Daily review 01/05/2019

Written By: - Date published: 5:30 pm, May 1st, 2019 - 94 comments
Categories: Daily review - Tags:

Daily review is also your post.

This provides Standardistas the opportunity to review events of the day.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Don’t forget to be kind to each other …

94 comments on “Daily review 01/05/2019”

  1. SPC 1

    Our debt law

    Man takes out loan gets partner to co-sign and then they separate. He is unable to pay and so the other party gets WINZ to take money out of her DPB each week to repay the debt

    Our bankruptcy law

    Owner of whaleoil declares bankruptcy. Partner takes over ownership of whaleoil and puts it up on new site (sounds like a finance company boss transferring assets to wifes trust fund before the firm goes under).

    Our new credit contracts law – a limit of 100 % payment on top of a loan

    AB borrows a $500 pay day loan from company A – 2 months to pay $1000 (maximum allowed in law). 

    CS borrows a $500 pay day loan from Company B – 2 months to pay $1000 (maximum allowed in law). 

    AB borrows a $1000 pay day loan from company B – 4 months to pay $2000 (maximum allowed in law). 

    CS borrows a $1000 pay day loan from Company A – 4 months to pay $2000 (maximum allowed in law). 

    A little collusion and company A and B have easily subverted the proposed new laws around lending.

    Company C (owned by the partners of the owners of company A and Company B) then lends each borrower $2000 with $4000 payable at the end of the year (maximum allowed in law) – the money owed tied to their car ownership. . They pay, or lose their car. They will try and pay, who wants to lose their car. So on a $1000 loan they have to pay $4000 within a year, or lose their car.

  2. Ankerrawshark 2

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/news/article.cfm?c_id=1501119&objectid=12226410

     

    and now for some light relief. Hilarious in my opinion 

  3. Dennis Frank 3

    Just saw a TVNZ newsreader telling us the govt has issued a statement critical of the Maduro regime, particularly its failure to act in accord with human rights.  Video showing an army vehicle driving over protestors had featured in the report from Caracas earlier.  Google didn't find any such statement, but we'll see if it shows up later.

    Pro-Maduro folks here will be keen to continue their claims that the regime and the people aren't on opposite sides.  The notion will be tested tomorrow, when we see how many respond to Guaido's call for an uprising.  I predict that Maduro will not declare that the driver of the army vehicle will be charged with attempted murder.  Why not?  It would make him seem humanitarian, using the rule of law.  Wrong look.

    • SPC 3.1

      A crisis created by economic sanctions on Venezuala. 

      • Dennis Frank 3.1.1

        If you replace created with compounded, I would agree.  Corruption began with Chavez, apparently.  If he had been an authentic socialist, distributing the oil money to the people, the crisis would not have happened.  Instead, his daughter is now widely-known to be the richest woman in Venezuela, according to media reports.

        • SPC 3.1.1.1

          The use of the money for health, education and social housing is well known  to those who voted for him time and time again. 

          • Dennis Frank 3.1.1.1.1

            Is it?  If so, he deserves credit.  If the BBC sent a doco crew to verify that, using random street interviews rather than Maduro-selected stooges, we would have a basis to form a more balanced view.  To counter claims that regime officials have been siphoning off the oil revenues to enrich themselves, I mean.

            • mauī 3.1.1.1.1.1

              First mistake is getting your information on Venezuela from well known propaganda sources TVNZ and the BBC. 

              • Dennis Frank

                Why just those two?  All online news sources carry propaganda.  Al Jazeera, for instance, provides us with this US propaganda:  "It's still very important for three figures in the Maduro regime who have been talking to the opposition over these last three months to make good on their commitment to achieve the peaceful transition of power from the Maduro clique to interim president Juan Guaido," Bolton told reporters.

                Such mediators doing non-violent conflict resolution seem a good option.  Are they real, or just a figment of Bolton's fevered imagination?  Until a journalist interviews them, we can't tell.  You think Maduro would allow them to report the news to the media?  No, any words of disloyalty and he'd lock them up pronto!

            • SPC 3.1.1.1.1.2

              It's true enough, the evidence as to the change in that country during his years is largely positive but so dependent on oil revenue for continuance. 

              Thus the impact of change in the world oil market, poor management of the state oil company and sanctions. 

