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Open Mike 18/09/2016

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, September 18th, 2016 - 175 comments
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175 comments on “Open Mike 18/09/2016 ”

  1. Muttonbird 1

    Social Development Minister Anne Tolley said she was looking forward to receiving ignoring recommendations from the UN’s Committee on the Rights of the Child, after a “comprehensive” session in Geneva.


    • Paul 1.1


      “They asked a question about poverty, they asked a question about how many children were homeless and did we have an official measure – of course, we do have an official measure.”
      They also talked at length about the new Ministry for Vulnerable Children.
      “There was some misunderstanding as to what we’re trying to achieve with that but I think we had good dialogue about it.”
      The government delegation did not pretend New Zealand had all the answers, particularly around outcomes for Māori and Pasifika children, Mrs Tolley said.
      But Unicef NZ executive director Vivien Maidaborn, who was part of the delegation, said the panel had expressed concern about the new ministry.
      “The comment that was made was, ‘I don’t understand why you would call a Ministry the Ministry of Vulnerable Children when it could just have been the Ministry of Children. You’re in danger of overtargeting towards vulnerable children at the expense of rights to all New Zealand children.'”

      • Draco T Bastard 1.1.1

        You’re in danger of overtargeting towards vulnerable children at the expense of rights to all New Zealand children.

        Just watch as National cuts the budget for the department and tightens up the criteria.

        • aerobubble

          Govt is only part of the problem, when a overwhelmed family has been forced to work several jobs, lacks access to family time, bonding opportunities, money to spend to take family out etc… …thanks to govt. You then should look at private sector abuses of child rearing. Working stiffs get how bone tired only to find there role at providing a healthy meal is impossible as our supermarket routinely extort money from them. Good retail provide the five basics, quality, consistency, availability, price, choice. Go in our major food retailers, and you’ll findaisles of sugery foods, varying prices, varying quality, unavailability (take red grapefruit f available its been on the shevles so long they’ve had to infuse it with detergent to keep it looking sellable. Fruit cooked on the inside. Meat tasteless and obvious thawed passed off as fresh, and wtf does freeflow meat mean.

          You want to know why the poorest in NZ, the child of the poorest, are so badly off, its quite simple. Labour MPs have too much wealth, there’s too few of them, and they have no connection to poverty and to much to propert, to the ideals of big retail. It was hard to believe, but Australia is institutionalized racist, take how Maori are treated there, and NZ is socially fascists, its retailers work far too hard squeezing profits to actually do it efficiently. Bulk sales means lower costs, o nly poor managers a poor mangerment class, like our awfully small parliament doubling as a upper chamber, would think that our extremist retail sector is good for either profits of shareholders (its not as debt growth from over paying idiots to produce another opportunity to grow rebates is not…

          We suffer in NZ from a lack of critical thinkers who can stand up and call a spade a spade, and have to many critics doing meta analaysis of their own meta handingly of procedural nonosense. Raise the no of MPs, fund public broadcasting, and put distance between business and govt, so let our nation finall breath some democratic air for a change.

    • DoublePlusGood 1.2

      They also straight-up lied to the UN about intersex genital mutilation. Hope the UN call them on it.

  2. Paul 2

    Shameful #2

    Women’s Refuge needs more funding – and soon.

    The head of the Women’s Refuge says recently signalled reforms to tackle family violence mean they’ll need even more funding, and soon.
    Dr Ang Jury from the Palmerston North Women’s RefugeAng Jury said Women’s Refuge had not received any increase to its core service funding since about 2008.
    Justice Minister Amy Adams told TV3’s The Nation a $130 million package announced this week was largely about changes to the legal framework and a ministerial taskforce is still working on how to fund frontline services.
    Dr Ang Jury said they would like to see an announcement before current contracts end in June.
    “There’s been no increase in our core service funding since about 2008 and all of the reforms which are being signalled as being put in place are requiring more.
    “Now I understand that the ministers are well and truly aware of that, and that they are working on that, but at this point in time we’ve got no idea what happens next.”


  3. Big story on racism and the justice system – well known to some may open eyes of others

    A Stuff Circuit investigation has delved into 10 years’ worth of data, examining arrest, prosecution, conviction and sentencing records and spoken to a broad range of people confronting the problem.

    Problem? Undeniably, yes. There is no doubt that, from whichever angle you look at it, there is a serious skew in the system against Maori.

    Even the Government acknowledges it. A senior official admitted to Stuff Circuit that unconscious bias in the justice system was a “live issue”.

    Besides, the numbers are undeniable…

    …As part of our research, we looked back at the number of police apprehensions over the past 10 years. It’s roughly the same number for Pakeha as Maori – 875,000 versus 868,000.

    But if the number of Maori apprehensions were adjusted to match the proportion of the population made up by Maori, the number of Maori apprehensions would reduce to about 300,000.

    Think about that for a minute: half a million fewer arrests of Maori. Imagine what it would mean not just for Maori but for our country if that was the reality.


    We all lose because of this institutional racism.

    • Draco T Bastard 3.1

      As part of our research, we looked back at the number of police apprehensions over the past 10 years. It’s roughly the same number for Pakeha as Maori – 875,000 versus 868,000.

      But if the number of Maori apprehensions were adjusted to match the proportion of the population made up by Maori, the number of Maori apprehensions would reduce to about 300,000.

      That could indicate racism or that Māori are more likely to commit crimes. Considering that poverty does drive criminal activity then that may actually be true considering that Māori are also over represented in poverty statistics.

      If Māori do commit more crime then we need to address the cause for that and that is most likely to mean addressing the cause of poverty which itself is probably, partially at least, due to racism. A large part is capitalism which is the direct cause of poverty in the first place.

      • marty mars 3.1.1

        Nah it is racism not bad Māori – read the research

        • Draco T Bastard

          I didn’t say anything about Māori being bad.

          And you should probably read all that I wrote.

          • marty mars

            I did read it and i agree about poverty and caputalism but I don’t agree when you say, ‘or that Māori are more likely to commit crimes’

            • Draco T Bastard

              That needs the entire sentence and what it was a response to as all I was doing there was showing that the bit quoted could show two things and thus wasn’t something that could be used to base a conclusion on.

