The Jamilee tweets

Written By: - Date published: 7:49 am, October 18th, 2018 - 246 comments
Categories: Abuse of power, Dirty Politics, internet, Media, Politics, Simon Bridges, you couldn't make this shit up - Tags: , ,

I wish this was not happening. My work is piling up and my unread unprocessed emails are getting to terrifying levels. But twitter is so interesting. Every day tweets appear that act like mini explosions and cause chaos to National’s hopes of appearing to be united and coherent.

The current destruction of the National Party is such fun to watch.

And it is really ironical that National is being torn apart by the forces of Dirty Politics, that bastard child of a political technique born and nurtured in the former Prime Minister’s office but with the chief protagonists being cast aside after Nicky Hager cast sunlight on the practice.

Because it has emerged that Jami-Lee Ross is being advised by Simon Lusk, one of Dirty Politics’ chief protagonists.

The problem is that the left has for a long time understood and known what was going on deep in the right’s collective thought processes. But we could not prove it. And their PR was so good. They were able to appear to be sympathetic to community, supportive of ethnic diversity and forward looking in their vision.

Fast forward to yesterday. We have an entirely new scenario. One informed by what has been happening in real time. Because one of their MPs has gone rogue and is providing the digital proof of all the shit cutting and conspiring that has happened recently.

The response to the first Jamilee tape was interesting. Initially there was a degree of angst, why wasn’t there a smoking gun, a “you got me bang up to rights” admission concerning the donations?  Although there certainly is a case to answer concerning the dividing up of a donation to levels that meant the donation did not have to be disclosed and questions why he hid the donation from Aaron Bhatnagar under the description of “Cathedral Club”.

It is the other parts of the tape that have caused consternation.

Like calling West Coast based list MP Maureen Pugh fucking useless.

For me the jaw dropping aspect of the tape was their complete indifference to their ethnic MPs who clearly are no more than piggy banks.  As can be seen from this part of the transcript of the tape:

Bridges: I mean, it’s like all these things, it’s bloody hard. You’ve only got so much space. Depends where we’re polling, you know? All that sort of thing…two Chinese would be nice, but would it be one Chinese or one Filipino? What do we do?

Ross: Two Chinese would be more valuable than two Indians, I have to say.

Bridges: Which is what we’ve got at the moment, right? Your problem there is you end up in a s***fight because you’ve got a list MP – you’ve got two list MPs – it’s a pretty mercenary cull – sitting MPs, all that s***. Then you’ve got the issue of, you could end up getting rinsed with list MPs and bringing in some of those new ones, and if you do that you’re just filling up your lists even further. You’ve got to sort of look after…I mean I reckon there’s two or three of our MPs, not talking about our obvious ones like Finlayson or Carter, the rest you just want to go. Like Maureen Pugh is f***ing useless.

I hope ethnic communities have heard this loud and strong.

And as I type this the latest bombshell has hit the interweb.  Melanie Reid at Newsroom has published an article about the concerns of four women about inappropriate activity by Ross.

Hang on.  This is going to be an interesting day.

246 comments on “The Jamilee tweets ”

  • Comments are now closed

  1. ScottGN 1
    18 October 2018 at 7:54 am

    Melanie Reid on Morning Report now.

    • Cinny 1.1
      18 October 2018 at 8:01 am

      That newsroom article…….

      Didn’t Nicky Hager refer to similar behaviour in Dirty Politics?

      • Ed 1.1.1
        18 October 2018 at 8:15 am

        We just don’t know which side is using the Dirty Politics playbook.
        Probably both sides.
        Hence so diabolical.

        • Cinny 1.1.1.1
          18 October 2018 at 8:36 am

          Am so sure there was something in his Dirty Politics book about such behaviour.

            • patricia bremner 1.1.1.1.1.1
              18 October 2018 at 10:13 am

              Yes Cinny, and it goes a long way towards explaining the behaviour of some women in National. They must be tough.
              Both Jenny Shippley and Judith Collins using their influence to use people and getting burned.
              Nasty personal attacks made in house and in parliament. Amy Adams did this and Paula Bennett.
              We never found the source of the nastiness about Clarke Gayford, and now we find it was ‘like Hollywood’ for some women staffers.
              The pattern of Dirty Politics is plain to see. Did JLR attend the parties?
              The attitudes are scary. The plan to bring ‘like minded candidates on board,’ as expressed by Lusk and Whaleoil in support of Judith. Are we seeing the outcomes now? Rewarding donors and shopping for candidates. A sickening underbelly, as two factions in the so called united National ranks divide.?
              It definitely feels like their will be more revelations.

        • mickysavage 1.1.1.2
          18 October 2018 at 8:39 am

          Que?

          Have you noticed how Labour has kept right out of this?

          It is purely self inflicted by competing forces within National.

          • Dukeofurl 1.1.1.2.1
            18 October 2018 at 8:57 am

            I think Ed meant ‘both sides’ of this National party infighting

          • SpaceMonkey 1.1.1.2.2
            18 October 2018 at 9:01 am

            I read Ed’s comment as “which side [within National]…” so yeah, absolutely… I reckon implosion has a much nicer dynamic to it than explosion, perhaps because it’s cleaner.

          • alwyn 1.1.1.2.3
            18 October 2018 at 10:05 am

            You mean that the Labour Party MPs are keeping quiet.
            Hangers on are certainly going off like Catherine wheels.
            Let the supporters throw the mud. Just pretend the leaders aren’t involved.
            Do you remember how your beloved party threw mud at Don Brash about an affair he had. Trevor Mallard, himself just dumped by his wife, threw the mud around with gay abandon while Helen Clark looked on happily.
            That didn’t work out to well for Labour of course as the new leader was the supreme politician of our time and wiped the Labour Government out at the next election.
            I’ve noticed comments by some people who are reasonably closely connected to the party tossing mud around. Some of them were close enough to the party to compete for the nominations in safe Labour seats.

            • mickysavage 1.1.1.2.3.1
              18 October 2018 at 10:07 am

              It was over 10 years ago Alwyn, let it go …

              Others are not throwing mud around. Just commenting on the mud that senior figures in the National Party are throwing around with gay abandon.

              • alwyn …
                18 October 2018 at 10:19 am

                It wouldn’t matter if the people involved in the smearing of Brash had all gone from the House.
                Trevor Mallard is still there unfortunately.
                There are other people, much more recently involved with the Labour Party, who are involved now of course.

                • Dukeofurl …
                  18 October 2018 at 1:27 pm

                  he was doing it directly – across the floor of the house – sledging if you like.
                  Paula seems to have dropped from view today for some reason while their proxies like Farrar have been ‘doing media since 6am’

            • AB 1.1.1.2.3.2
              18 October 2018 at 12:03 pm

              “the supreme politician of our time..”
              Lols – your infatuation with a grimy sleazeball like John Key does you no favours Alwyn:
              – enabler of tax-dodging foreign trusts
              – enabler of mass surveillance
              – enabler of dirty politics
              – enabler of a housing bubble that enriched his supporters, permanently impoverished others and elevated the pursuit of unearned income via speculation to the highest good a citizen could strive for
              – enabler of water-theft and environmental degradation by the dairy industry
              – corrupter of our electoral system with the Epsom rort
              etc. etc. etc.

              Key marked the end-point of a corrupt ideology. When he disappeared without trace, nobody could find anything to say about his legacy. His extraordinary forgettability is (ironically) the only reason to remember him.
              It’s over Alwyn, done, gone, never to return, an aberration, a curse.

            • Draco T Bastard 1.1.1.2.3.3
              18 October 2018 at 1:37 pm

              Do you remember how your beloved party threw mud at Don Brash about an affair he had.

              Context matters. IIRC, Brash had been going on about the sanctity of marriage while having an affair. It was the hypocrisy that was the problem – not the affair.

          • Skinny 1.1.1.2.4
            18 October 2018 at 12:45 pm

            “Two sources close to Auckland Mayor Phil Goff’s 2016 mayoral campaign said they recalled Zhang buying an item or two at a fund-raising auction.”

            “The September 2016 auction raised $250,000, with $150,000 coming for a copy of a book Goff donated, authored and signed by Chinese President Xi Jinping. Zhang was not the buyer of the book. Two sources close to Goff’s mayoral campaign said they recalled Zhang buying an item or two at the auction.” From NZH

            Goff raised a cool $600,000 for his mayoral campaign. The Pugh equivalent, the hapless Labour MP Raymond Huo, the Chinese community go to man for the party and probably behind most of Goff funding. So little wonder Labour are silent on this ‘can of worms’.

            In today’s Hearld they just say National are better at donation collecting. Labour are at it too. The PR of C are making a game of it.

