowledged by the law as a living tÅ«puna. ...
Labour is relieved to see Childrenās Minister Karen Chhour has woken up to reality and reversed her governmentās terrible decisions to cut funding from frontline service providers ā temporarily. ...
It is the first week of David Seymourās school lunch programme and already social media reports are circulating of revolting meals, late deliveries, and mislabelled packaging. ...
The Green Party says that with no-cause evictions returning from today, the move to allow landlords to end tenancies without reason plunges renters, and particularly families who rent, into insecurity and stress. ...
The Governmentās move to increase speed limits substantially on dozens of stretches of rural and often undivided highways will result in more serious harm. ...
In her first announcement as Economic Growth Minister, Nicola Willis chose to loosen restrictions for digital nomads from other countries, rather than focus on everyday Kiwis. ...
The Governmentās commitment to get New Zealandās roads back on track is delivering strong results, with around 98 per cent of potholes on state highways repaired within 24 hours of identification every month since targets were introduced, Transport Minister Chris Bishop says. āIncreasing productivity to help rebuild our economy is ...
The former Cadbury factory will be the site of the Inpatient Building for the new Dunedin Hospital and Health Minister Simeon Brown says actions have been taken to get the cost overruns under control. āToday I am giving the people of Dunedin certainty that we will build the new Dunedin ...
From today, Plunket in WhÄngarei will be offering childhood immunisations ā the first of up to 27 sites nationwide, Health Minister Simeon Brown says. The investment of $1 million into the pilot, announced in October 2024, was made possible due to the Governmentās record $16.68 billion investment in health. It ...
New Zealandās strong commitment to the rights of disabled people has continued with the response to an important United Nations report, Disability Issues Minister Louise Upston has announced. Of the 63 concluding observations of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities (UNCRPD), 47 will be progressed ...
Resources Minister Shane Jones has launched New Zealandās national Minerals Strategy and Critical Minerals List, documents that lay a strategic and enduring path for the mineral sector, with the aim of doubling exports to $3 billion by 2035. Mr Jones released the documents, which present the Coalition Governmentās transformative vision ...
Firstly I want to thank OceanaGold for hosting our event today. Your operation at Waihi is impressive. I want to acknowledge local MP Scott Simpson, local government dignitaries, community stakeholders and all of you who have gathered here today. Itās a privilege to welcome you to the launch of the ...
Racing Minister, Winston Peters has announced the Government is preparing public consultation on GST policy proposals which would make the New Zealand racing industry more competitive. āThe racing industry makes an important economic contribution. New Zealand thoroughbreds are in demand overseas as racehorses and for breeding. The domestic thoroughbred industry ...
Business confidence remains very high and shows the economy is on track to improve, Economic Growth Minister Nicola Willis says. āThe latest ANZ Business Outlook survey, released yesterday, shows business confidence and expected own activity are āstill both very highā.ā The survey reports business confidence fell eight points to +54 ...
Enabling works have begun this week on an expanded radiology unit at Hawkeās Bay Fallen Soldiersā Memorial Hospital which will double CT scanning capacity in Hawkeās Bay to ensure more locals can benefit from access to timely, quality healthcare, Health Minister Simeon Brown says. This investment of $29.3m in the ...
The Government has today announced New Zealandās second international climate target under the Paris Agreement, Climate Change Minister Simon Watts says. New Zealand will reduce emissions by 51 to 55 per cent compared to 2005 levels, by 2035. āWe have worked hard to set a target that is both ambitious ...
Nine years of negotiations between the Crown and iwi of Taranaki have concluded following Te Pire Whakatupua mÅ Te KÄhui Tupua/the Taranaki Maunga Collective Redress Bill passing its third reading in Parliament today, Treaty Negotiations Minister Paul Goldsmith says. āThis Bill addresses the historical grievances endured by the eight iwi ...
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I woke with a start
in the middle of the night
I realised our banking friends
just hoovered another great bite
of our daily toil you see
each time our eyes alight with glee
at the thought of hundreds of thousands
bulging our wallets so easily
. . .
all that is needed
is a 12% rise
in the price of Auckland houses
of great and wonderous size
12% you see
times $550,000 of each of 400,000 houses not many
is $26,000,000,000 (that’s 26 billion) in one short year..
So thanks mr banker for providing such a sum
is only $1,6000,000 (that’s 1.6 billion) in interest (for printed money of all things) ….
how …..
bloody ….
dumb ….
yup, she’s a bubble all night. (just keep shuttin’ out those first home buyers and await the inevitable increase in liabilities; RNZ-landlords trying to get tenants to pay the water and rates bills in addition to rent)
USA! USA! We’re No.2!
China overtakes the US in world trade. The Asian century has begun:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2013/feb/11/china-worlds-largest-trading-nation
Indifferent Labour leader who nobody much likes in poll shock:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2013/feb/11/labour-lead-conservative-12-point-poll
Harrumph. His brother would have done better. š
Keep pulling that bow string back, bruv. You’ve still got a fair way to go before you can link DS with EM. Nice try though.
Show the poll that shows if UK Labour had ditched pm Brown before the last election, their losses would have reduced to the point of forming a legitimate coalition with the lib dems.
I would not call Miliband indifferent. He is a conviction politician who speaks well.
And it makes you wonder why New Zealand Labour is not doing better.
And that’s with them blamed for GBR’s financial woes and increasing taxes for the lowest paid during their last government.
Looking at caucus is reason enough to work out why NZ Labour are not doing better.
Not really the Caucus, just the hopeless leader. Replace him with someone who can speak and Labour will have a 10 point bounce overnight.
Yip, elections are popularity contests these days…is there much of a difference between Labour UK & Labour NZ policies?
edit – just read Karol’s comment below…now my question is, if NZ Labour brought in more policies like UK Labour, would Shearer be popular in the polls?
