sigh two of my colleagues received freshly minted 90 day notices yesterday… Landlords selling up due to changes…. I guess the changes are having the desired effect not so good for solo mums thrust back into the exploding rental market…
Yeah its not alot of fun… effects schooling as well end up having to look in the same zone… expensive to time off… moving costs… finding bond… tenancy services is running behind on bond refunds by the sounds…
Pretty worried for one of them piles more shit on…
Hoping but not holding my breath that govt will move quickly to help renters… to my mind if you make renters rights really strong you deflate the market anyway… would put anyone in it for the short term off…
Unfortunately there will be a few landlords that decide to cash up now which was always going to happen as an unintended consequence. I fear these announcements may not be good for renters as rents will increase. Hopefully your colleagues can find another place but there is a shortage of rental places in many areas, thus the problem we have.
I actually have a nice landlord story. A friend of mine the landlord has cut down 2 big trees, cost 8k so the homes are warmer. Landlord said he was not selling.
Usually when costly land shaping is done either selling or a rent rise is in the horizon.
I do have nosy extractor fan issues 24/7 where I live due to a house divided into 3 tenancies with 6 people. Loud footsteps and doors banging can also annoy me and keep me up or wake me up.
The rental market is so tight and I have had the experience of the landlord selling and needing to move out. I had the last laugh they sold for 200k 4 1/2 years ago and the place is now worth 400k.
Some landlords might find the price of their home dropping. I do give a thought to those struggling to pay the rent and this cannot continue.
Agree Cricklewood. Renters rights need to be very strong. Rent freeze, long tenancies. Evictions only for anti social activities that bother the neighbours or destroy property.
I do also think it is a good sign if landlords are selling up(although very sorry for your friends). Hopefully too many who thought they would buy property to invest, changing their minds…
How are landlords selling good? Those who rent and will never be able to buy where do they go ? Perhaps into the waiting list for a HNZ property and with the demand there. With obvious outcomes where is the govts action on coping with the consequences? A plan to build more in the future. When and what if those living in the present ???!
Thereon lies the big flaw in the govts announcement, it may slow house price inflation which has runaway but they did nothing to help renters at the same time… once again its help for the upwardly mobile.
Further stiffening the rights of renters particularly around giving notice needed to be part of the package…
Something like this from Switzerland perhaps…
Tenants have the right to know the grounds for termination. Notices of termination not made in good faith (such as notice of termination because the landlord is exercising his landlord's right, or on account of the tenants' changed family circumstances) may be contested before the conciliation authority. The official notice form explains how tenants should proceed when disputing a termination.
If the termination is likely to cause undue hardship for the tenants (financial or family difficulties, housing shortage), an extension of the term of the tenancy may be applied for at the conciliation authority.
The other oversight I would add that in Feb 21 the average property in me rose $50,000 and our leaders talk of substainable price rises going forward 🤷♀️. Not of the damage done in recent times.
I am yet to read anything or contributor here as to what this country looks like in 3,5+ years . IMO that outlook would frustrate many . As J Ritren sang “ no future, no future for me ..”
well done to the govt for being seen to do something but deliver crap all.
Couple of ways….if the property was being held empty for capital gain it adds to the available stock….if the property was being used as an AirBnB, it adds to available stock.
If future rental stock is available at a lower price the pressure to reduce rents is increased, but most important of all, the realisation that property values are no longer a one way bet will bring some sanity back to the housing market and allow us to use housing as it should be….to house our population, not as a credit line for the few who seek to extract wealth from the many (and the broader economy)
There is no point in investors s buying property for a capital gain if there is no (or a CPI equivalent) capital gain….that capital will seek a new home, especially if they see their existing gains disappearing in a falling market.
In short, investors selling is a symptom of changed expectations….and that is beneficial to both FHB AND renters.
Has extending the brightline test and cutting the tax reduction on interest turned into a house being like a car sitting in the garage for years not knowing what you can sell it for?
The housing market hopefully is going to cool by 10%. This is advantageous to everyone BUT the seller.
Id suggest what the extended BL test and (especially) the change to interest deductibility have done is increase the costs to investors while they wait for the capital gain…it is a signal that if you are investing in existing property for capital gain then we are going to make it hard for you…especially when aligned with the exemption for new builds….that makes the business model for many investors, especially recent investors who have paid high prices, unworkable.
There are pretty much two questions that we are waiting to see the answer to….how many investment properties will re enter the market?…and will the Government stick to its position, or will they soften their message?
"The housing market hopefully is going to cool by 10%. This is advantageous to everyone BUT the seller."
Dont think anyone can put a percentage on it…there are too many variables, but the sellers will not necessarily lose …if you bought your rental say 6 years ago and you sell now you take out that capital gain of around maybe 60-80% (median house 2014 $457000—median house price 2020 $725000) and not subject to BL….not a bad return Id suggest.
Hopefully the latest changes put a brake on property investors who only buy to sell due to house prices rocketing.
Government cannot soften their message because nothing else has worked. It's a vicious cycle as renters now need more government assistance to pay the rent and landlords know this.
1. How to support people to pay the rent without it going into the landlords hand is what needs to be actioned?
2. Some sort of tier percentage system on when the rental was purchased and how much the rent can increase?
Rent caps or other forms of rent control are another option but I suspect that would only be used if there is widespread rent hikes….and as noted yesterday many landlords have already had their annual shot at rent hikes so they cant till the years is up….I dont think many of them will wait until next year to decide what to do.
I think that, before evicting a tenant or increasing his rent, a landlord should be required to apply to Kainga Ora for a review of the situation to determine whether the eviction/rent increase would be justified. I would regard the recovery of the no longer deductible interest as not constituting an adequate reason for either action.
I’ve always wondered about banning tenders in the sale process. It creates a lot of anxiety which I reckon drives up the selling price as FOMO pushes people to put in bids way above the estimated value
Auctions get the second best price (the winner only has to outbid the second best bid not bid with their top offer). Tenders means the seller gets the best price because everyone has to put in their best offer.
And this morning the deputy PM had fuelled the fire by “not ruling out rent freezes”. So what will landlords do … hike the rents as much as they can in the meantime to kick off any rent controls from a higher base.
However the deputy PMs credibility went from hero to zero this week so maybe we can just ignore him and carry on.
"investors have been offered a generous exit package"
Indeed – they get to keep the extraordinary wealth passively accumulated at the expense of others (including future generations) over the last two decades – minus a short blip post-GFC. Does anyone dare to go after some of this deplorable stash with a wealth tax – maybe to help fund a large state house building programme?
The wealth accumulated in the last couple of decades is going to perpetuate unequal access to housing into the next generation through inheritance. I don't see it as retribution so much as correcting market perversity and returning to a slightly more level playing field. I do agree though that the primary purpose of a wealth tax is not raising revenue and that state house building is not tax take-constrained.
Not entirely sure how say 5 separate people being forced out of a flat due to rent rises from this, for the sake of one of the few couples left, who manage to buy the flat as a home helps the 5 separate people find more affordable flats, when there are obviously less of them and the sudden demand, means the rent will just go up even more.
People to me seem to forget some people will just never be able to afford to own a house, and have to rent.
I dont forget that at all…and is why property prices (and consequently rents) need to fall to affordable levels….10+ times median income is not that.
"But she said there were warning signs beneath the surface and many people were still doing it tough. More than a third were still living “payday to payday”.
“We know we are not out of the woods yet, there are more Covid-19 effects to roll through the economy and this research highlights some concerns. The fact that more than a third of people have less than a single week’s expenses available to them and almost half have less than $1000 in rainy day savings rings alarm bells for me. This puts them in a potentially vulnerable position."
There are going to be people selling flats to couples (or other investers who sit on them for 10 years) or raising rents, to cover it, which means less flats available, which means even higher rent prices.
You can argue all you like the rents will be too high for people to cover it, but this just means more people joing the state housing waiting list, which is getting immense.
If first home buyers buy the properties landlords sell and prospective landlords change their minds and don’t but, those first home buyers will no longer need a rental. Good
For your info Pat these investors still have an advantage – Rates, maintenance etc are still able to be deducted for a reduction of tax and still allows a cash back advantage.
And what many have not understood these recent increases in price also distance new home purchasers with an increase of an already substantial deposit required. In feb the average price of a property increased by $50,000 a 20% deposit means that these 1st Home buyers in 28 days now required another $10,000 in deposit, and think what the impact of the increases that were achieved pre Feb 21??
And all of that explains why prices must fall or we consign home ownership in NZ to the dustbin.(and the likely exodus of our youth offshore….again)
The Gov have been bolder than I initially thought with this package and appear willing to accept a fall in property prices although they havnt explicitly said so…my guess is they would be happy for them to revert to what they were around a year ago ….good luck controlling the decline, theyll probably be the first in history if they pull it off, but at least theyre trying.
I dont rent but some of my children do, so do some of my friends and who knows circumstances may decide that one day I will….why is it so difficult to understand that peoples motives are not necessarily self serving?
This economic model is destroying everything that was best about this country/society so you may find that many of that 65% are quite happy for the 10% of the population who are investors to lose their gravy train…especially when it is wrecking their communities
My house value could fall 50% tomorrow and I wouldnt care, nor would my mother if hers did similarly, 50% may cause a problem for one of my children but theyd survive….dont forget roughly a third of properties in NZ are mortgage free.
"So to clarify, do house price falls only affect 0.3% of the population as you claim Pat?"
Obviously not, and the size of the fall will be determinant however you were asking about how voters would view house price falls and I gave you a couple of voters perspectives.
While there are potential downsides to property price falls there are also upsides so what is the net position?…not just for individuals but the economy as a whole.
And if the expectation is the current trajectory is unsustainable then the correction will happen anyway….and the greater the debt the bigger the impact when it does.
Some pain today or lots of pain tomorrow?
I know every investors thinks they will be out before that happens but history shows most mistime it.
Actually David I know of many many fhb who have the deposit, but keep missing out due to investors. They will now have far less competition and will be able to secure their own first home.
What I don't get about investors bleating on about interest payments no longer being tax deductable is that any good business person who took out a loan at record low interest rates should have forecasted in a potential for interest rates to increase substantially, or even for the govt to make interest no longer tax deductable. Any person with half a brain who is investing should have factored that in.. They took the risk, things change, too bad.
And yes bring on a rent freeze. Or even better a national rent strike.
Sounds awesome – that could highlight/solve a lot of issues.
The case for a rent strike in New Zealand under COVID-19 Nevertheless, there is still a key difference between these landlords and renters: if things get really bad, they can always sell their house to pay their bills. Renters don’t have that option. This is the true class difference between those who own private property and those who don’t. It’s about material security, not varying levels of personal greed.
2, 4, 6, 8
we don’t want to pay our bills in a commy state
Nice one David – cue the dancing Cossacks. Tbh, I don't know what Muldoon was so het up about. National governments always 'transfer' public assets into private hands – it's what they do.
One 'problem' facing a fairly sizable minority of NZ citizens is the inability to pay for the necessities of life, wouldn't you agree? Maybe inequality in NZ has gone a little too far…
Why poverty in New Zealand is everyone's concern
Liang describes poverty as a "heritable condition" that perpetuates and amplifies through generations: "It is also not hard to see how individual poverty flows into communities and society, with downstream effects on economics, crime and health, as well as many other systems. Loosen one strand and everything else unravels."
A Kete Half Empty Poverty is your problem, it is everyone's problem, not just those who are in poverty. – Rebecca, a child from Te Puru
Wrong target David. It is land speculators who have been getting a free ride at the expense of tenants, people who need a home and those of us who do pay taxes.
"Communism" is fine when they benefit, it seems.
If we all end up paying much higher interest rates, it will be because of their borrowing also.
Coincidentally, they released their Annual Report on Friday in which that information was made available to the public. Have you read the report? The photos of pristine New Zealand nature wouldn’t go amiss in a NZ Travel & Tourism brochure or a publication by DOC, all super-neutral, of course.
I know the identities of two NZers (maybe three) who were working for a 'foreign agency' in the 1970s and 1980s. They infiltrated the NZ Labour Party. Since the country concerned was a close geographical ally I guess that was alright. They could do what they liked and harass whoever they liked.
Please don’t even go there, thanks. Some other commenter might be stupid enough to put this site at risk and that would be a real shame, don’t you agree?
So why is this happening, all over the country it seems?
It its not just short staffed, it is arrivals at hospital for treatment have vastly increased – especially for this time of the year.
Is it the same cause as the housing crises we have and clogged up Auckland streets – ie far too many new immigrants have been allowed into NZ over the last 20 years ?
Is it the Baby Boomer generation aging ?
Have we not been training enough of our own nurses and doctors?
The A & E model needs to change so serious cases are triaged and a separate clinic run like a GP clinic adjacent to the premises. Fully staffed GP clinics need to run over the weekend at no extra cost.
More doctors and nurses are required. A shortage of specialists as well.
There needs to be a change in the way health care is delivered.
When someone is referred to ED/clinic etc the next steps must be available at the same time. eg Cat/MRI scan, Xray, dietician/nutrionist, mental health…
Folk often struggle to take that morning/afternoon/hour off as it is without scheduling further engagements.
I do like your answers at 5.3, gsays; enough so that I won't spoil them by replying directly.
But another cause behind the ED bottleneck is the drain of nurses to MIQ, vaccination, and more rewarding private work. Public health work conditions, in Dunedin hospital at least, are apparently pretty grim at the best of times for them.
The 2 ED nurses I know that are/were doing the MIQ stuff, where either working in Oz (clinic work in a remote town) or looking to exit health and grow their small dingo/digger truck business.
Both have talked about dismay with junior/inexperienced staff, cultural politics and being too busy, too often.
“Is it the same cause as the housing crises we have and clogged up Auckland streets – ie far too many new immigrants have been allowed into NZ over the last 20 years ?”"
A lot of the aforementioned immigrants, are staffing the wards and EDs. This may influence the militancy/stauchness of the workforce, therefore the nursing unions.
“Is it the Baby Boomer generation aging ? ”
Yes, along with increased presentations of folk who cant afford to see a GP, drug seekers, alcohol impaired, mental ill health, entitlitis etc.
“Have we not been training enough of our own nurses and doctors?”
Yes. Nor do we pay them well enough.
“What is the root cause ?”
Neo-liberalism. Letting a market decide. When your DHB has a Chief Executive Officer as the highest paid on the payroll, its a sign of the times.
A random meeting between the self-centred driven entrepreneurs being lauded in this country, trying hard to acquire enough custom from those with spare everything, and someone who has to count the pennies to get near that lifestyle and resents being pushed to the fringes.