            • Dukeofurl 1.1.1.2.4.1
              18 October 2018 at 1:16 pm

              “About 350 people attended the fundraising dinner at the Imperial Palace restaurant in Ellerslie where bidding on a book, The Governance of China, written and signed by Chinese President Xi Jinping, started at $5000 and sold to a phone bidder from China for $150,000.

              I wonder if the esteemed owner of the Imperial Palace restaurant was connected to the person who Goff was happy recommend for an NZOM honour and a restauranteur?

              Some book !

        • Bearded Git 1.1.1.3
          18 October 2018 at 12:17 pm

          Where is Jason Ede?

          • Dukeofurl 1.1.1.3.1
            18 October 2018 at 1:23 pm

            Where is jase ?

            ‘Communications & Strategy Manager at Property Institute of New Zealand (PINZ)’
            https://www.propertyinstitute.nz/
            PINZ was formed in the year 2000 to act as the voice of property professionals and incorporated the membership of the New Zealand Institute of Valuers (NZIV), the Institute of Plant & Machinery Valuers (IPMV), and the Property & Land Economy Institute of New Zealand (PLEINZ).

            Not the same as the Property Council of NZ, where Rachel MacGregor ended up.
            ‘Property Council exists to champion the property industry’

    • Gabby 1.2
      18 October 2018 at 9:04 am

      ‘How come you’ve been sitting on this for a year Mel?’ asks Soozy.
      Oh no, she doesn’t.

      • Macro 1.2.1
        18 October 2018 at 9:37 am

        🙂
        Yep! Same thoughts here.

      • Skinny 1.2.2
        18 October 2018 at 3:12 pm

        I have spoken to some of the MSM shills about this subject they just say they don’t go down that Avenue. I gathered there was musical beds going on amongst some of their own.

        Still the same I bet they bank sleaze files for a rainy day. Looks like Mel was waiting for the pending storm and cashed in. Now going into the long weekend on cloud nine.

  2. Dennis Frank 2
    18 October 2018 at 8:07 am

    Looking like JLR is one of those Jekyll & Hyde folk, so the mental health angle would be schizoprenia. The picture painted by Melanie Reid is vivid: https://www.newsroom.co.nz/@politics/2018/10/17/281200/jami-lee-ross-four-women-speak-out

    • Barfly 2.1
      18 October 2018 at 8:18 am

      Not schizophrenia try again.

      • Ankerrawshark 2.1.1
        18 October 2018 at 8:40 am

        Psychopath and dangerous with it…

        • Skinny 2.1.1.1
          18 October 2018 at 1:20 pm

          Goodfellow may have to reach into the slush fund to pay for a real Mr Fix It. One that makes problems go away permanently.

          Ross is one totally unhinged puppy.

          • Dukeofurl 2.1.1.1.1
            18 October 2018 at 1:32 pm

            Narcissist is more like it – then again not unusual in national .

            • Dennis Frank 2.1.1.1.1.1
              18 October 2018 at 1:52 pm

              When people tell the public they had a mental breakdown, as he did, why would anyone think narcissism explains it?? Obviously he’s a narcissist, but there’s clearly more to it than that! Especially as the texter referred to a past such episode. I’m curious as to why he isn’t clarifying this, and why the media isn’t trying to clarify it either. Not private information since he disclosed it – so you can’t invoke the privacy law.

    • Dukeofurl 2.2
      18 October 2018 at 9:01 am

      The story and one of the women actually names it
      ‘Once you realise what narcissists are, they actually become very predictable and formulaic.’

    • marty mars 2.3
      18 October 2018 at 9:38 am

      “Stigma can take a heavy toll on people who suffer from mental illness. Being shunned, feared, devalued and discriminated against can impair recovery and deepen social isolation and distress. Many sufferers judge stigma to be more difficult to cope with than the symptoms of their illness.

      …
      Schizophrenia is also often misused to refer to split personality or incoherence. This Jekyll-and-Hyde misconception persists despite countless corrections. ”

      https://www.google.com/amp/s/theconversation.com/amp/either-mad-and-bad-or-jekyll-and-hyde-media-portrayals-of-schizophrenia-12391

      Please leave diagnosis to professionals Dennis.

      • Dennis Frank 2.3.1
        18 October 2018 at 9:45 am

        Yes, no need to tell me about the deep social context of that stuff. I’ve got several dozen books about it & have been fascinated by it since I was a teenager. Won’t digress into the topic now but clearly that dimension of JLR is crucial to what’s been happening. Political analysts will keep trying to avoid factoring it in due to pc-conformism but they can’t hide from reality forever!

        • marty mars 2.3.1.1
          18 October 2018 at 10:02 am

          Really? Hard to tell that from what you wrote. You seem pretty ignorant and uninformed on these matters imo but that’s just based on what you wrote.

      • Rosemary McDonald 2.3.2
        18 October 2018 at 9:48 am

        “Please leave diagnosis to professionals….”

        But calling someone an ‘arsehole’ is okay?

        • solkta 2.3.2.1
          18 October 2018 at 9:53 am

          Has arsehole been added to the DSM-IV? Probably should be.

          Imagine after many months of psychotherapy the therapist coming back with “you’re just an arsehole mate”.

          • Dennis Frank 2.3.2.1.1
            18 October 2018 at 10:02 am

            🤣 I understand Marty’s sensitivity but we haven’t been informed of any official diagnosis, and that leaves us free to speculate. Mentally-ill folk have every right to be in parliament, but they have no right to special treatment from the public when they hijack the political process. They are not above scrutiny. They are not above criticism. They are not privileged!

            • marty mars 2.3.2.1.1.1
              18 October 2018 at 10:07 am

              Says who? You? – what qualifications do you have to judge and proclaim like that. We’ve just had mental health awareness week ffs.

              • One Two …
                18 October 2018 at 12:13 pm

                Marty, given your comments and references to direct involvement in working with people who suffer from mental health issues, and similar such circumstances….

                I would presume you are aware of https://dsm.psychiatryonline.org/doi/book/10.1176/appi.books.9780890425596

                Also that the psychiatric ‘industry’ is a pure definition of crank/quackery… there is no better example of ‘professional’ crank!

                So looping back to the question of qualifications….every single human being is a ready qualified ‘psychiatrist’….some more developed than others…

                • Sacha …
                  18 October 2018 at 12:39 pm

                  Do I detect a whiff of scientology?

                  • One Two …
                    18 October 2018 at 3:03 pm

                    Only if that is what you already have in your nostrels, Sacha…

                    Psychology and Scientology rate about the same…

                    • Sacha …
                      18 October 2018 at 4:19 pm

                      scientologists sure hate psychiatrists – which is the word you used, not psychologist.

                    • Ankerrawshark …
                      18 October 2018 at 5:55 pm

                      I disagree one two. A lot of psychiatry and psychology is research based. People suffering from psychosis or the mood disorders very often benefit from treatment, medication and or therapy

                      Btw Ross I believe Ross has an axis two rather than one disorder ie personally disorder

          • ankerawshark 2.3.2.1.2
            18 October 2018 at 11:35 am

            Solkta, doesn’t take that long to identify arsehole behaviour. We all do most of the time.

            Hate to be pedantic, but its now DSMV. And Arsehole not a diagnosis

          • xanthe 2.3.2.1.3
            18 October 2018 at 11:54 am

            🙂

          • Michael who failed Civics 2.3.2.1.4
            18 October 2018 at 12:17 pm

            It would certainly make diagnosis a lot clearer. Not sure about treatment though: AFAICS the condition is terminal. Probably best to shut the affected ones inside a hermetically sealed box, provide them with every material comfort they could possibly want and let them get on with it. Just like we do with Parliament really.

          • Andre 2.3.2.1.5
            18 October 2018 at 3:09 pm

            😆 I once worked with a guy that frequently used inappropriate language at inappropriate times and places. To the extent that soon after I started, I asked another coworker whether he had Tourette’s, not knowing he was behind me within easy earshot. He piped up with “Nah, it’s not Tourette’s, I’m just an asshole.”

        • marty mars 2.3.2.2
          18 October 2018 at 10:00 am

          Why are you asking me when you already know the answer rosemary?

      • Treetop 2.3.3
        18 October 2018 at 11:23 am

        Remarks like “ramblings of a mad woman, psychologically sick, put her on the list” made by people who have authority e.g. police can be very distressing. ( I have this in writing).

        This is what the NZ police did when I complained about a cop perjuring himself in December 1976.

        Very complex and my stoush with the police has had cycles of complaints over 40 years.

        I am a very strong person who likes to deal with the facts and I need to go public in the near future.