“Not really the Caucus, just the hopeless leader.”
All right, just at least 22 of them.
Miliband does have a reasonable amount of parliamentary experience: been an MP since 2005, has been a cabinet minister, was secretary of state for energy and climate change, has experience in student politics, has been an political speech writer and taken a lead in drafting Labour Party policy, is articulate and is very good at delivering speeches. He also has explicitly articulated his political position: he has stated he is a socialist, is for civil liberties, wants to scrap uni tuition fees and implement a graduate tax, is for an FTT, is against welfare cuts.
He still panders to neoliberalism, but I’d position him to the left of Shearer.
Yep and he said that the UK’s involvement in the Iraqi war was a mistake. All power to him.
karol – both Millibands were raised by seriously socialist parents. IIRC his dad was a published marxist.
Not quite; I would suggest that he panders to capitalists. That is slightly different, and also necessary, given the economic structure the world runs on today.
Interesting that you consider Milliband “indifferent” yet I have a far better idea who he is and what he stands for than I do Shearer.
And that’s despite Milliband living on the other side of the planet and me having only a passing interest in anything he says.
Still, you can prove us all misguided any time you like by publishing the glowing poll results showing that Shearer has mumbled Labour ahead of National here too.
If not, you’re really only highlighting his failure to do so.
Ed Milliband speaking at his old comprehensive, during the UK Labour leadership challenge.
Listen to how he speaks off the cuff.
“My parents taught me something very very simple. Which is a faith really. If you see an injustice in your society you shouldn’t just walk by on the other side, you shouldn’t just get angry, you should do something about it.”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DriJZdZxFpU
This is who TRP describes as an “indifferent” leader.
There’s a lot in that video that relates to the NZ Labour Party too, eh?
If only there were someone on the front bench capable of saying it. (Or someone who understands it.)
Oooh lads, your ignorance about Ed Miliband’s status in the UK is kinda cute.. He was initially regarded as being hopeless and is often ridiculed as being as being a Mr Bean like character. Like Shearer, he is starting to grow on the voters there. He is also, like Shearer, facing a whispering campaign to unseat him. Like it or not, its an apt comparison.
And, if you are going to claim reasonable knowledge of him and his works, felix, you should at least know how his name is spelled.
Didn’t claim that at all, TRP. Quite the opposite in fact.
“Like it or not, its an apt comparison.”
Really? You must have some polling data that none of the rest of us have seen then. Apparently Ed is 10 points ahead of the tories.
How far ahead of the tories is Dave?
Actually, a quick google suggests TRP might be on to something.
Just from the line snapshots in google:
Sep 29, 2012 ā NEARLY half of Labour voters think that Ed Miliband is too WEAK to be Prime Minister, a poll has revealed.
http://www.thesun.co.uk/…/Only-one-in-five-Brits-think-Ed-Miliban…Oct 1, 2012 ā FEWER than one in five Brits thinks Labour chief Ed Miliband is a PM in waiting, an exclusive YouGov poll for The Sun reveals.
Jun 23, 2012 ā Mr Miliband is used to being told that he is well placed to attract … Ed Miliband got some bad news: A private poll suggested his party’s lead …
Voters cannot see Ed Miliband in power
http://www.newstatesman.com/node/40683/Sep 14, 2011 ā The Times has released its annual pre-conference poll (Ā£), and it shows that Ed Miliband is still failing to command the support of his party.
Not following you McF.
Two leaders attract the same sort of criticisms, only one defies them.
with a year and a half advantage in time – sarc>so, no knives out before 2014, eh? /sarc>
Oh, and I’m not sure there was a Cunliffe grandstanding at Ed’s party conference address, refusing to say whether he’d challenge for the leadership in Feb.
Fair point about the 18 month head start.
Well, the UK Labour caucus had the sense to put their leadership out to a democratic vote by all members and all affiliates.
Amazing the unity in UK Labour which resulted eh?
Unlike the NZ Labour conference that chose not to put the vote to the membership of caucus had confidence in the leadership.
I agree with you.
On this count both the NZ Labour caucus and the NZ Labour Conference fucked up.
12 points, felix, put your glasses on. Itās an apt comparison for the reasons Iāve given above. Feel free to point out the social democratic party leader anywhere in the world more like Shearer than Miliband.
And seeing as you appear to have forgotten what I wrote, here it is again:
āIndifferent Labour leader who nobody much likes in poll shock:ā
My intention was to make people immediately think of Shearer, when the article was actually about Miliband. It’s a jokey juxtaposition of the two leaders, both of whom suffer from a lack of public enthusiasm. It’s a very common form of comedic one liner. Oddly enough, I’m sure you’ve cracked a few jokes along similar lines yourself in the past, so I’m surprised you’ve forgotten how it works.
ps, cheers, McFlock, you’re onto it.
This “joking” of yours, I dunno if it’s working for you.
The others get it, felix*. You used to be pretty funny yourself, back in the day. Why so sad?
*edit: Ok, you and the alien (below) don’t get it. Can I recommend the Guardian’s Fiver to you both? You’ll soon pick up how this comedic reversal stuff works.
Maybe I’m just a little too dumb and/or you’re just so cunningly good.
Happy to concede to either, unless of course I’m re-polarising the humour and injecting a particle of back at you, in which case, perhaps not. š
But being as honest as I am, I can’t lie. I just didn’t get it. š
You’re no dummy, so it must be my cunning goodness, Al1en! At the heart of it I was comparing Miliband and Shearer and the two Labour Parties. The leaders both got their jobs despite apparently better candidates being available and neither enjoys uncritical support. Both have a long way to go to convince voters to trust them, but UK Labour has found a way to turn disenchantment with the coalition government into positive support for them. NZ Labour have a couple of years to do the same, but the point is, it can be done.
“Youāre no dummy”
Now I know you’re having a laugh. š
“it can be done.”