And this is just a light touch on the cheek from the group finding social mobility difficult to achieve, tantalisingly available and then removed, perhaps in the 'gig' economy, or regularly denied and facing deprivation. Below such people are a mass who are at their wit's end, lacking wit for some time actually, becoming hopeless, munted, angry and holding in vengeful thoughts, just.
I saw this while looking for a source of retirement income apart from the traditional residential property, exchange traded shares, funds and fixed interest.
"We’re on a mission to simplify investment into high growth Kiwi companies.
"We want to make the capital market work much more efficiently for growth companies, so they can focus on selling their products to the world. We want to provide investors with a simple way to gain exposure to interesting investment opportunities – facilitating the flow of national savings into wealth-creating assets.
We’re driven by the significant positive impact we can make by building a thriving marketplace to connect growth companies with the capital they need.
Along the way we hope to develop the general financial literacy of the New Zealand public, and bring far more meaning and excitement to investing."
This shit should be a massive red flag for the left. Actually for everyone. Next time you see a woman being told that no-one is stopping them from speaking about their reality, understand that this is what is now routine in academia and has been increasing for quite some time. In another decade we, women, will have lost our ability to academic freedom around our own realities, and it's not like we were in a great place to begin with. And it won't end with women.
No McFlook, it looks like cancel culture to me. And it pisses me off because it is cancelling the existence of the women's liberation movement and menstruating at the very least.
“I was encouraged to abandon about the problems menstruation posed ……..because it was deemed trans exclusionary.”
I would be interested to hear you views on what I have written below.
Most academic institutions have an appeals process if someone feels they have been penalised unfairly or inconsistently.
As for your comments below, one doesn't have to be male to perv at women, so it's not as if self-id would automatically stop police or anyone else objecting to someone behaving objectionably.
And no, zoom-calling in a conference room isn't "kosher". It might even be a criminal offence (intimate visual recording).
btw, I’ll be offline for several hours very soon – I should have held off rather than getting into a discussion.
Actually McFlook you are discounting my concerns about having men who id as women in changing rooms with your glib comment about “One doesn’t have to be a man to perv at women”. I am sure I have shared many a changing room with lesbians (guess that’s who you are referring to) and I have never felt uncomfortable about any women’s behaviour in a change room. I have also NEVER heard of police being called to women’s objectionable behaviour towards other women in a change room. It is a completely different dynamic with a man. Also women often walk around without towels etc in a change room. If gender self id “women” who were really men did this it would be very unpleasant. Surely you have heard about flashers. But how could it be proved “she” just walking from the shower to “her” locker.
I think women will feel really concerned about this, even if you men can’t imagine how that will be for a women. You have never lived with the unwanted male gaze. Have you not read the paper about how many time men have been filming women in bathrooms changerooms etc????
As for flashing in the changing rooms, sure, the possibilities for human stupidity are limitless. Some non-trans guy might try it. How do you see that conversation with the cops or changing room staff going down, realistically?
Flashing in a public change room human stupidity????? WTF McFlook. That jut tells me you know nothing about what it is like being a women. Your o.k. for men who have changed their gender to do these things and of course the police/change room staff with make it o.k………..Think by this stage the horse has bolted. If the "woman" acts like other women in the change rooms, then there will be nothing that can be done about it. All they have to do is walk from the shower to their locker without a towel with or without an erection and they are women right? Police could probably say wear a towel mate, but can't enforce.
Thinking that self-id will avoid any repercussion is the stupidity part of it.
So we have a flasher of the subtle breed who are acting completely normally without eye contact to see what reaction they're getting? Ok, not the usual type I've had to call the cops over back in the day, but ok. Assuming there is nothing, nothing, to show dodgy intent, they can still be barred by the facility because of their behaviour, because it makes other people uncomfortable.
Point is McFlook, I don't want men in women's changing rooms. Full stop. Most women I have run this by feel the same.
I understand you side with the gender self id bill/trans rights side. Yours entitled to your opinion. But I don't think your opinion on how its going to operate in women's changing rooms has any merit. It can't have. You have never been in one (I hope except maybe when you were a child).
I didn't need to go into the women's room to control access, catch flashers, or see how people dealt with men who thought they were discriminated against because they weren’t allowed to run for women's rep positions.
The idea that self-id makes facilities management and the police powerless to deal with offensive behaviour just isn't reflected in the real world.
But transwomen being unsafe in one changing room and unwelcome in the other? That is reflected in the real world.
"Most academic institutions have an appeals process if someone feels they have been penalised unfairly or inconsistently."
This tells me that you have no idea what is actually going on. Academics are afraid to speak out. This isn't hyperbole. The ones that do get their office doors pissed on, they get rape and death threats, they lose their careers. The women more than the men of course. To suggest that in this environment an appeals process is going to be useful other than as a political act is incredibly naive.
What’s happening on the left is the dismissal and the position that there is no debate, so there is no way for the issues to be aired and resolved. That too should be a big fucking red flag for the left. It’s not like the left is immune to authoritarianism.
This tells me that you have no idea what is actually going on.
It's a bit unfair to post links about getting marked down in assignments and then argue that anyone who responds should be responding to unmentioned but more serious complaints.
Try writing a paper about a steady-state model of the universe sometime (as opposed to "Big Bang" theory), and see how that gets marked.
good to know you are ok with academia redefining feminism to mean a liberation movement for all people and educating its students to that effect against the wishes of many feminists including MA students.
I mean, it's always enlightening when men give away women's rights. Again. Maybe try putting up some actual arguments, I'd love to know where this goes. Feminist academics are raising the issue, and men are going, yeah, nah, nothing to worry about there.
When you can not conduct a study on women (biological or trans) and you can not discuss the impact of menstruation and menstruation products when in this country we have young vaginal beings not going to school for lack of menstruation products (and maybe there even is a trans boy or five in the group ) then academia is getting dumb, and discriminatory. Cause women who identify as women and would like to get treated as such exist. And we too would like to be identified as to our on self ID. And we would like our rights, and our safety taken seriously, cause we die the world over often at the hand of penis humans.
And i would just venture a guess that you have never refused an outing or been refused a promotion a job or such on the grounds that you may get your period, or that you may get pregnant, or that you may have given birth, or that you may have lost a pregnancy.
So really please, take your male privilege and ask yourself why women who identify as women, who were born as women, who have born literally every man that is, need to take what little rights we have gained over the last hundred years and give it up to accomodate and be surplanted by trans women. Cause the discussion is only affecting women.
Is this a discussion about a seat of the table and only 10 seats are there, so one needs to be knocked of to free up a seat? Or will this be a discussion about finding another seat and adding it the table?
McFlook then what do you see as the solution for trans women in changing rooms? What if women aren't comfortable with this?
Every concern and reservation I have have had about the gender self id bill you have dismissed. It sounds like you think women like me and there are many of us should put up and shut up. Is this how you see it?
You can see why as feminists it is a double problem for us. A. Maybe we don't want trans women in our change rooms. B. Men such as yourself seem to be dismissing this.
You also didn't answer whether you though it was a credible scenario that men would change their sex to have easy access to women and children. Is that o.k. by you because we can ring the police?
1: Trans women already use womens' changing rooms.
2: I have also listened to other non-trans women who disagree with your position. And trans women, and trans men. I suspect that you are, as they say, "on the wrong side of history", and quite possibly the legislation will change within months, regardless of any arguments here.
3: Some feminists and non-trans women agree with you. Others disagree with you. There does not seem to be any middle ground on this issue.
4: "Credible"? 2.5 million men, sure. Someone might try changing their birth certificate as an excuse to get unchallenged access to women and children. Will it work? Significantly less likely. Will it result in greater harm than if 50,000-odd trans people are policed about which changing rooms they go into regardless of birth certificate, not even including instances of non-trans women being challenged because they don't conform to feminine norms? I don't think so. That's why I have the position I have.
“Being on the wrong side of history” would never stop me from supporting a cause I believe in. Standing up for women’s rights is not something I d we oils drop because I might be on the wrong side of history.
but thanks to discussion on this blog and to you I have become better informed. What I have discovered about these issues worries me more. How debate/women’s voices are being silenced. Only this weekend gone at the pride event in Wellington a woman who is a lesbian who has terminal cancer was on a stall at the event. She left the stall briefly to take scissors and tape to a group of “reefs” in this case elderly lesbians who had been banned from pride who were protesting outside. In trying to re-gain entry 4 organisers including a very large male person intercepted her, accused her of carrying an offensive weapon. She still had her bag at the stall. She stood up to them and refused to budge. They man handled her and called the police. These older women have fought the good fight for lesbian and gay rights. What sort of treatment is this? Young people gathered and started chanting fucking terfs. An aggressive and vocal minority is shutting women’s. Voices down
Btw in the last week two cases of trans being barred from women’s changing rooms
Yes I think that is reasonably accurate, i.e. a generation divide.
Having read a bit more about it i.e. trans issues, I understand and feel free to disagree, that a lot of the children who identify as trans have other mental health issues such as anorexia and self harm. They also experience gender dysphoria. An approach that has been encouraged with their parents is to validate their wanting to be a different sex. This started to occur 20 years ago and so now we have a generation of young people who identify as trans. This I don't believe has ever happened before. From this point of view I acknowledge how very vulnerable some of these individuals must feel.
My perspective is a rigorous radical campaign has been mounted for trans rights, including the right to say there are real women. My understanding is if this is challenged is it vociferously, aggressively shot down. I think there is an enormous amount of solidarity in numbers group think going on.
I noticed McFlook that someone accused you of mysogeny and others implied as a man you shouldn't be taking about this issue. But I don't want to stop you from doing this, because this is a part of what I am objecting to with the trans activists. People have their voices shot down/cancelled.
You are still denying that trans is actually a thing. A while ago i said that i see this as where the gay thing was forty years ago. Back then there was still a lot of people who saw being gay as a mental illness. Now when people say that they are not taken seriously, they are considered bigots. So yes the wrong side of history you are on this i think also.
It is not surprising that trans people experience mental health issues with so many people denying their identity is real:
Cheers – the accusation did give me pause for thought, but that's usually a good thing.
The issue of trans kids and their mental health has a fair bit of research, which is why validation starts early. The main worry is suicide and depression. But are these comorbidities, or are they the consequences of social responses to how trans people are treated by society? When social discrimination is killing people, there's a strong campaign for rights for those people. And trans people have been part of the queer rights movement all the way back to before Stonewall.
I have friends with trans kids (in both directions). The kids and young adults seem to be happier now than my peers from back at the same age who have since transitioned. But also the young thesps just seem more fluid and accepting of themselves and each other, by and large. Still dramas (natch lol), but less judgy of each other's bits and more willing to stand up for each other (although they still have the young person thing of going overboard without thinking, maybe like in responding to that protest you mentioned).
The babies my friends had in their early twenties are leaving/left the nest. They generally seem to be better people than I was (and many of my peer group) at that age.
I am not sure where you get that I am still denying trans is a thing Solkta. Please let me know.
you are entitled to think it like where the gay thing was forty years ago. I accept that is your view. I see it differently. Gay people were not telling me they were really heterosexual nor were they deconstructing my identity, eg referring to me as a person who f…Ed men.
I was still a heterosexual woman.
I don’t believe I have ever been anything but pleasant and respectful when I have met trans people. You then accused me of being disrespectful about them on-line, but when challenged didn’t provide any evidence that I had been. I did a check with Mc flook who said I hadn’t been.
I am still reading and finding out about this stuff.
I am a feminist and hearing things about elderly lesbians being banned from pride, because they are not prepared to say trans women (not those who have transitioned) are real women. Said women who have been attending pride since it began don’t deserve to have 100 or so young people chanting fucking terfs at them.
there was a woman who happens to have terminal cancer who was staffing a stall at pride. She went out to give the protesters some tape and scissors for their banner, and when she went to go back in 4 people including a large man tried to man handle her out of the venue. She stood her ground and so they called the police. Utterly disgraceful in my opinion. Also because she had scissors caused her of carrying an offensive weapon. I mean ffs. This is disgraceful. She told them she had cancer.
I accept mental health issues are significant in the trans community. I did comment that they were vulnerable. Btw, I do have a criticism of the study. It really needed to have a control group of non trans young people, rather than extrapolating from other studies.
I still think we need to look at the Dunedin multi disciplinary study for gold standard research on this issue.
Surveying trans people and comparing their responses with previous and more general surveys might be the spanner for that job, rather than the dunedin study.
Can't see anything searching their journal publications database. But if you see an article you don't have access to, we might be able to sort something out between us. I could remember how to use dropbox, or flip email it to a mod and they can flip it to you, if willing. There's also an openaccess research site somewhere (like pirating movies, but for academic research because journals cost $$$).
a lot of the children who identify as trans have other mental health issues such as anorexia and self harm.
That can only be taken to mean that you consider being trans to be a mental health issue. If that is not what you meant then why say "other"? You say offensive things and then complain when people are offended.
DSMV1 talks about gender dysphoria. and I assume that many Trans people have gender dysphoria. This would cause psychological distress.
I don't deny trans is a thing. Checked out some trans activist blog sites tonight as I was trying to become more informed.
When I trained it was called Gender Identity disorder.
You seem to want to cast me as anti trans. This is not true. I don't really care too much. But I do care about how women's voices are being shut down and how my identity as a women is being de-constructed.
Would it help if we (again) re-acquainted ourselves with the meanings of the words "sex" and "gender"?
SUFW prefers (and why not?) the United Nations' definitions….
…it is our recommendation that New Zealand policy makers adopt definitions set up by United Nations Equality Glossary (2017). In particular, we suggest the following:
Sex (biological sex)
The physical and biological characteristics that distinguish males and females.
Gender
Gender refers to the roles, behaviours, activities, and attributes that a given society at a given time considers appropriate for men and women. In addition to the social attributes and opportunities associated with being male and female and the relationships between women and men and girls and boys, gender also refers to the relations between women and those between men. These attributes, opportunities and relationships are socially constructed and are learned through socialisation processes. They are context/time-specific and changeable. Gender determines what is expected, allowed and valued in a woman or a man in a given context.
Sex, what you were born with, is forever. It can't be changed.
It is possible with a great deal of medical and surgical intervention to alter one's appearance so as to look like the other sex, but you'll still be the sex you were born with.
Gender, on the other hand, has forever been whatever society/culture/fashion tries to dictate. Today it is possible to express yourself in whatever way floats your boat. Good on you.
