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Open mike 25/10/2013

Written By: - Date published: 7:26 am, October 25th, 2013 - 165 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Open mike is your post. For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose. The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy). Step right up to the mike…openmike

165 comments on “Open mike 25/10/2013 ”

  1. Paul 1

    Job Key must be getting sick of this bad news.
    Meridian float a flop.
    Affordable housing plan a failure.
    Police fiasco .

    Must be asking his controllers soon when he can pull the plug on his mission to sell NZ to them and retire to Hawaii.

    • Steve 2.1

      The partial sale of the power companies made absolutely no sense financially or strategically.

      The Government knew this so avoided the argument and used the “mum and dad investor” and “building our capital markets” pitch to try and sell the idea. This has also failed as the Herald article points out.

      To add to the pain, the cost of the sale process has been far greater than anticipated, the sum raised far less and there is now the spectacle of all those unwanted prospectuses.

      It is very hard to imagine how National could have effed this up any more. A failure of epic proportions. Any wingnuts out there who would care to offer some insight as to how this went well?

      • Tat Loo 2.1.1

        Unfortunately because National had made certain promises to it’s own key stake holders, and had taken a public stance on the asset sale programme which could not be backed out from easily, they proceeded, hoping for the best.

        English and co. knew there would be trouble with this float, hence the sweet heart deal of deferred payment for shares, but decided to push on anyways.

        “Damn the torpedoes”… very apt. The Nat ship is sinking.

      • bad12 2.1.2

        What i see National having ffed up with the asset sales isn’t actually the sales themselves, remove for a moment your mind from the froth of Ma and Pa investors, having a broader base of New Zealander’s involved in the share-market, assets sold so as to build schools and hospitals, etc etc and on the litany went,

        For that is what all of the ‘reasoning’ surrounding the part sale of assets was and continues to be, a litany, a litany of lies,(when has this present Government told the electorate the truth about anything),

        The asset sales as the Herald article points out was purely ideological, the stated reasons by this Government for the sales mere froth, the weasel words of the used car sales-man in other words,

        The real reason for the asset sales were quite simply to get those shares onto the open market, the manner of the sales pure political spin in an attempt to lull the electorate, once on the market such shares will be avialable to the banking cartels who over time will become the major beneficiaries of these sales,

        Politically with regards the sale of these assets this Government has Failed, in terms of ideology tho this National Government achieved exactly what it intended to with regards the asset sales…

        • thatguynz

          Right on the money bad12 – I concur 100%. These asset sales haven’t been a failure, in fact they’ve been highly successful. It is only when you view them through the lens of what is good for the people of NZ that the sales could be considered to be a failure. We all know that Key et al don’t use that lens 🙂

          • bad12

            Yes the whole ‘we are selling to Ma and Pa investors’ ruse is starting to now unwind, National had to try and get the large demographic of the middle class heavily complicit in this act of theft, allowing them if you will the ability of clipping the ticket as the shares transit over the decade from NZ Ma and Pa ownership to their intended owners Ma and Pa in the guise of Goldman Saches and various other little firms of New York Banksters,

            The brick wall seems to have been hit as far as National’s involvement of the middle class in this particular act of theft for reasons of lack of capital,(despite tax cuts),or the middle class balking at being involved in something that gives off an absolute reek of dirty deals done dirt cheap,

            i would pick a bit of both along with a savvy middle class seeing the political writing on the wall as far as a National government’s re-election chances go with the added realization of what KiwiPower will do to the market value of these shareholdings as the reasons for their mass non-involvement in these acts of theft…

        • Draco T Bastard

          The real reason for the asset sales were quite simply to get those shares onto the open market, the manner of the sales pure political spin in an attempt to lull the electorate, once on the market such shares will be avialable to the banking cartels who over time will become the major beneficiaries of these sales,

          And thus turning us into serfs.

    • BLiP 2.2

      Harsh words? Oh, I dunno. While the New Zealand Fox News Herald puts National Ltd™’s beligerence down to ideology, its apparent that the writer shares that same ideology.

      . . . The major pity is that only 16,000 of those who put money into Meridian are first-time investors. Most of those who dipped into their pockets found the dividend yield attractive enough to buy large parcels of shares. That outcome may not worry the Government unduly. It is, nevertheless, unfortunate. More people have to be attracted to the sharemarket, and not just to revive its fortunes. The Government’s programme represents an outstanding opportunity to cultivate that interest. In so doing, it would help to remedy the current unhealthy investment emphasis on the housing market. Unfortunately, the Meridian offer helps that process only to a very limited extent.

      It also does little to inspire confidence in the part-float of the final power company, Genesis Energy. The Government, however, has no choice but to push ahead. It would make no sense to pause now, leaving Genesis with a different ownership structure. But an acceptable level of investor backing will depend on innovative salesmanship . . .

      The problem, according to Kevin Hart, is not that the ideology is flawed, only that the process did not involve a sufficient level of bullshit to make it more attractive to the punters.

      • Tat Loo 2.2.1

        Kevin did OK. There’s no harm in pointing out that the sale of Meridian was a failure using any number of criteria.

        • BLiP

          Sure, but to suggest the failure was down to a lack of “salesmanship”, like its some sort of minor glitch, seems to under estimate the situation and his fellow New Zealanders. What’s most disappointing, though, is that he believes there is an “acceptable” level of private ownership and New Zealanders can be duped. That’s the very ideology which drove the sale in the first place.

      • Draco T Bastard 2.2.2

        Exactly BLiP.

  2. Sanctuary 3

    Russell Brand is one strange guy.


    But I do believe him to be sincere.

    • Te Reo Putake 3.1

      Brilliant! And, yes, the Daily Mail did campaign to have Jeremy Paxman shave. Funny old world etc.

    • Steve 3.2

      Can’t usually stand RB but this I like!

