TSmithfield asked how was peace possible when Russia does things like this ?
I responded by saying we have apparently come to an easy accomodation with allies who do things far more egregious than this:examples given, and somehow a peace was found.
Result? very predictable cries about "whataboutism" Frankly guys, that is worn out and lacking any kind of credible argument
Once again you will shriek Russian propaganda!! when I post this next link
Even if it is true that the Ukrainians shot down a Russian missile (how dreadful of them), how does that change anything?
After all, the Russians were targeting the Ukrainian power grid in this attack, amongst other things. That sort of action in the freezing conditions now prevailing in Ukraine could even have a worse effect in terms of human suffering.
The Russians are very aware of the suffering they are likely to cause one way or another with this sort of behaviour targeting civilian infrastructure. So, in no way does anything you say justify the Russian action.
The fact that you cite RT just confirms our suspicions about you.
Yes Jenny , its hugely profitable, I've made 3000 roubles a month at least, and have a time share in fabulous dachas in Crimea.There's never any difficulty getting the money sent over either, it comes packed in those Russian dolls
Oh the stories I could tell you !Dancing with Putin at my wedding, the fun!,the singing! the barbecues at the Kremlin, the chess games with Lavrov !
And no one has ever found me out (but there are those who've had their dark suspicions!)
Whether or not you work for a Russian troll farm, or not is irrelevant really. The way you slurp up to the Russian war machine, the effect is the same.
Well let's face it. Your continued appeasement for Russian atrocities does sound very much like the mantra of a useful idiot (and I use those words carefully as I was well aquainted with one in the 1960's who pestered my father relentlessly with Soviet propaganda). I know how they operated and what their belief systems were. They were totally down the rabbit hole of Soviet lies and misinformation regularly sent to them from the Russian consulate as it was then.
My father was the President of a Union for over 20 years so they were particularly keen to get him on their side and ferment trouble. They didn't like the fact that he ignored them, and instead the Union was able to gain very good pay rates and working conditions for the members of his union without the need for constant strikes and stop works. On one occasion a National Party MP was heard to say in the House how appalled he was that these workers were earning almost as much as he!
If only those pesky Ukrainians would see just how benign and helpful these continued bombardments form Russia are, and stop trying to shoot them down. Everything would be much so much better.
It says a lot about you that you can brush off the horror of this situation with some sort of wierd whataboutism justification of it.
But, putting that aside, why would the people of Ukraine be the slightest bit interested in doing any sort of peace deal with Russia when Russia behaves like this? Especially since the horror of this situation will likely just motivate the west to supply more and heavier weapons to Ukraine, thus increasing the likelihood of a Ukrainian victory.
If you really want to see a peaceful resolution to this conflict then you should be condemning this sort of behaviour not excusing it.
Likewise, the siege of Constantinople in 1451 was a particularly brutal affair.
And what about those nasty Romans sowing salt on the ruins of Carthage in 145BCE – there are plenty of examples which can be used to excuse present day barbarity.
Peace is possible .,it has to be .Vietnam has apparently forgiven the genocidal assaults of the Vietnam war, or as they call it , the Resistance war against America
In the face of our own barbarity, it seems we forgive and forget very easily
Where is the consistency?
Why aren’t we arming the Palestinians and applying sanctions to Israel, not that I would recommend that
War is disgusting, and should be avoided at all costs, peace agreements implemented, but there are precious few anti war activists left anywhere in the west , not when so many livelihoods are dependent on war and other people get to do the bloodshedding
What I don't condemn is people wanting to defend their country, homes, and families against unwarranted agression from larger nations. So, in this case, I condemn war by condemning Russia.
But, I guess you will just say the Russians are acting in "self defence" or that the US did it therefore Russia can do it, or something equally inane.
Further to that, "condemning war" in the way that you would have it in this conflict would mean allowing the Russian army to roll in with its tanks uncontested and Ukraine capitulating in order to avoid war.
I've already said it .The war could have been prevented .The Minsk peace agreements signed between the LPR, DPR, and Ukraine was a path to peace, but as Poroshenko boasted, there was never any intention of implementing it , and the plan was to take Donbas by force
Then you have no understanding of why there is such tension between the eastern provinces (formerly Russian territory which Ukraine expanded into under Lenin in the 20's)mainly orthodox and culturally Russian , and the western parts, where you are more likely to encounter monuments to Nazi collaborators like Bandera , and more likely to belong to the Ukrainian Greek Catholic church
and the western parts, where you are more likely to encounter monuments to Nazi collaborators like Bandera , and more likely to belong to the Ukrainian Greek Catholic church
Your modus operandi is to go around and round in circles repeating the same nonsense that has already been debunked many times.
It has already been pointed out on numerous occasions that the far right only got around 2% of the vote in the last Ukrainian election. So, it obviously isn't much more of a problem than most countries.
If you are really that vexed about Nazis, then you should be really worried about Nazis in Russia. Especially as it appears Putin has been trying to manipulate them for his own ends, as the article points out.
From the link:
“What has received less coverage is the Putin regime’s own record of collaboration with far-right extremists.”
So, it looks more like a continuation of Russian agression following the annexation of Crimea than anything else.
Does the name Igor Girkin mean anything to you. Pity about that Malaysian passenger plane that was shot down. But I guess you would blame the Ukrainians for that as well.
Yes, Igor Girkin aka Strelkov, a nationalist and a nutter, banned from eastern Ukraine by Putin,and ever since a strident critic of Putin , because he thinks Putin is a softie and appeaser of the west.
He has only become critical of Putin over recent times. And was actually quite popular prior to the downing of the Malaysian plane which was terminal for his career.
From the previous link:
While leading a group of separatist militants into Ukraine in the 2014 Siege of Sloviansk, Girkin gained influence and attention, being appointed to the position of Minister of Defense in the Donetsk People's Republic, a puppet state of Russia.[4][5][6]
groan the Dresden and Tokyo attacks were 80 years ago now, Korea three quarters of a century ago and Rolling Thunder for all it's tonnage of bombs dropped was not an area bombing offensive. This sort of tedious whatabboutism is mired in a miserable ignorance of the last eighty years.
The thing is, targets like Dresden and Tokyo (and Hamburg) were attacked using incendiaries for the simple reason the attackers couldn't hit the particular but they could hit the general. In other words, the Allied night bombers could find, hit and set fire to a city easily but they couldn't hit a specific target within the city at all. The US bombing of Vietnam COULD hit specific targets, which is why the Vietnamese didn't bother to claim the Americans were engaging in indiscriminate terror attacks on civilians.
Western military thought no longer embraces area bombing because it doesn't work. It is wasteful of resources and it doesn't achieve it's supposed primary goal – the destruction of the enemies means and will to fight. A primary military consideration is are the means conmensurate with the ways and the ends? The UK devoted between 35-40% of it's total wartime output in WW2 to the construction of lavishly equipped heavy bombers, yet this force was frightfully vulnerable German nightfighters right to the end of the war and the heavy losses in bomber crews were inflicted on the best and brightest young men of the era. So, area bombing cost the UK more than it did Germany. Now that isn't to say such bombing doesn't achieve secondary objectives. The use of area bombing forces the enemy to disperse their industry, which is disruptive. It forces the diversion of resources into air defenses (in WW2 the Germans deployed thousands of large AA guns, fighters etc etc and air defense consumed almost all the output of Germany's electronics industry). Finally, the way the ends were achieved have ultimately become an issue. While area bombing has some justification, it is morally questionable, to say the least. Bombing civilians because otherwise you'd have all this expensive stuff sitting around doing not much is as bad morally and it is bad militarily.
Ultimately, the big lesson of WW2 was what WORKED was using strategic bombing to achieve a specific strategic aim. Thus, the "transport plan", or the attacks on the German canal system, or were the Americans would send 1000 USAAF heavy bombers (escorted by 1000 Mustang and Thunderbolt fighters) to carry out precision daylight bombing of vital targets as "bait" to force the Germans to send up their fighters, were they were engaged in a huge battle of attrition that the United States was always going to win handily via the application of Lanchester's equation. That is why now the west relies on precision guided weapons. Why would you bomb an entire city with 1000 bombers when all you want to do is destroy a tank factory?
The thread of logic that links Russia's missile attacks on the Ukraine with area bombing is the Russians are now no longer particularly interested in hitting the target they are aiming their wildly inaccurate Kh-22 and S300 missiles at. Just like destroying anything of military significance was a bonus of area bombing rather than the aim, so Russia regards actually hitting something they aim at and causing a militarily significant outcome as a bonus. The aim is an airborne expression of splenetic state terrorism at the temerity of the Ukrainians to resist and a brutal and cruel desire to inflict suffering on the Ukrainian civilian population.