But just because you dislike wearing frocks and would not be seen dead in stilettos,and putting on make-up seems like an act of dishonesty, it does not necessarily follow that you were 'born into the wrong body'.
Today, and because many women have fought long and hard to throw of the shackles of what we used to term 'sex-role-stereotypes', you can be yourself without have to resort to extreme medical and surgical interventions.
What The Bill intends is to make the impossible…changing one's sex…possible.
If you had any insight into how the women reading this are assessing you I'm sure you would be horrified. But honestly you clearly have no idea and little insight. It's good really seeing frank misogyny laid bare. Dissolves any illusion we can't unsee it either.
Having done an English degree a little over a decade ago, I ran across a little of this. Our feedback system had no box for us to object to it – but I felt it was a gratuitously offensive waste of time at my and other students' expense. If I'd wanted to do gender wars, I'd've taken a course in it – my expectations were literary, a bit of Trollope maybe. No surprise that the humanities have been obliged to downsize.
Thanks Weka for posting this. We need to speak up about this sort of shit.
I commented last week about the gender self id bill and have written to the Minister about this.
Our identity as women is being deconstructed. I read today that the term maternity care and being a mother is being challenged as the language needs to be more inclusive. As is not just women giving birth.
I have been thinking about how sexist this is. I don't know of the equivalent i.d men being referred to as people who get erections or people who ejaculate. Yet there is an attempt to describe women as menstruaters or birthing units, or people with vaginas.
My go to for the best information is the Dunedin Multidisciplinary study. I say this because it is a prospective study that measures health and social outcomes. I would be interested to know what the rates of trans people there are in this cohort who are now in their 40s. Unfortunately I. have not been able to find out about whether that has been published or not. I suspect the rate is extremely low.
I am also objecting to the term Terf. When one group (trans activists) give another group a pejoritive label then it is deeply problematic to say the least.
More on this, I commented last week about the gender self id bill and some people poo pooed what I said.
Anybody dare to tell me that it is fanciful to imagine a scenario where sex offenders (and other men who might want to film women changing or peeing but don't have a criminal recored), change their gender to become a women. Then merrily waltz in to changing rooms at gyms, pools, woman's stores etc. They are free to perv at women and girls, free to expose themselves to women. And then when women call the cops, the cops can only say, sorry but he is a woman. This week alone there appears to be some sort of fracas with a "person" who had the body of a man being restrained by cops because of some incident in Glasons. There was also a report about David Farrar (yes I know I have no time for him) but he was in a male change room at the gym and some goof was on a zoom conference call. Farrar wasn't sure whether it was kosher or not
That is a very worthwhile read, thank you. Thought she said things very clearly.
I still believe people retain rights generally to set their own personal boundaries, individually and in groups. I, for example, avoid being in company with proudly public misogynists, but – crucially – I do not assume that every man I meet is in silent sympathy with them either. I would expect to be described as unfairly harsh if I did so, and this is where those holding exclusionary stances sometimes seem to want the impossible – to not be criticised when taking judgmental stances, especially when some of those stances involve not just social exclusion but the denial of civil rights.
I can only speak for myself Sacha, but what civil rights do you think I am denying?
What Civil Rights do you think groups such as the speak up for women are denying?
I am commenting on this issue because I am against the Gender Self ID Bill. That doesn't mean trans people can't change their sex on their birth certificate, it just means there is a process they have to go through.
I understand some feminist groups are not wanting to involve trans women in their meetings. But I think that is their right. Our experiences from trans women are very different. We have grown up with sexism since we were young girls. They have grown up with a very difficult situation of not feeling like the sex they were assigned.
In the 70's when I first became a feminist there were lesbian women who were separatists. So they wanted to meet and associate with each other and not with us. I had no problem with that.
As I have posted before the language now being used by some about women (menstruators, birthing units and people with vaginas I believe de-constructs my identity as a woman. I find it de-humanizing. As already posted it has been proposed to have a judicial enquiry into the gender self id bill on the basis of it nulifying what a women is.
I wonder what your thoughts are about what Weka is saying about academia?
BTW you asked a question about me assault last week. I gave quite a lengthy response about what happened. I guess you missed it.
The process of changing your birth certificate as it stands is very dehumanizing itself, as you are no doubt aware Anker. Also rather expensive.
But it does seem appropriate that you champion separatism. Given the link explaining how an early version of TERF that never really caught on was TES (trans-exclusionary seperatist).
Go online, .govt – change birth certificate and reduce any fees. That is something government can do.
I don't exclude Trans when i ask why i am now called a pregnant person, menstruating people etc. The question is why can we not called pregnant women? Because a transman is being a partime women in order to give birth? A man is pregnant? Really? Does that make me exclusionary?
Maybe it should be pregnant people when talking about trans women, and maybe it should be pregnant women when a women gets pregnant? Or would that too be exclusionary?
Before covid I had hired a transwomen. She lived for 28 years a man, and in her country that afforded her all the trimmings of male privilege, and she admits it. She is not going to be trans in her country as it would be deadly, so she came here. Do i feel her as a women? No, i don't Why – god knows, maybe its pheromone etc.? In saying that i don't feel her as a man. Go figure. But will i treat her as a women as a human being, as i would like to be treated by others, and ever now and then help her understand what it is to be women in our world, yes. Very funny tho when her boyfriend and her both applied at the same business for line cook postitions and she was offered a lower wage…….Welcome to the world of women, i said. Her look? Priceless.
I am not aware of what is involved in changing your birth certificate. That in my opinion is not a good reason to allow gender self id. It may be that there are aspects of the process that can be altered e.g. the cost. I would need to know more about the process to understand how it is de-humanizing. Going through life most of us will encounter difficult processes.
I am not championing separatism as such, merely offering that there are many occasions where we are all excluded from some groups.
I am not part of any feminist group currently, so whether I exclude trans women is mute. Like Sabine when I come across Trans people, I am respectful and civil, just like I am with any person I meet. So the label Trans exclusionary seperatiist doesn't really fit.
But surely that's the substance of the Gender Self ID Bill that you oppose?
The legislation – Births, Deaths, Marriages and Relationships Registration bill – was introduced in August 2017…
Currently, if someone wants to legally change their gender they need approval from a doctor or a judge.
Medical evidence of a sex change has to be provided as well…
In some cases, someone who wants to change their gender on their birth certificate needs to go through the family court – a process that could take up to a year.
But the legislation would change that so that the only thing needed was a statutory declaration – an official written statement
the current process seems appropriate to me. It is a big thing to change the sex on your birth certificate. I am sorry if it is a lengthy, expensive and difficult thing to change. Some things are e.g becoming a NZ citizen, immigrating to NZ especially under Covid. That doesn't make the processes wrong or right.
I don't support the Gender self id bill. Labour didn't as far as I can see have it as one of their election promises.
More that NZF held it up procedurally for the three years of last term.
It is a small change that will mean a lot to many Aotearoans. I don't believe that you are at all sorry for those whose identities are in limbo for years if not decades (17 years being the waiting list for the bottom surgery alone, even before the Pandemic). Plus there's still a lot of room for improvement around Nonbinary people too.
Biblical literalism, and centuries of colonialism have not left us many examples of that. Even Takitapui feels a bit reconstructed as much as extant culture. Good to have Kerekere in the parliamentary mix though. I guess the Heritage foundation's strategy of turning those with nontraditional gender expression against one another is working out pretty well for them…
Rambling, but at least you know what's in the bill you are opposing now, Anker.
RMcD, thanks for the link. I have tried to wade through the legalese of that a couple of times before, but my eyes just glaze over! The NZH summary above is more readable, though hardly complete.
Forget now, I hear it will mean a lot to many. You don't have to believe whether I am sorry or not. You are entitled to interpret what I say any way you want.
I think Sabine raises a very good point about the process of immigrating here. A rigorous costly process.
Trans people are still entitled to identify whatever gender they want to.
I also agree with Greywarshark that a minority are trying to change gender and sexual identification. No one is stopping them being trans. We are talking about a significant change to official documentation.
As I have said before, I can't change my ethnicity (at all) or my age for that matter.
Bend me, break me, anyway you make me… That is how many women and people feel about this minority that have taken centre stage to turn ordinary life on its side because they have a strong desire to make change! It's a tide of demands that is flooding us trying to stuff up the whole world and our very basic identities to suit the discontented.
There are only so many James Morris' around; the present growth of supplicants is through a power grab by gripe-merchants over young people faced with a convusing, fast-changing world, the control of which has been wrested from the orbit of ordinary people. A majority are facing poverty and homelessness and uncertainty because of ploys of the callous people pulling golden strings at the top. The meme is education and technology is the answer for all ills yet we can see the ills clearly but nothing can or will be done till the technocrats and the pollies trying to use them, have decided on the value to them of fixing them, affecting our fate, and devised a suitable budget to display. We are drowned in theoreticians words and economic inertia and the sort of science that wants to experiment in real time on real people.
This struck me as pertinent; Terry Pratchett's Thief of Time excerpt:
The concept of 'orders' was yet another and immensely unfamiliar one for any Auditors. They were used to decisions by committee, reached only when the possibilities of doing nothing whatsoever about the matter in question had been exhausted. Decisions made by everyone were decisions made by no-one, which therefore precluded any possibility of blame. (p.314 in my p/back.)
I have no issues with a transman wanting to be a 'parent', I have an issue with the statements of a 'man ' being pregnant, it is the female body of that transman who is pregnant. So the fair description would be 'transman' or 'self identified other'. And then feel free to call these groups of people people. But the vast majority of pregnancy happens to women who identify as women and historically it is the women bodies have been doing all of the worlds breeding. But thanks for the education, were would i be without it. .
And if you think that providing a medical certificate is dehumanising think about migrating. I presented several medical certificates to the immigration services, police certificates from every country i ever lived in, birth certificate, marriage certificate and photos, and letters, and more to prove that i am legally married and that my marriage was consumed. And it costs an arm and a leg and we are quite happy to demand even more from migrants today.
Maybe we really need to re-think the term of de-humanising and realise that it is not dehumanizing to prove that you went through a process to change your physical appearance of whom you were born into your real self in order to change every offical document ever issued to you.
Yes trans men and non binary people have vaginas and menstruate, because they were born with women’s anatomy I assume.
arkie, I assume you are a man? I am unhappy with my identity as a woman being deconstructed. As someone posted last week the gender self I’d bill, nulifies a women’s identity and if they try and pass I understand there will be a judicial review.
I didn’t read the whole article about who coined the term terf. It appears to be a woman who was speaking up for transgender rights. That isn’t the issue. The issue is what happens when a term not chosen by a group is used by an opposing group in a perjorative way to write that group off.
I belong to a number of groups that are exclusive. That is normal. I can’t join my husbands tribe because I am not Maori and he is. I very much doubt I could easily change my ethnicity. Trans people may or may not be members of groups I am a part of.
I don’t exclude trans people when I meet them in my day to day life
Hi McFlook, yeah I have checked the Dunedin study and they don't seem to have done anything on Trans. I choose that study as my go to source of science, because they really are scientists who are interested in what their research discovers rather than trying to prove a theory. For example their marvellous work on self control. Not popular with many people on the left because they have an ideology that they use to explain social problems. I am not saying that some ideology doesn't explain social/health issues e.g poverty's long term effect on health outcomes, even if people become financially well off in adulthood.
I would be interested to see the numbers who identified as Trans in the Dunedin study and at what age and what mental health outcomes and were the mental health outcomes correlated to other factors. Twelve is a very small sample, but I would be fascinated to see what the trajectory was for Trans people at all ages and stages. I would trust whatever they found.
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Day one of the solo leg of my long journey home begins with my favourite sound: footfalls in an empty street. 5.00 am and it’s already light and already too warm, almost.If I can make the train that leaves Budapest later this hour I could be in Belgrade by nightfall; ...
Do you remember Y2K, the threat that hung over humanity in the closing days of the twentieth century? Horror scenarios of planes falling from the sky, electronic payments failing and ATMs refusing to dispense cash. As for your VCR following instructions and recording your favourite show - forget about it.All ...
Climate Change Minister Simon Watts being questioned by The Kākā’s Bernard Hickey.TL;DR: My top six things to note around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the week to July 20 were:1. A strategy that fails Zero Carbon Act & Paris targetsThe National-ACT-NZ First Coalition Government finally unveiled ...
Summary:As New Zealand loses at least 12 leaders in the public service space of health, climate, and pharmaceuticals, this month alone, directly in response to the Government’s policies and budget choices, what lies ahead may be darker than it appears. Tui examines some of those departures and draws a long ...
The Minister of Housing’s ambition is to reduce markedly the ratio of house prices to household incomes. If his strategy works it would transform the housing market, dramatically changing the prospects of housing as an investment.Leaving aside the Minister’s metaphor of ‘flooding the market’ I do not see how the ...
As previously noted, my historical fantasy piece, set in the fifth-century Mediterranean, was accepted for a Pirate Horror anthology, only for the anthology to later fall through. But in a good bit of news, it turned out that the story could indeed be re-marketed as sword and sorcery. As of ...
An employee of tobacco company Philip Morris International demonstrates a heated tobacco device. Photo: Getty ImagesTL;DR: The top six things I’ve noted around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy on Friday, July 19 are:At a time when the Coalition Government is cutting spending on health, infrastructure, education, housing ...
TL;DR: My pick of the top six links elsewhere around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day or so to 8:30 am on Friday, July 19 are:Scoop: NZ First Minister Casey Costello orders 50% cut to excise tax on heated tobacco products. The minister has ...
Kia ora, it’s time for another Friday roundup, in which we pull together some of the links and stories that caught our eye this week. Feel free to add more in the comments! Our header image this week shows a foggy day in Auckland town, captured by Patrick Reynolds. ...
TL;DR : Here’s the top six items climate news for Aotearoa this week, as selected by Bernard Hickey and The Kākā’s climate correspondent Cathrine Dyer. A discussion recorded yesterday is in the video above and the audio of that sent onto the podcast feed.The Government released its draft Emissions Reduction ...
Save some money, get rich and old, bring it back to Tobacco Road.Bring that dynamite and a crane, blow it up, start all over again.Roll up. Roll up. Or tailor made, if you prefer...Whether you’re selling ciggies, digging for gold, catching dolphins in your nets, or encouraging folks to flutter ...
Waiting In The Wings:For truly, if Trump is America’s un-assassinated Caesar, then J.D. Vance is America’s Octavian, the Republic’s youthful undertaker – and its first Emperor.DONALD TRUMP’S SELECTION of James D. Vance as his running-mate bodes ill for the American republic. A fervent supporter of Viktor Orban, the “illiberal” prime ...