No doubting you. If only NZ Labour had their own Ed.
Oh I get how it works. You say the same sort of stuff all the time and usually try to argue it, then every now and then instead of arguing it you say “I was joking, I actually meant the opposite, not just of what I said just now but of what I say all the time.”
Hilar.
Fuck me, you’re really losing it felix! I’m not going to put smiley’s on every mildly wry comment I occasionally make just because you have a cobb on. Cheer up, for fucks sake!
Oh, didn’t you get it? Was totally a joke.
Yep, you certainly are. But not a particularly witty one, I’m afraid.
1057 pedants write in to say that the Fiver’s not very funny.
“And seeing as you appear to have forgotten what I wrote, here it is again:
āIndifferent Labour leader who nobody much likes in poll shock:ā”
I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make.
Is it Ed is perceived indifferently by some yet get’s good poll numbers, DS is perceived indifferently by many Labour members and voters, so it’s no surprise he’s continually gets the shit numbers his nothingness deserves?
I don’t get it.
Like Shearer, he is starting to grow on the voters
From the voice of reason
And yet on the old BBC polltracker, despite alleged misgivings, on the numbers, UK Labour have been able to form a government for the past couple of years.
So the poll about dumping Brown pre election equating to reduced parliamentary losses.
Not applicable here?
Would dumping the extremely unpopular Shearer not bounce the polls?
Argue otherwise.
And here the bloody Labour party can’t get past 33% What a crock!
Inspired TPR!
We should aim for indifferent spokespersons, backbench MPs and NZ Council members too.
Hey, why not go the full hog and insist that our canvassers/activists be indifferent and relatively unlikeable. That should do it. We are half way there. All we need now is for National to hang out the white flag, roll over and hand us the keys to the Beehive.
Inspired Strategy, Go TRP, the Voice of Pagani!
Aim…low..
Comprehension prob’s this arvo, KV? Try reading the words aloud. Oh, you already do that?
Worst Pope since that dork who made himself infallible. On your bike pal.
Tau Henare for pope!
lolz
If only all leaders had the humility to step down when they realise they’re not up to the job rather than letting pride get in the way…
Begs the question of what a great Pope would be:
A) One so sure of the rightness of his convictions – and thus that all non-Catholics are bound for Hell* – that he mobilises all the tools available to any wealthy organisation in the 21st Century to assault the great unwashed with his version of the truth (including an all-out assault on the mistaken beliefs of those other misguided People of the Book presently lopping the limbs off non-believers in various parts of the world), or
B) A Pope who declares ex-cathedra that the whole thing is really just a crock of merda, or
C) A Pope who converts Roman Catholicism into its true role as an entertainment business, as “The Church Ltd.” and moves the Vatican to Hollywood, or
D) A Pope who completes his entire Papacy without a single scandal,
E) a lady Pope who manages not to get pregnant.
*Pope Boniface VIII: “We declare, say, define, and pronounce that it is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff.
What has really made the Pope’s job untenable?
Probably the last eight decades of child sexual assault creating a backlog of settlements.
Yup! (according to RNZ report; he just could not reconcile all this kiddy-fiddlin’ and there is a lot more to come out of the woodwork in this pornocratic age)
On the flipside, someone has at last voluntarily left a secure job, most likely just to go on a benefit.
My ACT membership fees are in the post š
Prime TV has taken on 60 Minutes. Last night they did a great (?) Public Relations job for Mr Key and Sir Peter Jackson. The happily used the 3,000 employed and the saving of the Hobbits thanks to clever, brave action by Key and Jackson, leading to billions (!) of dollars for needy NZ.
Especially telling given the current wait for the emails.
They still categorise that program as “current affairs”, I just wonder “whose” “current affairs”?
“The Nation” on TV 3 has also struck me as having a “kind inclination” towards presenting the government in good light (remember the live cast from the National Party Conference and lengthy interviews with Ministers and co-hosted with selected media personalities).
This all calls for a solid return to fair, balanced public broadcasting, so turn TVNZ into something like the ABC in Australia. As for advertising “paying” for private or semi private broadcasting, in reality consumers pay for the broadcasting through buying the products advertised.
Only pay per view or so is acceptable, competitive “private” broadcasting.
It is that time again for Maori to decide which electoral roll to sign onto the Maori or European rolls,
The more Maori who sign onto the Maori roll, the more likely it is that there will be more Maori electorate seats in the Parliament…
running a whanau campaign as i type. Most Maori I know are on the Maori roll. Just need to educate more of our young ones.
Good skills, i love the Maori electorate seats, in my view an actual physical expression of Tinorangatiratanga within the Parliament,
Maori who deserve a central and pivotal role in the central decision making process are given that with the Maori electorates where they can at once vote for a candidate from within the rohe and if they so choose Party vote for who they see as being the major party of Government,
Speaking from Wellington i believe the Maori Party burned a lot of young people when it went into coalition with the National Government,
i was highly impressed having young Maori knocking on my door at the 2008 election seeking my vote for the party,(as i explained then i had to decline as Tariana’s motivation for foriming that party in the first place, no matter how justified She was in doing so, precluded the Maori Party from supporting a Labour lead Government),
It only took 18 months here for the Maori Party flags to all but disappear and the window stickers to be hastily scraped from the back windscreens of the waka,
2011 brought no canvassers for the Maori Party to the door round here and i can only assess the damage done to all those young Maori that once so proudly trod those miles supporting ‘their’ party against my own experience of having trod similar miles on behalf of the Labour Party which helped elect Sir(spit)Roger Douglas into a Government, which provided me a serious imperative to view myself as a fool for having been fooled by those people,
Good luck with inspiring your young voters we need them involved, not only as voters but as activists who have a voice in the political process…
It makes you wonder about the suggestion that Tamihere was going to get West Auckland Whanau to go over to the European roll. This would weaken the case for another seat so that he could try and take Bennett on. He would be better off going up against Pita Sharples.