The thing is, Western powers learnt from area bombing. It didn't work, it was wasteful, it was morally wrong in retrospect. They don't do it anymore. Russia, it seems, is not interested in these insights. They've learnt nothing and forgotten nothing from the human catastrophes of the mid 20th century.
The Western powers learnt not to area bomb? Or do you mean aerial?
You seem a bit lacking in some key understandings when it comes to being informed on what you are pontificating on about.
Any degree of comprehensive general knowledge should be familiar with the term area bombing. Here is the entry in Wikipedia. Avail yourself of some new knowledge.
"If you think the US has any morality whatsoever in its foreign policy …"morally wrong in retrospect"… come on , there's not really a discussion here…" Francesca
I don't think US foreign policy has any morality whatsoever. From the Halls of Montezuma to the shores of Tripoli, and everything in between, the nature and the crimes of American imperialism are well documented.
Every imperialism is racist and genocidal, it is the very nature of imperialism.
Biden calls the Russian Federation imperialist. Putin calls the U.S imperialist. What they both have in common is that they both don't want it known that they are both imperialists.
All imperialists are racist, how else can they claim they have the right to invade and take over and run other people's countries unless they believe those people are inferior.
All imperialists are genocidal, how else can can an imperialist nation put down an insurgent people, who refuse to submit. As one US general once said in Vietnam 'We had to destroy the village to save it"
Genocide is destroying the village to save it writ large
If the Russian imperialists did take their cue from the American imperialists, the student has become the master.
What the horrors of Syria and Chechnya can tell us about Russia’s tactics in Ukraine
Russia is bringing the deadly tactics used in Chechnya and Syria to Ukraine’s cities.
Abdulkafi Alhamdo remembers the day he asked his wife to take their infant daughter out of Aleppo. “I told her to take my daughter through the [humanitarian] corridor just to stay alive,” Alhamdo said. “I thought this was the last time I would see them, the last time I would kiss my daughter. I remember my daughter was holding my knees and crying. Perhaps she knew something.”…..
…..the tactics on display in Ukraine are “a clear attempt by the Russian military to do exactly what they did in Syria, and certainly what they did in Grozny: a mass shelling campaign to instill fear, terror, destruction, chaos and to create conditions in which the civilian population flees en masse, then creating conditions in which eventually, even the largest urban territories will end up falling under their control.”………
The Grozny model
After 20 days of heavy artillery shelling of the city center — sometimes at a rate of 4,000 rounds an hour — the Russian military eventually took Grozny on Jan. 20, 2005.
The heavy bombardment of Grozny “worked” in one sense. The Russians took the city. But Mogulof and other observers believe it may have made the Chechens more resolved to fight back. “It’s mechanized terrorism,” ….
……The air assault killed tens of thousands of civilians and left Grozny in ruins. The United Nations called it “the most destroyed city on earth.” …..
Aleppo —“a kind of hell”
….In 2015, Russian forces began an intervention in Syria on Assad’s behalf, using air power to tip the balance in his favor. In Aleppo, the rebel-held territories were completely encircled in mid-2016, leaving 250,000 people under siege and subject to heavy Russian airstrikes. The Russian and Syrian militaries were both accused of war crimes, including deliberately targeting medical facilities, using indiscriminate weapons such as cluster munitions and attempting to starve the city’s population……
"The thing is, Western powers learnt from area bombing. It didn't work, it was wasteful, it was morally wrong in retrospect"
Indeed, have three of four volumes of "The Strategic Air Offensive against Germany 1939-1945" by Sir Charles Webster and Noble Frankland published 1961 which was biffed out of Whenuapai Station Library – RNZAF Command and Staff College Library Book with CANCELLED stamped inside which examines and discusses this very subject.
Vol I issued once in 1995 Vol II issued thrice in 1962; 1972 & 1992 No Vol III and Vol IV issued once in 1976.
One wonders why it is not still a standard text for study!
BTW written in pencil on flyleaf is: Total Price Set of 4 Vols 9 pounds and four shillings. Do hope they got their moneys worth out of them …..
Would love to find Vol III and only paid $12 for the three.
You really love giving me a dose of Dysentery don't you?
Why don't you read up on Russia's guarantees that it signed under the Lisbon Protocol & Budapest Memorandum when Ukraine gave up its Strategic Wpns at the end of the Cold War for Starters.
Then go back to the 1917 through 1925 when the USSR signed a similar Peace Treaty in 1920 or 22 from memory where Russia kept Eastern Ukraine along the Dnipro River. Which it violated in 1925 leading to Holodomor under Stalin.
Then read up what Stalin did to Ukraine after Russia booted the Germans out & it could've a lot more worse if Khrushchev quietly squash some of Stalin Orders.
The Ukrainian's do not & will not trust Russia for the next 1k yrs no matter what what Peace Treaty they sign because Russia can not be Bloody Trust to keep their Bloody Word & will not Negotiate in Good Faith!
Why do you think Finland & Sweden decided to give up their Long Standing Neutrality FFS!!!
Respect to you too Francesca really enjoyed your comments today answering one an all with quiet aplomb inspite of the hubbub very well done and exactly the kind of diplomacy lacking in the general debate imo .
Gotta say it reminds me of a memorable scene from ' One flew over the cuckoos nest ' though …hope you can guess which one !!
There will be no peace, the Russians think they are winning (or at the very least have to win). Well the leadership think they are.
You get the Russian goal is on the West of Ukraine so they will keep going till they have all their strategic points occupied.
Peace might be discussed when the Russians have lost 500,000 troops. Might, they seem hell bent on self genocide at the moment – through throwing away the last generation who could save them as a people. Those who survive this mess are going to be totally FUBAR.
I want this war over, but the idiots are in charge so I see it lasting till the last Russian is left going "can I go home now"
Mr. Sensible kindly gives us a master class in demolishing your own argument in the first two paragraphs of a rather ill thought out opinion piece…
"…The suggestion that the national capital should be shifted from Wellington to Hamilton, on the spurious grounds that the majority of our population lives north of Te Awamutu, is as ludicrous as it would be disastrous.
One of Wellington’s great advantages remains its centrality – as true today as it was in 1865. Indeed, Wellington’s only real competitor in that regard is Nelson…"
Centrality? Over three-quarters of New Zealand's population live in the North Island, with half living north of Lake Rotorua, and one-third of the total population living in the Auckland Region. On the basis of "centrality" surely the Tron is a fantastic idea? I guess he means GEOGRAPHIC centrality – in which case the US should move it's capital to Belle Fourche, South Dakota or the UK should move it's capital to Lancashire – or how about moving the Australian capital to somewhere in the middle of the Simpson desert?
Peter Dunne is a pompous old fool who spouts nonsense.
Irrespective of the pompous prats argument. I hope it carries some sway.
The last thing we need north of Rotorua is that lot. We've got enough idiots of our own up here. It's becoming increasingly harder to fly under the radar these days.
I've always thought that Wellington was a ridiculous place for parliament, it's when not if that place gets leveled by a whopper earthquke(very scientific terminology)
Christchurch would be my pick , Auckland throws its weight around enough with out letting the seat of power any near them
“The busy summer holiday period has highlighted just what an appalling state much of our roading network is in,” Transporting New Zealand chief executive Nick Leggett said.
“It’s not just about road maintenance. We also need the Government to recommit to new roading capacity to ease the strain on our existing network.”
In October 2018 Leggett was appointed the CEO of the Road Transport Forum,[24] a lobby group which promotes and the interests of the trucking road freight industry.[25]
Hi BG. Its an absolute no-brainer. Sadly the NO brainers : think Nat Simeon Brown etc… are getting the media attention. And of course the totally vested interest lobbyists as in Nick Leggett in my link.
IMO KiwiRail…are not really NZ Rail proponents..or even Rail friendly. I really feel Labour should get with re nationalising NZ Rail .And maybe some changes within at the same time (to get a real focus on Rail)
It's never been about protecting Russian speaking people, NATO, or about "'nazis".
It's always been about the eradication of the Ukrainian presence and identity to facilitate a genocidal land grab.
.
Over the next four days, the Kherson Regional Art Museum was cleaned out, witnesses said, with Russian forces “bustling about like insects,” porters wheeling out thousands of paintings, soldiers hastily wrapping them in sheets, art experts barking out orders and packing material flying everywhere.
“They were loading such masterpieces, which there are no more in the world, as if they were garbage,” said the museum’s longtime director, Alina Dotsenko, who recently returned from exile, recounting what employees and witnesses had told her.
When she came back to the museum in early November and grasped how much had been stolen, she said, “I almost lost my mind.”
