Daily review 16/04/2019

69 comments on “Daily review 16/04/2019 ”

• Comments are now closed

1. Rosemary McDonald 1

   16 April 2019 at 5:46 pm

   Released today….Building System Legislative Reform Programme public consultation

   https://www.mbie.govt.nz/have-your-say/building-system-legislative-reform-programme-public-consultation

   And if reading is not your thing….

   https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=16&v=rvX7MitT1kc

   Seriously though, the consultation paper is 190 pages long, and a cursory scan indicates that prefab housing might just gain well deserved credibility and that the extortionate cost of building materials is not on the list of issues needing sorting.

   MOBIs levy is being reduced.
   • Pat 1.1

     16 April 2019 at 7:05 pm

     site appears unavailable
2. Sacha 2

   16 April 2019 at 6:38 pm

   Shub breathlessly reports that there might be a coup against Bridges, either immediately or in a few months, in caucus or behind closed doors (hang on, do they hold their caucus meetings in a field?), and the “anonymous” leakers from the Nat caucus seem to be fixated on Madame Collins. Hmmm.

   https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2019/04/national-mps-speaking-out-against-leader-simon-bridges.html
   • Dennis Frank 2.1

     16 April 2019 at 6:57 pm

     No smoke without fire. Well, not usually. Since Toby Manhire thought it worth a look, could be there’s a flame a-flickering in caucus: https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/16-04-2019/why-judith-collins-should-be-made-national-leader-and-why-she-shouldnt/

     “Collins is good at media. She can be scathing, she doesn’t equivocate and she’s able to laugh at herself.” Um, perhaps chuckle? Ever so briefly?

     Manhire uses Richard Harman as his springboard: “a leadership spill in the National caucus is growing ever likelier. On his site Politik, Harman wrote that “even now, multiple sources say, [Collins] has the support of just over half the caucus to take the leadership”. Figures in the caucus and wider party had been asking, he said, “questions about Bridges’ political judgement and the judgments of his inner circle”.”

     Gulp. Will be the reaction from Bridges when his staffers report it to him tomorrow (no, of course I don’t rate the technical possibility that they were sufficiently on the ball to get the news to him today).

     Toby ends with this hypothetical: “what if a Collins leadership were to provide an amicable catalyst for a future coalition partner, especially if might in the process sink NZ First?” That kite won’t fly long in current winds. Any such brainstorming would have had to be done last year, and the kite would be flying more decisively already awhile. Timing of any challenge is their huge problem…
     • Sacha 2.1.1

       16 April 2019 at 7:39 pm

       Smart writer, that man. I like this:
       “FOR: The risk of schism”
     • Puckish Rogue 2.1.2

       17 April 2019 at 6:04 am

       Not that its important but shes also saucier than a direct hit on a Heinz tomato sauce factory

       Never underestimate the power of unbridaled, raw sex appeal
   • Stuart Munro. 2.2

     16 April 2019 at 7:09 pm

     Ah but he knows the score
     Yeah he knows it
     And Jude can’t hide it anymore
     She can’t hide it anymore
   • BM 2.3

     16 April 2019 at 7:15 pm

     Collins is a far better choice for leader than Bridges by so many degrees it’s not funny

     1-Takes the women card off the table.
     2-Can criticise Ardern without all the women in NZ thinking “He’s only saying bad
     things about her because she’s a woman!”
     3- Splits the female vote which is heavily in favour of Ardern
     4- First proper Female National leader
     5- Signals that National isn’t run by a group of private boys only school feltchers who consider woman nothing more than baby factories and people who organize dinner parties

     Lots of win there for National if they can get past their ingrained misogyny.
     • A 2.3.1

       16 April 2019 at 7:21 pm

       WTH? Shipley was a proper female leader!

       It will be interesting once JC is installed because she is almost opposite in personality and approach to JA. Still I think JC doesn’t have the capacity to lead. Guess we will see.
       • BM 2.3.1.1

         16 April 2019 at 7:27 pm

         She had to stab Bolger in the back to get a shot at the top job.

         It doesn’t really count, Collins getting selected by caucus and winning the election would be a first for National.
         That would be the start of a new National party.
     • Rosemary McDonald 2.3.2

       16 April 2019 at 7:23 pm

       Yes! Yes! Make Judith Collins the Leader of the National Party!
     • Sacha 2.3.3

       16 April 2019 at 7:52 pm

       “Splits the female vote which is heavily in favour of Ardern”

       You seriously think women will vote based on the two figureheads being women?
       • BM 2.3.3.1

         16 April 2019 at 8:04 pm

         Yes, not all women but a fair chunk.

