Bill English is a liar not a leader

Written By: - Date published: 7:38 am, June 21st, 2017 - 160 comments
Categories: Abuse of power, accountability, bill english, useless - Tags: , , , ,

Much has been written about the Barclay affair –

Two bad decisions, one awful day for National (devastating)
Bill English’s worst day as PM (politics of Bill’s “memory lapse” – completely devastating)
It’s not the crime, it’s the coverup (legal view)
Audrey Young: MP and recording debacle becomes credibility matter for PM (well said)
Bill English had answers, but four hours too late (Tracy it’s not a ‘dodgy memory card’ it’s a lie)
Patrick Gower: National owes the taxpayer for Todd Barclay’s hush money (good luck with that)
Barclay and arrogance (thoughtful)
Politicians, police, and the payout (Melanie Reid’s great work started it all)

From which we learn that –

• English knew for months about the hush-money paid from the leader’s budget.

• English knew for months that Todd Barclay was lying.

• English covered up Barclay’s lies and his (possibly illegal certainly unethical and bullying) behaviour – screwing his old electorate and former workers in the process.

• English supported Barclay’s re-nomination (now the subject of a separate crisis).

• English lied to the media yesterday.

• English was forced to admit the lie 4 hours later.

• English was not strong enough to get Barclay’s resignation yesterday.

Bill English has blown his brand big-time. It was always fake.

160 comments on “Bill English is a liar not a leader ”

  1. Craig H 1

    I don’t know where it will go, but congratulations to the media for investigating it and writing about it. Always nice to see National getting the boot put into them for a change…

  2. English is toast, gone burger, and it is true that it is all his own fault.

  3. Tricledrown 3

    Sir lie a lot gave money out of his Prime Ministers slush fund to pay for the silence of a National Party employee to avoid prosecution and bad publicity.
    Highly illegal.

  4. ” Bill English has blown his brand big-time. It was always fake. ”

    And why would we expect anything different from the same man who advocated the same old ‘austerity’ type of policy’s for the unemployed, workers and even the middle classes while opening up the country to his beloved ‘ foreign interests’ and lining the pockets of the already filthy rich ? – and who also led the National party to its worst ever electoral defeat a decade ago ?

    And even then – he only got to his present position by default.

    Does this country never learn ?

    Does a leopard change its spots ?

    Does a Globalist ideologue ever think in terms of their country’s best interests ?

  5. Tricledrown 5

    The Hollow men strike again Barclay a Cameron Slater plant
    Dirty politics strike again.
    Barclay’s selection is looking suspect breaking party rules.

    • Well we see today the little Hosking pair of lips is already doing the minimizing bit and calling it ‘ only of interest to the beltway crowd’ … that in essence it will soon blow over and wont affect English…

      They say the majority of the iceberg is what you DON’T see under the water,…. however.

      As in the day when the Double Dipper from Dipton first earned his nickname, as is the Barclay / English scandal of the last few days …

      A person is judged by their fruits , a man once said.

      • Draco T Bastard 5.1.1

        They say the majority of the iceberg is what you DON’T see under the water,…

        That’s the big one. We’re seeing this but what aren’t we seeing?

        • Gabby 5.1.1.1

          Well we’re not hearing much (yet) about the candidate selection meetings, nor the dictaphone / cctv thing. That’d be a bit of a gamechanger. The police would have to look really hard the other way to let that slide. I wonder what ‘complaints’ from ‘the public’ Wee Toddy reported to P Services.
          Putting a name to the Party official who (allegedly) said nice family you got there, shame if anything happened to them, would be a bonus.

        • tom 5.1.1.2

          If the CCTV has audio it is illegal

  6. Shona 6

    Melanie Reid old school hard ass journo who does her job. And, isn’t allergic to work. What a gem!

    • mary_a 6.1

      @ Shona (6) … Melanie Reid is one of the best journalists around. Always has been. She works to keep the people informed. A rare treasure in media these days.

      I just hope she doesn’t suffer recrimination from the powers-that-be for her professional work over this issue. We all know how the Natz (and their puppet agents) operate, particularly using the police to its own advantage. One word from bully boy Joyce and they will do what’s in the Natz best interest!

  7. roy cartland 7

    Now everyone, especially “good” Nats, are flapping about as if it’s out of the ordinary. It’s as if they can finally pin the hatred to someone when they were quite happy to swallow and rubbish DP and all the atrocities of the past 3 terms.

    • Draco T Bastard 7.1

      Now everyone, especially “good” Nats, are flapping about as if it’s out of the ordinary.

      Yep. All of this is just National Party MO. The only difference is this time they got caught and it’s too much to sweep under the rug as the MSM usually do.

  8. greywarshark 8

    Bill English is not as good a liar and as astute as previous leader who was Key by name and held the key to their maintenance of popularity by nature and skills. That is the situation. Gnashional need to find a better, smoother, oilier liar. John Key’s absence is deeply felt by them and their sycophants.

    • Anne 8.1

      Yes greywarshark.

      I feel a teensy weensy bit sorry for Bill English (only a teensy weensy bit mind) because his predecessor lied like a trouper throughout his tenure (see BLiP’s famous list) and got clean away with all of it. Bill lies and he’s on the cutting board straight away.

      Choose your friends more wisely in the future Bill.

      • greywarshark 8.1.1

        Some conmen have it in spades, and some will never get beyond the 101 stage.

      • WILD KATIPO 8.1.2

        John Key was a scumsucking treacherous lying Globalist shitter.

        And so is Bill English.

        The hell with sentimentality. No one has any call crying even a sniffle of tears for those treasonist’s because they didn’t even bother to cry crocodile tears for any but the elite of this country.

        Screw them , and screw their New World Order.

        I’d have them all behind bars as soon as look at them.

    • Hanswurst 8.2

      Key was never really a convincing liar. He always looked uncomfortable and a bit sort of exposed. He just had a manner that made people like him and actively want to give him the benefit of even considerable doubt.

      • In Vino 8.2.1

        Well put. He had a charm that made the majority overlook what some of us thought were obvious clangers. English lacks that charm. This is actually dangerous for him (I hope).

  9. Penny Bright 9

    https://www.newsroom.co.nz/2017/06/20/35006?slug=english-barclay

    Comment: Bill English’s worst day as PM

    “Bill English’s decision to turn a blind eye in early 2016 to Todd Barclay’s revelation to him about illicitly recording staff member conversations has come back to haunt the Prime Minister with a vengeance, Bernard Hickey writes.”

    When is Todd Barclay going to resign?

    When will the Police reopen their investigation?

    How big a political dent will Todd Barclay make to PM Bill English’s ‘reputation’ and public perception thereof?

  10. ScottGN 10

    Herald is reporting that Joyce won’t back Barclay.

    “Asked if Barclay was a liar, Joyce said, “well, I must say, his two statements yesterday didn’t exactly match up, did they? But that’s for him to sort out, and it’s actually for him to sort out for the party in Clutha-Southland.”

    Where does leave him with Bill English then? His statements yesterday didn’t exactly match up either?

    • Please go a little easy on Dildo Man , will you?

      Put yourself in his shoes.

      So , …on the one hand , …

      We have a sniveling newbie caught out lying who is expendable , – on the other – we have a sniveling lying old hand who also happens to be Dildo Mans boss.

      Now ,… ask yourself, – who would you back to hang on to your position ???

  11. Penny Bright 11

    http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2017/06/patrick-gower-todd-barclay-s-admission-means-police-must-reopen-case.html

    “OPINION: Todd Barclay has provided all the evidence police need to reopen the case against him.”

  12. mordecai 12

    “English lied to the media yesterday.”
    When? What did he say that was a lie?

    “English was not strong enough to get Barclay’s resignation yesterday.”
    You don’t understand how the National party works. MP’s are selected by their electorates. The National Party operate a grass-roots democratic system, not like Labour, where candidates are selected effectively by Party HQ. English can call for Barclay to resign, but he can’t force him to.

    • RedLogix 12.1

      For four hours, English appeared to be a hostage to a lowly MP who was denying in public something that the Prime Minister knew to be true, and knew would damage the National Party if it came out.

      English prevaricated his way through 15 minutes of questions from reporters on the way into National’s caucus meeting in the hope the story might go away, saying seven times that he could not recall if Barclay had told him about the recording. He even said he had confidence in the first-term MP, despite Barclay revealing evidence of an illegal act against an electorate agent that English had known and respected for 17 years.

      Just metres away at the same time, Barclay was denying to reporters that he had made a recording or had spoken to the Prime Minister about it. That started the clock ticking.

      Even during the questioning before the caucus meeting, English could sense he was in trouble when Newsroom’s Sam Sachdeva asked him if he had made a statement to the police about it. English confirmed the statement, but then could not recall what he had told police in the statement. He then said he would not release the statement and then failed to answer questions about how he could have made a statement to police about a conversation, but now could not recall it.

      It looked like he had been caught unprepared to defend something he wasn’t comfortable defending.

