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Where’s the trap?

Written By: - Date published: 7:45 pm, June 10th, 2009 - 70 comments
Categories: john key, richard worth - Tags:

Yeah. Great honey-trap.

– First, target a minister that doesn’t matter with a woman who is openly Labour
– Second, delete the most offensive texts and don’t record any phone calls
– Third, don’t go public, refuse Goff’s offer to raise it privately with Key
– Fourth, raise the issue privately with Key once the harassment has ceased
– Fifth, Let the issue rest when Key’s staff says Worth was given a ticking off
– Sixth, don’t raise the issue when allegations of sexual offending by Worth come to light
– Seventh, attempt to get a private meeting with Key only after he casts doubt on the truth of your story
– Eighth, refuse media interviews

Wow. That’s pretty much exactly the opposite of how a honey-trap works. Fact is honey-traps only exist in the minds of undersexed Tories. Setting up another MP with a woman is orders of magnitude beyond the risk profile political parties run on. They would never do it for fear of it blowing up in their faces.

Best advice Key has had throughout this increasingly tedious affair has been from the Left. So here’s some more. Don’t run the misogynist ‘was that sexually harassing enough?’ line like the Right of the blogosphere. Accept her story backed as it is by evidence. Rescind the allegation she is lying . Use it to get Worth out of caucus.

Then all he’s got left to do is tell us why he fired Worth and why he didn’t do it on the Tuesday. Then the questions will stop. We can move onto important things. Like stopping this economic meltdown.

70 comments on “Where’s the trap?”

  1. Pascal's bookie 1

    Zet. Yep. Also needed to be explained in this little fantasy, is Worth’s reactions to events.

    It makes no sense at all. Which won’t stop them though.

    I’m actually shocked that they’ve gone here. Quite the drinking buddy John Key’s got. DPF’s dogwhistling call out to his commenters to ‘get on the google and identify her, but please don’t post her name here because she may be a victim’ is a new low for him.

    It’ll be interesting to see which righties stick up for common decency.

  2. tsmithfield 2

    Firstly, this is a LABOUR honey-trap (on a level with the Hee-Fee) not a professional one, which explains a lot.

    Secondly, the woman at the centre of the allegations has got form having been involved in fraudulent activities in the past.

    Thirdly, I doubt a lot of the “evidence” ever existed. The “deleted” texts were probably never there. Apparently, the woman, in her letter to Key, hasn’t included texts from her to Worth to give the context. The phone calls probably were taped but probably were as innocuous as the texts that have been published. So, why not just say the calls were never taped and invent a story about the phone calls.

    • IrishBill 2.1

      I’m assuming your next argument will be “she had it coming anyway”. I’m tiring of your misogyny.

      • tsmithfield 2.1.1

        Irish, did you read the article?

        Previously I was being a little tongue in cheek about the honey-trap thing. Having read the article, I am convinced.

    • Zetetic 2.2

      This guy is the biggest idiot out there. Can’t even read. Hope he’s not a cop, pretty crap at making a logical case.

      • Pascal's bookie 2.2.1

        What? You’re not supposed to start with a conclusion, look at the facts and then make up whatever other premisses you need to get the conclusion?

        Yeah ok, now that I look at it that does seem a bit fucking mental.

  3. tsmithfield 3

    Hmmm….the link in my previous post doesn’t seem to be working. So here it is:

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/recruitment/news/article.cfm?c_id=83&objectid=10546912

    • indiana 3.1

      …is there absolute certainty this is one in the same person? If so, very dodgey indeed.

  4. burt 4

    “Where’s the trap?’

    Blown up in Goff’s face. It’s a laugh isn’t it.

    • gobsmacked 4.1

      Evidence?

      The usual suspects are saying exactly what you’d expect. Which is nothing to do with public opinion – especially the women who put John Key into power.

      • tsmithfield 4.1.1

        What we really need to see, gobsmacked, is convincing evidence of the behaviour the woman has alleged.

        The herald article clearly shows that the woman and her husband participated together in fraudulent activities. With that knowledge as a backdrop, there is absolutely no credibility to the womans word unless she can provide solid evidence to back it up. Elementary really.

        • gobsmacked 4.1.1.1

          The royal “we”?

          What you need to see is of no importance. You are not interested in considering anything except conclusions you reach in advance, and never have been.

          • tsmithfield 4.1.1.1.1

            Gobsmacked, I base my views on the evidence in front of me. If the evidence changes, my views change. Is that not the way you treat things.

          • gobsmacked 4.1.1.1.2

            In her letter to Key, the woman has given him her phone number so Worth’s phone records can be checked.