      • veutoviper 2.3.4
        18 October 2018 at 11:47 am

        I back you fully on your comment e hoa.

        Was hoping it would come from someone like you who works in the field – as you have mentioned here on TS.

      • Tricledrown 2.3.5
        18 October 2018 at 12:32 pm

        Making diagnosis without training.
        Is like asking a butcher to do surgery.
        Narcissistic most leaders politician’s
        Public people have varying levels of Narcissism its a motivating force but when it gets out of control that’s when it is dangerous.
        Paula Bennett is one of those as well.
        But it was priceless when she retaliated yesterday by dropping her bomb Shane Jones was reminding her of her own past then the TV cameras focused on her eyes they were zooming in and out then her body language looked as if she knew this was her last stand and everything is turning to custer_d.
        The muck fight has started better than a good soap.
        Game of dethroning who is the leaker.

  3. outofbed 3
    18 October 2018 at 8:10 am

    So if the donations were made by seven separate people the police should easily check the bank accounts, like they did with Nicky Hager !

    • Barfly 3.1
      18 October 2018 at 8:15 am

      Absolutely 100% agree !!

      • cleangreen 3.1.1
        18 October 2018 at 8:23 am

        outofbad, at 3.

        I do agree also the police must now match the donations to National to find the inconstancy, but yesterday lying Paula Bennett said on the AM show that there was no record of the $100 000 donation Ross spoke of !!!!!!

        So now it proves that Paula Bennett and Bridges were both lying, so police must charge them as lying?

        • mickysavage 3.1.1.1
          18 October 2018 at 8:42 am

          Of course there was not. There were 7 donations of $14k and one donation of $2k. Total coincidence that they added up to $100k and came from the same source. The anti splitting provisions in the law have no application whatsoever.

          • Dennis Frank 3.1.1.1.1
            18 October 2018 at 8:56 am

            Seems to be the case, indeed. The Chinaman heads up an organisation, so no problem allocating the divisions to members. Via this method, you can hide large donations from political lobby groups. I got the origin of the Act wrong in a prior post, it was the Bolger govt in ’93.

            • RedLogix 3.1.1.1.1.1
              18 October 2018 at 9:07 am

              Which ever way you cut it the splitting of the donation into a number of equal amounts just below the declaration threshold is clearly in contravention of the intention of the Act.

              From my quick reading the other day, the relevant legislation is perfectly clear about this. Bridges claiming he’s technically squeaked inside the rules really isn’t good enough in terms of public probity and integrity.

              • Dukeofurl …
                18 October 2018 at 9:21 am

                National made amendments to the Electoral Act back in 2011 and 2013 or so to muddy the definitions and wording about donation splitting and covering ‘transmission’ of donations.

                • Dennis Frank …
                  18 October 2018 at 9:38 am

                  Okay, cool, that implicates John Key directly in a dirty-politics design. A design to finesse multiculturalism & immigration to their benefit, via Chinese funding, with political representation as the reward.

          • patricia bremner 3.1.1.1.2
            18 October 2018 at 11:00 am

            However Micky, the references to $100 000 and breaking it up tell a story.

  4. Muttonbird 4
    18 October 2018 at 8:13 am

    So this behaviour by Ross towards these women and the lack of action by the National Party when it was brought to their attention was actually going on when they were in government.

    Looks like their famed unity trumped all other concerns. What a revolting set up that party is.

    • ScottGN 4.1
      18 October 2018 at 8:21 am

      Yes. Melanie Reid said on Morning Report that at least one of the women had complained to Goodfellow. If it turns out that National did nothing with this until it suited them strategically they are all going to drown in the shitstorm.

      • Carolyn_Nth 4.1.1
        18 October 2018 at 8:25 am

        Yep. So it looks like Bennett and Bridges knew about the 4 women (the repeat of the number is telling). So why did Bennett try to minimise it as “inappropriate behaviour for a married man”? So it’s ok for single men to sexually harass and brutalise women for political ends?

        And why didn’t the National Party handle such claims according to protocol?

        If JLR’s report of his meeting with Bennett and Bridges is correct, why did B&B use the claims for poltical extortion and not ask for a proper investigation?

        • ianmac 4.1.1.1
          18 October 2018 at 8:56 am

          Mmm Carolyn. Think of the Labour Party woes over actions regarding the assaults at the party earlier this year. Hypocritical given the pressure from National?

        • miravox 4.1.1.2
          18 October 2018 at 11:09 am

          “Bennett and Bridges knew about the 4 women (the repeat of the number is telling). So why did Bennett try to minimise it as “inappropriate behaviour for a married man”? So it’s ok for single men to sexually harass and brutalise women for political ends?”

          More like for Bennett abusing people in their workplace is ok, it’s the affairs that are not ok?

        • McFlock 4.1.1.3
          18 October 2018 at 1:03 pm

          At a guess I’d say the “inappropriate behaviour for a married man” is a veiled threat that could be anything from leering through to affairs. Basically telling him to shut up.

          I’m also intrigued about whether Bridges supposed line about 4 becoming 15 complainants was bluster, or whether the nats know far more than Melanie reid and still kept quiet while Ross was useful.

          Obviously, nat concerns about Labour now-mps bulling were crocodile concerns from people who really don’t give a shit, they just wanted the political ammunition.

    • Chris T 4.2
      18 October 2018 at 8:21 am

      Where does it say National did nothing?

      • Muttonbird 4.2.1
        18 October 2018 at 8:29 am

        I bet they now wish they did do something!

      • ScottGN 4.2.2
        18 October 2018 at 8:29 am

        Go on then, point us all towards the compelling evidence that having been alerted to the presence of a power-grubbing, nasty, sexual predator in their caucus Peter Goodfellow, Simon Bridges and Paula Bennett et al moved decisively, and without regard to the fallout, to root out such behaviour in their midst?
        No I thought not.

        • Chris T 4.2.2.1
          18 October 2018 at 8:43 am

          There isn’t any either way

          Yet to you leap to one conclusion

          • ScottGN 4.2.2.1.1
            18 October 2018 at 8:50 am

            Yeah there is actually. We know that Ross’ behaviour has been under investigation for a year at least, if Melanie Reid is to be believed and we know from her statements that at least one of the women made a complaint to the Party President during that time and, yet, nothing was done until it suited Bridges and Bennett to use the info as they moved against Ross.
            What appalling and cynical behaviour.

            • Treetop 4.2.2.1.1.1
              18 October 2018 at 11:43 am

              Goodfellow was involved in the Barclay situation, the electoral worker was paid out money, she did not press charges.

              I want to know if there has been a payout to any of the four women by National.

              I am not interested in who any MP sleeps with, UNLESS the MP uses the relationship against the person e.g. a work dispute or there is mental or physical abuse in the relationship.

              I am pleased that no one has said that these woman are saying what they are saying because the relationship ended.

              Using an affair against a MP is not right either.

          • Gabby 4.2.2.1.2
            18 October 2018 at 9:09 am

            Fair enough christy, they may have told the women to shut up or else. You’re right to point that out.

        • Adrian 4.2.2.2
          18 October 2018 at 10:07 am

          Because you would never end, that describes every single one of the toxic Nats and wasn’t Goodfellow himself subject to a restraining order on his own house.
          If I recall properly he had to moved on by the Police after breaking the order when the neighbours complained about the noise.

      • Cinny 4.2.3
        18 October 2018 at 8:30 am

        Where does it say that national did something about it?

        • Chris T 4.2.3.1
          18 October 2018 at 8:41 am

          “At the time, those people did what they felt they could to address the situation by discussing Jami-Lee’s behaviour with him.

          “Unfortunately Jami-Lee is a very manipulative individual and he had plenty of ways to continue to intimidate and undermine me without it being particularly obvious to the National Party leadership. I do consider myself to be a strong person, and so I chose to rise above his behaviour and do my best to move on from it.”

          • Muttonbird 4.2.3.1.1
            18 October 2018 at 8:45 am

            So Ross is manipulative monster who engages in emotional abuse and rough extra-marital sex, and they…wait for it… discussed his behaviour with him.

            Obviously those things are no a high enough bar to be ejected from the National Party…until it impacts on the party itself.

            • Chris T 4.2.3.1.1.1
              18 October 2018 at 8:54 am

              Both Ross and National have said there were no official harrassment complaints against him, and the woman herself says she “raised concerns”

              It sounds like it was fairly “having a word” behind closed doors by everyone.

              Which is a bit stupid to say the least

              But then we don’t know how much of the revelations in this story National bosses were actually made aware of

              • Muttonbird …
                18 October 2018 at 8:59 am

                Melanie Reid has been working on it for a year she says and we know at least one woman went to the leadership. And of course alleged actions the likes of what Ross is supposed to have perpetrated don’t go unnoticed.