         It’s just the way females tend to be hard-wired, the default setting is pack animal.
         • Incognito 2.3.3.1.1

           16 April 2019 at 9:19 pm

           It’s just the way humans tend to be hard-wired, the default setting is pack animal.

           FIFY
         • Ankerrawshark 2.3.3.1.2

           16 April 2019 at 9:46 pm

           BM.

           “It’s just the way females tend to be hard wired, the default setting is pack animal…..

           Ridiculous unscientific comment.
     • Peter 2.3.4

       16 April 2019 at 10:11 pm

       I am certain there are males who post sneeringly about the ‘girl’ they see as an incapable leader. The idea of having a ‘young’ woman at the top is what really upsets them.

       They’ll be delighted to have Judith as ‘mum’ in charge. They’ll love the high leather boots, the whip, and her bossing them around. The toughies can’t handle Jacinda.
       • Puckish Rogue 2.3.4.1

         17 April 2019 at 6:06 am

         Awww yeah!
     • Kevin 2.3.5

       17 April 2019 at 10:19 am

       “Signals that National isn’t run by a group of private boys only school feltchers”

       —

       What is it with you right wingers and your fascination for mens arses?
       • Sacha 2.3.5.1

         17 April 2019 at 12:38 pm

         Boarding schools.
3. Muttonbird 3

   16 April 2019 at 7:06 pm

   If the answer is Judith Collins, what the hell was the question?
   • The Al1en 3.1

     16 April 2019 at 9:34 pm

     She’s as popular in her caucus as Cunliffe was in his, and we know how that worked out for him.
     Only a matter of time before the open disloyalty is on show, but as already noted, I don’t think anyone will want to take it on against JA this term.
   • Puckish Rogue 3.2

     17 April 2019 at 6:07 am

     Which MPs sex appeal and beauty is surpassed only by their intelligence, capability and empathy

     Pretty obvious really 🙂
4. A 4

   16 April 2019 at 7:16 pm

   Talking to a friend living in a caravan who is really sick. Needs an actual home but hasn’t been able to get one for over a year. Come to think of it she hasn’t had a real home for over five years.

   When I think of those people trashing HNZ houses it annoys me that my friend, and others are literally left in the cold because of the current “no consequence” policy. Time to admit this was a mistake?
   • swordfish 4.1

     17 April 2019 at 12:33 am

     Entirely Agree.

     My Parents are in their late 80s, they own their house (which they’ve lived in for more than 55 years !) … it’s part of a two-house unit … the other unit (on other side of dividing wall) still being a State House.

     For almost 50 years, they had very nice, quiet elderly / late middle age neighbours. The last 2 neighbouring Tenants, however, (& particularly the current one, by a significant margin) have been absolutely fucking horrendous.

     My Parents are the sort of people who never ever moan or complain about things … they are extremely reasonable, caring & empathetic, they put up with an enormous amount & are always going out of their way to help everyone else … so when they both spontaneously (albeit reluctantly & almost apologetically) mention what they’ve had to put up with on a daily / nightly basis … I immediately knew something really fucking major was happening.

     I won’t go into the details at this point … but HNZ are placing an extremely violent, anti-social, out-of-control element of the Underclass next to Elderly people … who should have a basic bloody right to continue to live in their own home without having to deal with the constant threat of violence, intimidation, enforced chronic sleep deprivation (relentless loud, aggressive, often violent noise throughout the early hours until dawn) and day-in / day-out extreme stress (from both the tenant’s constant aggression / explosions of violence & from the relentless full-on noise of his kids – who are dumped there by his former partner as often as she can get away with it. All in the context of a neighbouring unit with appalling echo-chamber acoustics … and a dividing wall that isn’t even remotely soundproof). It’s a bloody horrendous predicament for them to be forced into,

     The violence & intimidation are clearly the most shocking things (on two occassions my Parents have been forced to seek refuge with neighbours across the road … and on other occasions it’s been a close run thing … the guy’s just inherently violent, seems to have a criminal record, with local Police keeping a close eye on him) … but I can tell you the stress they suffer on an almost daily / nightly basis from the relentless running, banging, slamming, screaming of the kids is really bad … it’s right in their face often all day until very late at night … I mean my Mother’s a former childcare teacher … but even for her it’s just mega-stressful.