      Don’t agree with all that he says but love the “truth to power” theme as he cuts through all the noble BS that the “consensus” feeds us.

      Paxman, as part of the status quo, quite simply looks caught in the headlights!

      • karol 3.2.1

        Paxman – not so much caught in the headlights, as not computing anything that doesn’t fit in with his complacent world view.

        • phillip ure

          and the view of every mainstream–media entity here..

          ..phillip ure..

        • gorj

          Karol and steve are you sure? To me it looks like Paxman likes Brand and served him up some classic objections for Brand to ‘slam dunk’.. He doesnt interrupt Brand and lets him put on a show.. What did Nietzche say “The best way to harm a cause is to defend it with faulty arguments” or something like that..

          • miravox

            Yeah, I think I agree with that gorj. Paxman was making good TV while Brand, awesome though he was, had lots of valid opinion by faulty (or no) argument that made any sense around changing the status quo. He’s looking for the poor to resist so much that tptb stay in power long enough to ferment revolution, but he didn’t seem to want to go with where that thought process was taking him.

            I do agree with him that British politics is a very cosy club – at least in NZ there is The Greens and Mana to attempt to keep the mainstream parties honest, and Labour has taken a lurch to the left. I don’t think the Brits have a similar choice.

            Go with the vote the buggers out party, or start a revolutionary party. If everyone stopped voting tptb would be very happy – implied consent, no resistance in parliament. Sometimes people have to work within the system, especially the very big systems, to change the system. However distasteful that may seem.

          • emergency mike

            It seemed to me that he didn’t interrupt because Brand was both articulate and making fair points. A combination the politicians Paxman interviews don’t often manage. What unclassic objections should he have raised?

    • Tat Loo 3.3

      “Wherever there is profit, there is deficit.”

      “I don’t have to wait for you to give me the right, i’m taking the right.”

      Not a silly man, he’s learnt some of the fundamentals really well.

      • Sanctuary 3.3.1

        Brand completely sank Paxman’s battleship when he referred to Paxman’s reaction to the discovery of his grandmothers unfair treatment on the show “Who Do You Think You Are?”

        And his subtle putdown of Boris Johnson was brilliant.

      • travellerev 3.3.2

        OOOOHHHH, If I wasn’t happily married and was about a quarter of a century younger I would be so on to this guy 😆 now I am just totally enchanted with his brain, intelligence and humor!

      • Anne 3.3.3

        Not a silly man,…

        A very intelligent man. “They” will be watching him.

        • Populuxe1

          It’s a pity he’s such a misogynist dirtbag

        • Tat Loo

          To be realistic, if you’re posting on TS, they’ll be watching u.

          • King Kong

            Paranoid much?

          • King Kong

            Paranoid much?

          • TheContrarian

            Who’s ‘they’ and what do you mean “watching u’?

          • Tat Loo

            have none of you guys been following the revelations on Tempora, Prism, etc? Seriously?

            FFS stop pretending like it’s the internet ignorant bliss of 2012.

            • McFlock


              I’m not cool with it, but “watching” implies someone’s actually taking notice. Nobody here is probably important enough.

              The flipside to Prism is information overload – most of it would be for monday-morning refereeing, rather than active monitoring.

              sis/gcsb might be vaguely interested, but probably only because of network analysis showing a connection between one or two posters and prior-flagged individuals.

              My guess is that it’s all down to budgeting analyst time vs threat-scale. And what would they really gather (thanks to much of LP’s prior planning) that they wouldn’t get as a policy geek browsing here on their lunch break?

              • Tat Loo

                GCSB/GCHQ/NSA stuff all storm in a teacup then. Sorry my mistake.

                • McFlock

                  sorry, where did I say that?

                  Forgive me for not having the conceit to think that everything written here is delivered in a daily briefing to the NSC.

            • TheContrarian

              So “they” are the US government? And how do you mean watching, specifically?

              • Tat Loo

                Read up the Snowden/NSA files/Glen Greenwald op eds on the Guardian website mate.

                • TheContrarian

                  I know all about Snowden et al. What I am trying to establish is whether you think NSA etc are watching via a back-door into The Standard or merely reading The Standard.

                  Secondly why you think that.

    • The Al1en 3.4

      He’s a smart bloke is our Russell. Great interview, thanks for the link.

    • vto 3.5

      Yes very good.

      Of course he should be standing for the Vote Them Out Party so he can do something positive with the vote he refuses to use by using it to delete seats in Parliament.

    • joe90 3.6


      Strange or not he’s particularly eloquent in his appearance before the Home Affairs Committee on drug policy.

    • Rogue Trooper 3.7

      without a shadow of a doubt, A Complex Kid

    • Draco T Bastard 3.8

      He certainly very passionate and, yes, I think sincere as well.

    • Thanks Sanctuary that was great.

  3. i found this on my rounds this morn..

    ..and it really is a most excellent interview..

    ..that most should enjoy..


    ..(and stephen fry has these really cool magnetic-specs..eh..?..)

    ..phillip ure..

    • moderation:..thou art a harsh mistress..

      ..phillip ure..

      [lprent: Much better mistress than the alternative. This morning we had a catch of 196 in the auto-spam queue that I have to scan for any nuggets from humans. Looks like someone has a new set of slave bots as that is abnormally high. ]

      • Lanthanide 4.1.1

        Lynn: I’ve thought for a while that you should build up whitelists of commenters with good track records, who are automatically released from moderation but the comment is still recorded in the log so you could catch it later.

    • Chooky 4.2

      thanx philip ure….Malcolm Gladwell on psychological divergence and tolerance and exceptionality…..my English culture shot for the morning….very interesting

  4. Chooky 5

    thanx Sanctuary!….wow Russell Brand gets my vote!

  5. felix 6

    So yesterday our parliament, under urgency and with secrecy, passed legislation to retrospectively protect the NZ Police from the consequences of disregarding the laws under which they are expected to operate.