                And yet Bridges promoted him to the front bench!

                National Party = toxic waste pond.

                • Chris T …
                  18 October 2018 at 9:09 am

                  Your first paragraph is pure speculation

                  Your second paragraph relies on Bridges being one of the leaders told, but it would be weird if he wasn’t, so I actually agree with you. It is pretty disgusting

                  The third paragraph is just hyperbole because you hate National

                  It would be like saying Labour are a party of thugs and liars because of Meka and Curran.

                  • Muttonbird …
                    18 October 2018 at 9:16 am

                    2/3rds of the first is definitely true and 1/3rd is almost certainly true so not pure speculation.

                    Third paragraph is 100% accurate because they have been covering up Ross’ actions for so long in order to present a front of unity, trustworthiness and stability.

                    Y’know how waste ponds often look nice from above but it is what lurks beneath…

              • Dukeofurl …
                18 October 2018 at 9:33 am

                national/Bennett is being very cute , saying their have been ‘no complaints from women MPs’, when there has been no suggestion its Mps.

                Melanie Reid wants to keep the womens privacy so she isnt specific about the actual jobs these women were doing and we dont need to know anyway.

  5. Barfly 5
    18 October 2018 at 8:14 am

    So did these any or all of these four women contact Paula Bennett??

    “National Party deputy leader Paula Bennett says there have been no official complaints of harassment against rogue party MP Jami-Lee Ross.”

    “On The AM Show, Ms Bennett said there were no complaints from any female MPs made against Mr Ross”

    “On Tuesday, Ms Bennett told NZME the leadership team raised issues with Ross – but it wasn’t about harassment.

    “At no point was the matter of sexual harassment ever put to Jami-Lee Ross,” Bennett told NZME”

    • Dukeofurl 5.1
      18 October 2018 at 9:08 am

      No complaints from female MPs says Bennett

      She is using the wrong definition, as the women Reid spoke to dont seem to be Mps.

      This is how Bennett is being cunning and manipulative…

      • Ankerrawshark 5.1.1
        18 October 2018 at 9:28 am

        Bennet and Bridges et al are rank amateurs compared to Ross. He’s outsmarting them at every step. Cunning ruthless and manipulative………this is how it’s unfolding. Someone like Ross is very difficult to deal with as the women found. There will be no mercy for National. They are in for an catastrophic ride. It will be hell for them…they are out of their depths. It’s taken a massive player/bad guy to bring them down…………the good guys eg hager couldn’t cause they don’t play dirty.

        So you have a massively dirty player who is clever and calculating = National chickens come home to roost. Finally. Times up National

        • Treetop 5.1.1.1
          18 October 2018 at 12:29 pm

          “It takes fire to fight fire.”

          There sure is a lot of smoke.

          National chickens come home to roost.

          More like roast.

      • Sacha 5.1.2
        18 October 2018 at 12:32 pm

        “No complaints from female MPs says Bennett”

        Not complaining, is all she’s verifying.

    • Dennis Frank 5.2
      18 October 2018 at 9:31 am

      Could be the women complained to her, but didn’t want to lay official complaints. In which case Bridges was wrong to tell Ross there were four complaints of harassment against him, and explains why Bridges refused to give details to Ross. Unofficial complaints were an effective blackmail strategy, flipped Ross into mental breakdown.

      • Dukeofurl 5.2.1
        18 October 2018 at 9:45 am

        official/unofficial complaints ?

        What is this thing called unofficial complaint, is that the complaint you ignore when it suits you.

        • Dennis Frank 5.2.1.1
          18 October 2018 at 9:53 am

          Most large organisations have an official complaints process. I assume the National Party does. If the women wanted to complain to Paula, to see if she could do something about his behaviour, that would remain a private matter, woudn’t it? If they wanted the NP to hold him accountable, formally, they would instead engage the official process. Paula’s apparent self-contradictions, and incompatibility with the JLR account, are likely due to this.

    • miravox 5.3
      18 October 2018 at 11:26 am

      It’s not the harassing people Bennett has a problem with (that might be a tad hypocritical), it’s the affairs. Top Drawer (à la JK) response from her!

  6. cleangreen 6
    18 October 2018 at 8:19 am

    Cinny

    it seems like I just heard of a female producer on TV3 say the words “dirty politics”, so we hope that the rest of the mainstream media call this for what it is as Nicky Hagar reported that National has been using since 2007 against other parties but now against themselves.

    We live in hope of an honest neutral unbiased media.

    • Cinny 6.1
      18 October 2018 at 8:32 am

      CG, I’m hearing you.

      Wondering why no media have approached Nicky for comment.

    • Dukeofurl 6.2
      18 October 2018 at 9:11 am

      Well Hagers definition of Dirty Politics seemed to be National orchestrating social media stories from the beehive and hiding that fact they were the sponsors.
      This just seems to be plain old sexual politics with Ross behaviour for his own ends

      • Upapua 6.2.1
        18 October 2018 at 5:10 pm

        Simon said on the tape he wanted the donations to be used for party/non-party attack ads

  7. Booker 7
    18 October 2018 at 8:25 am

    I find the appearance and background to the Newsroom article pretty suspect:

    “Over the past year, Newsroom investigations editor Melanie Reid has been looking into the background and behaviour of former National MP Jami-Lee Ross”

    Really? Over the last year you’ve been looking into this, and the investigation just happens to have got to a point where you’re ready to publish today?

    • Carolyn_Nth 7.1
      18 October 2018 at 8:36 am

      Of course they publish now. It’s mainstream news. Doesn’t mean they didn’t have the story near to completion. The 4 women must also now want their story to be told. Says as much in the article that some of the women were furious about the way JLR claimed no harassment in the last couple of days.

      • Dennis Frank 7.1.1
        18 October 2018 at 8:46 am

        Also interesting what she added when talking to Duncan Garner this morning, Carolyn. Throws some light on the Bridges apparent bluff to JLR: four now, but I can get 15 if you don’t do what you’re told.

        Of the four, two were consensual sexual relationships (I’m paraphrasing) whereas the other two were bullying/harassment & coercion. Seems they were Nat women, so I’m puzzled about the prior suggestion their employer is Parliamentary Services – can both be true simultaneously?

        Then she added there were more, specified five other sexual relationships, but with pauses for consideration that suggested an even murkier situation she wasn’t fully clear about herself even.

        • Sacha 7.1.1.1
          18 October 2018 at 9:01 am

          Not exactly the same four women.

        • Dukeofurl 7.1.1.2
          18 October 2018 at 9:16 am

          Mps often pick party members for their electorate and Wellington offices.
          Ross himself worked in Williamsons electorate office before becoming MP- plenty of possible Mps do so.

          Thats not unusual they too would move in national party social circles

    • Muttonbird 7.2
      18 October 2018 at 8:38 am

      It mirrors in a lot of ways that Kavanaugh situation.

      Now, the RWNJs including Farrar have all stated that there’s no proof so he should be allowed to go about his business.

      I look forward to these same RWNJs applying the same logic to Ross…

      • outofbed 7.2.1
        18 October 2018 at 8:39 am

        We made the same observation here

      • Dennis Frank 7.2.2
        18 October 2018 at 8:50 am

        Farrar talking to Garner this morning pushed the lone wolf theory. Deliberately trying to mask Lusk? Garner failed to notice the lapse.

        • Muttonbird 7.2.2.1
          18 October 2018 at 8:55 am

          Ugh. How they can speak to that man when he is a dirty politics operative is beyond me.

          Farrar, I mean!

          • Tiger Mountain 7.2.2.1.1
            18 October 2018 at 9:15 am

            yes the simpering little turd–the Penguin–is hard enough to take for listeners let alone viewers!

      • Chuck 7.2.3
        18 October 2018 at 9:13 am

        “It mirrors in a lot of ways that Kavanaugh situation.”

        Go on tell us why?

        “I look forward to these same RWNJs applying the same logic to Ross…”

        Once you have explained your LWNJs logic to your “it mirrors” then you may have answered your sentence above.

        • Muttonbird 7.2.3.1
          18 October 2018 at 9:22 am

          Kavanaugh was #metoo’ed for attempted rape – by an actual witness in the senate – but RWNJs like yourself said no proof so it didn’t happen. It’s ‘inadmissible’. Let him get on with it.

          Ross has been #metoo’ed today for rough sex – by anonymous sources this time – so RWNJs must automatically say no proof so it didn’t happen. It’s ‘inadmissible’. Let him get on with it.