     My Partner & I don’t live too far away … so I’ve been monitoring the situation and I can tell you it’s just fucking incomprehensible to me that such an intolerable set up is allowed to exist. Feels like the systematic Use & Abuse of Elderly People. Thrown to the wolves (and by the Party they’ve devoted so much of their lives to).

     Something as mindnumbingly cruel as a No Eviction policy (or close enough to it) for extremely anti-social / violent tenants … can only happen when socially-detached Upper Middle-Class Professionals & Intersectionals – from often highly privileged backgrounds – take over both the activist core and elite parliamentary wings of the Labour Party. It’s an ignorant (& really quite callous) Luvvie Paternalism.

     But then I should realise that the historic role of the Left is no longer to take a universalist approach to human rights and social justice, endeavouring to make everyone’s life better … rather it’s simply to help a small group of remarkably privileged former Woodford House girls wrest power & control from a small group of remarkably privileged former Christ College boys.
     • RedLogix 4.1.1

       17 April 2019 at 6:59 am

       Knowing your voice here for many years I’m convinced of the seriousness of this situation. The system will not you help for all the reasons you so accurately outline. Don’t waste your energy on it.

       As a family you’re going to have to make a plan to get them out of there; if you don’t it will wear your parents down and kill them prematurely. Sorry to be blunt but this is where your attention needs to be.
       • greywarshark 4.1.1.1

         17 April 2019 at 2:07 pm

         The government should have plans for dealing with people who are entirely anti-social. Soppy emotional response to hard problems is unsatisfactory and don’t stop perpetrators’ bad behaviour; containment should be available, and for the worst it may be necessary to have borstals again, with basic standards, an ordered life, some work and skills earned and they be offered an attempt at habilitation; it is something that can’t be forced.
         Luvvie paternalism could work in this case – doing the only thing that one
         can do with those who have abandoned themselves, lost their souls, stewed their brains, and who are habitually violent, angry with no self-control.

         Shoving them in houses privately provided under leasing schemes appears a way out for government to abrogate responsibility. People at unskilled and semi-skilled levto be el have been left dangling with their jobs have crushed by imports from overseas, or a lack of training, or promise of work for those who get a reasonable level of schooling. So they fill time in smoking, drinking and drugging to fill in their days between the irregular jobs without hope for better and just turn nasty. People can deteriorate like meat left in the sun,till it is so unpleasant that nobody wants it.

         I have just started reading Lynley Hood’s concentrated analysis of the case against Peter Ellis in Christchurch years ago. It seemed clear when looked at dispassionately, that the Judges had been bent out of shape by a sort of Luvvie Paternalism. The precedents that they had once for checking for factual and practical aspects of evidence had been put aside on the basis that children hadn’t been treated fairly and properly when it came to evidence; having been dismissed as unreliable too often. Now, it appeared there was credence for everything they said.

         From one extreme to another the practice had gone, without regard of consequences. It showed a lack of balance, and dropped standards.
         These were abandoned in favour of understanding and making up for past wrongs. There seems a lack of willingness to get real and face the people who have problems that the public purse becomes forced to remedy when
         people have almost gone too far. If only the experts and academics with practical ideas got listened to when the parents and children are all young, and the older people who understand them could guide them with the proper aid and respect of government for those who were successful in this.
       • swordfish 4.1.1.2

         21 April 2019 at 6:09 am

         Thanks, Red. I really appreciate that.

         After 55 years, they are very wedded to the place (particularly my Mother … my Father's an Aussie who, deep down, always wanted to return to the Lucky Country but has slowly reconciled himself to remaining in "the Shaky Isles"). They also have a wider support network of neighbours & friends in the area (their long-term neighbours across the road have been brilliant & have called the police on their behalf on several occasions).

         And it's by no means a depressing or unattractive suburb. Hills/Beaches/Sea … arguably one of the more attractive & liveable lower income areas in the Country. Their street is very well established, most houses have trees / a lot of greenery in front yard and so on … about 80% Privately-owned / 20% pepper-potted Social housing … and they have beautiful sea views out to the South Island. So they've been very happy there … until very recently.