            Do you think this should happen? That would be important evidence, wouldn’t it?

      • Daveski 4.1.2

        Exactly. Evidence is required from the strikingly Labour beautiful woman … or is that strikingly beautiful Indian woman.

        FWIIW (ha ha, I have to laugh at my own puns) Worth is the lowest form of MP scum who the Nats can only be improved by ditching at the first opportunity. Total tosser.

        Key has shown a level of naivety and got exposed by Goff. Goff has played this for all it’s worth.

      • burt 4.1.3

        gobsmacked

        You seem to have missed the talking points. You don’t need evidence, just say you had it once but deleted/lost it.

        Look if this woman has been harassed then this whole debacle must be a nightmare for her – otherwise it is a major own goal for Labour.

        I posted previously that Key was right to fire Worth, the current events are giving me reason to reevaluate my views on that.

        • MikeG 4.1.3.1

          Burt – don’t forget that the reason Worth was fired wasn’t anything to do with this woman. The Police are still investigating the other allegation, and that seemed to be the cause of the sacking/resignation.

          • forgetabouthtelastone 4.1.3.1.1

            Actually – we dont even know why he was sacked yet. From Colin Espiner’s blog:


            * He wasn’t sacked for anything involving the use of drugs or alcohol

            * He wasn’t sacked over the lurid or lewd (Key has invented a new word, “lewid” to describe them) text messages he allegedly sent to the Indian woman.

            * He wasn’t sacked over the complaint made to police by the Korean businesswoman, since Key has already told us that his decision is not based on whether or not Worth is charged with anything.

            * He wasn’t sacked for not telling Key about the police complaint, since Key admitted yesterday he was unsure whether Worth even knew about it until Key confronted him.

            * He wasn’t sacked for adultery, since Key has also said he knows something about Worth that has not yet entered the public arena, and the allegation that Worth slept with someone other than his wife is already out there and just about the least of his worries.

            * He wasn’t sacked for anything to do with his business dealings, or the trip to India earlier in the year.

            http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/blogs/on-the-house/2484958/Curiouser-and-curiouser

          • Pascal's bookie 4.1.3.1.2

            And don’t forget that Worth hasn’t publicly denied anything that this woman or Goff have said. None of Whaleboy’s news is news to Worth. He could have been running the honey trap line and suing every bastard since May 6.

    • I think that we should thank the right for being so feral about this. Over the past 5 weeks they have well and truely blown the honeymoon, their chances in Mount Albert, and their chances in South Auckland. Their chances next election look poor.

      We should ask them to continuously vent and shout about this because essentially it does not make sense. The complainant and Goff obviously wanted to keep things quiet.

      The Nats are deeply embarassed. Their only response is the pit bull attack mode we are seeing now.

      They do seem to work on the basis that if you shout and scream enough then you may persuade some people to think that you may not be in the wrong.

      This is a somewhat desperate tactic however.

      Roll on the next scandal. What is the bet there will be a further attempt to smear Labour and to then try and blame us for their weaknesses.

      • gingercrush 4.2.1

        The complainant and Goff obviously wanted to keep things quiet..

        So that is why day after day they have been attempting political scoring points? Who has been smearing? Why Goff and The Standard. Key mentioned an earlier incident. That is fact. But it was Goff that kept pushing the politics of it all. He created the smears.

  5. Whacky Lefty 5

    I hope her grace is noticed and she makes a higher place up the next Labour Party list. She has clearly proven she is well behaved and can deal with unsavory characters with tact and class.

    • Eddie 5.1

      Unfortunately, this whole saga will probably have poisoned any ambitions she had to be an MP. I suspect the husband’s conviction was a reason she wasn’t chosen for Botany, a seat Labour would never win anyway.

      • burt 5.1.1

        So what you are saying Eddie is that this past was known about within Labour and Goff was sitting on this for months.

        OK – I’m a reasonable person, can you convince me this whole thing isn’t a political shit storm that got out of hand and blew up in Labour’s face?

        • Eddie 5.1.1.1

          Of course the local Labour party would have known that this woman’s husband was convicted of fraud when they chose the candidate

          That’s got no bearing on the sexual harassment issue.

          I know where you’re going to go next – the husband was convicted of fraud, so she must be a liar too – that ignores the fact that she has provided 34 texts to Key.

          • tsmithfield 5.1.1.1.1

            Read the article. Both she and her husband were actively involved in the fraudulent activity together. Only he was convicted. However, she was very close to it as well. So, its not just a case of judging her on the basis of the behaviour of her husband.