              As to corruption, US financial sanctions because Chavez was not an ally in the war against terrorism or the war on drugs – original excuses, just lead to backdoor operations that people skim off (loss of official channels and accountability). In a world where realpolitic reigns people become cynical and more selfish.  

    • Cinny 3.2

      I doubt that anyone here is pro Maduro. 

      What I do know is that many, myself included are anti Guaido (who is a USA puppet) and pro the Venezuelan people.

      • Dennis Frank 3.2.1

        Several commenters here have been consistently pro-Maduro over the past year.  I've attempted to open their minds by providing evidence in support of the residual democracy, which Guaido represents.  I understand why he seems like a puppet, but I see him as authentic representative of the Venezuelan middle class, using Trump as leverage. 

        As with Putin, collusion is a reasonable perception, but an alignment of interests is the more reasonable view.  Maduro originated as an authentic representative of the Venezuelan lower class.  Too bad absolute power corrupts absolutely.

        • Cinny 3.2.1.1

          For reals? I haven't been actively commenting as much on here, but I've still been reading TS, and following Venezuelan comments/posts.  Can't recall reading anything obviously pro Maduro, maybe I missed it.

          It's really sad how power corrupts some leaders, meanwhile the people suffer.  I think there is also much pride involved with this particular power struggle, and once again the people suffer, that's what really blows.

          • Dennis Frank 3.2.1.1.1

            Yeah, seems to me the people are split along class lines, unfortunately.  And Maduro is not obviously evil.  His humanity is evident in some of his videos, such as a wry sense of humour at times. 

            I've opposed US foreign policy most of my adult life, so it's only in recent years I've trended towards a more-balanced view.  In such nuanced situations, generalising can lead us astray.  I agree US policy errs in trying to recycle 1980s hegemony (Eliot Abrams).  Trump is too thick to realise he's reinforcing the polarisation – reconciliation is the only good way out.

          • Dennis Frank 3.2.1.2.1

            Ends well:  "we must encourage efforts to build trust and dialogue across the political divide while marginalizing hardliners who oppose any form of compromise."

            Trump ought to delegate someone to go there & make it happen!  He lacks the vision, and statesmanship, to do so.  A credible Democratic contender for the US presidency would issue a public call for him to pull finger & solve the problem via this method.  I bet nobody demonstrates such leadership capacity!

            Also interesting that your link piece says Trump is continuing Obama's policy line in Venezuela.  Now there's a thought:  he ought to get Obama to solve the problem.  Call him in to the Oval Office, suggest Obama use the opportunity to provide a model of bipartisan collaboration.  Obama is a good talker, let's see if he's also a good actor…

        • SPC 3.2.1.3

          If Guaido represented residual democracy why did he not run against Maduro in the 2018 Presidential elections? 

          The USA recognition of someone who chose not to contest that election is dubious, their opinion does not count for more than that of the local population. 

          • Brigid 3.2.1.3.1

            Dennis

            Dennis

            Dennis you haven't answered this question.

             

            Dennis where are yuuuuuuuuu

            • Dennis Frank 3.2.1.3.1.1

              I'd gone to bed.  Unprejudiced people can easily discover the lengthy sequence of anti-democratic moves made by the Maduro regime.  Evidence of their policy of faking democracy has been compiled onto several different interlinking Wikipedia pages by researchers.  Not hard to find!

          • Dennis Frank 3.2.1.3.2

            I presume it was due to Maduro's moves to rig the election.  Elections in a democracy are supposed to be free and fair.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_Venezuelan_presidential_election

            "On 11 December 2017, President Maduro announced that many of the main opposition parties, including Justice First and Popular Will, would be banned from participating in the 2018 presidential election… In February 2018, the government announced that elections would be held on 22 April 2018, less than three months before the date. Popular Will announced on 16 February that it would boycott the elections."

            • SPC 3.2.1.3.2.1

              I am not convinced, given the performance of opposition parties in the previous parliamentary election (sure the Court removed 3 of those elected to take away a 66% super majority, but beating the government party in the election was done decisively)

              There was nothing to stop anyone running as an opposition candidate supported by all of those parties – if anything what Maduro did was to make it easier to unite the opposition behind one candidate. Maybe he wanted to lose, but the opposition taking direction from DC, wanted another course for reasons we can only guess at.

              • Dennis Frank

                No point participating in an election that has been rigged in advance.  The regime stacked their equivalent of our Electoral Commission with its supporters, likewise their Supreme Court.  Elections are only viable when designed to be free and fair.  The opposition sensibly refused to endorse the charade.