         And, of course, as Age Concern chief executive Stephanie Clare emphasised in the Listener a few weeks back,

         Older people have the right to stay in the home they have grown into and to be cared for in the homes they love

         In the same article, Ruth Nichol cited a range of scholarly literature to argue that elderly people who continue to live in their own house generally have much happier and healthier outcomes (all in line with the Country's Positive Ageing Strategy).

         So, you know, I don't give up without a fight. When this violent, sadistic, malevolent little prick was being born in the early 90s, my Parents would've already been living there for about 30 years … I'll be fucked if I'm just going to allow him to turn up, make their life hell, and force them out. It's not right (quite apart from the question of just who is going to buy a house with that kind of in-your-face noise and malevolent atmosphere nextdoor … Maybe HNZ has some sort of cunning Baldrick-like plan to buy up private neighbouring units at bargain basement prices ?)
         

         So, I really feel like publicising this and putting as much pressure as possible on HNZ (& MSD) to do the right thing. Sunlight as the best disinfectant. I might start by laying out some of the more shocking details on my Blog, then move on to contacting local Media. Local City Councillors, Age Concern, Retirement Commission … I'm not against shaming a few hypocrites who need to be shamed.

         But I hear what you're saying: essentially hopeless cause / naive to think otherwise / just prolonging the agony.

         I'll just have to try and get it sorted as quickly as poss … if worst comes to worst, I'll encourage them to move. Can't force them though and don't want to. It'll have to be their decision … they're not too far off 90 … but still as mentally alert as ever.

         Pisses me off so much. Both of them still grieving over the death of my older brother in 2016, both have undergone major surgery for bowel cancer in the last 5 years … then just callously thrown to the wolves.
         • RedLogix 4.1.1.2.1

           21 April 2019 at 6:24 am

           I had all those thoughts too, we lived just up the road in Tawa for many years and I know the area you indicate well. Every reason not to want to move, and if you're going to into battle for them I absolutely wish you the best with it.

           Still if you're going to do that, make sure you have a solid Plan B and a clear cut idea of what the threshold of tolerable is. That will give everyone a sense of control and the sense that you are doing things on your terms not theirs.
           • swordfish 4.1.1.2.1.1

             22 April 2019 at 9:31 am

             Sound advice. Thanks, Red. Always appreciate your very solid, feet-on-the-ground approach … anchored in realism and universalism – rather than the highly selective morality / ethics / empathy of some. Cheers.
     • Graeme 4.1.2

       17 April 2019 at 7:26 am

       My mother was in a similar situation in West Auckland. Same thing, HNZ unit through the wall and all good, actually really good, up until 10 years ago. Over 3 or 4 years and a succession of tenants it got to a point where Mum’s health, physical and mental, was in a very bad place. HNZ had no interest at all, your problem.

       Fortunately we were able to get mum out of there and build a unit on our property for her, wasn’t easy, but Mum’s come out of it really well. The town planning side of building the unit was tricky, but a logical argument to council got a non-compliant application through quite easily and with out consultants.
       • swordfish 4.1.2.1

         21 April 2019 at 5:43 am

         Thanks, Graeme. Sounds very similar … almost identical situation … and pretty similar timing.

         Glad to hear your mother's recovered from what sounds like an awful ordeal. But it must still be a bit upsetting for her to have been (for all practical purposes) forced out of her home through absolutely no fault of her own. Some anti-social little shit just gets to come in, take over, and destroy her quality of life. It's so fucking wrong that this is allowed to even remotely happen. Really rough-as-guts, out of control people who have absolutely no boundaries or social norms, treat 3am as if it's 3pm, innately violent impulses … get to just suddenly turn up, call the shots and ride roughshod at will. They have 100% of the rights, zero consequences, your Parent(s) have no rights at all.

         I mean reasonable sleep, safety from violence & relaxation in your own home … especially for older people … should be a fundamental human right. HNZ Tenancies need to be contingent on tenants respecting those basic rights of their neighbours … and if they don't over a prolonged period then OUT.