          • burt 5.1.1.1.2

            Eddie

            “she must be a liar too” – I didn’t say that.

            I said she had a speckled past which was known to Labour and that Goff sat on the scandal of sexual harassment for months – can you convince me that this debacle wasn’t a political shit storm?

        • gobsmacked 5.1.1.2

          Read the original post, Burt. Seriously.

          You want ABC? One week ago:

          A) Worth sacked
          B) Key tells media about other allegations
          C) Goff responds to media questions, and story begins.

          OK?

          • gingercrush 5.1.1.2.1

            Yeah and then he Phil Goff and Left supporters kept the story going. Goff made it political. This blog site made it political. If you make things political, you’re going to be played politically back. That is the lesson for Phil Goff and The Standard.

          • mickysavage 5.1.1.2.2

            GC

            Lefties despaired and how inept Key’s handling of this issue was. Of course that was an issue. Worth was already dead and buried by that time so whether or not he acted like a total prat is not relevant.

  6. Eddie 6

    she gave Key 34 texts in the letter today. There’s your evidence.

    • tsmithfield 6.1

      Unfortunately, Eddie, the evidence is very weak. The stuff quoted in the media today appears to be the worst of it. In fact, all that evidence does is prove the two were engaged in some sort of mutual relationship.

      Furthermore, she hasn’t included her texts going back the other way. That raises alarm bells with me straight away. What has she got to hide in this respect?

      Furthermore, there is absolutely no evidence of the sexually explicit calls she complained about. Now, the article I have pointed to calls her word into question. So, its all a bit of a damp squib really.

      • Eddie 6.1.1

        like Zetetic said. Key would be a fool to copy you and start arguing over what level of sexual harassment is serious enough.

        But then only a fool would copy a fool.

        • burt 6.1.1.1

          Eddie

          Key might have ‘sacked’ Worth because of the ‘what level of sex scandal scandal is acceptable?’ question for all we know.

          Send it all to court – if there are charges laid then it will be resolved using correct procedure. Umm, what position to take if it ends up ‘prima facie evidence not in the public interest to prosecute’ ?

          • gobsmacked 6.1.1.1.1

            what position to take if it ends up ‘prima facie evidence not in the public interest to prosecute’ ?

            Very good question, Burt. And that’s Key’s petard, hoist on it by his own stupid team.

            Coming soon, after police drop the charges …

            Media question: So why can’t Worth even remain an MP?

            Key: Well, as I said, it was conduct unbecoming, and um, well, along with other allegations …

            Media: The ones from the wicked Labour lady, who you’ve tried so hard to discredit?

            Key: Er, yes … oh, hang on, no … um …

            Yes, I’ll spell it out for the thickies who still don’t get it. Richard Worth has just started to look like a man hard done by. Thanks to the boys on the blogs. Good work, guys!

      • mickysavage 6.1.2

        Tsmithfield

        It does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter, it does not matter.

        Have I made myself clear.

        Worth was sacked for whatever it is Key decided to sack him for.

        Goff had a quiet chat with him in the hope that Mrs Worth could be spared the ignomy of all this.

        The complainant has never wanted it publicised.

        Goff is criticising Key because his handling has been so abysmal.

        There is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy, there is no conspiracy.

        Understood?

        • gingercrush 6.1.2.1

          So if Goff and this woman wanted to keep it quiet. Why did Phil Goff every day keep going to the media and peddling stuff.

          Can you not understand that mickysavage?

          • mickysavage 6.1.2.1.1

            GC

            He did AFTER Key published the complaint.

            Do you not understand? The issue is Key’s appalling handling of this matter, not the complaint itself?

            By the time this story broke Worth was a bloodied corpse that had already been thrown overboard.

            I bet this is the last time that Goff ever thinks of trying to deal with a matter privately. Next time it will be boots and all. You wingnuts should understand this.

          • gobsmacked 6.1.2.1.2

            MickeySavage, they’re just too thick to get it.

            Question time, soon:

            “Did the Minister … ?”

            “No”

            “I seek leave to table …”

            Ah, the good old days. They’ll be back.

          • Eddie 6.1.2.1.3

            Goff hasn’t been ‘going to the media’ he has been asked to answer questions by reporters.

            Look at the news tonight, Goff is about to get on a train and Espiner has asked him a question. Should he have not answered? Would you be praising him then?

          • mickysavage 6.1.2.1.4

            gobsmacked

            Precisely.

            I am amazed that the wingnuts are incapable of recognising what was a very magnanimous gesture.

            Perhaps because this is a concept they do not understand.