    Does anyone think they’re ever going to behave lawfully if we bend over backwards to avoid them ever experiencing the consequences of their unlawfulness?

    • vto 6.1

      As long as the courtesy is extended to everyone I don’t see a problem felix ………..

    • What you should understand in that the NZ civil justice system is fundamentally corrupt. Absurdities like the one that you have just described are simply a consequence of the perversion of law that parliament operates by. One way of looking at it is as a consequence of the dereliction of duty of the monarchs of the house of Windsor regarding the English coronation oath.

    • McFlock 6.3

      The alternative is to negate damned near every single case those officers were involved in.

      However, I would be very interested to see what disciplinary action was taken against the district commanders who exceeded their authority by administering oaths. If they don’t understand their procedural power in normal duties, how can they be relied on in an emergency?

      • felix 6.3.1

        “The alternative is to negate damned near every single case those officers were involved in.”

        Yes that’s right. Stupid arrogant irresponsible lawbreaking can have serious consequences.

        Or, we just validate their behaviour (again) and let them continue to make up their own rules, safe in the knowledge that no-one will ever challenge them on it.

        • McFlock

          We’re not talking about lying on warrants or extrajudicial killings, here.

          The consequences should be felt by those responsible for the error. What convictions are you prepared to overturn because the evidence was gathered by a cop who turned out to have been sworn in by the wrong person (and so didn’t actually have the power to take part in a search warrant or issue notices)? Speeding tickets? Drink driving arrest? Murder convictions?

          I reckon it’s a minor error that is more symptomatic of a problem than it is particularly bad in itself.

          • felix

            “What convictions are you prepared to overturn…”

            None, that’s a matter for the courts. However I would anticipate that any half-way decent lawyer should be able to convince the courts to overturn just about any conviction that was obtained illegally.

            And so they should.

            • Tat Loo

              Hence the need for secret justice and secret law…yeah its an oxymoron.

              • McFlock

                It’s not “secret justice”, and the law was under wraps for very similar reasons to the Budget being under wraps.

            • McFlock

              Nah, that’s too black/white.

              Firstly, we’re not talking about an intentional abuse of authority by the officers concerned with the cases, but a procedural fuckup that doesn’t directly affect rights or chain of custody. So the suspects aren’t compromised.

              Secondly, 63 officers by several years = a possible shitload of cases being tested. This puts more pressure on the courts, but the idiots who made the gaff aren’t affected.

              Thirdly, overturning a murder case simply because one of the officers on the search warrant was caught up in this cockup is farcical, but a number of the more dickish folk around would use it to the fullest extent of the law without preventing themselves being convicted. It would draw out the process even longer for the surviving victims, however.

              So parliament is supposed to step in to overturn this sort of fuckup as a sort of prophylactic deus ex machina.

              Like I said, though, the commanders issuing the oaths without authority really need to be censured at the very least. If it’s only one or two, fire them as a warning to everyone. Why wasn’t it done the first time this fuckup happened?

              • felix

                “Like I said, though, the commanders issuing the oaths without authority really need to be censured at the very least. If it’s only one or two, fire them as a warning to everyone. Why wasn’t it done the first time this fuckup happened?”

                Because the Police assume themselves to be above the law. That’s the whole point, McF.

                • McFlock

                  yeah, sorry, I forgot for a moment that police officers aren’t individuals, they’re the Borg. /sarc

                  • felix

                    This has very little to do with individuals.

                    I think what you forget is that this isn’t an isolated instance. The failure is symptomatic of far broader institutional systemic and cultural problems in the Police.

                    Mock that observation all you like. It may help pass the time while you wait for the Police to fire or discipline the “individuals” you think are responsible.

                    • McFlock

                      If you want the organisational culture to change, you make individuals within that organisation accountable for their actions.

                      Let me put it this way – the fact that parliament has had to resolve the same issue twice indicates that the ministers and managers failed in their roles. The first time, maybe they’d been unclear on what was expected. The second time means someone’s playing silly buggers.

                      It’s like any other situation where an organisational culture has atrophied and needs correcting. You detect wrongdoing, issue clear corrective instructions, and if those instructions are not heeded you take disciplinary action against the individuals who break the rules.

                      So I want to know what action, for example, the minister has taken, and whether the responsible commanders are facing disciplinary action.

                    • felix

                      Yeah I agree with all of that.

                      But it’s not going to happen because there are no consequences for ignoring it.

                    • McFlock

                      Shit flows downhill.

                      I’d be disappointed if labour and the greens didn’t make some hay from the fact they they’ve had to help national clean up national’s failure to adequately ensure the police act lawfully. Twice.

                  • Te Reo Putake

                    Jacinda Adern and David Clendon have been leading the charge for Labour on this. Heard her on the radio earlier and they’re both quoted here:


                    btw: I’ve always thought the way Greg O’Connor refers to the organisation as ‘Police’, rather than ‘the Police’, is a little Borg-like.

      • Murray Olsen 6.3.2

        “The alternative is to negate damned near every single case those officers were involved in.”

        TINA. They acted without legal authority and the government retrospectively gave it to them. They acted as private citizens. I can think of one or two people I’d love to do something horrible to, and poaka behaviour gives me a few ideas. I could shoot them, taser them, baton them, pepper spray them, and lock them up in a cell. When I got caught, the politicians could just make me a retrospective constable and it’d all be sweet.

        One day they will have to face the consequences of illegal activities. I hope that day is soon.

    • King Kong 6.4

      Pretty hard for you to bend over backwards for the police when you have already well and truly bent over for the criminals

  6. Obamacare or the affordable care act seems to turn into a total disaster it seems.

    Of course this does not surprise those of us who where of the opinion that legislation written by the for profit big insurance companies can not in any form or shape be good for the little man living pay check to paycheck if he is lucky enough to have two or three jobs in the US.