        • Cinny

          Strongly agree

          Weak police and people in power, profiling others based on their appearance aka skin colour. They need to sharpen up, psychologically advance.

          Next generation teaches me, my youngest points to a person in a group of others, telling me how awesome that person is, how they helped her at school and that he was a nice kid, i ask her which one, she replies the one with the orange shirt on, he was the only brown kid in that small group of kids and she choose to identify him by his shirt colour. Kudos little one keep it up.

    • North 3.2

      Thanks for highlighting this demonstrable stain MM. One can only guess at the figures if Polynesian people were included in the analysis……a million, more ?

      My almost daily and oftentimes bitter experience is of a justice system which discriminates against Maori and Polynesian, particularly the young. In randomly varying measure it is evident at all levels. From police on the street to police prosecutors to probation officials to court officials to lawyers to judicial officers. The ‘spin’, grand mission statements and so on, tells differently. Trouble is the ‘spin’ is devised and disseminated to conceal the ugly fact rather than to own and address it. A construct moral comfort.

      Subliminal racist attitudes persuade that “these people” are more or less definitionally culpable. Time and again “these people” are treated accordingly as the Stuff analysis shows.

      Examples are too numerous to report exhaustively. I will report this informally made observation from a District Court judge – “We are at real risk of civil unrest in New Zealand…….” Yes, poverty of course but when as is so often the case the picture includes racism…….ask yourself. A society can blame and brand and humiliate and dehumanise for only so long.

    • b waghorn 3.3

      It’s more classism than racism , we saw a kings son walk away with no conviction recently in nz just as the delegate boy did .

      • Pasupial 3.3.1

        b waghorn
        If it is; “more classism than racism”, then how do explain this?

        Parliament’s Senior Māori Advisor is angry he was threatened with arrest when pulled over by Wellington police because he chose to respond to the officer’s questions in te reo Māori. Kura Moeahu says he did nothing wrong and was only exercising his legal right to speak his national language…

        “[The officer said] ‘Don’t talk like that, I won’t have that talk to me’, so I continue to respond in Māori and then he said, ‘you do that again I’m going to arrest you’.”


        • b waghorn

          If i was a cop and i pulled someone up while doing my job and the spoke to me another language when i knew damn well he could speak my language i’d just see him as being a foolish dick head. Or are you suggesting all police be multi lingual .

          • Pasupial

            I am suggesting that our police should have multilingual capability – for the official languages of Aotearoa/ NZ (though it wouldn’t hurt to be able to communicate with tourists too). The individual officer might be monolingual, but an interpreter service should be accessible; this might even be an app for te reo (though I’ve heard that they’re a bit iffy so far).

            Would you also suggest that someone who persisted in using NZ sign language as being a; “foolish dick head”?

            • left for dead

              Good point, as you have read, some have trouble with just the one language. 👿

            • b waghorn

              ”Would you also suggest that someone who persisted in using NZ sign language as being a; “foolish dick head”?”
              if they could hear and speak then yes if they were deaf or mute or both then of course not

          • Psycho Milt

            That’s the thing about making a language an official one of your country – you’re free to demand that public officials use it when they speak to you. The cop should count himself lucky it wasn’t a deaf-rights activist demanding to be dealt with in sign language.

        • Gabby

          He sounds like a bit of a pigheaded arsehole. I wonder what he was pulled over for.

        • Gabby

          He was ‘exercising his right’ to use language as a status marker and put himself above the copper. He clearly understood what was said to him.

  4. BM 5

    What a surprise, she was lying her head off.


    Hopefully the SJW’s and all those women group advocates who signed the document when the witch hunt was in full swing show a bit of spine and apologise to the Chiefs rugby players.

    • James 5.1

      They won’t of course. A woman can never be a liar. It’s the men’s fault as always.

      • BM 5.1.1

        Yep, an attitude that seems to be synonymous with the left.

        • Paul

          Of course, if you are a true New Zealander, you don’t say sorry if you’re a man, do you?
          Educate yourself.

          David Cunliffe’s apology brave, not silly
          ‘Please tell me I’m dreaming”, texted a friend of mine. “Please tell me that David Cunliffe didn’t just apologise for being a man.”

          I stared at my cell-phone in disbelief. Was he joking? Why would the leader of a political party languishing in the opinion polls alienate at least half of the voting public? Why would he hand his opponents such an enormous cudgel? As if his party wasn’t already battered enough?

          Later that day, at the pub, the guffaws and the jokes continued. I have to confess, I contributed my fair share of them. I would also point out that although all of my drinking companions were Lefties, by no means all of them were men. This was equal-opportunity ridicule.

          So what was going on here? Why were a tableful of seasoned Leftists – male and female – and all of them well-versed in the facts and figures of domestic violence in New Zealand, so unanimous in condemning the opening sentences of David Cunliffe’s speech to last Friday’s Women’s Refuge Symposium?

          It might be useful, here, to remind ourselves of his actual words: “Can I begin by saying I’m sorry – I don’t often say it – I’m sorry for being a man, right now. Because family and sexual violence is perpetrated overwhelmingly by men against women and children. So the first message to the men out there is: ‘wake up, stand up, man up and stop this bullshit’.”

          You see? Written down in full and contextualised, Cunliffe’s words don’t look all that silly – do they? Indeed, you might even say they look rather brave.

          None of us seated around that table at the pub, and no intelligent person reading Cunliffe’s sentences anywhere else in New Zealand, would dispute them. The perpetration of psychological, physical and sexual violence is overwhelmingly a masculine phenomenon. And while not every male is guilty of assaulting and/or raping women and girls, the violence inflicted upon females by a minority of males does contribute to the maintenance of a patriarchal culture from which all men derive benefit.

          Patriarchy and imperialism are closely related, so perhaps it would help to elucidate the role that violence plays in shoring up our patriarchal culture by elucidating the role it played in shoring up the British Empire.

          It is said that the entire Indian sub-continent was kept in the thrall of Great Britain by an imperial administration of fewer than 100,000 men. By no means all of these men were engaged in the brutal business of repression. The majority were well-educated, thoroughly decent civil servants who would never have dreamed of flogging a man to death, or presiding over the slow starvation of an entire province. Such dreadful acts were carried out by others: by soldiers and policemen. Deplorable, of course, but necessary – if the British Raj was to survive.