He sure would! Sometimes you wonder about politicians, signing onto the Maori roll as opposed to European should not be a monopoly game……
JT must earn a seat by taking it from the opposition.
Using Treasury figures Nick Smith is claiming that Labour’s KiwiBuild will not bring down the cost of housing in Auckland,(RadioNZ National news),
I have yet to see this Treasury report but it’s obvious from what Nick Smith has been saying that the Treasury has started from the point of a ‘false’ initial premise,(that the entire ‘build’ is a one off 10,000 homes), and then extrapolated their conclusions upon that false premise, in other words created for it’s own purposes a ‘strawman’ argument with which to attempt to discredit Labour’s ‘KiwBuild’ program,
Treasury of course get everything right in their advice to Minister’s like getting right the assertion that the GST rise to 15% along with the associated shuffling of the tax burdon to the detriment of those reliant on the lower income brackets for their daily needs by the Slippery lead National Government would be ‘fiscally neutral’,
Such a getting of it’s advice right to Government blew a billion dollar annual hole in the Government’s revenue from taxation, not that Slippery and Co gave a big one about that as their only intent with such a ‘tax switch’ was to ensure the loyalty of the current National Party vote,
The new Minister of un-Housing NZ Nick Smith tho thrives on such ‘strawman arguments'(if the truth were known it’s possible that He dictated the contents of the Treasury report to those who wrote it),and the 2009 settlement of Nick’s defamation of a South Island building supply company settled by over 200 grand of your and my monies shows that Nick hasn’t yet realized that mostly what is ejected from His mouth turns out to be s**t…
Did anyone read the Richard Prosser column in investigate magazine, where he refers to all muslims as being from “wogistan”, and states that anyone looking even vaguely “muslim” shouldnt be allowed on western airlines.
Tried to find it online, but best I can do is a kiwiblog link (sorry).
http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/wogistan.html
“In his latest column he refers to certain people as coming from āWogistanā and also declares that no young male who is a Muslim, looks like a Muslim or is from a Muslim country should be able to fly on a Western airline.”
That rules out Temuera Morrison and Cliff Curtis ever flying again š
What does a Muslim look like anyway? I think Prosser means Arab. What a dick.
Looks like pretty clear grounds for a Race Relations complaint. I guess he is after the publicity.
Not really a Race Relations complaint.
If they are happy with “White Mother Fuckers” – since it was an opinion (of somebody that is generally popular on this forum) – then Prossers opinion (as messed up as it is) should be ok also.
Private emails and published magazine columns are completely the same thing! Using a naughty word and advocating institutional oppression are completely the same thing!
God, could white dudes get over what a meany-pants Hone Harawira is already?
Poor James, no grasp of set theory, takes a couple of words out of a sentence and applies his own meaning as if it were gospel.
Hint James: When I say “smart motherfuckers have been posting in this thread” I’m not necessarily talking about you.
Messers felix and QoT, I aint diving into this one except to put this to your good minds…. this is exactly where the left misses huge portions of the population. Either the left has the wrong end of the stick in defending one disparaging racist comment and supporting the other disparaging racist comment, or the left is totally useless in explaining what is wrong with the point james makes. It just leaves the population shaking its head and dismissing it. QoT’s explanation comes across as splitting hairs to support personal preferences in the political realm.
This is what they see. I mean, what is going on when the two “sides”, left and right, just cannot understand each others points. Especially on issues as basic as this. It just comes across as two sets of rules for two different groups to the rightish types…
So, what gives?
Over
I never said Hone’s comments were advisable, or helpful, or smart.
Yeah – Hone isnt a rasist – he is taken out of context. :Tui:
Its people like you – and the fact that labour will die in the ditch with Mana / NZ First if you needed that are driving your voters away in droves.
So dont worry about poor James – Felix Viper, worry about your own party who are sinking and will continue to do so. After all you are judged by the company you keep.
lol at that kb thread, not many commenters disagree with Prosser.
DPF puts on his outraged urban liberal hat and invites all his KKK mates over for a beer.
As usual.
I heard this Prosser issue make it on to National Radio. Really fucking sick bastard.
If Winston doesn’t force Prosser to retract this ASAP it will be a black mark against NZ1: evidence that it’s still a racist party at heart.
If you ever needed an example of why a Labour-Green-NZFirst coalition will never work you only have to look at the stupidity and racist bigotry contained in Richard Prosser’s (or is that Tosser’s) article. And fancy writing for Investigate magazine!
If you ever needed an example of why a Labour-Green-NZFirst coalition will never work …
This, exactly this.
Nobody on the (broad) left has to pander to the likes of Prosser. A Labour/Green majority is achievable. Now we just need Labour to say they really want one. And mean it.
Is that so much to ask?
Completely agree micky and gobsmacked. It scares me everytime I see someone here talk about a threeway coalition that included NZF as if it’s a good thing. And yeah, Labour really need to get their shit together on who their allies are.
Based on this article, will Shearer have the balls to ask Winston that he either dumps Prosser or Labour will not go into coaliation win NZF?, or does getting into power trump everything else?
Should be asking Key really, he’s the one who’s going to have to deal with Winston & co.
Excellent, Winston has just about passed His used by date, Brendon Who has been kneecapped and bundled off to Siberia along with His leadership aspirations,
Prosser, the loose cannon in this little game of ‘Texas holdem’ has not only jumped off of the 17th floor in an act of political suicide far grander in scale than that of Brendon Who, Prosser has also managed to introduce the possibility that NZFirst wont feature in the next Parliament,
Bravo Richard Prosser lets have you on the TV news for a week raving about muslims and ‘Wogistan’ a guaranteed provocation that should have the left arm of NZFirst walking away in droves…
Winston was just on RadioNZ National distancing Himself from Richard Prosser’s comments, saying that there are zillions of law abiding Muslims and he knows a few personally as they are Party members,
Richard Prosser’s political future in NZFirst=Zero, NZFirst’s chances of returning to the Parliament in 2014= Fading fast…
Darn – no cliff in a hollywood movie – on the upside it also means no Tem in a hollywood movie.