          • RedLogix 7.2.3.1.1
            18 October 2018 at 9:47 am

            No-one is suggesting that the testimonies we’re talking about are ‘inadmissible’. Ford was completely entitled to her day in the sun.

            The problem is that ‘guilt by allegation’ alone is wide open to abuse in it’s own right.

            • Muttonbird 7.2.3.1.1.1
              18 October 2018 at 9:52 am

              That’s why I put inadmissible in single quotes. I know that’s not the correct term because Ford’s testimony was admissible, but in the end her testimony was deemed irrelevant.

              • RedLogix …
                18 October 2018 at 12:36 pm

                Fair enough. To be semantic about it I would use the word ‘insufficient’.

                On reflection I think I’ve been quite consistent on this all the way along; sex and politics were conventionally kept separate for good reason. And this is an example of why.

          • Chuck 7.2.3.1.2
            18 October 2018 at 10:05 am

            So you would have liked JLR to have continued on without any repercussions just to try and prove a point?

            You are confusing two very different set of circumstances with Kavanaugh v Ross.

            Yep, I understand all things to do with the Nats is to be seen as evil, and even when they tell a scumbag like JLR his time is up, you still need to spin why did they not do it earlier etc.

            • Dukeofurl 7.2.3.1.2.1
              18 October 2018 at 1:53 pm

              They arent different circumstances.

              Both times a woman/women has come forward with credible accusations as to a persons character.

              Neither Ross or Kavanaugh are being accused of a crime- its their character thats in doubt, one for a new top level job, another in his accusations against the party leader.

              Theres always been a ladder for the legal burden of proof ( this is an american list)

              Some evidence
              Reasonable indications
              Reasonable suspicion
              Reasonable to believe
              Probable cause ( ie used in search warrants in US)
              Some credible evidence ( that would be kavnaugh)
              Substantial evidence( That would be Ross)
              **Preponderance of the evidence ( NZ civil cases)
              Clear and convincing evidence
              **Beyond reasonable doubt ( NZ criminal cases)

              of course in both Kavanaugh and Ross its character thats being called into question not a crime.
              For a job on the Scotus a flawless character is required

              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burden_of_proof_(law)#Legal_standards_for_burden_of_proof

              • RedLogix …
                18 October 2018 at 8:45 pm

                For a job on the Scotus a flawless character is required

                Why? Are there any ‘flawless’ people? What absurd mythology is this?

                All of us, without exception have some guilty secret, although you’d never guess it from all the virtue signalling that goes on around here. All of us are capable of being monstrous, but most delude themselves into thinking the world is divided into good and evil people … and leave no doubt which side they think they’re on.

                It’s the people who know how bad they can be, who’ve confronted what evil every single one of us is capable of … and who can both recognise it and have learned to constrain it … these are the ones I trust with high office.

      • RedLogix 7.2.4
        18 October 2018 at 9:43 am

        Similar but not identical. In this instance the stories are very current, with what I assume is strong corroboration that Reid has done her homework on. In other words much stronger than Ford’s evidence.

        At the same time it’s not immediately apparent there is criminal behaviour being alleged. If narcissism was a crime we’d need a lot more prisons indeed. Either way I agree the story reflects very poorly on JLR, like a great many people, his private sex life wilts under the glare of public scrutiny.

        Still there is now a clear pattern of women all around the world, making allegations of a sexual nature , that also carry an obvious political baggage and timing. Whether this is a good idea or not remains to be seen; it’s such an effective political weapon the manifest potential for mis-use cannot be blithely ignored.

        • Dukeofurl 7.2.4.1
          18 October 2018 at 1:56 pm

          Oh yes the old ‘we cant let women misuse their new power ‘ excuse.

          They said the same thing about not letting women have the vote …. and everything since.

          • RedLogix 7.2.4.1.1
            18 October 2018 at 8:38 pm

            This ‘new power’ is predicated on the idea that women must be believed; that all allegations must be true; that essentially women are incapable of lying or being mistaken.

            Or if they do, it doesn’t matter because …. patriarchy.

    • You_Fool 7.3
      18 October 2018 at 8:47 am

      Its been about a year since National lost the election and realised they couldn’t go alone and needed a new party to be their mate since ACT was dead and gone…

  8. AsleepWhileWalking 8
    18 October 2018 at 8:51 am

    They both look unstable. Surely an exit looks appealing at this point, or must we endure several months of this?

    I’d like my regular news back.

    • ianmac 8.1
      18 October 2018 at 9:01 am

      And today Ross is going to release the texts regarding the donations. So sorry. Like Micky you cannot get back to work just yet.

    • the other pat 8.2
      18 October 2018 at 5:46 pm

      we dont get news here in NZ….unless its a bus accident in Nepal or a murder….sweet FA real news here

  9. Ankerrawshark 9
    18 October 2018 at 9:17 am

    Are texts about donations. I seem to remember from the tape that Simon said he would text Jamie back that night after talking to good fellow. I wonder if there is a doming gun text…

    We are seeing a major narcissist likely psychopath at work here. He’s clever and cunning and deeply manipulative. National are in a lot of trouble. It’s about time. It has taken someone as clever and manipulative and dirty as Ross to bring them down….

    • ianmac 9.1
      18 October 2018 at 9:20 am

      Ross said that the texts were between the Secretary (Maxwell?) and Ross regarding questions about the donations. Ross said that he forgot to publish them yesterday but will do so today.

    • Dennis Frank 9.2
      18 October 2018 at 9:24 am

      Yes, think you’re right in that character analysis. Yet he has that charming, self-deprecating style as well. He manages to seem authentic effectively when fronting in a high-pressure situation. Very rare combination. That’s why I’m going for Jekyll & Hyde, classic split personality. People like that it’s never either/or really, since the reality is both/and.

      • Ankerrawshark 9.2.1
        18 October 2018 at 9:36 am

        Psychopaths and narcissists can be and often are extremely charming and can seem really plausible which makes them very dangerous

        • Michelle 9.2.1.1
          18 October 2018 at 9:52 am

          are you a psychologist Ankerawshark ?

          • Ankerrawshark 9.2.1.1.1
            18 October 2018 at 10:16 am

            Nope not psychologist. But I am a professional in the field

            • Robert Guyton 9.2.1.1.1.1
              18 October 2018 at 11:15 am

              Farmer?

              • ankerawshark …
                18 October 2018 at 11:39 am

                LOL Robert Guyton. A Mental Health professional.

                • Dukeofurl …
                  18 October 2018 at 2:01 pm

                  Arent these things multiple items from a list ?

                  This says 5 out 7 traits
                  eg Narcissist DSMIV

                  A. A pervasive pattern of grandiosity (in fantasy or behavior), need for
                  admiration, and lack of empathy, beginning by early adulthood and
                  present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by five (or more) of the
                  following:
                  1. Has a grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates
                  achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior
                  without commensurate achievements).
                  2. Is preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power,
                  brilliance, beauty, or ideal love.
                  3. Believes that he or she is “special” and unique and can only be
                  understood by, or should associate with, other special or highstatus
                  people (or institutions).
                  4. Requires excessive admiration.
                  5. Has a sense of entitlement, i.e., unreasonable expectations of
                  especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with his
                  or her expectations.
                  6. Is interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to
                  achieve his or her own ends.
                  7. Lacks empathy: is unwilling to recognize or identify with the
                  feelings and needs of others

                  • ankerawshark …
                    18 October 2018 at 4:03 pm

                    Yeah it looks right re DSM. I would think he would register on the psychopathy spectrum too…………………But have never interviewed him so just from behaviour…………………..

                    Psychosis as suggested by Nicky Wagner is just an attempt to muddy water mad/bad etc as someone else wrote further down

  10. Delia 10
    18 October 2018 at 9:17 am

    They love diversity as long as a big sum of money is attached.

    • Dukeofurl 10.1
      18 October 2018 at 9:26 am

      yes . Thats in the claim that ‘two chinese are worth more than two indians’

      I knew they played identity politics as tokenism, I didnt think it went as far as $ amounts as well.

    • Muttonbird 10.2
      18 October 2018 at 9:27 am

      And they love manipulative, bullying sex-pests as long as the image of party stability is at stake.

  11. roy cartland 11
    18 October 2018 at 9:26 am

    It only takes a moment’s thought to realise that of course the Nat party would be filled with people like JLR. That is really the only endpoint of the ideology of ‘me first’. I’m surprised that others associated with the Nat party are acting surprised. They put up with the most vile actions of Key et al, defended him and continued. It’s actually hard to feel sorry for any but the most naive and vulnerable.