Kherson. Mariupol. Melitopol. Kakhovsky. Museums of art, history and antiquities.
As Russia has ravaged Ukraine with deadly missile strikes and brutal atrocities on civilians, it has also looted the nation’s cultural institutions of some of the most important and intensely protected contributions of Ukraine and its forebears going back thousands of years.
International art experts say the plundering may be the single biggest collective art heist since the Nazis pillaged Europe in World War II.
Looting is as old as war. So the pearl clutching is a bit rich for someone who supports the war.
The reality is war produces animals out of all who fight them.
But as your a huge supporter of keeping this war going joe90, you have to face up to the reality of the ugly as well: Rape, Looting, Killing of prisoners, and Mass murder of civilians is going to keep happening as long as this war keeps going. Both sides are going to do it.
No one has a monopoly on doing evil shit in war.
We just have to wait until at least 1/2 a million Russian soldiers are dead, before we can get around to peace talks.
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Some of the recent announcements from the government have reminded us of posts we’ve written in the past. Here’s one from early 2020. There were plenty of reactions to the government’s infrastructure announcement a few weeks ago which saw them fund a bunch of big roading projects. One of ...
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The Finance and Expenditure Committee has reported back on National's Local Government (Water Services Preliminary Arrangements) Bill. The bill sets up water for privatisation, and was introduced under urgency, then rammed through select committee with no time even for local councils to make a proper submission. Naturally, national's select committee ...
Some years ago, I bought a book at Dunedin’s Regent Booksale for $1.50. As one does. Vandrad the Viking (1898), by J. Storer Clouston, is an obscure book these days – I cannot find a proper online review – but soon it was sitting on my shelf, gathering dust alongside ...
History is not on the side of the centre-left, when Democratic presidents fall behind in the polls and choose not to run for re-election. On both previous occasions in the past 75 years (Harry Truman in 1952, Lyndon Johnson in 1968) the Democrats proceeded to then lose the White House ...
This is a free articleCoverageThis morning, US President Joe Biden announced his withdrawal from the Presidential race. And that is genuinely newsworthy. Thanks for your service, President Biden, and all the best to you and yours.However, the media in New Zealand, particularly the 1News nightly bulletin, has been breathlessly covering ...
A homeless person’s camp beside a blocked-off slipped damage walkway in Freeman’s Bay: we are chasing our tail on our worsening and inter-related housing, poverty and climate crises. Photo: Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: The top six things I’ve noted around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy ...
What has happened to it all?Crazy, some'd sayWhere is the life that I recognise?(Gone away)But I won't cry for yesterdayThere's an ordinary worldSomehow I have to findAnd as I try to make my wayTo the ordinary worldYesterday morning began as many others - what to write about today? I began ...
TL;DR: My pick of the top six links elsewhere around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day or so to 7:00 am on Monday, July 22 are:Today’s Must Read: Father and son live in a tent, and have done for four years, in a million ...
TL;DR: As of 7:00 am on Monday, July 22, the top six announcements, speeches, reports and research around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day are:US President Joe Biden announced via X this morning he would not stand for a second term.Multinational professional services firm ...
A listing of 32 news and opinion articles we found interesting and shared on social media during the past week: Sun, July 14, 2024 thru Sat, July 20, 2024. Story of the week As reflected by preponderance of coverage, our Story of the Week is Project 2025. Until now traveling ...
This weekend, a friend pointed out someone who said they’d like to read my posts, but didn’t want to pay. And my first reaction was sympathy.I’ve already told folks that if they can’t comfortably subscribe, and would like to read, I’d be happy to offer free subscriptions. I don’t want ...
National: The Party of ‘Law and Order’ IntroductionThis weekend, the Government formally kicked off one of their flagship policy programs: a military style boot camp that New Zealand has experimented with over the past 50 years. Cartoon credit: Guy BodyIt’s very popular with the National Party’s Law and Orderimage, ...
Day one of the solo leg of my long journey home begins with my favourite sound: footfalls in an empty street. 5.00 am and it’s already light and already too warm, almost.If I can make the train that leaves Budapest later this hour I could be in Belgrade by nightfall; ...
Do you remember Y2K, the threat that hung over humanity in the closing days of the twentieth century? Horror scenarios of planes falling from the sky, electronic payments failing and ATMs refusing to dispense cash. As for your VCR following instructions and recording your favourite show - forget about it.All ...
Climate Change Minister Simon Watts being questioned by The Kākā’s Bernard Hickey.TL;DR: My top six things to note around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the week to July 20 were:1. A strategy that fails Zero Carbon Act & Paris targetsThe National-ACT-NZ First Coalition Government finally unveiled ...
Summary:As New Zealand loses at least 12 leaders in the public service space of health, climate, and pharmaceuticals, this month alone, directly in response to the Government’s policies and budget choices, what lies ahead may be darker than it appears. Tui examines some of those departures and draws a long ...
The Minister of Housing’s ambition is to reduce markedly the ratio of house prices to household incomes. If his strategy works it would transform the housing market, dramatically changing the prospects of housing as an investment.Leaving aside the Minister’s metaphor of ‘flooding the market’ I do not see how the ...
As previously noted, my historical fantasy piece, set in the fifth-century Mediterranean, was accepted for a Pirate Horror anthology, only for the anthology to later fall through. But in a good bit of news, it turned out that the story could indeed be re-marketed as sword and sorcery. As of ...
An employee of tobacco company Philip Morris International demonstrates a heated tobacco device. Photo: Getty ImagesTL;DR: The top six things I’ve noted around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy on Friday, July 19 are:At a time when the Coalition Government is cutting spending on health, infrastructure, education, housing ...
TL;DR: My pick of the top six links elsewhere around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day or so to 8:30 am on Friday, July 19 are:Scoop: NZ First Minister Casey Costello orders 50% cut to excise tax on heated tobacco products. The minister has ...
Kia ora, it’s time for another Friday roundup, in which we pull together some of the links and stories that caught our eye this week. Feel free to add more in the comments! Our header image this week shows a foggy day in Auckland town, captured by Patrick Reynolds. ...
TL;DR : Here’s the top six items climate news for Aotearoa this week, as selected by Bernard Hickey and The Kākā’s climate correspondent Cathrine Dyer. A discussion recorded yesterday is in the video above and the audio of that sent onto the podcast feed.The Government released its draft Emissions Reduction ...
Save some money, get rich and old, bring it back to Tobacco Road.Bring that dynamite and a crane, blow it up, start all over again.Roll up. Roll up. Or tailor made, if you prefer...Whether you’re selling ciggies, digging for gold, catching dolphins in your nets, or encouraging folks to flutter ...
Waiting In The Wings:For truly, if Trump is America’s un-assassinated Caesar, then J.D. Vance is America’s Octavian, the Republic’s youthful undertaker – and its first Emperor.DONALD TRUMP’S SELECTION of James D. Vance as his running-mate bodes ill for the American republic. A fervent supporter of Viktor Orban, the “illiberal” prime ...
TL;DR: As of 6:00 am on Friday, July 19, the top six announcements, speeches, reports and research around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day are:The PSAannounced the Employment Relations Authority (ERA) had ruled in the PSA’s favour in its case against the Ministry ...
TL;DR: The podcast above of the weekly ‘hoon’ webinar for paying subscribers last night features co-hosts and talking with:The Kākā’s climate correspondent talking about the National-ACT-NZ First Government’s release of its first Emissions Reduction Plan;University of Otago Foreign Relations Professor and special guest Dr Karin von ...
Open access notablesImproving global temperature datasets to better account for non-uniform warming, Calvert, Quarterly Journal of the Royal Meteorological Society:To better account for spatial non-uniform trends in warming, a new GITD [global instrumental temperature dataset] was created that used maximum likelihood estimation (MLE) to combine the land surface ...
A late change to charter school legislation will cheat educators out of fair pay and negotiating power proving charter schools are just a vehicle to make profit out of our education system. ...
In 2004 te iwi Māori rallied against the Crown’s attempt to confiscate our coastlines and moana with the Foreshore and Seabed Act. This led to the largest hīkoi of a generation and the birth of Te Pāti Māori. 20 years later, history is repeating itself. Today the government has announced ...
It has been five and a half years since the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in Care was established to investigate the abuse of children, young people, and vulnerable adults within state and faith-based institutions. Yesterday, the final report - Whanaketia through pain and trauma, from darkness to light ...
The Green Party is calling on the Government to take action off the back of the International Court of Justice ruling on Israel’s illegal occupation of Palestine. ...