          Is that why even we Lefties buried our heads in our hands upon hearing Cunliffe’s words? Because we knew, instinctively, just how outraged “ordinary” men would be when they heard them?

          Not because these other men were in favour of hurting women and children, but because, however ham-fistedly, Cunliffe had acknowledged all men’s complicity in the myriad acts of violence and intimidation that mandate the equally numerous acts of female-to-male deference and acceptance by which the patriarchal individual defines himself.

          The exercise of power and control constitutes the common coinage of both patriarchy and imperialism. And, no matter how thoroughly we attempt to conceal them beneath the draperies of romantic love and the “White Man’s Burden”, the true character of their brutal transactions cannot be hidden.

          All men (and, I suspect, an alarmingly large number of women also) learn to both see and not-see the effects of domestic and sexual violence. We recoil in horror from the murdered wives and children but find it next to impossible to recognise the manifest evil in the perpetrators – the men invariably described as “just an ordinary bloke, a good family man”. But, in portraying these “enforcers” of patriarchy in such chillingly normative terms we confirm (albeit unconsciously) our own participation in the dark secret that Cunliffe shouted to the world.

          That these horrors are of our making – men’s making – and will persist until, acknowledging the role violence plays in preserving our patriarchal privilege, we can all say: “I’m sorry for being a man.”


          • Colonial Viper

            shame the Labour caucus couldn’t wait to get rid of him.

            • Paul

              I agree.
              The Labour Party is full of men who totally agree with BM and James’s neanderthal view of women.

          • BM

            Yeah I get it Paul, you’re one of those self loathing left wing men who feels the need to constantly self flagellate for being born with a penis.

            • Paul

              So you did not read a word of the article.

            • reason

              BM could not get an erection the whole time Helen Clark was prime minister and it nearly drove him insane ………… bitter memories.

              He finds trolling helps…… and For man relief he takes pride in John Key winning us the world cup for domestic violence …..

              Gives him a hard on like Clint Rickards police baton.

              Yay …….BMs got enough cock pride for all of us men…………..

              Bent to the right though ……………………..

          • vto

            unbalanced bull

            keep perpetrating the myth though

            the hand that rocks the cradle

          • Ad

            Cardinal political rule: It’s wrong to be right too soon

            • ianmac

              So true Ad. Andrew wondered why we import so many chefs and was ridiculed for ages. Now? Questions are being raised about that.
              David’s, ““Can I begin by saying I’m sorry – I don’t often say it – I’m sorry for being a man, right now. Because family and sexual violence is perpetrated overwhelmingly by men against women and children. So the first message to the men out there is: ‘wake up, stand up, man up and stop this bullshit’.”
              Now it is becoming more relevant. We do nod in agreement.

          • Cinny

            Agree, and just wanted to add that only a non alpha male does not apologise even when he is wrong.

            An Alpha Male has no hang-ups. He simply says, “I was wrong. I apologise.” And he rectifies the problem if possible.

            A sure way of spotting the boys from the men, men admit when they are wrong then try and fix the problem. But then again parenting does have a role to play, much of it is learned behaviour. Break the cycle

        • Paul

          An attitude that seems to be synonymous with too many New Zealand men.


        • Ffloyd

          @.BM/James. Do you two sit together in class? Bet the teacher gets annoyed with you. A lot to say while saying nothing of any consequence. Boring in the extreme.

      • left for dead 5.1.2

        You two !
        When you fell on your head’s, they never put humpty together again.
        Egging him on is even more sinister, then lie.

      • Disturbed 5.1.3

        Nah, = you are having me on aren’t you? James.

        Gender has nothing to do with honesty, men & women be as deceptive as each other but men shouldn’t belittle women more should they?

    • Colonial Viper 5.2

      No wonder the police declined to press the matter further.

      • fender 5.2.1

        The Police should still have dealt with the matter as one of theft. It seems the products on offer were available to those willing to pay appropriately but like a shoplifter they chose not to.

    • Paul 5.3

      The driver admitted to licking “Scarlette” as she performed a lap dance for him, which was paid for by the Chiefs.
      He said he did so after he was egged on by Chief team members.

      I hope you are not justifying the Chief’s actions. Did you note their behaviour as reported in the article?
      This is the reason why we have such awful statistics in this country.


      New Zealand is no paradise, it is brutal

      New Zealand is no paradise: Is it the most sexist place on earth?

      New Zealand is no paradise: Rugby, racism and homophobia

      • James 5.3.1

        She lied – a lot. And there is no evidence for he majority of her claims – in fact all the witnesses etc indicate she made a lot of this up.

        As CV said – no wonder the police didn’t take it forward. But still there are limp wristed fools like yourself.

        What about the damage this has done to the chiefs.

        In an ideal world they would take a civil case against the woman for all the $ this has cost them from her false allegations.

        • Paul

          Limp wristed fools

          Homophobia and misogyny.

        • reason

          James sounds like a dickhead letting his balls do the thinking for him ……..

          Rugby union must love clowns like him or BMs and the ugly face it puts to our shit house minor league and irrelevant national game ………..

          Club player numbers are through the floor …………….

          The lost sheep was going on about super 15 rugby players licking arseholes at team celebrations the other day ………. like it was a normal part of the game …..

          It does not seem very family orientated though ……………

          I hope john key does not have any NZ rugby players involved with his lawyer and their tax haven connections …………….

          That wo7uld be a very ugly look ………….

        • Red Hand

          Witness statements are notoriously unreliable and Scarlette was justifiably outraged by not being paid in full for her services. A chiefs player would be aggrieved if he wasn’t paid by his employer to do the job he had agreed to.

        • Ffloyd

          @ James. A civil case would be great. Then these ghost witnesses would have to front up and be visible and swear to ‘tell the truth’ etc. How do you know they even exist? And doesn’t it seem ironical that the only REAL witness is an elderly bus driver who appears to have been thrown under his own bus? It is also telling that none of the rugby team (chiefs) have fronted up to tell their story. Why haven’t they? Pathetic rugby brand being protected by the Old Boys Club.