Just listened to yesterday’s RNZ politics with Hooton & Williams.
http://podcast.radionz.co.nz/ntn/ntn-20130211-1110-politics_with_matthew_hooton_and_mike_williams-048.mp3
Yet again, Mike W agrees with almost everything that Hooton says and so yet again the seemingly
only leftwing voice comes from the bloody presenter. (Hint Mike: It’s not Kathryn’s job to call Mathew out on his shit, it’s yours)
Lowlights: When asked why NZ doesn’t have enough sailors to operate its vessels, Hooton bizarrely goes into a rant about how the Green party are hypocrites because they aren’t pushing for a strong military given their position on climate change. (Hooton apparently thinks that consequences of climate change for NZ will be millions of Indonesians trying to invade us.)
After this Kathryn, once more, called him on his shit of not answering the question.
Then….
Right at the end Hooton, like a love-sick puppy, can’t sing enough praise for David Shearer, ‘oh David’s so savvy, oh David’s fought off three leadership challenges, oh David oh David….etc’
I used to think the problem with the show was hooton but it’s not, it’s Williams.
He’s too bloated (in all senses of the word) to do the job properly. Too close to the beltway. He’s spent too many years on the good paddocks, getting fat on the very system he should be railing against. I hear him speak and I feel, as he nods along with Hooters, that his mind is straying to the pasta and beer he’s going to have for lunch, or the afternoon nap in a comfy chair.
Please step down Mike. Please let someone with vitality and enthusiasm do the job properly.
+1
I don’t like having to listen to sound of Williams wheezing all the way through the slot. Can’t they turn his mic off when he’s not speaking?
Hah! Absolutely, quartz.
The problem is the Nine to Noon producers. Maybe they need a few emails of alternative suggestions and encouragement to change, or at least trial some different people. Maybe making complaints would help.
Yeah true, CW.
How can this be so? The secret vote is no longer secret? And whoever has leaked it is pushing Grant Robertson as leader?
http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/was_it_10_votes_against.html
Yeah I understood that it was a 10 vote abstention as well. In otehr words, 70% of caucus decided that there was no need to give a voice to the members and affiliates.
Don’t just blame the 70%, CV! The other 30% of caucus also decided that there was no need to give a voice to the members and affiliates and bottled it by abstaining.
And, encouragingly, 100% of caucus endorsed the democratic process the members and affiliates wanted and voted in at conference.
Even if this report was true, and I seriously doubt it, so what? The minority didn’t have the courage of their convictions., Shearer is endorsed and we move on …
…to Robertson.
The next government will be a Shearer led Labour /Green coalition.and Shearer will prove to be an excellent Labour PM. I just wish some of you so called Labour Supporters would just start to fully support the LP, party . I think a lot of you are just Tories in drag if you are not well join the Nat’s and moan and groan to those Po faced creeps or better still join NZ 1st and join the Muslim bashers At least they give the Jews and Asians a break. from their Racist utterances .
How hard would it have been for Shearer to respond to Prosser’s crap by saying “It’s outrageous and he won’t be a minister in any government I lead” ?
But instead
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10864924
where are his instincts? On what do you base your belief that he’d be an excellent PM?
Why on earth is the word “Moslem” used in that NZH article??? What the frak is a “Moslem”???
An indication that the Herald’s only dictionary on site is fifty years old?
Ha, it’s “Muslim” now. I noticed earlier in the day though that it was “Moslem” except for the name of the NZ Muslim Association. So who do you reckon the numpty is, Kurt Bayer or Matthew Theunissen?
And from Stuff:
That’s my point McFlock.
His instincts. are ‘OMG what will people think’ rather than the principle. And he includes a weird little aside about how he thinks Muslims might riot if he’d said it in the middle east. At least he didn’t call it wogistan I guess.
The best bit is the subtle buying into the “Muslims are violent and lawless” meme that Prosser is promoting.
No, his instincts were to say Prosser’s comments were offensive and completely inappropriate for Parliament.
THEN to look into the further problems with them, and the impact they could have locally and internationally. And that the comments were premeditated, not just a slip of the tongue.
Was he incorrect?
The correct answer in that context is “That’s racist bullshit and I won’t have him in my govt”.
Anything else – in that context, for Shearer – is incorrect, yes.
incorrect for two reasons: firstly, Shearer doesn’t do “ladsy” very well. Using the patois of the gutter wouldn’t be convincing from him – it would be patronising. And referring to “my government” at this stage would be fodder for key and yourself (seriously – if he’d said what you just typed, are you seriously saying you wouldn’t call him something like “try-hard and deluded”?).
So Shearer needed to go to the second characteristic of leadership: show decorum and geopolitical competence. Which he did.
Hone’s line was best, Peters did the minimising self-serving statement, and key was pretty noncommittal until fed the angle by the journalists.
[edit] PB – did we cross-post?
Was he incorrect to start blathering about how he reckons Muslims might have reacted (hint Violent muslims)? Yes.
the point isn’t that what he said might hurt us internationally, the point is he’s a bigoted halfwit. How hard is it to say:
āItās outrageous and he wonāt be a minister in any government I leadā ?
If he needs to follow up on that go with how he wouldn’t have future in the party if he was a Labour MP but that’s a matter for Winston.
Or talk about how this is the sort of nonsense we last heard when Bush was in power, and the National party wanted to join in on the stupid war in Iraq, where John Key said we were missing in action.
That was geopolitical competence? For whom, a 3rd year pol-sci undergrad?
nope. From someone with several years’ experience in the region.
I guess we did cross post.
