Kiwis feel worse off after Nat tax swindle

Written By: - Date published: 9:43 am, November 22nd, 2010 - 22 comments
Categories: polls, tax - Tags:

A new Horizon poll shows that the vast majority of Kiwis at all incomes level, but especially low-income families, feel worse off after the Nats’ October 1 tax swindle. John Key claimed the vast bulk of us would be better off but clearly we aren’t; shuffling money around and giving more to the rich leaves the rest of us with less.

Here’s the ODT’s summary of results:

More people are unhappy with tax changes than are pleased, a new poll shows.

On October 1, the Government increased GST from 12.5 percent to 15 percent, increased benefits and reduced personal income tax rates.

A nationwide HorizonPoll survey of 1558 people between November 16 and 19 found 8.2 percent of those surveyed felt better off because of the changes while 53.5 percent thought they were worse off.

A substantial group, 35.6 percent, felt their situation was unchanged.

Of lower income households, 71.5 percent earning less than $20,000 a year felt worse off while 60 percent of those earning between $20,000 and $30,000 felt the same.

Among households earning between $100,001 and $150,000, 39.3 percent a year felt worse off (19.6 percent better off) and 53.2 percent of those in households with incomes $200,000 plus felt worse off (24.6 percent better off).

Of households earning $30,000 to $50,000, 5.5 percent felt better off, 54.3 percent worse off.

Among middle income households earning $50,001 to $70,000 a year 11 percent felt better off, 45.9 percent worse off.

Young and elderly people felt better off — 18 to 24 year-olds had the highest better-off result at 11.2 percent, followed by those aged 65-74 years (9.5 percent). Among 24 to 34 year-olds 4.3 percent felt better off, the lowest score.

Among National voters, 14.9 percent felt better off, 44.6 percent were neutral and 37.3 percent said they were worse off.

Of Labour voters, 4.2 percent feel better off, 30.4 percent neither better nor worse and 62.9 percent worse off.

The question now: what are National going to do next year? Tax cuts are the one entry in their policy play book. The tax cuts they promise at the next election (and they will promise tax cuts) will not only be unaffordable, they will be more of the same, which Kiwis have found leaves them worse off.

22 comments on “Kiwis feel worse off after Nat tax swindle”

  1. aj 1

    They had to borrow to put these first cuts in place.

    “North of $50” – Yeah, right

  2. Lanthanide 2

    “Among National voters, 14.9 percent felt better off, 44.6 percent were neutral and 37.3 percent said they were worse off.

    Of Labour voters, 4.2 percent feel better off, 30.4 percent neither better nor worse and 62.9 percent worse off.”

    It’d be nice to see this data controlled for incomes, to see if your political bias determines how you feel about extra cash in your back pocket.

    I guess you could explain such a difference as Labour voters being more critical and discriminating as they disagree with the idea, whereas National voters would tend to ‘go with the flow’ and not question the increase, rather than simply saying that “Labour voters instinctively disagree with anything National does, even if it actually benefits them”.

    • Bright Red 2.1

      although that is a pretty justifible instinct, going from history.

    • Bazar 2.2

      You could guess what the differance is by many things, but without any data, its just guessing and/or wishful thinking.

      I’d say its that labour supporters that are feeling the recession the hardest, so since the tax changes, things have degraded rather then improved.

      Or that its national that are the most pragmatic about the future of our country and can see that the tax changes helped level the playing field between those that avoid taxes using trust accounts, and those that don’t.

      And i’m sure someone will come in and “correct” me, but there is little solid data in that survey. Just two facts.
      That most people think they are worse off, and that who you vote for greatly affects your bais.

      • Lanthanide 2.2.1

        “I’d say its that labour supporters that are feeling the recession the hardest, so since the tax changes, things have degraded rather then improved.”

        That’s why I said the income should be controlled, so that the only main variable is who you vote for. In general there’s no reason that someone who votes labour on $60k and someone who votes national on $60k should somehow have a difference in “feeling the recession”.

        “Or that its national that are the most pragmatic about the future of our country and can see that the tax changes helped level the playing field between those that avoid taxes using trust accounts, and those that don’t.”
        They did that by lowering the trust tax rate to 28% and the top tax rate to 33%, thereby still leaving a 5% window between trusts and not-trusts? How is that levelling the playing field? Sure, it’s smaller than the 8% gap between 30 and 38, but it’s still significant enough to put your assets in trusts (or keep them there if they are already).

    • Vicky32 2.3

      I actually took part in this poll if it’s the Horizon one) and yes, they asked about incomes. I am a Labour voter and I certainly haven’t benefitted, it’s that simple… There’s no connection between the two things. If I were better off, I would have said so. Honesty is an important value for me.
      Deb

    • bbfloyd 2.4

      the old “we would do it, so they would too” assumption again…… along the way, insulting the integrity of people you will never know.. can’t even call it dissembling…. i suppose someone had to try it though…

  3. Craig Glen Eden 3

    But But you mean tax cuts are not the panacea to my financial ills? Oh no John Key was lying when he said the vast majority of Nzers would be better off under National. What about closing the wage gap with Australia surely they are doing that ? No . What about that cycle way ? No nothing. What about GDP and the Government debt levels, no they are all going in the wrong direction to.