        • Cinny

          Boys will always stick together, we all know that, especially those boys. I can fully see them egging on the bus driver, or using him for a scape goat. Only those whom were there know the real story.

          It’s rugby, cleverly managed by the media to keep it shiny as key cradles it in his punny arms.

      • whispering kate 5.3.2

        It sounds to me like the Chiefs team members didn’t have the bottle to do what the driver did and so they egged him on so they could visually get their jollies off – whatever the outcome its disgusting. What staggers me is from reading these comments from BM and others is the extent of the vitriole and hatred some men in NZ have for women. There is real anger in their replies – why do these men hate women so much – what have women done to them in their lives to have this attitude?

        • James

          WK. I guess I’m the “and others” you mentioned.

          Don’t hate women – happily married 20 years plus and have a stepdaughter I have raised and love very much.

          The fact I can hate the actions of a person who has lied and caused a huge amount of damage does not mean I hate all of her sex.

          I think she should be held to account for her actions.

          That’s all.

          it really is that simple.

        • BM

          Don’t be ridiculous,I don’t hate women.

          What i do hate though is this lefty construct of putting women up on a pedestal and treating them like some godly creatures beyond reproach.

          This person told lies, hurt a lot of people and cost businesses money by having their reputations dragged through the mud.

          She should be called out on that.

    • Fireblade 5.4

      Yep. The stripper was whinging because she didn’t get an extra $50 for the licking & touching. Happy to do anything if she’s paid for it.
      We all know this type.

      • Sabine 5.4.1

        yep the one that insist in CONSENT.

        consent to not be licked and touched.
        consent to be licked and touched.

        you don’t have consent? you should consider any licking and touching sexual assault.

      • save nz 5.4.2

        Well it is $50 extra if you are sick in the taxi on top of the fare. Maybe look at in this light. The women had to do something unpleasant (put up with the touching) so expected to be paid for it. The points are that

        a) did she consent to the touching?,
        b) if she did consent, then she was ripped off as they did not pay her for it. Either way, not acceptable. (In their warped little brains maybe they imagine she enjoyed it and therefore should not be paid). Just as the drunks think that taxi drivers should clean up vomit as part of their duties.

        c) This is completely unacceptable anyway for a group representing the country to acting this way. What’s next, strip teases at parliament for the men to get their jollies???

        • Sabine


          it is actually really easy, she is working in a legal profession and has the right to a safe workplace. if these geezers can’t behave themselves after a beer or many, than they need to be

          a. trained in how to consume alcohol responsible

          b. taught the difference between consent and not consent

          c. taught how commercial transactions come about and what happens when a contractual obligation is not upheld

          d. trained into not being an ass when pretending to be a ‘role model’ for the young in this country, lest we would like to see our young turn into asses like they are.

          e. taught that prostitutes, strippers, burlesque dancers and all others that work in the adult entertainment business are full human beings with all the rights of full human beings.

      • Red Hand 5.4.3

        Just like the Warrior players are happy to be paid for being in a scrum and tackling. Close body contacts and exchange of sweat, blood, saliva, egged on by a cheering crowd many of them drunk.

    • vto 5.5

      I think half the country is walking around with bashed chins from their knees jerking so violently

    • Anne 5.6

      BM @ 5
      You call her a liar? As any honest woman would tell you… better to carry on the charade than admit you’re upset. Who knows what might happen if a bunch of obnoxious, drunken rugby hooligans discover you don’t like their behaviour. After all they were a lot bigger than she was.

      To describe you and your ilk as neanderthals is an insult to Neanderthals. I bet they didn’t behave like that. The All Blacks – aka The Chiefs – only served to confirm for me what I have long known. They are the worst possible ‘role models’ imaginable for impressionable school boys.

      It says heaps about what is really wrong with this country.

      • Paul 5.6.1

        Totally agree Anne.
        It is clear from the account that the Chiefs were behaving like ‘obnoxious, drunken hooligans’, yet James and BM feel sorry for them.

      • James 5.6.2

        Anne – I don’t know what made you so bitter – but a lot of those guys are indeed fantastic role models.

        You say you have always known that they were bad role models without having met most (if any) of them, without knowing their lives and values or how they behave.

        You make allegations and remarks based off your view of what you think they would be like.

        But you get shitty if it’s on the other foot. People like you are more of the problem than anything.

        You probably think the woman in this story is a better role model. Despite being proven a liar and running to the media with a billshit story trying to ruin the lives of other people.

        • Draco T Bastard

          You say you have always known that they were bad role models without having met most (if any) of them, without knowing their lives and values or how they behave.

          We do know how they behave. Their atrocious behaviour is almost always in the news and arseholes like you are ready and willing to defend that behaviour.

        • Garibaldi

          Regardless of the Scarlett carry-on, it remains abundantly clear that rucking fugby has turned a team sport into an embarrassing all encompassing lifestyle. A lifestyle of pack mentality by and for testosterone driven boof heads. Rugby has always had this element in NZ, but it has worsened with the move to professional sport and the neolib attitude of win at all costs. Exactly what this Government fosters.
          As an aside, it is a total embarrassment to attend any match now and observe the crowd behaviour.

        • Halfcrown

          “Anne – I don’t know what made you so bitter ”

          I don’t think Anne is bitter, she is telling the truth. Why is it every time someone has a comment which the right does not feel comfortable with the person commenting is always “bitter”?

          “but a lot of those guys are indeed fantastic role models.”

          You must be Joking, I would be most surprised if any of my kids had any Thugby player as a role model. Real men and role models aren’t they to younger generations when they had a stripper at one of their functions.
          The are put on pedestals by the media and politicians when they think they can score browny points off them.
          There are a lot of better role models in NZ that do a lot more than fight over an odd shaped ball in a paddock.

      • Draco T Bastard 5.6.3

        To describe you and your ilk as neanderthals is an insult to Neanderthals. I bet they didn’t behave like that. The All Blacks – aka The Chiefs – only served to confirm for me what I have long known. They are the worst possible ‘role models’ imaginable for impressionable school boys.


    • Draco T Bastard 5.7

      No, sounds to me like she was telling the truth and she’s just been vindicated by the one person who could fully do so.