Read this: Judith Collins ffs, sounds more like what I’d expect a NZ Labour party leader to sound like:
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA1302/S00126/nz-embarrassed-by-prossers-comments.htm
rain artillery on the prick, from a position of principle.
Goff’s statement.
Similar to Collins’. Which is a valid technique – the leader frowns, the front bench barks. 1-MP parties have to do both.
I didn’t mean he should say that verbatim McF.
My fault, should’ve been clearer. I just meant all he needs to do is strongly disagree and NOT waffle on about how you shouldn’t piss muslims off ‘cos they get a bit stroppy, or anything else.
Trouble is the more he does this sort of thing, the more I think he’s just saying what he really thinks.
And that’s way worse than what I was giving him credit for.
completely inappropriate for Parliament.
Totally appropriate in heaps of other contexts, though.
Shearer did strongly disagree with Prosser’s comments.
I disagree with your interpretation of Shearer’s comments relating to civil stability in the Middle East. I think they were valid, especially given his extensive experience in the area. But feel free to correct him. I suggest repeating Prosser’s statements in downtown Cairo. Let us know how you get on.
@QoT: what a load of crap.
“I suggest repeating Prosserās statements in downtown Cairo. Let us know how you get on.”
Ah, so you mean if you just take Shearer’s literal words, squnting away all context and subtext, you could say he was factually accurate in that you shouldn’t actually go to the middle east and be all anti-muslim.
Does that make it a smart thing to say? I suppose it depends what message you’re trying to send.
A bit like Hone’s ‘white motherfuckers have been raping our land for centuries.’ Factually accurate if you allow a little poetic license, but potentially highly offensive, mainly to those with no grasp of basic set theory.
Many thought at the time that it was politically naive of him to say such things, but again, it depends who the message is for. Who do you think Shearer’s message about muslims being prone to violence was for?
“Many thought at the time that it was politically naive of him to say such things, but again, it depends who the message is for. Who do you think Shearerās message about muslims being prone to violence was for?”
That wasn’t the message I detected. So I guess is wasn’t for people who generally try to see if there’s any realistic reason for outrage before displaying it.
Maybe Shearer was simply pointing out that having a racist MP won’t make us friends in the Middle East, and might make us a few enemies? But once again Shearer can’t mention an issue without it apparently being an intentional dogwhistle.
Option B is that people are going well out of their way to detect cause for offense.
It’s possible.
It’s also possible that he’s just not very good at making a concise, unambiguous statement.
I guess one day we’ll have enough data to figure out if there’s a pattern to support either of those hypotheses.
Ex-UNAMA worker in let’s-avoid-violence in Middle East shocker!
Cf to Harawira –
” Mana Party leader Hone Harawira said Mr Prosser’s comments were racist, and without basis in fact.
“It’s kinda like saying that no 19- to 35-year-old white guys should be allowed to go anywhere because they cause so many wars around the world.”
Lol.
I thought Hone was pretty damn good with that one.
aye, ’twas a nice response.
It’s all very well saying Shearer will led a Labour/ Green coalition but he’s not exactly shining when it comes to actually having some talent on the front benches – still the same old, same old. Even Key has managed to gain the march on him when it comes to bold moves (and that’s saying something). The vindictive way he has treated Cunliffe is rediculous. When Shearer starts pulling the party together, we will start winning!
How private was the private vote? Did some MPs abstain instead of voting because they feared repercussions?
Well, not so much supposed to be a private vote, as a secret vote…
most MPs voted for just a little democracy (eg they supported the thresholds at 50% or 60%). Only a minority of MPs voted for the 40% threshold.
I meant within caucus, in that specific vote, CV. Sorry if that wasn’t clear.
Ahhhh no probs mate.
And, in fact, a minority of the R&F delegates.
Can someone who really knows what the Labour Constitution changes were please explain one thing for me.
Did Shearer have to get 60% of the caucus to vote for him to keep his position without a party-wide vote or did 40% have to vote against him to force a vote?
In the first case an abstention would be just the same as a no vote wouldn’t it?
In the second case it wouldn’t but there would surely have to be another candidate who stood against him.
“Everyone in Labour knows Grant Robertson will become the next leader. The only question is when.”
In August is my guess, six months to see if there is a poll improvement and then the chop or resignation as leader by Shearer.
The link you supplied says it all, how united the Labour caucus are over Shearer being the leader.
āEveryone in Labour knows Grant Robertson will become the next leader. The only question is when.ā
I’ll add a why?
Is this the “almost certainly unanimous” vote we heard so much about?
Nah, it’s the “Shearer will have 100% support” one.
Yeah tht’s right, pretty sure I remember someone saying something about that?….
http://thestandard.org.nz/growing-the-left-vote/#comment-584523
š
Er, Shearer did get 100% support, if this lie is true. 100% support from those with the courage to vote. The interesting thing in this beat up is how low opposition to Shearer now is. Ok, it’s not true, but if its down to just ten, Shearer’s here for the long run.
Of course, a certain backbencher might refuse to say whether he’ll challenge in 2015…
well, now that I have a telly, Shearer continues to underwhelm; maybe I’m phylum and xylem after all š
Assuming you’ve replied to the wrong comment there, but anyhoo…
“for all the reasons I’ve given above” would seem to me to include the bit about how Ed is starting to grow on voters, and how the polls are showing it.
No?
edit: This was a response to a comment from TRP which appears to be missing.
[lprent: He probably deleted it. It can be done in the editing window. ]
I replied in the wrong place, felix, and deleted it. It’s now a bit further down the page.
And in answer to your question, a qualified yes. Both leaders are starting to gain some small traction in the preferred PM polls, but both have a long way to go. In terms of the UK poll support for Labour, it really has a lot to do with voter disgust with both the other parties, rather than anything Miliband is doing. But then, its probably easier to gain support in a 3 way, FPP contest where the other 2 parties form the current Government than it is in a 7 way MMP contest. In the UK situation, Labour is the default depository of the anti-coalition vote, though UKIP are also hurting the Tories by taking the important taxi driver, white van man and Little Englander vote.