    • Zorr 7.1

      Travellerev – there is no data there to back up their claims whatsoever and even the most rudimentary digging in to these “issues” shows that it’s all smoke and mirrors bullshit from the negative-ACA people

      I really can’t be arsed digging up links to support my position because neither did your link have any proof.

  7. The racist paul henry is soon to return to primetime screens on TV3.
    Judging by their reported programme line-up, it’ll be one show on a long list of things to deliberately avoid.


    Maybe Campbell live could do a show on how a bunch of controlling bankster shareholders can decide who owns the countries biggest media outlet.

    • McFlock 8.1

      I might even try to avoid tv3 altogether

    • ak 8.2

      Any clued-up standardista know who made this decision? Time to repeatedly name and shame the scum who are responsible for smearing this repulsive squirt of putrid tory faeces in the living rooms of innocent kiwis.

      • Tim 8.2.1

        Well he’s under contract to Mediaworks, so I imagine they’ll be trying to figure ways of ‘utilising’ him as much as possible.

        One of the reasons I’m not yet prepared to offer Labour anything more of an electoral vote (they were going to get NOTHING pre-Cunliffe) is that they’ve not yet committed to any policy on issues such as Public Service Broadcasting, the plight of beneficiaries, and a few other things – you know – some of the really important issues that concern their traditional support base.
        That legitimisation they supported yesterday of Police incompitence rushed through Parliament (which if you watched, saw the Nats throwing shit at them) almost made me withdraw that commitment to an electoral vote. They should have made it clear to some of the shit throwers from the Natzy side, that if they kept it up – support would be withdrawn.

        As I’ve mentioned before – there are a couple of really simple things they (Labour/Greens/others) could do once in power to break the Sky monopoly, commit to PSB TV, and in doing so – go a long way to improving the situation of the Film/TV industry that’s widely canvassed in another thread. (There are a few people in TVNZ, gubbmint depts and quangos that really need to lose their shirts over both their incompetence and not behaving as public servants acting in the PUBLIC interest)

        • Murray Olsen

          Yep. There’s still far too much of the old business as usual in Labour. There are too many groups that are untouchable, such as ngati poaka, who get laws made to suit them at the speed of a MacDonald’s drive in window.

        • ak

          Ta Tim.Quite agree old chap,

  8. risildowgtn 9

    And so the pillaging begins…..


    Raglan Fishing Charters’ Brian Hooker is worried about the environmental impact on marine life and is threatening to lead a fleet of boats to picket the Anadarko vessel the Noble Bob Douglas when it arrives at the end of next month.

    Go hard

    • tc 9.1

      That’s what you don’t see being all out at sea, however on land the planes drone on most days doing their grid pattern aerial surveying with Rigs drilling hundreds holes below the water table (sinosteel) but as its…
      a) private land
      b) not a crown mineral
      c) farmer gets money

      Gov’t agencies don’t care and WDC only care to see they have got a bore permit and aren’t making roads, which of course you don’t with a tractor on hand in case a rig gets stuck.

      The pillaging has been well under way for some years now.

    • Sanctuary 9.2

      Mr. Hooker is about to discover that the law changes this government has done to try and outlaw protest at sea doesn’t just apply to Greenpeace – law abiding middle class citizens will also suffer.

  9. BLiP 10

    I see both National Ltd™ and Labour have been feasting upon the public purse while simultaneously ensuring the details remain hidden. Kinda explains Not-So-Clever Trevor’s emotional outburst in the House the other day. Apart from the mendacity in keeping such information from scrutiny, I don’t really have a problem with the travel perks. If I was in charge of things I’d pass a law requiring the airlines to provide the internal travel for free to MPs and partners as part of their civil duty.

  10. Philgwellington Wellington 11

    Go Russell Brand! If you like what he says check out Jesse Ventura. There must be Hope.

  11. TE 12

    While watching paula bennett give her speak easy on parliment tv last night I noticed the finger action of that john key clone simon something or rather,
    was he texting to WO?
    is there a law against texting, while pretending to be at work as an mp ?

    • Tim 12.1

      “is there a law against texting, while pretending to be at work as an mp ?”
      Unfortunately not – just one introduced to cover driving – introduced to make sure they looked as though they were concerned, and ekshully doing something. Of course there were already enough laws in place to cover those idiots that text while driving (most of whom can’t even text whilst walking down a city street) – it’s just the the Polis seemed to have a problem using them.
      And from what I’ve noticed, there are just as many people still trying to drive and text (all the while unable to keep to the lanes they’re in, following way to close, indiscriminately changing lanes and driving like they’re in a dodgem car, etc.)
      I’m picking they’re really really really remorseful when they’ve killed some one, or in vegetative state wrapped halfway around a lamp post. And I’m expected to feel some sort of sympathy for them after such an event. The urgency to reply to a text telling them was a spunk SBW is si rilly rilly important (aye!).
      Pardon me while I back out of my driveway and over my son – I’ve got a rilly rilly important call to take! (aye)

      • karol 12.1.1

        was he texting to WO?

        Actually quite a few MPs on both sides of the House tweet comments during Question Time & Parliamentary Debates.

        I often check twitter while watching Parliament on TV. I don’t follow all opposition MPs, but often the best tweets get retweeted by people I do follow.

        So tapping on a mobile phone while in the House, might actually be work.

    • Murray Olsen 12.2

      I remember seeing Rodney Hide driving and talking on a cellphone a few times. Even though he probably supports 1lawforall, he must think it shouldn’t apply to him.

  12. AsleepWhileWalking 13

    New work assessments for the disabled and people with health conditions will impose ”unnecessary angst” and wrongly put the onus on clients rather than employers, CCS Disability Action Otago patron Donna-Rose McKay says.