         I certainly wouldn't be opposed to the State forcing one or two prominent, well-healed, Intersectionals on the 'Left' (increasingly, I'm thinking this particular faction comprises an elitist, self-interested Faux Left) to live in the sort of intolerable situation your / my Parent(s) have had to endure … maybe every day & night for a year or two … might just lead to a little less ostentatious virtue-signalling, less paternalistic romanticisation / sacralization of particular demographics, less of a tendency to adopt the role of heroic Rescuer in a housing context & social situation that they're completely bloody ignorant of … and, who knows, maybe even a little less obsessive focus on 'microaggression' and a little more focus on the rather more pressing MACROaggression
     • Sacha 4.1.3

       17 April 2019 at 12:41 pm

       “an ignorant (& really quite callous) Luvvie Paternalism”

       Good description. Sorry to hear about your folks.
       • swordfish 4.1.3.1

         21 April 2019 at 4:53 am

         Cheers, Sacha … appreciate your support.
     • Grant 4.1.4

       17 April 2019 at 1:11 pm

       I wish I could have written your last two paragraphs.
       • swordfish 4.1.4.1

         21 April 2019 at 4:59 am

         Born of anger
5. Muttonbird 5

   16 April 2019 at 7:45 pm

   What’s going on here?

   Did Bob Jones lift his skeletal frame out of the lazy-boy in order to tear down tax fairness?

   https://i.stuff.co.nz/business/112077063/billboard-promoting-tax-fairness-removed-without-permission
6. reason 6

   16 April 2019 at 7:47 pm

   TRP …… Anyone can use google …. but I have trouble searching The Standard site and could not find the Link that The Al1en was selectively misrepresenting, … and James was tag teaming him with …. with ‘ rape apologist’ insults at me.

   I found it now https://thestandard.org.nz/julian-assange-journeys-end/#comment-1505841

   While I was Abused, discredited …. and goaded …. I note you never provided the link either …. yet TRP asks me for an apology ? …. For something I summarized ( I had no link ), and the Al1en pretended I’d quoted ver-batum

   You’ll note when I paraphrased your / TRP s, ‘ You were rude to me ‘, statement I did not use direct quotation marks …. this is because I could not find the thread.

   The Al1en however did use exact quote marks” ” …. claiming I was quoting you ver batum. ….. was he being dishonest? … probably .

   But ‘ you were rude / rude to me ‘ was exactly your message …. and excuse,,, to set The Al1ens dishonest and survivor / victim abuse stand .
   ” [Given that you’d normally be banned for calling an author an arsehole, I think you should take the same charitable approach to al1en’s reply.”

   I’m very disappointed you’ve let victim denial and abuse go unchecked against me in your thread ….. and then expect I should apologized to you.

   You’ve got as much as an apology as you will ever get out of me ……

   In the post of mine …. you used to ban me with.
   • The Al1en 6.1

     16 April 2019 at 7:53 pm

     Bollocks to “selectively misrepresenting”.
     All quotes I made can all be found in the very old thread, and whatever you wrote the other day.
     Lying is just sad, as it trying to get out of it.
     Give it up.

     https://thestandard.org.nz/julian-assange-journeys-end/
     • Andre 6.1.1

       16 April 2019 at 8:02 pm

       To get it to link directly to the comment you need to embed the link. Instructions are on the FAQ page, then click the link for How do I put links in comments cleanly. There’s the whole palaver of a href= and you have to have the quote marks and stuff (and just one space) but it works in the end.
       • The Al1en 6.1.1.1

         16 April 2019 at 8:08 pm

         Thanks, but it’ll do as it is. Good to note for future ref.
         • Andre 6.1.1.1.1

           16 April 2019 at 8:14 pm

           Looking at (un)reason’s rant, it might also work if the link is part of a sentence like this https://thestandard.org.nz/daily-review-16-04-2019/#comment-1608499 instead of separating it with an enter like it’s a new paragraph.

           edit: yup, seems to be leaving the link complete instead of deleting the hash and comment number after it.
           • The Al1en 6.1.1.1.1.1

             16 April 2019 at 8:25 pm

             Well I might have to use it because the allegation that “The Al1en however did use exact quote marks” ” …. claiming I was quoting you ver batum. ….. was he being dishonest? … probably .” is just more bull shit.

             In the recent thread, any instance of ” ‘Yup … you were rude to me.” has been from a quote from that days thread, such as…

             The Al1en …
             14 April 2019 at 3:41 pm
             “I asked TRP if he was going to let that stand …… his reply ‘Yup … you were rude to me.”

             I’ve directly quoted from the posts in that thread. Nowhere in the exchange did TRP ever write ‘Yup … you were rude to me.
             That’s a lie, isn’t it?