NRT gets blogpost title of the week:
“Labour: As useless as a proverbial useless thing”
http://norightturn.blogspot.co.nz/2013/02/labour-as-useless-as-proverbial-useless.html
A pondering… one tane huna and meself just had another ding dong over when someone becomes a hater rather than a person with simply a different view.
When does someone become a hater? You know, like a hater of homosexuals. A hater of old white men. A hater of the yellow peril. A hater of pakeha. When? Because as far as I can see there remain so many issues where there is blanket hypocrisy e.g. supporting of separate institutions… is this bigotry of a form? Or is it not? Or another example, supporting of inclusive institutions … is it this that is a form of prejudice? Or does it depend on what side of the political specturm your view apparently stems from according to political fashion of the day?
When does racism exist? When does ageism exist? When does any form of bigotry exist? It is such a mish-mash of varying rules and determinants that it renders so many of these accusations and labels empty and useless. There is no consistency. Or is there? Where is it? Who has it?
Who woulda thunk it.
http://www.desmogblog.com/2013/02/11/study-confirms-tea-party-was-created-big-tobacco-and-billionaires
Anyone care to argue that Shearer handled this well?
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10864924
Never mind! He’s getting Better!!
Except he’s not.
How hard is it to respond to a bunch of bigited crap from a NZ First idiot without saying ‘Muslims would riot if he said it over there’. ffs.
Jeebers. The actual words he used are worse than your summary.
The worst part is that he was quoted alongside Peters, Key, Banks and Harawira and he still looks a tool in comparison. ffs indeed.
Peters saying there’s an element of truth? Sheesh.
Nice chuckle at Banks’ describing someone else as “crazy” and “bizarre”.
Harawira had the best response I reckon, and the journos in the lobby chat with Key on tv1 website basically led him to the desired lines.
Yeah I liked that too, and Banks’ weirdness.
Peters’ response ain’t far from what Shearer said really. All that stuff about how the muslims would turn violent if you said that in the middle east etc, that’s pretty much just another way of saying there’s an element of truth to it.
I disagree. Peters was saying that there was an element of truth that muslim males pose a significant risk to air transport (when apparently Boeing batteries are more dangerous). Basically the only non-Muslim terrorist he knew of was McVeigh.
Shearer was simply pointing out that sometimes cartoons can clock off riots in the MidEast.
But Shearer should know that cartoons that insult the prophet have sparked riots. This is not like that. All he did was reinforce that those crazy Muslims riot at the drop of a hat over there in wogistan.
Firstly, I should point out that the cartoon reference was mine, not Shearer’s. Shearer referred to the Middle East.
I’m sure that the cartoon-related riots were the only incidents of civil disorder from North Africa to the Indus in the past decade.
But this perfectly illustrates Shearer’s problem. He’s hopeless at politics.
I am quite certain that David Shearer the person – the guy who has worked in all those places, alongside so many people of different faiths, ethnicities etc – would be genuinely offended by Prosser’s comments. He’s thinking “What a racist sh*t”.
But Shearer the politician thinks he has to second-guess and run it by whoever the handlers are and generally dilute and diminish his own real response. He condemns, but … as always, with qualifiers. Every time he speaks, he qualifies.
According to NRT he couldn’t even say that he wouldn’t have Prosser in his team. But I bet he wouldn’t have Prosser in his team … he’s just been brainwashed into thinking he mustn’t say so. Or say anything that would interfere with the Sleepwalk Strategy.
FFS David, stop this. You lose both ways. The liberals and left only think less of you, the so-called centre (conservatives?) just think you’re a wimp.
Projection.
Just because you or I think in obscenities it doesn’t mean Shearer does.
And did KEY say Prosser couldn’t be in HIS government? If Shearer had said it he would be arrogant and delusional. He doesn’t so he gets flak. Key doesn’t, not a whisper. Shearer’s already losing both ways, right here.
*bangs head on desk*
Shearer can’t determine what Key says. Or what the media say about what Key says. But (and this really, really isn’t hard …) –
Shearer can determine what HE says. Jessica Mutch asked him a question. It wasn’t a fair question, it was a “Gotcha” if you like, but if Shearer can only cope with what’s fair, he should quit politics right now.
Do you seriously have any difficulty in deciding on the spot how to answer a question about standing Prosser down? Of course you don’t. Nor do I. Nor would anybody with an ounce of political smarts.
He is lost.
[lprent: I am getting concerned about your head banging. Is there anything we can do to help? š Personally at present I find that standing directly in front of te aircond….]
Who in the blogosphere has criticised key for not ruling prosser out of government, was my point. But it seems to be a drumbeat against the guy the drum-circle seem to think will never be IN government, anyway.
Mutch with a gotcha? What are you referring to? The only searches I’ve found that quote Shearer are print – got a link? Or am I to wait for 6pm?
He couldbe in govt McF, but he’s doing his darndest to avoid it so far.
Which still means issuing statements about who he’d govern with is arrogant to the point of delusion. Or it’s a serious omission by a probable future prime minister. Damned both ways.
He doesn’t have to issue statements. He simply has to respond to questions. Exactly what he’ll be required to do in the election campaign, without benefit of minders 24/7.
For the Twitter reaction, here’s a good starting point:
https://twitter.com/publicaddress
The relevance here is that this is part of a consistent pattern. Shearer is not faced with a tough challenge, condemning Prosser. But he can only deal with the prepared line (Stage 1), not follow-ups (Stage 2). That tells us a lot about both his political instincts, and his underlying principles. Both are found wanting, frequently.