    • Gabby 5.8

      You know, the Chuffs don’t come out of that version too well. Egging on a pensioner? Bunch of arseholes.

    • What a surprise, she was lying her head off.

      She was? You know this how, exactly? Nothing in the article you linked to provides a basis for such firm conviction – maybe the certainty’s an artefact of your prejudice, not a demonstrated outcome of the evidence.

    • mauī 5.10

      The bus driver sounds like a BM type character. Willing to drop a whole rugby squad in it for 5 weeks before coming clean. Partial to the coverup and probably full of bullshit anyway.

      If it was all Labour’s bus drivers fault I’m sure he would have been crucified from day one. Funny he wasn’t.

    • mpledger 5.11

      How in the world do you get that Scarlett was lying about what happened from that article?

      All it says is that one older man, who was there for a short time, thinks Scarlett was talking about him in her complaint because he licked her. Sounds like the Chiefs have found someone to throw under the bus.

  5. Colonial Viper 6

    Syrian flash pointier: US Centcom admits error in airstrike killing 62 Syrian Army soldiers, wounding over 100 more and destroying vital equipment and facilities, allowing head chopping Islamic jihadists to advance on a Syrian air base.

  6. Paul 7

    This is what happens when you have a government owned by lobbyists.
    Policy that does not tackle the issues properly.

    The government has been accused of ignoring scientific evidence of how alcohol reform could contribute to reducing family violence.
    Professor Doug Sellman, medical spokesman for Alcohol Action NZ, insists the government has a mistaken political ideology that education and targeting interventions at high risk individuals is the correct way to tackle social problems like family violence, without evidence that approach works.
    He says the government has cynically dismissed the Law Commission’s report recommending reform of alcohol pricing, marketing, accessibility and age of purchase.
    “There’s been very little done about alcohol law reform in New Zealand, despite the Government – I think – pretending they are doing a lot,” he said.


    • Draco T Bastard 7.1

      The government protects the profits of the corporations at the expense of the community. Always has done.

    • The government has been accused of ignoring scientific evidence of how alcohol reform could contribute to reducing family violence.

      Sellman’s a fuckwit. Yes, banning alcohol could contribute to reducing family violence. So could banning men and women from living together. Solutions that aren’t stupid ones would be more worth looking at.

      • Draco T Bastard 7.2.1

        He doesn’t appear to have asked for banning of alcohol but better regulation.

        • Psycho Milt

          Principle’s the same: restricting access to alcohol would reduce family violence; so would restricting the opportunities for men and women to live together; and there are other, equally stupid measures that could be adopted, like installing video surveillance in every home. Just because some stupid idea would reduce family violence doesn’t make it less of a stupid idea.

          • Draco T Bastard

            Principle’s the same: restricting access to alcohol would reduce family violence; so would restricting the opportunities for men and women to live together;

            No, they’re not.

            One is shaping the market to help bring about reform while the other simply a stupid, illogical argument because it cannot be done and you know it.

            • Psycho Milt

              Can’t be done? Tell that to Saudi Arabia. Of course it can be done, the only question is whether the fact that it would reduce family violence means it should be done. “Reduce family violence” isn’t some kind of trump card that means the government must adopt any stupid idea some fanatic comes up with.

              • Draco T Bastard

                Yes, cannot be done. Saudi Arabia has a completely different culture than we do and there’s no way that such restrictions could be put in place in NZ.

                On the other hand, we have restrictions on alcohol sales that do mostly work and further minor restrictions will still work and produce some sort of result in decrease in both binge drinking and lower violence.

                • We already have an overly restrictive approach to alcohol and even more so to other recreational drugs. Tinkering around the edges making already stupid workarounds more stupid isn’t a good approach to problem-solving.

                  • Draco T Bastard

                    We already have an overly restrictive approach to alcohol and even more so to other recreational drugs.

                    I agree with the other drugs needing to be legalised but I also think that raising the age to 21 from its present 18 and putting in place more restrictive opening hours of pubs would help and so does the research.

                    You’re calling it ‘tinkering around the edges’ while the government does nothing at all. Laws aren’t perfect and they do need to be changed and updated every now and again based upon the evidence. You’re doing the same as the government and ignoring that evidence.

    • reason 7.3

      As usual with the Nacts its even worse than it appears on the surface ….

      They swung their Dirty politics unit into action against health professionals and others seeking to lower alcohol abuse …………

      John Key was the first out of the blocks to go ‘nah fuck that’,….. and immediately nobble the main recommendations from the Law Commission’s report ….

      The laws they did end passing are an expensive mess for councils and ratepayers …. with the booze companys appealing every liquor plan submitted …………

      Twice under the misuse of urgency in parliament the Nacts passed pro-booze laws……..

      So clearly Collins, Tolly, Bennett, Adams,Key etc are all liars when they pretend to be concerned about child welfare and abuse ………….

      A lot of extra kids have experienced or witnessed violence because of Alcohol abuse in their homes …..

      Finally rehab services have been shrunk and are inferior to what they once were …… they are still the first to get chopped or cut back when health funds and budgets are under stress ….

      What society calls Alcoholics and problem drinkers ….. the booze company s call high value customers.

      A relapsed alcoholic earns the piss sellers heaps ……….

      If I wanted to fuck up Alcoholics recoveries….. I’d stick booze in supermarkets

      If I wanted to keep domestic violence rates high …… I’d keep alcohol abuse rates high ….

  7. Fuck this whole thread should be nuked from orbit – rwnjs and their issues – so pathetic.

  8. Small&Furry 9

    President of Haiti reveals Clinton tried to bribe him… and he kept the documents

    • Colonial Viper 9.1

      Yep Trump held a campaign meeting in Little Haiti in Miami this week – first visit by a Presidential candidate to Little Haiti ever.

  9. joe90 10

    Letterman apologises to Trump.

    • Colonial Viper 10.1

      Letterman was spot on – Trump says dopey stupid things to get attention. And boy, has it worked.

  10. millsy 11

    Good to see that BM and James are pro-rape apologists who think that is it is OK for men to force themselves on a woman.

