http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10907972 another journalists texts ‘hacked’, this time 2-3 months after the ‘cuppergate’ thing the police asked vodaphone for all of bradley ambroses txts, his txts to his lawyer, his txts to his fmaily, his txts to his sources & work colleagues, for what purpose? bloody nosey buggers. i think maybe we should all do what tony soprano used to do if he wanted to talk to his lawyer, face to face in a busy street somewhere, keep all private information away from the wires!
By arming what is effectively the mythical AQ (but referred to as “Rebels”), thus creating future terror threats which are then sold to the world via the propaganda wing (MSM) of the military/intelligence machine, such as what has been announced in the ME in the last 24 hours!
The television network said that a CIA team was working in an annex near the consulate on a project to supply missiles from Libyan armouries to Syrian rebels.
CIA chiefs were actively working to ensure the real nature of its operations in the city did not get out.
Part of the cover up appears to be seeking to hide how many of their own people died in Benghazi – If they are good with covering up losses of their own people to serve a purpose, then what care factor will they give to covering up, literally, anything at all!
Sources said that more Americans were hurt in the assault spearheaded by suspected Islamic radicals than had been previously reported
So only the losses suffered by the State Department in the city had been reported to Congress.
Starting to become clear to the most ardent of deniers by now, I would expect!
A quick look at Simon Lusk and the Slater child’s blog this morning is quite telling, they seem to be in a bit of a spin.
Every single one of their five “Must Read” posts is about how privacy is no big deal, journalists should pull their heads in and stop questioning the govt, and there’s NOTHING to see here.
Damn you Felix for making me go there and read that filth. Managed to fall over a vile anti-gay post (‘correcting’ the word lesbian for something the writer clearly thinks is hilarious but is just sad). You’re right though, they are scared. Good.
Yes the louder they yell that there is ”nothing” to see here gives the indication that there is in fact ”something” lurking in the background of this whole sordid little affair that ”we” would definitely like to see,
At first i thought the Friday ‘document dump’ was an attempt to head off the furore about the, at the time, breaking revelation that it wasn’t only phone records that the Henry Inquiry/Prime Ministers Office went after but the emails as well,
i do tho have the ‘sneaking suspicion’ that i have missed something, although the nature of what has been ‘missed’ escapes me also,
Give the Slippery little Shyster a couple of brownie points for, as David Shearer says, using weapons of mass distraction in His, the Prime Minister’s, efforts to wriggle out from under,
What we do know is that none of it, the phone records nor the emails, were sent ‘straight back’ by either the Henry inquiry or the Prime Ministers office, a rather large LIE pointed out by the ‘document dumps’ timeline when compared with the claims of the Prime Minister and other’s,
Given that on the Thursday afternoon befor the release of the Government’s email trail Dunne had already publicly stated that Henry had approached Him verbally asking for details of specific mobile phone conversations between Dunne and Vance there is then the prima facie evidence of all the information, phone and email, having been read by either the Henry Inquiry, the Prime Ministers office, or both, despite their continual denials of having done so…
That’s always a problem with multi-person blogs. Look at the conspiracy theories that got spun when several Standard authors chose to post on Shearer’s woeful leadership at the same time.
The difference of course is that we actually have separate pseudonyms for separate authors.
That was more of a cascade effect. The irritation levels had been bubbling for some time. Besides I barely mentioned Shearer in mine. I was having a go at the incompetent caucus as being useless. Shearer is just one of them and more of a symptom than the proximate cause.
“Lawyers are demanding a review of how police intercept private communications after a photo-journalist’s cellphone logs and messages, including exchanges with a lawyer, were obtained in and inquiry instigated by the PM.
Police seized the text messages of a photo-journalist involved in the “teapot tape” saga, including exchanges with his family, his lawyer and Herald on Sunday journalists.
Auckland University associate law professor Bill Hodge describes the police actions as “mind-boggling”.
What a good idea. If we fail to stop this bill there is more than one way to stop the spying. Close down the secret spybase in Waihopai. Turn its metal into ploughshares, or something else that’s useful. Let’s shut it down. Yeah, let’s tear it down.
“Last night I had the strangest dream, I ever dreamed before. I dreamed the world had all agreed to put an end to war…..
“Three cheers for the Dome Busters…..
The next protest outside Waihopai should be the biggest ever.
Pretty poor ShonKey Python work from Michelle Boag on (Q) Qeue + (A) Adore this morning – clumsy attempt to define attacks on democracy a mere trifle – “let’s focus instead on sleeper issues such as recreational schnapper catch and animal testing” says Michelle.
Interesting that with restrained vigour Corin Dann should correct her – paraphrasing – “……..this is about the credibility of the Prime Minister”. Wow ! Suddenly ?
We are getting closer and closer to the situation where eventually there’s going to be some journalist who will see Bernstein possibilities arising out of ShonKey Python’s Flying Circus. Possibilities which persuade said journalist to engage true journalistic ethics, even if only for selfish purpose.
Could Potty@Gower be said journalist ? His “part of the story” addiction would seem to acquit him well.
Boag’s line shows the agenda planned by the right wing cabal.
Repeal the dog testing.
Repeal the schnapper limit.
Prove to middle New Zealand you ‘listen’
Pass The GCSB bill while the passive New Zealand population follow the line that the spying issue is just a grumble from pesky journalists.
And get pliant shills like Hoskings, Boag….to sell the line.
Exactly Paul @ 6.1 – the manipulation value of this relative minutiae (schnapper etc) – “yes we hear you…..see how we listen…..” – did occur to me.
Not directly on point but please Paul – no mention of Hosking, on Sundays. Vaingloriousness, narcissism, entitled snippiness, risible mutton-dressed-up-as-lamb confusion – not something I care to address on a Sunday.
On point – any views on Michelle Boag’s role in parachuting ShonKey Python into NZ to meet the kaupapa devised post 1999 when the National Party was at its lowest ebb and the Evil Helen Clark was PM ? Who apart from Mich’ was on that committee ?
Boag is talking shit when she says animal testing should not be allowed for party pills……
Animal testing if allowed for alcohol
Animal testing is allowed for sports
Animal testing is allowed for all kinds of private, entertainment, pleasureable activities.
If some big fat slob requires some animal-tested medication for her condition that has arisen due to excessive eating and excessive drinking then what the fuck is the difference?
It was a sad feeling when I listened to Helen Clark as it became once more very clear what leadership talent we had and nothing like her has come along. Her comment about parity for women participation in politics however mad me sit up as the last thing we need is more M. Boag’s looking after 50% of the population. Interesting how MB phrased her comment on the living wage issue: … so that the board will say, don’t take our money (profit). Well that says it all. The gray people in the background that see everything around them as “theirs”. Reminds me on a bad mob movie theme.
Unfortunately we live in an age of personality politics.
The mind boggles at what sort of philosophical discussion we would witness, away from media frenzy and interviewers, between Helen Clark and John Key.
Key is a shallow populist who struggles to speak English, mixing metaphors and speaking largely in mono syllables. Clark is a thinker and articulate and sees the world and New Zealand’s role in it, in a totally different light.
That’s why Key’s minders get him interviewed by commercial radio disk jockeys and soundbite thinkers.
A good journalist would have noticed he’s here as a guest of the New Zealand Institute for the Study of Competition and Regulation (ISCR). Gok on their website and their supporters include Contact, Meridian, Westpac.
So an independent academic, then.
He’s just spouting the more competition BS that is the mainstay of modern economics and which has seen our power and telecommunications priced far beyond what they should be priced at. NZers know this but they don’t see a way to get the politicians to change it. We need to provide that way.
“NZers know this but they don’t see a way to get the politicians to change it. We need to provide that way.”
Could you please persuade Labour to adopt a policy of eliminating the market economy? And announce it – get David Shearer to announce that competition as the mainstay of the economy is bullshit and he will stop it. Please please.
It of course hasn’t entered your head that power prices to consumers have risen at rates which far outstrip the levels of inflation in the economy and such rising power prices are not reflected in any additional costs to generators or retail power suppliers other than by dint of a cozy little club raising such prices on that well known business imperative known as ‘coz we can’…
Electricity is a natural monopoly as such having more than one “supplier” increases costs. We could get rid of a lot of the bureaucracy inherent in the present system, especially the high paid CEOs, if we went to a government monopoly and thus decrease costs.
Economies of scale also apply. The generating equipment and distribution network cost close to a fixed amount every year no matter how much electricity is actually generated and so the way to keep the cost per household down you spread that cost across every household and business. Our present system breaks that economy of scale and thus increases costs per household and business.
Also, the present system uses a dis-economy of scale by charging per kilowatt hour. This dis-economy is realised by large companies paying less per kilowatt hour than households. This causes a misallocation of electricity. According to supply and demand, higher use should result in being charged more. Of course, by doing it this way they can hide the fact that households are subsidising businesses while keeping profits high.
A bigger joke is that you think it will never happen, here’s what an actual sick joke is vis a vis the retail price of electricity,
In the past 2 years urged on by a continual stream of (false) Government propaganda i have managed to trim my already minimal use of electricity by 10%,
During that same 2 year period the cost of that electricity from my retail provider has risen by a full 30%,
Don’t be so stupid to suggest that i switch to a cheaper retail provider as to my knowledge there is not one,
The only evident sick joke round these parts is your ego where you make claims of being an ‘economist’ unable to hire help at grandiose salary’s when evidenced by your comments you have very little clue about economics or anything else for that matter…
Paras 75 onwards provide a lucid explanation of retail price movements.
and I repeat NZ Power will NEVER happen. Zero chance. Under any government. There may well be a sign on a door in Wellington saying “NZ Power” but it will never do what Labour says it is going to do. Because when they win office they will receive the scary advice that it is a dog. Gee who would have thought? There will be a face saving announcement. When politicians get in they generally need to get with the programme if they want to get re-elected. Blackouts don’t win elections.
That is me for today – I’m off to crank up the spa at full power and turn on the heat pumps. 🙂
This is the guy that was rolled out by Labour to support NZ Power when it was announced. Now he calls the policy a “nightmare”
“It may look good, but it’s got lots of challenges,” said Wolak of the Labour-Greens policy. “You’re throwing the entire baby out just to get rid of the bathwater and you’re going to start over, as if you have all these problems.”
The Clobbering Machine
Just over a week ago, on Saturday 27 July, an unpleasant thread appeared in The Standard, entitled “Lazy Jono on 3 News invents a story”. Second-team TV3 jonolist Jono Hutchinson had mischievously quoted an incendiary remark by activist/commentator/provocateur Jenny in order to reinforce his—or more accurately, his boss Patrick Gower’s—allegation that Shearer and Cunliffe had squabbled in public at a protest meeting against the Snooping Bill.
The headmaster, Mr Prent, quickly administered a stern lecture to Jenny, and that of course should have been the end of it. Unwisely, though, Jenny answered back, and the headmaster dished out an even sterner scolding. Once again, that should have been the end of the matter. Unfortunately, however, the school yobbos and one or two thickies heard what was happening, and decided to get in on the act….
SCENE: The Back Benchers Tavern, Wellington. On the sound system, something mellow and atmospheric by the Phoenix Foundation—although the pleasant music is somewhat undermined by the deranged shouting of a drunken army officer bawling threats at a tall young man in one corner. The rest of the bar seems to have been taken over by a motley group of malcontents, complainers and vehement political junkies as well as various sad hangers-on, coat-tailers and vacuous gigglers. In fact, that’s exactly what has happened: a large group of Standard regulars are knocking back the hard stuff and dishing out the verbals. At one table sits the fearsome foul-mouthed feminist Queen of Thorns. All afternoon QoT has been slamming back tequila after tequila after tequila, occasionally snarling at anybody unwise enough to cast an apprehensive glance at her, “Don’t you DARE fucking label me!”. This terrifying Medusa is attended by various hapless minions, foremost among them the Labour Party apparatchik, self-appointed enforcer and tireless deliverer of spurious accusations, Te Reo Putake, AKA “Squealer”. As well as diligently agreeing with every one of QoT’s feisty feminist flare-ups, Te Reo Putake has been hovering over the proceedings like a rain-sodden black cloud, waiting for his chance to dump on Jenny’s parade.
Lounging at an adjoining table is the aforesaid contingent of hangers-on and gigglers, a rather pathetic and contemptible group comprising Morrissey Breen, Arfamo, Weka and Colonial Viper. They are all listening intently to Queen of Thorns as she lays into poor beleaguered Jenny….
QoT:[snarling] Right, so you didn’t provide the link because you weren’t actually transcribing the audio but we’re meant to take your word for it even though others can’t verify it. That would be you making shit up right there, wouldn’t it?
This frothing denunciation leads to an awkward silence. Nobody dares to speak. When the Queen of Thorns is up on her high horse like this, nobody has the courage to cross her, not even the notoriously feisty Jenny. An ominous gloom settles over the Standardista community. Even more ominously, it looks like now is the time for Squealer to unleash his burden…
Te Reo Putake:[roaring with choleric rage] Bullshit, Jenny. You made that up. It didn’t happen. QoT:[glowering] Gods forbid anyone question your integrity given your extensive history of making shit up to suit your own narrative, but care to link to the footage you’re claiming to transcribe? McFlock: omg, she’s turning into morrissey… Colonial Viper:[stupid giggle] Heh heh heh. That’s funny. weka: I’d like to know what bizarre universe it is we’ve all ended up in where we’re feeling compelled to speak up for Shearer. Planet Jenny. Arfamo: Lol. I feel your pain and I share it. Te Reo Putake: Just for fun, I’d like to suggest that future examples of lazy news reporting are tagged as ‘jonolism’. Like, “Hi, I’m a jonolist from 3 News!” EVERYONE: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! Te Reo Putake: Or “Look Mum I’ve won an award for my jonolism!” Mr Prent:[grimly] Heh! Almost worth doing as an object lesson. Arfamo: Lol. Jonolism is where reporters simply Garner their own news. Colonial Viper:[dopey chuckle] That’s funny.
Meanwhile, in a dark corner of the bar, a drunken and aggressive slob continues to dish out threats to New Zealand’s best journalist…. ARMY GENERAL WHO CANNOT BE NAMED: I have contacts in Afgh*n*st*n and I can have you fucking killed just like THAT! And I fucking will, you subversive communist al Qaeda fuckhead! JOHN STEPHENSON: You’re drunk, Rh*s. You’re making a fool of yourself.
NOTE: This is a reconstruction of an actual conversation.
If you want, you can follow the whole abject thing in its original form….
“It’s intention is to…”
…… possibly show that Morissey can be just as cynical about himself as he can be aout others (which to my mind is a good thing)
Never been there, i fear the place is a fire-hazard, humorous wee lampoon you have posted there. It’s intention is to…
There is a serious reason I repackaged and presented those dismal messages for the reconsideration of Standard regulars. It is to highlight something that greatly troubles me, and indeed should trouble anyone who values free and open discussion, conducted in a serious and civil tone.
I’m talking about a particularly malicious insult that our friend Te Reo Putake has regularly employed against me, and no doubt many others who have crossed him. QoT used it twice in that thread, against Jenny. This is the continued repetition of the lie that your opponent is “making shit up”.
Instead of dealing with the substance of an uncomfortable issue, some people resort reflexively to abuse, and the repetition of a sordid piece of rhetorical abuse. Te Reo Putake is undoubtedly the worst offender here, but felix has also indulged in it, and (as we saw) so has QoT. This is the scurrilous and cynical behaviour you expect to see on the crazier right wing blogs; to see it indulged in on a mostly excellent and thoughtful forum like The Standard is extremely worrying.
Tho i have no reason to support many of those you ‘name’ and in fact the opposite of that is true, my opinion is that while the accusation of ‘making s**t up’ is to a certain extent gutter language probably saying more about it’s users than anything else the substance of what they were pointing out could be said to be largely true,
A re-litigation of this whole issue seems unwarranted but i found one of Jenny’s comments about the Shearer interjection, whether it actually occurred or not, to be rather ludicrous,
To be able to infer from that one simple interjection, made or otherwise, that Shearer was Bullying Cunliffe would be, in my opinion, within the realm of ‘making s**t up’…
You do make shit up Morrissey. I’ve pointed it out several times when you’ve made up quotes you think you heard on the radio but never bothered to check.
I’ve pointed it out several times when you’ve made up quotes you think you heard on the radio but never bothered to check.
