All police to carry tasers

Written By: - Date published: 11:08 am, July 31st, 2015 - 100 comments
Categories: law and "order", police - Tags: ,

As is being widely reported:

All frontline police to carry Tasers

All frontline police staff will now routinely carry Tasers while on duty, in a major change to the organisation’s operational policy.

Police Association president Greg O’Connor has backed the move, saying it will improve safety of the officers. “This is a courageous, sensible and timely decision by the Commissioner, and acknowledges the realities of modern policing, where police face a generation of offenders who are prepared to ‘have a go’ when confronting police officers,” he says.

100 comments on “All police to carry tasers ”

  1. Tiger Mountain 1

    great, here a zap, there a zap, everywhere a zap zap!!

    two things come to mind,
    a) this is practice for issuing the coppers with firearms sooner rather than later
    b) tasers were snuck in on trial on the basis that they would be last resort weapons and an alternative option to lethal force in some situations, the reality is that tasers quickly became a short cut to normal police work and a compliance device

    tasers will be a further barrier to community Policing, why build relationships and talk to people when busy cops can just say–“do it or else–want some of this?”

  2. Puckish Rogue 2

    This is good common sense practice, if it helps keep our police safe while carrying out their duties then I’m all for it

    • Colonial Viper 2.1

      Yours is a short sighted view and somewhat simplistic view. Up-arming our police with no discussion with the community that they are supposed to be protecting is NOT “good common sense practice” – in fact it is the complete opposite of good policing practice.

      • Puckish Rogue 2.1.1

        I’m guessing that if there were a poll the majority would agree with me and not you

      • Keith 2.1.2

        Is it better to let police who are doing the job for you in the community get the shit beaten out of them instead, as happens, so you can feel better about yourself? Get a life!

        • Colonial Rawshark 2.1.2.1

          with that thoughtless approach to always up arming policing, why not give every cop a semi-automatic firearm as well?

          • Clemgeopin 2.1.2.1.1

            If armed robberies and armed offenses against the public and the police increase, arming police is bound to happen. Has already happened in many countries, I think. It is primarily a societal, governmental and criminal problem, not a problem created by the police. Of course, the police should use force sparingly and only when absolutely necessary. Society needs to be protected from criminals and violent offenders and police need support from the public to do that. I think policing is one of the dangerous, stressful and soul sapping jobs around.

            I suspect that the police encounter many dangerous situations everyday where they wish they had tasers on them, been at risk and unable to do their job properly sometimes due to lack of that last option.

            Of course they shouldn’t go gung ho and use tasers as their first option. I don’t think they will, because the tasers have cameras and the police will be accountable.

      • weka 2.1.3

        “Up-arming our police with no discussion with the community that they are supposed to be protecting is NOT “good common sense practice” – in fact it is the complete opposite of good policing practice.”

        Pretty sure that the 1%ers will have had their discussion ;-/

    • Sabine 2.2

      and who is a good obedient little ‘rogue’ 🙂

    • Anno1701 2.3

      Peelian Principles

      #2

      To recognise always that the power of the police to fulfil their functions and duties is dependent on public approval of their existence, actions and behaviour, and on their ability to secure and maintain public respect.

      # 5

      To seek and preserve public favour, not by pandering to public opinion, but by constantly demonstrating absolutely impartial service to law, in complete independence of policy, and without regard to the justice or injustice of the substance of individual laws, by ready offering of individual service and friendship to all members of the public without regard to their wealth or social standing, by ready exercise of courtesy and friendly good humour, and by ready offering of individual sacrifice in protecting and preserving life.

      #6

      To use physical force only when the exercise of persuasion, advice and warning is found to be insufficient to obtain public co-operation to an extent necessary to secure observance of law or to restore order, and to use only the minimum degree of physical force which is necessary on any particular occasion for achieving a police objective.

      # 7

      To maintain at all times a relationship with the public that gives reality to the historic tradition that the police are the public and that the public are the police, the police being only members of the public who are paid to give full-time attention to duties which are incumbent on every citizen in the interests of community welfare and existence.

      Looks like the inventor of “the police” would disagree with you there PR

    • Blue Horseshoe 2.4

      “Ours”

      LOL – No thanks sissy boy. Yours!

    • Tanz 2.5

      Agree. Don’t do the crime, won’t have a problem.