    • Ankerrawshark 11.1
      18 October 2018 at 9:37 am

      Roy Cartland 100+. Absolutely no accident that Ross is in their camp

      • Chuck 11.1.1
        18 October 2018 at 10:47 am

        “Absolutely no accident that Ross is in their camp”

        As opposed to Ross being in one of those Young Labour camps?

        When the alleged molester is publicly known, will you still say the same thing about his family ties with Labour?

        • ankerawshark 11.1.1.1
          18 October 2018 at 10:59 am

          Chuck how people operate or their modus operandi tells you a lot about their underlying character structure.

          The person who molested the people at the Labour camp committed a criminal act which is unacceptable (unless he is found not guilty). Inappropriate touching is ALWAYS unacceptable.

          We are looking at something quite different with Ross. Neither is o.k.
          But Ross is IMPO (My professional opinion) likely to be far more dangerous than the guy at the Labour Party event. I am not saying the victims at that event are suffering any less. I have always said what happened was appalling.

          I am raising the issue of characterological structures that motivate people.

        • Sacha 11.1.1.2
          18 October 2018 at 11:00 am

          Whataboutism is tiring, charlieboy.

        • mauī 11.1.1.3
          18 October 2018 at 12:26 pm

          Yes, drunk, disorderly, inappropriate behaviour by kids at a party like event never ever happens. All responsibility should be sheeted back to a tenuous link with…

          Labour, Labour, Labour!

          Never mind the parents… 🙂

          • RedLogix 11.1.1.3.1
            18 October 2018 at 12:32 pm

            Yes, drunk, disorderly, inappropriate behaviour by kids at a party like event never ever happens

            Now where did I hear something just like that … very recently?

        • Gabby 11.1.1.4
          18 October 2018 at 1:12 pm

          We all have unsavoury rellies chuckles.

          • Chuck 11.1.1.4.1
            18 October 2018 at 1:40 pm

            “We all have unsavoury rellies chuckles.”

            Yes, indeed we do Gabby thank you for that astute observation.

            Hence lumping all National supporters in with someone like JLR is absurd. Like roycartland @ 11 did with Ankerawshark giving it a 100+ rating.

            • ankerawshark 11.1.1.4.1.1
              18 October 2018 at 4:06 pm

              No didn’t say all National supporters like JLRoss. He’s in a league of his own………………seriously. But he is more likely to be attracted to a party that holds the valus/enacts the policies of the National Party. But people with Ross personality profile as it is emerging can crop up anywhere. Hope this clarrifies.

            • roy cartland 11.1.1.4.1.2
              19 October 2018 at 12:42 pm

              Thanks Chuck – obviously not all Nat supporters are like JLR, but at the very least they put up with him and ultimately excuse his behaviour. Nat promotes selfishness uber alles and as a consequence is more attractive to JLR types than Labour could be.

  12. joe90 12
    18 October 2018 at 9:31 am

    Probably pretty legal.

    Bridges seemed at least open to the following:Not immediately alerting the Party Secretary to a large donation;Having a party (cf parliamentary) expenses/advertising fund that he controlled, not the party secretary;— Graeme Edgeler (@GraemeEdgeler) October 17, 2018

    ‏ @GraemeEdgeler

    He also didn’t seem surprised a donation of $100k had been made, giving credence to the story he asked for it from that person, and thus may have (as alleged) knowledge about its true source, which is backed up by his desire to return dinner to the donor.

    ‏@GraemeEdgeler

    And also didn’t seem surprised at the suggestion a party could simply decide whether to treat a donation as a party donation or a candidate donation, giving some support to the claims around his personal return.
    Nothing definitive, but definitely true public interest.

    https://twitter.com/GraemeEdgeler/status/1052480032872882176

    ‏

    • Muttonbird 12.1
      18 October 2018 at 9:49 am

      I thought this. Bridges defenders have said there’s nothing incriminating from him in that tape but that fact he’s a non-protesting party in that conversation is proof of complicity.

  13. OnceWasTim 13
    18 October 2018 at 9:34 am

    It’s a party of bloody sociopaths. Everything is all very transactional.

    A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush
    2 Chinese are worth more than 2 Indians (and fuck the Filipino)
    The cost of everything and the value of nothing

    Hopefully it won’t be forgotten come 2020

  14. outofbed 14
    18 October 2018 at 9:43 am

    Well I want Bridges to stay,in the same way I wanted Wenger to stay at Arsenal (Chelsea supporter).
    He, Bridges is a liability to National .the longer he stays the better.
    Please don’t go Simon Pretty please

  15. joe90 15
    18 October 2018 at 9:46 am

    If this prick was on fire I wouldn’t put him out with the proverbial, but he’s probably right.

    Knowing that @newsroomnz’s Mel Reid was working on an exposé of @jamileeross’ manipulations, lying and sleaze for a year gives some explanation for JLR’s cataclysmic unraveling. #nzpol— Hamish Price (@hamishpricenz) October 17, 2018

    • Muttonbird 15.1
      18 October 2018 at 9:56 am

      Still doesn’t mitigate the gloriously corrupt internal workings of the National Party of New Zealand.

      I thank Jami Lee Ross for exposing that. All good Kiwis should.

      • Ankerrawshark 15.1.1
        18 October 2018 at 10:20 am

        Agree muttonbird ross is doing us a favour. Said to husband early this am cant quite see what’s motivating him. Narcissistic wound, grand plot re Judith? Bad guy turned good. Now believe it s the former, but wouldn’t rule out long term political goal

        • You_Fool 15.1.1.1
          18 October 2018 at 12:23 pm

          Proof is in what candidate National puts up at the by-election… if it is a strong candidate then is definitely full on in-fighting, if it is a bit of a no-one/weak candidate then it is all a plan to get a new right wing party started… Sure Bridges will have to resign, and a non-JLR leader brought in for the new party that JLR will join sometime between the by-election and the next general election… During that time all hatchets will be buried and the right wing parties will all go on a camp to become good friends again…

          • Dennis Frank 15.1.1.1.1
            18 October 2018 at 1:44 pm

            Good theory, that. It would mean that the unanimity of caucus was designed to operate as a show play, fool the media & public, and lull Bridges into a false sense of security. If Ross & Lusk are actually working for a faction that chose to remain invisible yesterday as a tactic (see The Art of War, Sun Tzu), and the plan is to use the by-election to establish a coalition partner for National (post-Bridges), seems to fit the facts and could rightly be called (ta da!) conspiracy.

    • mickysavage 15.2
      18 October 2018 at 10:11 am

      I am aware she was working on this story about a month ago. Timing is perfect given recent events and the item is very topical.

      • Chuck 15.2.1
        18 October 2018 at 10:37 am

        Drums had been beating for a while that JLR liked to play away from home. That was all I had heard anyway.

        However, JLR had taken it to a whole new level and I think the National party and NZ have dodged a bullet with JLR having been exposed.

        • ankerawshark 15.2.1.1
          18 October 2018 at 11:01 am

          Umm Chuck……………can you not see the “Bullet” has not been dodged by National at all. Its coming back at them and its nuclear………..

          • Chuck 15.2.1.1.1
            18 October 2018 at 11:29 am

            I disagree…Bridges call for the leak enquiry now makes sense. Despite many here (and elsewhere) saying he was stupid for pushing on with it.

            The bullet dodged by National was this did not explode out into the open months out from the next election.

            The passage of time will tell, this could be the making of Bridges leadership or the end of it.

            As for NZ, we have had unmasked a person in JLR that requires extensive professional help to say the least.

            • ankerawshark 15.2.1.1.1.1
              18 October 2018 at 11:48 am

              Chuck do you not see the blood spatter all over the Indian and Chinese community and the potential for a criminal investigation into National re their donations?????? Even Barry S is calling National on their donations for seats situation.

              Maureen Pugh mum has waded in calling Bridges a dumb arse on the am show…………………..

              And it occurs to me if Jami wasn’t the leaker their is someone who is shit scared sitting in National who knows Jami knows they are the leaker and who says what Jami is capable of. Actually it makes sense to me that Jami isn’t the leaker as its a bit too stupid for him. But of course I can’t possibly know.

              BTW I now think the leak investigation is a bit of red hearing as Ross would have imploded anyway.

              • veutoviper …
                18 October 2018 at 12:58 pm

                Well said (as have been your other comments on this post). Absolutely with you, particularly re your para 3 – and 4. I am concerned re that other person.

              • ianmac …
                18 October 2018 at 1:06 pm

                Yesankerawshark. Wondered about the possibility that JLR is not the Leaker, and the crisis erupted at a convenient time to be used by Bridges as an attempt to regain the credit for exposing the Leaker. If so then Bridges would have believed that Ross would go quietly but didn’t he miscalculate!