                • SPC

                  Demonstrably not so, the earlier parliamentary election result being evidence. 

                  • Dennis Frank

                    Well, the people who compiled the evidence on Wikipedia disagree.  The governments who recognised Guaido as president on the constitutional basis that he cited disagree.  When facts are in dispute, opinions will differ.  No point arguing against human nature, eh?

                    • SPC

                      Sure not, the same (US backed) entitled middle class made the same effort to remove the elected President Chavez in 2002. 
                       

          • Cinny 3.2.1.3.3

            Well said SPC.

    • Dennis Frank 3.3

      "U.S. National Security Adviser John Bolton said the Trump administration was waiting for three key officials, including Maduro's defense minister and head of the supreme court, to act on what he said were private pledges to remove Maduro. He did not provide details."  https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/world/anti-government-protesters-in-venezuela-clash-troops-close-president-maduro

      Some of the armed forces are with Guaido:  "Leopoldo Lopez, his political mentor and the nation's most-prominent opposition activist, stood alongside him. Detained in 2014 for leading a previous round of anti-government unrest. Lopez said he had been released from house arrest by security forces adhering to an order from Guaidó.  "I want to tell the Venezuelan people: This is the moment to take to the streets and accompany these patriotic soldiers," Lopez declared."

      • adam 3.3.1

        Far right nut job.

        Promoting violence, thus showing us all you’re just another white nationalist.

    • Siobhan 3.4

      https://fair.org/home/venezuela-its-only-a-coup-if-the-us-government-says-so/?awt_l=CnT3e&awt_m=jCYO.gMRaIR._TQ

      I recommend reading this piece. it may help explain why you are being told that there is mass support for Guaido, from the people and the military..and yet.."bizarrely"..Maduro is still in power.

      • Dennis Frank 3.4.1

        Thanks, but that writer believes Maduro was "democratically elected".  Wikipedia provides contrary evidence, which I compiled here several months ago.

        All we can do when facts are disputed is to appraise competing claims critically.  We will then disagree, because we interpret them in accord with our prior bias.  My bias is neither left nor right, so ideology doesn't handicap me.

        • solkta 3.4.1.1

          ideology doesn't handicap me.

          Your ideology handicaps you more than most as you are not able to understand the basis of your ideas.

          • Dennis Frank 3.4.1.1.1

            What part of being Green do you not get?  Half a century of non-alignment and it remains a principle too hard for you to comprehend?  Try harder.

            • solkta 3.4.1.1.1.1

              If you are saying that your ideology is Green as in the NZ Green Party then i call bullshit on that. Your opinion often varies widely from that of the Party as you often complain about.

              If you are saying that the Greens don't have ideology then i call bullshit on that for reasons that should be obvious.

               

              • Dennis Frank

                You seem unaware that the Green movement has always been neither left nor right.  Such ignorance makes you unqualified for political commentary.  Go back to kindergarten and pay attention this time…

                • solkta

                  You seem to be unaware that there is more political ideologies than left and right. You take a holier-than-thou attitude like somehow everybody has ideology except you. There are many types of political ideology: left, right, centrist, green, libertarian, authoritarian, anarchist..

                  You are too fucking stupid to understand your own ideas. And no you aren't Green, that is so obvious from the crap you talk.

                   

                  • Dennis Frank

                    How would you know?  You've never demonstrated any ability in your comments here that you have the faintest clue about the world that surrounds you.  You just get off on being abusive.  Pathetic.

  4. gsays 4

    While researching a good design for a rocket stove/gasifier/charcoal maker I came across this clip

    Talking about bamboo as improving soil health, erosion prevention, housing.

    Then the biochar, carbon sequestering, retaining nitrous oxide in the soil and lots of benefits for mycorrhizal fungi.

    Really inspiring and positive.

    • greywarshark 4.1

      What a great link about bamboo.    I'm sold on that.

    • Bruce 4.2

      timely  facebook page on bamboo uses not sure it worked as intended you may need to scroll down a couple of post.

       

      https://www.facebook.com/SprinkleDrinkingWater/photos/pcb.2343354775727402/2343350685727811/?type=3&theater

    • Pingau 4.3

      Bamboo is an awesome material but many species are very invasive and very difficult to control – repeated use of boosted concentrated herbicide is probably the only practical way to get rid of it.