    Details of the tests, which start early next year, have been released to the Government’s electronic tenders website in a Ministry of Social Development request for proposal.

    Mrs McKay believed New Zealand was adopting the same ”flawed model” as Britain, where work-testing the disabled was highly controversial.

    ”The process focuses on the person as having to overcome the barriers, but in reality for many people with impairment or many people who have an illness, the barriers are not with themselves; the barriers are with employment and other people’s attitudes.”

    • aerobubble 13.1

      Its a mentality in the lazy elite, that claimed wealth creation was due to their genius when in fact it was increasing amounts of cheap high density energy, so of course they believe the state can solve the problem, since it can’t be the market which is filled with lazy self-absorbed thinkers like them.

  13. Sanctuary 14

    Russell Brand’s editorial in the Newstatesman is an incredible piece of controlled fury, not to mention a fine fine piece of prose.


    • Paul 14.1

      Should be forwarded to many many sell out politicians of the left

    • karol 14.2

      It’s very good, but it goes on a bit. He nails it in many places, but too often it’s about Russell.

      • Murray Olsen 14.2.1

        That’s very much the impression he gives me. It seems to be a performance about himself, although that could just be my dislike of fast talkers.

  14. FYI (I have sent this FAR and WIDE…….)

    24 October 2013

    ‘Open Letter’/OIA to NZ Prime Minister John Key:

    “Why have you not ensured that ‘due diligence’ was carried out over the increased risk of money-laundering with the International Convention Centre (Sky City) Bill”?

    Dear Prime Minister,

    As an ‘anti-corruption’ campaigner, (and 2013 Auckland Mayoral candidate), I am deeply concerned at the apparent lack of ‘due diligence’, by yourself, as Prime Minister of New Zealand (‘perceived’ to be ‘the least corrupt country in the world’ ) regarding the increased risk of money-laundering arising from the International Convention Centre (Sky City deal) Bill?


    Please provide all information which confirms why you failed to do ‘due diligence’ and consult the ‘lead agency’ (OFCANZ) who has responsibility for “making it harder to launder money”,regarding the increased risk of money-laundering arising from the International Convention Centre (Sky City deal) Bill.

    (Please be reminded of the role of OFCANZ, as stated on their website: http://www.ofcanz.govt.nz/about-ofcanz

    OFCANZ will combat organised crime through:

    Leading, coordinating or contributing to policy or legislative changes to make it harder for organised criminals to operate. There will be opportunities to do so by, for example, making it harder to launder money, or obtain false identities, or by increasing information sharing. )




    Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 16:28:05 +1200
    Subject: ‘Open Letter/ OIA ‘ request to OFCANZ
    re: the increased risk of money-laundering associated with the NZ International Convention Centre Bill 2013

    11 July 2013

    Sheryl McCormick

    Financial Crime Group | Organised & Financial Crime Agency New Zealand
    Police National Headquarters

    ‘Open Letter/ OIA ‘ request to OFCANZ re: the increased risk of money-laundering associated with the NZ International Convention Centre Bill 2013.

    Dear Sheryl,

    Can you please forward this ‘Open Letter / OIA request’ to whoever from OFCANZ is responsible for handling such requests.

    ( re: Potential risk of money laundering )


    New Zealand International Convention Centre Bill 2013
    Regulatory Impact Statement
    New Zealand International Convention Centre
    Potential risk of money laundering

    95: Cash intensive industries such as casinos are attractive to money laundering activity. New Zealand’s National Risk Assessment 2010 assessed casinos as presenting moderate to high risk of money laundering.

    For this reason, casinos (including all SkyCity casinos) are subject to the Anti-Money Laundering and Countering Financingof Terrorism Act 2009 (the AML/CFT Act), which comes into force on 30 June 2013.

    96: Nothing in the Agreement affects SkyCity’s obligations under the AML/CFT Act. Those obligations include:

    a. – developing a risk assessment of the money laundering and terrorism financing risks facing

    b .- appointing an AML/CFT compliance officer

    c. – designing and implementing an AML/CFT programme, which must include:
    i. vetting senior managers and staff engaged in AML/CFT related duties

    ii. training senior managers and relevant staff on AML/CFT related matters

    iii. complying with customer due diligence (CDD) requirements, including determining
    when enhanced CDD is required, when simplified CDD might be permitted, and when
    CDD can be carried out by a person other than the reporting entity

    iv. reporting suspicious transactions

    v. monitoring and record keeping, especially in relation to specified high-risk transactions
    and business relationships

    vi. policies and procedures for how SkyCity will manage and mitigate its risks of money
    laundering and financing of terrorism

    vii. monitoring and managing compliance with the AML/CFT programme.

    97: However, there are aspects of the regulatory concessions that potentially raise the risk of money laundering through SkyCity.

    98: For example, the anonymity that can be associated with TITO technology has the potential to facilitate money laundering, by increasing the potential for currency refining and ticket structuring.

    In effect, this means that low denomination notes could be fed into one or more gaming machines or kiosks and then be redeemed by ticket into high denomination notes or casino cheques.

    Increasing the use of TITO technology (and raising the denominations that can be fed into a machine) may therefore increase the potential for money laundering.

    99: Increased use of “white cards” may also lead to increased risk of money laundering.

    White cards are an account-based system with a unique identifier that permits transaction sequences to be tracked. However, the form of identification information associated with each card will depend on the “business relationship” between the casino and the white card holder(s).

    100: The limits on anonymous cashing-out of TITO and white cards described in paragraphs 69-71 of this paper are aimed at mitigating this potentially higher risk of money laundering.

    I note the role of OFCANZ, as stated on your website: http://www.ofcanz.govt.nz/about-ofcanz

    OFCANZ will combat organised crime through:

    Leading, coordinating or contributing to policy or legislative changes to make it harder for organised criminals to operate. There will be opportunities to do so by, for example, making it harder to launder money, or obtain false identities, or by increasing information sharing.