TL;DR: As of 6:00 am on Friday, July 19, the top six announcements, speeches, reports and research around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day are:The PSAannounced the Employment Relations Authority (ERA) had ruled in the PSA’s favour in its case against the Ministry ...
TL;DR: The podcast above of the weekly ‘hoon’ webinar for paying subscribers last night features co-hosts and talking with:The Kākā’s climate correspondent talking about the National-ACT-NZ First Government’s release of its first Emissions Reduction Plan;University of Otago Foreign Relations Professor and special guest Dr Karin von ...
Open access notablesImproving global temperature datasets to better account for non-uniform warming, Calvert, Quarterly Journal of the Royal Meteorological Society:To better account for spatial non-uniform trends in warming, a new GITD [global instrumental temperature dataset] was created that used maximum likelihood estimation (MLE) to combine the land surface ...
A late change to charter school legislation will cheat educators out of fair pay and negotiating power proving charter schools are just a vehicle to make profit out of our education system. ...
In 2004 te iwi Māori rallied against the Crown’s attempt to confiscate our coastlines and moana with the Foreshore and Seabed Act. This led to the largest hīkoi of a generation and the birth of Te Pāti Māori. 20 years later, history is repeating itself. Today the government has announced ...
It has been five and a half years since the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in Care was established to investigate the abuse of children, young people, and vulnerable adults within state and faith-based institutions. Yesterday, the final report - Whanaketia through pain and trauma, from darkness to light ...
The Green Party is calling on the Government to take action off the back of the International Court of Justice ruling on Israel’s illegal occupation of Palestine. ...
On Friday the International Court of Justice reaffirmed what Palestinian’s have been telling us for decades: that the occupation and colonisation of Palestinian lands by Israel is illegal and must end immediately. They also called for reparations for Palestinian’s who have lived under Israeli occupation since it began in 1967. ...
Labour calls on the Government to act after the International Court of Justice (ICJ) ruled that Israel’s occupation of Palestinian Territories is illegal. ...
The 53.7 percent rise in benefit sanctions over the last year is more proof of this Government’s disdain for our communities most in need of support. ...
Aotearoa could be a country where every child grows up feeling safe, loved and with a sense of belonging in their whānau and community. But for some of our children, this is far from reality. Instead, they are trapped in a maze of intergenerational harm that they can’t escape on ...
Te Pāti Māori are calling for David Seymour to resign as Associate Health Minister in response to his call for Pharmac to ignore the Treaty of Waitangi. “This announcement is just another example of the government’s anti-Tiriti, anti-Māori agenda.” Said Co-leader and spokesperson for health, Debbie Ngarewa-Packer. “Seymour thinks it ...
The soaring price of renting is driving the rise of inflation in this country - with latest figures from Stats NZ showing rents are up 4.8 per cent on average while annual inflation is at 3.3 per cent. ...
National’s Emissions Reduction Plan will take New Zealand further from the economy we need to ensure the next generation has a stable climate and secure livelihoods. ...
Following consultation with named parties and thorough consideration of privacy interests, the Green Party is in a position to release the Executive Summary of the final report from the independent investigation into Darleen Tana. ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon should be asking serious questions of his Minister for Resources Shane Jones now it’s been revealed he misled the public about a dinner with mining companies that he didn’t declare and said wasn’t pre-arranged. ...
Te Pāti Māori have submitted to the Justice Select Committee against the Sentencing (Reinstating Three Strikes) Amendment Bill. The bill will further entrench racism in our justice system and fails to focus on rehabilitation. “Reinstating Three Strikes will empower a systematically racist system and exacerbate the overrepresentation of Māori in ...
The Transport and Infrastructure Committee is set to make a determination on the Residential Tenancies Amendment (RTA) Bill in the coming weeks. “This legislation will give landlords the power to kick our whānau out onto the street for no reason” said Housing spokesperson, Mariameno Kapa-Kingi. “Their solution to the housing ...
“National’s campaign was about tackling crime and the best they can do is a two-year long Ministerial Advisory Group,” Labour justice spokesperson Duncan Webb said. ...
“There are more examples of charter schools failing their students than there are success stories. The coalition Government is driving to dismantle our public school system and instead promote a privatised, competitive structure that puts profits before kids,” Jan Tinetti said. ...
“This government is choosing to deliberately mislead and withhold information, keeping our people in the dark about this government’s agenda and the future of our mokopuna,” said co-leader and spokesperson for Health, Debbie Ngarewa-Packer. The call comes after the demand from the Chief Ombudsman that Associate Minister of Health, Casey ...
“Today’s climate announcement by Simon Watts makes clear the National Government is simply paying lip service to meeting its climate change targets,” Megan Woods said. ...
National is choosing to make life harder for workers by taking away the rights our communities have fought hard for. Here's how they’re taking workers backwards. ...
Australia, Canada and New Zealand today issued the following statement on the need for an urgent ceasefire in Gaza and the risk of expanded conflict between Hizballah and Israel. The situation in Gaza is catastrophic. The human suffering is unacceptable. It cannot continue. We remain unequivocal in our condemnation of ...
Attorney-General Judith Collins today reminded all State and faith-based institutions of their legal obligation to preserve records relevant to the safety and wellbeing of those in its care. “The Abuse in Care Inquiry’s report has found cases where records of the most vulnerable people in State and faith‑based institutions were ...
Minister of Internal Affairs Brooke van Velden says the Government’s online safety website for children and young people has reached one million page views. “It is great to see so many young people and their families accessing the site Keep It Real Online to learn how to stay safe online, and manage ...
Tēnā tātou katoa, Ngā mihi te rangi, ngā mihi te whenua, ngā mihi ki a koutou, kia ora mai koutou. Thank you for the opportunity to be here and the invitation to speak at this 50th anniversary conference. I acknowledge all those who have gone before us and paved the ...
New Zealand’s payroll providers have successfully prepared to ensure 3.5 million individuals will, from Wednesday next week, be able to keep more of what they earn each pay, says Finance Minister Nicola Willis and Revenue Minister Simon Watts. “The Government's tax policy changes are legally effective from Wednesday. Delivering this tax ...
An experimental vineyard which will help futureproof the wine sector has been opened in Blenheim by Associate Regional Development Minister Mark Patterson. The covered vineyard, based at the New Zealand Wine Centre – Te Pokapū Wāina o Aotearoa, enables controlled environmental conditions. “The research that will be produced at the Experimental ...
The Coalition Government has confirmed the indicative regional breakdown of North Island Weather Event (NIWE) funding for state highway recovery projects funded through Budget 2024, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “Regions in the North Island suffered extensive and devastating damage from Cyclone Gabrielle and the 2023 Auckland Anniversary Floods, and ...
Indonesia’s Foreign Minister, Retno Marsudi, will visit New Zealand next week, Foreign Minister Winston Peters has announced. “Indonesia is important to New Zealand’s security and economic interests and is our closest South East Asian neighbour,” says Mr Peters, who is currently in Laos to engage with South East Asian partners. ...
He aha te kai a te rangatira? He kōrero, he kōrero, he kōrero. The government has reaffirmed its commitment to supporting the aspirations of Ngāti Maniapoto, Minister for Māori Development Tama Potaka says. “My thanks to Te Nehenehenui Trust – Ngāti Maniapoto for bringing their important kōrero to a ministerial ...
Transport Minister Simeon Brown has thanked outgoing Chair of the Civil Aviation Authority, Janice Fredric, for her service to the board.“I have received Ms Fredric’s resignation from the role of Chair of the Civil Aviation Authority,” Mr Brown says.“On behalf of the Government, I want to thank Ms Fredric for ...
The Government is proposing legislation to overturn a Court of Appeal decision and amend the Marine and Coastal Area Act in order to restore Parliament’s test for Customary Marine Title, Treaty Negotiations Minister Paul Goldsmith says. “Section 58 required an applicant group to prove they have exclusively used and occupied ...
Regulation Minister David Seymour says that opposition parties have united in bad faith, opposing what they claim are ‘dangerous changes’ to the Early Childhood Education sector, despite no changes even being proposed yet. “Issues with affordability and availability of early childhood education, and the complexity of its regulation, has led ...
After receiving more than 740 submissions in the first 20 days, Regulation Minister David Seymour is asking the Ministry for Regulation to extend engagement on the early childhood education regulation review by an extra two weeks. “The level of interest has been very high, and from the conversations I’ve been ...
The Coalition Government is investing $802.9 million into the Wairarapa and Manawatū rail lines as part of a funding agreement with the NZ Transport Agency (NZTA), KiwiRail, and the Greater Wellington and Horizons Regional Councils to deliver more reliable services for commuters in the lower North Island, Transport Minister Simeon ...
Local Government Minister Simeon Brown has announced his intention to appoint a Crown Manager to both Hawke’s Bay Regional and Wairoa District Councils to speed up the delivery of flood protection work in Wairoa."Recent severe weather events in Wairoa this year, combined with damage from Cyclone Gabrielle in 2023 have ...
Mr Speaker, this is a day that many New Zealanders who were abused in State care never thought would come. It’s the day that this Parliament accepts, with deep sorrow and regret, the Report of the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in Care. At the heart of this report are the ...
For the first time, the Government is formally acknowledging some children and young people at Lake Alice Psychiatric Hospital experienced torture. The final report of the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in State and Faith-based Care “Whanaketia – through pain and trauma, from darkness to light,” was tabled in Parliament ...
The Government has acknowledged the nearly 2,400 courageous survivors who shared their experiences during the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Historical Abuse in State and Faith-Based Care. The final report from the largest and most complex public inquiry ever held in New Zealand, the Royal Commission Inquiry “Whanaketia – through ...
With a week to go before hard-working New Zealanders see personal income tax relief for the first time in fourteen years, 513,000 people have used the Budget tax calculator to see how much they will benefit, says Finance Minister Nicola Willis. “Tax relief is long overdue. From next Wednesday, personal income ...
Workplace Relations and Safety Minister Brooke van Velden says a bill that has passed its first reading will improve parental leave settings and give non-biological parents more flexibility as primary carer for their child. The Regulatory Systems Amendment Bill (No3), passed its first reading this morning. “It includes a change ...
Two Bills designed to improve regulation and make it easier to do business have passed their first reading in Parliament, says Economic Development Minister Melissa Lee. The Regulatory Systems (Economic Development) Amendment Bill and Regulatory Systems (Immigration and Workforce) Amendment Bill make key changes to legislation administered by the Ministry ...
New legislation paves the way for greater competition in sectors such as banking and electricity, Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Andrew Bayly says. “Competitive markets boost productivity, create employment opportunities and lift living standards. To support competition, we need good quality regulation but, unfortunately, a recent OECD report ranked New ...
Minister of Internal Affairs Brooke van Velden says lotteries for charitable purposes, such as those run by the Heart Foundation, Coastguard NZ, and local hospices, will soon be allowed to operate online permanently. “Under current laws, these fundraising lotteries are only allowed to operate online until October 2024, after which ...
The Coalition Government is accelerating work on the new four-lane expressway between Auckland and Whangārei as part of its Roads of National Significance programme, with an accelerated delivery model to deliver this project faster and more efficiently, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “For too long, the lack of resilient transport connections ...
Sir Don McKinnon will travel to Viet Nam this week as a Special Envoy of the Government, Foreign Minister Winston Peters has announced. “It is important that the Government give due recognition to the significant contributions that General Secretary Nguyen Phu Trong made to New Zealand-Viet Nam relations,” Mr ...
Minister of Internal Affairs Brooke van Velden says newly appointed Commissioner, Grant Illingworth KC, will help deliver the report for the first phase of the Royal Commission of Inquiry into COVID-19 Lessons, due on 28 November 2024. “I am pleased to announce that Mr Illingworth will commence his appointment as ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters travels to Laos this week to participate in a series of Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN)-led Ministerial meetings in Vientiane. “ASEAN plays an important role in supporting a peaceful, stable and prosperous Indo-Pacific,” Mr Peters says. “This will be our third visit to ...
Construction of a new mental health facility at Te Nikau Grey Hospital in Greymouth is today one step closer, Mental Health Minister Matt Doocey says. “This $27 million facility shows this Government is delivering on its promise to boost mental health care and improve front line services,” Mr Doocey says. ...
New Zealand is committing nearly $50 million to a package supporting sustainable Pacific fisheries development over the next four years, Foreign Minister Winston Peters and Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones announced today. “This support consisting of a range of initiatives demonstrates New Zealand’s commitment to assisting our Pacific partners ...
Associate Education Minister David Seymour says proposed changes to the Education and Training Amendment Bill will ensure charter schools have more flexibility to negotiate employment agreements and are equipped with the right teaching resources. “Cabinet has agreed to progress an amendment which means unions will not be able to initiate ...
In response to serious concerns around oversight, overspend and a significant deterioration in financial outlook, the Board of Health New Zealand will be replaced with a Commissioner, Health Minister Dr Shane Reti announced today. “The previous government’s botched health reforms have created significant financial challenges at Health NZ that, without ...
Minister for Space and Science, Innovation and Technology Judith Collins will travel to Adelaide tomorrow for space and science engagements, including speaking at the Australian Space Forum. While there she will also have meetings and visits with a focus on space, biotechnology and innovation. “New Zealand has a thriving space ...
Climate Change Minister Simon Watts will travel to China on Saturday to attend the Ministerial on Climate Action meeting held in Wuhan. “Attending the Ministerial on Climate Action is an opportunity to advocate for New Zealand climate priorities and engage with our key partners on climate action,” Mr Watts says. ...
Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones is travelling to the Solomon Islands tomorrow for meetings with his counterparts from around the Pacific supporting collective management of the region’s fisheries. The 23rd Pacific Islands Forum Fisheries Committee and the 5th Regional Fisheries Ministers’ Meeting in Honiara from 23 to 26 July ...
The Government today launched the Military Style Academy Pilot at Te Au rere a te Tonga Youth Justice residence in Palmerston North, an important part of the Government’s plan to crackdown on youth crime and getting youth offenders back on track, Minister for Children, Karen Chhour said today. “On the ...
The Government has welcomed news the NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) has begun work to replace nine priority bridges across the country to ensure our state highway network remains resilient, reliable, and efficient for road users, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says.“Increasing productivity and economic growth is a key priority for the ...
Acting Prime Minister David Seymour has been in contact throughout the evening with senior officials who have coordinated a whole of government response to the global IT outage and can provide an update. The Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet has designated the National Emergency Management Agency as the ...