      The problem with that is it can spread into places where it will create issues for the property  (under your house, in cracks in the driveway, etc.) or into places where it will not be controlled (a neighbours place, a reserve) or that dug up or cut bamboo will be dumped and start a new colony.

      So … If you are going to plant bamboo please pick a species that spreads very slowly (depends on your local climate as well) and cannot spread into somewhere where it will not be controlled.

      • gsays 4.3.1

        Hi Pingau, it does ring a bell the invasive nature of the plant.

        The trick would be to plant the right sort in the right place.

        In the clip, there is an example of bamboo being planted on a barren hill of mine tailings and in a few months the soil is viable.

        Lots of upsides to the plant.

        • Pingau 4.3.1.1

          Hi Gsays – there sure are many upsides to bamboo but it is good to check out the downsides as well and also to check out alternatives. In NZ there has been a bit of research over the years on phytoremediation and whatnot on mine tailings and land stabilisation. It's a pretty interesting field.

          • gsays 4.3.1.1.1

            I had to look up phytoremediation.. I did come at this from a charcoal making angle, with a view to make wood vinegar (liquid smoke) as a fertiliser, herbicide and perhaps in conjunction with biochar as a soil conditioner.

            I suppose why bamboo stood out is because of its quick growing nature (also part of why it can be a pest, as you alluded to).

            Fast growing, a bit like hemp, another plant that can offer so many solutions to the problems we face. But that is another story.

  5. SPC 5

    The mentor and the pupil

    “The weak crumble, are slaughtered and are erased from history while the strong, for good or for ill, survive. The strong are respected, and alliances are made with the strong, and in the end peace is made with the strong…our enemies know very well what Israel is capable of doing. They are familiar with our policy. Whoever tries to hurt us—we hurt them”

    “I like soft power, but hard power is usually better. You need F-35s (fighter jets), cyber (security), lot of intelligence… Where does the power for hard power come from? It comes from economic power,” 

    US economic sanctions on North Korea
    US economic sanctions on Iran – now extended to all nations that trade with Iran
    US economic sanctions on Venezuala – to be extended to Cuba if it does not withdraw its military from Venezuala
    US economic sanctions on Russia
    US cuts funds to the UN agency for Palestinian refugees (UNWRA) and cuts off aid to the PA
    US declares Moslem Brotherhood a terrorist organisation (even though it is not)

    As to why none of this seems to work – see

    https://www.timesofisrael.com/those-ineffectual-us-sanctions/

    But then it’s not about winning – it’s about inspiring fear of being isolated by association with those cut off from the world market. It’s about us and them and fearing the nation which can do this to others. And fear of the USA when it is 100% behind Israel is fear of Israel.

  6. vto 6

    The Chch terror attacks have led to a wholly misplaced questioning of our ways in NZ. 

    It should be clear: it was a foreigner who invaded and attacked New Zealanders on our own soil. 

    The attack had nothing to do with New Zealand, other than being a victim.

    All this conflating with 'white New Zealand' this and 'racist New Zealand' that and 'haters in New Zealand' the other – it is all a nonsense and without basis in this context.

    It was a foreign invasion and attack on New Zealanders on their own soil.

    • solkta 6.1

      You know i can't live in your ghost NZ.

    • marty mars 6.2

      I wonder what the characteristics of the people that subscribe to that view are? Doesn't take a mensa score to work it out i'd say lol

      • vto 6.2.1

        The opening line in this months NZ Geographic article on the attacks;

        "After the attack on two Christchurch mosques, after the number of dead and injured climbed and climbed, New Zealand came to several hard realisations: This is not a peaceful and equitable country." https://www.nzgeo.com/stories/brothers-and-sisters/?source=homepage 

        On what basis is this claim that New Zealand is not a peaceful and equitable country made? What is the evidence?  

        edit: those questions are open to anyone. marty mars will likely only reply with smartarsery again and avoid them.

        • Drowsy M. Kram 6.2.1.1

          Characterising the mass murderer as an "invader" is potentially misleading – he may have 'invaded' places of religious worship, but he came to NZ legally.

          1. Is NZ a peaceful country?  It's certainly 'peaceful' for some.

          2. Is NZ an equitable country?  Less so with each passing day (see answer to Q. 1).

          • vto 6.2.1.1.1

            A foreigner entering the country for the purpose of murder and terrorism is not a legal entry, no. 