On Friday the International Court of Justice reaffirmed what Palestinian’s have been telling us for decades: that the occupation and colonisation of Palestinian lands by Israel is illegal and must end immediately. They also called for reparations for Palestinian’s who have lived under Israeli occupation since it began in 1967. ...
Labour calls on the Government to act after the International Court of Justice (ICJ) ruled that Israel’s occupation of Palestinian Territories is illegal. ...
The 53.7 percent rise in benefit sanctions over the last year is more proof of this Government’s disdain for our communities most in need of support. ...
Aotearoa could be a country where every child grows up feeling safe, loved and with a sense of belonging in their whānau and community. But for some of our children, this is far from reality. Instead, they are trapped in a maze of intergenerational harm that they can’t escape on ...
Te Pāti Māori are calling for David Seymour to resign as Associate Health Minister in response to his call for Pharmac to ignore the Treaty of Waitangi. “This announcement is just another example of the government’s anti-Tiriti, anti-Māori agenda.” Said Co-leader and spokesperson for health, Debbie Ngarewa-Packer. “Seymour thinks it ...
The soaring price of renting is driving the rise of inflation in this country - with latest figures from Stats NZ showing rents are up 4.8 per cent on average while annual inflation is at 3.3 per cent. ...
National’s Emissions Reduction Plan will take New Zealand further from the economy we need to ensure the next generation has a stable climate and secure livelihoods. ...
Following consultation with named parties and thorough consideration of privacy interests, the Green Party is in a position to release the Executive Summary of the final report from the independent investigation into Darleen Tana. ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon should be asking serious questions of his Minister for Resources Shane Jones now it’s been revealed he misled the public about a dinner with mining companies that he didn’t declare and said wasn’t pre-arranged. ...
Te Pāti Māori have submitted to the Justice Select Committee against the Sentencing (Reinstating Three Strikes) Amendment Bill. The bill will further entrench racism in our justice system and fails to focus on rehabilitation. “Reinstating Three Strikes will empower a systematically racist system and exacerbate the overrepresentation of Māori in ...
The Transport and Infrastructure Committee is set to make a determination on the Residential Tenancies Amendment (RTA) Bill in the coming weeks. “This legislation will give landlords the power to kick our whānau out onto the street for no reason” said Housing spokesperson, Mariameno Kapa-Kingi. “Their solution to the housing ...
“National’s campaign was about tackling crime and the best they can do is a two-year long Ministerial Advisory Group,” Labour justice spokesperson Duncan Webb said. ...
“There are more examples of charter schools failing their students than there are success stories. The coalition Government is driving to dismantle our public school system and instead promote a privatised, competitive structure that puts profits before kids,” Jan Tinetti said. ...
“This government is choosing to deliberately mislead and withhold information, keeping our people in the dark about this government’s agenda and the future of our mokopuna,” said co-leader and spokesperson for Health, Debbie Ngarewa-Packer. The call comes after the demand from the Chief Ombudsman that Associate Minister of Health, Casey ...
“Today’s climate announcement by Simon Watts makes clear the National Government is simply paying lip service to meeting its climate change targets,” Megan Woods said. ...
National is choosing to make life harder for workers by taking away the rights our communities have fought hard for. Here's how they’re taking workers backwards. ...
Australia, Canada and New Zealand today issued the following statement on the need for an urgent ceasefire in Gaza and the risk of expanded conflict between Hizballah and Israel. The situation in Gaza is catastrophic. The human suffering is unacceptable. It cannot continue. We remain unequivocal in our condemnation of ...
Attorney-General Judith Collins today reminded all State and faith-based institutions of their legal obligation to preserve records relevant to the safety and wellbeing of those in its care. “The Abuse in Care Inquiry’s report has found cases where records of the most vulnerable people in State and faith‑based institutions were ...
Minister of Internal Affairs Brooke van Velden says the Government’s online safety website for children and young people has reached one million page views. “It is great to see so many young people and their families accessing the site Keep It Real Online to learn how to stay safe online, and manage ...
Tēnā tātou katoa, Ngā mihi te rangi, ngā mihi te whenua, ngā mihi ki a koutou, kia ora mai koutou. Thank you for the opportunity to be here and the invitation to speak at this 50th anniversary conference. I acknowledge all those who have gone before us and paved the ...
New Zealand’s payroll providers have successfully prepared to ensure 3.5 million individuals will, from Wednesday next week, be able to keep more of what they earn each pay, says Finance Minister Nicola Willis and Revenue Minister Simon Watts. “The Government's tax policy changes are legally effective from Wednesday. Delivering this tax ...
An experimental vineyard which will help futureproof the wine sector has been opened in Blenheim by Associate Regional Development Minister Mark Patterson. The covered vineyard, based at the New Zealand Wine Centre – Te Pokapū Wāina o Aotearoa, enables controlled environmental conditions. “The research that will be produced at the Experimental ...
The Coalition Government has confirmed the indicative regional breakdown of North Island Weather Event (NIWE) funding for state highway recovery projects funded through Budget 2024, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “Regions in the North Island suffered extensive and devastating damage from Cyclone Gabrielle and the 2023 Auckland Anniversary Floods, and ...
Indonesia’s Foreign Minister, Retno Marsudi, will visit New Zealand next week, Foreign Minister Winston Peters has announced. “Indonesia is important to New Zealand’s security and economic interests and is our closest South East Asian neighbour,” says Mr Peters, who is currently in Laos to engage with South East Asian partners. ...
He aha te kai a te rangatira? He kōrero, he kōrero, he kōrero. The government has reaffirmed its commitment to supporting the aspirations of Ngāti Maniapoto, Minister for Māori Development Tama Potaka says. “My thanks to Te Nehenehenui Trust – Ngāti Maniapoto for bringing their important kōrero to a ministerial ...
Transport Minister Simeon Brown has thanked outgoing Chair of the Civil Aviation Authority, Janice Fredric, for her service to the board.“I have received Ms Fredric’s resignation from the role of Chair of the Civil Aviation Authority,” Mr Brown says.“On behalf of the Government, I want to thank Ms Fredric for ...
The Government is proposing legislation to overturn a Court of Appeal decision and amend the Marine and Coastal Area Act in order to restore Parliament’s test for Customary Marine Title, Treaty Negotiations Minister Paul Goldsmith says. “Section 58 required an applicant group to prove they have exclusively used and occupied ...
Regulation Minister David Seymour says that opposition parties have united in bad faith, opposing what they claim are ‘dangerous changes’ to the Early Childhood Education sector, despite no changes even being proposed yet. “Issues with affordability and availability of early childhood education, and the complexity of its regulation, has led ...
After receiving more than 740 submissions in the first 20 days, Regulation Minister David Seymour is asking the Ministry for Regulation to extend engagement on the early childhood education regulation review by an extra two weeks. “The level of interest has been very high, and from the conversations I’ve been ...
The Coalition Government is investing $802.9 million into the Wairarapa and Manawatū rail lines as part of a funding agreement with the NZ Transport Agency (NZTA), KiwiRail, and the Greater Wellington and Horizons Regional Councils to deliver more reliable services for commuters in the lower North Island, Transport Minister Simeon ...
Local Government Minister Simeon Brown has announced his intention to appoint a Crown Manager to both Hawke’s Bay Regional and Wairoa District Councils to speed up the delivery of flood protection work in Wairoa."Recent severe weather events in Wairoa this year, combined with damage from Cyclone Gabrielle in 2023 have ...
Mr Speaker, this is a day that many New Zealanders who were abused in State care never thought would come. It’s the day that this Parliament accepts, with deep sorrow and regret, the Report of the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in Care. At the heart of this report are the ...
For the first time, the Government is formally acknowledging some children and young people at Lake Alice Psychiatric Hospital experienced torture. The final report of the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in State and Faith-based Care “Whanaketia – through pain and trauma, from darkness to light,” was tabled in Parliament ...
The Government has acknowledged the nearly 2,400 courageous survivors who shared their experiences during the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Historical Abuse in State and Faith-Based Care. The final report from the largest and most complex public inquiry ever held in New Zealand, the Royal Commission Inquiry “Whanaketia – through ...
With a week to go before hard-working New Zealanders see personal income tax relief for the first time in fourteen years, 513,000 people have used the Budget tax calculator to see how much they will benefit, says Finance Minister Nicola Willis. “Tax relief is long overdue. From next Wednesday, personal income ...
Workplace Relations and Safety Minister Brooke van Velden says a bill that has passed its first reading will improve parental leave settings and give non-biological parents more flexibility as primary carer for their child. The Regulatory Systems Amendment Bill (No3), passed its first reading this morning. “It includes a change ...