      Once English knew that Newsroom knew about the police statement, he could not be sure it would not come out to make fools of both Barclay and English. So some time between 10am and 2pm he decided to cut at least some of his losses and throw Barclay under the bus.

      https://www.newsroom.co.nz/2017/06/20/35006?slug=english-barclay

      It’s called ‘lying by omission or misdirection’. I know you’re going to try and parse, pontificate and piffle this into non-existence, but let me put it this way … if I pulled such a stunt with my employer over such a serious matter I’m 100% sure I would not be on the payroll next week.

      • Gabby 12.1.1

        It was probably prudent of Bingles to avoid the ambush and check – tv or dictaphone dammit? What did I say?

      • mordecai 12.1.2

        Thanks for the press release, but again, what is the lie English told? Stop your evasion and answer the question.

        • RedLogix 12.1.2.1

          Lie by omission, English knew the recording existed, that he had made a statement to the police, and repeatedly pretended he ‘could not remember’.

          There under your nose, but it’s fun watching you deny it.

          I’m thinking if your moral compass cannot detect why English has just so damaged his credibility here, it’s going to take you even longer to show some self-awareness.

          • mordecai 12.1.2.1.1

            “Lie by omission, English knew the recording existed, that he had made a statement to the police, and repeatedly pretended he ‘could not remember’.”
            Saying he can’t remember something isn’t evidence of a lie by omission. Unless you can read minds. You’re simply letting your irrational bias cloud your judgement.

            • RedLogix 12.1.2.1.1.1

              Ever made a statement to the police and ‘forgotten about it’? I can understand wanting to forget about it, but when you are PM we do expect a slightly higher standard of personal integrity.

              Or not … in your case.

              • mordecai

                What was the statement? When was it made? Where is the transcript of English saying he had ‘forgotten’?

                • left_forward

                  FFS mordecai, perhaps you should find this stuff out for yourself rather than this manic cross examination.

                  • Sadly mortify doesn’t care about the truth. And no one cares about his bullshit in spport of his lying PM.

                  • mordecai

                    I’m not accusing anyone of telling lies.

                    • left_forward

                      No, you are feverishly defending the obfuscation of truth as if significantly distinct to telling a lie.

                    • mordecai

                      “No, you are feverishly defending the obfuscation of truth as if” significantly distinct to telling a lie.”
                      What obfuscation?

                    • Macro

                      “No, you are feverishly defending the obfuscation of truth as if” significantly distinct to telling a lie.”
                      What obfuscation?

                      🙄

                      obfuscate verb
                      make obscure, unclear, or unintelligible:

                      You should know – you do it all the time!

        • Stuart Munro 12.1.2.2

          Come on – “Strong economy” the bugger is a compulsive liar and has never been anything else.

          • mordecai 12.1.2.2.1

            Proof? Examples?

            • Macro 12.1.2.2.1.1

              Have a walk down Queen street some time
              Count the number of people begging.

              Visit Bunnings car parks at night
              Count the number of people living in cars

              Visit a foodbank tomorrow
              Ask if the number of food parcels issued is on the increase

              Visit a night shelter some time:
              Are there any vacant beds?

              Get off your bottom sitting at the gate( and whispering to the king) and have a look around at what is truely happening to the people of this country – and I don’t mean just your mates.

            • Stuart Munro 12.1.2.2.1.2

              Ex immigration and housing the prawn has never come up with growth over 1%, when 3% actual is the baseline for competence.

              Talks a great game though.

              • mordecai

                Must do, given we have a third term government at record levels of popularity, and a PM who is consigning his primary opponent to oblivion.

                • Stuart Munro

                  He’s not at record levels of popularity though – he’s within two seats of losing the Treasury benches.

                  So you kind of need a more realistic statement – more like “English’s popularity dives as a perfect storm of revelations show he’s piking over Pike River, he lied about Todd Barclay, and his so-called ‘strong economy’ will evidently collapse if the immigration rorts are shut down. Will he return to the dizzying depths of the low 20s he occupied the last time he led National to a richly deserved defeat?”

            • WILD KATIPO 12.1.2.2.1.3

              Mordecai has thought this through and believes he / she has an angle for justification.

              The fact is , there is none. The story’s were switched , they lied , and the old ‘ I forget ‘ ruse was pulled out to A ) buy time and B ) to deliberately avoid stating the outright truth .

              Incidentally the ‘ I forget ‘ ruse was popularized during the Ronald Reagan era by ( in particular , but not exclusively so ) far right wing politicians , – who started adopting that tactic and making it commonplace in western politics to avoid adverse legal and political complications. ( It is important however , … to note that both the far left and the far right are simply the two heads of Globalist world government ).

              But it was part of the ‘ dirty politics’ tactics imported from the USA and taught by such subversives as Simon Lusk.

              Here , it was used extensively by John Key to almost ridiculous extremes (who , although being of the ‘Right ‘ wing National party of NZ , – was firmly and blatantly in the Obama team – who was a Democrat – traditionally the equivalent of the USA’ s ‘ Left ‘ wing …. and who endorsed the same erosion of civil liberties as Key ie : TTPA , increased Police state, massive increase in the surveillance of the public, and the aggressive advocation of wars on foreign soil eg : ”Get some GUTS !!! ” and regular drone indiscriminate bombings )

              John Banks was another serial offender in obstructing justice in this manner. Nick Smith and others have also used it when in a tight corner as are many other minor players and even private sector individuals.

              It is simply not credible that on so many , many issues of critical import –
              whether it involves illegal activity, breach of democratic principle or evidence of complicity or collusion – that these political officials continually resort to demonstrating their unfitness to be in their positions by simply ‘ forgetting ‘ their words or actions or those of others when questioned.

              Particularly so in this modern age of fast digital recording , and instant recall of evidence.

              As in the old legal ‘peasants right to silence’ which was legislated around to make it an offence, so also should ‘ forgetting’ when used as a defense to avoid criminal prosecution or political embarrassment when there is sufficient circumstantial evidence of a serious breach.

              I could hardly see ( as an extreme case to illustrate the point ) , … Herman Goering – had he lived – being let off the death penalty by simply saying ‘ I forget ‘ every time he was questioned.

              • mordecai

                Yawn. Still no real evidence of lies. No wonder this is off the top of the Herald site already.

                [lprent: The NZ Herald site has foe aboutva decade been run using clickbait criteria. Effectively this means that nothing survives at tbe top of the site for more than about 2 days if it doesn’t appeal to a very wide demographic. Ie sport, gossip invokving sex and violence or gore of some form.

                Basically it is run by mindless observation by a dumb computer of the clicks of people’s reptilian hind brains rather than any form of intelligence.

                I usually have to scan through about a hundred articles before I find one worth reading. Which is why I don’t read it directly anymore. I just read the business section and whatever articles are highlighted by others as having some interest. The Minerals website appears to be trying to emulate The Truth (Which eventually failed)

                But while I can see its appeal for you. It isn’t a valid argument to use here. ]

                • Yawn.

                  Interesting.

                  Interesting that you display the same endorsement of evasion in using the authority of a newspaper to qualify not only in your view public opinion but also the legality of the situation as do other biased National supporters .

                  Its not going to work.

                  Its called Perjury.
                  ………………………………………………………..

                  perjury
                  ˈpəːdʒ(ə)ri/Submit
                  nounLAW
                  the offence of wilfully telling an untruth or making a misrepresentation under oath.
                  “he claimed two witnesses at his trial had committed perjury”
                  synonyms: lying under oath, violation of an oath, giving false evidence/testimony, bearing false witness/testimony, forswearing oneself, making false statements, wilful falsehood.

                  …………………………………………………………..

                  You will also notice that the word ‘ untruth’ was included in the above list.

                  …………………………………………………………..

                  untruth
                  ʌnˈtruːθ/Submit
                  noun
                  a lie or false statement (often used euphemistically).
                  “they go off and tell untruths about organizations for which they worked”
                  synonyms: lie, falsehood, fib, fabrication, deception, made-up story, trumped-up story, invention, fiction, piece of fiction, falsification, falsity, cock and bull story, barefaced lie; More
                  the quality of being false.
                  “the story was full of misleading innuendo and untruth”

                  ……………………………………………………………

                  ” Mr English initially responded to questions saying “I can’t recall,” but later admitted he’d known about the recordings for over a year and that Mr Barclay had told him.”

                  Todd Barclay recording scandal: ‘Someone is lying’ | Newshub
                  http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/…/todd-barclay-recording-scandal-someone-is-lying.html

                  ………………………………….

                  Little said that English had known about the recording 18 months ago but had never acknowledged this in media interviews and had stood aside while Barclay denied its existence. That was a ” total failure of leadership,” he said.

                  New Zealand First leader Winston Peters went further, saying that English and former Prime Minister John Key had been complicit in hiding illegal activity.

                  “When you aid and abet a crime, and when you are involved in hush money and a cover-up, then there are serious questions to be answered.”

                  Opposition targets Prime Minister Bill English and police over Todd …
                  http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11880251

                  ………………………………….