I have often conceded that not all of my transcripts are word-perfect. But they are always true to the spirit and substance of what has been said. If you want to object to my slant on an issue, or the way I have portrayed someone, that is fair enough, but you have occasionally taken the unwise option of following Te Reo Putake’s lead and claimed that what I write is all “made up.” That’s obviously the way he deals, or thinks he deals, with people at his LEC meetings, but such extreme and spurious tactics don’t work here. I would have thought you had more nous than to take such a lead.
Perhaps your most grievous misjudgement was when you claimed that Chris (Haw Haw) Trotter had not delivered a depraved and pretentious defence of the appalling Florida jury decision in the Trayvon Martin case; he had done exactly that, of course, but you made some ridiculous claim that I had not put his windy oratory “in context”.
We all expect better of you, felix, and I’m sure you will return to your normal high standards sooner rather than later.
Last time you actually said your transcript was accurate. It was nothing of the sort.
And you are wrong about Trotter. I posted the audio to prove it. He did not say what you said he did, literally or otherwise.
Your writing is funny and clever but it is an outright lie to call it “transcribing”. It is fiction, sometimes based on actual events, sometimes entirely imaginary.
I challenge you to post the links to the audio next time so people can judge for themselves.
Love you, felix. I take your point, but disagree about Trotter. He commented on that verdict, and it was all in support of the jury’s decision. I would provide a verbatim transcript if I could, but I can’t even get the link you provided to play on my computer.
Maybe some kind soul—Queen of Thorns, perhaps?—might like to assist me by providing a transcript.
… I don’t get it. Besides adding your own spin on something which people can easily read for themselves, what’s the point?
Nice attempt at shaming me with the drinking and “apparatchik” comments, though, they really add to your cred as the one-man Open mike crusade against whoever you’ve decided to paraphrase for the day.
Nice attempt at shaming me with the drinking and “apparatchik” comments, though,
The tequila detailing, and the “Don’t judge me” thing come straight from your website’s “About” page. The apparatchik dig was aimed at our friend Te Reo, not at you.
they really add to your cred as the one-man Open mike crusade against whoever you’ve decided to paraphrase for the day.
Those were direct quotes, not paraphrases.
And….I know we’ve had some rather spiteful exchanges, but I enjoy your writing, and I’ve even commented (positively) on some of your Daily Blog articles.
style, like beauty, is oft in the eyes of the beholder (as is comedy). But morrissey keeps claiming that his conceptual pieces are “accurate”, and I can never figure out whether he’s seriously delusional or just taking perfomance art to the next level, like Sacha Baron Cohen or Laibach.
….like Sacha Baron Cohen or Laibach.
Big difference between myself and Sacha Baron Cohen: I target the arrogant (Key and his cronies), the dishonest (Garth “Gaga” George), the vicious (Dr Michael Bassett, Garth the Knife McVicar), the pompous (Chris Trotter), the vacuous (Simon Farrell Green, Murray Deaker), the smug (Kerre Woodham), the hypocritical (“Sir” Graham Henry) and the corrupt (John “Cabbage Boat” Banks).
Sacha Baron Cohen’s targets are the poor, the kind, the polite, and the victims of war crimes. He is a brutal and reckless liar, and a fanatical supporter of an outlaw state.
Comparing that scumbag to me was a misjudgement on your part.
Laibach I do have some time for; those guys are a timely reminder that Slovenia produces better things than foolish and shallow poseurs like Slavoj Žižek.
I’m sure that when I call myself a tequila-drinking bitch who rejects labels, it’s very very different from when Morrissey calls me a tequila-drinking bitch who rejects labels.
But of course he’s ~dramatizing~ things so misogynist behaviour-policing is totally okay.
Context is meaningless!
I’m sorry to have to say that inanely shouting slogans does not enhance your credibility one bit. I think you’re trying to imply with your ranting that, for me, context is meaningless. That, of course, is a ridiculous accusation; I go to great pains to always put my writing in context.
Up is down!
Could you provide an example of my trying to say any such thing? Of course you can’t, but I am eagerly awaiting your tabling of the evidence.
Morrissey’s fantasies about the Jim Mora panel are completely accurate!
“Fantasies”? Oh, I see—you’re channeling Te Reo Putake! Bad idea, that.
Take your bullshit “praise” and go fuck yourself with it, mate.
The praise was genuine, but it appears you lack the grace to let bygones be bygones. I do admire your feistiness, but you should know that not everybody has my patience. I advise you to dial down the indignation a notch or two.
Jeez, Moz, I was tempted to be positive about this effort, especially since, for the first time ever, you accurately transcribed the quotes, but your hopeless drivel about me in your replies really only leaves room for one retort.
You’re making shit up.
Feel free to transcribe these words any way that makes sense to you, dude.
Jeez, Moz, I was tempted to be positive about this effort, especially since, for the first time ever, you accurately transcribed the quotes, but your hopeless drivel about me in your replies really only leaves room for one retort.
Oh puh-leeeease! Enough already with the wounded admonitions. I believe my characterisation imbued you with a demonic energy that will see the ladies flocking around you, you bad boy you.
You’re making shit up.
If that’s a technical term for lifting some banal online banter out of its usual obscurity and putting it into a Broadway production, then this writer, i.e., moi is…. http://finkorswim.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/guilty2.png
Feel free to transcribe these words any way that makes sense to you, dude.
Thanks dude. Keep up the good work.
Interesting, in today’s Herald, a retired, retiring Judge’s contribution to a book containing well known New Zealanders who are considered grumpy males,(are there not grumpy females),
This and the follow up article in the same Herald simply say ”if you are not wearing a suit and you have visible Tatts then you will receive from the New Zealand court system far less ”justice” than those who appear in suit without any visible body ink”,
In today’s Herald on-line, sorry i have never been able to do links from other than Googled web-pages,(and then not all of them are a great success),
The problem being my computer illiteracy being a self taught user AND the not inconsiderable fact that i am a lazy little sod lulled into the belief that i need no further skill other than the present level of self taught ‘getting by’…
With respect, I suspect that His Honour expresses tongue-in-cheek here. And that being the case I further suspect there will be a sides-split audience of some 120 plus who as we speak will be flicking off “HaHaHa !” emails to their brother.
If I suspect wrongly, I look forward NOT to reading His Honour on the day he is no longer hobbled by the proscriptions inherent in picking up the $250,000 plus annual stipend of a District Court judge.
Oh that on my next court appearance I have the wedge to engage the sartorial standard which sufficiently reflects my respect for the justice system and the learned judicial officer holding my immediate fate in his/her hands !
i favor that you suspect wrongly, the legal eagle quoted in the link kindly provided by Molly, a follow-up piece by a Herald reporter, echo’s, with a certain amount of reservation the learned Judge’s comments…
In all the talk on leadership contenders, one name that should be mentioned but rarely is.. Iain Lees-Galloway. I think he ticks all the boxes. Smart, articulate, left leaning and decidedly the thinking woman’s crumpet.
It is travesty that we are forced to bring in 17,000 migrants to rebuild ChCh when we have so many welfare recipients. Not all of these jobs require high skills.
The problem is not a lack of training places. It is a mixture of motivation, ability to relocate, and sadly very low skill levels, demotivation, and drug use.
The priority should be their children (and doing everything possible to discourage long term welfare recipients having children that will repeat the cycle). The existing children of welfare recipients should be a high priority for Government attention – both money and re-education.
Yeah well you better get on the blower to ShonKey Python and suggest that he not allow the portly gal from Waitakere to high-prioritise dog-whistles against beneficiaries.
Sounds to me like you’re not quite so enamoured by the performance of ShonKey Python’s Flying Circus as once you were Sryland ?
srylands you have been sucked in by your cults bull shit drug use amongst beneficiaries research has shown to be at a lower level than the general population!
you are just another cult victim who has swallowed your leaders BS (poison like those in jones town)
When you don’t have effective policy to create jobs for NZders its a cheap nasty solution to demonize those who can’t help them selves!
I have no idea what he said – I am not an apologist for the Government or the National Party. The current government is a left wing government. I’m simply telling you my view that Governments cannot create jobs. They can certainly adopt policies to destroy jobs. Just read through a list of Green Party policies to give you a heads up.
Given that in most developed economies the government is directly responsible for about 35-45% of GDP and probably around 20-30% of employment … your claim is ridiculous on the face of it.
More importantly however is that in the absence of government .. the private sector would not exist either.
The only way the Government can create jobs is to lower state sector productivity (it needs to do the opposite) or increase the size of the public sector (when it needs to do the opposite – and not nearly enough is being done on that front).
Channeling resources away from the productive sectors might “create jobs” but they are illusory.
We could use general taxation to pay people to paint rocks white. That of course would create jobs. But that is not the direction we need to head in. Small government and high productivity is the way to go.
No, we haven’t no matter how much you RWNJs think we have.
BTW, the low productivity is a) a load of BS, productivity has been increasing faster than wages and b) it hasn’t been increasing as fast as it should have because of the policy settings that allowed businesses to keep wages low.
The problem is business which has been enabled by government that believed the illusion of the neo-liberal paradigm.
In the 1980’s we shrunk the Government, cut state spending, cut services, wages and taxes. We have been falling behind comparable countries, ever since.
We have one of the best per capita resource bases in the world. The fact we are falling behind other similar sized OECD countries is an indictment of the policies of the last 30 years.
Note how the economy picked up under Labour’s slightly increased State involvement and the recession Richardson caused, when the rest of the world was not having one, by her cuts.
thats absolute bullshit srylands .
Look at what happened to Argentina when they copied your policies.
Your are just repeating a failed mantra.
Germany is the most successful economy in Europe why because they train young people like no other economy !
We had Shipley and Bolger trying your less govt more business model in the 1990’s we had 3 good years out of 9 revolving around tax cuts for the better off just before the elections (election bribes) they gave the economy a short term boost followed by a long period of decline in between elections!
What we got was less govt and less business!
You r trying to push the old right wing whore’s(thatcherism) explanation of how to run an economy like a home budget which is naive redneck BS!
productivity is very hard to measure and as you get more people into employment in your economies, productivity goes down same all over the world I have studied every economy going back to Egyptian times.
Your simplistic bullshit is just that, unresearched redneck moralizing bullshit!
So Srylands say due to your small government argument we have a foot in mouth out break or as we are about to see a company like Fontera implodes all because of poor oversight.
My guess is you will say something like ‘thats just market forces at work’, yet many jobs will be lost, not to mention our reputation, so yes governments do create jobs through good governance.
Another twit with the idea that, say, a Teacher, or a Doctor, working in the State sector, is not part of the “” productive sector””.
Do they suddenly only become “”productive”” LOL, only if they are privatised?
Srylands statement of course comes from the laffer curve idea.
That expansion of Government provision of services always displaces the private sector.
If that was really the case then you would expect the countries with extremely large State shares in the economy to be the worst off. Which is obviously not the case.
Countries with large State investment in the economy are the most successful. Some States manage with no private sector at all. (Not what I would recommend though).
Every one from Singapore to Norway, Germany and Denmark.
Countries which have high State spending either/or both percentage wise or per capita.
How are your low tax, small Government countries doing? Srylands.
Funny that everyone wants to immigrate to countries with high levels of State social spending.
Not many want to go to Somalia. Your ideal of small Government and unlimited/unregulated free enterprise.
Shrinking the States share of the economy is working so well in Greece, Spain, Ireland and Italy, Right!
You claim to be in business. How well would your business be doing without our State provided infrastructure?
Painting rocks white is of course silly. Neither a public nor private sector organisation would do this because:
1. The private sector organisation would not achieve a cash flow for doing so.
2. The public sector organisation would not achieve a political mandate for doing so.
Different means of accountability, same end result.
Now the cash flow mechanism is simpler, faster and more direct. If you can’t find the cash to pay the wages and overheads this month you must take immediate action. Indeed this is why the private sector is good at things that are relative low-risk, short-term and local in scope … like selling baked beans. The downside is that it’s very hard to get things done that you cannot extract an immediate direct cash-flow from.
By contrast political accountability works over more variable time-frames, with more variable responses. If a government ultimately loses the confidence of the people they eventually have to take some action. But there is a fair bit of flexibility, resilience and ability to spread risk over time. This is why the public sector is better at high-risk, long-term and globally scoped undertakings ….like education and health.
Taken to the next level – and this is already done in some sectors, car industry, defense etc…- is the use of robots in production and online shopping instead of shops. Who is really needed in such a “productive world”? It also means that there is no need to be governed as the corporates are not even overseen today, let alone under such circumstance.Tax take will decline to a mere trickle and the rulers of foreign politics and defense could as well be appointed directors of the corporate body. This would be the smallest government and highest productivity one can think of.
I belief we have to rethink the way society works, the sooner the better.
Beside your snide remark – yes ordinary people do actually go and get i.e. groceries – you have not come up with an answer to the issues our society is and will face. Slogans wont cut it.
Oh yes you do Srylands…….be honest now. And posing as a rightie who thinks ShonKey Python is actually Matt McCarten Left…….well…….you just look like a fuckwit.
Honesty is the best policy mate……wherever you’re at.
Have a Snickers bro’. You’re mean when you’re disappointed and outed for it.
Governments cannot (and should not try to) “create” jobs.
Actually, the government can and should create jobs. Saying that it shouldn’t is just making our society ever more dependent upon the rich which is, of course, what they want and why they created the fiction that governments shouldn’t. When governments go round looking after the people that they’re supposed to serve the capitalists lose power.
I’m simply telling you my view that Governments cannot create jobs.
Governments cannot (and should not try to) “create” jobs.
I don’t think Shitlands has ever been treated at a public hospital, been pulled over by a policeman, or had a letter delivered to his address, by the sounds of it. Or, he’s an idiot.
Whatever – there is too much drug use amongst welfare recipients. Go to the East Cape and talk to logging companies trying to recruit tree pruners. They struggle to recruit and retain young unemployed men because of drug testing. It is a serious problem.
Of course employed people will use more drugs than those on welfare – they have more money. Doesn’t mean that it is not a serious problem.
logging companies have also been exploiting workers, the word gets around young people don,t want to go out in work gangs to work for eight hours, when they get to work they are given the dangerous work with little training while the contract workers take the easy work easy money
The eight hours becomes 10 to 12 hrs work with no pay for the extra hours putting these workesr health safety at risk no pay for the extra hours and quite often no pay at all as alot of these contractors keep the wages and fob off young naive workers!
more blame shifting just like your leader!
then we should drug and alcohol test students whose parents are wealthy,as they are getting 70% of their fees paid for by the state mp.s are recieving 100% funding by the state drug test cops ird staff work and income defence force roading contractors etc etc.
I don’t think that employers who pay minimal wages for difficult dangerous and dirty work, far from home, are going to get the pick of the bunch, somehow.
The problem is not a lack of training places. It is a mixture of motivation, ability to relocate, and sadly very low skill levels, demotivation, and drug use.
The problem is a lack of training programs. It is also a mixture of incompetence by government, ability to forecast when builders would be required, and sadly, very low levels of intelligence.
FIFY
What’s not to like aye! It’s a win win situation. Those Chinese will work for nothing (their visas will be tied to a specific employer – just to keep track of them of course), and Fonterra can assist in some sort of feeding programme akin to weatbix and milk in schools. Perhaps something like corn product and milk whey.
Nathe-the-man Guy and Soimun Brudges can keep an eye on the whole scheme to ensure transparency and oversight.
I imagine their also botulism-intolerant too – but then what’s a few chinks between friends! We’ve still got the nargy-nation to work on for our next FTA – and who knows ….. something may still come of that South American jaunt earlier this year
It is travesty that we are forced to bring in 17,000 migrants to rebuild ChCh
You’re not forced to bring them in at all.
The problem is not a lack of training places.
No, it’s a lack of being supported through training either by the government or the businesses.
It is a mixture of motivation, ability to relocate, and sadly very low skill levels, demotivation, and drug use.
Well, I’m pretty sure that if you paid enough to cover expenses including the expense of relocating then people would be motivated. Drug use isn’t that much of an issue – never has been. If it was all those people drinking alcohol (a legal drug) wouldn’t have a job.
The priority should be their children (and doing everything possible to discourage long term welfare recipients having children that will repeat the cycle).
That “cycle” is a direct result of capitalism because capitalism forces poverty on the many. When people don’t have access to the needed to resources to better themselves, to make a go of life then they inevitably lose self-esteem and start to see no point in doing anything. Get these people to the resources they need and that cycle will come to an end but the capitalists don’t want that because then they’d actually have competition and wouldn’t be able to profit so much.