Two Bills designed to improve regulation and make it easier to do business have passed their first reading in Parliament, says Economic Development Minister Melissa Lee. The Regulatory Systems (Economic Development) Amendment Bill and Regulatory Systems (Immigration and Workforce) Amendment Bill make key changes to legislation administered by the Ministry ...
New legislation paves the way for greater competition in sectors such as banking and electricity, Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Andrew Bayly says. “Competitive markets boost productivity, create employment opportunities and lift living standards. To support competition, we need good quality regulation but, unfortunately, a recent OECD report ranked New ...
Minister of Internal Affairs Brooke van Velden says lotteries for charitable purposes, such as those run by the Heart Foundation, Coastguard NZ, and local hospices, will soon be allowed to operate online permanently. “Under current laws, these fundraising lotteries are only allowed to operate online until October 2024, after which ...
The Coalition Government is accelerating work on the new four-lane expressway between Auckland and Whangārei as part of its Roads of National Significance programme, with an accelerated delivery model to deliver this project faster and more efficiently, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “For too long, the lack of resilient transport connections ...
Sir Don McKinnon will travel to Viet Nam this week as a Special Envoy of the Government, Foreign Minister Winston Peters has announced. “It is important that the Government give due recognition to the significant contributions that General Secretary Nguyen Phu Trong made to New Zealand-Viet Nam relations,” Mr ...
Minister of Internal Affairs Brooke van Velden says newly appointed Commissioner, Grant Illingworth KC, will help deliver the report for the first phase of the Royal Commission of Inquiry into COVID-19 Lessons, due on 28 November 2024. “I am pleased to announce that Mr Illingworth will commence his appointment as ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters travels to Laos this week to participate in a series of Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN)-led Ministerial meetings in Vientiane. “ASEAN plays an important role in supporting a peaceful, stable and prosperous Indo-Pacific,” Mr Peters says. “This will be our third visit to ...
Construction of a new mental health facility at Te Nikau Grey Hospital in Greymouth is today one step closer, Mental Health Minister Matt Doocey says. “This $27 million facility shows this Government is delivering on its promise to boost mental health care and improve front line services,” Mr Doocey says. ...
New Zealand is committing nearly $50 million to a package supporting sustainable Pacific fisheries development over the next four years, Foreign Minister Winston Peters and Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones announced today. “This support consisting of a range of initiatives demonstrates New Zealand’s commitment to assisting our Pacific partners ...
Associate Education Minister David Seymour says proposed changes to the Education and Training Amendment Bill will ensure charter schools have more flexibility to negotiate employment agreements and are equipped with the right teaching resources. “Cabinet has agreed to progress an amendment which means unions will not be able to initiate ...
In response to serious concerns around oversight, overspend and a significant deterioration in financial outlook, the Board of Health New Zealand will be replaced with a Commissioner, Health Minister Dr Shane Reti announced today. “The previous government’s botched health reforms have created significant financial challenges at Health NZ that, without ...
Minister for Space and Science, Innovation and Technology Judith Collins will travel to Adelaide tomorrow for space and science engagements, including speaking at the Australian Space Forum. While there she will also have meetings and visits with a focus on space, biotechnology and innovation. “New Zealand has a thriving space ...
Climate Change Minister Simon Watts will travel to China on Saturday to attend the Ministerial on Climate Action meeting held in Wuhan. “Attending the Ministerial on Climate Action is an opportunity to advocate for New Zealand climate priorities and engage with our key partners on climate action,” Mr Watts says. ...
Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones is travelling to the Solomon Islands tomorrow for meetings with his counterparts from around the Pacific supporting collective management of the region’s fisheries. The 23rd Pacific Islands Forum Fisheries Committee and the 5th Regional Fisheries Ministers’ Meeting in Honiara from 23 to 26 July ...
The Government today launched the Military Style Academy Pilot at Te Au rere a te Tonga Youth Justice residence in Palmerston North, an important part of the Government’s plan to crackdown on youth crime and getting youth offenders back on track, Minister for Children, Karen Chhour said today. “On the ...
The Government has welcomed news the NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) has begun work to replace nine priority bridges across the country to ensure our state highway network remains resilient, reliable, and efficient for road users, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says.“Increasing productivity and economic growth is a key priority for the ...
Acting Prime Minister David Seymour has been in contact throughout the evening with senior officials who have coordinated a whole of government response to the global IT outage and can provide an update. The Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet has designated the National Emergency Management Agency as the ...
New Zealand and Japan will continue to step up their shared engagement with the Pacific, Foreign Minister Winston Peters says. “New Zealand and Japan have a strong, shared interest in a free, open and stable Pacific Islands region,” Mr Peters says. “We are pleased to be finding more ways ...
New developments in the heart of North Island forestry country will reinvigorate their communities and boost economic development, Regional Development Minister Shane Jones says. Mr Jones visited Kaingaroa and Kawerau in Bay of Plenty today to open a landmark community centre in the former and a new connecting road in ...
President Adeang, fellow Ministers, honourable Diet Member Horii, Ambassadors, distinguished guests. Minasama, konnichiwa, and good afternoon, everyone. Distinguished guests, it’s a pleasure to be here with you today to talk about New Zealand’s foreign policy reset, the reasons for it, the values that underpin it, and how it ...
Last summer when Matairangi burned, Ginny and Tom stood at the window of their lounge, watching kākā shoot skyward from the burning trees. From the distance, they looked to Ginny like pages torn from books and thrown into a bonfire. It was Tom, voice tight, who told her it was ...
Opinion: The Canadian short story writer Alice Munro – winner of the Nobel Prize in Literature in 2013 – died in May at the age of 92. Her work was about “the damage people inflict on one another in the name of love”, Deborah Treisman wrote in the New Yorker. ...
This month marks two years since the most powerful telescope ever built sent its first pictures back to earth. From its lofty vantage point, beyond the moon in orbit around the sun, the James Webb Space Telescope was tuned to observe the first stars and galaxies being born soon after ...
Comment: After Climate Change Minister Simon Watts’ preview several weeks ago, I had some optimism about the Government’s emissions reduction plan. Now I’ve read the discussion document, that hope has been dashed. How can the Government propose a plan that wants to take New Zealand taxpayers’ hard-earned money, and spend ...
Christopher Luxon: hurdles The little man from National jumps hurdles in his sleep. He’s quite good at it in his dreams and even though the reality doesn’t quite match up you have to give him credit for getting up every morning and crashing into the very first hurdle of the ...
Comment: It was a good two hours into the conversation when Tyrone Marks raised the most basic of questions when I first spoke to him in 2017. “They didn’t explain the things they did to me. They never told me why. And they still haven’t. There’s no explanation for it. ...
Madeleine Chapman rounds out Death Week on The Spinoff with a final recommendation. You can read all of our Death Week coverage here. Nothing forces you to reflect on your life and relationships quite like proximity to death. For those whose nearest and dearest have died, there are reasonably obvious ...
Whitney Greene takes us through her life in television, including the TV character she’d like to plan a funeral for and her cow lung catastrophe on The Traitors NZ. “If the phone rings, I have to answer it,” Whitney Greene from The Traitors NZ warns as we begin our My ...
Maddie Ballard reviews the debut essay collection of Pōneke writer Flora Feltham.In ‘The Raw Material’, the longest essay in Flora Feltham’s dazzling debut collection, the author heads out for a run after hours of weaving and sees the world turn to textile. “Pounding along the Parade, I saw the ...
Andy Christiansen, one half of the experimental rock-pop duo TRiPS, shares the tunes inspiring the band’s perfect weekend and new release. “Good speakers, good food, good music, no distractions”: that’s all you need to enjoy the psychedelic stylings of TRiPS, a new band formed by Fly My Pretties’ Barnaby Weir ...
Celebrating our quadrennial opportunity to become experts in a bunch of sports we never normally watch.The games of the XXXIII Olympiad are upon us. Paris will host this year’s showcase of sporting and athletic prowess, which means some late-night and early-morning viewing for us in Aotearoa.But what sports ...
The photograph is striking and beautiful, but also disturbing – a reminder that my love for John was often entangled in shame.The Sunday Essay is made possible thanks to the support of Creative New Zealand.In the spring of 1980, in Dunedin, shortly before his death, someone took a photograph ...
Get to know Babushka, our latest Dog of the Month. This feature was offered as a reward during our What’s Eating Aotearoa PledgeMe campaign. Thank you to Babu’s humans, Jo and Isabel, for their support. Dog name: Babushka (Babu for short) Age: 2Breed: Border Collie X poodleIf rescued, ...
Pacific Media Watch A Lebanese photojournalist who was severely wounded during an Israeli air strike in south Lebanon carried the Olympic torch in Paris this week in honour of her peers who have been wounded and killed in the field — especially in Gaza and Lebanon. Christina Assi of Agence ...