    • Paul 2.6

      You would probably also support cops using guns.

  3. Sabine 3

    Great, now all the coppers in town can enforce compliance with the aide of a taser.

    Feeling safer yet?

    However, i think they will still only come after the robbery, so no changes there.

  4. Tigger 4

    This won’t end well.

    But none of us are surprised, right?

  5. With police going to places with no witnesses to their actions be sure there will be tasers used on people merely for being angry or upset. There will be tasers used on political activists. there will be torture in police cells and deaths.

    In the US the police run riot with them and they have killed 664 people to date this year alone! With tasers, guns and in police cells!

    Our police will get guns next! Feeling safer already?

  6. Ann Johns 6

    How quickly ppl forget! I see a comment on here on that says it will lead to deaths, what about the man who is already dead from the police use of a taser? Within hours, a high ranking police official was on our screens saying “there is no reason why these officers cannot carry on with their careers”. BEFORE an investigation could even be launched. That story has disappeared from all MSM reports, when is the report coming out. Surely, they should have waited for the results of that, before the decision was made to give them out to any and all police officers. Ppl are getting more confrontational, that’s what happens when the police ride roughshod all over your civil rights. Perhaps a review of police behaviour would be the better option here. Be prepared for the zapping to start at all political rallies that question or criticise this corrupt govt. Another useful tool for keeping the citizens of NZ under their control.

  7. Tautoko Mangō Mata 7

    Call me paranoiac, but I wonder if the timing of this announcement is designed to put a chill on those people who will be taking to the streets to protest, should the TPPA be signed.

    • infused 7.1

      You need some more tin foil buddy.

      • Anno1701 7.1.1

        nope the elites just know whats coming their way in the not to distant future

        Listen to Nick Hanaer (Hanauer was one of the first investors in Amazon.com) , he knows it !

        • gsays 7.1.1.1

          hi anon, great ted talk, thanks for sharing.

          i dont have a pitchfork, but there is a rusty eel gaff in the shed…

  8. Capn Insano 8

    The same Greg O’Connor that keeps insisting on arming our cops?

  9. b waghorn 9

    Maybe adding personal cameras to all police on the beat so at least there is proof right or wrong should be considered . better fried then shot IMO

    • Sabine 9.1

      thats what they said in the US…..and since then many many people died being tasered.
      And considering that shooting a person often leaves behind visual and bloody ugliness, often dead bodies…i personally would rather they were armed. IF they shoot someone they have to explain it, if they taser someone they just have to state that they were afraid for their safety, the person charged at me, did not obey command, i was afraid for my life and oh…shits n giggles.

      • b waghorn 9.1.1

        A cop gets over powered and his gun or taser gets taken which would you prefer.
        As I said cameras should be on all police .

  10. adam 10

    I wish the police in this country would roll that brown nose Greg O’Connor. They got 1% this round, when that got effectively no pay rise over the last 3 years. Lets leave aside the ridiculous targets they had to meet, to get that pay rise, and all the extra paper work that went with it. How the hell do tasers; pay the mortgage? Feed the kids? or let you plan for retirement, when your take home pay is falling behind inflation?

    The police need to realise that the attacks on unions, have effectively undermined them as well. They have a union/association that if was any other union I’d be saying -“in bosses pocket”. It would not be a stretch to call it a corruption of the original intent of the union/association, as it stands. They have a leader of the union/association who is more interested in staying in good with the men upstairs, rather than look after the average cops. This is a union/association is out of ideas. The police union/association is completely out of touch with the average cop with a family, a mortgage and a desire to plan for the future.

    Come cops in this country, time to realise your being shafted, much like the rest of us. Take your union back, get a pay rise, not another toy.

  11. Clemgeopin 11

    Looking at the powerful gangs and behaviour, and thinking of the very difficult and the dangerous work that the police do (in all kinds of places, dealing with violent unpredictable crims and in all kinds of situations, including at night when the rest of us are peacefully sleeping in our beds) to protect the rest of us in the society, I think it is time to arm the police with the tasers, body cameras and bullet proof vests. This does not mean that the police will not make any mistakes. Those will happen sometimes whether the police are armed or not.

    I considered this question : If I were a police officer in today’s world of wealthy criminals, drug induced dangerous crims, armed robberies etc, would I prefer to have some protection for myself for the sake of myself, my family and my work, and also to be able to be in position to control a violent crim during a violent situation, the answer is yes.