Supplying people with the means that they don’t have to get somewhere and set up somewhere to live is not displaying an attitude of ‘entitlement culture’, it is simply an attitude of addressing the practical obstacles that a person on welfare would have to getting those jobs in Chch.
Given the passage of a sweeping new law legalizing marijuana in the entire nation of Uruguay by their Congress on August 2 (with the apparent inevitable passage by the Uruguayan Senate this fall), the South American nation is likely to become the first nation to set the dominoes of a ruinous US drug war policy tumbling down.
And the sooner we legalise marijuana here in NZ the better as well.
Christ Draco T!!!!
This IS serious!
You do realise those bloody narco states COULD (possibly, maybe, at a pinch) be financing the Yell Kida!
What can be done?
This really IS a crisis!
I know …. let’s trust in our Proim Munsta and our agencies of state to protect us.
After all – we lekd them, and they’ve got OUR best, bestest, bestest bestest intrusts at heart! (AYE?)
Portugal and the Netherlands have already moved in terms of legalisation. Uruguay isn’t the first, but it is good seeing it happen in South America. As always, drug laws there are used to attack the poor, curb civil rights and excuse brutal militarised police forces.
Schrilands you are just wheeling out the same lines word for word letter for letter even the punctuation marks of other neo liberal has beens!
Show us some evidence your neo liberal moralistic crap works.I have researched and studied economics for over 30 years and have found no place your simplistic naive short sighted model works!
That apparatchik Beltway Grant Robertson on “democracy” on Beige Alert?! “Leonid Brezhnev* on democracy” would be less cynical, more inspiring and sincere.
Nice words. Coming from someone else, I might believe them.
Interesting. Looks like the MP will hold the balance of power.
MMP seat allocator has change a bit, lets see if this link works… this is based on the MP having 2 electorate seats, and there being an overhang of 1 seat. It assumes that UF don’t retain their seat (and that NZF are out for being under the 5%).
NACT = 58
Lab/GP/Mana = 60
MP = 3
Total seats 121
(can’t remember the rules, who gets for form govt in that situation?)
However if the MP lost all their electorate seats, the left would have a clear win. Would the GP, Mana and Labour work together on that? Apparently they’d rather lose the election.
My view on NZFirst, touch and go, But, always remembering that even under massive fire from the opposition and media at the time NZFirst still managed 4.8% of the party vote so i cannot see that Party being as low as 3%,
NZFirst tho will struggle, there is little impetus for ‘activists’ to support that Party in 2014 and the opposite is now true,
i take my view of the Mana Party from a basis of what occurred in the Ikaroa-Rawhiti byelection after which the Roy Morgan polled Mana at 1.5%, (a list seat in it’self),
Given that Mana, contesting Ikaroa-Rawhiti for the first time picked up 4000+ votes off of the Maori Party then there is no reason to believe that Mana will not end the 2014 campaign with up to 1.5-2.5% of the party vote,
Flavell on those numbers is GONE from Waiariki, his majority is only 1900 votes and Labour have nothing to gain by seriously contesting this electorate seat and lots to lose as this besides Hone’s Te Tai Tokerau is the next most winnable seat for Mana,
Sharples’s Tamaki-Makaurau is also a goner for the Maori party where Sharples holds it by a mere 1000 votes over Labour’s Shane Jones who should win it for Labour in 2014 although with a large chunk of the electorate and Party votes going across to Mana,
Auntie Tariana’s seat, meh???, i cannot pick it, don’t know who Tariana has picked to stand there and don’t know what sort of strength Mana have in the electorate, Labour i am picking to just win it with Mana picking up a good chunk of the Maori Party’s party vote,
The Maori Party party vote across NZ, i pick it to halve, and 90% of that halving of the Maori Party % to go to the Mana Party,
If there’s a overhang in Parliament 2015 it will be one of Mana Party MP’s…
Thanks, good to see some analysis of the Maori seats. Still, Mana made some big predictions in the past that haven’t come true, so I’m not sure that the MP can be ruled out so easily. The question then becomes, what would they do if they held the balance of power? Presumably go back to their electorates and members as ask?
The real problem is NZF, and Labour/left voters, including some here, who believe that a NZF list vote helps the left somehow. Would like to see someone explain that too.
The posit that a vote for NZFirst applied for the 2011 election, and i might add had Labour gained a couple of more % points than what it did would have come within a whisker of giving Slippery’s crew the kick,
But it isn’t Mana that is making such predictions, those are my very own little analysis of where Mana now stand in the Maori political pecking order and are based upon the Ikaroa-Rawhiti by-election,
In Ikaroa-Rawhiti the Maori Party lost 1/2 it’s 2011 vote all but a 100 of those votes went to the Mana Party,
A simple transfer of that Maori Party loss across all the Maori electorates will see them disappear from the Parliament, and, my rough calculations tell me that Mana would only need pick up 1/2 of those lost Maori Party party votes to gain 2.5% of that party vote,
The loss of that Maori Party party vote in 2014 is also why i see Labour as polling a bit lower than it’s actual support as the share of the Maori Party party vote that Labour will pick up is probably 1%…
Seriously???, i assume you mean what would the Maori Party do if by some fluke that party is still represented by an MP in the 2015 Parliament,
Go back to their electorate and members and ask, that a giggle, Te Ururoa would consult the nearest mirror and then phone all and sundry telling them He is open for Biz and please gentleman place your bids now…
“But it isn’t Mana that is making such predictions,”
Mana seemed confident that they would decimate the MP. They haven’t done that, yet. I think they will continue to grow, but not as fast as they were suggesting. That’s why I’m not entirely convinced of the collapse of the MP, but can live in hope (although I tend to think it’s for Maori to sort out, and I don’t know enough to know if the collapse of the MP entirely is a good thing or not).
Sorry, no, but I heard it straight from Russel Norman’s mouth before the last election. He might not have said actively campaigning (so I don’t know if it was on billboards, that sor of thing), but he definitely meant that GP policy was to go for both ticks.
When you vote, you don’t vote for someone who says that they’ll give you a fluffy unicorn, you vote for them if you have confidence that they will actually try to.
Beltway Grant doesn’t quite exude that impression from every one of his pores.
Sure, but the point we were discussing was people giving two ticks to the GP, because they think the GP needs two ticks, when the GP don’t and someone else would be better off with the electorate tick.
Your case sounds entirely reasonable to me, but I’m curious what you would do if electorate voting Robertson was tactically the better thing to do eg if it was a close contest between Labour and National. Or hypothetically, Robertson was standing in Ohariu and had a chance of ousting Dunne/UF. Would you still electorate vote away from Robertson (assuming that person met your unicorn criteria)?
“Criteria” is plural. “Criterion” is singular and more appropriate. Sorry about the pedantry – I do admit to being a wanker.
I see your point and agree, and pragmatically, I might get extremely drunk and tick Robertson if it were very close if Franks or Prebble were standing again, but I reserve my right to say that as a Wellington Central voter, I do not see Robertson as my representative.
His electorate office is literally right across the road from a WINZ office on Willis Street, he could see it right out his window, but that hypocrite doesn’t give a wet shit about the poor in real life.
“Tactical voting” for me means voting for the “least awful who’s likely to get a seat at Bellamy’s”, and that’s bad faith as far as I’m concerned. I deserve better than the least awful as my representative, I’ve lived here a lot longer than that opportunist and carpetbagging Beltway Grant doesn’t cut it.
“I’m curious what you would do if electorate voting Robertson was tactically the better thing to do eg if it was a close contest between Labour and National.”
There’s an assumption built into that question that supporting Labour is necessarily a tactical goal.
Also, there’s a difference between tactical voting and strategic voting.
“Tactical voting” for me means voting for the “least awful who’s likely to get a seat at Bellamy’s”, and that’s bad faith as far as I’m concerned. I deserve better than the least awful as my representative, I’ve lived here a lot longer than that opportunist and carpetbagging Beltway Grant doesn’t cut it.
I don’t think I’ve ever voted in an electorate where I felt like the candidate would be a good representative of me, so voting for me has always been more pragmatic, around what kind of govt is realistic, or what I don’t want, rather than thinking that I’m voting with any kind of purity.
“I’m curious what you would do if electorate voting Robertson was tactically the better thing to do eg if it was a close contest between Labour and National.”
There’s an assumption built into that question that supporting Labour is necessarily a tactical goal.
Also, there’s a difference between tactical voting and strategic voting.
Yes true, I can that it might be better for Roberston to have a low electorate vote and that that might serve the left better in the medium and long term. Maybe even the short term.
I guess the better example is Waitakere and having Sepuloni as the electoriate MP instead of Shipley. But that doesn’t really compare with Rhinocrates situation, who is stuck with a useless option.
I disagree that your interpretation of my voting has been tactical.
Tactical voting is what delivered Banks to parliament.
voting for me has always been more pragmatic,
Indeed, appropriate point,Weka, so I guess that we see conflicting idealisms, not ideologies.
I am an idealist when it comes to democracy. If I have to vote for a representative, then they have to represent me.
Still, while a candidate would never be “perfect” for me (too much hair, likes Dmitri Shostakovich and Brian Eno less than me, etc), I just simply cannot accept Beltway Grant as my representative under any terms. He has no loyalty to his electorate because he’s a parachute candidate, he has no loyalty to the traditional Labour voter or those whom Labour needs now.
I urge people to make moral and ideological choices about their representatives.
This is the issue: representatives are representative , not merely expedient.
That said, I hope that you have a better candidate for your electorate.
I guess the better example is Waitakere and having Sepuloni as the electoriate MP instead of Shipley. But that doesn’t really compare with Rhinocrates situation, who is stuck with a useless option.
Indeed – that would suddenly make things easy- albeit expensive (I really don’t have the budget for much good whisky).
I was very sad not to see Carmel Sepuloni win, especially considering her opponent, and by such a small margin!
Yes but the same could be said of Labour when they contest the Te Tai Tokerau and Waiariki seats,
Polling in the 30’s on the party vote Labour has got nothing to win even if they won both electorates,
Labour should they win both those seats will not gain any extra MP’s in the House and winning those 2 seats might cost Labour the election, the fact is should they not contest those 2 seats Labour will have the number of seats in the House dictated by it’s % of the Party vote and at least 2 seats in the House that Will Not ever vote for National…
Let’s put it like this: Natz gained 47% of the electorate vote in that Culmar Brunton Polling. Labour gained 39% and Greens 8%. If those who plan to waste their electorate vote on the Greens instead voted for Labour candidates, they would also have 47% of the electorate votes. An 8% swing in favour of Labour candidates could secure another 5 electorate seats at least. Basically if you vote for The Greens in your electorate, you may as well be voting for your National party candidate.
Never let it be said that i would have a moan about a mainstream media poll that shows the left in a good position,( and still a long way out from November 2014),
But, this poll strikes me as ‘funny’ in that it shows the Green vote to have jumped a massive 5% while showing only a loss of 4% in total from other Party’s,
What also does not quite compute is that 4% of ‘shown’ shift has come from the Conservative Party and National Party to the Green Party,
Now no matter how much i would be amused at such a wild swing in the mood of the electorate taking 4% from the far right of the spectrum across to the far left seems to me to be a little far fetched,
Of course, Labour for all i know may have picked up that far right vote decamping from National and the Conservatives at the same time as the same % of Labour voters scarpered across to the Green Party, all very confusing i know, and, i might add, slightly unbelievable,
Having had my moan tho, the Colmar Brunton is pretty much where i see the state of the party’s to be ( in my opinion),
Altho i pick Labour to be a little light and the Greens to have profited in this particular poll because of that light reading for Labour, (believe me i would like nothing better than to be proved wrong),
No Mana Party, i think that’s a mistake especially after the Ikaroa-Rawhiti by election result showed the massive gains Mana have made mainly at the expense of the Maori party…
Chuck on roughly 10% positive for the combined left to allow for the ah standard Brolmar bias, and allow for the Spygate traction to come (thank you Pascale), and sleep well Standardistas. For your sins (and yes we all sin dear, sorry thought that was your leg) three mail hairies, a hail holy queen for Peter may god rest his soul and fast from Shearerpoking for a week cold showers maybe, go now and sin no more, sorry sorry something on your cardy..
Fonterra’s handling of the contamination at their Hautapu Factory is unbelievable. I cant help but think the attempt to cover this up and the lack of openness and honesty we are seeing from Fonterra is related to the way our country is currently lead. Key and National have turned cover ups and dishonesty into an art form.
This Fonterra cock up is catastrophic…expect some fairly senior heads to roll this week….and I predict an eventual reversal of the 50 cent increase in the payout announced earlier this week (Thats probably best case scenario at this stage)
I wonder if HONESTY & INTEGRITY will play an important part in the 2014 election…should be good for the Green Party, clearly the only major party that has this in truck loads.
But real corruption and the Corporate state have now arrived in NZ.
Fonterra, too big to regulate. Farmers run the show. I see a Feds spokesman blames the testing and the media – after all, no-one died. (Since lost the link, mmmm…!)
Where is the Ministry of Primary Industries in all this? Hardly a suitable regulatory authority. Minister Guy spends most of his time talking up the benefits of irrigated dairying, and downplaying its effects on the environment.
And this is the Nats’ doing – they set up MPI. If the regulatory authority was the Min of Health things might have been different.
This will be the week that Key heads away on holiday again, my guess.
Federated Farmers vice president Dr William Rolleston begged people not to jump to conclusions.
”As far as we know no-one has got sick, it’s the testing that has brought this to the surface … and that has to be something that will help build Fonterra’s reputation,” he said.
MPI and Fonterra needed to do further testing, he said.
if the regulatory authority was the Min of Health things might have been different.
It would be the fault of the quasi autonomous company asure nz that would have oversight and would have some portion of the phytosanitary certification,whether they were informed or when is another matter.
testing would be especially difficult,if there was suspicion of the causative agent .i would suggest it would only be able to be tested at Wallaceville or an overseas certified lab.
Fonterra’s handling of the contamination at their Hautapu Factory is unbelievable. I cant help but think the attempt to cover this up and the lack of openness and honesty we are seeing from Fonterra is related to the way our country is currently lead. Key and National have turned cover ups and dishonesty into an art form.
This Fonterra cock up is catastrophic…
Saarbo, do you have something I can read that supports that. Because what I’ve seen on Stuff etc doesn’t.
Do you know what the actual risk is? AFAIK, they found the Clostridium botulinum bacteria in its inert, not its active form. That’s a different thing than botulism.
Don’t get me wrong, I think Fonterra rate fairly high on the evil scale, and are capable of covering up things to save their own butts. But, I don’t think they are stupid enough to allow botulism into the food chain and then go slow on resolving that, so am guessing the actual risk is pretty low. Unfortunately the MSM aren’t providing any useful information on that, so we’re pretty much in the dark.
Foodborne botulism is a rare illness caused by eating foods contaminated with botulinum toxin. Spores of C. botulinum are ubiquitous in the environment (3), but growth and elaboration of toxin occur only under particular conditions that include an anaerobic, low-salt, low-acid environment. Bacterial growth is inhibited by refrigeration below 4°C, heating above 121°C, high water activity,or acidity (pH <4.5) (4). Toxin is destroyed by heating to 85°C for at least 5 minutes, and spores are inactivated by heating to 121°C under pressure of 15–20 lb/in2 for at least 20 minutes (5).
Only what I have read in the media Weka. This happened in May 2012, why are we only hearing about this now? remember this is all in the shadow of the melamine disaster, Fonterra need to treat any contamination with real care and respect. China and Russia have stopped all Dairy imports from NZ. My thinking is that this is catastrophic.
Only what I have read in the media Weka. This happened in May 2012, why are we only hearing about this now? remember this is all in the shadow of the melamine disaster, Fonterra need to treat any contamination with real care and respect. China and Russia have stopped all Dairy imports from NZ. My thinking is that this is catastrophic.
I’m a bit confused by that. I agree that the health risks should be taken seriously, but that is separate from economic issues (my thinking is the slowing of the industrial dairying in NZ would be good for NZ).
Re the health issues, well I’ll say it again, we don’t know what the risk is, but it’s possible that it is very low. Clostridium is not synonmous with people getting ill from botulism. You need specific conditions for that to happen.
To put it another way, I think the real concern here is that the MSM haven’t reported what the actual risk is. If it turns out that Fonterra have been negligent and cavalier, then throw all kinds of shit at them.