New Zealand and Japan will continue to step up their shared engagement with the Pacific, Foreign Minister Winston Peters says. “New Zealand and Japan have a strong, shared interest in a free, open and stable Pacific Islands region,” Mr Peters says. “We are pleased to be finding more ways ...
New developments in the heart of North Island forestry country will reinvigorate their communities and boost economic development, Regional Development Minister Shane Jones says. Mr Jones visited Kaingaroa and Kawerau in Bay of Plenty today to open a landmark community centre in the former and a new connecting road in ...
President Adeang, fellow Ministers, honourable Diet Member Horii, Ambassadors, distinguished guests. Minasama, konnichiwa, and good afternoon, everyone. Distinguished guests, it’s a pleasure to be here with you today to talk about New Zealand’s foreign policy reset, the reasons for it, the values that underpin it, and how it ...
Last summer when Matairangi burned, Ginny and Tom stood at the window of their lounge, watching kākā shoot skyward from the burning trees. From the distance, they looked to Ginny like pages torn from books and thrown into a bonfire. It was Tom, voice tight, who told her it was ...
Opinion: The Canadian short story writer Alice Munro – winner of the Nobel Prize in Literature in 2013 – died in May at the age of 92. Her work was about “the damage people inflict on one another in the name of love”, Deborah Treisman wrote in the New Yorker. ...
This month marks two years since the most powerful telescope ever built sent its first pictures back to earth. From its lofty vantage point, beyond the moon in orbit around the sun, the James Webb Space Telescope was tuned to observe the first stars and galaxies being born soon after ...
Comment: After Climate Change Minister Simon Watts’ preview several weeks ago, I had some optimism about the Government’s emissions reduction plan. Now I’ve read the discussion document, that hope has been dashed. How can the Government propose a plan that wants to take New Zealand taxpayers’ hard-earned money, and spend ...
Christopher Luxon: hurdles The little man from National jumps hurdles in his sleep. He’s quite good at it in his dreams and even though the reality doesn’t quite match up you have to give him credit for getting up every morning and crashing into the very first hurdle of the ...
Comment: It was a good two hours into the conversation when Tyrone Marks raised the most basic of questions when I first spoke to him in 2017. “They didn’t explain the things they did to me. They never told me why. And they still haven’t. There’s no explanation for it. ...
Madeleine Chapman rounds out Death Week on The Spinoff with a final recommendation. You can read all of our Death Week coverage here. Nothing forces you to reflect on your life and relationships quite like proximity to death. For those whose nearest and dearest have died, there are reasonably obvious ...
Whitney Greene takes us through her life in television, including the TV character she’d like to plan a funeral for and her cow lung catastrophe on The Traitors NZ. “If the phone rings, I have to answer it,” Whitney Greene from The Traitors NZ warns as we begin our My ...
Maddie Ballard reviews the debut essay collection of Pōneke writer Flora Feltham.In ‘The Raw Material’, the longest essay in Flora Feltham’s dazzling debut collection, the author heads out for a run after hours of weaving and sees the world turn to textile. “Pounding along the Parade, I saw the ...
Andy Christiansen, one half of the experimental rock-pop duo TRiPS, shares the tunes inspiring the band’s perfect weekend and new release. “Good speakers, good food, good music, no distractions”: that’s all you need to enjoy the psychedelic stylings of TRiPS, a new band formed by Fly My Pretties’ Barnaby Weir ...
Celebrating our quadrennial opportunity to become experts in a bunch of sports we never normally watch.The games of the XXXIII Olympiad are upon us. Paris will host this year’s showcase of sporting and athletic prowess, which means some late-night and early-morning viewing for us in Aotearoa.But what sports ...
The photograph is striking and beautiful, but also disturbing – a reminder that my love for John was often entangled in shame.The Sunday Essay is made possible thanks to the support of Creative New Zealand.In the spring of 1980, in Dunedin, shortly before his death, someone took a photograph ...
Get to know Babushka, our latest Dog of the Month. This feature was offered as a reward during our What’s Eating Aotearoa PledgeMe campaign. Thank you to Babu’s humans, Jo and Isabel, for their support. Dog name: Babushka (Babu for short) Age: 2Breed: Border Collie X poodleIf rescued, ...
Pacific Media Watch A Lebanese photojournalist who was severely wounded during an Israeli air strike in south Lebanon carried the Olympic torch in Paris this week in honour of her peers who have been wounded and killed in the field — especially in Gaza and Lebanon. Christina Assi of Agence ...
The first report in a five-part web series focused on the 15th Triennial Conference of Pacific Women taking place in the Marshall Islands this week.SPECIAL REPORT:By Netani Rika in Majuro Women continue to fight for justice 70 years after the first nuclear tests by the United States caused ...
Christopher Luxon has joined with Australia and Canada's leaders in voicing support for US President Joe Biden's ceasefire deal between Israel and Hamas. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra The 2022 election brought the “teal wave” into parliament. The next election will test whether teals, who occupy what were Liberal seats, and other independents can maintain their momentum. Joining us on the Podcast ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Ian Musgrave, Senior lecturer in Pharmacology, University of Adelaide Pixavri/Shutterstock A major Federal Court class action has been dismissed this week after Justice Michael Lee ruled there was not enough evidence to prove the weedkiller Roundup causes cancer. Plaintiff Kelvin ...
In The Week in Politics: politicians have to decide what to do about child abuse, Health NZ is booked in for major surgery and Darleen Tana returns. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Clare Corbould, Associate Professor, Contemporary Histories Research Group, Deakin University Mainstream media are surprisingly muted at the prospect of the world’s most powerful nation being led for the first time by a woman – specifically a woman of colour, Vice President Kamala ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Rebecca Bennett, PhD Student, Associate Research Fellow, Deakin University Last week, a drone delivery company called Wing (owned by Google’s parent company, Alphabet) started operating in Melbourne. Some 250,000 residents in parts of the city’s eastern suburbs can now order food from ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Jonathan Foo, Lecturer, Physiotherapy, Monash University pikselstock/Shutterstock In the next 40 years in Australia, it’s predicted the number of Australians aged 65 and over will more than double, while the number of people aged 85 and over will more than triple. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Katrina Grant, Research Associate, Power Institute for Arts and Visual Culture, University of Sydney Jonas Åkerström’s 1790 work, Session of the Accademia dell’Arcadia on August 17 1788.Nationalmuseum/Cecilia Heisser Ever wondered whether you’d have a better chance at winning an Olympic gold ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Alexandra Jones, Program Lead, Food Governance, George Institute for Global Health wavebreakmedia/Shutterstock On Thursday, Australian and New Zealand food ministers at state, federal and national levels met to thrash out what’s next for health star ratings on packaged foods. Now, after ...
The Abuse in Care report found many Pacific survivors lost their connections to their culture and language, resulting in trauma that has been carried from generation to generation. ...
In the regulatory review, ECC intends to suggest that ERO focus on curriculum delivery reviews rather than the Ministry, because it’s not efficient or effective to have two agencies with radically different approaches climbing over each other. ...
Te Rūnanga Nui o Ngā Kura Kaupapa Māori invites the current government to work in partnership with them to develop a pathway forward, including the development of a parallel pathway and meaningful policy and strategy for Kura Kaupapa Māori ...
If you haven’t started watching yet, Tara Ward begs you to reconsider. This is an excerpt from our weekly pop culture newsletter Rec Room. Sign up here. In the world of New Zealand reality television, we have many gems in our crown. There’s the delicious second season of the Celebrity Treasure ...
A new poem by Fiona Kidman. The clothes of the dead I did not keep my mother’s furry red beret for long nor the stringy scarves that adorned the necks of my aunts, although I have kept tag ends of gold, the rings and trinkets they wore, the brooches no ...
The government’s announcement that it will re-open the foreshore and seabed controversy by changing the rules on recognising centuries-old Māori customary title for a third time goes against the rule of law and New Zealand values,” Mr Tipa says. ...
The only published and available best-selling indie book chart in New Zealand is the top 10 sales list recorded every week at Unity Books’ stores in High St, Auckland, and Willis St, Wellington.AUCKLAND1 Lioness by Emily Perkins (Bloomsbury, $25) Roarrrr! Perkins’ brilliant, award-winning, Marian-Keyes anointed, darkly funny, long ...
The 2004 Act vested ownership of the foreshore and seabed in the Crown, extinguishing any Māori claims to ownership and causing widespread outrage and protests among Māori communities. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Antje Deckert, Associate Professor (Criminology), Auckland University of Technology Getty Images Despite the connection between institutional harm and gang membership made clear in this week’s mammoth royal commission abuse-in care report, the government seems unlikely to soften its “get tough on ...
From Lewis Clareburt in the swimming to the start of the rowing – the first seven days of Paris 2024 promise to be big for New Zealand. There are few events that bring the country together quite like an Olympic Games. Nothing quite matches the excitement of getting up in ...
Groundbreaking local science just showed up in the most surprising of places: the season finale of The Kardashians. In the season five finale of The Kardashians last night, several members of the family gathered together in one of their signature empty, cream-coloured rooms to hear test results that had been ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Amin Saikal, Emeritus professor of Middle Eastern and Central Asian Studies, Australian National University The Middle East is on the brink of a possibly devastating regional war, with hostilities between Israel and Hezbollah reaching an extremely dangerous level. Washington has engaged in ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Laura Elizabeth Eades, Rheumatologist, Monash University Lupus is an inflammatory autoimmune illness, where the body’s immune system mistakenly attacks itself. Lupus can affect virtually any part of the body, although it most commonly affects the skin, joints and kidneys. The symptoms ...
A law firm that specialises in working with survivors of abuse in State care is disappointed that the Government fails to recognise that its boot camps can be directly compared to previous boot camps from the 1990s and 2000s. ...
Dying is a natural part of life, like updating your Wof or seeing your hairdresser, but without the word-of-mouth recs that help guarantee a good service. What if we changed that? Dying Reviews received by The Spinoff have had the names of organisations redacted while Hospice NZ collects further data. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Jonti Horner, Professor (Astrophysics), University of Southern Queensland Mike Lewinski/Flickr, CC BY On any clear night, if you gaze skywards long enough, chances are you’ll see a meteor streaking through the sky. Some nights, however, are better than others. At ...
Despite having no bars or other designated spaces for lesbians, Auckland boasts a small but mighty lesbian museum. So how did it get here? The past 18 months has brought increasing hostility towards the queer community across Aotearoa. Kellie-Jay Keen-Minshull’s anti-trans rally in Tamaki Makaurau last March led to a ...
Poneke Antifascist Coalition has invited Wellingtonians to stand in solidarity with the Kanak people at 12pm today outside the French Embassy in Wellington. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Peter Layton, Visiting Fellow, Strategic Studies, Griffith University Drones are the signature technology of the Ukraine war. A few miniature aircraft designs were used in the war’s early days, but an incredible array of drones have now evolved. There are different types, ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Mark Slee, Associate Professor, Clinical Academic Neurologist, Flinders University Francisco Gonzelez/Unsplash Migraine is many things, but one thing it’s not is “just a headache”. “Migraine” comes from the Greek word “hemicrania”, referring to the common experience of migraine being predominantly ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Lee White, Senior Lecturer and Horizon Fellow, School of Social and Political Sciences, University of Sydney Australia was slow to introduce minimum building standards for energy efficiency. The Nationwide House Energy Rating Scheme (NatHERS) only came into force in 2003. Older homes ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Steven Sherwood, Professor of Atmospheric Sciences, Climate Change Research Centre, UNSW Sydney The past century of human-induced warming has increased rainfall variability over 75% of the Earth’s land area – particularly over Australia, Europe and eastern North America, new research shows. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Tony Heynen, Program Coordinator, Sustainable Energy, The University of Queensland A temporary stadium in the Champ-de-Mars, ParisEkaterina Pokrovsky/Shutterstock As Paris prepares to host the Olympic and Paralympic Games, the sustainability of the event is coming under scrutiny. The organisers have promoted ...
A night of karaoke and community in a pub that feels like a memory. You’d barely even notice it, unless you knew to look. Tucked away behind a liquor store on busy Constable Street is the capital’s last great pub. Newtown Sports Bar is an emblem of the pub culture ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Ian Wright, Professor in Marine Geology, University of Canterbury Louise Corcoran/Getty Images The decline in the number of doctoral candidates at New Zealand universities is a worrying sign for the country’s effort to build a knowledge-based economy. Aotearoa New Zealand’s ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Laurie Berg, Associate Professor, University of Technology Sydney defotoberg/Shutterstock Migrant worker exploitation is entrenched in workplaces across Australia. Tragically, a deep fear of immigration consequences means most unlawful employer conduct goes unreported. On Wednesday, however, the government officially launched a ...
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sigh two of my colleagues received freshly minted 90 day notices yesterday… Landlords selling up due to changes…. I guess the changes are having the desired effect not so good for solo mums thrust back into the exploding rental market…
Oh no, how incredibly frightening for all of them. I really hope they find somewhere that is at a minimum safe for the kids.
Yeah its not alot of fun… effects schooling as well end up having to look in the same zone… expensive to time off… moving costs… finding bond… tenancy services is running behind on bond refunds by the sounds…
Pretty worried for one of them piles more shit on…
Hoping but not holding my breath that govt will move quickly to help renters… to my mind if you make renters rights really strong you deflate the market anyway… would put anyone in it for the short term off…
Unfortunately there will be a few landlords that decide to cash up now which was always going to happen as an unintended consequence. I fear these announcements may not be good for renters as rents will increase. Hopefully your colleagues can find another place but there is a shortage of rental places in many areas, thus the problem we have.
I actually have a nice landlord story. A friend of mine the landlord has cut down 2 big trees, cost 8k so the homes are warmer. Landlord said he was not selling.
Usually when costly land shaping is done either selling or a rent rise is in the horizon.
I do have nosy extractor fan issues 24/7 where I live due to a house divided into 3 tenancies with 6 people. Loud footsteps and doors banging can also annoy me and keep me up or wake me up.
The rental market is so tight and I have had the experience of the landlord selling and needing to move out. I had the last laugh they sold for 200k 4 1/2 years ago and the place is now worth 400k.
Some landlords might find the price of their home dropping. I do give a thought to those struggling to pay the rent and this cannot continue.
Home work for spelling. Noisy not nosy and on the horizon not in. Any other spelling errors not picked up.