    Besides, I think that when bad people see a police coming after them and knowing that every officer is armed with a camera and a taser, will/could make them behave better.

    These days, the crooks have the upper hand over the police. Let us support our police in their difficult work.

    • Sabine 11.1

      are they armed with cameras and tasers or only tasers?

      And what will the threshold be?

      and how dangerous can it be, when the police routinely shows up after the robbery murder has happened?

      and how will it make us safer, considering the shit that goes down in the states?

      • Clemgeopin 11.1.1

        The report is only about arming them with tasers. I think wearing cameras is also a good thing. Both are good for police confidence and for their safety in their very difficult & dangerous job. Of course there should be thresholds and rules of operations with good checks and balances and consequences for misuse.

        Regarding your third point, I think the cause of that is the shortage in numbers and reduced resources. That would be the government’s responsibility to remedy the situation.

        About your question 2 and 4, I have no idea. You may need to get clarification from the police headquarters or the Police Minister.

      • Rosemary McDonald 11.1.2

        “are they armed with cameras and tasers or only tasers?”

        IMHO…they can’t have one without the other.

        • Adele 11.1.2.1

          Tena koe, Rosemary

          Tasers have an inbuilt camera. I know this as not so long ago a local man received a payout from Police after being illegally tasered, twice.

          The video clip from the camera shows the man being tasered the second time for about 13 seconds.

          The Policeman involved didn’t suffer any significant sanction beyond retraining.

          • Rosemary McDonald 11.1.2.1.1

            “retraining”…what a joke.

            How about a camera attached to the cop that records everything done and said whenever on duty.

            Could be de -activated temporarily for loo breaks etc…but must show all actions and words leading up to having to use the weapon.

            We all know that police are not universally honest. We all have seen how their conduct can exacerbate situations. Like a good old rumble.

            We all have heard of police who are downright corrupt.

            They back each other up…and their mates.

            No, I don’t like this at all.

            Methinks CR is close to the truth.

    • Colonial Rawshark 11.2

      this is stupid and leads to the police becoming a para-military force and with an attitude that the public is the enemy.

      • Clemgeopin 11.2.1

        No, it doesn’t! The violent gangs and the bad and dangerous buggers among the public ARE the enemy of society. Why are you batting for them with red herrings? I don’t believe they will use it on peaceful law abiding people including peaceful political protests.

        Will they sometimes make mistakes? Yes, quite likely.

        The world has changed. It is not the work of the police to be philosophical, goody-goody and change the world back to what it was a hundred years ago, That is your job by writing cool PC stuff on a blog sitting behind a comfortable safe chair.

        Confucius says, ‘handicapping cops from arming with protection is same same as cutting off their legs’.

        [Hey, Clem, can you drop the ‘confucious says’ stuff, please? It feels dodgy to me in any context, let alone in a reply to someone who has an Asian heritage. TRP]

        • greywarshark 11.2.1.1

          Clem
          You’re conflicted. One sentence says you dont believe they will be used on law abiding citizens. Then you say that mistakes will happen.

          CV thinks that having these too accessible will make the short-tempered reach for them too fast instead of attempting reason and self control on both sides.
          I think I am channelling his thoughts right. Please correct me if I’m wrong.

          But I am anxious and you will be too when you think about it and look at the stats from the USA as well as how often they are used here already, and misused. And how groupthink can result in overuse on one person by multiple officers.

          • Clemgeopin 11.2.1.1.1

            Mistakes will happen occasionally, like in any professions, be it doctors, surgeons, cleaners or drivers. There have to be rules and guidelines.

        • Clemgeopin 11.2.1.2

          “[Hey, Clem, can you drop the ‘confucious says’ stuff, please? It feels dodgy to me in any context, let alone in a reply to someone who has an Asian heritage. TRP]

          Oh sorry. I wasn’t writing it as a racial slur. I like the wit and wisdom of Confucius and Mark Twain and enjoy all their quotes and supposed quotes, the original ones as well as the send up jokes. Besides, I just made up the line as a light witty joke about tasers, arms and legs, police and handicap. Nothing to do with Asians.

          Also, I did not even know that Colonial Rawshark is of Asian heritage! I had thought that the other Colonial, the Colonial Viper was, not that it matters to me either way, because I KNOW that I do not have a racist attitude. I should know!