    Under the OIA – can OFCANZ please provide the following information:

    (1) Copies of all/any Information OFCANZ has provided for the NZ International Convention Centre Bill / or any related Regulatory Impact Report or Statement/ Cabinet re: the increased risk ofmoney-laundering

    (2) Information which confirms that the views of OFCANZ on the increased risk of money-laundering were sought by any of the following parties:

    a) Department of Internal Affairs
    b) Ministry of Economic Development
    c) Sky City
    d) The Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet
    e) The Office of the Prime Minister
    f) Cabinet
    g) Any Cabinet Minister (in particular Steven Joyce)

    (3) I am also interested in any information held by OFCANZ on how TITO (Tickets In Tickets Out) can be used for money-laundering at casinos.

    I would prefer this information to be provided electronically

    (4) All/any information held by OFCANZ which raises concerns about the potential increase in ‘organised crime’ as a result of potentially increased money-laundering opportunities through the proposed NZ International Convention Centre Bill.

    Kind regards,

    Penny Bright

    ‘Anti-corruption / anti-privatisation’ campaigner
    Attendee: Australian Public Sector Anti-Corruption Conference 2009
    Attendee: Transparency International

    Anti-Corruption Conference 2010

    2013 Auckland Mayoral candidate






    Candidate Affiliation No Votes Received Rank

    BRIGHT, Penny Independent 102 11723 (4th)



  15. johnm 16

    I do hope that Pullya Benefit and Shonkey aka GoldinSacks are not going to replicate the obscenity of the persecution of Beneficiaries in Arbeit Mach Frei land under the Tory scum?

    “Bedridden farmer suffering from diabetes had benefits cut and told he was fit to work… then was refused reassessment when diagnosed with terminal cancer

    David Coupe lost his £50 a week payment after he was ruled fit to work
    Farmer, 57, was ill with injured back, diabetes, ulcers and heart condition
    He was then diagnosed with cancer and given just weeks to live
    Mr Coupe tried to appeal the decision but died before it could be overturned
    Wife Lyn, 57, vows to fight in husband’s name so other families don’t suffer
    Prime Minister David Cameron said he would personally look into ‘sad’ case.”


  16. Tat Loo 17

    I see Hutchison and Calder are exiting stage right.

    • bad12 17.1

      That’s four jumping after reading the numbers, any bets on at least 10 of them finding they have better things to do after November 2014…

      • Tat Loo 17.1.1

        Yes, I suspect a few more MPs will announce between now and the Summer holiday period.

        • weka

          Who are Hutchison and Calder?

          • bad12

            Obscurities from the deep gloom of National’s back bench who have only been able to today raise their personal profiles to that of being non-entities by announcing their retirements…

          • Tim

            Failed stand-up comedians? Shoes in for the next Narzy intake. All they have to do is get on their backs and let the Collins/Slug/Wewege Neshnool Party X Fekta judges to give them the thumbsup

            • Tim

              Actually Cam Calder reminds me of a Maurice Williamson of the 1990’s. – except he’s got more sense (by getting out now whilst the going’s good and he can clutch to a smidgeon of credibility). Cam – if you’ve got shares in Chorus – sell sell sell1

  17. bad12 18

    The Crown will take over the prosecution of John Banks from Wellington pensioner Graham McCready,

    It’s about time the Crown got off of it’s proverbial and did it’s JOB in this case and considering the personal sacrifices Mr McCready has had to make to progress the case thus far the Crown should also consider reimbursing Him for His costs so far incurred…

    • veutoviper 18.1

      Hi, Bad12 – as I have opinioned elsewhere here on TS in the last day or so, I am of two minds on this. I just hope that the Crown will do their job and not a whitewash. I was pleased yesterday to see that Michael Lloyd, an Auckland barrister and former Crown prosecutor, has offered to provide his services pro bono if the S-G did not decide to take over the prosecution, but know nothing of his reputation – or connections. But in some respects, I would prefer to see an ‘independent’ taking the prosecution case on behalf of McCready.

      I have been watching to see whether Banks and his legal team had actually filed a request this week for the High Court to undertake a judicial review of the DC decision to commit the case to trial but have been unable to find any reference to them having filed this request.

      Re McCready, I really wish I was in a position to help out financially, but unfortunately I am not….

      • greywarbler 18.1.1

        Re McCready – this is the Soc for … take on the history of the last few years.

        He has been a naughty boy and taken taxes and the law into his own hands. He probably understands a lot of things about financiers better than many of us.

        • veutoviper

          Greywarbler, I am well aware of McCready’s background as are others here. However, I also admire the fact that he has taken on this private prosecution despite his own record and lack of current resources. Re your past para, as the saying goes “it takes one to know one”.

          • greywarbler

            I didn’t set out to take him down so no need to get all tetchy. I noted what he had done with interest.
            And you say ‘ the others here’ are well aware of the info. That doesn’t mean that it shouldn’t be put up. All the others here cannot all be as completely informed on everything as you apparently are. So don’t read things into my comments that actually are in your own head.

            I didn’t address the comment to you particularly or I would have put your pseudonym. That’s what I do so that comments can be connected and understood as a conversation which is often difficult when there is no initial reference.

        • bad12

          Greywarbler, only a fool or the ‘wing-nuts’ decide upon the merits of any particular case put befor a Court or Tribunal by the ‘past’ of those who bring such actions,

          Such cases should be judged by Courts and Tribunals upon the evidence they contain not by the character of those putting any particular case unless that person is an integral part of the evidence at the heart of such a case…

          • greywarbler

            Well naturally I am bound to fail to meet your standards as you call me a wanker. Making negative snap judgements about others is your forte.