The first report in a five-part web series focused on the 15th Triennial Conference of Pacific Women taking place in the Marshall Islands this week.SPECIAL REPORT:By Netani Rika in Majuro Women continue to fight for justice 70 years after the first nuclear tests by the United States caused ...
Christopher Luxon has joined with Australia and Canada's leaders in voicing support for US President Joe Biden's ceasefire deal between Israel and Hamas. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra The 2022 election brought the “teal wave” into parliament. The next election will test whether teals, who occupy what were Liberal seats, and other independents can maintain their momentum. Joining us on the Podcast ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Ian Musgrave, Senior lecturer in Pharmacology, University of Adelaide Pixavri/Shutterstock A major Federal Court class action has been dismissed this week after Justice Michael Lee ruled there was not enough evidence to prove the weedkiller Roundup causes cancer. Plaintiff Kelvin ...
In The Week in Politics: politicians have to decide what to do about child abuse, Health NZ is booked in for major surgery and Darleen Tana returns. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Clare Corbould, Associate Professor, Contemporary Histories Research Group, Deakin University Mainstream media are surprisingly muted at the prospect of the world’s most powerful nation being led for the first time by a woman – specifically a woman of colour, Vice President Kamala ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Rebecca Bennett, PhD Student, Associate Research Fellow, Deakin University Last week, a drone delivery company called Wing (owned by Google’s parent company, Alphabet) started operating in Melbourne. Some 250,000 residents in parts of the city’s eastern suburbs can now order food from ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Jonathan Foo, Lecturer, Physiotherapy, Monash University pikselstock/Shutterstock In the next 40 years in Australia, it’s predicted the number of Australians aged 65 and over will more than double, while the number of people aged 85 and over will more than triple. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Katrina Grant, Research Associate, Power Institute for Arts and Visual Culture, University of Sydney Jonas Åkerström’s 1790 work, Session of the Accademia dell’Arcadia on August 17 1788.Nationalmuseum/Cecilia Heisser Ever wondered whether you’d have a better chance at winning an Olympic gold ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Alexandra Jones, Program Lead, Food Governance, George Institute for Global Health wavebreakmedia/Shutterstock On Thursday, Australian and New Zealand food ministers at state, federal and national levels met to thrash out what’s next for health star ratings on packaged foods. Now, after ...
The Abuse in Care report found many Pacific survivors lost their connections to their culture and language, resulting in trauma that has been carried from generation to generation. ...
In the regulatory review, ECC intends to suggest that ERO focus on curriculum delivery reviews rather than the Ministry, because it’s not efficient or effective to have two agencies with radically different approaches climbing over each other. ...
Te Rūnanga Nui o Ngā Kura Kaupapa Māori invites the current government to work in partnership with them to develop a pathway forward, including the development of a parallel pathway and meaningful policy and strategy for Kura Kaupapa Māori ...
If you haven’t started watching yet, Tara Ward begs you to reconsider. This is an excerpt from our weekly pop culture newsletter Rec Room. Sign up here. In the world of New Zealand reality television, we have many gems in our crown. There’s the delicious second season of the Celebrity Treasure ...
A new poem by Fiona Kidman. The clothes of the dead I did not keep my mother’s furry red beret for long nor the stringy scarves that adorned the necks of my aunts, although I have kept tag ends of gold, the rings and trinkets they wore, the brooches no ...
The government’s announcement that it will re-open the foreshore and seabed controversy by changing the rules on recognising centuries-old Māori customary title for a third time goes against the rule of law and New Zealand values,” Mr Tipa says. ...
The only published and available best-selling indie book chart in New Zealand is the top 10 sales list recorded every week at Unity Books’ stores in High St, Auckland, and Willis St, Wellington.AUCKLAND1 Lioness by Emily Perkins (Bloomsbury, $25) Roarrrr! Perkins’ brilliant, award-winning, Marian-Keyes anointed, darkly funny, long ...
The 2004 Act vested ownership of the foreshore and seabed in the Crown, extinguishing any Māori claims to ownership and causing widespread outrage and protests among Māori communities. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Antje Deckert, Associate Professor (Criminology), Auckland University of Technology Getty Images Despite the connection between institutional harm and gang membership made clear in this week’s mammoth royal commission abuse-in care report, the government seems unlikely to soften its “get tough on ...
From Lewis Clareburt in the swimming to the start of the rowing – the first seven days of Paris 2024 promise to be big for New Zealand. There are few events that bring the country together quite like an Olympic Games. Nothing quite matches the excitement of getting up in ...
Groundbreaking local science just showed up in the most surprising of places: the season finale of The Kardashians. In the season five finale of The Kardashians last night, several members of the family gathered together in one of their signature empty, cream-coloured rooms to hear test results that had been ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Amin Saikal, Emeritus professor of Middle Eastern and Central Asian Studies, Australian National University The Middle East is on the brink of a possibly devastating regional war, with hostilities between Israel and Hezbollah reaching an extremely dangerous level. Washington has engaged in ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Laura Elizabeth Eades, Rheumatologist, Monash University Lupus is an inflammatory autoimmune illness, where the body’s immune system mistakenly attacks itself. Lupus can affect virtually any part of the body, although it most commonly affects the skin, joints and kidneys. The symptoms ...
A law firm that specialises in working with survivors of abuse in State care is disappointed that the Government fails to recognise that its boot camps can be directly compared to previous boot camps from the 1990s and 2000s. ...
Dying is a natural part of life, like updating your Wof or seeing your hairdresser, but without the word-of-mouth recs that help guarantee a good service. What if we changed that? Dying Reviews received by The Spinoff have had the names of organisations redacted while Hospice NZ collects further data. ...
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How is peace with Russia possible when they do this sort of thing?
Dunno.
What are the precedents?
Dresden firebombing killing 25,000 people in WW2 ,perpetrated by joint US/UK airforce
Tokyo napalm firebombing killing 100,000 in single night , perpetrated by the USairforce in WW2
Napalm bombing in Vietnam
Ditto Korea, reducing the Koreans in the north to living underground
More recently Raqqa 1,600 civilians killed
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/coalition-strikes-killed-1600-civilians-raqqa-report/story?id=62629765
Mosul
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/press-release/2017/04/bombed-in-their-homes-civilians-in-mosul-blame-reckless-coalition-forces/
How can we bear to consider these people our allies?
By practising selective morality aka calculating where our economic interests lie
What about your whataboutism?
This is a despicable attack by Russia and whatabouting doesn't make it any less so.
TSmithfield asked how was peace possible when Russia does things like this ?
I responded by saying we have apparently come to an easy accomodation with allies who do things far more egregious than this:examples given, and somehow a peace was found.
Result? very predictable cries about "whataboutism" Frankly guys, that is worn out and lacking any kind of credible argument
Once again you will shriek Russian propaganda!! when I post this next link
https://www.rt.com/russia/569890-ukraine-missile-fell-dnepr/
Even if it is true that the Ukrainians shot down a Russian missile (how dreadful of them), how does that change anything?
After all, the Russians were targeting the Ukrainian power grid in this attack, amongst other things. That sort of action in the freezing conditions now prevailing in Ukraine could even have a worse effect in terms of human suffering.
The Russians are very aware of the suffering they are likely to cause one way or another with this sort of behaviour targeting civilian infrastructure. So, in no way does anything you say justify the Russian action.
The fact that you cite RT just confirms our suspicions about you.
Oh Smithfield !
I did have a laugh at the idea of "our" suspicions
OK then. I will ask you directly
Are you employed by a troll factory?
Yes or No
Yes Jenny , its hugely profitable, I've made 3000 roubles a month at least, and have a time share in fabulous dachas in Crimea.There's never any difficulty getting the money sent over either, it comes packed in those Russian dolls
Oh the stories I could tell you !Dancing with Putin at my wedding, the fun!,the singing! the barbecues at the Kremlin, the chess games with Lavrov !
And no one has ever found me out (but there are those who've had their dark suspicions!)
Until now!
Clever Jenny!
Yes or No
"Many a true word is spoken in jest" James Joyce
Whether or not you work for a Russian troll farm, or not is irrelevant really. The way you slurp up to the Russian war machine, the effect is the same.
Well let's face it. Your continued appeasement for Russian atrocities does sound very much like the mantra of a useful idiot (and I use those words carefully as I was well aquainted with one in the 1960's who pestered my father relentlessly with Soviet propaganda). I know how they operated and what their belief systems were. They were totally down the rabbit hole of Soviet lies and misinformation regularly sent to them from the Russian consulate as it was then.