                  And also , at least figuratively , … that can apply also in the ‘court of public opinion’ as well.

                  I would shut up if I were you and stop trying to derail , talk in semantics and otherwise divert attention away from what is , in fact , quite a serious breach in the integrity of our democracy and our laws .

                  And one other thing… if I can put it succinctly at your level so that you can understand ….

                  I don’t give a FLYING FUCK about your vested interest’s , bud.

                  Not one sack of shit.

                  • mordecai

                    So now you’re quoting A Little as a source? Desperate as.

                    • You seem to be an abject fool in comprehensive reading skills and interpreting what is patently obvious , – yet an expert at denying what everybody else including members in the National party are now saying…

                      Are you ,… really a fool?

                      Of course not. You are just a person who will defend a liar if it means defending your personal self interests. Either that or you are not interested in democracy and its defense at all but rather subverting and filling threads such as this up with your inanities with the end objective of rendering them nonsensical.

                      What you have succeeded in doing , however , – and congratulations for achieving it – is demonstrating a childish and stubborn incredibility in trying to defend the indefensible of something that somehow threatens your security , – to which a more balanced and mature adult viewpoint being required than yours would have to admit was absolutely indefensible.

                      I really do not think , you have convinced anybody of your viewpoints barring edifying people of the fact that you are , in fact , a dime a dozen common garden internet troll with no real input worth printing , let alone actually expecting people to take what you have to say as anything of any real substance or import.

                    • mordecai

                      “I really do not think , you have convinced anybody of your viewpoints…”
                      I really didn’t expect I would. My point was to demonstrate how silly the ‘liar liar’ claims really are, because on the basis of this example you could accuse anyone of anything.

    • mpledger 12.2

      You don’t understand about political leadership and political capital.

      If Collins was PM, Barclay would be goneburger – Collins wouldn’t suffer fools making her look like an idiot and the party look like a corrupt, ugly, nasty mess.

      • Reality 12.2.1

        It’s likely the electorate is a spider’s web of intrigue and machination between all those involved. Who is going to backstab who?

        • mordecai 12.2.1.1

          Oh there’s no doubt about that. The electorate has had some pretty heavy hitters from within National playing against Barclay for some time. Politics is a dirty game, no question.

        • Robert Guyton 12.2.1.2

          What did Invercargill MP, Sarah Dowie know? As Todd Barclay’s “buddy” MP, Dowie was close to him and must have at least wondered, “what’s it all about, Toddy?”. As well, her husband is a policeman and it’s not unreasonable to think she’d have asked him about the position police were taking over the allegations against her National Party buddy. Has anyone asked her?

      • mordecai 12.2.2

        You don’t understand the National Party constitution. English can’t fire Barclay. He can only outline him.

        • ianmac 12.2.2.1

          Applies to all Electorate MPs mordecai.. Can’t be sacked unless convicted of a crime with a sentence of 2 years or more. But an effective PM would convince an MP to resign. English failed. They can ban an MP from Caucus whence they become an “Independent.”

        • Kaplan 12.2.2.2

          mordecai. You don’t understand electorates if you think that has anything to do with National’s constitution.

          • mordecai 12.2.2.2.1

            Yes, I do. The grass roots members in each electorate choose their MP. That is why the Nats are more democratic than the Lab’s, whose ‘local’ candidates are largely dictated by HQ.

            [lprent: Ah no. Perhaps you should read up on that particular subject before making simple minded stupid ignorant and invalid assertions. Come back to that topic once you are actually informed about it. Rather what appears to be some kind of retarded troll who probably also has to stimulate their lower brain with their fingers to be able to think at all.

            I really don’t like trolls or people acting like them. Because of that I don’t like assertions stated as fact with neither accuracy or backing – it is a trait of a fuckwit troll..

            Read our policy as well. Then you may understand what I mean whn I say that you just got a warning. ]

            • Draco T Bastard 12.2.2.2.1.1

              That is why the Nats are more democratic than the Lab’s, whose ‘local’ candidates are largely dictated by HQ.

              LOL

              Typical RWNJ – completely misinformed about reality. National is the least democratic political party in the country.

              The thing about authoritarians and capitalists is that they really, really hate democracy as the idea of the people having power truly terrifies them.

    • rob 12.3

      it looks as if he abused that system aswel.

    • red-blooded 12.4

      Excuse me, mate, but you clearly don’t understand Labour’s candidate selection processes. Labour electorate MPs are nominated and chosen by members in their electorate. List MPs are ranked by rank and file members from their region, then final ranks are decided by a committee made up of MPs, officials and members’ reps, based on input from the regional votes, skills and experience and policies re diversity, balance of ages, genders etc. The difference is that the Nats don’t give ordinary members a voice in the list process.

      I’m sure both parties have some internal negotiation processes, but Labour electorate MPs are definitely not “selected effectively by Party HQ”.

      • mordecai 12.4.1

        Let’s assume you are correct. Then Little is a hypocrite, because he is calling for English to do something he can’t do (sack an MP), and that Little can’t himself do in his own party. That about sum it up?

  13. What did he say that was a lie?

    Warning: obfuscation based on convoluted disputes over what the word “lie” means ahead.

    On the plus side, you never know, we may get a quote out of it fit to stand with “It depends on what the meaning of the word ‘is’ is.”

    “English was not strong enough to get Barclay’s resignation yesterday.”
    You don’t understand how the National party works.

    And you apparently don’t understand how politics works.

    • mordecai 13.1

      I’m more than happy to define a lie to you.
      “noun
      1.
      a false statement made with deliberate intent to deceive; an intentional untruth; a falsehood.
      Synonyms: prevarication, falsification.
      Antonyms: truth.
      2.
      something intended or serving to convey a false impression; imposture:
      His flashy car was a lie that deceived no one.
      3.
      an inaccurate or false statement; a falsehood.”
      http://www.dictionary.com/browse/lie

      Now quote me the statement from English that qualifies under any part of that definition.

      • Hanswurst 13.1.1

        “I can’t recall where the story came from.” — Bill English

        Later the same day, he confirmed that Barclay had told him. Now, I think that most of us would be charitable enough to assume that English’s brain and memory currently function at a level that makes him more fit than a goldfish to be PM of New Zealand. Allowing for that assumption, the above statement can only be interpreted as a lie.

        • mordecai 13.1.1.1

          Rubbish. Quote the question he was responding to.

        • Psycho Milt 13.1.1.2

          Incoming: you can’t prove Bill English hadn’t really forgotten that Todd Barclay had told him about illegally recording someone’s conversation, that he’d had to make a statement to the Police about it, help arrange a cover-up involving a payout to the victim, and spend a year or more pretending that he didn’t know anything about it.

          • mordecai 13.1.1.2.1

            Not commenting on something is not a lie. Good try, but you can scurry away now.

            • Psycho Milt 13.1.1.2.1.1

              OK, so now we get to “depends on what the meaning of ‘is’ is.” Took you long enough.

              • mordecai

                You didn’t comment on what you had for breakfast 3 months ago. You lied?

                • Just a note, mordecai: I’ve never read a weaker rejoinder than the above from you. Play-ground-aggrieved children do better.

                  • adam

                    Yes the phrase “I know you are, but what am I” did run through my head reading morecai’s comments – on more than one occasion.

                    • And Peewee Herman does that better than anyone 🙂

                    • adam

                      LOL, true

                    • mordecai

                      “But she didn’t.”
                      You’ve taken that an extra step, which isn’t logical. Clark knowingly signed a picture she didn’t paint. In the narrow minds of some that is dishonesty, just as in the narrow minds of some (and by the way this issue is already dead in the MSM after McCarten and Labour’s travails today) English lied.

                    • McFlock

                      ^ merdecai does do dunning-Kreuger better than anyone, though 🙂

                    • Mordecai is being pedantic on this point, though why, I’m not sure. It may simply be that he/she is fanatical about being right. There’s a difference though, between lying and not telling the truth. I guess Mordecai is determined to ram that difference down readers’ throats. Again, why that is, I’m not sure.

                • You didn’t comment on what you had for breakfast 3 months ago. You lied?

                  Let’s see how well that analogy stacks up against its point of comparison:

                  English confirmed the text message was his, but repeatedly said he could not recall who told him about the alleged recording.

                  More accurate analogy: I’m surrounded by reporters wanting to know what I had for breakfast three months ago, I know the answer very well but instead of giving it I tell them I can’t recall. I lied? Yep – mos def.

                  • mordecai

                    Context.

                    • The context being journos asking him about this thing he was involved in that he’d really rather not talk about. What do we call saying something that isn’t true in that context?

                    • mordecai

                      “The context being journos asking him about this thing he was involved in that he’d really rather not talk about. ”
                      And that’s why I’m asking, because you still haven’t provided the question he was responding to.

                    • …you still haven’t provided the question he was responding to.

                      Well, no, because that’s what we have a fucking news media for and they kindly put things like that on the web so that even the most incapable researcher can quickly find them, should he be able to tear himself away from obfuscatory trolling long enough to give it a go.