      • bad12 18.1.2

        Ventoviper, yes what you have opinioned and are in two minds over has also had Graham McCready in those same two minds,

        On the one hand He was and i suppose still is a little worried that the Crown Law Office might choose not to prosecute Banks with the full force of it’s resources,(my belief is that Crown Law will actually go the extra mile in this trial to PROVE to New Zealand people their total separation and independence from the executives power) and without imparting anything that i shouldn’t i know that there were some concerns about the ‘unknown’ status of the ex Crown prosecutor who kindly offered His services,

        The judicial review was also going to be problematic for Mr McCready should He have been forced to defend the District Courts decision that Bank’s should stand trial, for reasons i will not at this point go into,

        It is my view, strongly put in recent days in certain quarters, that it is the Crowns duty to at least defend the decision made so far in that Banks should stand trial by the District Court, or, provide Mr McCready the funding to have legal counsel assigned with High Court experience so as to assist Mr McCready at the High Court,

        i have had a conversation with Graham about how He feels His abilities would handle the complexities of the High Court and while He wasn’t overly confident His attitude was if He had to He had to,(but would rather have a Legal Eagle do it),

        VV, re the finances, ummm right now, with the insertion of the Crown Law Office into the prosecution and the actions of a couple of kind people that for now is ‘sorted’,(and i have wondered if the Crown move today was as a result of the ‘kind’ people having intervened without reaching a conclusion), although i believe that should Banks be convicted the ‘cost’ of the work already put in by Graham McCready should be paid by Banks…

        • veutoviper

          Thanks for your reply. bad12. We seem to be on the same wavelength re reservations on the Crown Law taking over and Lloyd’s offer. I could find very little as to Lloyd and his background on Google. We can but wait to see ….

          And I see that Banks has filed for judicial review by the High Court and a hearing is scheduled for next Thurs, 31 Oct. This will be interesting as I gather in some ways this is a ‘first’ legally.

          What really riled me this week was Banks’ attitude that came across as him expecting different treatment by the courts to other people in terms of timing and number of hearings and process. In particular, one media report which I cannot now find (funny that!) reported him as saying something to the effect that a trial next year “was not an option for me”. Sorry, John, you don’t get to decide the options in this situation! (sarc)

    • Murray Olsen 18.2

      I hope the Crown actually puts some effort into the prosecution, but I am deeply worried by this development. They are far more likely to settle for a discharge without conviction than a private prosecution would be. Since an actual lawyer has expressed interest, I’d prefer to donate to his fees.

      Of course, any reimbursement of McCready is a different question. I’m happy for them to do that, and then claim costs off Banks.

      • karol 18.2.1

        McCready is happy with the Crown taking it over.

        [audio src="http://podcast.radionz.co.nz/ckpt/ckpt-20131025-1716-solicitor-general_takes_over_prosecution_of_john_banks-048.mp3" /]

      • bad12 18.2.2

        i suppose we all have to judge our loathing of Banks and our wish to see Him convicted against our view of the pro’s and con’s of an early election,

        Myself i am up for it, but are the political parties ready to go to the election early because Banks convicted means He is gone and Slippery is leading a Government that is unlikely to be able to pass anything in the House (considering the Maori Party voting pattern)…

        • Tat Loo

          I see the Crown has finally won its $1.2M civil case against the Waihopai protestors. That”ll teach youse hippies for confronting the global surveillance state.

  18. I dunno about this one – a space cannon ffs!!!

    Built by the Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXA), the space cannon’s job is to fire off a 1.8kg metal projectile into the catchily named 1999JU3 asteroid, giving the previously attached space probe access to all that sweet, sweet asteroid soil.

    Hayabusa 2 is scheduled to arrive at its target mid-2018, and we won’t have the soil samples back on Earth until sometime in 2019.


    I like the science but, well, I watched moonraker the other night…

    • weka 19.1

      You watched moonraker?! Why?

      “Hayabusa 2 is scheduled to arrive at its target mid-2018, and we won’t have the soil samples back on Earth until sometime in 2019.”

      There’s an opportunity there for someone to do a projection comparison re Peak Oil and AGW 😉

  19. lprent 20

    Site upgraded to wordpress 3.7. That has to be the fastest upgrade ever. Worked well on all betas and the quick test today.

  20. greywarbler 21

    Just been to the supermarket. The Budget soap is made in CHINA. Boy they sure cleaned up. Boom boom.

    I have a memorial pack of McLeods soap once made in Dunedin, by McLeods I suppose. Then I think mine was made in Petone. Any offers for this artifact of ancient NZ when simple people made things for themselves? Then of course the bigwigs decided that was just effete and primitive thinking, and we should all make our living tapping out clever things on keyboards. Like at the present! What offer do I have for this clever thing….

  21. greywarbler 22

    Chris Trotter writing on the new work testing by Minimum of SockDeviation here in Nz.

    The people behind these reforms know that there are simply not enough jobs to socially integrate the tens-of-thousands of “jobseekers” currently registered on the MSD’s books. And yet, they have no intention of following the example set by previous New Zealand Governments, in which the state itself provided the jobs so necessary to people’s health and wellbeing.
    What they propose to do, instead, is force as many jobseekers as possible off the MSD’s books. They will achieve this objective by turning the experience of being on the MSD’s books into a nightmare of bureaucratic harassment and social stigmatisation.


    It is reminiscent of George Orwell’s The Road to Wigan Pier. In that there were bands of people kept tramping round the country looking for work and not being able to stay more than one or two days in one place. He talks about being in Salvation Army care, where they had to have prayers before eating though very hungry. Of one person after another sharing bath water until it was like a watery bog. He comments that there is little comfort, even the women tramping refuse to have sex. I think that may be a male-centred thought.

  22. ak 23

    And for how much again are we bankrolling our fearless attourney general to sue a penniless man of the cloth for $1.2 mill? Kapai, Chris, know where you are now brother.