              • Chuck …
                18 October 2018 at 1:23 pm

                “Chuck do you not see the blood spatter all over the Indian and Chinese community”

                It is no secret that political parties choose there MP’s based on sex/ethnicity etc to fit the demographics of the population.

                At least they did not use Chinese sounding surnames names as a basis to identify non-Kiwi’s.

                “the potential for a criminal investigation into National re their donations?????? Even Barry S is calling National on their donations for seats situation.”

                The “potential” faded away pretty quickly yesterday afternoon. Barry is just being Barry…

                I agree re Pugh…those comments made in private should never have seen daylight (but unfortunately they did thanks to JLR).

                BTW: Jacinda Ardern would have had a similar conversation with her inner circle re- Clare Curran and the mess she left. I think most people understand that.

                • ankerawshark …
                  18 October 2018 at 1:52 pm

                  Ok Chuck, I hear that is your point of view. I understand you are hoping for this to go away and to play a role in trying to shut it down/normalize it “Barry just being Barry” (which I have to disagree with). Good luck with that.

                  I see the situation very differently. Its a seriously reveal for National and I think has potential to get a lot worse. I will be interested to see the next poll, but hard to believe it will stay above 40…………..we will see.

                  • Chuck …
                    18 October 2018 at 2:50 pm

                    Yes agree…we will see!

                    Remember what matters most to people is what occurs in there day to day lives…the cost of everything, the ability to work, access to health care, how they perceive the Govt of the day is managing the economy etc.

                    • ankerawshark …
                      18 October 2018 at 4:08 pm

                      Great Chuck. Glad we are in agreement about that. Who would no how this will play out (I think its going to get a lot worse, but that is only an opinion). Politics usually full of surprizes.

                  • the other pat …
                    18 October 2018 at 6:02 pm

                    i agree with what you say but with the great pile of kiwi indifference after a couple of days of outrage???…..well i guess we will see.

  16. Adrian 16
    18 October 2018 at 10:28 am

    There was some oblique reference to ” many” people in the group that Zhang chairs being ” donors” of the money but why did it turn up as ONE cheque for $100k.
    Smells a lot like CC Government money direct from Beijing.
    Or of course the cost of being allowed to operate as a wealthy ” businessman ” in a communist controlled economy is tithing large sums to the Chairman or the King as in fuedal England or to Putin by olioglarchs.
    Throw the fuckers out.

    • Treetop 16.1
      18 October 2018 at 12:58 pm

      Was the check used for a business tax return by the donor/s?

      Did the business tax year end in the financial year June 30 2018?

      Say there was only one check for 100k (this has not been traced even though there is reference to a 100k being recieved).

      Say the 100k is a group donation, it now comes down to identifying everyone in the group as existing.

      • ianmac 16.1.1
        18 October 2018 at 1:08 pm

        ..and Treetop finding evidence that the named actually gave the sum. Needs more than just to be named.

        • Treetop 16.1.1.1
          18 October 2018 at 1:47 pm

          So IRD and the bank of the donor/s as well as the existence of the named donors is going to shed more light.

          Do you know if there is a tax deduction for a donation from the donor?

          I expect Zhang to have a bank in NZ.

          I also would like to know which bank/s the so called individual checks were from?

          Can a NZ political party recieve a check/s from a bank which is not a known bank in NZ e.g. bank in Switzerland?

          Were the current government National, NO way would JLR have alleged what Bridges has done.

  17. Pete 17
    18 October 2018 at 10:29 am

    There are a number of forums in the country where four months ago if you’d said something bad about Ross you’d have been slaughtered.

    He was another of ‘God’s children” doing the good work.

    For anything he’s done or hasn’t, for all the qualities has or hasn’t, there is really only one thing to the National clan wrong about him or what he has done. He let us in on what they are really like.

    They don’t want us to see the ugly.

  18. David Mac 18
    18 October 2018 at 10:33 am

    I wonder if Jamie-Lee might of rung Lusk…

    “When the press run with their exposure of my peccadilloes the party will probably have me walk the plank. Can we get together and discuss my: Where to from here? options.”

  19. Sacha 19
    18 October 2018 at 10:45 am

    Buried in this un-bylined story (my bold) ..
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12144495

    Bennett would not be drawn on the identities of the women or the roles they held. She would not comment on whether there were sitting MPs or media among those considered to have had relationships with Ross.

    • I feel love 19.1
      18 October 2018 at 12:39 pm

      There’s always been bed hopping between media and MPs, partly why we never hear about it. It’s a way of shutting them all up.

    • Dukeofurl 19.2
      18 October 2018 at 5:42 pm

      Wasnt a RNZ female journalist one of Ross trusted sources and had the exclusive
      from him about the leaker who had texted Mallard and Bridges with the mental health angle…… intriguing

      • Treetop 19.2.1
        18 October 2018 at 6:40 pm

        Are you saying that the leaker of Bridges expenses is a journalist who may have been involved with JLR?

        You have got me thinking, journalists could get their info from MPs they are involved with and the MP cannot do anything because of the affair. Now that would be blackmail.

  20. David Mac 20
    18 October 2018 at 10:52 am

    Most Kiwis don’t follow politics, the current news hog can’t help but be noticed. Their take home message will be: These sleazeballs are a consortium of hopelessly ambitious dodgy real estate agents.

    Long strides on the path to a 2 party coalition.

    • Gabby 20.1
      18 October 2018 at 1:30 pm

      Maybe there’s a reality show in it. Kiwis seem to lap up that shit.

      • Dennis Frank 20.1.1
        18 October 2018 at 5:48 pm

        I was musing on that a few hours ago. An auction similar to the ones sportsfolk are into nowadays, in which the best performers get the biggest amounts.

        You can imagine the catharsis & caterwauling when some narcissists get bid up way above others! Audience reaction shots alone would have viewers glued to the screen!!

      • Tricledrown 20.1.2
        18 October 2018 at 7:05 pm

        Survivor National Party.
        Blind siding
        Broken alliances
        Weakest link

  21. R.P Mcmurphy 21
    18 October 2018 at 10:53 am

    a tragic tale of deceit, depravity and ultimately despair.

  22. patricia bremner 22
    18 October 2018 at 10:53 am

    The players in this also probably believe they can beat the Chinese at business chess.
    Their hubris knows no bounds. They are really dangerous fools.

    • David Mac 22.1
      18 October 2018 at 11:01 am

      Yes, the Chinese are playing a 100 year long game, politicians struggle to see further than 3 years out.

    • Sacha 22.2
      18 October 2018 at 11:02 am

      And any successful Chinese business people have had to learn how to handle corrupt politicians back home.

      • Prickles 22.2.1
        18 October 2018 at 12:21 pm

        Unfortunately a lot of what we see as corrupt behaviour is simply normal business procedure in China.

    • WeTheBleeple 22.3
      18 October 2018 at 12:06 pm

      “Their hubris knows no bounds” Well said Patricia.

      They shout you down with meaningless sound bites in debate, over and over like repeating shit makes it mean something. They tell me I ‘know fucken’ nothing’ despite them being completely obvious.

      And now we have proof, that which we knew all along.

      David Mac’s “a consortium of hopelessly ambitious dodgy real estate agents” is totally on point.

      I personally (and unfortunately) know some wealthy nat donors/supporters. These descriptions are uncannily accurate.

      The words: sociopaths, psychopaths and narcissists also fit very well.

      Why else would you turn your back on the human race for personal ambition. The ‘rat race’ is composed of rats.

  23. ankerawshark 23
    18 October 2018 at 11:03 am

    Umm Chuck……………can you not see the “Bullet” has not been dodged by National at all. Its coming back at them and its nuclear………..

  24. Rosemary McDonald 24
    18 October 2018 at 11:12 am

    While Paula is feigning concern for these women, we should remind ourselves of her finest media moments.

    https://www.nbr.co.nz/article/i-wouldn%E2%80%99t-say-we%E2%80%99ve-got-rape-culture-%E2%80%94-paula-bennett-ns-159125

    • Chris T 24.1
      18 October 2018 at 11:36 am

      I don’t quite see how someone disagreeing we as a country have a rape culture is not caring about victims of abuse.

      Do you mind explaining?

      • Rosemary McDonald 24.1.1
        18 October 2018 at 12:26 pm

        I guess I read the entire transcript of the interview, as I presume you yourself did.

        Did it not strike you as somewhat ironic that while Paula mines political capital from this current shit storm by offering support to the ‘victims’, not so long ago she was staunch in her complete lack of sympathy for women struggling to provide a basic standard of living for their children whilst on the DPB?

        She stresses that only 50% of beneficiaries are applying for Hardship Grants…like, er, 50% are struggling.