          Funnily, as I was writing it, I did think that some silly PC minded freedom-of- expression-controlling-dumb-arse-witnit readers might think I was being a racist for using the name, Confucius! I decided to post it anyway in order not to deprive myself of free thought and expression. I can assure you it was not a racist slur and will never be as far as I am concerned.

          If you don’t agree with me and feel that some Asians and other readers may be offended, please just delete the word, ‘Confucius’ which is in front of my made up quote. No worries. Cheers!

          • te reo putake 11.2.1.2.1

            I assumed it wasn’t meant to be offensive, Clem, and nobody has taken offence that I know of. However, it does feel off to me and I think that there is clear potential for misunderstandings, at the very least, to occur. There are also a variety of jokes that begin that way, some of which are offensive. So better to err on the safe side, I reckon.

            • Blue Horseshoe 11.2.1.2.1.1

              There are also a variety of jokes that begin that way, some of which are offensive

              And none of which have been used….

              Ooh ooh just in case… also known as ‘thought policing’

              [Clemgeopin and I managed to have a mature discussion about a potential issue. Nothing to do with thought policing, all about using avoiding language that, to quote the site policy, has the effect of excluding others. If you really want to see the violence inherent in the system, I’m more than happy to give you some time off to read and comprehend the policy. Up to you. TRP]

            • Blue Horseshoe 11.2.1.2.1.2

              If you really want to see the violence inherent in the system, I’m more than happy to give you some time off to read and comprehend the policy

              Righto so you’re some sort of site moderator then as well, so I guess you wear multiple hats. One seems to be a threatening hat using the suggestion of violence, which seems unnecessary, and out of context

        • Colonial Rawshark 11.2.1.3

          No, it doesn’t! The violent gangs and the bad and dangerous buggers among the public ARE the enemy of society. Why are you batting for them with red herrings?

          I’m pretty sick and tired of left wing authoritarians who think that good policing centres around being ready to stamp on bad guys with all available force.

        • Colonial Rawshark 11.2.1.4

          The world has changed. It is not the work of the police to be philosophical, goody-goody and change the world back to what it was a hundred years ago, That is your job by writing cool PC stuff on a blog sitting behind a comfortable safe chair.

          Fuck you mate, you don’t know a thing about me.

          Now you tell me, what’s changed in policing in the last 5 years that has now required the introduction of tasers as standard equipment on every police officer?

          Apart from your contention that our police are now operating in a violent gang war zone – which buys into the right wing Sensible Sentencing memes about NZ society becoming increasingly violent.

          • Clemgeopin 11.2.1.4.1

            “Fuck you mate, you don’t know a thing about me”

            And you know all about me to call me an idiot?

            • Colonial Rawshark 11.2.1.4.1.1

              I based that comment on what you wrote. Also please see my final comment on this goddam topic below.

    • Colonial Rawshark 11.3

      I considered this question : If I were a police officer in today’s world of wealthy criminals, drug induced dangerous crims, armed robberies etc, would I prefer to have some protection for myself for the sake of myself, my family and my work, and also to be able to be in position to control a violent crim during a violent situation, the answer is yes.

      You’re an idiot.

      You’ve never done a day working anywhere near a policing or community security environment have you. To you, more body armour, more weapons, more readiness to blow away that Hollywood king pin drug bust scene, the better.

      • Clemgeopin 11.3.1

        “You’re an idiot”

        Really? Thanks for your kind and considered judgement.

        • Colonial Rawshark 11.3.1.1

          I quite like you, but I find some of your positions thoughtless (or perhaps not sufficiently thought through).

          • Clemgeopin 11.3.1.1.1

            “I quite like you’

            Are you being sexist?
            ————
            I once told an acquaintance that I like meat ball curries with lots of coconuts in them! He looked at me a little funny. For a second I wondered why and the penny dropped. His wife was from the coconut loving pacific Island of Kiribati! He & his wife taught me a great recipe for ‘naturally cooked’ raw fish! I had posted it here some time back.
            Here it is if any of you are interested:
            http://thestandard.org.nz/ope-mike-08022015/#comment-965332
            ————-
            I will never forget the time I asked, what I then had thought was an innocent quiz of type question, to a group of about forty or so colleagues during a fun and banter happy hour session.