  7. Rodney 7

    tsmithfield you must be dizzy by now with your spinning all day. Just listen to how this is playing out in the msm, on the radio in my car for example: “nats bully women who complain about harassment”. Her husband? Who? He didn’t receive the unwelcome harassment, or is there something even more about worth you’re not telling? And who will remember the husband at the next election?

    The issue is about women suffering harrassment, two of them; perhaps more. This woman is being pilloried in the National party blogs, as will be the unfortunate Korean woman no doubt. National party attitude about women coming out loud and clear. They just can’t stop themselves, and worth will stay on.

    Goff tried to keep it quiet and resolve it with worth’s boss, that’s how the msm are reporting it to busy people who listen to the bulletins, and no amount of national party post-dated spin will change that fact.

  8. QoT 8

    I’m almost sad the trolls have gone for “it’s this ridiculously convoluted because Labour are incompetent”. I was definitely hoping for at least another few days of “DON’T YOU SEE THIS IS HOW *MACHIAVELLIAN* THEY ARE IT’S ALL INTENTIONAL”.

  9. GFraser 9

    Micky, I think even TS got that ! LOL

    • GF

      I look forward to Saturday night. It should be a great party as Labour celebrates the winning of a seat it could have lost, the solid return of South Auckland to the Labour fold and the undermining of the guy the Nats thought was invincible.

  10. GFraser 10

    GC possibly because key was trying to put a spin on the story, which was at odds with Goffs version of events

    • gingercrush 10.1

      Which is fine if you just say that instead of peddling the story every damn day. Jesus do you people not get that?

      KEY IS AN IDIOT
      WORTH IS AN IDIOT

      Very few of us on the right are denying that.

      But when you lot play holier-than-thou its going to come back and bite you. This is exactly what has happened. Goff should have kept his mouth shut and none of this would be happening. He decided to smear Key. This blog site decided to smear Key. When you smear you’re going to get smeared back. The fact many of you see Goff as a hero is really pathetic. Yes it was right of Phil Goff to go quiet. That was admirable. And would have been left admirable. But Goff simply could not keep his damn mouth shut.

      • mickysavage 10.1.1

        GC

        “KEY IS AN IDIOT
        WORTH IS AN IDIOT”

        Thanks for acknowledging that. And you expect us to be quiet?

        Is it not fair for the left to point out the weaknesses of the current PM and his Ministers?

        Do you realise how absurd that proposition is?

        And you complain because we react to the smearing of the character of a perfectly decent woman by wingnuts?

      • felix 10.1.2

        “Goff should have kept his mouth shut and none of this would be happening.”

        None of what? You guys making dicks of yourselves and calling women bitches?

        • gingercrush 10.1.2.1

          No Felix. That would be you and the stupid pedo line you opened up back when this first started.

          • felix 10.1.2.1.1

            You make even less sense than usual gc. It’s like you actually think you’ve accomplished something with all your pissing and moaning and lies and tripe.

            But carry on. It’s a great show.

          • mickysavage 10.1.2.1.2

            Pedo?

            Worth has been called a womaniser and an idiot but not a pedo. Is there something we should be told about?

          • felix 10.1.2.1.3

            Last week I asked if that was what Worth was sacked for. ginger is just angry and desperate.

  11. gingercrush 11

    Micky Savage – Yes and Goff and this blog site kept pushing the damn thing. Accusing Key of being corrupt and everything else. Goff could have declined appearing on media. He chose not to. He chose to score political points. Eventually that causes backlash.

    This would have been a Labour victory if they just shut up about it. But they didn’t so it comes back and bites them. Goff opened up us questioning who this person is. He is directly implicit in bringing this up. You even had on this blog one author Irishbill saying Goff and others should SHUT THE FUCK UP. Did Labour do that? Um no. What happens. Things get even more dirtier.

    • GC

      You guys throw the proverbial around and then complain that we cause the mess?

      So if the left is good and does not point out the right’s inadequacies the right will have no reason to go feral?

      Why do I feel like I am being bullied?

      And the left should shut up about major scandals. But didn’t Goff try that?

      • gingercrush 11.1.1

        Do you not read?

        When you continually make accusations of John Key being corrupt. Which is what Phil Goff repeatedly did and has kept doing. Eventually that will cause a backlash. Goff had the money five days ago. Hell he still had it three days. He could have left it there. Instead he kept digging and digging and digging. He even helps to reveal who this woman is and even makes the weird statement that she is “strikingly beautiful”. He chooses to not sort this out by having the woman go to John Key’s Chief of Staff. That is because he wants to play politics. That eventually comes back and bites you. Had Goff stopped three days ago like Irishbill suggested. Things would have been sorted. Labour would have scored the points politically and be in a better position. But they were too arrogant and wanted to keep pushing.