    • Muttonbird 11.1

      No moral compass. Comes with being rightwing.

      • Gangnam Style 11.1.1

        Didn’t those ‘independent witnesses’ say they saw ‘nothing happen’? Did any of them mention a naughty bus driver? Barbara Streisand effect maybe? There’s a story going round in rugby fan circles that the stripper was ‘paid off’ by rugby management not to comment.

    • James 11.2

      Now you are just being hysterical – I do not think that at all.

      • Gangnam Style 11.2.1

        I was waiting for the ‘hysterical’ word to come up! Nice one, never one to disappoint are you James! Now the ladeees should just shut up, its mans time now.

        • James

          I have no idea is Millsy is a woman or a man – and dont care. That was my view of his/her comment stating that I was a pro-rape apologist.

          • Gangnam Style

            I don’t know wether Millsy is a man or women, I don;t assume he/she isn’t. Also, there are women readers, or don’t they count? Politics = man talk?

  11. Fireblade 12

    Then she should have admitted it was all about the money. Seems like she enjoyed it at the time and gave CONSENT. Then she’s all boo hoo I wasn’t paid enough. Good on the Pensioner for having go. Get real people, this how [deleted] operate.

    [That’s quite some run-up to the line you’ve taken in order to jump waaay over there. Well done…outta sight! One month ban] – Bill

  12. Pat 13

    100 years since the Somme.

    “Trench warfare is a type of land warfare using occupied fighting lines consisting largely of trenches, in which troops are significantly protected from the enemy’s small arms fire and are substantially sheltered from artillery. The most famous use of trench warfare is the Western Front in World War I. It has become a byword for stalemate, attrition, sieges and futility in conflict.[1]”
    The area between opposing trench lines (known as “no man’s land”) was fully exposed to artillery fire from both sides….”

    • Pasupial 13.1

      It has been interesting reading the; “100 years ago” reprints in the ODT. The level of propagandist drumbeating for the war makes me wonder how our own media will be seen after a similar interval (assuming there’s anyone left to read it) eg:

      The thoughts of the people of New Zealand will be with the members of their Expeditionary Force who form part of that glorious army which is facing discomfort, danger, and the risk of death in order to protect their Empire and to assist in crushing the military despotism of Germany.

      That was actually from earlier in the week (13/9/1916). Because, although later reprints do have such WTF images as Indian Calvary preparing for the Somme, that day had this reminder of how wars can be used to justify other ends:

      Wellington states that the film censorship regulations have been gazetted, and will come into operation to-morrow. Provision has been made for the establishment of a Board of Appeal, consisting of three persons, who will be appointed shortly. Strong representations have been made to the Minister urging the appointment of at least one woman to the Appeal Board; but, as the censorship deals with the questions of decency and suggestiveness of films, Mr Russell, after careful consideration, has decided that, in order to provide full freedom for the discussion of details, it is better that women should not be on the board.


  13. Chuck 14

    Is this not what the activist left want to happen?

    “A speech from Andrew Little in which he acknowledges the devastation wrought by Rogernomics, and spelling out how he proposes to right the wrongs it inflicted on working-class Kiwis, would almost certainly produce a similar galvanising effect as Brash’s 2004 speech to the Orewa Rotary Club.”

    “And a much better poll.”


    Trotter lays it out so well…

    “Regardless of its severity, it was tactically foolish of Little to deny the accuracy of Colmar Brunton’s latest survey”

    “When presented with terrible news, it is perfectly natural for human-beings to take refuge in denial.”

  14. Takere 15

    Speaking Maori to a Police Officer is considered a threat …. nekminit Maori will be shot because Maori man looked aggressively at me “Police Officer” says? Do we need to declare we’ve got an Apartheid State in Aotearoa, oh sorry, Nueeew Zeeeelind? WTF. Nick Smiths got a lot to answer for! Kiwi versus Iwi election campaign slogan-John Ansell!

    • Chuck 15.1

      No one likes to be pulled over by the police. This looks like Kura Moeahu was being a little naughty…quickly working out the police officer did not understand him so milked it for all it was worth.

      • Gangnam Style 15.1.1

        So now it’s ‘naughty’ to speak Te Reo in NZ? Firing on all barrels today!

        • Gabby

          Well in this case it’s bloody rude and arrogant.

          • Trey

            New Zealand has three official languages, English, Maori and NZ sign. How is it rude and arrogant to speak one of these official langauges? Would it be rude an arrogant for a deaf person to speak in New Zealand Sign language? Or does it only apply to Maori?

            • Chuck

              “How is it rude and arrogant to speak one of these official langauges?”

              When the other party to the conversation does not understand what you are saying…more so in this case when a police officer is just trying to do his/her job.

              • Trey

                It is not rude or arrogant to speak an official langauge of this country. What is rude and arrogant is racists like you trying to deny someones rights to do that. As I said would a deaf person speaking in sign been treated the same way

            • Gabby

              It’s an unacceptable microaggression.

              • One Anonymous Bloke


                Oh noes! Hurt feelings!

                Taser the fucker then? What does it say in the Police manual? “You will respect my authoritah!”.

                Get off your knees.

        • Chuck

          In this case yep. Moeahu was clearly looking to cause “a issue” by refusing to communicate with the police officer (who obviously could not speak Te Reo).

          • One Anonymous Bloke

            When in Rome, do as the Romans do. Unless they’re speaking Italian, the insolent dogs!

      • Takere 15.1.2

        Speaking the National language of the country isn’t a crime.(Well not yet) The price of milk has nothing to do with what language one speaks or what colour your skin is. Ignorance is in-discriminant too, race shouldn’t be a reason to discriminate nor should, colour & what language one speaks. I don’t speak Maori. I have a desire to but have tried a number of times to learn but I think my “programming” from the 80’s NZ’s ed. system has some influence on my ability to do so, so I’ll just plug along with the this language for now. Chuck, you’re obviously “unaware” of institutional racism and more aligned probably with Nick Smiths way of seeing things? So stand by and observe, you might just learn something?? Its time that Institutional Racism is addressed and if its possible to do so, keep the bigots, racists and inbreds well away from the debate.

        • Chuck

          “Its time that Institutional Racism is addressed and if its possible to do so, keep the bigots, racists and inbreds well away from the debate.”