    Oh hang on what about improved transparency openess and accountability in Government you know no more outrageous housing and travel perks for Government Ministers.No

    Oh I feel let down I really do!

    Anti spam word “wine” where’s my bottle John

  4. tc 4

    As beatson exposed this with a simple question to Blinglish “what research have you done around the middle/lower income groups to analyse the impact of GST rise V tax cuts..”
    Blinglish ” we haven’t done any..”
    Beatson ” so how do you know they’ll be better off ?…”

    It’s not only that they don’t know but more to the point they don’t care or give a F….you’d do some analysis if you did and prove you’ve thought it through otherwise……a relentless focus on looking after our rich mates is the only message coming from the nat’s.

  5. Colonial Viper 5

    Tax cuts to fund your personal life style is like debt to fund your personal lifestyle. You MIGHT live like you are better off, but you’re just kicking the can a bit down the road and hiding from the fact that your income hasn’t actually increased.

    And NACT have no idea how to increase real incomes in NZ. (In fact for many they seem to be doing the opposite). So lets be clear here: people aren’t leaving NZ for Oz because they have lower taxes In Australia, but because they have higher incomes over there. Bill and John have absolutely no reply to that, and no credible plan for a reply. National are rudderless and directionless.

  6. Fisiani 6

    Feeling worse off is not the same as actually being worse off. Every taxpayer is taking home more money and prices have risen by far less than the anticipated one off 2.2% rise from GST.
    This opinion poll is not based on the reality of better incomes for everyone it is just opinion. Opinions are often wrong. Like for instance the opinion that the 7% swing to National in Mana was a great success for Labour……….

    • Colonial Viper 6.1

      Lolz you sound like a doctor saying to a patient: you’re fit and well, don’t complain to me that you are feeling sick, what would you know, you’re just the patient!

    • bbfloyd 6.2

      Fisi…even for you that was lame… you’re starting to sound shrill.

      i took part in the poll as well.. it was quite comprehensive, and very wide ranging.. i would be interested in seeing the total results.. i think they would make interesting reading.

    • Craig Glen Eden 6.3

      No swing to National Fisinai National got less votes than last time. Key spent a lot of time in the electorate so probably cost her votes?
      Or was it just that less people actually voted for both parties but Chris got 1080 more votes than Lady Gardner. But I have to agree with you about opinion polls apparently they say that the majority of people think Keys a good PM, the reality says he promises heaps and delivers bugger all (Smile and Wave).

      But hey we shouldn’t expect to much from a guy who feels like a winner when his Party has just lost. So aspirational!

      Anti spam word Lazy yup!

    • Lanthanide 6.4

      “Feeling worse off is not the same as actually being worse off.”
      And making crap up is not the same as having actual facts to back up your statements.

      “Every taxpayer is taking home more money”
      Prove it.

      “and prices have risen by far less than the anticipated one off 2.2% rise from GST.”
      Prove it.

    • Daveosaurus 6.5

      “Every taxpayer is taking home more money”

      Mere sophistry. I pay a higher percentage of my income in tax this year than I did at this time last year, therefore my taxes have gone up.

      Thanks a bunch, High Tax National.

      • Colonial Viper 6.5.1

        Dave-O its your own fault for not having an annual income >$150K p.a. I hear that group did OK tax wise under National.

    • KJT 6.6

      Prices of food and necessities have risen by a lot more than 2.2% over the last few months. Of course the CPI is fiddled with luxuries added and some things excluded to show price inflation as lower than reality.

      If you are buying cars and flat screen TV’s you may be better off. For everyone else who just buys groceries we are much worse off. 0 to 2% pay increases mean another year where median wages are lagging further behind price inflation.

      • Draco T Bastard 6.6.1

        Prices of food and necessities have risen by a lot more than 2.2% over the last few months.

        Yep, prices of food have been doing nasty things since the recession began and wages began falling.

  7. Maui 7

    We could convert members of unviable industries into currency traders. 600,000 Japanese housewives reputedly trade currencies every day to make ends meet, but I have yet to see the evidence.