My father was the President of a Union for over 20 years so they were particularly keen to get him on their side and ferment trouble. They didn't like the fact that he ignored them, and instead the Union was able to gain very good pay rates and working conditions for the members of his union without the need for constant strikes and stop works. On one occasion a National Party MP was heard to say in the House how appalled he was that these workers were earning almost as much as he!
If only those pesky Ukrainians would see just how benign and helpful these continued bombardments form Russia are, and stop trying to shoot them down. Everything would be much so much better.
Like Russia murdering = moral, west murdering = immoral. Got it.
It says a lot about you that you can brush off the horror of this situation with some sort of wierd whataboutism justification of it.
But, putting that aside, why would the people of Ukraine be the slightest bit interested in doing any sort of peace deal with Russia when Russia behaves like this? Especially since the horror of this situation will likely just motivate the west to supply more and heavier weapons to Ukraine, thus increasing the likelihood of a Ukrainian victory.
If you really want to see a peaceful resolution to this conflict then you should be condemning this sort of behaviour not excusing it.
Quite right, Fransesca.
Likewise, the siege of Constantinople in 1451 was a particularly brutal affair.
And what about those nasty Romans sowing salt on the ruins of Carthage in 145BCE – there are plenty of examples which can be used to excuse present day barbarity.
But it still remains barbarity!
Once again , you miss the point
Peace is possible .,it has to be .Vietnam has apparently forgiven the genocidal assaults of the Vietnam war, or as they call it , the Resistance war against America
In the face of our own barbarity, it seems we forgive and forget very easily
Where is the consistency?
Why aren’t we arming the Palestinians and applying sanctions to Israel, not that I would recommend that
War is disgusting, and should be avoided at all costs, peace agreements implemented, but there are precious few anti war activists left anywhere in the west , not when so many livelihoods are dependent on war and other people get to do the bloodshedding
Anything is "possible''. But this sort of action by the Russians makes peace a much more difficult outcome to achieve.
So, as I said before, if you really want to see a peaceful resolution to this conflict, you should be condemning this sort of action.
Do you condemn it?
So, as I said before, I condemn war , because this is the sort of barbaric shit that happens in war .(see numerous examples I have given)
Do you condemn war?
Of course I condemn "war''.
What I don't condemn is people wanting to defend their country, homes, and families against unwarranted agression from larger nations. So, in this case, I condemn war by condemning Russia.
But, I guess you will just say the Russians are acting in "self defence" or that the US did it therefore Russia can do it, or something equally inane.
Further to that, "condemning war" in the way that you would have it in this conflict would mean allowing the Russian army to roll in with its tanks uncontested and Ukraine capitulating in order to avoid war.
Am I correct in that interpretation?
No , you're not
I've already said it .The war could have been prevented .The Minsk peace agreements signed between the LPR, DPR, and Ukraine was a path to peace, but as Poroshenko boasted, there was never any intention of implementing it , and the plan was to take Donbas by force
No negotiations , no compromise
Well then , you would approve the Donbas people of resisting attack by Western Ukraine , since 2014, only I've never heard that from you
"…Well then , you would approve the Donbas people of resisting attack by Western Ukraine , since 2014, only I've never heard that from you…"
A bizarre statement. Where is this "Western Ukraine" you speak? I can't find it on a map.
The Donbas is legally part of the Ukraine, like Crimea.
Then you have no understanding of why there is such tension between the eastern provinces (formerly Russian territory which Ukraine expanded into under Lenin in the 20's)mainly orthodox and culturally Russian , and the western parts, where you are more likely to encounter monuments to Nazi collaborators like Bandera , and more likely to belong to the Ukrainian Greek Catholic church
Here is a small primer for you
https://www.timesofisrael.com/ukraine-divided-over-legacy-of-nazi-fighters/
Your modus operandi is to go around and round in circles repeating the same nonsense that has already been debunked many times.
It has already been pointed out on numerous occasions that the far right only got around 2% of the vote in the last Ukrainian election. So, it obviously isn't much more of a problem than most countries.
If you are really that vexed about Nazis, then you should be really worried about Nazis in Russia. Especially as it appears Putin has been trying to manipulate them for his own ends, as the article points out.
From the link:
“What has received less coverage is the Putin regime’s own record of collaboration with far-right extremists.”
It is not at all clear who was attacking who in that conflict, especially considering it wasn't only rebel Ukrainians involved. But also, large numbers of Russians, including Russian special forces.
So, it looks more like a continuation of Russian agression following the annexation of Crimea than anything else.
Does the name Igor Girkin mean anything to you. Pity about that Malaysian passenger plane that was shot down. But I guess you would blame the Ukrainians for that as well.
Yes, Igor Girkin aka Strelkov, a nationalist and a nutter, banned from eastern Ukraine by Putin,and ever since a strident critic of Putin , because he thinks Putin is a softie and appeaser of the west.
You're really drifting here
You obviously didn't read the link very well.
He has only become critical of Putin over recent times. And was actually quite popular prior to the downing of the Malaysian plane which was terminal for his career.
From the previous link:
"Peace is possible .,it has to be .Vietnam has apparently forgiven the genocidal assaults of the Vietnam war,…." Francesca.
Only when and after the US imperialists were driven out.
Did you forget that part?
groan the Dresden and Tokyo attacks were 80 years ago now, Korea three quarters of a century ago and Rolling Thunder for all it's tonnage of bombs dropped was not an area bombing offensive. This sort of tedious whatabboutism is mired in a miserable ignorance of the last eighty years.
The thing is, targets like Dresden and Tokyo (and Hamburg) were attacked using incendiaries for the simple reason the attackers couldn't hit the particular but they could hit the general. In other words, the Allied night bombers could find, hit and set fire to a city easily but they couldn't hit a specific target within the city at all. The US bombing of Vietnam COULD hit specific targets, which is why the Vietnamese didn't bother to claim the Americans were engaging in indiscriminate terror attacks on civilians.
Western military thought no longer embraces area bombing because it doesn't work. It is wasteful of resources and it doesn't achieve it's supposed primary goal – the destruction of the enemies means and will to fight. A primary military consideration is are the means conmensurate with the ways and the ends? The UK devoted between 35-40% of it's total wartime output in WW2 to the construction of lavishly equipped heavy bombers, yet this force was frightfully vulnerable German nightfighters right to the end of the war and the heavy losses in bomber crews were inflicted on the best and brightest young men of the era. So, area bombing cost the UK more than it did Germany. Now that isn't to say such bombing doesn't achieve secondary objectives. The use of area bombing forces the enemy to disperse their industry, which is disruptive. It forces the diversion of resources into air defenses (in WW2 the Germans deployed thousands of large AA guns, fighters etc etc and air defense consumed almost all the output of Germany's electronics industry). Finally, the way the ends were achieved have ultimately become an issue. While area bombing has some justification, it is morally questionable, to say the least. Bombing civilians because otherwise you'd have all this expensive stuff sitting around doing not much is as bad morally and it is bad militarily.
Ultimately, the big lesson of WW2 was what WORKED was using strategic bombing to achieve a specific strategic aim. Thus, the "transport plan", or the attacks on the German canal system, or were the Americans would send 1000 USAAF heavy bombers (escorted by 1000 Mustang and Thunderbolt fighters) to carry out precision daylight bombing of vital targets as "bait" to force the Germans to send up their fighters, were they were engaged in a huge battle of attrition that the United States was always going to win handily via the application of Lanchester's equation. That is why now the west relies on precision guided weapons. Why would you bomb an entire city with 1000 bombers when all you want to do is destroy a tank factory?
The thread of logic that links Russia's missile attacks on the Ukraine with area bombing is the Russians are now no longer particularly interested in hitting the target they are aiming their wildly inaccurate Kh-22 and S300 missiles at. Just like destroying anything of military significance was a bonus of area bombing rather than the aim, so Russia regards actually hitting something they aim at and causing a militarily significant outcome as a bonus. The aim is an airborne expression of splenetic state terrorism at the temerity of the Ukrainians to resist and a brutal and cruel desire to inflict suffering on the Ukrainian civilian population.
The thing is, Western powers learnt from area bombing. It didn't work, it was wasteful, it was morally wrong in retrospect. They don't do it anymore. Russia, it seems, is not interested in these insights. They've learnt nothing and forgotten nothing from the human catastrophes of the mid 20th century.
Two wrongs don't make a right.
The Western powers learnt not to area bomb?Or do you mean aerial?
What planet are you on ?
Iraq, Libya,Syria, Somalia,Afghanistan,Vietnam, Laos,Cambodia,Serbia.