             The Al1en …
             14 April 2019 at 4:14 pm
             I’ve quoted directly from the thread. No argument from me. It’s black and white.

             “I asked TRP if he was going to let that stand …… his reply ‘Yup … you were rude to me.”

             That was never posted in the whole exchange. Link to it.

             The Al1en 3.1.4.2.1.1
             14 April 2019 at 5:02 pm
             Find your own thread. I did. Maybe you can too. But I can tell you for sure there’s no “I asked TRP if he was going to let that stand …… his reply ‘Yup … you were rude to me.” in there.

             As for all the ban crap, Since last July I’ve had exchanges with reason. At no time has this been mentioned before. 🙄
             • Muttonbird …

               16 April 2019 at 8:42 pm

               Get a room, you two. This is boring.
               • The Al1en …

                 16 April 2019 at 8:52 pm

                 Yeah, but definitely not the same one Shane Jones had. Eeeewww

                 But seriously, what should I do? What’s the consensus here?
                 Should I rebut the reaching lies from reason, or just ignore it and accept it for what it is – Another internet troll with a grudge?
                 • McFlock …

                   16 April 2019 at 9:19 pm

                   After a while, shit gets circular, and reason is to incoherent to actually provide any laughs by contradicting themself or suddenly not understanding basic English. Just my opinion.

                   I suspect that reason feels aggrieved because double quotes got put around what they originally used single quotes for, but frankly their summary (“yup” etc) is so far off the mark of what the mod note said as to be a damned lie anyway.

                   But “lie” implies that they don’t have an honest delusion that what they thought they remembered reading is actually what was on the screen in the first place.
                   • The Al1en …

                     16 April 2019 at 9:29 pm

                     I hear you, though as the quotes above show, With that ‘yup’ line, I was quoting from the recent thread and at no time put quote marks around reason’s ‘yup’ summary. Aggrieved, or not, it’s totally misplaced in this case, and yes, far off what was actually said as to be a damn lie.

                     The point about it being a lie and delusion, is after I posted in this thread, where all the info was available, reason reposted the same crud in the recent assange topic. It’s like it didn’t happen.
                     I call that completely untruthful and malicious in intent.

                     In that thread I wrote my conscience is clear, and it still is.

                     I think I’ll just leave it. It’s all out there.
                   • McFlock …

                     16 April 2019 at 9:33 pm

                     No worries. Cray-cray be cray-cray, in the patois of the street 😉
                   • The Al1en …

                     16 April 2019 at 9:35 pm

                     Thing is, if he’s not Phil, then I really would apologise for last July. That’s a terrible insult for anyone. 😉
                   • McFlock …

                     16 April 2019 at 9:45 pm

                     Maybe it’s more that there is a timeless ur-phil that naturally populates pols blogs, rather than a single phil ure 🙂
                   • The Al1en …

                     16 April 2019 at 9:49 pm

                     Scary thought, but probably true.
                 • gsays …

                   17 April 2019 at 8:34 am

                   ‘what should I do.?’
                   Since you asked.
                   reason said they were sexually abused.
                   You could show some compassion and empathy and back away.
                   Stop trying to be right and do the correct thing.

                   When the Prime Minister asks for kindness, it’s not just for people you like.
   • BM 6.2

     16 April 2019 at 8:23 pm

     Jesus, Phil get a fucking grip.

     if there’s one stand out reason why weed shouldn’t be legalised, it’s YOU.
     • greywarshark 6.2.1

       16 April 2019 at 9:27 pm

       Who is Phil?
       • joe90 6.2.1.1

         16 April 2019 at 11:02 pm

         Phil’s a long time commenter on NZ blogs with a thing for ellipses.
         But I don’t think it is Phil because despite his ellipses and weird AF syntax, Phil’s screeds make sense.
7. Andre 7

   16 April 2019 at 7:51 pm

   Y’know, we all missed a very important detail in Barr’s 4 page whitewash of Mueller’s report. In particular, in Mueller’s line ‘[T]he investigation did not establish that members of the Trump Campaign conspired or coordinated with the Russian government in its election interference activities.’