        She then, as you would know as you’ve read the transcript entire, accounts for NZ’s ridiculously high levels of domestic violence as due to us having a culture of reporting such incidents.

        So, a little thin on the old sympathy for the victims there.

        However, the new Paula positively exudes TLC for these ‘victims’…

        I guess to her, a successful woman who has by sheer dint of hard work raised herself to such a rarefied position, other women who have also chosen to dive into the cesspit that is politics are more deserving of her sympathy and support when they end up covered in shit.

  25. ianmac 25
    18 October 2018 at 11:18 am

    In relation to the National Party not acting on complaints from the women, No Right Turn is not a gentle critic is he?

    “Ross was a former party whip, so dumping the dirt on the guy whose job was literally to know where all the bodies were buried may not have been the best ideas. But to be honest, they’re all arseholes, so why should we care what they do to one another? Burn them all, and we can toast marshmallows on the flames.

    http://norightturn.blogspot.com/2018/10/arseholes-all-way-down.html

  26. joe90 26
    18 October 2018 at 11:42 am

    I doubt we’re anywhere near bottom….

    "He's going through a psychotic episode at the moment and I feel sorry for the people around him." – National MP @nickywagner on @jamileeross. Just spoken to @nickywagner on @NewstalkZB 100.1FM Canterbury. #jamileeross #nzpol— Chris Lynch (@lynchinnz) October 17, 2018

    • ankerawshark 26.1
      18 October 2018 at 11:51 am

      Nicki Wagner is likely incorrect, because there has been no signs of psychosis in Jami and he said his Dr said he was fit for work and that his Dr told Paula this. Paula would have said if this was a lie I think.

    • AB 26.2
      18 October 2018 at 12:14 pm

      I’m surprise Nicky Wagner found the time to train as a mental health professional. Wouldn’t she have preferred to be out on the harbour?

    • Cinny 26.3
      18 October 2018 at 1:48 pm

      A psychotic episode? Sheez she needs to get out and about more.

      What jlr is going through is a pissing match and contest of ego’s.

      • Dukeofurl 26.3.1
        18 October 2018 at 2:05 pm

        Well according to Bridges , shes not quite useless , I think she has bigger worries than bagging Ross.

  27. Brutus Iscariot 27
    18 October 2018 at 11:47 am

    JLR is a complete arsehole, but as far as i’m aware, between 2 consenting (and i emphasise that word) adults there are no legal restrictions on the tactics used to get someone to sleep with you. This includes the use of jewellery gifts and compliments!

    So these allegations of “grooming” are somewhat pathetic, coming as they do from grown women. Call it for what it is, which is “buyer’s remorse”.

    • Dukeofurl 27.1
      18 October 2018 at 1:01 pm

      Some of the ‘regrets’ from one woman were : Its not that he was good looking or had a hot body.
      So the transactional sex would be Ok if he was more desirable?

    • Treetop 27.2
      18 October 2018 at 2:37 pm

      Manipulation or being deceptive is probably a better term.

      The word grooming is what a pedophile does.

  28. joe90 28
    18 October 2018 at 12:07 pm

    Way to kill the goose.

    One of the many spectacular revelations from the National Party saga this week is the shameful and tokenistic way Jami-Lee Ross and Simon Bridges apparently regard potential Asian-New Zealander members of parliament. In the secret recording released yesterday by Ross, the men are heard discussing simplistic quotas geared towards donations not merit. In doing so, they’re driving division among all of us.

    https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/18-10-2018/ross-and-bridges-just-told-us-what-nz-political-leaders-really-think-about-asian-mps/

  29. Janet 29
    18 October 2018 at 12:14 pm

    New Zealand’s politics is in need of a deep, deep clean.
    The first whiff of NZ becoming NOT run for NZ’ers and their wishes arrived with John Key straight out of Wall Street’s Big Short. Money, money money must be funny….
    We must claim our NZ back – and thank you JLR for bringing the shit we knew was going on out where all Baa baa,s can see it.

  30. Herodotus 30
    18 October 2018 at 12:19 pm

    Thanks to JLR I cannot wait until DF and Curia phone us lucky few 🙂 I Pity the other 98% who will miss out in having a few moments in shaping and giving our opinions, even if it does inconvenience us for 10 minutes during dinner as we are polled.

  31. joe90 31
    18 October 2018 at 12:38 pm

    Dude’s looking more and more like a serial predator.

    Newsroom reporter Melanie Reid says she knows of “at least another five” women with stories to tell about Jami-Lee Ross.

    Newsroom on Thursday morning quoted four women accusing the outgoing National MP of being a narcissist who used “brutal sex” to “dig dirt” on others. Two allegedly had affairs with Mr Ross, and the other two detailed their “toxic working environment”.

    https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/jami-lee-ross-affair-claims-at-least-another-five-women/ar-BBOwvzR

    • Ffloyd 31.1
      18 October 2018 at 1:44 pm

      Very hard to believe all of this confrontational rhetoric. “Rough sex”. Really?? If this is true and it has been known by others why has it never been addressed before? Something as serious as that should have been before the courts. Just the other day bennett was saying none of the accusations were serious enough to warrant moving forwardwith them. So what was it paula??? Serial sexual and intimidating behaviour by jlr over many years, and hidden, or just s bit of argy bargy as you first intimated. Nothing stacks up here.

      • Dukeofurl 31.1.1
        18 October 2018 at 2:03 pm

        Could rough sex just be no candle light and roses….. maybe the office desk or furniture.

      • ianmac 31.1.2
        18 October 2018 at 3:47 pm

        Standard practice of the Nats. Destroy the reputation of your critics so that their story can be debunked. Hager? Stevenson?
        It may be that in this case Ross rounded on adult women but to what degree should adult women be regarded as defenceless? We get hints but nothing concrete.

      • Cinny 31.1.3
        18 October 2018 at 4:08 pm

        ‘rough sex’ dominant/submissive role play, between consenting adults.

  32. AB 32
    18 October 2018 at 12:40 pm

    ‘Learnings’ for the last 2 days:
    – Corrupt ideologies attract corrupt people
    – Make wealth a disqualification for immigration because wealth seeks influence in order to increase itself
    – Get all anonymous money out of politics, get all corporate money out of politics, and get all private money out of politics above a level that is affordable by someone on the median wage

  33. Ad 33
    18 October 2018 at 1:51 pm

    Chris Finlayson will be a substantial loss.

    I know he is an elitist who has a clear view of his own worth, so he’s well suited to going back to the bar.

    But in his tenure under Key he got through a power of Treaty of Waitangi settlements – setting a bar that Andrew Little I don’t think has a hope of attaining unless he’s both lucky and hangs in there for three terms.

    Finlayson was also their number one legislative drafter. I’d struggle to figure who is going to draft SOPs or other legislative variations in his absence.

    As Shadow Attorney General he was certainly the best legal mind of the MPs in the House, even though he was quite happy to tell you so.

    For clarity: no, I don’t support National or Finlayson. But currently he has no replacement either inside National or arguably inside Parliament.

    It was a foolish mistake for Bridges to stamp Finlayson’s forehead “spent”.

  34. Fireblade 34
    18 October 2018 at 1:56 pm

    The National Party is embarrassing NZ on the international stage again.

    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2018/10/national-party-meltdown-makes-international-headlines.html

  35. Herodotus 35
    18 October 2018 at 3:17 pm

    Found this from the last By election
    https://www.electionresults.govt.nz/2011_botany_byelection/
    Electorate Number: 3 Final: Yes
    Polling Places Counted: 24 of 24 (100.0%) Votes Counted: 15,421
    Winning Candidate: ROSS, Jami-Lee (NAT) Majority: 3,972

    Candidates
    AL-SAADY, Hussain PIR 32
    BIGGS, Leo ALCP 61
    BRIGHT, Penny IND 128
    CAITHNESS, Robin JAMP 45
    GOH, Robert IND 31
    MURPHY, Lyn ACT 687
    ROSS, Jami-Lee NAT 8,352
    WOOD, Michael LAB 4,380
    YOUNG, Paul NCP 1,626
    YOUNG, Wayne IND 54

    Candidate Informals 25
    TOTAL 15,421

  36. Cinny 36
    18 October 2018 at 4:10 pm

    jlr is now consulting a lawyer re his legal options.

    And radiolive have just wheeled out maggie barry to soothe the confused national voters.

  37. Philj 37
    18 October 2018 at 4:11 pm

    Thank you Simon and Jamie, you have clearly confirmed, and demonstrated, the toxic dumokrupty that exists in Nu Zeeland. Knighthoods have been bought for less.

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