I do also think it is a good sign if landlords are selling up(although very sorry for your friends). Hopefully too many who thought they would buy property to invest, changing their minds…
How are landlords selling good? Those who rent and will never be able to buy where do they go ? Perhaps into the waiting list for a HNZ property and with the demand there. With obvious outcomes where is the govts action on coping with the consequences? A plan to build more in the future. When and what if those living in the present ???!
Thereon lies the big flaw in the govts announcement, it may slow house price inflation which has runaway but they did nothing to help renters at the same time… once again its help for the upwardly mobile.
Further stiffening the rights of renters particularly around giving notice needed to be part of the package…
Something like this from Switzerland perhaps…
Tenants have the right to know the grounds for termination. Notices of termination not made in good faith (such as notice of termination because the landlord is exercising his landlord's right, or on account of the tenants' changed family circumstances) may be contested before the conciliation authority. The official notice form explains how tenants should proceed when disputing a termination.
If the termination is likely to cause undue hardship for the tenants (financial or family difficulties, housing shortage), an extension of the term of the tenancy may be applied for at the conciliation authority.
The other oversight I would add that in Feb 21 the average property in me rose $50,000 and our leaders talk of substainable price rises going forward 🤷♀️. Not of the damage done in recent times.
I am yet to read anything or contributor here as to what this country looks like in 3,5+ years . IMO that outlook would frustrate many . As J Ritren sang “ no future, no future for me ..”
well done to the govt for being seen to do something but deliver crap all.
I think you mean J. Rotten or Johnny Rotten.
"Further stiffening the rights of renters particularly around giving notice needed to be part of the package…"
cough… rent freeze for 24 months…cough cough
"How are landlords selling good?"
Couple of ways….if the property was being held empty for capital gain it adds to the available stock….if the property was being used as an AirBnB, it adds to available stock.
If future rental stock is available at a lower price the pressure to reduce rents is increased, but most important of all, the realisation that property values are no longer a one way bet will bring some sanity back to the housing market and allow us to use housing as it should be….to house our population, not as a credit line for the few who seek to extract wealth from the many (and the broader economy)
There is no point in investors s buying property for a capital gain if there is no (or a CPI equivalent) capital gain….that capital will seek a new home, especially if they see their existing gains disappearing in a falling market.
In short, investors selling is a symptom of changed expectations….and that is beneficial to both FHB AND renters.
Has extending the brightline test and cutting the tax reduction on interest turned into a house being like a car sitting in the garage for years not knowing what you can sell it for?
The housing market hopefully is going to cool by 10%. This is advantageous to everyone BUT the seller.
Id suggest what the extended BL test and (especially) the change to interest deductibility have done is increase the costs to investors while they wait for the capital gain…it is a signal that if you are investing in existing property for capital gain then we are going to make it hard for you…especially when aligned with the exemption for new builds….that makes the business model for many investors, especially recent investors who have paid high prices, unworkable.
There are pretty much two questions that we are waiting to see the answer to….how many investment properties will re enter the market?…and will the Government stick to its position, or will they soften their message?
Or put another way, who will blink first.
"The housing market hopefully is going to cool by 10%. This is advantageous to everyone BUT the seller."
Dont think anyone can put a percentage on it…there are too many variables, but the sellers will not necessarily lose …if you bought your rental say 6 years ago and you sell now you take out that capital gain of around maybe 60-80% (median house 2014 $457000—median house price 2020 $725000) and not subject to BL….not a bad return Id suggest.
Hopefully the latest changes put a brake on property investors who only buy to sell due to house prices rocketing.
Government cannot soften their message because nothing else has worked. It's a vicious cycle as renters now need more government assistance to pay the rent and landlords know this.
1. How to support people to pay the rent without it going into the landlords hand is what needs to be actioned?
2. Some sort of tier percentage system on when the rental was purchased and how much the rent can increase?
Rent caps or other forms of rent control are another option but I suspect that would only be used if there is widespread rent hikes….and as noted yesterday many landlords have already had their annual shot at rent hikes so they cant till the years is up….I dont think many of them will wait until next year to decide what to do.
I think that, before evicting a tenant or increasing his rent, a landlord should be required to apply to Kainga Ora for a review of the situation to determine whether the eviction/rent increase would be justified. I would regard the recovery of the no longer deductible interest as not constituting an adequate reason for either action.
I’ve always wondered about banning tenders in the sale process. It creates a lot of anxiety which I reckon drives up the selling price as FOMO pushes people to put in bids way above the estimated value
Auctions are where the FOMO is most powerful, agents generally prefer them for that reason.
Auctions get the second best price (the winner only has to outbid the second best bid not bid with their top offer). Tenders means the seller gets the best price because everyone has to put in their best offer.
And this morning the deputy PM had fuelled the fire by “not ruling out rent freezes”. So what will landlords do … hike the rents as much as they can in the meantime to kick off any rent controls from a higher base.
However the deputy PMs credibility went from hero to zero this week so maybe we can just ignore him and carry on.
Maybe you can….and maybe you cant, how much are you willing to bet?
The investors have been offered a generous exit package, will enough of them take it or will they let greed cloud their thinking?
"investors have been offered a generous exit package"
Indeed – they get to keep the extraordinary wealth passively accumulated at the expense of others (including future generations) over the last two decades – minus a short blip post-GFC. Does anyone dare to go after some of this deplorable stash with a wealth tax – maybe to help fund a large state house building programme?
Whats immediately more important?….giving working Kiwis somewhere affordable to live or retribution?….Id plump for the former.
The state house building programme is underway and its acceleration is not immediately constrained by tax take.
The wealth accumulated in the last couple of decades is going to perpetuate unequal access to housing into the next generation through inheritance. I don't see it as retribution so much as correcting market perversity and returning to a slightly more level playing field. I do agree though that the primary purpose of a wealth tax is not raising revenue and that state house building is not tax take-constrained.
"…so maybe we can just …"
Who is this we you speak of?
Not entirely sure how say 5 separate people being forced out of a flat due to rent rises from this, for the sake of one of the few couples left, who manage to buy the flat as a home helps the 5 separate people find more affordable flats, when there are obviously less of them and the sudden demand, means the rent will just go up even more.
People to me seem to forget some people will just never be able to afford to own a house, and have to rent.
All this does is screw them.
I dont forget that at all…and is why property prices (and consequently rents) need to fall to affordable levels….10+ times median income is not that.
"But she said there were warning signs beneath the surface and many people were still doing it tough. More than a third were still living “payday to payday”.
“We know we are not out of the woods yet, there are more Covid-19 effects to roll through the economy and this research highlights some concerns. The fact that more than a third of people have less than a single week’s expenses available to them and almost half have less than $1000 in rainy day savings rings alarm bells for me. This puts them in a potentially vulnerable position."
https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/300262937/new-zealanders-mostly-better-off-but-some-doing-it-tough-bank-says
Coincidentally roughly a third of the population rent….reckon any more blood can be wrung out of that stone?
Well yes.
There are going to be people selling flats to couples (or other investers who sit on them for 10 years) or raising rents, to cover it, which means less flats available, which means even higher rent prices.
You can argue all you like the rents will be too high for people to cover it, but this just means more people joing the state housing waiting list, which is getting immense.
If first home buyers buy the properties landlords selll …
I always love this argument. If they coulda, they woulda…but they haven’t so they probably won’t
You mean if they coulda outbid an investor with their previously inherent advantage….lets see what happens now the competition is eased.
Assuming of course they have the deposit which is where I suspect the biggest issue lies.
Whether you think it is a good use or not Kiwisaver has provided assistance for many in that space….not all granted, but enough
For your info Pat these investors still have an advantage – Rates, maintenance etc are still able to be deducted for a reduction of tax and still allows a cash back advantage.
And what many have not understood these recent increases in price also distance new home purchasers with an increase of an already substantial deposit required. In feb the average price of a property increased by $50,000 a 20% deposit means that these 1st Home buyers in 28 days now required another $10,000 in deposit, and think what the impact of the increases that were achieved pre Feb 21??
And all of that explains why prices must fall or we consign home ownership in NZ to the dustbin.(and the likely exodus of our youth offshore….again)
The Gov have been bolder than I initially thought with this package and appear willing to accept a fall in property prices although they havnt explicitly said so…my guess is they would be happy for them to revert to what they were around a year ago ….good luck controlling the decline, theyll probably be the first in history if they pull it off, but at least theyre trying.
That will be a sure fire voter winner for the 65% of the population who don’t rent.
I dont rent but some of my children do, so do some of my friends and who knows circumstances may decide that one day I will….why is it so difficult to understand that peoples motives are not necessarily self serving?
This economic model is destroying everything that was best about this country/society so you may find that many of that 65% are quite happy for the 10% of the population who are investors to lose their gravy train…especially when it is wrecking their communities
Sorry, my estimate of property investors was woefully inaccurate….the 0.03% of the population who are property investors
I can imagine the election proposition – vote labour, let’s get house prices falling. Sure to be a winner.
zero point zero three percent….thats one hell of a constituency
Oh dear Pat, you said in an earlier post Labour are being bold to be the first government in history to accept a fall in house prices.
That affects the 65% who own, not just the 0.3% who invest! Sure to go down well with voters.
My house value could fall 50% tomorrow and I wouldnt care, nor would my mother if hers did similarly, 50% may cause a problem for one of my children but theyd survive….dont forget roughly a third of properties in NZ are mortgage free.
So to clarify, do house price falls only affect 0.3% of the population as you claim Pat?
Correction on my correction….3% or roughly 150,000 property investors.
Yeah yeah. But you still didn’t answer the question. Guess you can’t or don’t want to.
It’s a beautiful afternoon, certainly up here on the Kaipara. I’ll let you get back to the vino.
"So to clarify, do house price falls only affect 0.3% of the population as you claim Pat?"
Obviously not, and the size of the fall will be determinant however you were asking about how voters would view house price falls and I gave you a couple of voters perspectives.
While there are potential downsides to property price falls there are also upsides so what is the net position?…not just for individuals but the economy as a whole.
And if the expectation is the current trajectory is unsustainable then the correction will happen anyway….and the greater the debt the bigger the impact when it does.
Some pain today or lots of pain tomorrow?
I know every investors thinks they will be out before that happens but history shows most mistime it.
Actually David I know of many many fhb who have the deposit, but keep missing out due to investors. They will now have far less competition and will be able to secure their own first home.
What I don't get about investors bleating on about interest payments no longer being tax deductable is that any good business person who took out a loan at record low interest rates should have forecasted in a potential for interest rates to increase substantially, or even for the govt to make interest no longer tax deductable. Any person with half a brain who is investing should have factored that in.. They took the risk, things change, too bad.
And yes bring on a rent freeze. Or even better a national rent strike.
A national rent strike … sounds awesome…that would solve all the issues.
Glad you agree David. I see your time on the Standard is teaching you some things! Keep it up!
Perfect. Now we just need to work on our protest song. Here’s a starter for 10. With the brainpower here though I’m sure we can improve on it:
2, 4, 6, 8
we don’t want to pay our bills in a commy state
what do we want?
a free ride
when do we want it?
now
Nice one David – cue the dancing Cossacks. Tbh, I don't know what Muldoon was so het up about. National governments always 'transfer' public assets into private hands – it's what they do.
One 'problem' facing a fairly sizable minority of NZ citizens is the inability to pay for the necessities of life, wouldn't you agree? Maybe inequality in NZ has gone a little too far…
Wrong target David. It is land speculators who have been getting a free ride at the expense of tenants, people who need a home and those of us who do pay taxes.
"Communism" is fine when they benefit, it seems.
If we all end up paying much higher interest rates, it will be because of their borrowing also.
Goodness me, a traitor in our midst!
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/124674099/spies-catch-out-new-zealander-working-for-a-foreign-intelligence-agency
A foreign plot revealed coincidentally when the SIS is trying to deflect criticism and expand their surveillance powers? Must be legit.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/439030/sis-expansion-of-data-mining-powers-not-off-the-cards-andrew-little
Coincidentally, they released their Annual Report on Friday in which that information was made available to the public. Have you read the report? The photos of pristine New Zealand nature wouldn’t go amiss in a NZ Travel & Tourism brochure or a publication by DOC, all super-neutral, of course.
“… a traitor in our midst!”
What a surprise. Never happened before?
I know the identities of two NZers (maybe three) who were working for a 'foreign agency' in the 1970s and 1980s. They infiltrated the NZ Labour Party. Since the country concerned was a close geographical ally I guess that was alright. They could do what they liked and harass whoever they liked.![angry angry](https://cdn.ckeditor.com/4.11.3/full-all/plugins/smiley/images/angry_smile.png)
@ Sanctuary (3) ' … a traitor in our midst.' Must have gone full time since quitting politics.
Please don’t even go there, thanks. Some other commenter might be stupid enough to put this site at risk and that would be a real shame, don’t you agree?
@ Incognito (3.3.1) … noted.
He is the Very Model of a Modern Major-General
Prince Harry, AKA "The Big H", that scourge of Afghani shepherds, is obviously not the only "piece of work" in the British Army….
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-dorset-56524730
Connoisseurs of low-level British military scumbaggery might also like to check out the following…
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Ingram
Arguably the peers of Major General Welch are far far harsher than any peer of any current UK MP…
“emergency department struggles were symptomatic of the struggles the whole health system is facing.”
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/full-corridors-overworked-staff-an-eye-opener-for-ed-visitor/T67VDH3XGPT6NTUSMWPTPTH6JI/
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/code-black-at-dunedin-hospital-avoid-ed-if-possible/57SUM4GFWY73NWFJUO2HC5EFVA/
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/southern-district-health-board-restricts-surgeries-as-bed-demand-soars/3PPEK6PRGYWX2PKMVNY52ZA664/
So why is this happening, all over the country it seems?
It its not just short staffed, it is arrivals at hospital for treatment have vastly increased – especially for this time of the year.
Is it the same cause as the housing crises we have and clogged up Auckland streets – ie far too many new immigrants have been allowed into NZ over the last 20 years ?
Is it the Baby Boomer generation aging ?
Have we not been training enough of our own nurses and doctors?
What is the root cause ?
The roots are rotten and as every gardener knows that will cause a plant to go limp and die.
The A & E model needs to change so serious cases are triaged and a separate clinic run like a GP clinic adjacent to the premises. Fully staffed GP clinics need to run over the weekend at no extra cost.
More doctors and nurses are required. A shortage of specialists as well.
Had a chat with a senior ED nurse.
There needs to be a change in the way health care is delivered.