   [T]he???? What exactly was the word that came before that [T]he? Perhaps it was ‘Although’ ?

   https://www.huffpost.com/entry/george-conway-william-barr-mueller-report_n_5cb3f09be4b098b9a2d5a0ef
   • Sacha 7.1

     16 April 2019 at 8:04 pm

     “It would be ridiculous to claim that t[he] …”
8. joe90 8

   16 April 2019 at 8:38 pm

   Wingnut fight!

   https://twitter.com/gatewaypundit/status/1117907874519240704
9. Pat 9

   16 April 2019 at 8:41 pm

   “As the environmental crisis accelerates, and as protest movements like YouthStrike4Climate and Extinction Rebellion make it harder not to see what we face, people discover more inventive means of shutting their eyes and shedding responsibility. Underlying these excuses is a deep-rooted belief that if we really are in trouble, someone somewhere will come to our rescue: “they” won’t let it happen. But there is no they, just us.”

   https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/apr/15/rebellion-prevent-ecological-apocalypse-civil-disobedience

   “This is less daunting than we might imagine. As Erica Chenoweth’s historical research reveals, for a peaceful mass movement to succeed, a maximum of 3.5% of the population needs to mobilise. Humans are ultra-social mammals, constantly if subliminally aware of shifting social currents. Once we perceive that the status quo has changed, we flip suddenly from support for one state of being to support for another. When a committed and vocal 3.5% unites behind the demand for a new system, the social avalanche that follows becomes irresistible.”

   Only 3.5%….I thought it was 15%, and that always made me realise how precarious our ordered lives were
   • Dennis Frank 9.1

     16 April 2019 at 9:43 pm

     Good stuff, here’s the guts: “I collected data on all major nonviolent and violent campaigns for the overthrow of a government or territorial liberation since 1900. The data cover the entire world and include every known campaign that consists of at least a thousand observed participants, which constitutes hundreds of cases.”

     “Then I analyzed the data, and the results blew me away. From 1900 to 2006, nonviolent campaigns worldwide were twice as likely to succeed outright as violent insurgencies. And there’s more. This trend has been increasing over time—in the last fifty years civil resistance has become increasingly frequent and effective, whereas violent insurgencies have become increasingly rare and unsuccessful. This is true even in extremely repressive, authoritarian conditions where we might expect nonviolent resistance to fail.”

     “In fact, no campaigns failed once they’d achieved the active and sustained participation of just 3.5% of the population—and lots of them succeeded with far less than that”. Keywords are “active and sustained”.

     Teams are active and sustained while playing. Task-forces are active and sustained until they produce the output designed for. Forget political parties – few members are ever able to sustain activity. Only one way for a mass movement to succeed in making the world a better place: ensure that it forms more than 3.5% of global population, and contract those members to sustain their collaborative endeavour until their goal is achieved.
     • Pat 9.1.1

       16 April 2019 at 10:28 pm

       175000 New Zealanders…not so many
       • greywarshark 9.1.1.1

         17 April 2019 at 1:07 pm

         Trying to fill a hall over something that deserves consideration but hasn’t reached enough people’s anxiety trigger point or pocket indicates that a relatively small number of determined people in NZ with good planning and strategies could do much.

         How many men to spread the unsettling word around that the NZ$ was to be devalued which started the capital flight?

         John Roughan’s 2005 NZ Herald backgrounder:
         https://www.nzherald.co.nz/john-roughan/news/article.cfm?a_id=5&objectid=3576219
         In 1984 David Lange’s … theme – ironically, it would turn out – was about “bringing the country together”, dispelling the nastiness of the Muldoon years and returning to the politics of consensus.
         It was a message borrowed wholesale from the Australian Labor Party’s successful campaign the previous year. Like Bob Hawke, Lange was carefully dressed in authoritative dark suits and Labour promised nothing more than to copy the ALP’s “economic summit conference”.

         But behind the warm rhetoric, something else was happening. Word was around the business world that Labour’s finance spokesman, Roger Douglas, favoured devaluing the dollar, as the ALP had done.
         The more likely Labour’s victory became, the more dollars were sold. And since the currency had to be traded at a fixed rate through the Reserve Bank, the flight from the dollar rapidly depleted the bank’s foreign currency reserves….

         Before the day was out Muldoon capitulated. The dollar was devalued by 20 per cent and the exchange re-opened. But the dye was cast. The fourth Labour Government had been hijacked by the crisis.
         And far more importantly, the extraordinary sequence of events had given the public a sharpened sense of the economy’s fragility, creating a climate receptive as never before to drastic change…

         There were advocates of those [neoliberal economic] policies within the conservative governments of New Zealand and Australia in the early 1980s. Derek Quigley, Ian McLean, George Gair, Hugh Templeton and Jim McLay were among those doing what they could to liberalise the economy in the Muldoon years, and they had some achievements.
         