          This particular situation has nothing to do with racism. Its simply a plonker called Moeahu trying to cause a issue…

          • Paul

            Or is this thread rapidly becoming about a plonker called Chuck trying to cause a issue…

            • adam

              No point engaging with Chucky Paul, he believes in conspiracy theories perpetuated by a far left cabal…

          • Trey

            It has everything to do with racism. He was speaking an official language of New Zealand as he is legally entitled to do and was threatened with arrest for that. The fact you can’ t see that as a problem highlights Takeres point regarding the institutional racism in this country.

            • Chuck

              Sigh…its called common courtesy to communicate in a language that both parties understand.

              Just because you have a plonker trying to engineer a headline, for people like you to scream “see its racism” says it all.

              • Trey

                “Sigh…its called common courtesy to communicate in a language that both parties understand.” My god how many times has that old chestnut been dragged out by English speakers too arrogant to learn another language?

                “people like you to scream “see its racism” says it all”. People like me who are Maori experience racism everyday and unlike people like you I have seldomly been treated with any courtesy when I have had dealings with the police.

                Or people like my koro who feel more comfortable speaking in Te Reo than in English and should be able to do so without being threatened with arrest or being called plonkers by you

                I see you still have not addressed whether a deaf person using sign would have been considered arrogant or would have been threatened with arrest.

                • Chuck

                  “English speakers too arrogant to learn another language?”

                  Why should every NZer “have to learn Te Reo”? no issue with those who want to (or can learn, as even Takere said he has tried but can’t pick up a new language).

                  “People like me who are Maori experience racism everyday” I call bullshit on that…nearly 3/4 of my family have Maori blood in there veins, they work in a diverse range of jobs, from a police officer to builders, admin, customer service and early childhood ed. They don’t experience racism everyday or most other times.

                  Are you mixing up racism with just everyday BS that ALL of us have to put up with?

                  Don’t get me wrong…Maori are on the wrong side of a bunch of things, that needs to be improved. Going around with a chip on ones shoulder does not help matters.

                  “Or people like my koro who feel more comfortable speaking in Te Reo than in English and should be able to do so without being threatened with arrest or being called plonkers by you”

                  Your koro are just being awkward and rude. If they know the other person cannot speak Te Reo.

                  “I see you still have not addressed whether a deaf person using sign would have been considered arrogant or would have been threatened with arrest.”

                  If a person is deaf that would be clearly signaled and understood by the police officer. And if required an interrupter would be used.

                  • One Anonymous Bloke

                    if required an interrupter would be used


                    Your koro are just being awkward and rude

                    They’re in the Crimes Act now eh? “Being awkward and rude to police”.

                    How about “smelling of foreign food” or “dressing in a funny way”?

                    My head hurts from repeated banging on the desk. I think it would be better if in future I used yours.

                    • Chuck

                      It may of escaped your thinking OAB, that if a person is deaf they have pretty much no option other than to use sign language.

                      If a person can speak 2 languages, of which the one they CHOOSE to use is not understood by the other person…its called being awkward and rude.

                      The police have a hard enough job to do, without plonkers trying it on.

                    • One Anonymous Bloke

                      Deaf people can’t write?

                      I missed the part where being “awkward and rude” is grounds for arrest.

                  • Trey

                    Whenever I go to a petrol station the attendent makes me come in and pay first even though often a white guy will pull up at the next pump and give a little wave and have his pump turned on. I then go inside and explain I want a fill and am asked for a credit card. Meanwhile white guy has pumped his gas and is coming in to pay. Only difference is the colour of our skin.
                    So yes I see this as racism not everyday bullshit.
                    I work at a University and regularly travel overseas to conferences etc and for no apparant reason I “randomly” get stopped for “random” checks. My pakeha colleagues say it’s not because I am Maori, it is because I look middle eastern so am mistaken for a terrorist and they may be right but either way it is racial profiling.
                    I also work closely with schools in South Auckland helping teachers to provide culturally responsive programmes for Maori and Pasifika. I have lost track of the number of times a Pakeha teacher has made comments about nothing being done for white kids when our whole education system is designed to benefit white kids and there is not a single white kid in their class.
                    I never said that you should learn Te Reo I merely pointed out the arrogance of English speakers (not just in this country) who believe everyone should have to speak English when nearly every other ethnic group speaks multiple langauges.
                    It always makes me smile when Pakeha teachers talk about their Samoan and Tongan students being below standard. I mention to them that those kids speak two languages and by that standard it is them that is below.
                    Lastly I do not have a chip on my shoulder. I am extremely well balanced and have a chip on both shoulders.

                    • Chuck

                      Fair enough.

                      “Lastly I do not have a chip on my shoulder. I am extremely well balanced and have a chip on both shoulders.”

                      Great reply back 🙂

        • Gabby

          I think calling the fellow a racist is going a bit far. Rude not to respond in an official NZ language when he was capable though.

  15. Gangnam Style 17

    Hello CV, I would be interested to hear your opinion on the DCC candidates this year, I am social aquaintances with Ronald Fung & find him a pleasant approachable guy. What do you think?

    • Pasupial 17.1

      Gangnam Style
      I put a cross by Fung’s name mainly on the basis that he used too many exclamation marks in his Candidate Information booklet blurb. Also, the way he was enthusing about facilitating private investment in white elephant projects (tourism seems a very shaky platform for economic development). However, I haven’t filled out the voting form yet.

      I would be happy to learn more about the candidates when they’re not targeting their brief words to what they assume the voters want to hear. So far, I’ve only been googling background on the Mayoral aspirants. Those other candidates who aren’t already councillors are a blank to me.

    • Colonial Viper 17.2

      Hi Gangnam Style…no strong opinions as yet…will keep in touch

  16. Gabby 18

    private investment in white elephant projects seems a bit easier on the public purse. Or is it a euphemism for sale of council assets?

    • Pasupial 18.1

      That assumes that the white elephant (a harbour pier, when Dunedin’s attraction to tourists is largely in its not completely trashed natural environment), is worth while in the first place. If it requires the election of a councilor to implement the project, rather than it being viable on its own merits, then that seems to be more likely to be for the benefit of the private investors than the town’s people (in this case securing planning permission against the industrial area’s opposition).