            My question was : ‘What is the difference between an empty pipe and a Dutchman?’

            They said, ‘don’t know. What is the difference?’

            I knew!
            I told them ‘One is a hollow cylinder while the other is a silly Hollander!’ Ha ha! Every one laughte…or so I thought!

            After a few minutes, a very lovely elderly lady cornered me alone and told me that I was being very racist against the Dutch and she was very offended. She was from Holland!’ I was horrified that she had taken such offense at the joke. I apologised profusely to her and explained that I was not being nasty or racist but was just trying to be funny. I said I was very sorry and would be really careful in future. She did not really accept it and said she was still pretty hurt. In fact, she was quite angry! I became quiet after that and left a little while later. An evening ruined for me…and for her! That was on a Friday evening.

            The good part of the story is that the first thing she did on Monday morning on coming to the office was to seek me, give me a hug and say that she had thought things over, realised she had over-reacted & that she was sorry for having taken unnecessary offense! It was so wonderful of her to do that. You can imagine my relief!

            We became very friends over the tears. Sadly, she died a few years ago of cancer. I always feel good whenever I think of her.

            —-

            Bloody hell, Now I am feeling like eating a little raw fish and lots of meat ball curry with coconuts! Confucius has a lot to answer for!

            • marty mars 11.3.1.1.1.1

              lol – she ruined your evening by getting upset at your joke – says it all really clem

              • Clemgeopin

                What do you mean by saying–‘says it all really’. Can’t read your mind. Care to explain?

                • why can’t we see the other people around us clem, why are they invisible

                  • Clemgeopin

                    True. Lucky we don’t have any smarty PC Martians on Earth with green eyes, thin skin and low self esteem around who may easily mistake your name as being deliberately nasty and racist!

                    Come to think of it, we may also need to refer to the green mung beans as something else too. How about ‘scarlet red kernel shangri la pee-see nuts’?

                    • funny how attack the messenger is always a go to fail safe for some – you’d do better to think on what I’ve said but whatever – privilege does as privilege wants eh clem and none so blind…

                    • Clemgeopin

                      Go have a good night bro…..I get what you mean. And also, what TRP’s concern was. You both have a point and are correct.

                      But don’t take things that seriously. I wasn’t being serious in my reply to you….had you seen me smiling away when writing it.

                      But don’t know what you are on about when you say, ‘privilege does as privilege wants eh clem and none so blind…’ But never mind, what eva, don’t worry.

                    • All good – funny is underrated so good on you for giving it a go, my attempts are often dismal 🙂

    • tangled_up 11.4

      Well said Clemgeopin.

      • marty mars 11.4.1

        yep it’s good he takes these knocks on the pocky out bit under the mouth – not easy to accept another’s assertion that you are an idiot with a thank you for your kind and considered judgement.

    • McFlock 11.5

      Tasers and guns and even the extendable batons are purely offensive weapons.

      The rich armed robbers will just up-gun. The poor armed robbers aren’t known for thinking ahead anyway.

      And the escalation of force will always be easier than using words. It becomes a substitute for effective training.

      We already have cops who can be kitted up to face unusually dangerous threats. Routinely kitting up all officers is needless and dangerous.

      You want to support the police in their work? Double their numbers and remove some of the nuttier stats-driven management policies.

    • les 11.6

      can you expand on this difficult and dangerous work Police do.I see them patrolling highways,catching EBA’s speedsters,boy racers and shaking down youths for cannabis.What do you see rank and file police doing?

  12. Clean_power 12

    A very good idea. About time.

  13. infused 13

    Good.

  14. Stuart Munro 14

    To make it a good idea, tasers must only be used when it is warranted. The obvious regulation should be that if a policeman is found to have improperly tased anyone, the victim gets to return the favour. If police feel that that is unfair then they have some explaining to do. Tasers cause deaths and must not be used inappropriately.

    • Rodel 14.1

      SM Nice bit of logic there.

      I heard the taser news today just as a police car drove past me. Funny I got immediate negative/anti feelings about the police and I’m a law abiding pussy with cop friends.

      Wonder what others with different attitudes to lawfulness will be thinking? I’m not too sure about this taser stuff but I wouldn’t want to be a cop with the crap they have to deal with.

      It does seem to be a radical move without much consideration given to public opinion but hey that’s Key’s government, isn’t it?