The other factor is, how common or rare is it for a pipe to become contaminated in this way? How often do people in NZ get botulism? We don’t have a context to understand this within.
And industrially produced food is always going to have levels of unsafety that are specific to it. Look at the ecoli outbreaks in the US in recent years – they came from spinach that was grown with animal shit spread in the fields, and then the spinach was distributed via the industrial food supply chains and it was difficult for them to figure out where it came from and what the source was. I’d like to know how clear and efficient Fonterra’s supply chains are.
Yes, I understand where you are coming from Weka, I hope you are right. But we do know that the Chinese are incredibly sensitive since the melamine disaster which is completely understandable. Attached is the e mail from the fonterra Chairman yesterday, it raises a big question around TIMING. The problem occurred in May 2012 (Point 1), a POTENTIAL issue discovered in March 2013 (Point 7), Issue confirmed in July 2013 (Point 8)…..why did all of this take so long?
Fonterra let farmers know within a matter of hours whether there is contamination in their supply, why does it take Fonterra factories so long….its not a good look.
E mail from John Wilson to Farm Suppliers yesterday.
Good evening
1)Fonterra today advised eight customers of a quality issue involving three batches of whey protein concentrate (WPC80) produced at a single New Zealand manufacturing site in May 2012.
2)These companies are now investigating where the affected product is in their supply chains and if necessary, will initiate consumer product recalls.
3)There have been no reports of any illness linked to consumption of the whey protein. –4)Dairy products such as fresh milk, yoghurt, cheese, spreads and UHT milk products are not affected.
5)Food safety is Fonterra’s number one priority. Fonterra takes matters of public health extremely seriously and is doing everything it can to assist its customers to ensure any affected product is removed from the marketplace and that the public is made aware.
6)The business is working closely with New Zealand’s regulatory authority – the Ministry for Primary Industries – to keep New Zealand and offshore regulators informed.
7)Fonterra initially identified a potential quality issue in March this year, when a product tested positive for Clostridium. There are hundreds of different strains of Clostridium, the majority of which are harmless.
8)Product samples were then put through intensive testing over the following months. On Wednesday 31 July 2013, a test indicated the potential presence of suspected Clostridium Botulinum in a sample – a strain which can cause botulism.
9)This particular Whey Protein Concentrate (WPC80) is used by Fonterra’s customers in a range of products including infant formula, growing up milk powder and sports drinks – and that is why the business has acted with speed so any potentially affected product is removed from the marketplace.
10)Fonterra is continuing to work with customers and will provide more information as it becomes available.
Pono, Weka. We don’t really know the full health risks, but from what we do know, the reaction does seem a little disproportionate. Just like the recent reaction to the wrong paperwork which held tonnes of mutton on Chinese wharves.
What we do know however, is that the Chinese are rather sensitive to international criticism. Especially from arrogant minnows who cuddle up to Taiwan and Uncle Sam. Oh – and that our own dear wee PM recently accused them publicly of “spreading their tentacles” in the South Pacific.
Schrilands with all your neo liberal arguements can you show us some proof they work which countries or states work .name policy country or sate ,show,evidence or put
Up or shut up!
Schrilands with all your neo liberal arguements can you show us some proof they work which countries or states work .name policy country or sate ,show,evidence or put
Up or shut up!
New Zealand’s economic performance over the last six decades has been poor compared
with most other Organisation for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD) countries.
Theory and evidence suggest that high levels of government expenditure, as a share of the
economy, can be detrimental to economic growth due to the economic costs of raising
taxation to finance expenditure
Economic theory suggests that a large government may undermine economic growth
through the cost of financing expenditure and differences in the rate of productivity growth
between the public and private sector.
A number of countries have smaller governments than New Zealand, including Australia and South Korea, with the larger governments generally being European.
The classic natural experiment is North and South Korea. North Korean economic policies are remarkably similar to those expounded by many The Standard contributors. Didn’t work so well.
The other example is Australia – much smaller government over the last 30 years compared to NZ, with deeper more competitive markets – The country has a population 5 x NZ’s but the sharemarket is 30x larger. Says it all. (Another reason we desperately need 100% privatisation asap)
And of course New Zealanders vote with their feet by moving there in large numbers.
Schrilands BS Australia smaller govt than NZ what absolute tossing lies.
Australia has out grown NZ because of cheaper housing better family tax credits concentrated population bigger govt subsidies tougher tarrifs Capital gains tax mining mining and mining!
Australia has a far bigger govt than us lower house upper house state govts wow!
You are just plain lying
Ok you will be rushed into the front bench of National Monday morning born leader liar!
Australia smaller govt than NZ what absolute tossing lies.” Tosser.
Bloody hell – you people don’t let facts get in the way do you? Australia has a much smaller government share of GDP than NZ – that includes ALL levels of government. In 2011 Australia had a government sector = 34% of GDP – in NZ it was 44%. The trend over the last 30 years has been for an overall widening of the gap.
And of course because government is smaller overall tax take is smaller too.
Mining explains a relatively small proportion of Australia’s economic performance – the resources boom was a help but it has been the services sector that has driven growth.
But feel free to ignore facts and carry on with your prejudices. Australia has grown despite some negative policies like PMV subsidies – NOT because of them
Australian government expenditure – at all levels of government has been between 5 and 10% of GDP SMALLER than NZ for 30 years. And the gap is increasing.
shrilands thats federal spending. mining has been booming for the last thirty years their population is concentrated which is cheaper to provide services.
that is federal govt spending it does not include state govt spending then when you look at the size of govt spending per person, Australia out spends us take mining out of the equation and your figures will look sick, unemployment has been higher in Australia most of that time
Australia spends more on health welfare defence infrastructure per head than we do!
The size of the Australian economy allows them to spend more on all fronts than us.
Another reason is health insurance and compulsory super savings aren’t included!
Compulsory super savings has cut the amount of govt super paid out as well!
Now the mining boom is over Australia is hitting the skids NZ will feel the effects!
Australia has way more tarrifs than us as well!
Where Australia is making faster gains is in education they spend way more than us Australian have better access to tertiary education with much better performing universities.
it is funny that you seem to attribute australia’s growth due to a single crude and highly debateable measure, while ignoring the many other factors that might also contribute to growth (including economies of scale: “Australia has smaller government.
Of course it spends more per head – it is a richer country” – and bigger in every way).
You can’t explain (let alone predict) a substantial part of a massive chaotic system with a single abstract measure. It’s just stupid to try.
Factual? More like stupid and irrelevant. NZ is poorer than most other OECD countries because we were idiots and followed the neolib free market prescription to the letter.
The fact you can’t see that is a serious problem undermining all your ongoing natter about what to do next.
Australia has smaller government.
Of course it spends more per head – it is a richer country.
Billions of NZD have been extracted out of NZ workers and companies to feed Australian bank shareholders over the last few years.
NZ is poorer than most other OECD countries because we have a poor productivity record. The policy response to that has been well covered by the Treasury.
Even if Labour wins the next election they will get with the programme and follow most of these policies. e.g say goodbye to NZ Power.
Really? You know which of the Treasury’s policy recommendations have been accepted by governments? You are really clear on that? I doubt you eben know what they are.
Other way around: if treasury is indeed consistent with your deranged political lens, then we can pick which policies were at least partial treasury recommendations. Privatisation, deregulation, removal of workers’ rights, and blaming the poor.
why should a worker bother to participate in “productivity” improvement when time and again its the worker who gets screwed by changes while the fat cat owners take 98c out of every new dollar generated.
its about share of income – too much now in the hands of owners, corporates and shareholders, not enough in the hands of ordinary workers and citizens
I’m not going to try again. That is such an idiotic claim.
The CTU recognises that productivity is central to prosperity. Sure they might have different views to Treasury about HOW to lift productivity but they also will have a lot in common, and the CTU would certainly not say “productivity is a crock”.
“Improving productivity has been identified as a key factor for New Zealand’s long term, sustainable economic growth and prosperity. Productivity levels affect our living standards, our ability to create jobs and our ability to afford education, health and other services.”
New Zealand Council of Trade Unions – Te Kauae Kaimahi
“Productivity is the biggest long-run determinant of wages and living standards.”
It is productivity stupid.
Your quote is as stupid as saying “humidity is the biggest long run determinant of precipitation”.
In a chaotic system, no single factor can be the deterimant of a desired outcome. In fact, the same input of that “determinant” can have dramatically different outcomes depending on what every single other factor is doing.
Treasury is wrong again treasury is loaded with right wing purists.
You look at every single industry in NZ and ask if they are improving productivity they are!
treasury is a right wing think tank subsidized by the tax payer.
so
Shrilands I wasn’t wrong STATE TAXES ie stamp duties land tax Varying state payroll taxes are not included in the OECD figure’s nor are3.5% + medicare contrbutions nor are compulsory 9% super contributions .so by the time you add those contributions into the overall figures theirs not a lot of difference!
Campbell live looked at that last week came to the same conclusion!
Manurfacturing has declined by 70% since the 1960’s 60% of Australia’s economy is service Industry.
Shril more lies from you federal govt taxes Aprox A$ 340 billion out $1008 billion
33% aprox as you have pointed out
State pay roll ,land taxes, stamp duties not included!
super contributions not included as they are seen as private investments
Medicare contributions not included as they are private contributions
We pay all of that to one govt so your facts are bullshit!
If smaller government is so great for the country, why is it that unemployment and inequality skyrocketed at the same time the NZ cut the size of its govt around 1990?
It’s all very well saying that smaller government is better for the country, but that means shit if you have no job and can’t afford to put shoes on your kids’ feet. In fact, it’s more like your “economic theory” isn’t so much a better economy as it is throwing as many people under the bus as possible, and then blaming them for being unemployed or otherwise in need.
Australia has a higher minimum wage, something like a partially functioning union movement, a huge number of government subsidies to business, government investment in infrastructure, mineral resources that they exploit regardless of environmental and social cost, an apprenticeship program, government gifts to first home buyers, and far more government bureaucracy than NZ. Hardly a model for us to follow, but more successful in purely economic terms. Oh, and while Kiwi workers do a lot of the heavy lifting over there, Kiwi executives powder their noses at bars next to the Sydney Harbour and complain about how we want to care for our environment, all while spouting their Randian delusions. Cocaine does that, it makes people delusional. It’s almost as bad as neoliberal economics.
“Fonterra yesterday announced three batches of a whey protein called WPC80, manufactured in May last year, may have been contaminated by a dirty pipe at the company’s Hautapu plant”
So if there was another contamination event this instant, we wouldn’t know about it till October 2014 earliest?
“Fonterra said it initially identified a potential quality issue in March this year, when a product tested positive for Clostridium”
“New Zealand has an independent, highly regarded judiciary, with a robust appeal process for people who feel they have been wrongly convicted,”
and
“It would be completely inappropriate for a Minister of the Crown to interfere in the court process.”
This is complete and utter bile. If anyone thinks Key’s full of lies and deceit and has ongoing and total contempt for the intelligence of our citizens, then they should know we’d be in for far more of Collins ever became PM.
Andrew Little has rightly pointed out that the appeal hasn’t been lodged yet. But even if it had there’d still be nothing to stop the government looking into whether there were grounds to put things right. The Crown would (or at least should) in fact be doing this if and when the need to prepare for an appeal arose.
Ultimately there’s absolutely nothing stopping the Crown looking at the case again because it would be done with a view to being of benefit to Teina Pora. For example, a party in any litigation can choose to agree with the arguments of the other side. This is how parties to litigation reach settlement!
Judith Collins is wholly disingenuous in trying to spin the line that it would be inappropriate for the government to “intervene” in the Pora case. Doing so is not “intervening” – if there’s prina facie injustice she in fact has a duty to act. What she’s in effect saying is that the government does not have the power to fix an injustice. That’s plainly wrong. I’d go further to say it’s just darn right nasty, uncaring, cold and inhuman. Heaven help us if she’s ever PM.
Her redneck voters will look at the guy and say “So what if he didn’t do this one. Being in prison will have stopped him committing other offences.” The vileness inherent in their thought processes knows no bounds.
Her supporters would be saying that. It’d be good if MSM challenged her on her flawed logic and lack of principle. It always amazes me when lawyers try to do what she’s doing because it shows she’s prepared to use personal bias and adherence to ideological dogma to override established public service ethics and basic legal principle. It’s sometimes difficult to know precisely how in particular cases this happens. I don’t know Collins well enough to say whether she could be called a narcissist or not, but it’s pretty clear a lot of the signs are there.
I know the type Murray Olsen. All hot pontification about cases and lives they know absolutely nothing of. Larry-Loudmouth-Williams-Radio-Live style.
But wait until it’s one of their own entitled little bastards in the dock. The most innovative excuses and rationalisations when it’s one of their own little bastards in the dock.
And of course it would be madness, what’s more patently unjust, for other than a rehabilitative sentence to be handed down. “We want counselling for this boy right now ! Blah Blah Blah !”.
Dealt with the type thousands of times. Thick socially retarded fuckwits.
Collins is right in the first instance and it’s routine stuff…….while the case is in progress…….etc etc.
I’m not absolutely sure where it’s at so far but I recall hearing mention of application for the exercise of the royal prerogative, a pardon. Seemingly because there appears to be no taste for it in the government (Collins) it is now heading to the Privy Council. Because of Collins, Collins can say – “case in progress……” Technically.
A cry-off of course. Given that Judith is so absorbed in her Thatcher pretensions we cannot reasonably expect any other response. The same personal trait led her to all sorts of extraordinary overtness (and the spending of a rather large amount of public money) re the Binnie report.
You see this is a 17 year old (now 38), never amounted to much, Maori boy with a criminal record. Yes, in the slammer for 21 years. And yes, a fact which senior police officers, damn, the Police Association, are calling to be investigated. Unprecedented.
I’d like to think that Judith would agree he’s entitled to a pardon as matter of urgency and twenty, no thirty million. If you can put a price on it at all…….
There’s the rub. The Justice Sow values the money and fears the ignominy of having to concede, more than putting right the travesty. After all………we’re only talking Maori boy criminal underclass here……..
“Collins is right in the first instance and it’s routine stuff…….while the case is in progress…….etc etc.”
With respect, that’s not quite the case. If an injustice is identified the Crown can choose to address it at any point, regardless of whether an appeal has been lodge, is being contemplated or not. This, of course, makes sense: if the Crown has done something to someone it later realises it shouldn’t have it has every ability to fix it. What’s also important to note is that this is over and above the Royal Prerogative, which is different again. You’re right in that Pora’s off to the PC because government isn’t listening, which highlights further Collins’ lie that her hands are tied because the matter’s “with the courts”. This is a particularly large amount of shit coming out of Collins’ mouth this time, probably more than usual, and which the nature of has got me thinking about whether she’s narcissistic.
I agree entirely Mary. Don’t misunderstand me. I’m identifying that Collins is technically right in one part alone of the broad legal picture.
Of course it is from there that Collins chooses to speak.
The “speak” is rubbish as a disguise or excuse for this boy not already having a pardon.
All of the Thatcher disdain mentioned above is true. As are the reasons for that disdain.
Florists usually like flowers, jockeys horses, dancers dancing.
How come this Minister of Justice has a problem with you know what ?
Anyway, thanks to Jonathan Krebs counsel for Teina Pora – personal commitment to get the case to London for the Privy Council irrespective of insufficiency if any of legal aid grant. Would gladly contribute.
Thanks North. I guess my point is that I think Collins is not technically correct on anything she’s saying on this particular issue. What is the “one part alone of the broad legal picture” you’re saying she’s technically right about?
Hi Mary. My apprehension was that the Privy Council appeal was already underway and accordingly Collins was technically able to invoke sub-judice even though that amounted to a sidestepping of the huge justice issue here. Sub-Judy-Say. Horrors !
Then I see from the Herald this morning that the appeal is not yet underway and that Collins is now prepared to consider a formal investigation. Something she was always able to engage of course, had she the will to do so.
So yes, my assessment of Collins’ behaviour is unjustifiably charitable. For my part I simply cannot understand how a minister responsible for “Justice” could drag her heels in this unprecedented case………concerns of senior police officers, the Police Association, forensic pshychiatric evidence etc etc.
All that aside a gathering momentum now appears. Hopefully it is such that even the Justice Sow cannot stem it. Who knows ? The minister’s “doing the numbers” in what is already something of a cause celebre might well persuade her to make like donning the cloak of “justice” rather than deviously obstruct.