There’s no “drum beat” from many of those (like Russell Brown) who were annoyed on Twitter. The idea that Shearer’s critics are only a Standard few is a delusion.
Yeah, on current polling it probably would be arrogant.
But that’s where he should be now: Being taken seriously as a contender for the top job, articulating an alternate vision for the country, describing the kind of govt he’ll lead.
@gobsmacked: I’m sure it’s just a one-off stumble, he won’t be like this all the time, he’s stared down warlords, his media training will kick in any day now, he’s only like this when there are cameras or people around etc etc.
fuck twitter – where’s the interview with the gotcha question you’re talking about?
@FV:
At the moment he’s not. And if Labour were polling 55%, people here would be calling him arrogant and jumped up.
Meh, can’t really argue with what you reckon people would say given this or that.
You could point out how my characterisation is completely inconsistent with the measured and rational tone with which issues are logically discussed whenever Shearer’s name is mentioned. Good luck with that.
Yes, it’s getting quite difficult to criticise anything Shearer (or Labour) says without inviting quite irrational and emotional responses from certain commenters here.
You’d have a point if “mad barking at contrived slights” counted as “criticism”.
Oh I think there’s been plenty of decent criticism. You’re bound to get a bit of mad barking when all the decent criticism goes so unheeded for so long though.
chicken and egg syndrome again, I guess
Trust the process and get on side guys, no more of this whining like bellyachers, victory will be ours in 2014!
Cannot see anything wrong with the Shearer comment myself, if such a story became a feature of news in many of the Arab Muslim countries there is a likelihood of demonstrations being provoked…
@vto
I thought you wound up that little ding dong rather well!
Seems like the ground is always shifting as to what’s ‘a different opinion ‘ and what’s ‘enter derogatory name here’. I get fed up with the race to label someone and box them into a place where they have no choice but to hold their ground. What do you (as in anybody) want – to “win the contest” ? Have a frank exchange of views? Learn something? Bring someone round to your point of view? If you want to alter someone’s perception, giving them no option but to defend themselves at all costs results in a ‘not achieved.’
It’s interesting how one’s own views get challenged in unexpected ways. A couple of years ago, I was in a large workplace where I was one of the 5% minority by ethnicity and gender. That place fractured in ways I never expected, much of it was destructive, cut-throat and detrimental to the people it was meant to serve. It was very ugly and a timely warning that greed, ambition and egotism reside everywhere. And that for me is the crux of the matter – the best ideals can be subverted by ugliness.
I like authenticity. Where the walk matches the talk.
I’m very fond of the word ‘and’. Like, I think there’s room in the Labour Party for Louisa Wall AND John Tamihere. Personally, neither is my cup of tea, but both voices need to be heard. Room in the Green Party for Russel Norman AND David Cunliffe – yeah, I know, in my dreams.
Indeed, thanks for the feedback. You are especially right about the race to pigeonhole someone and the effect, often cumulative, that that has on healthy debate and inclusiveness – it does the opposite, as it did. For no gain.
This entire issue around pigeonholing and labelling and hypocrisy is on the watch list …..
Well he was (DC I mean) frolicking/engaging with a few Green Party types on the Rainbow Warrior today so ….. funnier things have happened at sea
Been trying to find an online copy of Tom Scott’s cartoon of Steven Joyce sicking a turtle onto Novopay in Sat 9 Feb DomPost. Stuff have conveniently not shown it, nor is it on their Tom Scott page. It’s sad/funny and spot on. Can anyone supply a link please?
Rob Oram, one of my favorites when commenting on either business or economics got around to being really circumspect when discussing the Mainzeal collapse on His regular RadioNZ National nine to noon spot today,
Rob got as far as pointing out that RichinaPacific the Richard Yan investment vehicle which was the majority shareholder in the collapsed Mainzeal had been de-listed from the New Zealand share-market
along with Mainzeal and RichinaPacific was then registered in the Bahamas,(a known tax haven),
Here’s one for Rob, and would tend to suggest RichinaPacific in the guise of a company registered in an extremely low tax jurisdiction being the depository for the monies from Mainzeal construction being a vehicle for claiming losses in a higher taxed jurisdiction,
December 2012, Revenue Minister, (the Hairdo from Ohariu), Peter Dunne publicly announces that He will be closing the loophole in the New Zealand tax laws which allows multi-national companies to declare losses in New Zealand and ship the profits off-shore to be declared in a low tax inviroment,
December 2012,Jenny Shiply along with a number of others quit the board of Mainzeal Construction…
He’s rod oram not rob oram. And yes, he is very good.
If Johnny smart arse had worked in NZ for any great length of time before his need for greed completely took over and became Shylock he might have a small idea as to what NZ is loosing thru his tight wad policies
Crown Law spent $441,000 fighting Susan Couch suing corrections; as if the woman has not been through enough already nearly dying. RNZ put in an OIA request.
Yes and the awful affair has been going on since 2005!
It appears to have been settled only because the Corrections department got a new boss.
For a change I am on the side of Garth McVicar on this one.
Ok. Starting to get close. Two bugs, one (minor) enhancement, and a occasional repaint issue to go on the project. At 32 months, one product already released, a heart attack, and more than 4500 revisions in svn – I might be able to slow down from coding for a while and actually write some posts….
I’m sure that politicians will be looking forward to that. š
svn = makes life worth living
But congrats … I never picked up on what the project was but I imagine it’s been all consuming. In my own technical space I’ve been pretty committed and full on myself this last year or so… finally got to a decent break myself this week.
But how the hell did you do all that and run this place too Lynn?
Carefully
Mostly over the last two years by steadily dropping everything that sucked up too much time. The Labour work I dropped. Effectively stopped writing posts and cut back on comments here, but maintained tech and moderation. Driving to work rather than buses/walking (saves about an hour a day but drops the exercise way back). And above all, using an iPad in bed for blogging and reading (kicked reading speed up by about 50%)