        That is why you get the issues of:

        * Who this women is
        * What her family connections are
        * Issues of credibility.

        There is a lesson for Phil Goff and this opposition. Make your political points but eventually you need to stop and reflect. Don’t keep driving issue because eventually there is a backlash.

        What do you not get?

        • gobsmacked 11.1.1.1

          So in short:

          If only Goff had said nothing, then Whale Oil and the blog bullies would have played nice. As they do.

          Ginger, go to bed, you’re already dreaming.

          • gingercrush 11.1.1.1.1

            There certainly wouldn’t be the identification of this woman.

            For days I deliberately kept away from these threads because I found John Key that pathetic. The way he handled it as already illustrated was pathetic. But you lot on the left couldn’t help yourselves but push the issue, push the issue and push the issue. Goff could have stopped the media a few days ago. Instead of listening to what Irishbill had to say he decided to kept peddling stuff. As he did that. More and more of this whole issue has been revealed. As that has been revealed. Instead of actual evidence. We’ve been left with more questions which led to even more questions. Eventually we find the whole truth of this so-called victim. Who she is. Who she is married to. What texts she received. And what we find isn’t convincing.

            If only this blog site and Phil Goff in particular actually listened to what Irishbill said three days. You couldn’t do that.

          • mickysavage 11.1.1.1.2

            The “issue” is that the current PM is incompetent.

            The rest is essentially irrelevant.

            So we should decline to say that the PM is incompetent when he clearly is?

            Why do I have this headache? My brain is not able to stretch enough to understand the right’s rationale …

  12. felix 12

    “But they didn’t so it comes back and bites them”

    What? In bizzaro world maybe.

    In the real world Worth is a perve, Key is a lame duck, and no-one cares about Goff.

    Sorry to burst your bubble but you guys getting angry and calling women bitches doesn’t do much for anyone except highlight the nasty dirty true face of the national party.

    • burt 12.1

      Hang on a minute felix, let the story play out a bit before deciding who’s got a dirty face.

      • felix 12.1.1

        No need. I’ve learned lately that these things can be worked out retrospectively.

      • burt 12.1.2

        If this story has been used for political gain then it has worked. Worth’s a fool for getting involved like this, I think it’s right for him to resign (be sacked – whatever) under accusations like that. What level of ‘sexual harasser’ should we tolerate in parliament?

        As a minimum, Worth has been shown to be easily led by his dick, not an admirable quality for a minister in govt. Key has taken care of that all be it inelegantly. As a maximum – chemical castration might be in order.

        The current question is; was there harassment? The claim has been made, the proof is still being ‘looked at’ by highly conflicted parties. More parliament investigating and ruling on parliament stuff so yes – RV is certainly in the tool kit should National feel the need to use it over any illegal spending by Worth in these matters, ( God forbid we pass a validation through parliament because Worth booked a high class hooker to his expense account – what will parliamentary services do if they approved it! )

        • jarbury 12.1.2.1

          Good summary Burt.

          Basically all that’s left in the story is whether Worth stays in parliament. Hopefully that’s decided soon so we can go back to debating issues that actually matter.

    • burt 12.2

      Look I said sack him with the rest of you, but if this story has been used for political gain then it has worked. Worth’s a fool for getting involved like this, I think it’s right for him to resign under accusations like that. What level of ‘sexual harasser’ should we tolerate in parliament?

      As a minimum, Worth has been shown to be easily led by his dick, not an admirable quality for a minister in govt. Key has taken care of that all be it inelegantly. The next question is; was there harassment? The claim has been made, the proof is still being weighed.

  13. gingercrush 13

    The “issue’ is that the current PM is incompetent.

    That was the issue. That is no longer case. The media tonight and the newspapers and radio tomorrow will be about HER. You’ve answered what I’ve been saying all night. The issue was and still should have been about Key. Now its about her and her accusations.

    • felix 13.1

      Course it is.

      Careful, ginge – your nasty side is showing again. And your wishful thinking is dripping off your chin.

  14. Draco T Bastard 14

    Like stopping this economic meltdown.

    JK doesn’t want to stop the economic meltdown as he benefits from all the lowered wages that he wanted.

  15. Maynard J 15

    gingergrush, I’m inclined to agree with elements of what you are saying here, but I would point out that Key kept this going by calling Goff’s honesty into question. Basically point-blank called him a liar. I am not sure how Goff could have defended himself without saying anything – and we all know silence in politics is taken as tacit admission.

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