                      As you seem unable to tear yourself away, some of the questions at least are in one of the videos on this page, said video being appropriately captioned “The Prime Minister repeatedly said he couldn’t remember where he had heard about MP Todd Barclay’s alleged illegal recording of staffer.”

                      On the basis that you’re probably unable or unwilling to admit finding it even with those instructions, here are some of the questions and answers:

                      English: “Was I…?”

                      Reporter: “…told by Todd Barclay he’d made a recording.”

                      English: “I can’t recall exactly…”

                      Reporter: “Who told you that he left a dictaphone running?”

                      English: “As I said, I can’t recall…”

                      Reporter: “Was it Todd Barclay himself? Because it’s really important.”

                      English: “I can’t recall where that information came from.”

                      Those answers were all lies, in whatever context you’d like to fantasise for them.

                    • weka

                      Well, no, because that’s what we have a fucking news media for and they kindly put things like that on the web so that even the most incapable researcher can quickly find them, should he be able to tear himself away from obfuscatory trolling long enough to give it a go.

                      Quite. Plus a number of authors at TS have put up posts with the relevant media links. Not sure if I will have time today, but will put a moderator hat on when I get the chance as this looks like patterns of behaviour likely to annoy.

                    • mordecai

                      “Those answers were all lies,”
                      You simply cannot prove that.

                      [You are trolling. PM set out the proof for you. Keep this up and your commenting ability will be suspended – MS]
                      No, he didn’t. He quoted the context, but cannot prove English lied. If that doesn’t fit your preferred narrative, that’s your problem, but it certainly isn’t trolling.

                      [Using the test you propose no crime will ever be proved. Warning stands – MS]

                    • And now we arrive at the “You can’t prove Bill English hadn’t forgotten what he said in a statement to Police and didn’t suddenly just remember it when it was clear the reporters already knew” bit that I mentioned in comment 13.1.1.2. Don’t you feel even slightly embarrassed at your predictability? Not to mention, the stupidity of your position?

                    • mordecai

                      ““You can’t prove Bill English hadn’t forgotten what he said…”
                      Just like no-one can prove Helen Clark set out to deliberately deceive by signing a painting she didn’t paint. It’s just silly claims based on irrational bias.

                    • Just like no-one can prove Helen Clark set out to deliberately deceive by signing a painting she didn’t paint.

                      Well, it would be just like that if Helen Clark had spent a morning telling reporters that she couldn’t recall whether she’d actually painted something, then confessed the truth a few hours later once it became clear the reporters already knew it and were going to blab all. And, if the story about the painting had been out more than a year and she’d obfuscated the whole time when asked about it. And, if the incident had involved an actual crime. In other words, not very “just like” at all.

                    • PM you’d think that would be enough evidence for mortify but I suspect that zombie won’t stay down.

                    • mordecai

                      “And, if the incident had involved an actual crime. In other words, not very “just like” at all.”
                      Ah, no. The incidents have significant similarities, including silly claims made by opponents for ideological reasons only.

                • Cinny

                  Lolz, I didn’t lie, I just forgot to tell you and stop asking so many questions.

                  Bonus points for Bill being Catholic, he gets to pray his sins away to an imaginary friend, prayer the catholics excuse for inaction.

                  • mordecai

                    Well, at least I’m not Catholic!

                  • greywarshark

                    I seem to remember, not lying though I may be wrong, that Helen Clark signed her name on the back of the painting, as an autograph. If she had put her name in the corner in the front that would be a lie.

                    And what does that have to do with matters of political significance
                    and what the political elite choose to remember about them?
                    mordecai is filling in time with meaningless arguments. Meanwhile the planet is burning.

            • Robert Guyton 13.1.1.2.1.2

              It would seem that mordecai is hovering around a new position; that Bill English has behaved admirably throughout this issue. ‘Cause Bill didn’t akshully lie don’tchaknow!

            • Macro 13.1.1.2.1.3

              The slickest way in the world to lie is to tell the right amount of truth at the right time-and then shut up.

              ― Robert A. Heinlein, Stranger in a Strange Land

              Lying by omission is still lying.
              It fails the test you quoted at 13.1 above.
              something intended or serving to convey a false impression

              • mordecai

                How did he lie by ommission?
                You see you can assert anything you like…the moon is made of cheese…but repeating it doesn’t make it true.

                • Macro

                  You see you can assert anything you like…the moon is made of cheese…but repeating it doesn’t make it true.
                  Well you should know!
                  You do it repeatedly

            • mac1 13.1.1.2.1.4

              Good old Catholic theology allows for lying by omission and lying by commission, mordecai. Yes, you can lie by not commenting. That could be lying by omission. Bill English would understand that theological nicety.

              And as an edit, snap to Macro just above!

            • Draco T Bastard 13.1.1.2.1.5

              Not commenting on something is not a lie.

              Yes it is. It’s called lying by omission.

              Or it could be this one:

              Misleading and dissembling
              Main article: Misleading

              A misleading statement is one where there is no outright lie, but still retains the purpose of getting someone to believe in an untruth.

              In fact, there’s several points in that definition as to what a lie is that Blinglish and the rest of National are probably guilty of.

              • ropata

                Bungling Bill also had direct involvement in covering up Barclay’s misdeeds. Technically it’s not “lying” merely “conspiring to mislead the people of NZ” and “hiding the evidence of an abusive MP”

                So therefore Bingles gets a free pass by the Nat cheerleaders. He enabled an abuser, covered it up, and conveniently “forgot” about it when directly questioned.

                What a saintly PM
                /sarc

                • mordecai

                  Oh no argument from me, English has handled this poorly. But that’s a long way from lying.

              • mordecai

                “Yes it is. It’s called lying by omission.”
                Lying by ommission only applies when a person misleads by doing so. If English was asked to tell everything he recalled, and didn’t, then that would be lying by ommission. Moving on from definitions, lets have some proof.

                • Draco T Bastard

                  You’ve had the proof supplied. You didn’t believe it for the political purpose of defending Blinglish’s and National’s immoral actions.

                  Which is what you’re still doing and will do no matter what – exactly as the typical authoritarian you are is bound to do.

                  • mordecai

                    Post the proof.

                    • Draco T Bastard

                      And now you’re just trolling.

                      As I’ve said – the proof has been posted. You refuse to accept it because doing would upset you as it would mean having to accept that a) you’re wrong and b) your leaders are scum.

                    • mordecai

                      “As I’ve said – the proof has been posted.”
                      This is classic denialist behaviour. What you have posted is Bill English saying he didn’t recall the specifics of something that happened months ago. You have posted NO evidence he lied. None.

                • AB

                  “Let’s have some proof”
                  But that’s exactly why the “I can’t remember” ploy is used so frequently – because you can’t prove that someone can remember something. Balance of probability helps as in:
                  “I can’t remember what I had for dinner 3 months ago”. Plausible
                  “I can’t remember seeing the alien spaceship descending, disgorging green 3-headed creatures who ate 126 schoolchildren in Gore” Less plausible

        • Stuart Munro 13.1.1.3

          I’d sooner have the goldfish frankly.

          • Draco T Bastard 13.1.1.3.1

            At least it’d probably have some concern about keeping the countries waterways clean.

            • Stuart Munro 13.1.1.3.1.1

              Goldfish do not scheme, they do not pretend to have economic skills they don’t possess. Goldfish listen more than they talk, and live in the now, not the 1960s when milk powder was a credible new technology. Goldfish don’t lie about having bad memories.

  14. silvertuatara 14

    With Joyce’s comments entering the fold, and not backing Barclay for fear of damage to Joyce’s own personal brand….could their be a possible leadership challenge unfolding within National…..Joyce & Collins or possibly Joyce & Bridges possibly?

    After all National will want to refocus the public’s attention away from Bill English’s apparent brain fade yesterday which MSM have largely not brought into, and more importantly English’s inactions in having not advised Barclay to come clean from the outset….all impacting on both English’s and Barclay’s integrity in a negative manner.

    Could we see Joyce step into the leadership role, having just delivered the Budget which according to some polls appeared to boost National’s polling? Could we see more pre election financial sweeteners soon to be offered to the public (to be implemented post election result of course when there is less of an obligation for National to follow through)?

    Or will Bill try and reassert himself publicly and request/force the resignation of Barclay, a long term family friend, for which the two have been reported to have been neighbors?

    Only time will tell…..but then again National do not have much time left to make their next step to quell the public’s distaste of having been so openly mislead by the ruling party, which is currently being laid to bare through the Main Stream Media.

    I was however interested to read Barry Soper’s NZ Herald piece this morning http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11879788. Having read a number of Barry Soper’s political pieces through the Herald and his pro National line he came out strongly and I would say pretty much in line with where public sentiment on this matter currently stands.