  15. Imagine if the equivalents of O’Connor in other public sector unions got to comment on policy & procedural matters in the way and to the degree he does.

    Effective policing depends on community trust. The plethora of TV cop shows do their best to persuade people that modern policing is all about forensic science – which plays a part obviously but policing still relies heavily on people trusting cops and providing them with information.

    Good cops know that trust is eroded every time a bad cop uses excessive force and/or where that force is disproportionately targeted at a section of society.

    The police in the USA are increasingly hated and feared by large sections of the population – especially people of colour and poor people. We aren’t at that stage yet but it would not take much for the NZ police to follow in the USA’s footsteps and become – even less about solving crimes and keeping people safe – and much more about controlling dissent.

    I always used to refer to the Police Service – I’ve gone back to using the term Police Force.

  16. Richard@Down South 16

    I can understand there are situations where the Police need better access to Tasers… mark my words however, we shall see a lot more footage from cellphones of Police abusing their powers

    • James 16.1

      Most likley – Personally I think cops should have camera vest and they can show the behaviour of the asshats they need to deal with before they taze em.

      • Richard@Down South 16.1.1

        There are definitely some asshats out there, and generally the police i find are good

        They however are human, and are just as prone to be having a bad day like the rest of us… or sadly, there are some who make others look bad

  17. greywarshark 17

    Hasn’t taking the force to the people done enough harm in the USA. There is another case now where a policeman with apparently no compunction has just turned some minor offence into a weapons use one.

    Of course there are world conferences probably mostly in the USA, where the latest weapons for hurting and hunting people are put on display for the police forces of the world. It must have made NZ police feel so lacking and backward that they were unarmed. Someone saying today how Sydney police seem to dress as if they were facing a riot as everyday gear.

  18. James 18

    Im all for this. I think its GREAT !!!!!

    About bloody time to be honest.

    I also believe that if cops misuse it – then they should be held to account.

    http://lawprofessors.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341bfae553ef019b025f78af970d-pi

  19. James 19

    Police report on the use of tasers in NZ – seem to help calm the situation:

    http://www.police.govt.nz/sites/default/files/publications/taser-key-findings-report.pdf

  20. hello 20

    At least the Tasers all have cameras that start when the weapon is drawn, even if they are not all reviewed but can be reviewed.

  21. Colonial Rawshark 21

    To those lefties who have said great for the police to now always have tasers.

    Well, a big pre-emptory “fuck you”, when down the track me or my friends and family get tased by the police because we happen to be participating in some protest action against the next TPPA or the next US sponsored war in the Middle East or the next Springbok Tour.

    Lefties seem to be utterly incapable of projecting what is going to happen in the next few years.

    Why do you think 5,700 NZ police officers are getting training with the M4 assault carbine? Why do you think the NZ police are now trialling pepper sprays which are six times more powerful than the one originally approved for use?

    Oh yes, this is so that the police is prepared to act against the “bad guys” in society. Which is all well and good, until you remember the history of the Left, when protestors, unionists and human rights activists were all routinely classified by the authorities as the “bad guys.”

    Of course, the right wing remember this history very well, and always cheer when the authorities standardise another level of weaponry for use against the least powerful and most marginalised in society.

    • Blue Horseshoe 21.1

      Yeah that’s pretty much it

      People need to understand they are going to have to shed some blood, or else they might as well keep digging their own graves, and building their own prisons. Those are the options we are accelerating towards, what about that do people not understand

      The controllers know this, hence the tooling up of the plods

  22. Colonial Rawshark 22

    Look at this US Police Officer who pepper sprayed University of California (Davis) students performing a peaceful sit down protest against tuition fee increases.

    Look at how many police officers were around this guy. Look at how many of them moved to stop the officer (none). Some even had batons out to keep the crowd at bay when they voiced disapproval of the pepper spraying.

    The police officer in question went on to win US$38,000 in compensation after being fired.

    • Clemgeopin 22.2

      That is a shocking and disgraceful thing for that cop to have done. I would like to know the full story about what was the reason for that pepper spray use, what did transpire before that, who gave the order, why was he fired. why was he compensated etc. A link to the full investigation will be good if any of you have it.
      I will try to google it, but not sure if I will find it. Certainly, the use of pepper spray for that demonstration does not seem right.