All power to Teina Pora ! And once he is free, all power to a very high level ministerial or other enquiry to identify the how and whom in this travesty. And fix on a truly awesome sum in compensation.
There should be no hiding in the thickets of extant legislation (if any) to artificially limit the level of compensation. There must be special legislation if necessary. Mmmmm…….that’s where this minister is bound to be a problem.
Notwithstanding their pious talk Justice and Truth are basically malleable concepts to this crowd. Money and how they “look” is their real imperative. The evil unleashed on Teina Pora is surpassed only by the evil extinguishment of Susan Burdett’s life. It is our duty as a nation to make truly conspicuous amends, mindful that compensation of whatever striking level can never truly displace the evil Teina Pora has suffered.
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Thanks to our strong health response, New Zealand’s economy is more open than many other countries. But as COVID continues to surge around the world, the economic consequences of the virus will continue to be a challenge, which is why we have a detailed plan to help New Zealand bounce ...
The Government is stepping up action to deal with environmentally harmful products – including plastic packaging, tyres and e-waste – before they become waste. ...
The Green Party are ensuring that New Zealanders who were overseas when COVID-19 hit will not be charged for the cost of isolation or quarantine if they return home to live. ...
It's been another week of creating jobs, supporting local businesses, and investing in infrastructure up and down the country - all of which are helping to keep our economy moving post-COVID-19. ...
Law changes to end tenure review and provide for better management of Crown pastoral lands in the South Island high country were considered by Parliament today with the first reading of the Crown Pastoral Land Reform Bill says Minister for Land Information, Eugenie Sage. ...
The Green Party have secured legislative amendments in a bill expected to pass third reading this week, to ensure better rules for school teachers and staff, so they can de-escalate children with diverse needs and cognitive differences, such as autism, rather than using unnecessary and often traumatising force. ...
New Zealand needs to be more aggressive in pursuing economic opportunities and resist the short-term thinking affecting some of its major industry, Deputy Prime Minister Winston Peters says.Mr Peters told Wellington Chamber of Commerce members this morning that the planned closure of the Tiwai Point aluminium smelter will have ...
Deputy Prime Minister Winston Peters has ridiculed the National Party "circus", with the politician saying it was in "chaos" after the resignation of another MP.Rangitata MP Andrew Falloon announced on Monday he would retire from politics after he allegedly sent inappropriate pornographic images to a young woman. Following a ...
Deputy Prime Minister Winston Peters today outlined what he saw as the requirements to re-open New Zealand's borders for tourists and travellers. If New Zealand was dealing solely with an Australian state such as Tasmania, we wouldn't need a vaccine, said Mr Peters, but these moves were complicated by the ...
New Zealand First leader Winston Peters appears to have prompted last-minute alterations to proposed legislation for commercial landlords and their tenants. Mr Peters told reporters on Wednesday said that he was making sure the proposed bill was in step with what the parties had actually agreed to. He said he ...
Associate Minister for State Owned Enterprise and New Zealand First List MP Shane Jones attended the groundbreaking ceremony for the new NZ Post "super depot" in Wellington. The state-owned postal service, which got $280 million from the Coalition Government last month, is expanding its operations to handle surging parcel volumes. ...
Rt Hon Winston Peters, Leader of New Zealand First CHECK AGAINST DELIVERYIntroduction Good afternoon. Welcome to you all here today and party supporters watching from around the country. We appreciate your hard work keeping New Zealand First strong; thank you for keeping the faith. Sixty-three days out from Election Day, ...
The diversity of conservation boards around Aotearoa is increasing with 47 appointments to 14 of the 15 conservation boards across New Zealand announced today by the Conservation Minister Eugenie Sage. ...
A Government grant of $6.4 million will expand the Pettigrew Arena in Taradale with new indoor courts of national standard. “The project is likely to take 18 months with approximately 300 people employed through the process,” Grant Robertson said. “The expansion will increase the indoor court space up to 11 ...
The Far North tourist destination of Mangonui is to receive Government funding to improve waterfront infrastructure, open up access to the harbour and improve water quality, Infrastructure Minister Shane Jones has announced. A total of $6.5 million from the $3 billion set aside in the COVID-19 Response and Recovery Fund ...
The Government has re-affirmed its commitment to supporting the hosting of the ICC Women’s Cricket World Cup, which the ICC has delayed from 2021 to 2022. “This is obviously a disappointing decision for cricket players and fans around the world and for the White Ferns and their supporters here at ...
Cyclists and walkers will now have a safer way to get around Taupō, Tūrangi, and between Hamilton and Cambridge, with funding for shared paths and Te Awa River Ride, Associate Minister of Transport Julie Anne Genter announced today. “The Te Awa River Ride is the latest part of massive growth ...
Six major cycle routes will be completed in Christchurch thanks to funding from the Government’s investment in shovel-ready infrastructure as part of the COVID-19 recovery Associate Minister of Transport Julie Anne Genter announced today. $125 million will be invested to kick-start construction and fund the completion of the following cycleway ...
Plans are underway for a brand new state-of-the-art hub for Whanganui’s justice and social agencies, following confirmation the ageing Whanganui Central Police Station is to be replaced. Police Minister Stuart Nash has announced $25 million in new infrastructure spending to improve facilities for the wider community, and for staff who ...
An adjustment payment has been made to Waikato-Tainui and Ngāi Tahu under the relativity mechanisms in their 1995 and 1997 Treaty of Waitangi settlements, Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations Andrew Little announced today. The latest payments to Waikato-Tainui and Ngāi Tahu are $2,700,000 and $2,600,000 respectively to ensure the ...
Deputy Prime Minister Winston Peters and Transport Minister Phil Twyford today kicked off the start of the Auckland NZ Upgrade Programme rail projects which will support over 400 jobs and help unlock our biggest city. Both ministers marked the start of enabling works on the third main rail line project ...
The Provincial Growth Fund (PGF) investment of $3.78 million in Wairoa will create much needed economic stimulus and jobs, Under-Secretary for Regional Economic Development Fletcher Tabuteau announced today. PGF projects announced today include: $200,000 loan to Nuhaka Kiwifruit Holdings Ltd (operated by Pine Valley Orchard Ltd) to increase the productivity ...
Tenants in public and Māori housing may be benefiting from their own affordable renewable energy in future – a fund to trial renewable energy technology for public and Māori housing has today been announced by Energy and Resources Minister Megan Woods and Associate Minister for Housing (Māori Housing) Nanaia Mahuta. ...
Hokianga will receive $2.7 million to redevelop four of its wharves and upgrade its water supply, Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones has announced. Far North District Council will receive $1.8 million from the Provincial Growth Fund for the work on the wharves. “The work will include the construction of ...
A $350 million Residential Development Response Fund is being established to support the residential construction sector and to minimise the economic impact from COVID-19, the Housing Minister Dr Megan Woods has announced. “The Residential Development Response Fund will help to progress stalled or at-risk developments that support our broader housing ...
As part of a broader plan to divert waste from landfill, the Government today announced $10.67 million for new infrastructure as part of the Resource Recovery Network across the Auckland region. “This key investment in Auckland’s community recycling network is part of the Government’s Infrastructure Reference Group ‘shovel ready’ projects ...
The Government is investing $45 million in the first stage of an ambitious urban development project for Tauranga that will employ up to 250 people and help the region grow, Urban Development Minister Phil Twyford announced today. Phil Twyford says the funding has been allocated out of the $3 billion ...
Getting low-emission trucks on the road is a step closer with investment in infrastructure to support hydrogen vehicles, the Energy and Resources Minister Megan Woods has announced. The Infrastructure Reference Group has provisionally approved $20 million for New Plymouth company Hiringa Energy to establish a nationwide network of hydrogen-fuelling stations. ...
A new trades training centre to upskill the local workforce will be built in the South Waikato town of Tokoroa through funding from the Government’s COVID-19 Response and Recovery Fund, Education Minister Chris Hipkins and Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones have announced. The Government will contribute $10.84 million from ...
The Government has agreed to repeal part of the Oranga Tamariki Act subsequent children provisions, Minister for Children Tracey Martin announced today. “There are times when children need to go into care for their safety – the safety and care of children must always be paramount,” Minister Martin said. “But ...
A $1.5 million boost to grow primary mental health and addiction services for Pacific peoples in Auckland, Hamilton and Canterbury will lead to better outcomes for Pacific communities, Associate Health Minister Jenny Salesa says. Pasifika Futures has received funding to expand services through The Fono, Aotearoa New Zealand’s largest by ...
Twenty-two projects to boost the sustainability and climate resilience of New Zealand’s food and fibres sector have been announced today by Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor. The $18m funding will deliver practical knowledge to help farmers and growers use their land more sustainably, meet environmental targets, remain prosperous, and better understand ...
Employment Minister Willie Jackson welcomes an initiative that assists employers to get mature workers into New Zealand small businesses. The disadvantages that older people face in the workplace was highlighted in the whole of Government Employment Strategy. In order to address this, a Mature Workers Toolkit has been developed and ...
New Zealand and Australia reaffirmed today the need for the closest possible collaboration as they tackle a global environment shaped by COVID-19, Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters said. “In these challenging times, our close collaboration with Australia is more vital than ever,” said Mr Peters. Mr Peters and his Australian ...
The recovery and forensic examination of the loader driven by survivor Russell Smith means the underground team are now moving into an area of the Pike River Mine that has not been seen since the explosion, Minister Responsible for Pike River Re-entry Andrew Little said. “The fifth and last robot ...
The Government has confirmed a community-wide trial of CovidCard technology as it explores options for COVID-19 contact tracing. “Effective contact tracing is a vital part of the COVID-19 response,” Minister of Health Chris Hipkins said. “While manual processes remain the critical component for contact tracing, we know digital solutions can ...
The government is proposing changes to aquaculture legislation to improve the process for allocating and transferring aquaculture assets to iwi. Fisheries Minister Stuart Nash has introduced the Maori Commercial Aquaculture Claims Settlement Amendment Bill to Parliament. It proposes a limited new discretionary power for Te Ohu Kaimoana Trustee Limited (ToKM). ...
The Minister of Justice has today introduced the Family Court (Supporting Children in Court) Legislation Bill – the next step in the ongoing programme of work to fix the failed 2014 Family Court reforms led by then Justice Minister Judith Collins. The Bill arises from the report of the Independent ...
A new Department of Conservation (DOC) action plan tackles the impacts of climate change on New Zealand’s biodiversity and DOC managed infrastructure including tracks, huts and cultural heritage. Minister of Conservation Eugenie Sage says extreme weather events around the country have really brought home our vulnerability to changing weather patterns. ...
A heavily scaled back international Antarctic season will commence this week, Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters and Research, Science and Innovation Minister Megan Woods have confirmed. “Antarctica is the only continent that is COVID-19 free,” Mr Peters said. “Throughout the global pandemic, essential operations and long-term science have continued at ...
The Government is providing up to $30 million to help fund the NZ Campus of Innovation and Sport in Upper Hutt - an investment that will create 244 jobs. “The sports hub is designed to be a world-leading shared service for a range of sports, offering the level of facilities ...
Transport Minister Phil Twyford announced today transport projects currently in construction will continue at pace due to extra Government support for transport projects to mitigate the impact of COVID-19. To keep the $16.9 billion 2018-21 National Land Transport Programme going the Government has allocated funding from the COVID Response and ...
$50 million for further rural broadband digital connectivity has been allocated from the $3 billion infrastructure fund in the COVID Response and Recovery Fund has been announced by Shane Jones, Minister for Infrastructure and Kris Faafoi, Minister for Broadcasting, Communications and Digital Media. The investment will go to boosting broadband ...
The Minister for Broadcasting, Communications and Digital Media has congratulated the Ultra-fast Broadband (UFB) programme on its major milestone of connecting more than 1 million New Zealand households and businesses to UFB. “This milestone has been 10 years in the making and demonstrates the popularity of the UFB network. “Uptake ...
Landmark legislation passed today puts New Zealand on track to saving thousands of lives and having a smokefree generation sooner rather than later, Associate Health Minister, Jenny Salesa says. The Smokefree Environments and Regulated Products (Vaping) Amendment Bill regulates vaping products and heated tobacco devices. “There has long been concern ...
A discriminatory law that has been a symbol of frustration for many people needing and providing care and support, has been scrapped by the Government. “Part 4A of the New Zealand Public Health and Disability Amendment Bill (No 2) was introduced under urgency in 2013 by a National Government,” Associate ...
Kiwi motorists are set to reap the benefits of a more competitive fuel market following the passing of the Fuel Industry Bill tonight, Energy and Resources Minister Megan Woods says. “This Act is where the rubber meets the road in terms of our response to the recommendations made in the ...
The Government has delivered on its promise to New Zealanders to modernise tenancy laws with the passing of the Residential Tenancies Amendment (RTA) Bill 2020 today, says Associate Minister of Housing (Public Housing), Kris Faafoi. “The Residential Tenancies Act 1986 was out-dated and the reforms in the RTA modernise our ...
New rules to protect and restore New Zealand’s freshwater passed into law today. Environment Minister David Parker and Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor welcomed the gazetting of the new national direction on freshwater management. “These regulations deliver on the Government’s commitment to stop further degradation, show material improvements within five years and ...
Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters has announced the appointment of Jeremy Clarke-Watson as New Zealand’s new Consul-General in Los Angeles. “New Zealand and the United States share a close and dynamic partnership, based on a long history of shared values and democratic traditions,” Mr Peters said. “Mr Clarke-Watson is a ...
Victims of family violence can end a tenancy with two days’ notice Landlords can terminate tenancies with 14 days’ notice if tenants assault them Timeframe brought forward for limiting rent increases to once every 12 months Extension of time Tenancy Tribunal can hear cases via phone/video conference Reform of New ...
Two employment schemes – one new and one expanded – going live today will help tens of thousands of people continue training on the job and support thousands more into work, the Government has announced. Apprenticeship Boost, a subsidy of up to $12,000 per annum for first year apprentices and ...
The Government is funding a significant infrastructure package at Omokoroa which will create 150 new jobs and help transform the Western Bay of Plenty peninsula, Urban Development Minister Phil Twyford announced today. Phil Twyford says the Government is investing $14 million towards the $28 million roading and water package. This ...
The Green Party has unveiled its housing plan which aims to get the record-high number of people off the social housing waiting list, while improving the size and quality of the rental market. ...
In its third major policy announcement, the Green Party has revealed a suite of plans to subsidise community-provided rental housing and boost the state housing build programme, Marc Daalder reports Amidst the Covid-19 pandemic and global economic meltdown, New Zealand's housing crisis has continued unabated. House prices are still surging and the ...
By Patrick Makis in Buka Contact tracing has begun for the Autonomous Region of Bougainville’s first covid-19 case. The 22-year-old male, who had returned from Port Moresby on an Air Niugini flight on July 29, is stable and is being isolated in Arawa town. ABG’s Deputy Controller, Health Secretary Clement ...
The Race Relations Commissioner Meng Foon wants New Zealanders to amplify the resilience of Māori whānau and communities on the International Day of Indigenous Peoples on Sunday 9th of August. The theme for the day is ‘COVID-19 and Indigenous Peoples’ ...
A small proportion of Covid-19 patients continue experiencing symptoms long after they test negative. Freya Sawbridge, one such ‘Covid long hauler’, describes what it’s like.Four months have passed and I’m onto my fifth relapse. The room is eerily still yet my mind spins like the stripes of a barber’s pole. ...
A new poll shows New Zealand First list MP Shane Jones coming third in the contest for the Northland seat that's being seen as crucial to his party's chances of staying in Parliament. ...
A poll in the electorate seat of Northland shows New Zealand First could be out of Parliament altogether after the election Shane Jones has a big hill to climb if he wants to take Northland and secure NZ First's position in parliament. National Party candidate Matt King is well ahead of ...
Christchurch writer Chris Stuart spent decades toggling between high-stakes overseas aid work and the strange safety of home. Out of that has emerged a crime novel: For Reasons of Their Own. I used to always tell people that when you work in war zones and disasters, you are only ever a ...
Welcome to Election Live for August 9, bringing you the latest on election 2020 and other breaking news. For key dates in the election seasonclick here. For all you need to know about the cannabis referendum click here. For the assisted dying referendum click here. 7.15am: Labour tax policy coming ...
New Zealand's unofficial poet laureate Victor Billot pens topical verse every Sunday. This week: the rotten egg laid by the outgoing coalition governmentLet’s keep moving I was sitting in my cheap motel room next to the window, smelling petrol fumes when on the TV came a lady in red ...