    This passage in Barry Soper’s Herald article wjich I quote directly does however give cause for concern;

    “Perhaps they’d like to have a look at the case again, given information that the recordings didn’t come from a dictaphone left lying around, as had been claimed, it ‘s said to have come from CCTV camera surreptitiously planted in the MP’s office by a security firm to spy on his staff, which would be an offence under the Crimes Act.”

    For it has the potential to assist Bill English out from the hole that he has dug himself since Todd Barclay confided in him that he had recordings of staff speaking about him, because it contradict’s Bill English’s original statements confirming to the police that Barclay’s recordings were made on a dictaphone, and not stated as from a CCTV camera as alleged this morning by Barry Soper.

    The Privacy Commission has the following publication/guide regarding the use of CCTV’s https://www.privacy.org.nz/assets/Files/Brochures-and-pamphlets-and-pubs/Privacy-and-CCTV-A-guide-October-2009.pdf

    It will be interesting to see if Barry Soper’s sources are correct in that CCTV was installed as opposed to Barclay making use of a dictaphone.

    Either way the Police now have a duty to establish this and be supplied with the actual device and footage/recordings that were used and made. If Barclay has destroyed any of the evidence then there should be further possible ramifications under the Privacy Act, if not through the Crimes Act also.

  15. BM 15

    Won’t make one iota of difference to National support, the public doesn’t seem to care about this sort of stuff. The general view of politicians is that they can be a bit economical with the truth and sometimes they get caught out, it’s no big deal.

    What they do care about though is the Greens announcing raising the refugee quota to 5000.

    Staggeringly dumb politics with what’s currently happening in NZ around immigration and the terror attacks in Europe and the UK.

    I actually reckon National will be up at the next poll.

    • “The public” are intensely interested in this case, BM. Ask any blogger or commenter who has posted on this over the past couple of days how their statistics have behaved – off the scale! Interest is intense, the pressure is intense and soon, there’ll be a loud bang!.

    • RedLogix 15.2

      the public doesn’t seem to care about this sort of stuff.

      So you are telling us the typical right wing voter is venal, amoral and self-serving. We always suspected, now you confirm it. Your candidness is appreciated; can I bookmark this for future reference?

      • BM 15.2.1

        Go for your life.

        In the overall scheme of things and reasons behind who people vote for this would be way down the very bottom of the list.

        Look at John Key he had numerous memory lapses yet Nationals vote increased at every election.

        • Andre 15.2.1.1

          Gosh, what is it about becoming a Nat MP that is so damaging to people’s memory?

        • Robert Guyton 15.2.1.2

          People who vote National have honesty “way down the very bottom of the list”?

          That’s your considered view?

          Sobering admission and deeply saddening thought.

      • Draco T Bastard 15.2.2

        +111

    • Won’t make one iota of difference to National support, the public doesn’t seem to care about this sort of stuff.

      National’s supporters indeed don’t seem to care about their MPs engaging in illegal activities, lying about it to cover it up, and possibly even conspiring to defeat justice. It remains to be seen whether voters in general share that lack of shit-giving.

      • Robert Guyton 15.3.1

        It’s difficult to understand and seems like a disconnect is operating somehow. I wonder if it ties into the position many rugby fans hold, where they know our best players cheat and “get away with stuff” under-cover of the game, but figure, doesn’t matter,’cause we won! I suspect it’s the same “logic” operating.

    • adam 15.4

      Becaue the polls will always save you, they seems to be a bit of a pattern with the polls, somthing bad happens with national – they then get a bump.

      A beige reaction?

      As one of the companies that does the polls is owned by a national party stalwart, and the other company is beholden to a bail out by the political party currently in power.

      Ah the beige revolution – this is how it’s down.

      3
      2
      1

      BM yells conspiracy theory.

      Nope, this is what an observation looks like. It’s no theory, just an observation.

    • left_forward 15.5

      What have refugees in NZ got to do with the terror attack at the London Mosque?

    • Ed 15.6

      Michael Deaker seems to disagree with you.
      And he is a Tory.

      http://www.radionz.co.nz/audio/player?audio_id=201848359

  16. peterh 17

    You have to give John Key credit now, he was a far better lair than English is
    my be it was because he did it more often

  17. Barclay – gone by afternoon tea time.

      • Cinny 18.1.1

        But still able to collect a tax payer funded salary for the next 3 months, wonders how many tax payer dollars have been eaten up over this.

        Three staff resigning, secret pay out, on going salary to an MP who will probably be investigated by the police, all the time spent on this issue, meetings etc. And all they do is decide he won’t be standing again, FFS useless gutless. But the good news is, in three months we will have a new government, one that won’t put up with lying scheming MP’s.

      • Ed 18.1.2

        OMG.
        He was inspired by Gerry Brownlee.
        Says it all.

  18. Ovid 19

    “Todd Barclay will not stand at the next election” – Katie Bradford via Twitter.

  19. Banjo 20

    Bill English is “pretty damned hopeless” at telling the truth and his management of this from the start has been pretty damned hopeless too. I have anecdotal evidence that there are too many Leaders/managers/employers in this country with inept management & people skills &. It’s a big problem. We might need to reduce their incomes and work conditions. They’re clearly incapable. Maybe put them on a 90 day trial or something.

  20. Cinny 21

    If anyone wants to tune in to the live stream for the outgoing PM’s statement re Barclay, I’ve found a link here…

    http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2017/02/livestream-prime-minister-s-post-cabinet-news-conference.html

    Lol can hear the reporters chatting in the background

  21. Bill English said: “the fallout wasn’t damaging to the party because “these sorts of issues arise commonly in politics” and it had been dealt with quickly.”

    It had been dealt with quickly??????

    For how many months has this issue been festering???

    Dealt with quickly!

    Looking for examples where the PM isn’t being truthful?

    They are coming thick and fast.

  22. patricia bremner 23

    Bill wanted it to be over before the conference.
    Don’t think that will help smooth the rifts that are now showing.
    Interesting groupings happening now!
    Looks like Judith may have lost an offsider.
    Bennett is very quiet! Hardly seen as support for Bill.
    Joyce getting his face out there.
    I think there is more to come yet.
    Good reporting will unearth more yet, and connections are rife.

  23. Penny Bright 24

    http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2017/06/patrick-gower-bill-english-has-damaged-his-political-mana.html

    OPINION: Bill English has faced his first political test – and failed.

    “He’s looked shifty on the Todd Barclay issue and there is no question that his political mana has been damaged.”

    Yep – PM Bill English is nowBILLSH*T – Prime Minister for COVERUPS.

    • BILLSH*T

      The best so far. And we can string quite a sentence together now ( will save having to expend cash and energy for any future crony Knighthood Titles …)

      Double Dipper from Dipton BILLSH*T English.

      I like it.

      Its got a certain ‘ ring ‘ to it….

      * And if you say it fast enough ,… it sounds like a Rap number being sung… a bit like another certain Rap number that the Dildo man thought was ‘pretty legal ‘ at the time ….

  24. peterlepaysan 25

    I have said it before on this site. Bill English is a Treasury robot.
    Once again he has demonstrated that (not alternative) fact.

  25. “When one of your employees repeatedly gets up before the media and says something you know is false, then continues making that same assertion for more than a year, and you do nothing, isn’t that kind of a evasion of omission?

    The worst thing here is that English’s main selling point is that he’s a morally upstanding Catholic farmer from Southland”

    https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/21-06-2017/all-the-untruths-evasions-and-um-bulldust-in-the-todd-barclay-debacle/

  26. “Yesterday morning, English was asked who told him Barclay had made the secret dictaphone recordings. He said he couldn’t remember.

    Now I’m as prone to having my underlings confess possible crimes to me as anyone, but I will assert one thing: I’d always remember the conversation. And I would particularly remember it if I had to recount it to the police in an official statement soon afterward.