            But I don't think the question has been answered – it wasn't "is NZ a peaceful and equitable country?"… it was , in the context of the foreign attack on New Zealanders, "On what basis is this claim that New Zealand is not a peaceful and equitable country made? What is the evidence?  "

            So, what features of the foreign terror attack make it thus? 

            • McFlock 6.2.1.1.1.1

              Except for the actual NZers who aided fucky mcfuckwit by sharing his manifesto and streaming video with others, and requested a "kill counter" to be added to the video.

              Whether or not there were NZers who provided active assistance prior to the act (money, information, advice) is unknown, but we definitely had next-level supporters assisting the PR aspect that every terrorist requires. And then there are the  less active supporters, too.

              So, yeah, it is a NZ problem.

            • Drowsy M. Kram 6.2.1.1.1.2

              Maybe 1% of NZ citizens have been raised in the Muslim faith.

              Vto, you views wiil naturally seem valid from your perspective.  I'm suggesting that for those 1% of citizens, NZ perhaps feels like a less peaceful place after a visitor (who entered NZ legally in 2017) murdered 50 of those 1% in an afternoon.  To be fair, some of the murder victims were probably too young to be devout Muslims, but it was a very calculated act.

              At the risk of making an assumption, I would encourage you to try to examine the events from alternative points of view – walk a mile in their shoes and all that.

              • vto

                Thanks Kram, but I have been viewing the events from the others point of view, and that time spent in said consideration has led to the above questioning… I would encourage others to take up your suggestion and consider it more factually, rather than racing off to conflate anything and everything with the tragedy.

                It was a foreigner who attacked New Zealanders.

                How does that make New Zealanders less peaceful and equitable?

                There is a disconnect going on which has been activated by emotion rather than due consideration.

                • Drowsy M. Kram

                  I accept that most New Zealanders are largely peaceful (although we can each of us have our moments, no?) and probably view NZ as a peaceful, safe country to live in.  I certainly count my lucky stars.

                  It's even possible that the majority of NZers view NZ as an equitable country, although more citizens might contest that view.

                  The NZ Geographic contention appears to be that "New Zealand" is not a peaceful or equitable country.  Based on the events of 15 March 2019 onward, I would really struggle to present the contrary view to those who had partners and/or relatives murdered that day.

                  This was a targetted massacre.  You may cling to the fact that the mass murderer was not raised in NZ, but IMHO it's hazardous to ignore or (worse) deny the racist, violent underbelly in NZ.  Just last Sunday anti-Mulsim propaganda was left on church-goers cars in Palmerston North.

                  "The pamphlet itself uses really extreme language such as 'Islam is the enemy, this is a declaration of war, this is them versus us'," he [Reverend Andy Hickman] said.

                  Is NZ really that peaceful for all?  Is there no room for improvement?

                  If you believe that you have given these questions “due consideration“, then perhaps we can agree to disagree?

                  • vto

                    "This was a targetted massacre" … by a foreigner who came to our shores for that specific purpose.

                    New Zealand is the victim here, not the perpetrator.

                    I am not ‘clinging’ to the terrorist’s foreign status. That is a basic and important fact. The fact you describe it as ‘clinging’ indicates a desire on your part to subjectively view the evidence.

                    If the Australian had committed this act in Australia, would this contention about New Zealand even reach people’s frontal lobes? I dont think so. So how does this foreign attack make New Zealand less peaceful and equitable?

                    • RedLogix

                      It's not even clear that if he had been a New Zealander that he represented us in any meaningful fashion. All the evidence in the public domain strongly suggests he had little to no contact with anyone local, and was radicalised overseas in Europe and the Middle East.

        • marty mars 6.2.1.2

          Your question is idiotic and shows a complete myopic view that doesn't consider the many reported and unreported instances of violence, political, domestic, racial, ethnic, gender based and so on. You seem to be reverting back to your old ways which is sad cos I was liking the new considerate and peaceful vto. You live in a complete bubble I think.

          • vto 6.2.1.2.1

            The question is perfectly legitimate. The Standard requires those making claims to provide evidence in support of their claims. I got banned for not doing such.

            So the question is repeated. What is the evidence?

            • marty mars 6.2.1.2.1.1

              Try going right up to the top of this post and following the wee flowchart – your answer is there.