She’s Cheryl West, she’s Ellen Crozier, she’s the woman who makes headlines for throwaway jokes online. Sam Brooks talks to Robyn Malcolm, actor and activist.There’s nothing more compelling on a New Zealand screen than Robyn Malcolm wanting something. Whether it’s Cheryl West trying to get a lingerie business off the ...
The Labour leader returned yesterday to the Auckland Town Hall, where she was last seen riding the Jacindamania wave towards government. Toby Manhire went along to see how this campaign launch compared to the 2017 edition.A lot was the same. The big wash of red light bouncing off the Town ...
REVIEW: JACINDAMANIA: THE SEQUELWritten, directed and starring: Jacinda ArdernGenre: Political love story Classification: General ReleaseRunning Time: Six weeksShowing: NationwideRating: * * * * starsReviewer: Tim Murphy We've waited three years but the sequel to the 2017 blockbuster Jacindamania has finally arrived, debuting Saturday at the ...
Judith Collins is still shy of a month into the job but in her media blitz she and her arched eyebrows are everywhere, along with the party slogan "Strong team, More Jobs, Better Economy". ...
New Zealand First is pleased to announce the next tranche of candidates that will represent our values and spread our message across the country at this year’s election. We thank these hardworking New Zealanders for putting their hand up to take on the ...
A high-ranking Chinese candidate promoted over more than a dozen incumbent MPs is the biggest surprise in an otherwise orthodox National Party list for the 2020 election, as Sam Sachdeva reports The National Party has released its list rankings for the 2020 election, with the ascent of new candidate Nancy ...
The National Party is pleased to announce the appointment of Nancy Lu to the National Party’s List for the 2020 General Election, President Peter Goodfellow says. “Nancy Lu is a Chartered Accountant with a background in accounting and business working ...
Headline: A crisis of governance. – 36th Parallel Assessments [embedded content] The Port of Beirut warehouse explosion, involving 2.7 kilotons of highly explosive ammonium nitrate negligently stored in an unsecured area, crystalizes in one national tragedy a much wider trend: the crisis and decline of democratic governance world-wide.For a ...
National’s 2020 Party List is a strong mix of experience coming up through our Caucus, and new and exciting talent joining our team from communities across New Zealand, Party President Peter Goodfellow says. “The National Party is incredibly ...
Latest from the Beehive – It looked (at first blush) like Christchurch would gobble up around half the money earmarked by the government for projects to get us on our bikes. Julie Anne Genter, Associate Minister of Transport and a Green with a fondness for two-wheeled, pedal-driven transport, today banged ...
The suggestion of putting border exemptions up for auction so large companies can bring in overseas executives and key workers is naïve and totally unfair,” says Ms June Ranson, chair of the New Zealand Association of Migration and Investment ...
Looking for a wonderfully trashy movie to watch? TVNZ OnDemand now have some of Lifetime’s best dramas for your viewing pleasure. In a world of serious and credible television, the arrival of Lifetime to TVNZ OnDemand is joyous news. Lifetime is an American cable channel that churns out emotional drama after emotional drama, ...
The introduction of a $3,100 fee for returning New Zealanders will disadvantage Māori disproportionately, Phoebe Carr (Ngāti Awa, Ngāi Tūhoe)and Max Harris argue.The government has once again failed to honour Te Tiriti o Waitangi by rushing through legislation to introduce exorbitant managed isolation fees for returning New Zealanders. This ...
7 August 2020: The Team of Six Million, a campaign group established to oppose the imposition of quarantine fees by the New Zealand Government, has expressed disappointment at the Government's urgent passing of the Public Health Response Amendment Bill to ...
In July support for Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern’s Labour Party was at 53.5% down 1% since June, but still more than double the support for National on 26.5%, down 0.5%, with just over a month to go before the election in mid-September. If ...
Welcome to Election Live for August 7, bringing you the latest on election 2020 and other breaking news. For key dates in the election season click here. For all you need to know about the cannabis referendum click here. For the assisted dying referendum click here. Policy launching soon. Get in touch ...
After initial concerns about low testing rates in South Auckland, Counties Manukau DHB has the second-highest testing rate in the country. Ōtara Health chief executive Sosefina Paletaoga explains her organisation’s role in achieving this. Covid-19 has affected us all in different ways, and for us in Ōtara, it has highlighted existing ...
Oranga Tamariki's Chief Executive appeared before the Waitangi Tribunal a day after a report from the Chief Ombudsman found the agency had used its draconian powers to uplift babies too readily in many cases A Waitangi Tribunal hearing has seen Oranga Tamariki chief executive Gráinne Moss concede her organisation harmed families during ...
"A resident of the boarding house disappeared the same day Mrs Bethany’s body was discovered": provincial gothic, with astrology, by Auckland writer Mandy McMullin. I moved into the tearooms the day I turned sixteen, 23 December 2006. The same day I met Garth. It was Saturday, a lucky day for ...
The resignation of Westland Milk Products chief executive Tony Brendish almost a year to the day the company was sold to Chinese conglomerate Yili makes a mockery of assurances that there was no conflict of interest in top management preparing ...
*Watch the video in the player below*The wheels of progress turn frustratingly slow in Christchurch’s Red Zone. Frank Film asks, is anything going to happen? Hayley Guglietta is honest about her group’s activities on vacant land bordering Christchurch’s Avon River. She admits the groundwork was commenced without official ...
On this week's Extra Time podcast: After significant investigations into cycling, football and hockey in New Zealand, now gymnastics is in the spotlight around their athletes' welfare. Allegations of multiple New Zealand gymnasts suffering from verbal and physical abuse, bullying and unsafe training methods have surfaced over the past week. And ...
She’s a lone wolf, a team player, a rebel, a leader and the nicest lady around. But what combination of those do you need to survive in government?On a cold July morning, I found myself driving around Totara Park in Manurewa in the dark. I had been invited to a ...
All around the country, people are asking ‘what’s going to happen in the 2020 general election campaign?’ That’s because they haven’t read this guide, which reveals exactly what will happen in the 2020 general election campaign.Someone has finally put this term of parliament out of its misery. We’ve had three ...
The UK car industry has run a good race in the post-Brexit lobbying stakes. But Britain’s chemical industry looks to be making a late run, if recent coverage in the Financial Times is accurate.The issue for the industry is the post-Brexit regulatory regime and how this is to be ...
Latest from the Beehive – We had just finished digesting an outpouring of announcements from the Beehive over the previous 24 hours or so when the Point of Order Trough Monitor shrieked an alert. A new trough had been established. While we were inspecting the contents of this new trough, ...
Analysis by Keith Rankin. Chart 1, Historical: Australian much lower than Spain, Belgium and Sweden. Chart by Keith Rankin. The known incidences of Covid19 in Spain, Belgium and Sweden are similar, although Sweden lagged for a while before overtaking the other two. In deaths, Sweden is slightly lower than ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Peter Martin, Visiting Fellow, Crawford School of Public Policy, Australian National University The good news in the Reserve Bank’s latest quarterly set of forecasts is that the recession won’t be as steep as it thought last time. The bad news is it ...
Analysis: National entices voters with big infrastructure projects, Judith Collins rips into Jacinda Ardern and Parliament passes a bill that could affect every tenant in the country. ...
By RNZ Pacific France’s new overseas minister Sebastien Lecornu says New Caledonia’s restrictions over the covid-19 pandemic will not affect the preparations for the October referendum on independence. Lecornu gave the assessment during a visit to New Caledonia House in Paris. Paris is expected to send dozens of officials and ...
Ngāti Kahungunu ki Wairoa descendants are overjoyed they can do up their wharenui, while also attracting their rangatahi back to their marae, with more than $1.5 million from the Provincial Growth Fund. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Julian Meyrick, Professor of Creative Arts, Griffith University National crises, like the pandemics that can provoke them, come in stages. Each stage presents leaders with unique problems that require mental, moral and emotional agility to manage. Change is the only constant, as ...
How is New Zealand faring in during the Covid-19 pandemic? Newsroom is taking a weekly look at the latest numbers related to the virus and the impact on the economy.Excess deaths Overseas the death toll in some countries has risen sharply, with the ...
Justice campaign organisation JustSpeak has outlined a vision for a society without prisons in its 2020 election campaign ‘ Our Justice Our Future ’. The campaign was launched last night in Wellington, to a sold out audience of supporters and volunteers. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Vasso Apostolopoulos, Pro Vice-Chancellor, Research Partnerships, Victoria University During the COVID-19 pandemic we’re constantly being reminded to practise good hygiene by frequently washing our hands and regularly cleaning the spaces where we live and work. These practices aim to remove or kill ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra University of Canberra Professorial Fellow Michelle Grattan and University of Canberra Assistant Professor Caroline Fisher discuss the week in politics. This week Michelle and Caroline discuss the closure of ‘non-essential’ businesses in Melbourne under stage ...
Labour's campaign slogan "Let's Keep Moving" is hardly the most inspirational but reflects the conservative game plan - trade on the Covid response and stay on track. ...
By granting a permit to OceanaGold to mine under DOC land in the Coromandel, the government is not only threatening an endangered species, says Catherine Delahunty – it’s threatening future generations.I woke up angry. The government has given a 40-year permit to OceanaGold to mine under DOC land behind Whangamatā. ...
How come, after numerous condemnatory reports, Oranga Tamariki chief executive Grainne Moss holds on to her job? Aaron Smale wonders if those harmed by her tenure aren't a big enough voting bloc So, what happens when a government department breaks the law and breaches its own policies? Nothing, apparently. The latest ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Ari Mattes, Lecturer in Communications and Media, University of Notre Dame Australia Review: The Meddler, screening at the Melbourne International Film Festival For movie scholars and enthusiasts, one of the worst things about the COVID-19 pandemic has been the shutting down of ...
The combination of solar panels, electricity storage batteries, smart household gadgets, and a boring looking black box is set to change forever how our electricity system works. But do we need subsidies? ...
The New Zealand Bar Assocation says misinformed criticism of a South Island judge’s sentencing of a sex offender has the potential for disturbing consequences for the justice system and society generally. The Bar Association’s President Kate Davenport ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra The Royal Commission into Aged-Care Quality and Safety delivered it’s interim report in October 2019. Titled ‘Neglect’, it provided a scathing insight into the aged care industry – finding it centred around transactions not care. ...
By Tom Peters, Socialist Equality Group More than one year after the March 15, 2019 terrorist attack, an official inquiry into the mass shooting that killed 51 people and injured 49 in two Christchurch mosques has still not released any information ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Damien Manuel, Director, Centre for Cyber Security Research & Innovation (CSRI), Deakin University Australia’s long-awaited cybersecurity strategy, released yesterday, pledges to spend A$1.67 billion over the next ten years to improve online protection for businesses, individuals and the country as a whole. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Roxana Diamond, PhD Candidate, Flinders University This article has links that contain graphic content Many industries and employees have been hurt by COVID-19. But sex workers, who face stigma and discrimination at the best of times, have been hit particularly hard by ...
By Lulu Mark in Port Moresby Port Moresby may need to expand its covid-19 isolation facilities quickly and effectively in case a big spike in cases occurs, a doctor says. Rita Flynn isolation facility manager Dr Gary Nou said it would be a disaster if the spread of covid-19 in ...
Paige Tapara is a fast-rising young singer-songwriter whose debut EP explores themes of sexuality, coming of age, mental health and relationships. We asked her how it came together, and why she thinks it’s so important for NZ music to include voices like hers.Paige swoops into the room, a cream doughnut in ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Cathy Foley, Chief Scientist, CSIRO Universities and other research organisations in Australia have been hit hard by the COVID-19 pandemic. In May, a group led by Australia’s Chief Scientist Alan Finkel forecasted severe impacts for our research workforce. These included the loss ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Nicole Carnt, Scientia Senior Lecturer, School of Optometry and Vision Science, UNSW, Sydney, UNSW You’re rushing and accidentally drop a contact lens on the bathroom floor. Should you: a) run it under the tap and pop it in? b) spit on it ...
The Māori Party is celebrating World Indigenous Day the Māori way, surrounded by friends and whānau at a Meet-the-Candidates at the Third Place Café in Rotorua this weekend. To mark World Indigenous Day, the Māori Party wants to remind Aotearoa ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Sarah Wayland, Lecturer, University of Sydney As part of new research into missing persons in Australia, I have been asking people who return after disappearing what they needed or wanted. Mary, who has gone missing four times in the last few years, ...
Forest & Bird is calling for all political parties to back an end to mining conservation land, after a permit was issued to mine the home of a critically-endangered native animal. This week Oceana Gold was granted a 40-year mining permit from the ...
Here’s a snapshot of a single day in parliament. A day where changes were made to laws that govern everything from the milk in your refrigerator to the speed you can drive your car, and to Netflix, and war crimes, and who tests your water. It was a big day.The ...
*This article was first published on RNZ and is republished with permission* Māori leaders say they have no faith in Oranga Tamariki and the chief executive needs to go after the latest report into the organisation found it was routinely taking newborns without whānau consultation. The Chief Ombudsman's report He Take Kōhukihuki, ...
So is the government succeeding in steering the country through the Covid-19 crisis and what it calls a “one-in-100-year shock”. And just what is it costing? These are questions which will be uppermost in the minds of voters when they cast their ballots in next month’s general election. Finance Minister ...
Open mike 04/08/2013 
A chronological listing of news articles linked to on the Skeptical Science Facebook Page during the past week: Sun, Aug 2, 2020 through Sat, Aug 8, 2020 Editor's Choice Five Years After Speaking Out on Climate Change, Pope Francis Sounds an Urgent Alarm The encyclical ‘Laudato Si’ motivated many people ...9 hours ago
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From some quarters, incessant scaremongering. From others, it’s a full-on tilt into touching the alarmist buttons a little too readily (uncertain times make for very captive audiences with this angle of attack). The (so-called) Opposition (and merely regarding them as that seems to be a far looser term now ...22 hours ago
National Party leader - Judith CollinsElections often bring out the best and worst in politicians. Some rise to the occasion and provide us with a clear vision for the future. While others wallow in resentment and controversy, over-relying on attack politics to try to attain the interest of voters.That’s been ...1 day ago
The attempts to sabotage Corbyn's leadership seems likely to do more damage than Corbyn supposedly ever could have done, even if all the stories about him were true: I was reluctant to say anything but this is too important, the full story needs to be told.Don’t let anyone ever tell ...1 day ago
Good day to everyone. I’ve been asked by Mr Thinks to come here and talk to you all about my concerns regarding the government response to Covid-19. We’ve been living through this pandemic for, what seems like, years. Years and years and years. Why else would the National Party have ...1 day ago
‘Good Economics for Hard Times’ should be on your reading list. New Zealand does not have a Minister of Labour. It has Ministers of Immigration and Workplace Relations and Safety but there is no minister with responsibility for the labour market. That responsibility was abolished in 2012 when ...2 days ago
Back in the Kyoto era, the international climate change regime included a Clean Development Mechanism to fund emissions reduction projects in developing nations. Essentially someone would certify that a project - e.g. building a windfarm, or installing energy-efficient lightbulbs - would reduce emissions over and above "business-as-usual". The project would ...2 days ago
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http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10907972 another journalists texts ‘hacked’, this time 2-3 months after the ‘cuppergate’ thing the police asked vodaphone for all of bradley ambroses txts, his txts to his lawyer, his txts to his fmaily, his txts to his sources & work colleagues, for what purpose? bloody nosey buggers. i think maybe we should all do what tony soprano used to do if he wanted to talk to his lawyer, face to face in a busy street somewhere, keep all private information away from the wires!
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/10218288/CIA-running-arms-smuggling-team-in-Benghazi-when-consulate-was-attacked.html
By arming what is effectively the mythical AQ (but referred to as “Rebels”), thus creating future terror threats which are then sold to the world via the propaganda wing (MSM) of the military/intelligence machine, such as what has been announced in the ME in the last 24 hours!
Part of the cover up appears to be seeking to hide how many of their own people died in Benghazi – If they are good with covering up losses of their own people to serve a purpose, then what care factor will they give to covering up, literally, anything at all!
Starting to become clear to the most ardent of deniers by now, I would expect!
Sigh *eye roll*
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2012/12/benghazi_report_not_a_cover_up.html
Warren Commission was not a cover up!
A quick look at Simon Lusk and the Slater child’s blog this morning is quite telling, they seem to be in a bit of a spin.