    Is it really plausible that English just forgot Barclay telling him he’d made the recordings? It really sounds like the prime minister has been caught in a fabrication of commission. That’s a big deal, and we’ve completely exhausted our thesaurus’s suggested alternatives for “lie”.”

    https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/21-06-2017/all-the-untruths-evasions-and-um-bulldust-in-the-todd-barclay-debacle/

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    PolitikBy Richard Harman
    2 days ago
  • 2024 SkS Weekly Climate Change & Global Warming News Roundup #11
    A listing of 35 news and opinion articles we found interesting and shared on social media during the past week: Sun, March 10, 2024 thru Sat, March 16, 2024. Story of the week This week we'll give you a little glimpse into how we collect links to share and ...
    2 days ago
  • 2024 SkS Weekly Climate Change & Global Warming News Roundup #11
    A listing of 35 news and opinion articles we found interesting and shared on social media during the past week: Sun, March 10, 2024 thru Sat, March 16, 2024. Story of the week This week we'll give you a little glimpse into how we collect links to share and ...
    2 days ago
  • Out of Touch.
    “I’ve been internalising a really complicated situation in my head.”When they kept telling us we should wait until we get to know him, were they taking the piss? Was it a case of, if you think this is bad, wait till you get to know the real Christopher, after the ...
    Nick’s KōreroBy Nick Rockel
    2 days ago
  • Bring out your Dad
    Happy fourth anniversary, Pandemic That Upended Bloody Everything. I have been observing it by enjoying my second bout of COVID. It’s 5.30 on Sunday morning and only now are lights turning back on for me.Allow me to copy and paste what I told reader Sara yesterday:Depleted, fogged and crappy. Resting, ...
    More Than A FeildingBy David Slack
    3 days ago
  • Bring out your Dad
    Happy fourth anniversary, Pandemic That Upended Bloody Everything. I have been observing it by enjoying my second bout of COVID. It’s 5.30 on Sunday morning and only now are lights turning back on for me.Allow me to copy and paste what I told reader Sara yesterday:Depleted, fogged and crappy. Resting, ...
    More Than A FeildingBy David Slack
    3 days ago
  • Bring out your Dad
    Happy fourth anniversary, Pandemic That Upended Bloody Everything. I have been observing it by enjoying my second bout of COVID. It’s 5.30 on Sunday morning and only now are lights turning back on for me.Allow me to copy and paste what I told reader Sara yesterday:Depleted, fogged and crappy. Resting, ...
    More Than A FeildingBy David Slack
    3 days ago
  • The bewildering world of Chris Luxon – Guns for all, not no lunch for kids
    .“$10 and a target that bleeds” - Bleeding Targets for Under $10!.Thanks for reading Frankly Speaking ! Subscribe for free to receive new posts and support my work.This government appears hell-bent on either scrapping life-saving legislation or reintroducing things that - frustrated critics insist - will be dangerous and likely ...
    Frankly SpeakingBy Frank Macskasy
    3 days ago
  • Expert Opinion: Ageing Boomers, Laurie & Les, Talk Politics.
    It hardly strikes me as fair to criticise a government for doing exactly what it said it was going to do. For actually keeping its promises.”THUNDER WAS PLAYING TAG with lightning flashes amongst the distant peaks. Its rolling cadences interrupted by the here-I-come-here-I-go Doppler effect of the occasional passing car. ...
    3 days ago
  • Manufacturing The Truth.
    Subversive & Disruptive Technologies: Just as happened with that other great regulator of the masses, the Medieval Church, the advent of a new and hard-to-control technology – the Internet –  is weakening the ties that bind. Then, and now, those who enjoy a monopoly on the dissemination of lies, cannot and will ...
    3 days ago
  • A Powerful Sensation of Déjà Vu.
    Been Here Before: To find the precedents for what this Coalition Government is proposing, it is necessary to return to the “glory days” of Muldoonism.THE COALITION GOVERNMENT has celebrated its first 100 days in office by checking-off the last of its listed commitments. It remains, however, an angry government. It ...
    3 days ago
  • Can you guess where world attention is focussed (according to Greenpeace)? It’s focussed on an EPA...
    Bob Edlin writes –  And what is the world watching today…? The email newsletter from Associated Press which landed in our mailbox early this morning advised: In the news today: The father of a school shooter has been found guilty of involuntary manslaughter; prosecutors in Trump’s hush-money case ...
    Point of OrderBy Bob Edlin
    3 days ago
  • Further integrity problems for the Greens in suspending MP Darleen Tana
    Bryce Edwards writes – Is another Green MP on their way out? And are the Greens severely tarnished by another integrity scandal? For the second time in three months, the Green Party has secretly suspended an MP over integrity issues. Mystery is surrounding the party’s decision to ...
    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    3 days ago
  • Jacqui Van Der Kaay: Greens’ transparency missing in action
    For the last few years, the Green Party has been the party that has managed to avoid the plague of multiple scandals that have beleaguered other political parties. It appears that their luck has run out with a second scandal which, unfortunately for them, coincided with Golraz Ghahraman, the focus ...
    Democracy ProjectBy bryce.edwards
    3 days ago
  • Bernard’s Dawn Chorus with six newsey things at 6:46am for Saturday, March 16
    TL;DR: The six newsey things that stood out to me as of 6:46am on Saturday, March 16.Andy Foster has accidentally allowed a Labour/Green amendment to cut road user chargers for plug-in hybrid vehicles, which the Government might accept; NZ Herald Thomas Coughlan Simeon Brown has rejected a plea from Westport ...
    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    4 days ago
  • How Did FTX Crash?
    What seemed a booming success a couple of years ago has collapsed into fraud convictions.I looked at the crash of FTX (short for ‘Futures Exchange’) in November 2022 to see whether it would impact on the financial system as a whole. Fortunately there was barely a ripple, probably because it ...
    PunditBy Brian Easton
    4 days ago
  • Elections in Russia and Ukraine
    Anybody following the situation in Ukraine and Russia would probably have been amused by a recent Tweet on X NATO seems to be putting in an awful lot of effort to influence what is, at least according to them, a sham election in an autocracy.When do the Ukrainians go to ...
    4 days ago
  • Bernard’s six stack of substacks at 6pm on March 15
    TL;DR: Shaun Baker on Wynyard Quarter's transformation. Magdalene Taylor on the problem with smart phones. How private equity are now all over reinsurance. Dylan Cleaver on rugby and CTE. Emily Atkin on ‘Big Meat’ looking like ‘Big Oil’.Bernard’s six-stack of substacks at 6pm on March 15Photo by Jeppe Hove Jensen ...
    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    4 days ago
  • Buzz from the Beehive Finance Minister Nicola Willis had plenty to say when addressing the Auckland Business Chamber on the economic growth that (she tells us) is flagging more than we thought. But the government intends to put new life into it:  We want our country to be a ...
    Point of OrderBy Bob Edlin
    4 days ago
  • National’s clean car tax advances
    The Transport and Infrastructure Committee has reported back on the Road User Charges (Light Electric RUC Vehicles) Amendment Bill, basicly rubberstamping it. While there was widespread support among submitters for the principle that EV and PHEV drivers should pay their fair share for the roads, they also overwhelmingly disagreed with ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    4 days ago
  • Government funding bailouts
    Peter Dunne writes – This week’s government bailout – the fifth in the last eighteen months – of the financially troubled Ruapehu Alpine Lifts company would have pleased many in the central North Island ski industry. The government’s stated rationale for the $7 million funding was that it ...
    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    4 days ago
  • Two offenders, different treatments.
    See if you can spot the difference. An Iranian born female MP from a progressive party is accused of serial shoplifting. Her name is leaked to the media, which goes into a pack frenzy even before the Police launch an … Continue reading ...
    KiwipoliticoBy Pablo
    4 days ago
  • Treaty references omitted
    Ele Ludemann writes  – The government is omitting general Treaty references from legislation : The growth of Treaty of Waitangi clauses in legislation caused so much worry that a special oversight group was set up by the last Government in a bid to get greater coherence in the public service on Treaty ...
    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    4 days ago
  • The Ghahraman Conflict
    What was that judge thinking? Peter Williams writes –  That Golriz Ghahraman and District Court Judge Maria Pecotic were once lawyer colleagues is incontrovertible. There is published evidence that they took at least one case to the Court of Appeal together. There was a report on ...
    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    4 days ago
  • Bernard's Top 10 @ 10 'pick 'n' mix' for March 15
    TL;DR: My top 10 news and analysis links this morning include:Today’s must-read: Climate Scorpion – the sting is in the tail. Introducing planetary solvency. A paper via the University of Exeter’s Institute and Faculty of Actuaries.Local scoop: Kāinga Ora starts pulling out of its Auckland projects and selling land RNZ ...
    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    4 days ago