And from the Progressive
https://progressive.org/latest/usa-bombs-drop-benjamin-davies-220112/
If you think the US has any morality whatsoever in its foreign policy …"morally wrong in retrospect"… come on , there's not really a discussion here
The Western powers learnt not to area bomb? Or do you mean aerial?
You seem a bit lacking in some key understandings when it comes to being informed on what you are pontificating on about.
Any degree of comprehensive general knowledge should be familiar with the term area bombing. Here is the entry in Wikipedia. Avail yourself of some new knowledge.
Thanks, I did know, I just couldn't believe you thought the US had given up bombing residential areas , urban areas
I repeat Mosul, Raqqa
"If you think the US has any morality whatsoever in its foreign policy …"morally wrong in retrospect"… come on , there's not really a discussion here…" Francesca
I don't think US foreign policy has any morality whatsoever. From the Halls of Montezuma to the shores of Tripoli, and everything in between, the nature and the crimes of American imperialism are well documented.
Every imperialism is racist and genocidal, it is the very nature of imperialism.
Biden calls the Russian Federation imperialist. Putin calls the U.S imperialist. What they both have in common is that they both don't want it known that they are both imperialists.
All imperialists are racist, how else can they claim they have the right to invade and take over and run other people's countries unless they believe those people are inferior.
All imperialists are genocidal, how else can can an imperialist nation put down an insurgent people, who refuse to submit. As one US general once said in Vietnam 'We had to destroy the village to save it"
Genocide is destroying the village to save it writ large
If the Russian imperialists did take their cue from the American imperialists, the student has become the master.
"The thing is, Western powers learnt from area bombing. It didn't work, it was wasteful, it was morally wrong in retrospect"
Indeed, have three of four volumes of "The Strategic Air Offensive against Germany 1939-1945" by Sir Charles Webster and Noble Frankland published 1961 which was biffed out of Whenuapai Station Library – RNZAF Command and Staff College Library Book with CANCELLED stamped inside which examines and discusses this very subject.
Vol I issued once in 1995 Vol II issued thrice in 1962; 1972 & 1992 No Vol III and Vol IV issued once in 1976.
One wonders why it is not still a standard text for study!
BTW written in pencil on flyleaf is: Total Price Set of 4 Vols 9 pounds and four shillings. Do hope they got their moneys worth out of them …..
Would love to find Vol III and only paid $12 for the three.
FFS,
You really love giving me a dose of Dysentery don't you?
Why don't you read up on Russia's guarantees that it signed under the Lisbon Protocol & Budapest Memorandum when Ukraine gave up its Strategic Wpns at the end of the Cold War for Starters.
Then go back to the 1917 through 1925 when the USSR signed a similar Peace Treaty in 1920 or 22 from memory where Russia kept Eastern Ukraine along the Dnipro River. Which it violated in 1925 leading to Holodomor under Stalin.
Then read up what Stalin did to Ukraine after Russia booted the Germans out & it could've a lot more worse if Khrushchev quietly squash some of Stalin Orders.
The Ukrainian's do not & will not trust Russia for the next 1k yrs no matter what what Peace Treaty they sign because Russia can not be Bloody Trust to keep their Bloody Word & will not Negotiate in Good Faith!
Why do you think Finland & Sweden decided to give up their Long Standing Neutrality FFS!!!
Because they no longer Bloody Trust Russia FFS!!!
I think we'll let you have the last word Scud.Probably the only one amongst us who's been in the thick of it
Respect
To obtain some understanding – if this is what you aim for – read Bloodlands by Timothy Snyder – of what both Stalin and Hitler did to Ukraine.
The Ukrainians, for damn good reason, will never trust the Russians!
Respect to you too Francesca really enjoyed your comments today answering one an all with quiet aplomb inspite of the hubbub very well done and exactly the kind of diplomacy lacking in the general debate imo .
Gotta say it reminds me of a memorable scene from ' One flew over the cuckoos nest ' though …hope you can guess which one !!
regards
Cheers Weston !
I appreciate it
There will be no peace, the Russians think they are winning (or at the very least have to win). Well the leadership think they are.
You get the Russian goal is on the West of Ukraine so they will keep going till they have all their strategic points occupied.
Peace might be discussed when the Russians have lost 500,000 troops. Might, they seem hell bent on self genocide at the moment – through throwing away the last generation who could save them as a people. Those who survive this mess are going to be totally FUBAR.
I want this war over, but the idiots are in charge so I see it lasting till the last Russian is left going "can I go home now"
Mr. Sensible kindly gives us a master class in demolishing your own argument in the first two paragraphs of a rather ill thought out opinion piece…
"…The suggestion that the national capital should be shifted from Wellington to Hamilton, on the spurious grounds that the majority of our population lives north of Te Awamutu, is as ludicrous as it would be disastrous.
One of Wellington’s great advantages remains its centrality – as true today as it was in 1865. Indeed, Wellington’s only real competitor in that regard is Nelson…"
Centrality? Over three-quarters of New Zealand's population live in the North Island, with half living north of Lake Rotorua, and one-third of the total population living in the Auckland Region. On the basis of "centrality" surely the Tron is a fantastic idea? I guess he means GEOGRAPHIC centrality – in which case the US should move it's capital to Belle Fourche, South Dakota or the UK should move it's capital to Lancashire – or how about moving the Australian capital to somewhere in the middle of the Simpson desert?
Peter Dunne is a pompous old fool who spouts nonsense.
Irrespective of the pompous prats argument. I hope it carries some sway.
The last thing we need north of Rotorua is that lot. We've got enough idiots of our own up here. It's becoming increasingly harder to fly under the radar these days.
I've always thought that Wellington was a ridiculous place for parliament, it's when not if that place gets leveled by a whopper earthquke(very scientific terminology)
Christchurch would be my pick , Auckland throws its weight around enough with out letting the seat of power any near them
Would hazzard a guess that Christchurch – nay the entire South Island – would not want them and make that quite plain
No. Too conservative and lacking real diversity.
Hmmm. Nick …Leggett. Who he?
Aha….
So…apart from being a Nat…he also represents a major cause of the road damage problem. Egg.
Yep. Follow the dollars pretty much always demonstrates the validity of these guys statements.
It always amazes me how many "ceo's" of this or that lobby group there are in every sphere of our society.
Once again, follow the dollars. Cynicism is my new mantra.
Agreed Psyc.
I have posted a couple of times before on TS how trucks cause almost 1000 (one thousand) times the damage to roads compared with a family saloon.
Invest in rail is the obvious way out
Hi BG. Its an absolute no-brainer. Sadly the NO brainers : think Nat Simeon Brown etc… are getting the media attention. And of course the totally vested interest lobbyists as in Nick Leggett in my link.
IMO KiwiRail…are not really NZ Rail proponents..or even Rail friendly. I really feel Labour should get with re nationalising NZ Rail .And maybe some changes within at the same time (to get a real focus on Rail)
Youve probably seen these, but..
Also I have always kept this ..Rail…but also Coastal Shipping ! (FYI its a PDF..but very useful : )
He used to be the Labour mayor of Porirua. “Insert imprecation here.”
It's never been about protecting Russian speaking people, NATO, or about "'nazis".
It's always been about the eradication of the Ukrainian presence and identity to facilitate a genocidal land grab.
.
Over the next four days, the Kherson Regional Art Museum was cleaned out, witnesses said, with Russian forces “bustling about like insects,” porters wheeling out thousands of paintings, soldiers hastily wrapping them in sheets, art experts barking out orders and packing material flying everywhere.
“They were loading such masterpieces, which there are no more in the world, as if they were garbage,” said the museum’s longtime director, Alina Dotsenko, who recently returned from exile, recounting what employees and witnesses had told her.
When she came back to the museum in early November and grasped how much had been stolen, she said, “I almost lost my mind.”
Kherson. Mariupol. Melitopol. Kakhovsky. Museums of art, history and antiquities.
As Russia has ravaged Ukraine with deadly missile strikes and brutal atrocities on civilians, it has also looted the nation’s cultural institutions of some of the most important and intensely protected contributions of Ukraine and its forebears going back thousands of years.
International art experts say the plundering may be the single biggest collective art heist since the Nazis pillaged Europe in World War II.
https://archive.li/kriwg (nyt)
Looting is as old as war. So the pearl clutching is a bit rich for someone who supports the war.
The reality is war produces animals out of all who fight them.
But as your a huge supporter of keeping this war going joe90, you have to face up to the reality of the ugly as well: Rape, Looting, Killing of prisoners, and Mass murder of civilians is going to keep happening as long as this war keeps going. Both sides are going to do it.
No one has a monopoly on doing evil shit in war.
We just have to wait until at least 1/2 a million Russian soldiers are dead, before we can get around to peace talks.