              • vto

                You are a useless smartarse all the time

              • vto

                You too scared to answer the question? Chicken book book

                • marty mars

                  You ignore the nazis and skinheads in christchurch the white supremacist that ran for mayor twice, the marches – all against others from the 'white' supremacists point of view, they bragged about it and flaunted it. But you, who live in christchurch can't see any evidence, never saw nothing – pull your head out your arse mate, the evidence has been presented for fucken years.

                  • vto

                    Those people exist in every country = not specifically related to the foreigner attacks = not evidence that supports the contention as so succinctly put, without evidence, by NZ Geo above.

                     

                    • marty mars

                      You wrote

                      "After the attack on two Christchurch mosques, after the number of dead and injured climbed and climbed, New Zealand came to several hard realisations: This is not a peaceful and equitable country." https://www.nzgeo.com/stories/brothers-and-sisters/?source=homepage 

                      On what basis is this claim that New Zealand is not a peaceful and equitable country made? What is the evidence? 

                      On the basis of the first part of the sentence – the attack on the mosques in Christchurch are the evidence. The mass murder, by a killer, of a group of New Zealanders at prayer. This is not hard stuff. Do you dispute the evidence or diminish the attacks?

                    • vto

                      That is evidence of an attack by a foreigner on New Zealanders. 

                      How does that make New Zealand less peaceful and equitable? It doesn't.

                      That evidence perhaps shows that New Zealand is less safe than previously perceived because our border controls and domestic laws are useless when it comes to terrifying Australians, but it does not support the contention that New Zealand is less peaceful and equitable.

                      In fact, the opposite should be the contention in light of the outpouring of emotion towards the muslim community in the aftermath.

                      You do understand Marty that it was not a New Zealander who did this don't you

                       

                    • marty mars

                      You are sad and delusional – keep your stupid head in the sand – people like you are the support structure for hate – I hope you're proud of yourself.

                    • vto

                      It is you who is the delusional hater marty mars. All your comments ever have is personal attack. Have a look back at your comments in this thread and count the number of personal comments you have made and then count the number of actual points on the issue you have made. Go on – add them up.

                      dickhead

                    • marty mars

                      yeah play the victim card – you dudes always get to that one lol sadsack

                    • vto

                      Oh and there you go doing it again. What a dick.

                      You need to stop the abuse

              • vto

                The question is repeated

                What is the evidence?

      • BM 6.2.2

        Do you have an issue with white people Mars?

  7. OnceWasTim 7

    Quite obviously, gone are the days of the Dominion reading room of proof readers and sub editors:

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/christchurch-shooting/112374374/police-investigation-into-leaked-watchlist-contradictory-security-analyst-paul-buchanan-says

    (even if most of them were off their faces half the time) 

    “Buchanan also explained tha, mere mention ………….”
    “Stuff chose has chosen not to publish the names of the those on the list.”

  8. alwyn 8

    I have no personal knowledge of what the Brian Tamaki Man Up program does.

    However Hone Harawira does and he claims it really does work. Any chance that Ardern, Robertson, and Davis might just pull their heads in and look at it? Do they really need to simply come out with smart arse comments and refuse to go anywhere near it because they won't get the credit and they don't like Tamaki dissing them?

    Andrew Little at least seems willing to consider it. Why not the others? After all you can hardly accuse Hone of being a National Party mouthpiece can you?

    https://thedailyblog.co.nz/2019/05/01/guest-blog-hone-harawira-kelvin-davis-time-to-man-up/

    • vto 8.1

      Its all a con for Tamaki's political purposes… a trojan horse… to get engagement with current politicians so he can become one himself…

      nothing more

      • alwyn 8.1.1

        Can you please answer the question I brought up?

        Why does Hone say the system works? I am not aware that Hone is trying to get Tamaki to go into politics. I'm not a great fan of Hone's but I believe he really is trying to do something for his people. Ardern, Robertson and Davis show no evidence of any such intention. They are only interested in themselves and in attacking anyone they can't control. Ban anyone who says anything that doesn't flatter them seems to be their style

        • vto 8.1.1.1

          sure alwyn, tho the question was "addressed"…

          I have no idea why Hone would say such, and don't consider it relevant because of Tamaki's political aspirations. Hone seeks headlines as well – maybe that is why he commented, plus the fact that he does do good work for his people, including those the programs are aimed at.