Every single one of their five “Must Read” posts is about how privacy is no big deal, journalists should pull their heads in and stop questioning the govt, and there’s NOTHING to see here.
lolz boys, do you have to make it so obvious?
Ah, so Key’s lot ARE trying to hide something, and they have been over-riding democratic processes, along with undermining rights to privacy!
Damn you Felix for making me go there and read that filth. Managed to fall over a vile anti-gay post (‘correcting’ the word lesbian for something the writer clearly thinks is hilarious but is just sad). You’re right though, they are scared. Good.
Yes the louder they yell that there is ”nothing” to see here gives the indication that there is in fact ”something” lurking in the background of this whole sordid little affair that ”we” would definitely like to see,
At first i thought the Friday ‘document dump’ was an attempt to head off the furore about the, at the time, breaking revelation that it wasn’t only phone records that the Henry Inquiry/Prime Ministers Office went after but the emails as well,
i do tho have the ‘sneaking suspicion’ that i have missed something, although the nature of what has been ‘missed’ escapes me also,
Give the Slippery little Shyster a couple of brownie points for, as David Shearer says, using weapons of mass distraction in His, the Prime Minister’s, efforts to wriggle out from under,
What we do know is that none of it, the phone records nor the emails, were sent ‘straight back’ by either the Henry inquiry or the Prime Ministers office, a rather large LIE pointed out by the ‘document dumps’ timeline when compared with the claims of the Prime Minister and other’s,
Given that on the Thursday afternoon befor the release of the Government’s email trail Dunne had already publicly stated that Henry had approached Him verbally asking for details of specific mobile phone conversations between Dunne and Vance there is then the prima facie evidence of all the information, phone and email, having been read by either the Henry Inquiry, the Prime Ministers office, or both, despite their continual denials of having done so…
That’s always a problem with multi-person blogs. Look at the conspiracy theories that got spun when several Standard authors chose to post on Shearer’s woeful leadership at the same time.
The difference of course is that we actually have separate pseudonyms for separate authors.
That was more of a cascade effect. The irritation levels had been bubbling for some time. Besides I barely mentioned Shearer in mine. I was having a go at the incompetent caucus as being useless. Shearer is just one of them and more of a symptom than the proximate cause.
I don’t think Whaleoil is really “multi-author” though. As far as I can tell, Lusk writes the articles and Slater posts the videos.
He’s made up a few pseudonyms but if you look closely they all just post the stuff that Slater has always posted.
“Lawyers are demanding a review of how police intercept private communications after a photo-journalist’s cellphone logs and messages, including exchanges with a lawyer, were obtained in and inquiry instigated by the PM.
Police seized the text messages of a photo-journalist involved in the “teapot tape” saga, including exchanges with his family, his lawyer and Herald on Sunday journalists.
Auckland University associate law professor Bill Hodge describes the police actions as “mind-boggling”.
Herald on Sunday today.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10907972
Just what Shonkey needs now, yet another shit storm, from yet another Journalist. It’s just not his week is it ?? (Fade out to laughter)
1. Vance
2. Stephenson
3. Ambrose
How many more?
What a good idea. If we fail to stop this bill there is more than one way to stop the spying. Close down the secret spybase in Waihopai. Turn its metal into ploughshares, or something else that’s useful. Let’s shut it down. Yeah, let’s tear it down.
“Last night I had the strangest dream, I ever dreamed before. I dreamed the world had all agreed to put an end to war…..
“Three cheers for the Dome Busters…..
The next protest outside Waihopai should be the biggest ever.
Now I know what Waihopai is doing.
Closing Waihopai should be an election issue.
Disagree. Much much more oversight of its uses should be an election issue.
Spying makes open warfare less likely, and shortens wars that occur in spite of it. Waihopai is a significant asset.
OAK
– Under attack – the threat from cyberspace
This was something interesting on BBC World Service
Thanks – Here it is 🙂
Pretty poor ShonKey Python work from Michelle Boag on (Q) Qeue + (A) Adore this morning – clumsy attempt to define attacks on democracy a mere trifle – “let’s focus instead on sleeper issues such as recreational schnapper catch and animal testing” says Michelle.
Interesting that with restrained vigour Corin Dann should correct her – paraphrasing – “……..this is about the credibility of the Prime Minister”. Wow ! Suddenly ?
We are getting closer and closer to the situation where eventually there’s going to be some journalist who will see Bernstein possibilities arising out of ShonKey Python’s Flying Circus. Possibilities which persuade said journalist to engage true journalistic ethics, even if only for selfish purpose.
Could Potty@Gower be said journalist ? His “part of the story” addiction would seem to acquit him well.
Boag’s line shows the agenda planned by the right wing cabal.
Repeal the dog testing.
Repeal the schnapper limit.
Prove to middle New Zealand you ‘listen’
Pass The GCSB bill while the passive New Zealand population follow the line that the spying issue is just a grumble from pesky journalists.
And get pliant shills like Hoskings, Boag….to sell the line.
do you get schnapps if you squeeze a schnapper really hard? 🙂
Exactly Paul @ 6.1 – the manipulation value of this relative minutiae (schnapper etc) – “yes we hear you…..see how we listen…..” – did occur to me.
Not directly on point but please Paul – no mention of Hosking, on Sundays. Vaingloriousness, narcissism, entitled snippiness, risible mutton-dressed-up-as-lamb confusion – not something I care to address on a Sunday.
On point – any views on Michelle Boag’s role in parachuting ShonKey Python into NZ to meet the kaupapa devised post 1999 when the National Party was at its lowest ebb and the Evil Helen Clark was PM ? Who apart from Mich’ was on that committee ?
good question …
Boag is talking shit when she says animal testing should not be allowed for party pills……
Animal testing if allowed for alcohol
Animal testing is allowed for sports
Animal testing is allowed for all kinds of private, entertainment, pleasureable activities.
If some big fat slob requires some animal-tested medication for her condition that has arisen due to excessive eating and excessive drinking then what the fuck is the difference?
… what a duh issue ….
It was a sad feeling when I listened to Helen Clark as it became once more very clear what leadership talent we had and nothing like her has come along. Her comment about parity for women participation in politics however mad me sit up as the last thing we need is more M. Boag’s looking after 50% of the population. Interesting how MB phrased her comment on the living wage issue: … so that the board will say, don’t take our money (profit). Well that says it all. The gray people in the background that see everything around them as “theirs”. Reminds me on a bad mob movie theme.
Unfortunately we live in an age of personality politics.
The mind boggles at what sort of philosophical discussion we would witness, away from media frenzy and interviewers, between Helen Clark and John Key.
Key is a shallow populist who struggles to speak English, mixing metaphors and speaking largely in mono syllables. Clark is a thinker and articulate and sees the world and New Zealand’s role in it, in a totally different light.
That’s why Key’s minders get him interviewed by commercial radio disk jockeys and soundbite thinkers.
So true FW & l97 🙁
This guy needs to get with the programme. NZ Power or bust!
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU1308/S00083/labour-greens-power-policy-is-bass-ackwards-wolak-says.htm
A good journalist would have noticed he’s here as a guest of the New Zealand Institute for the Study of Competition and Regulation (ISCR). Gok on their website and their supporters include Contact, Meridian, Westpac.
So an independent academic, then.
He’s just spouting the more competition BS that is the mainstay of modern economics and which has seen our power and telecommunications priced far beyond what they should be priced at. NZers know this but they don’t see a way to get the politicians to change it. We need to provide that way.
“NZers know this but they don’t see a way to get the politicians to change it. We need to provide that way.”
Could you please persuade Labour to adopt a policy of eliminating the market economy? And announce it – get David Shearer to announce that competition as the mainstay of the economy is bullshit and he will stop it. Please please.
It of course hasn’t entered your head that power prices to consumers have risen at rates which far outstrip the levels of inflation in the economy and such rising power prices are not reflected in any additional costs to generators or retail power suppliers other than by dint of a cozy little club raising such prices on that well known business imperative known as ‘coz we can’…
Why would retail electricity price movements match general CPI inflation?
Why should they rise at all?
Your question simply insinuates that retail price increases occur because of that other well know business imperative,’coz we can’…
Eloquent Bad !
Electricity is a natural monopoly as such having more than one “supplier” increases costs. We could get rid of a lot of the bureaucracy inherent in the present system, especially the high paid CEOs, if we went to a government monopoly and thus decrease costs.
Economies of scale also apply. The generating equipment and distribution network cost close to a fixed amount every year no matter how much electricity is actually generated and so the way to keep the cost per household down you spread that cost across every household and business. Our present system breaks that economy of scale and thus increases costs per household and business.
Also, the present system uses a dis-economy of scale by charging per kilowatt hour. This dis-economy is realised by large companies paying less per kilowatt hour than households. This causes a misallocation of electricity. According to supply and demand, higher use should result in being charged more. Of course, by doing it this way they can hide the fact that households are subsidising businesses while keeping profits high.
NZ Power is a sick joke. It will never happen.
A bigger joke is that you think it will never happen, here’s what an actual sick joke is vis a vis the retail price of electricity,
In the past 2 years urged on by a continual stream of (false) Government propaganda i have managed to trim my already minimal use of electricity by 10%,
During that same 2 year period the cost of that electricity from my retail provider has risen by a full 30%,
Don’t be so stupid to suggest that i switch to a cheaper retail provider as to my knowledge there is not one,
The only evident sick joke round these parts is your ego where you make claims of being an ‘economist’ unable to hire help at grandiose salary’s when evidenced by your comments you have very little clue about economics or anything else for that matter…
You need a lesson in basic economics.
“The Economics of Electricity”
Paras 75 onwards provide a lucid explanation of retail price movements.
and I repeat NZ Power will NEVER happen. Zero chance. Under any government. There may well be a sign on a door in Wellington saying “NZ Power” but it will never do what Labour says it is going to do. Because when they win office they will receive the scary advice that it is a dog. Gee who would have thought? There will be a face saving announcement. When politicians get in they generally need to get with the programme if they want to get re-elected. Blackouts don’t win elections.
That is me for today – I’m off to crank up the spa at full power and turn on the heat pumps. 🙂
This is the guy that was rolled out by Labour to support NZ Power when it was announced. Now he calls the policy a “nightmare”
“It may look good, but it’s got lots of challenges,” said Wolak of the Labour-Greens policy. “You’re throwing the entire baby out just to get rid of the bathwater and you’re going to start over, as if you have all these problems.”
This is very funny.
http://whoar.co.nz/2013/q-a-a-review-10/
(excerpt..)
“..then..bloody hell..!..knock me over with a feather..!..the compere woods asks some real journalist-type questions..
..when she asks tindall from the warehouse how anyone could live on the minimum-wage they pay..
..and that isn’t working for families etc just a taxpayer subsidy for low-wage employers..
..tindall shifts uncomfortably in his seat..and blames the inernet for him having to pay that low-low-wage to most employees..
..tindall then says he supports a low-wage economy..and wants to see it continue nto the future..’cos it will create jobs’…(!)..(ed:..f.f.s..!..)
..(ed:..now if that dosen’t firmly make the case for a govt-mandated living-wage..what the fuck would..?
..it is clear our ‘sam walton’..tindall..and his like…will never voluntarily pay that living wage to their employees..
..these multi-millionaire employers are more than happy for the rest of new zealand to continue to subsidise their riches/profits..for forever..”
phillip ure..
Do not rely on ‘journalists’ like Wood to protect your democratic rights.
Far too much in the pay and due to corporate interests.
I don’t suppose anyone saw the preferred PM figures from Q&A this morning? Can’t find it anywhere…
no change..
but dann is promising big shifts in the party polls released tonight..
phillip ure..
Key down 1pt to 41%. Shearer up 1pt to 13%.
Everyone who knows anything knows there’s generally a huge disconnect between preferred PM and any other half real scale.
Preferred PM is nothing more than His Strangeness Potty@Gower and Radio Loudmouth Live’s DungCan Gooner having, well…….fun?
pm down 1
shearer up 1
norman down 1
peters up 1
Norman was up 1pt. Winston didn’t change.
The Clobbering Machine
Just over a week ago, on Saturday 27 July, an unpleasant thread appeared in The Standard, entitled “Lazy Jono on 3 News invents a story”. Second-team TV3 jonolist Jono Hutchinson had mischievously quoted an incendiary remark by activist/commentator/provocateur Jenny in order to reinforce his—or more accurately, his boss Patrick Gower’s—allegation that Shearer and Cunliffe had squabbled in public at a protest meeting against the Snooping Bill.
The headmaster, Mr Prent, quickly administered a stern lecture to Jenny, and that of course should have been the end of it. Unwisely, though, Jenny answered back, and the headmaster dished out an even sterner scolding. Once again, that should have been the end of the matter. Unfortunately, however, the school yobbos and one or two thickies heard what was happening, and decided to get in on the act….
SCENE: The Back Benchers Tavern, Wellington. On the sound system, something mellow and atmospheric by the Phoenix Foundation—although the pleasant music is somewhat undermined by the deranged shouting of a drunken army officer bawling threats at a tall young man in one corner. The rest of the bar seems to have been taken over by a motley group of malcontents, complainers and vehement political junkies as well as various sad hangers-on, coat-tailers and vacuous gigglers. In fact, that’s exactly what has happened: a large group of Standard regulars are knocking back the hard stuff and dishing out the verbals. At one table sits the fearsome foul-mouthed feminist Queen of Thorns. All afternoon QoT has been slamming back tequila after tequila after tequila, occasionally snarling at anybody unwise enough to cast an apprehensive glance at her, “Don’t you DARE fucking label me!”. This terrifying Medusa is attended by various hapless minions, foremost among them the Labour Party apparatchik, self-appointed enforcer and tireless deliverer of spurious accusations, Te Reo Putake, AKA “Squealer”. As well as diligently agreeing with every one of QoT’s feisty feminist flare-ups, Te Reo Putake has been hovering over the proceedings like a rain-sodden black cloud, waiting for his chance to dump on Jenny’s parade.
Lounging at an adjoining table is the aforesaid contingent of hangers-on and gigglers, a rather pathetic and contemptible group comprising Morrissey Breen, Arfamo, Weka and Colonial Viper. They are all listening intently to Queen of Thorns as she lays into poor beleaguered Jenny….
QoT: [snarling] Right, so you didn’t provide the link because you weren’t actually transcribing the audio but we’re meant to take your word for it even though others can’t verify it. That would be you making shit up right there, wouldn’t it?
This frothing denunciation leads to an awkward silence. Nobody dares to speak. When the Queen of Thorns is up on her high horse like this, nobody has the courage to cross her, not even the notoriously feisty Jenny. An ominous gloom settles over the Standardista community. Even more ominously, it looks like now is the time for Squealer to unleash his burden…
Te Reo Putake: [roaring with choleric rage] Bullshit, Jenny. You made that up. It didn’t happen.
QoT: [glowering] Gods forbid anyone question your integrity given your extensive history of making shit up to suit your own narrative, but care to link to the footage you’re claiming to transcribe?
McFlock: omg, she’s turning into morrissey…
Colonial Viper: [stupid giggle] Heh heh heh. That’s funny.
weka: I’d like to know what bizarre universe it is we’ve all ended up in where we’re feeling compelled to speak up for Shearer. Planet Jenny.
Arfamo: Lol. I feel your pain and I share it.
Te Reo Putake: Just for fun, I’d like to suggest that future examples of lazy news reporting are tagged as ‘jonolism’. Like, “Hi, I’m a jonolist from 3 News!”
EVERYONE: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!
Te Reo Putake: Or “Look Mum I’ve won an award for my jonolism!”
Mr Prent: [grimly] Heh! Almost worth doing as an object lesson.
Arfamo: Lol. Jonolism is where reporters simply Garner their own news.
Colonial Viper: [dopey chuckle] That’s funny.
Meanwhile, in a dark corner of the bar, a drunken and aggressive slob continues to dish out threats to New Zealand’s best journalist….
ARMY GENERAL WHO CANNOT BE NAMED: I have contacts in Afgh*n*st*n and I can have you fucking killed just like THAT! And I fucking will, you subversive communist al Qaeda fuckhead!
JOHN STEPHENSON: You’re drunk, Rh*s. You’re making a fool of yourself.
NOTE: This is a reconstruction of an actual conversation.
If you want, you can follow the whole abject thing in its original form….
LOLZ, put another log on the fire….
Nice song. I think they play it at the Back Benchers sometimes….