      That said, Fung isn’t one of the candidates who I’ve crossed off the list for asset selling. Though there are no shortage of those promising to focus on “rate stability” & “core infrastructure” which translates to asset sales. Also anyone with a background in real estate tends to get crossed off the list pretty quickly.

  17. Cinny 19

    Awesome story on The Listening Post this morning. All about the media in the USA, I didn’t know that Bill Clinton signed a communications agreement in the ’90’s effectively transforming the media into a monopoly, changing the landscape into what we see today, 6 corporations controlling 96% of media in the USA.

    Well worth a watch, just 30mins long. Fascinating write up on how media is capitalising on Trumps notoriety to gain huge profits via advertising/ratings.


    • Paul 19.1

      Watch this film.
      It covers a lot on the issue of the US media.
      Of course a lot can now be applied to NZ as well.

      “Shadows of Liberty presents the phenomenal true story of today’s disintegrating freedoms within the U.S. media, and government, that they don’t want you to see. The film takes an intrepid journey through the darker corridors of the American media landscape, where global media conglomerates exercise extraordinary political, social, and economic power. The overwhelming collective power of these firms raises troubling questions about democracy. Highly revealing interviews, actuality, and archive material, tell insider accounts of a broken media system, where journalists are prevented from pursuing controversial news stories, people are censored for speaking out against abuses of government power, and individual lives are shattered as the arena for public expression has been turned into a private profit zone. Will the Internet remain free, or be controlled by a handful of powerful, monopolistic corporations? The media crisis is at the core of today’s most troubling issues, and people everywhere are taking action, trying to change the media monopolies’ strangle hold on information.”


      • Cinny 19.1.1

        Thanks for the link 😀

        • Paul

          It’s a great film.
          And this is too.

          Consuming Kids.

          Consuming Kids throws desperately needed light on the practices of a relentless multi-billion dollar marketing machine that now sells kids and their parents everything from junk food and violent video games to bogus educational products and the family car. Drawing on the insights of health care professionals, children’s advocates, and industry insiders, the film focuses on the explosive growth of child marketing in the wake of deregulation, showing how youth marketers have used the latest advances in psychology, anthropology, and neuroscience to transform American children into one of the most powerful and profitable consumer demographics in the world. Consuming Kids pushes back against the wholesale commercialization of childhood, raising urgent questions about the ethics of children’s marketing and its impact on the health and well-being of kids.


        • Cinny

          better version on the putlocker, the link u gave just went to another link and so on and so on


          Some excellent viewing on putlocker. Will watch doco 2nite, thanks again.

      • Richard Rawshark 19.1.2

        their was an old saying..

        “He who controls the message controls the masses”

        or something similar and it’s as true as the day is long.

        Currently I am living in an age where I am not in control of my countries destiny but those in power have control of mine. When we lost the fourth estate we lost democracy, and in most western countries you will see how media has progressed this way since well starting in the 90’s I’d say.

        If you look at the western worlds media moguls today can you name even one without far right political leanings if not direct ties?

    • Colonial Viper 19.2

      Bill Clinton created the model of a Democratic Party paid for and captive to large corporates (broadcasting, banks, etc.) using the active assumption that the working class would keep voting Democratic anyway because “they had no where else to go.”

  18. Gangnam Style 20

    Is it normal for someone to get arrested by a NZ cop for only speaking French, Chinese, Tongan or any other language other than english? Or just Te Reo. Or would the cop try & find an interpreter first?

    • Colonial Viper 20.1

      Might depend if someone was using a different language in a deliberate, contrived attempt to stymie a police investigation or an inquiry.

  19. Chooky 21

    While the elderly New Zealanders and others in pain suffer because this government and Peter Dunne has denied them legal access to medicinal cannibas…there are political lobby groups involved and big Bucks..pharmaceutical companies and the alcohol industry

    ‘Opioid use decreases in US states that legalize medical marijuana – study’


    “New research shows a decline in the use of opioid painkillers in US states that allow people to treat pain with medical marijuana, affirming the fears of Big Pharma who have been vigorously seeking to frustrate efforts to legalize the herb….

    “Given the growing opioid overdose epidemic, campaigning against medical marijuana is morally repugnant.”

    “We cannot allow prescription drug companies to block the legalization of #medicalcannabis http://huff.to/2clBjZY

    “Addictive painkiller profiteer donates $500k to fight cannabis legalization in #Arizona http://on.rt.com/7oux

    …”Insys isn’t the first pharmaceutical company to be found bankrolling anti-marijuana legislation though with a number of alcohol and pharmaceutical companies “heavily” invested in such laws in a number of states, according to The Intercept.


    • aerobubble 21.1

      Oh, but what about euthanasia… …a distraction issue to speak to older people and move away from getting on with medical legalization. Anyone who needs these drugs should have to declare it, lose their license, be banned from certain jobs, and anyone stupid enough to get themselves addict should suffer similar fates, they wont be so eager to di drugs if they cant drive, or have to declare in public being needy of chemical immerframes. Olds should be respectedthese drugs are for them, youth need to know they can wait for old age to have their spin.

      And wtf, whats with the palative lobby, do they make a bundle from elderly putting them in their will or what. Put a quota up, allow say five euthanasias a year, its not like elderly people aren’t being now, its just they have to change their wills first. Bring it out into the open and we can then start focusing on the real number of such killings.

      And wtf gives with the SST are these fools for real, they cant believe they serve crime when they call for harnessness, people trip up, they find themselves in jail, they dont need to be pushed further away from society, brutalized they come out hating, that means more crime, there’s nothing sensuble about the SST if it wants harsher punishment, its oxymoronic.

  20. Richard Rawshark 22

    I have a quick question before I go to bed..

    Hope someone can help.

    This David Farrar fella runs a stats polling thing company am I correct?

    Isn’t he the same guy who seems to run the ratepayers and taxpayers associations?

    what’s going on there? If so.. hopw can he be knee deep in right wing action groups he’s funding and setting up and have a job polling ?

    I must be wrong perhaps it’s the tickle bloke.

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