          If a political aspiration is wrapped around Tamaki's deeds and words then it all makes sense, imo

          • alwyn 8.1.1.1.1

            " the question was "addressed"

            My God, vto is unmasked. Who but Trevor Mallard can make a statement like that without even a giggle?

            smiley

            • vto 8.1.1.1.1.1

              no bananas for that one

              i was aping our great leaders, in the hope of exposing their inadequacies and failings

        • Stuart Munro. 8.1.1.2

          It may well work – but assuming without evidence that it is best or even good practice is quite a step. Tamaki will have a chance to establish its benefits and may get to implement a trial. Trying to obtain more on prophetic grounds is also quite a step. Had Ardern et al bought Tamaki's claims at face value I expect you still would not be happy.

    • Cinny 8.2

      tamaki needs to man up with the paperwork.  Interesting that seems to have been overlooked in the link.

      Man up can't even provide the proper documentation by the sounds of it, I heard only one piece of paper was produced.  A government can't analyse a proposal with out the information/documentation.

      If tamaki's program is not copyrighted, then why not create a new improved model of it, without a patched up wanna be christian gang milking running it…..

      Maybe Hone could man up and help brian with the paperwork….

       

    • SPC 8.3

      If it worked the MP would have backed it when they were in coalition with National. 

    • However Hone Harawira does and he claims it really does work. 

      Do you consider Hone Harawira to be a person of excellent judgement and discernment?  Because I don't, and I'd be very surprised if you do.  

      There's also the matter of the Harawiras not having a great history when it comes to dealing with others' mental problems. His opinion on the efficacy of the Man Up programme may actually be of less value than other people's.

      Then there's the documented instances of Man Up "counsellors" telling abusers the violence is their wife's fault for provoking them.  If that "really does work," what is the "work" that's being achieved?

      Any chance that Ardern, Robertson, and Davis might just pull their heads in and look at it?

      Why would they look at it?  There's a process for getting your programme into prisons, and it doesn't involve either standing outside Parliament shouting, or the PM and Minister of Corrections examining your programme to see if they personally think it's a good idea or not.  There's nothing to stop Tamaki following that process, although I doubt his application would get a very welcome reception at Corrections now.  

    • Gabby 8.5

      Maybe Hone could provide a copy of the programme wally. Then they could 'look at it'.

  9. A 9

    Don Brash seeks legal advice after being called out by the Maori Council for inciting racisim and violence. I’m not much of a Maori…lighter skin and disconnected from my culture. Even so I wouldn’t feel comfortable eating dinner with the guy. I find him judgemental, misinformed.

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/112386350/divisive-group-of-haters-in-hobsons-pledge-must-be-investigated-mori-council-says

    Tukaki also said Hobson’s Pledge was “nothing more than a divisive group of haters who would do nothing more than send us all back to the dark ages”.

    “They may wear suits and drive around in late model expensive European cars … but they are nothing more than a gang of misfits that seek to incite hate and divide the country.

    “They should be held to account,” Tukaki said.

    “They’re creating an environment…in which hate is breeding and not just breeding but duplicating and replicating.”

    He said if the lobby group wanted to become a political party it should “go for it” because “then all of your policies will be seen for what they are.”

    Tukaki said the Māori Council was concerned that comments Hobson’s Pledge leaders had made in public constituted “incitement to both violence and racism, hate and the segregation of New Zealand society”.

    Hobsons’ Pledge spokesman Don Brash said claims of racism were “absolutely outrageously stupid” and he was taking legal advice.

    Unfortunately I don’t have faith in our HRC. Do they even care? Are they resourced enough to investigated, or should we start a GoFundMe page?

  10. Incognito 10

    That flow diagram is awesome.

    • AB 10.1

      Yes – very elegant. But it has a logical flaw – if you are being a dick, you mostly can't tell whether you are being a dick of not.

      So as well as YES and NO options, there should be a DON'T KNOW option. The flow from the DON"T KNOW option should return to the question "Are you being a dick?"

      Thus, unwitting dicks are trapped in a potentially endless loop of self-questioning.  The time-consuming anxiety of endless self-analysis might just stop them from being dicks.

      • Incognito 10.1.1

        No, I think many dicks have issues with reading comprehension and they’ll read the question as “do you have a dick?”. The result is the same though: an infinite loop. And that’s how you know somebody is a dick wink

  11. McFlock 11

    Assange gets 50 weeks for skipping bail.

    Probably doesn't make much difference to him – bail might have been hard to get while he works through the US (and possibly revitalised Swedish) extradition case(s).

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