      Pepper spray and tasers should only be used in serious incidents. I hope our police and laws will be more sensible than what appears to have happened there.

      • McFlock 22.2.1

        lol
        good luck with that hoping.

        • Clemgeopin 22.2.1.1

          I haven’t seen any reaction from other political parties such as Labour, the Greens and NZF. Do you know what they said? (Don’t worry about what the 0 % ACT or DUNNE parties have to say. They are just non-independent National’s arse-licking useless dumbass parasites anyway)

        • Clemgeopin 22.2.1.2

          “lol
          good luck with that hoping”

          Yep, not as bad as hoping that there isn’t a God or an after life. Good luck with that, I say! lol

          [That is my own quote, not from some oriental wise old man who lived elsewhere near a forbidden city in a distant land]

      • Colonial Viper 22.2.2

        if you google pepper spray protest UC Davis you’ll come up with tonnes of links to the incident.

        • Clemgeopin 22.2.2.1

          I just read quite an extensive article. See link. Yes, it was an atrocious incident, way over the top the way the pepper spray was deployed. The article is here.

          The final part says this:

          (After the inquiry was concluded with personal details redacted as decreed by courts,)

          “The Internet group Anonymous responded by releasing Pike’s personal information online.[91] The San Francisco Chronicle reported that Pike subsequently received 17,000 angry or threatening emails, 10,000 text messages, and hundreds of letters, causing him to suffer from depression and anxiety and winning him a workers compensation claim settlement of $38,056.[14] The three dozen student protestors, meanwhile, were collectively awarded US$1 million by UC Davis in a settlement from a federal lawsuit, with each pepper-sprayed student receiving $30,000 individually.[92]”

          I am guessing that Pike was carrying out what he was asked to do by the authorities, but did it very badly.

  23. Sable 23

    Guns will be next, just wait and see…..

  24. Socal 24

    I don’t think people actually understand the change. Prior to this tasers had to be kept in lock boxes in cars and an officer could only take it out if they anticipated an assault or worse. Which of course is a fat lot of good if your like the cop who was knocked out at a routine traffic stop or the cop who was almost hacked to death with a machete after another routine stop, or of course the hundreds of officers each year who are assaulted at routine jobs where the taser was locked away in a car.

    The irony of it all is that tasers are a far better use of force option in terms of keeping police accountable as they have cameras that film every interaction.

    • Stuart Munro 24.1

      There’s a very good analysis by an Australian on police taser use that draws a very different conclusion. The taser is for use against armed opponents, and is meant to be a peaceful alternative to firearms.

      The Oz study found in the first year police moved from eight police use of firearms incidents to about three thousand taser use incidents. The conclusion was that they were an increased use of force, and that police were using them to ‘discipline’ people.

      I will only welcome their use if I see a realistic commitment to be bloody careful with them – something I have not seen the remotest sign of.

    • McFlock 24.2

      I really dislike that hypothetical bullshit.

      In the US, a study of murders of police officers showed 10% were killed with their own weapon and 43% were killed in situations that they had not perceived as dangerous enough to get backup on and were working alone.

      It’s not the lack of weaponry that’s a contributor in the US, it’s a lack of ability to accurately anticipate threats and a lack of immediate support.

      Holsters are gimmicks – if they don’t have time to get to a lockbox, what makes you think they are in the appropriate frame of mind to recognise the threat, draw, aim and discharge the weapon, whatever that weapon is?

      You talked about “routine” traffic stops. That assessment is the problem, not the lack of a utility-belt of death and pain.

      • ZTesh 24.2.1

        Would you rather that they then revert to the American model of policing and treat every traffic stop as a life or death encounter, ordering occupants out of cars and on the ground for minor infractions and shooting those who don’t comply.

        The reality is that ‘utility belt of death and pain’, hasn’t actually caused any deaths or resulted in the wide spread misuse we were promised it would eventuate in.

        • McFlock 24.2.1.1

          No. Uniformly treating the public as an enemy is an even more extreme example of the assessment problem.

          It’s a bit funny how we don’t have the widespread misuse (although one or two individual incidents/sarc) when the decision to universally equip with tasers has only recently be made.

  25. millsy 26

    I bet the ‘good ol’ boy’ deputies in Madison County, Mississippi circa 1962 would have loved to have been issued tasers.

    They would flatten their batteries in one night.

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