  23. Morrissey 24

    Possibly the worst statement ever on the Panel
    —-and it’s by a “Professor of Legal Ethics”

    The Panel, Thursday 24/10/13 (Part TWO of TWO)
    Jim Mora, Michael Deaker, Chris Trotter

    PART ONE: http://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-24102013/#comment-716126

    JIM MORA: Now we turn to the ethics of gassing as opposed to droning. Two new reports have ben issued by Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch. Most disturbing was the story of Mamana Bibi, a 68-year-old grandmother killed by a Hellfire missile while tending her garden. The ethics of gassing versus droning in a moment with Professor Tim Dare, but before he comes on, do you think we’ve been under a bit of a false impression with regard to these drones?
    CHRIS TROTTER: Oh I think so. There is an argument there, there is no question about that. If you could guarantee that you could kill these terrorists and insurgents, there would be no problem. But you can’t. The Americans are building up trouble for themselves, because the locals are not intimidated, they are enraged.
    MICHAEL DEAKER: It is a bestial way of running a foreign policy. There’s a place for this new technology but it sure is not for killing.
    JIM MORA: Professor Tim Dare is on the program. Hi Tim.
    PROFESSOR TIM DARE: Hi Jim, hi Chris, hi Michael.
    JIM MORA: How come you can use drones to blow people to kingdom come but it’s unacceptable for other countries to use gas?
    PROFESSOR TIM DARE: [slowly, carefully, with gravitas] Well, I guess it is because the countries that have nuclear weapons and drones don’t need to use poison gas. It sounds like the critics of terrorism: the powerful countries that condemn terrorism don’t need to use it. ….

    I have excised the rest of a rather rambling speech in order to focus on that quite extraordinary assertion, viz. “the powerful countries that condemn terrorism don’t need to use it.”

    Since it began in 2005, regular listeners to The Panel have been subjected to some staggeringly ignorant statements [1]. They have listened in dismay to Panelists snickering at the plight of victims of state repression [2]. They have suffered a plethora of lazy, complacent [3] and/or hateful [4] statements. When it comes to selecting guests, there seems to be no base level of stupidity or depravity below which Jim Mora’s producers are not prepared to sink [5]. But in spite of all that, I believe that statement—“the powerful countries that condemn terrorism don’t need to use it”—uttered by a “Professor of Legal Ethics”, no less, might just be the worst, the most ignorant, the stupidest, the most depraved of all of them.

    It’s a sad sign of both the intellectual level and the moral tone of this program that not one of the others—neither the host nor his two guests—picked up on what the “Professor of Legal Ethics” said. None of them even demurred at the statement. But on the other hand at least none of them murmured assent. Possibly they were simply rendered speechless; truly bizarre statements can have that effect [6].

    It’s pretty hard to envision much worse than Tim Dare’s dishonest and irresponsible words, but Jim Mora came close a short time later…..

    CHRIS TROTTER: We have heard plenty of criticism of the Assad regime, but nobody dares to criticize Israel’s nuclear arsenal.
    MORA: [caviling tone] Yeah but is that an entirely fair comparison? Because what would happen to Israel’s security if it did not have those weapons?

    Jim Mora’s insincere, spurious and cynical expostulation had the same effect as Tim Dare’s learned observation that powerful states don’t use terror: neither Chris Trotter nor Michael Deaker dignified it with a response.

    [1] http://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-03092013/#comment-690908
    [2] http://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-16072013/#comment-663663
    [3] http://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-24062013/#comment-653263

    Open mike 2/09/2013

    [4] http://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-03092013/#comment-690908
    [5] http://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-12082013/#comment-678579
    [6] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cy4-snbDcIM
    If you would like to see the issue of state terror discussed by a couple of people far more serious, well informed and thoughtful than Professor Tim Dare or Jim Mora, watch how Dr. Norman Finkelstein schools a bewildered reporter from the scurrilous Murdoch rag the New York Post….

    …and listen to Professor Noam Chomsky talking about the massive use of terror by Western states, something which Professor Dare reckons is not needed by the most powerful states…..

  24. FYI

    Solicitor-General to to ‘assume responsibility for the prosecution’ of Mr Banks.

    “25 October 2013

    Dear Ms Bright and Ms Prager

    New Zealand Private Prosecution Service Ltd vs the Honorable John Archibald Banks:
    Request for Solicitor-General intervention: Our Ref SOL 115/2464

    Thank you for your email of 21 October 2013 requesting that I intervene in the private prosecution of Mr Banks.

    I have written to the District Court at Auckland today, advising of my decision to assume responsibility for the prosecution.

    Yours faithfully,

    Crown Law
    Michael Heron
    Solicitor-General ”


    (A copy of this letter should be up soon on http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com )


    Penny Bright

  25. Draco T Bastard 26

    You been playing with the gravatars again LPrent?

    • Morrissey 26.1

      Although it lacks the classical elegance and gravitas of my old avatar, I have to say that I love my new one! I’m impressed how the avatars kind of match the posters, in the same way dogs look like their owners. Especially appropriate are the ones for: Te Reo Putake, greywarbler, weka, McFlock and The Al1en.

      Only one has not changed: Felix. He retains the solid black square, befitting his role as a sinister dark eminence on this board.

      How did he manage to escape the reshuffle?

  26. Thanks, don’t know whether to be flattered or not.
    MS paint and two of Dell’s old style alienware laptop logos.
    A bit of a copy and paste, a resize and image copyright is now held by me.

    Happy to license usage to Dell in exchange for a customised, top of the line music production notebook. 🙂

    But McF does look good with his monocle.

  27. ghostrider888 28


  28. captain hook 29

    who is the geek?

  29. dv 30

    What is my avatar?
    I look very aggressive.

  30. Murray Olsen 31

    Does my avatar suggest I’m a deep cover Pentagon agent?

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