  • The day Wellington up-zoned its future
    Wellington’s massively upzoned District Plan adds the opportunity for tens of thousands of new homes not just in the central city (such as these Webb St new builds) but also close to the CBD and public transport links. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: Wellington gave itself the chance of ...
    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    4 days ago
  • Weekly Roundup 15-March-2024
    It’s Friday and we’re halfway through March Madness. Here’s some of the things that caught our attention this week. This Week in Greater Auckland On Monday Matt asked how we can get better event trains and an option for grade separating Morningside Dr. On Tuesday Matt looked into ...
    Greater AucklandBy Greater Auckland
    5 days ago
  • That Word.
    Something you might not know about me is that I’m quite a stubborn person. No, really. I don’t much care for criticism I think’s unfair or that I disagree with. Few of us do I suppose.Back when I was a drinker I’d sometimes respond defensively, even angrily. There are things ...
    Nick’s KōreroBy Nick Rockel
    5 days ago
  • The Hoon around the week to March 15
    Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: The five things that mattered in Aotearoa’s political economy that we wrote and spoke about via The Kākā and elsewhere for paying subscribers in the last week included:PM Christopher Luxon said the reversal of interest deductibility for landlords was done to help renters, who ...
    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    5 days ago
  • Labour’s policy gap
    It was not so much the Labour Party but really the Chris Hipkins party yesterday at Labour’s caucus retreat in Martinborough. The former Prime Minister was more or less consistent on wealth tax, which he was at best equivocal about, and social insurance, which he was not willing to revisit. ...
    PolitikBy Richard Harman
    5 days ago
  • Skeptical Science New Research for Week #11 2024
    Open access notables A Glimpse into the Future: The 2023 Ocean Temperature and Sea Ice Extremes in the Context of Longer-Term Climate Change, Kuhlbrodt et al., Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society: In the year 2023, we have seen extraordinary extrema in high sea surface temperature (SST) in the North Atlantic and in ...
    5 days ago
  • Melissa remains mute on media matters but has something to say (at a sporting event) about economic ...
     Buzz from the Beehive   The text reproduced above appears on a page which records all the media statements and speeches posted on the government’s official website by Melissa Lee as Minister of Media and Communications and/or by Jenny Marcroft, her Parliamentary Under-secretary.  It can be quickly analysed ...
    Point of OrderBy Bob Edlin
    5 days ago
  • The return of Muldoon
    For forty years, Robert Muldoon has been a dirty word in our politics. His style of government was so repulsive and authoritarian that the backlash to it helped set and entrench our constitutional norms. His pig-headedness over forcing through Think Big eventually gave us the RMA, with its participation and ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    5 days ago
  • Will the rental tax cut improve life for renters or landlords?
    Bryce Edwards writes –  Is the new government reducing tax on rental properties to benefit landlords or to cut the cost of rents? That’s the big question this week, after Associate Finance Minister David Seymour announced on Sunday that the Government would be reversing the Labour Government’s removal ...
    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    5 days ago
  • Geoffrey Miller: What Saudi Arabia’s rapid changes mean for New Zealand
    Saudi Arabia is rarely far from the international spotlight. The war in Gaza has brought new scrutiny to Saudi plans to normalise relations with Israel, while the fifth anniversary of the controversial killing of Jamal Khashoggi was marked shortly before the war began on October 7. And as the home ...
    Democracy ProjectBy Geoffrey Miller
    5 days ago
  • Racism’s double standards
    Questions need to be asked on both sides of the world Peter Williams writes –   The NRL Judiciary hands down an eight week suspension to Sydney Roosters forward Spencer Leniu , an Auckland-born Samoan, after he calls Ezra Mam, Sydney-orn but of Aboriginal and Torres Strait ...
    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    5 days ago
  • It’s not a tax break
    Ele Ludemann writes – Contrary to what many headlines and news stories are saying, residential landlords are not getting a tax break. The government is simply restoring to them the tax deductibility of interest they had until the previous government removed it. There is no logical reason ...
    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    5 days ago
  • The Plastic Pig Collective and Chris' Imaginary Friends.
    I can't remember when it was goodMoments of happiness in bloomMaybe I just misunderstoodAll of the love we left behindWatching our flashbacks intertwineMemories I will never findIn spite of whatever you becomeForget that reckless thing turned onI think our lives have just begunI think our lives have just begunDoes anyone ...
    Nick’s KōreroBy Nick Rockel
    5 days ago
  • Who is responsible for young offenders?
    Michael Bassett writes – At first reading, a front-page story in the New Zealand Herald on 13 March was bizarre. A group of severely intellectually limited teenagers, with little understanding of the law, have been pleading to the Justice Select Committee not to pass a bill dealing with ram ...
    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    5 days ago
  • Gordon Campbell on National’s fantasy trip to La La Landlord Land
    How much political capital is Christopher Luxon willing to burn through in order to deliver his $2.9 billion gift to landlords? Evidently, Luxon is: (a) unable to cost the policy accurately. As Anna Burns-Francis pointed out to him on Breakfast TV, the original ”rock solid” $2.1 billion cost he was ...
    5 days ago
  • Bernard's Top 10 @ 10 'pick 'n' mix' for March 14
    TL;DR: My top 10 news and analysis links this morning include:Today’s must-read: Jonathon Porritt calling bullshit in his own blog post on mainstream climate science as ‘The New Denialism’.Local scoop: The Wellington City Council’s list of proposed changes to the IHP recommendations to be debated later today was leaked this ...
    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    5 days ago
  • No, Prime Minister, rents don’t rise or fall with landlords’ costs
    TL;DR: Prime Minister Christopher Luxon said yesterday tenants should be grateful for the reinstatement of interest deductibility because landlords would pass on their lower tax costs in the form of lower rents. That would be true if landlords were regulated monopolies such as Transpower or Auckland Airport1, but they’re not, ...
    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    5 days ago
  • Cartoons: ‘At least I didn’t make things awkward’
    This is a re-post from Yale Climate Connections by Tom Toro Tom Toro is a cartoonist and author. He has published over 200 cartoons in The New Yorker since 2010. His cartoons appear in Playboy, the Paris Review, the New York Times, American Bystander, and elsewhere. Related: What 10 EV lovers ...
    5 days ago
  • Solving traffic congestion with Richard Prebble
    The business section of the NZ Herald is full of opinion. Among the more opinionated of all is the ex-Minister of Transport, ex-Minister of Railways, ex MP for Auckland Central (1975-93, Labour), Wellington Central (1996-99, ACT, then list-2005), ex-leader of the ACT Party, uncle to actor Antonia, the veritable granddaddy ...
    Greater AucklandBy Patrick Reynolds
    6 days ago
  • I Think I'm Done Flying Boeing
    Hi,Just quickly — I’m blown away by the stories you’ve shared with me over the last week since I put out the ‘Gary’ podcast, where I told you about the time my friend’s flatmate killed the neighbour.And you keep telling me stories — in the comments section, and in my ...
    David FarrierBy David Farrier
    6 days ago
  • Invoking Aristotle: Of Rings of Power, Stones, and Ships
    The first season of Rings of Power was not awful. It was thoroughly underwhelming, yes, and left a lingering sense of disappointment, but it was more expensive mediocrity than catastrophe. I wrote at length about the series as it came out (see the Review section of the blog, and go ...
    6 days ago
  • Van Velden brings free-market approach to changing labour laws – but her colleagues stick to distr...
    Buzz from the Beehive Workplace Relations and Safety Minister Brooke van Velden told Auckland Business Chamber members they were the first audience to hear her priorities as a minister in a government committed to cutting red tape and regulations. She brandished her liberalising credentials, saying Flexible labour markets are the ...
    Point of OrderBy Bob Edlin
    6 days ago
  • Why Newshub failed
    Chris Trotter writes – TO UNDERSTAND WHY NEWSHUB FAILED, it is necessary to understand how TVNZ changed. Up until 1989, the state broadcaster had been funded by a broadcasting licence fee, collected from every citizen in possession of a television set, supplemented by a relatively modest (compared ...
    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    6 days ago
  • Māori Party on the warpath against landlords and seabed miners – let’s see if mystical creature...
    Bob Edlin writes  –  The Māori Party has been busy issuing a mix of warnings and threats as its expresses its opposition to interest deductibility for landlords and the plans of seabed miners. It remains to be seen whether they  follow the example of indigenous litigants in Australia, ...
    Point of OrderBy Bob Edlin
    6 days ago