  8. AB 8

    What looks like a full tables of results on this survey is published by HorizonPoll at
    http://www.horizonpoll.co.nz/page/72/more-than-half-say-they-are-worse-off-after-major-tax-reform

  9. kriswgtn 9

    Our household food spending has gone up $20 a week and we havent added anything extra
    youre a thief and a liar Donkey

    better off – nah hes better off more like

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    Scottish appeal court judges have declared that Boris Johnson’s decision to suspend parliament in the run-up to the October Brexit deadline is unlawful. The three judges, chaired by Lord Carloway, Scotland’s most senior judge, overturned an earlier ruling that the courts did not have the powers to interfere in the prime ...
    1 week ago
  • Let me explain what I meant by Everyday New Zealanders
    By Simon Bridges. The following is a press release from the office of Simon Bridges, leader of The National Party. Key ora, New Zealand. Happy Maori Language Week. Look, I’m writing to you today because I want to clear something up. There’s been a lot of kerfuffle around some things ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • Yes, the SIS is subject to the Public Records Act
    I understand there's some stuff going round about how the SIS "was removed from the list of public offices covered by the Public Records Act in 2017". The context of course being their records derived from US torture, which will be disposed of or sealed. The good news is that ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • An evidence-based discussion of the Canadian fluoride/IQ study
    Dr. Christopher Labos and Jonathan Jarry discuss the recent Canadian fluoride/IQ research. They provide an expert analysis of the paper and its problems. Click on image to go to podcast. The critical debate about the recent ...
    1 week ago
  • Climate Change: Australia in denial
    Australia is burning down again, and meanwhile its natural disaster minister is denying climate change:Australia’s minister responsible for drought and natural disasters, David Littleproud, has said that he doesn’t “know if climate change is manmade”. Clarifying earlier comments that the question is “irrelevant” when considering the Coalition government’s response to ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Philippines activist speaking on the Duterte tyranny
    Auckland Philippines Solidarity is excited to host Professor Judy Taguiwalo for a speaking tour of NZ in September. She is a well-known activist in the Philippines and was a political prisoner under the Marcos dictatorship. Professor Taguiwalo briefly served as a Cabinet member under President Duterte but was forced from ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • Disgust
    I have no special insights to offer on the Labour sexual assault coverup. All I have is disgust. Disgust that an organisation could fail its people so badly. Disgust that they punished the victims rather than the perpetrator. Disgust that its party hacks are apparently blaming the victims for demanding ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Speak Up for Women calls out Greens’ censorship
    This open letter to the Green Party was penned after an opinion piece by Jill Abigail, a feminist and founding member of the party, was censored by the Greens’ leadership. (Redline has reprinted her article here).The intolerance of the Green Party leaders and their acceptance of the misogyny of gender ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • Member’s Day: End of Life Choice, part 3
    Today is a Member's day, and David Seymour's End of Life Choice Bill continues its slow crawl through its committee stage. They're spending the whole day on it today, though the first hour is likely to be spent on voting left over from last time. After that they'll move on ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Flight to Los Angeles turned back after passengers decide they don’t want to go anymore
    An ambitious plan to fly to Los Angeles petered out into a brief sight-seeing trip and a desire to return home and get some sleep before work tomorrow. Air New Zealand has confirmed a flight to Los Angeles last night was turned back about a quarter of the way into ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago
  • Indigenous Futures: defuturing and futuring – an analytical framework for policy development?
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    EllipsisterBy Ellipsister
    2 weeks ago
  • Cadbury rumoured to be releasing the Pineapple Trump
    Here’s another novelty chocolate to shove in your gob, New Zealand Cadbury could be seeking to make itself great again with a rumoured new release: Pineapple Trumps, a spin on its classic chocolate-encased pineapple treat and do-it-yourself tooth remover. The global confectionery manufacturer and bumbling “before” character in an infomercial, ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago
  • The coming resource war.
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    KiwipoliticoBy Pablo
    2 weeks ago
  • Māori Language Week with The Civilian
    Kia ora, Aotearoa. It’s that magical time of year. Te Wiki o te Reo Māori. In English, the week that frightens talk radio. As you probably know by now, all your favourite media outlets are participating, some more successfully than others. Stuff has changed its name to Puna for the ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago
  • Will Horizons act on climate change?
    Local body elections are coming up next month. And it looks like all Palmerston North candidates for Horizons (the Manawatu-Whanganui Regional Council) want to take action on climate change:Climate change is set to be a key issue in Palmerston North for the next three years if those wanting to get ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • BORA reform is stalled
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    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Corbyn and Brexit
    As the Brexit saga staggers on, the focus is naturally enough on the Prime Minister and his attempts to achieve Brexit “do or die”. But the role played by the Leader of the Opposition is of almost equal interest and complexity. The first problem for Jeremy Corbyn is that he ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    2 weeks ago
  • A ditch for him to die in
    Last week, English Prime Minister Boris Johnson boldly declared that he would rather die be dead in a ditch than delay Brexit. Unfortunately for him, the UK parliament accepted the challenge, and promptly dug one for him. The "rebellion bill" requires him to ask for and secure yet another temporary ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Warning! Warning! Danger Jacinda Ardern! Danger Marama Davidson! Warning!
    Lost In Political Space: The most important takeaway from this latest Labour sexual assault scandal, which (if I may paraphrase Nixon’s White House counsel’s, John Dean’s, infamous description of Watergate) is “growing like a cancer” on the premiership, is the Labour Party organisation’s extraordinary professional paralysis in the face of ...
    2 weeks ago

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