When someone is referred to ED/clinic etc the next steps must be available at the same time. eg Cat/MRI scan, Xray, dietician/nutrionist, mental health…
Folk often struggle to take that morning/afternoon/hour off as it is without scheduling further engagements.
I do like your answers at 5.3, gsays; enough so that I won't spoil them by replying directly.
But another cause behind the ED bottleneck is the drain of nurses to MIQ, vaccination, and more rewarding private work. Public health work conditions, in Dunedin hospital at least, are apparently pretty grim at the best of times for them.
How is vaccination ”another cause behind the ED bottleneck”?
The 2 ED nurses I know that are/were doing the MIQ stuff, where either working in Oz (clinic work in a remote town) or looking to exit health and grow their small dingo/digger truck business.
Both have talked about dismay with junior/inexperienced staff, cultural politics and being too busy, too often.
From my one step removed position I would answer:
“Is it the same cause as the housing crises we have and clogged up Auckland streets – ie far too many new immigrants have been allowed into NZ over the last 20 years ?”"
A lot of the aforementioned immigrants, are staffing the wards and EDs. This may influence the militancy/stauchness of the workforce, therefore the nursing unions.
“Is it the Baby Boomer generation aging ? ”
Yes, along with increased presentations of folk who cant afford to see a GP, drug seekers, alcohol impaired, mental ill health, entitlitis etc.
“Have we not been training enough of our own nurses and doctors?”
Yes. Nor do we pay them well enough.
“What is the root cause ?”
Neo-liberalism. Letting a market decide. When your DHB has a Chief Executive Officer as the highest paid on the payroll, its a sign of the times.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/business/439237/letters-mocking-struggling-queenstown-businesses-shock-recipients
A random meeting between the self-centred driven entrepreneurs being lauded in this country, trying hard to acquire enough custom from those with spare everything, and someone who has to count the pennies to get near that lifestyle and resents being pushed to the fringes.
And this is just a light touch on the cheek from the group finding social mobility difficult to achieve, tantalisingly available and then removed, perhaps in the 'gig' economy, or regularly denied and facing deprivation. Below such people are a mass who are at their wit's end, lacking wit for some time actually, becoming hopeless, munted, angry and holding in vengeful thoughts, just.
I saw this while looking for a source of retirement income apart from the traditional residential property, exchange traded shares, funds and fixed interest.
"We’re on a mission to simplify investment into high growth Kiwi companies.
"We want to make the capital market work much more efficiently for growth companies, so they can focus on selling their products to the world. We want to provide investors with a simple way to gain exposure to interesting investment opportunities – facilitating the flow of national savings into wealth-creating assets.
We’re driven by the significant positive impact we can make by building a thriving marketplace to connect growth companies with the capital they need.
Along the way we hope to develop the general financial literacy of the New Zealand public, and bring far more meaning and excitement to investing."
https://www.snowballeffect.co.nz/about
There's no cancel culture, right?
https://twitter.com/Miroandrej/status/1375147768348557324
https://twitter.com/Miroandrej/status/1375147785750724609
This shit should be a massive red flag for the left. Actually for everyone. Next time you see a woman being told that no-one is stopping them from speaking about their reality, understand that this is what is now routine in academia and has been increasing for quite some time. In another decade we, women, will have lost our ability to academic freedom around our own realities, and it's not like we were in a great place to begin with. And it won't end with women.
Stories here:
https://www.gcacademianetwork.org
and this. Women students are being marked down for writing that feminism is about the liberation of women.
https://twitter.com/RoisinMartin14/status/1375397369722908676
Looks to me like "cancel culture" now excuses getting lower marks for not keeping up with the subject area or lecturer's expectations.
No McFlook, it looks like cancel culture to me. And it pisses me off because it is cancelling the existence of the women's liberation movement and menstruating at the very least.
“I was encouraged to abandon about the problems menstruation posed ……..because it was deemed trans exclusionary.”
I would be interested to hear you views on what I have written below.
Most academic institutions have an appeals process if someone feels they have been penalised unfairly or inconsistently.
As for your comments below, one doesn't have to be male to perv at women, so it's not as if self-id would automatically stop police or anyone else objecting to someone behaving objectionably.
And no, zoom-calling in a conference room isn't "kosher". It might even be a criminal offence (intimate visual recording).
btw, I’ll be offline for several hours very soon – I should have held off rather than getting into a discussion.
Actually McFlook you are discounting my concerns about having men who id as women in changing rooms with your glib comment about “One doesn’t have to be a man to perv at women”. I am sure I have shared many a changing room with lesbians (guess that’s who you are referring to) and I have never felt uncomfortable about any women’s behaviour in a change room. I have also NEVER heard of police being called to women’s objectionable behaviour towards other women in a change room. It is a completely different dynamic with a man. Also women often walk around without towels etc in a change room. If gender self id “women” who were really men did this it would be very unpleasant. Surely you have heard about flashers. But how could it be proved “she” just walking from the shower to “her” locker.
I think women will feel really concerned about this, even if you men can’t imagine how that will be for a women. You have never lived with the unwanted male gaze. Have you not read the paper about how many time men have been filming women in bathrooms changerooms etc????
I meant that, as far as I know, literally every law in NZ against indecent acts or offensive behaviour, indecent assault or sexual violation, or crimes against personal privacy uses non-gendered language.
As for flashing in the changing rooms, sure, the possibilities for human stupidity are limitless. Some non-trans guy might try it. How do you see that conversation with the cops or changing room staff going down, realistically?
Flashing in a public change room human stupidity????? WTF McFlook. That jut tells me you know nothing about what it is like being a women. Your o.k. for men who have changed their gender to do these things and of course the police/change room staff with make it o.k………..Think by this stage the horse has bolted. If the "woman" acts like other women in the change rooms, then there will be nothing that can be done about it. All they have to do is walk from the shower to their locker without a towel with or without an erection and they are women right? Police could probably say wear a towel mate, but can't enforce.
Thinking that self-id will avoid any repercussion is the stupidity part of it.
So we have a flasher of the subtle breed who are acting completely normally without eye contact to see what reaction they're getting? Ok, not the usual type I've had to call the cops over back in the day, but ok. Assuming there is nothing, nothing, to show dodgy intent, they can still be barred by the facility because of their behaviour, because it makes other people uncomfortable.
Point is McFlook, I don't want men in women's changing rooms. Full stop. Most women I have run this by feel the same.
I understand you side with the gender self id bill/trans rights side. Yours entitled to your opinion. But I don't think your opinion on how its going to operate in women's changing rooms has any merit. It can't have. You have never been in one (I hope except maybe when you were a child).
I didn't need to go into the women's room to control access, catch flashers, or see how people dealt with men who thought they were discriminated against because they weren’t allowed to run for women's rep positions.
The idea that self-id makes facilities management and the police powerless to deal with offensive behaviour just isn't reflected in the real world.
But transwomen being unsafe in one changing room and unwelcome in the other? That is reflected in the real world.
"Most academic institutions have an appeals process if someone feels they have been penalised unfairly or inconsistently."
This tells me that you have no idea what is actually going on. Academics are afraid to speak out. This isn't hyperbole. The ones that do get their office doors pissed on, they get rape and death threats, they lose their careers. The women more than the men of course. To suggest that in this environment an appeals process is going to be useful other than as a political act is incredibly naive.
What’s happening on the left is the dismissal and the position that there is no debate, so there is no way for the issues to be aired and resolved. That too should be a big fucking red flag for the left. It’s not like the left is immune to authoritarianism.
It's a bit unfair to post links about getting marked down in assignments and then argue that anyone who responds should be responding to unmentioned but more serious complaints.
Try writing a paper about a steady-state model of the universe sometime (as opposed to "Big Bang" theory), and see how that gets marked.
good to know you are ok with academia redefining feminism to mean a liberation movement for all people and educating its students to that effect against the wishes of many feminists including MA students.
I mean, it's always enlightening when men give away women's rights. Again. Maybe try putting up some actual arguments, I'd love to know where this goes. Feminist academics are raising the issue, and men are going, yeah, nah, nothing to worry about there.
Thanks again Weka. Yes I feel people are not really aware of what's going on re this issue.
Academic concepts and even disciplines get "redefined" every day. It's called "expanding the sum of human knowledge".
And in this case it's also according to the wishes of many women, and not only trans women at that.
When you can not conduct a study on women (biological or trans) and you can not discuss the impact of menstruation and menstruation products when in this country we have young vaginal beings not going to school for lack of menstruation products (and maybe there even is a trans boy or five in the group ) then academia is getting dumb, and discriminatory. Cause women who identify as women and would like to get treated as such exist. And we too would like to be identified as to our on self ID. And we would like our rights, and our safety taken seriously, cause we die the world over often at the hand of penis humans.
And i would just venture a guess that you have never refused an outing or been refused a promotion a job or such on the grounds that you may get your period, or that you may get pregnant, or that you may have given birth, or that you may have lost a pregnancy.
So really please, take your male privilege and ask yourself why women who identify as women, who were born as women, who have born literally every man that is, need to take what little rights we have gained over the last hundred years and give it up to accomodate and be surplanted by trans women. Cause the discussion is only affecting women.
No, it really isn't. Not according to the opponents of self-id, anyway.
Is this a discussion about a seat of the table and only 10 seats are there, so one needs to be knocked of to free up a seat? Or will this be a discussion about finding another seat and adding it the table?
Hear hear Sabine. Totally agree. Great stuff!
McFlook then what do you see as the solution for trans women in changing rooms? What if women aren't comfortable with this?
Every concern and reservation I have have had about the gender self id bill you have dismissed. It sounds like you think women like me and there are many of us should put up and shut up. Is this how you see it?
You can see why as feminists it is a double problem for us. A. Maybe we don't want trans women in our change rooms. B. Men such as yourself seem to be dismissing this.
You also didn't answer whether you though it was a credible scenario that men would change their sex to have easy access to women and children. Is that o.k. by you because we can ring the police?
1: Trans women already use womens' changing rooms.
2: I have also listened to other non-trans women who disagree with your position. And trans women, and trans men. I suspect that you are, as they say, "on the wrong side of history", and quite possibly the legislation will change within months, regardless of any arguments here.
3: Some feminists and non-trans women agree with you. Others disagree with you. There does not seem to be any middle ground on this issue.
4: "Credible"? 2.5 million men, sure. Someone might try changing their birth certificate as an excuse to get unchallenged access to women and children. Will it work? Significantly less likely. Will it result in greater harm than if 50,000-odd trans people are policed about which changing rooms they go into regardless of birth certificate, not even including instances of non-trans women being challenged because they don't conform to feminine norms? I don't think so. That's why I have the position I have.
“Being on the wrong side of history” would never stop me from supporting a cause I believe in. Standing up for women’s rights is not something I d we oils drop because I might be on the wrong side of history.
but thanks to discussion on this blog and to you I have become better informed. What I have discovered about these issues worries me more. How debate/women’s voices are being silenced. Only this weekend gone at the pride event in Wellington a woman who is a lesbian who has terminal cancer was on a stall at the event. She left the stall briefly to take scissors and tape to a group of “reefs” in this case elderly lesbians who had been banned from pride who were protesting outside. In trying to re-gain entry 4 organisers including a very large male person intercepted her, accused her of carrying an offensive weapon. She still had her bag at the stall. She stood up to them and refused to budge. They man handled her and called the police. These older women have fought the good fight for lesbian and gay rights. What sort of treatment is this? Young people gathered and started chanting fucking terfs. An aggressive and vocal minority is shutting women’s. Voices down
Btw in the last week two cases of trans being barred from women’s changing rooms
Is that generational divide typical of your observations of the different sides to the issue?
It seems to be the case down here, but a heavily thespian social group in a college town is the practical definition of "sample bias".
Yes I think that is reasonably accurate, i.e. a generation divide.
Having read a bit more about it i.e. trans issues, I understand and feel free to disagree, that a lot of the children who identify as trans have other mental health issues such as anorexia and self harm. They also experience gender dysphoria. An approach that has been encouraged with their parents is to validate their wanting to be a different sex. This started to occur 20 years ago and so now we have a generation of young people who identify as trans. This I don't believe has ever happened before. From this point of view I acknowledge how very vulnerable some of these individuals must feel.
My perspective is a rigorous radical campaign has been mounted for trans rights, including the right to say there are real women. My understanding is if this is challenged is it vociferously, aggressively shot down. I think there is an enormous amount of solidarity in numbers group think going on.
I noticed McFlook that someone accused you of mysogeny and others implied as a man you shouldn't be taking about this issue. But I don't want to stop you from doing this, because this is a part of what I am objecting to with the trans activists. People have their voices shot down/cancelled.
other mental health issues
You are still denying that trans is actually a thing. A while ago i said that i see this as where the gay thing was forty years ago. Back then there was still a lot of people who saw being gay as a mental illness. Now when people say that they are not taken seriously, they are considered bigots. So yes the wrong side of history you are on this i think also.
It is not surprising that trans people experience mental health issues with so many people denying their identity is real:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/115867340/kiwi-transgender-and-nonbinary-people-at-higher-risk-of-suicide–survey
Cheers – the accusation did give me pause for thought, but that's usually a good thing.
The issue of trans kids and their mental health has a fair bit of research, which is why validation starts early. The main worry is suicide and depression. But are these comorbidities, or are they the consequences of social responses to how trans people are treated by society? When social discrimination is killing people, there's a strong campaign for rights for those people. And trans people have been part of the queer rights movement all the way back to before Stonewall.
I have friends with trans kids (in both directions). The kids and young adults seem to be happier now than my peers from back at the same age who have since transitioned. But also the young thesps just seem more fluid and accepting of themselves and each other, by and large. Still dramas (natch lol), but less judgy of each other's bits and more willing to stand up for each other (although they still have the young person thing of going overboard without thinking, maybe like in responding to that protest you mentioned).
The babies my friends had in their early twenties are leaving/left the nest. They generally seem to be better people than I was (and many of my peer group) at that age.
you are entitled to think it like where the gay thing was forty years ago. I accept that is your view. I see it differently. Gay people were not telling me they were really heterosexual nor were they deconstructing my identity, eg referring to me as a person who f…Ed men.
I was still a heterosexual woman.
I don’t believe I have ever been anything but pleasant and respectful when I have met trans people. You then accused me of being disrespectful about them on-line, but when challenged didn’t provide any evidence that I had been. I did a check with Mc flook who said I hadn’t been.
I am still reading and finding out about this stuff.