         How many in a Labour government ostensibly with goodwill towards the ordinary working man and woman?
         Tim Shadbolt in 2015 names the few men who gained the most notoriety and set smugly enjoying some element of leadership in the eyes of the pragrmatic and comfortably off:
         https://www.stuff.co.nz/southland-times/opinion/73077140/null
         But lurking in the shadows, behind the euphoria of our Kiwi Spring,
         was Roger Douglas, Richard Prebble, Michael Bassett, Mike Moore and almost the entire Auckland University, Princess St branch of the New Zealand Labour Party who were about 200km to the right of the National Party. They called themselves “the fish and chip brigade”. A name that sounded working class but was yet another disguise for this bunch of ruthless, well-educated right wing revolutionaries.
10. reason 10

    16 April 2019 at 9:31 pm

    Here s the thing ….

    Gummy Bear posting involves the tactic to keep pushing your argument while ignoring personal attacks …. even ones abusing and calling you dishonest over your sexual abuse survivor / victims status ……….. Like The Al1en does ,,,, and TRP allows him to

    With The L1ar AL1en …. If it was anyone other poster in the world apart from Phil Ure ….

    Would he not have called them a spreader of fucking lies … and Faux Bullshit ?

    Really ??

    I may think the L1ar Al1en is standing on liquid ground ….

    Anyway back to more evidence …. and discrediting the political use of rape allegations against wikileaks

    Gummy bear styles 🙂

    https://thestandard.org.nz/julian-assange-journeys-end/#comment-1505777
    • James 10.1

      16 April 2019 at 9:50 pm

      If you want people to stop thinking of you as a rape apologist- stop making excuses for a rapist.

      He is accused of doing the crime by real victims they deserve their day in court.
      • reason 10.1.1

        16 April 2019 at 10:09 pm

        ….Who used sleazy rape culture posts to diminish the woman involved in the waikato cheifs sexual assault controversy.

        ….Who uses and advocates for the lawless rapey company ‘uber’.

        ….who advocated for public toilet sex … he did this when defending some other over-sexed rugby player.

        ….who thought it fair enough Oxfam should lose funding ……… for two sacked workers who allegedly used prostitutes

        ….He who who called right wing Brazilian leader and rape celebrator Jair Bolsonaro “charismatic”

        James ….Who ran around with glee …. trying to smear Labour as ‘rape apologists’ …. over a drunk committing assults at a Labour youth event …

        And has run around the Assange thread.. trying to label everyone ‘rape apologists’…

        lets have a laugh at the Tory party and bbc James …. David cameron 5 mins 😉
        • James 10.1.1.1

          16 April 2019 at 10:26 pm

          nothing You posted takes away the fact you are a rape apologist.

          Own it reason.
          • reason 10.1.1.1.1

            16 April 2019 at 10:33 pm

            James ….Who used sleazy rape culture posts to diminish the woman involved in the waikato cheifs sexual assault controversy….

            Women posters and authors left this site over that … and roast busters … and other bits of NZ culture … that james usually joined in and posted in a rapey way in

            Own it Jair James

            David Cameron 20 mins to 25 mins in the Frankie Boyle vid 🙂

            funny stuff 🙂 ;0 🙂

            [You were put on notice the other day to show some restraint in your comments. You’ve ignored that advice. Banned till May 1. TRP]
            • WeTheBleeple 10.1.1.1.1.1

              17 April 2019 at 6:32 am

              To be fair James has delighted in poking the bear continuously and will now be crowing over his days of deliberate provocation.

              You could do a far better job, or is this the controversy TS seeks – listening to James shit talk, followed by people saying, you talk shit.

              Stunning media.
              • James …

                17 April 2019 at 7:34 am

                In fairness I was ignoring reasons post /incoherent rants until they started writing comments about me and I had nothing to do with it.
    • The Al1en 10.2

      16 April 2019 at 9:54 pm

      “I may think the L1ar Al1en is standing on liquid ground ….”

      lol

• Comments are now closed

• Log in
• Donate
• Contribute post

• Articles RSS