  • Government moves to quickly ratify the NZ-EU FTA
    "The Government is moving quickly to realise an additional $46 million in tariff savings in the EU market this season for Kiwi exporters,” Minister for Trade and Agriculture, Todd McClay says. Parliament is set, this week, to complete the final legislative processes required to bring the New Zealand – European ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 hours ago
  • Positive progress for social worker workforce
    New Zealand’s social workers are qualified, experienced, and more representative of the communities they serve, Social Development and Employment Minister Louise Upston says. “I want to acknowledge and applaud New Zealand’s social workers for the hard work they do, providing invaluable support for our most vulnerable. “To coincide with World ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    8 hours ago
  • Minister confirms reduced RUC rate for PHEVs
    Cabinet has agreed to a reduced road user charge (RUC) rate for plug-in hybrid electric vehicles (PHEVs), Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. Owners of PHEVs will be eligible for a reduced rate of $38 per 1,000km once all light electric vehicles (EVs) move into the RUC system from 1 April.  ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    10 hours ago
  • Trade access to overseas markets creates jobs
    Minister of Agriculture and Trade, Todd McClay, says that today’s opening of Riverland Foods manufacturing plant in Christchurch is a great example of how trade access to overseas markets creates jobs in New Zealand.  Speaking at the official opening of this state-of-the-art pet food factory the Minister noted that exports ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    10 hours ago
  • NZ and Chinese Foreign Ministers hold official talks
    Minister of Foreign Affairs Winston Peters met with Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi in Wellington today. “It was a pleasure to host Foreign Minister Wang Yi during his first official visit to New Zealand since 2017. Our discussions were wide-ranging and enabled engagement on many facets of New Zealand’s relationship with China, including trade, ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    24 hours ago
  • Kāinga Ora instructed to end Sustaining Tenancies
    Kāinga Ora – Homes & Communities has been instructed to end the Sustaining Tenancies Framework and take stronger measures against persistent antisocial behaviour by tenants, says Housing Minister Chris Bishop. “Earlier today Finance Minister Nicola Willis and I sent an interim Letter of Expectations to the Board of Kāinga Ora. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Speech to Auckland Business Chamber: Growth is the answer
    Tēna koutou katoa. Greetings everyone. Thank you to the Auckland Chamber of Commerce and the Honourable Simon Bridges for hosting this address today. I acknowledge the business leaders in this room, the leaders and governors, the employers, the entrepreneurs, the investors, and the wealth creators. The coalition Government shares your ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Singapore rounds out regional trip
    Minister Winston Peters completed the final leg of his visit to South and South East Asia in Singapore today, where he focused on enhancing one of New Zealand’s indispensable strategic partnerships.      “Singapore is our most important defence partner in South East Asia, our fourth-largest trading partner and a ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Minister van Velden represents New Zealand at International Democracy Summit
    Minister of Internal Affairs and Workplace Relations and Safety, Hon. Brooke van Velden, will travel to the Republic of Korea to represent New Zealand at the Third Summit for Democracy on 18 March. The summit, hosted by the Republic of Korea, was first convened by the United States in 2021, ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Insurance Council of NZ Speech, 7 March 2024, Auckland
    ICNZ Speech 7 March 2024, Auckland  Acknowledgements and opening  Mōrena, ngā mihi nui. Ko Andrew Bayly aho, Nor Whanganui aho.  Good morning, it’s a privilege to be here to open the ICNZ annual conference, thank you to Mark for the Mihi Whakatau  My thanks to Tim Grafton for inviting me ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Five-year anniversary of Christchurch terror attacks
    Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and Lead Coordination Minister Judith Collins have expressed their deepest sympathy on the five-year anniversary of the Christchurch terror attacks. “March 15, 2019, was a day when families, communities and the country came together both in sorrow and solidarity,” Mr Luxon says.  “Today we pay our respects to the 51 shuhada ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Speech for Financial Advice NZ Conference 5 March 2024
    Speech for Financial Advice NZ Conference 5 March 2024  Acknowledgements and opening  Morena, Nga Mihi Nui.  Ko Andrew Bayly aho, Nor Whanganui aho. Thanks Nate for your Mihi Whakatau  Good morning. It’s a pleasure to formally open your conference this morning. What a lovely day in Wellington, What a great ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Early visit to Indonesia strengthens ties
    Foreign Minister Winston Peters held discussions in Jakarta today about the future of relations between New Zealand and South East Asia’s most populous country.   “We are in Jakarta so early in our new government’s term to reflect the huge importance we place on our relationship with Indonesia and South ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • China Foreign Minister to visit
    Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Foreign Affairs Winston Peters has announced that the Foreign Minister of China, Wang Yi, will visit New Zealand next week.  “We look forward to re-engaging with Foreign Minister Wang Yi and discussing the full breadth of the bilateral relationship, which is one of New Zealand’s ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Minister opens new Auckland Rail Operations Centre
    Transport Minister Simeon Brown has today opened the new Auckland Rail Operations Centre, which will bring together KiwiRail, Auckland Transport, and Auckland One Rail to improve service reliability for Aucklanders. “The recent train disruptions in Auckland have highlighted how important it is KiwiRail and Auckland’s rail agencies work together to ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Celebrating 10 years of Crankworx Rotorua
    The Government is proud to support the 10th edition of Crankworx Rotorua as the Crankworx World Tour returns to Rotorua from 16-24 March 2024, says Minister for Economic Development Melissa Lee.  “Over the past 10 years as Crankworx Rotorua has grown, so too have the economic and social benefits that ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Government delivering on tax commitments
    Legislation implementing coalition Government tax commitments and addressing long-standing tax anomalies will be progressed in Parliament next week, Finance Minister Nicola Willis says. The legislation is contained in an Amendment Paper to the Taxation (Annual Rates for 2023–24, Multinational Tax, and Remedial Matters) Bill issued today.  “The Amendment Paper represents ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Significant Natural Areas requirement to be suspended
    Associate Environment Minister Andrew Hoggard has today announced that the Government has agreed to suspend the requirement for councils to comply with the Significant Natural Areas (SNA) provisions of the National Policy Statement for Indigenous Biodiversity for three years, while it replaces the Resource Management Act (RMA).“As it stands, SNAs ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Government classifies drought conditions in Top of the South as medium-scale adverse event
    Agriculture Minister Todd McClay has classified the drought conditions in the Marlborough, Tasman, and Nelson districts as a medium-scale adverse event, acknowledging the challenging conditions facing farmers and growers in the district. “Parts of Marlborough, Tasman, and Nelson districts are in the grip of an intense dry spell. I know ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Government partnership to tackle $332m facial eczema problem
    The Government is helping farmers eradicate the significant impact of facial eczema (FE) in pastoral animals, Agriculture Minister Todd McClay announced.  “A $20 million partnership jointly funded by Beef + Lamb NZ, the Government, and the primary sector will save farmers an estimated NZD$332 million per year, and aims to ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • NZ, India chart path to enhanced relationship
    Foreign Minister Winston Peters has completed a successful visit to India, saying it was an important step in taking the relationship between the two countries to the next level.   “We have laid a strong foundation for the Coalition Government’s priority of enhancing New Zealand-India relations to generate significant future benefit for both countries,” says Mr Peters, ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Ruapehu Alpine Lifts bailout the last, say Ministers
    Cabinet has agreed to provide $7 million to ensure the 2024 ski season can go ahead on the Whakapapa ski field in the central North Island but has told the operator Ruapehu Alpine Lifts it is the last financial support it will receive from taxpayers. Cabinet also agreed to provide ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Govt takes action to drive better cancer services
    Health Minister Dr Shane Reti says the launch of a new mobile breast screening unit in Counties Manukau reinforces the coalition Government’s commitment to drive better cancer services for all New Zealanders. Speaking at the launch of the new mobile clinic, Dr Reti says it’s a great example of taking ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Govt takes action to drive better cancer services
    Health Minister Dr Shane Reti says the launch of a new mobile breast screening unit in Counties Manukau reinforces the coalition Government’s commitment to drive better cancer services for all New Zealanders. Speaking at the launch of the new mobile clinic, Dr Reti says it’s a great example of taking ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Work begins on SH29 upgrades near Tauriko
    Unlocking economic growth and land for housing are critical elements of the Government’s plan for our transport network, and planned upgrades to State Highway 29 (SH29) near Tauriko will deliver strongly on those priorities, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “The SH29 upgrades near Tauriko will improve safety at the intersections ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Work begins on SH29 upgrades near Tauriko
    Unlocking economic growth and land for housing are critical elements of the Government’s plan for our transport network, and planned upgrades to State Highway 29 (SH29) near Tauriko will deliver strongly on those priorities, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “The SH29 upgrades near Tauriko will improve safety at the intersections ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Fresh produce price drop welcome
    Lower fruit and vegetable prices are welcome news for New Zealanders who have been doing it tough at the supermarket, Finance Minister Nicola Willis says. Stats NZ reported today the price of fruit and vegetables has dropped 9.3 percent in the 12 months to February 2024.  “Lower fruit and vege ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Statement to the 68th United Nations Commission on the Status of Women
    Tēnā koutou katoa and greetings to you all.  Chair, I am honoured to address the sixty-eighth session of the Commission on the Status of Women. I acknowledge the many crises impacting the rights of women and girls. Heightened global tensions, war, climate related and humanitarian disasters, and price inflation all ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Speech to the 68th United Nations Commission on the Status of Women (CSW68)
    Tēnā koutou katoa and greetings to you all.  Chair, I am honoured to address the 68th session of the Commission on the Status of Women. I acknowledge the many crises impacting the rights of women and girls. Heightened global tensions, war, climate related and humanitarian disasters, and price inflation all ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Government backs rural led catchment projects
    The coalition Government is supporting farmers to enhance land management practices by investing $3.3 million in locally led catchment groups, Agriculture Minister Todd McClay announced. “Farmers and growers deliver significant prosperity for New Zealand and it’s vital their ongoing efforts to improve land management practices and water quality are supported,” ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Speech to Auckland Business Chamber
    Good evening everyone and thank you for that lovely introduction.   Thank you also to the Honourable Simon Bridges for the invitation to address your members. Since being sworn in, this coalition Government has hit the ground running with our 100-day plan, delivering the changes that New Zealanders expect of us. ...
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    1 week ago
  • Commission’s advice on ETS settings tabled
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  • Government lowering building costs
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  • Trustee tax change welcomed
    Proposed changes to tax legislation to prevent the over-taxation of low-earning trusts are welcome, Finance Minister Nicola Willis says. The changes have been recommended by Parliament’s Finance and Expenditure Committee following consideration of submissions on the Taxation (Annual Rates for 2023–24, Multinational Tax, and Remedial Matters) Bill. “One of the ...
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  • Minister’s Ramadan message
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  • Minister appoints new NZTA Chair
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    1 week ago
  • Speech to Life Sciences Summit
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  • Government agrees to restore interest deductions
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    1 week ago
  • Minister to attend World Anti-Doping Agency Symposium
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