I am a feminist and hearing things about elderly lesbians being banned from pride, because they are not prepared to say trans women (not those who have transitioned) are real women. Said women who have been attending pride since it began don’t deserve to have 100 or so young people chanting fucking terfs at them.
there was a woman who happens to have terminal cancer who was staffing a stall at pride. She went out to give the protesters some tape and scissors for their banner, and when she went to go back in 4 people including a large man tried to man handle her out of the venue. She stood her ground and so they called the police. Utterly disgraceful in my opinion. Also because she had scissors caused her of carrying an offensive weapon. I mean ffs. This is disgraceful. She told them she had cancer.
I accept mental health issues are significant in the trans community. I did comment that they were vulnerable. Btw, I do have a criticism of the study. It really needed to have a control group of non trans young people, rather than extrapolating from other studies.
I still think we need to look at the Dunedin multi disciplinary study for gold standard research on this issue.
It only has a thousand participants, so at 1%, that's 10 trans people to do the heavy lifting?
Surveying trans people and comparing their responses with previous and more general surveys might be the spanner for that job, rather than the dunedin study.
Can't see anything searching their journal publications database. But if you see an article you don't have access to, we might be able to sort something out between us. I could remember how to use dropbox, or flip email it to a mod and they can flip it to you, if willing. There's also an openaccess research site somewhere (like pirating movies, but for academic research because journals cost $$$).
@Anker
I am not sure that you read the words you write.
You said:
a lot of the children who identify as trans have other mental health issues such as anorexia and self harm.
That can only be taken to mean that you consider being trans to be a mental health issue. If that is not what you meant then why say "other"? You say offensive things and then complain when people are offended.
sorry for the confusion Solkta.
DSMV1 talks about gender dysphoria. and I assume that many Trans people have gender dysphoria. This would cause psychological distress.
I don't deny trans is a thing. Checked out some trans activist blog sites tonight as I was trying to become more informed.
When I trained it was called Gender Identity disorder.
You seem to want to cast me as anti trans. This is not true. I don't really care too much. But I do care about how women's voices are being shut down and how my identity as a women is being de-constructed.
Would it help if we (again) re-acquainted ourselves with the meanings of the words "sex" and "gender"?
SUFW prefers (and why not?) the United Nations' definitions….
…it is our recommendation that New Zealand policy makers adopt definitions set up by United Nations Equality Glossary (2017). In particular, we suggest the following:
Sex (biological sex)
The physical and biological characteristics that distinguish males and females.
Gender
Gender refers to the roles, behaviours, activities, and attributes that a given society at a given time considers appropriate for men and women. In addition to the social attributes and opportunities associated with being male and female and the relationships between women and men and girls and boys, gender also refers to the relations between women and those between men. These attributes, opportunities and relationships are socially constructed and are learned through socialisation processes. They are context/time-specific and changeable. Gender determines what is expected, allowed and valued in a woman or a man in a given context.
Sex, what you were born with, is forever. It can't be changed.
It is possible with a great deal of medical and surgical intervention to alter one's appearance so as to look like the other sex, but you'll still be the sex you were born with.
Gender, on the other hand, has forever been whatever society/culture/fashion tries to dictate. Today it is possible to express yourself in whatever way floats your boat. Good on you.
But just because you dislike wearing frocks and would not be seen dead in stilettos,and putting on make-up seems like an act of dishonesty, it does not necessarily follow that you were 'born into the wrong body'.
Today, and because many women have fought long and hard to throw of the shackles of what we used to term 'sex-role-stereotypes', you can be yourself without have to resort to extreme medical and surgical interventions.
What The Bill intends is to make the impossible…changing one's sex…possible.
If you had any insight into how the women reading this are assessing you I'm sure you would be horrified. But honestly you clearly have no idea and little insight. It's good really seeing frank misogyny laid bare. Dissolves any illusion we can't unsee it either.
Given some of those individual's expressed opinions of trans women and many academics of any gender, I would seem to be in good company.
Having done an English degree a little over a decade ago, I ran across a little of this. Our feedback system had no box for us to object to it – but I felt it was a gratuitously offensive waste of time at my and other students' expense. If I'd wanted to do gender wars, I'd've taken a course in it – my expectations were literary, a bit of Trollope maybe. No surprise that the humanities have been obliged to downsize.
Thanks Weka for posting this. We need to speak up about this sort of shit.
I commented last week about the gender self id bill and have written to the Minister about this.
Our identity as women is being deconstructed. I read today that the term maternity care and being a mother is being challenged as the language needs to be more inclusive. As is not just women giving birth.
I have been thinking about how sexist this is. I don't know of the equivalent i.d men being referred to as people who get erections or people who ejaculate. Yet there is an attempt to describe women as menstruaters or birthing units, or people with vaginas.
My go to for the best information is the Dunedin Multidisciplinary study. I say this because it is a prospective study that measures health and social outcomes. I would be interested to know what the rates of trans people there are in this cohort who are now in their 40s. Unfortunately I. have not been able to find out about whether that has been published or not. I suspect the rate is extremely low.
I am also objecting to the term Terf. When one group (trans activists) give another group a pejoritive label then it is deeply problematic to say the least.
More on this, I commented last week about the gender self id bill and some people poo pooed what I said.
Anybody dare to tell me that it is fanciful to imagine a scenario where sex offenders (and other men who might want to film women changing or peeing but don't have a criminal recored), change their gender to become a women. Then merrily waltz in to changing rooms at gyms, pools, woman's stores etc. They are free to perv at women and girls, free to expose themselves to women. And then when women call the cops, the cops can only say, sorry but he is a woman. This week alone there appears to be some sort of fracas with a "person" who had the body of a man being restrained by cops because of some incident in Glasons. There was also a report about David Farrar (yes I know I have no time for him) but he was in a male change room at the gym and some goof was on a zoom conference call. Farrar wasn't sure whether it was kosher or not
Yet there is an attempt to describe women as menstruaters or birthing units, or people with vaginas.
This language more about the contrary; some NB and trans-men are people with vaginas and menstruate.
As for the t-word:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/nov/29/im-credited-with-having-coined-the-acronym-terf-heres-how-it-happened
That is a very worthwhile read, thank you. Thought she said things very clearly.
I can only speak for myself Sacha, but what civil rights do you think I am denying?
What Civil Rights do you think groups such as the speak up for women are denying?
I am commenting on this issue because I am against the Gender Self ID Bill. That doesn't mean trans people can't change their sex on their birth certificate, it just means there is a process they have to go through.
I understand some feminist groups are not wanting to involve trans women in their meetings. But I think that is their right. Our experiences from trans women are very different. We have grown up with sexism since we were young girls. They have grown up with a very difficult situation of not feeling like the sex they were assigned.
In the 70's when I first became a feminist there were lesbian women who were separatists. So they wanted to meet and associate with each other and not with us. I had no problem with that.
As I have posted before the language now being used by some about women (menstruators, birthing units and people with vaginas I believe de-constructs my identity as a woman. I find it de-humanizing. As already posted it has been proposed to have a judicial enquiry into the gender self id bill on the basis of it nulifying what a women is.
I wonder what your thoughts are about what Weka is saying about academia?
BTW you asked a question about me assault last week. I gave quite a lengthy response about what happened. I guess you missed it.
The process of changing your birth certificate as it stands is very dehumanizing itself, as you are no doubt aware Anker. Also rather expensive.
But it does seem appropriate that you champion separatism. Given the link explaining how an early version of TERF that never really caught on was TES (trans-exclusionary seperatist).
actually that could be changed easily by law.
Go online, .govt – change birth certificate and reduce any fees. That is something government can do.
I don't exclude Trans when i ask why i am now called a pregnant person, menstruating people etc. The question is why can we not called pregnant women? Because a transman is being a partime women in order to give birth? A man is pregnant? Really? Does that make me exclusionary?
Maybe it should be pregnant people when talking about trans women, and maybe it should be pregnant women when a women gets pregnant? Or would that too be exclusionary?
Before covid I had hired a transwomen. She lived for 28 years a man, and in her country that afforded her all the trimmings of male privilege, and she admits it. She is not going to be trans in her country as it would be deadly, so she came here. Do i feel her as a women? No, i don't Why – god knows, maybe its pheromone etc.? In saying that i don't feel her as a man. Go figure. But will i treat her as a women as a human being, as i would like to be treated by others, and ever now and then help her understand what it is to be women in our world, yes. Very funny tho when her boyfriend and her both applied at the same business for line cook postitions and she was offered a lower wage…….Welcome to the world of women, i said. Her look? Priceless.
I am not aware of what is involved in changing your birth certificate. That in my opinion is not a good reason to allow gender self id. It may be that there are aspects of the process that can be altered e.g. the cost. I would need to know more about the process to understand how it is de-humanizing. Going through life most of us will encounter difficult processes.
I am not championing separatism as such, merely offering that there are many occasions where we are all excluded from some groups.
I am not part of any feminist group currently, so whether I exclude trans women is mute. Like Sabine when I come across Trans people, I am respectful and civil, just like I am with any person I meet. So the label Trans exclusionary seperatiist doesn't really fit.
Anker
But surely that's the substance of the Gender Self ID Bill that you oppose?
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/mothballed-gender-self-id-law-back-as-a-priority-for-govt-will-pass-this-year-minister-says/CIPLGCHFKCK5OB5MOBNYTQ36RQ/
Sabine
Some Intersex & NB, as well as Trans men are also people with uteri.
the current process seems appropriate to me. It is a big thing to change the sex on your birth certificate. I am sorry if it is a lengthy, expensive and difficult thing to change. Some things are e.g becoming a NZ citizen, immigrating to NZ especially under Covid. That doesn't make the processes wrong or right.
I don't support the Gender self id bill. Labour didn't as far as I can see have it as one of their election promises.
More that NZF held it up procedurally for the three years of last term.
It is a small change that will mean a lot to many Aotearoans. I don't believe that you are at all sorry for those whose identities are in limbo for years if not decades (17 years being the waiting list for the bottom surgery alone, even before the Pandemic). Plus there's still a lot of room for improvement around Nonbinary people too.
Biblical literalism, and centuries of colonialism have not left us many examples of that. Even Takitapui feels a bit reconstructed as much as extant culture. Good to have Kerekere in the parliamentary mix though. I guess the Heritage foundation's strategy of turning those with nontraditional gender expression against one another is working out pretty well for them…
Rambling, but at least you know what's in the bill you are opposing now, Anker.
…at least you know what's in the bill…
https://www.legislation.govt.nz/bill/government/2017/0296/latest/whole.html#LMS55955
RMcD, thanks for the link. I have tried to wade through the legalese of that a couple of times before, but my eyes just glaze over! The NZH summary above is more readable, though hardly complete.
Thanks Rosemary.
Forget now, I hear it will mean a lot to many. You don't have to believe whether I am sorry or not. You are entitled to interpret what I say any way you want.
I think Sabine raises a very good point about the process of immigrating here. A rigorous costly process.
Trans people are still entitled to identify whatever gender they want to.
I also agree with Greywarshark that a minority are trying to change gender and sexual identification. No one is stopping them being trans. We are talking about a significant change to official documentation.
As I have said before, I can't change my ethnicity (at all) or my age for that matter.
Bend me, break me, anyway you make me… That is how many women and people feel about this minority that have taken centre stage to turn ordinary life on its side because they have a strong desire to make change! It's a tide of demands that is flooding us trying to stuff up the whole world and our very basic identities to suit the discontented.
There are only so many James Morris' around; the present growth of supplicants is through a power grab by gripe-merchants over young people faced with a convusing, fast-changing world, the control of which has been wrested from the orbit of ordinary people. A majority are facing poverty and homelessness and uncertainty because of ploys of the callous people pulling golden strings at the top. The meme is education and technology is the answer for all ills yet we can see the ills clearly but nothing can or will be done till the technocrats and the pollies trying to use them, have decided on the value to them of fixing them, affecting our fate, and devised a suitable budget to display. We are drowned in theoreticians words and economic inertia and the sort of science that wants to experiment in real time on real people.
This struck me as pertinent; Terry Pratchett's Thief of Time excerpt:
The concept of 'orders' was yet another and immensely unfamiliar one for any Auditors. They were used to decisions by committee, reached only when the possibilities of doing nothing whatsoever about the matter in question had been exhausted. Decisions made by everyone were decisions made by no-one, which therefore precluded any possibility of blame. (p.314 in my p/back.)
I have no issues with a transman wanting to be a 'parent', I have an issue with the statements of a 'man ' being pregnant, it is the female body of that transman who is pregnant. So the fair description would be 'transman' or 'self identified other'. And then feel free to call these groups of people people. But the vast majority of pregnancy happens to women who identify as women and historically it is the women bodies have been doing all of the worlds breeding. But thanks for the education, were would i be without it. .
And if you think that providing a medical certificate is dehumanising think about migrating. I presented several medical certificates to the immigration services, police certificates from every country i ever lived in, birth certificate, marriage certificate and photos, and letters, and more to prove that i am legally married and that my marriage was consumed. And it costs an arm and a leg and we are quite happy to demand even more from migrants today.
Maybe we really need to re-think the term of de-humanising and realise that it is not dehumanizing to prove that you went through a process to change your physical appearance of whom you were born into your real self in order to change every offical document ever issued to you.
.
arkie, I assume you are a man? I am unhappy with my identity as a woman being deconstructed. As someone posted last week the gender self I’d bill, nulifies a women’s identity and if they try and pass I understand there will be a judicial review.
I didn’t read the whole article about who coined the term terf. It appears to be a woman who was speaking up for transgender rights. That isn’t the issue. The issue is what happens when a term not chosen by a group is used by an opposing group in a perjorative way to write that group off.
I belong to a number of groups that are exclusive. That is normal. I can’t join my husbands tribe because I am not Maori and he is. I very much doubt I could easily change my ethnicity. Trans people may or may not be members of groups I am a part of.
I don’t exclude trans people when I meet them in my day to day life
Hi McFlook, yeah I have checked the Dunedin study and they don't seem to have done anything on Trans. I choose that study as my go to source of science, because they really are scientists who are interested in what their research discovers rather than trying to prove a theory. For example their marvellous work on self control. Not popular with many people on the left because they have an ideology that they use to explain social problems. I am not saying that some ideology doesn't explain social/health issues e.g poverty's long term effect on health outcomes, even if people become financially well off in adulthood.
I would be interested to see the numbers who identified as Trans in the Dunedin study and at what age and what mental health outcomes and were the mental health outcomes correlated to other factors. Twelve is a very small sample, but I would be fascinated to see what the trajectory was for Trans people at all ages and stages. I would trust whatever they found.