Never been there, i fear the place is a fire-hazard, humorous wee lampoon you have posted there,
It’s intention is to…
“It’s intention is to…”
…… possibly show that Morissey can be just as cynical about himself as he can be aout others (which to my mind is a good thing)
Never been there, i fear the place is a fire-hazard, humorous wee lampoon you have posted there. It’s intention is to…
There is a serious reason I repackaged and presented those dismal messages for the reconsideration of Standard regulars. It is to highlight something that greatly troubles me, and indeed should trouble anyone who values free and open discussion, conducted in a serious and civil tone.
I’m talking about a particularly malicious insult that our friend Te Reo Putake has regularly employed against me, and no doubt many others who have crossed him. QoT used it twice in that thread, against Jenny. This is the continued repetition of the lie that your opponent is “making shit up”.
Instead of dealing with the substance of an uncomfortable issue, some people resort reflexively to abuse, and the repetition of a sordid piece of rhetorical abuse. Te Reo Putake is undoubtedly the worst offender here, but felix has also indulged in it, and (as we saw) so has QoT. This is the scurrilous and cynical behaviour you expect to see on the crazier right wing blogs; to see it indulged in on a mostly excellent and thoughtful forum like The Standard is extremely worrying.
Tho i have no reason to support many of those you ‘name’ and in fact the opposite of that is true, my opinion is that while the accusation of ‘making s**t up’ is to a certain extent gutter language probably saying more about it’s users than anything else the substance of what they were pointing out could be said to be largely true,
A re-litigation of this whole issue seems unwarranted but i found one of Jenny’s comments about the Shearer interjection, whether it actually occurred or not, to be rather ludicrous,
To be able to infer from that one simple interjection, made or otherwise, that Shearer was Bullying Cunliffe would be, in my opinion, within the realm of ‘making s**t up’…
Morrissey, there are no reliable witnesses, which means that making shit up is a condition we all share. Therefore it cannot be an insult.
You do make shit up Morrissey. I’ve pointed it out several times when you’ve made up quotes you think you heard on the radio but never bothered to check.
You do make shit up Morrissey.
No I do not. And you know it.
I’ve pointed it out several times when you’ve made up quotes you think you heard on the radio but never bothered to check.
I have often conceded that not all of my transcripts are word-perfect. But they are always true to the spirit and substance of what has been said. If you want to object to my slant on an issue, or the way I have portrayed someone, that is fair enough, but you have occasionally taken the unwise option of following Te Reo Putake’s lead and claimed that what I write is all “made up.” That’s obviously the way he deals, or thinks he deals, with people at his LEC meetings, but such extreme and spurious tactics don’t work here. I would have thought you had more nous than to take such a lead.
Perhaps your most grievous misjudgement was when you claimed that Chris (Haw Haw) Trotter had not delivered a depraved and pretentious defence of the appalling Florida jury decision in the Trayvon Martin case; he had done exactly that, of course, but you made some ridiculous claim that I had not put his windy oratory “in context”.
We all expect better of you, felix, and I’m sure you will return to your normal high standards sooner rather than later.
Morrissey.
Last time you actually said your transcript was accurate. It was nothing of the sort.
And you are wrong about Trotter. I posted the audio to prove it. He did not say what you said he did, literally or otherwise.
Your writing is funny and clever but it is an outright lie to call it “transcribing”. It is fiction, sometimes based on actual events, sometimes entirely imaginary.
I challenge you to post the links to the audio next time so people can judge for themselves.
Love you, felix. I take your point, but disagree about Trotter. He commented on that verdict, and it was all in support of the jury’s decision. I would provide a verbatim transcript if I could, but I can’t even get the link you provided to play on my computer.
Maybe some kind soul—Queen of Thorns, perhaps?—might like to assist me by providing a transcript.
“That’s funny :)”
Vintage Morrissey. Love it !
+1.
I’m sitting on the fence here but I do enjoy Morrissey.
[random guffaw]
LOL™
… I don’t get it. Besides adding your own spin on something which people can easily read for themselves, what’s the point?
Nice attempt at shaming me with the drinking and “apparatchik” comments, though, they really add to your cred as the one-man Open mike crusade against whoever you’ve decided to paraphrase for the day.
… I don’t get it.
Oh come on, Your Majesty! I think you get it perfectly well.
Besides adding your own spin on something which people can easily read for themselves, what’s the point?
Dramatization, my dear. It’s been going on since the days of THIS BLOKE….
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-fk7zwBoZgXk/T1u9ChkNA4I/AAAAAAAAAJE/6_hcvMexHGA/s320/shakespeare.jpg
Nice attempt at shaming me with the drinking and “apparatchik” comments, though,
The tequila detailing, and the “Don’t judge me” thing come straight from your website’s “About” page. The apparatchik dig was aimed at our friend Te Reo, not at you.
they really add to your cred as the one-man Open mike crusade against whoever you’ve decided to paraphrase for the day.
Those were direct quotes, not paraphrases.
And….I know we’ve had some rather spiteful exchanges, but I enjoy your writing, and I’ve even commented (positively) on some of your Daily Blog articles.
The tequila detailing, and the “Don’t judge me” thing come straight from your website’s “About” page.
Context is meaningless! Up is down! Morrissey’s fantasies about the Jim Mora panel are completely accurate!
Take your bullshit “praise” and go fuck yourself with it, mate.
Are you sure that Morrisey didn’t capture your incandescent verbal style just write?
style, like beauty, is oft in the eyes of the beholder (as is comedy). But morrissey keeps claiming that his conceptual pieces are “accurate”, and I can never figure out whether he’s seriously delusional or just taking perfomance art to the next level, like Sacha Baron Cohen or Laibach.
Either way it’s not really my cup of tea.
….like Sacha Baron Cohen or Laibach.
Big difference between myself and Sacha Baron Cohen: I target the arrogant (Key and his cronies), the dishonest (Garth “Gaga” George), the vicious (Dr Michael Bassett, Garth the Knife McVicar), the pompous (Chris Trotter), the vacuous (Simon Farrell Green, Murray Deaker), the smug (Kerre Woodham), the hypocritical (“Sir” Graham Henry) and the corrupt (John “Cabbage Boat” Banks).
Sacha Baron Cohen’s targets are the poor, the kind, the polite, and the victims of war crimes. He is a brutal and reckless liar, and a fanatical supporter of an outlaw state.
Comparing that scumbag to me was a misjudgement on your part.
Laibach I do have some time for; those guys are a timely reminder that Slovenia produces better things than foolish and shallow poseurs like Slavoj Žižek.
I’m sure that when I call myself a tequila-drinking bitch who rejects labels, it’s very very different from when Morrissey calls me a tequila-drinking bitch who rejects labels.
But of course he’s ~dramatizing~ things so misogynist behaviour-policing is totally okay.
Context is meaningless!
I’m sorry to have to say that inanely shouting slogans does not enhance your credibility one bit. I think you’re trying to imply with your ranting that, for me, context is meaningless. That, of course, is a ridiculous accusation; I go to great pains to always put my writing in context.
Up is down!
Could you provide an example of my trying to say any such thing? Of course you can’t, but I am eagerly awaiting your tabling of the evidence.
Morrissey’s fantasies about the Jim Mora panel are completely accurate!
“Fantasies”? Oh, I see—you’re channeling Te Reo Putake! Bad idea, that.
Take your bullshit “praise” and go fuck yourself with it, mate.
The praise was genuine, but it appears you lack the grace to let bygones be bygones. I do admire your feistiness, but you should know that not everybody has my patience. I advise you to dial down the indignation a notch or two.
Jeez, Moz, I was tempted to be positive about this effort, especially since, for the first time ever, you accurately transcribed the quotes, but your hopeless drivel about me in your replies really only leaves room for one retort.
You’re making shit up.
Feel free to transcribe these words any way that makes sense to you, dude.
Jeez, Moz, I was tempted to be positive about this effort, especially since, for the first time ever, you accurately transcribed the quotes, but your hopeless drivel about me in your replies really only leaves room for one retort.
Oh puh-leeeease! Enough already with the wounded admonitions. I believe my characterisation imbued you with a demonic energy that will see the ladies flocking around you, you bad boy you.
You’re making shit up.
If that’s a technical term for lifting some banal online banter out of its usual obscurity and putting it into a Broadway production, then this writer, i.e., moi is….
http://finkorswim.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/guilty2.png
Feel free to transcribe these words any way that makes sense to you, dude.
Thanks dude. Keep up the good work.
Interesting, in today’s Herald, a retired, retiring Judge’s contribution to a book containing well known New Zealanders who are considered grumpy males,(are there not grumpy females),
This and the follow up article in the same Herald simply say ”if you are not wearing a suit and you have visible Tatts then you will receive from the New Zealand court system far less ”justice” than those who appear in suit without any visible body ink”,
What an ugly little prejudiced system we have…
Link ? Would seek it out myself if Herald did not routinely bury real stuff in favour of distracting pap. Keen to know whom the judge is.
In today’s Herald on-line, sorry i have never been able to do links from other than Googled web-pages,(and then not all of them are a great success),
The problem being my computer illiteracy being a self taught user AND the not inconsiderable fact that i am a lazy little sod lulled into the belief that i need no further skill other than the present level of self taught ‘getting by’…
I always appreciate the effort a person makes and until something is banned and I am unable to do it differently I can only do what I know.
For bad12 – Rough gear does you no good by Johnathan Milne.
Lolz, thanks Molly, add to my little excuses list above the fact that someone usually comes along and saves my bacon link-wise…
Never mind Bad12. Found it.
With respect, I suspect that His Honour expresses tongue-in-cheek here. And that being the case I further suspect there will be a sides-split audience of some 120 plus who as we speak will be flicking off “HaHaHa !” emails to their brother.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10907875
If I suspect wrongly, I look forward NOT to reading His Honour on the day he is no longer hobbled by the proscriptions inherent in picking up the $250,000 plus annual stipend of a District Court judge.
Oh that on my next court appearance I have the wedge to engage the sartorial standard which sufficiently reflects my respect for the justice system and the learned judicial officer holding my immediate fate in his/her hands !
i favor that you suspect wrongly, the legal eagle quoted in the link kindly provided by Molly, a follow-up piece by a Herald reporter, echo’s, with a certain amount of reservation the learned Judge’s comments…
In all the talk on leadership contenders, one name that should be mentioned but rarely is.. Iain Lees-Galloway. I think he ticks all the boxes. Smart, articulate, left leaning and decidedly the thinking woman’s crumpet.
Whats not to like.
What’s not to like ? Mean sour old pikelets is what not to like. As a pretty dependable rule of thumb. Just generally
“Deal opens door for Chinese workers in Christchurch rebuild”
http://www.3news.co.nz/Deal-opens-door-for-Chinese-workers-in-Christchurch-rebuild/tabid/423/articleID/305702/Default.aspx
It is travesty that we are forced to bring in 17,000 migrants to rebuild ChCh when we have so many welfare recipients. Not all of these jobs require high skills.
The problem is not a lack of training places. It is a mixture of motivation, ability to relocate, and sadly very low skill levels, demotivation, and drug use.
The priority should be their children (and doing everything possible to discourage long term welfare recipients having children that will repeat the cycle). The existing children of welfare recipients should be a high priority for Government attention – both money and re-education.
Yeah well you better get on the blower to ShonKey Python and suggest that he not allow the portly gal from Waitakere to high-prioritise dog-whistles against beneficiaries.
Sounds to me like you’re not quite so enamoured by the performance of ShonKey Python’s Flying Circus as once you were Sryland ?
srylands you have been sucked in by your cults bull shit drug use amongst beneficiaries research has shown to be at a lower level than the general population!
you are just another cult victim who has swallowed your leaders BS (poison like those in jones town)
When you don’t have effective policy to create jobs for NZders its a cheap nasty solution to demonize those who can’t help them selves!
“When you don’t have effective policy to create jobs for NZders”
Governments cannot (and should not try to) “create” jobs.
Srylands……….does this shifted goal posts argument of yours apply even when the ShonKey Python Kool-Aid contained the promise of 170,000 new jobs ?
Or is that promise too inconvenient (and impossible) for you to address ?
Damn ! Just when I thought you were coming right…….
I have no idea what he said – I am not an apologist for the Government or the National Party. The current government is a left wing government. I’m simply telling you my view that Governments cannot create jobs. They can certainly adopt policies to destroy jobs. Just read through a list of Green Party policies to give you a heads up.
srylands How many jobs has national promised to create 170’000 was what your leader promised!
“How many jobs has national promised to create 170’000 was what your leader promised!”
No idea what he said. Don’t care. Governments don’t create jobs.
Given that in most developed economies the government is directly responsible for about 35-45% of GDP and probably around 20-30% of employment … your claim is ridiculous on the face of it.
More importantly however is that in the absence of government .. the private sector would not exist either.
The only way the Government can create jobs is to lower state sector productivity (it needs to do the opposite) or increase the size of the public sector (when it needs to do the opposite – and not nearly enough is being done on that front).
Channeling resources away from the productive sectors might “create jobs” but they are illusory.
We could use general taxation to pay people to paint rocks white. That of course would create jobs. But that is not the direction we need to head in. Small government and high productivity is the way to go.
/facepalm
Most jobs created by the private sector aren’t what one could call “productive” and, more often than not, they’re illusory as well.
Good job that nobody, except you, has suggested we do that.
The increasing poverty that that model has brought about over the last three decades proves you wrong.
“Small government and high productivity is the way to go.
The increasing poverty that that model has brought about over the last three decades proves you wrong.”
Because over the last three decades we have had low productivity and large government.
No, we haven’t no matter how much you RWNJs think we have.
BTW, the low productivity is a) a load of BS, productivity has been increasing faster than wages and b) it hasn’t been increasing as fast as it should have because of the policy settings that allowed businesses to keep wages low.
The problem is business which has been enabled by government that believed the illusion of the neo-liberal paradigm.
In the 1980’s we shrunk the Government, cut state spending, cut services, wages and taxes. We have been falling behind comparable countries, ever since.
We have one of the best per capita resource bases in the world. The fact we are falling behind other similar sized OECD countries is an indictment of the policies of the last 30 years.
Note how the economy picked up under Labour’s slightly increased State involvement and the recession Richardson caused, when the rest of the world was not having one, by her cuts.
We used to send aid to Singapore, FFS.
thats absolute bullshit srylands .
Look at what happened to Argentina when they copied your policies.
Your are just repeating a failed mantra.
Germany is the most successful economy in Europe why because they train young people like no other economy !
We had Shipley and Bolger trying your less govt more business model in the 1990’s we had 3 good years out of 9 revolving around tax cuts for the better off just before the elections (election bribes) they gave the economy a short term boost followed by a long period of decline in between elections!
What we got was less govt and less business!
You r trying to push the old right wing whore’s(thatcherism) explanation of how to run an economy like a home budget which is naive redneck BS!
productivity is very hard to measure and as you get more people into employment in your economies, productivity goes down same all over the world I have studied every economy going back to Egyptian times.
Your simplistic bullshit is just that, unresearched redneck moralizing bullshit!
So Srylands say due to your small government argument we have a foot in mouth out break or as we are about to see a company like Fontera implodes all because of poor oversight.
My guess is you will say something like ‘thats just market forces at work’, yet many jobs will be lost, not to mention our reputation, so yes governments do create jobs through good governance.
Another twit with the idea that, say, a Teacher, or a Doctor, working in the State sector, is not part of the “” productive sector””.
Do they suddenly only become “”productive”” LOL, only if they are privatised?
Srylands statement of course comes from the laffer curve idea.
That expansion of Government provision of services always displaces the private sector.
If that was really the case then you would expect the countries with extremely large State shares in the economy to be the worst off. Which is obviously not the case.
Countries with large State investment in the economy are the most successful. Some States manage with no private sector at all. (Not what I would recommend though).
Every one from Singapore to Norway, Germany and Denmark.
Countries which have high State spending either/or both percentage wise or per capita.
How are your low tax, small Government countries doing? Srylands.
Funny that everyone wants to immigrate to countries with high levels of State social spending.
Not many want to go to Somalia. Your ideal of small Government and unlimited/unregulated free enterprise.
Shrinking the States share of the economy is working so well in Greece, Spain, Ireland and Italy, Right!
You claim to be in business. How well would your business be doing without our State provided infrastructure?
Painting rocks white is of course silly. Neither a public nor private sector organisation would do this because:
1. The private sector organisation would not achieve a cash flow for doing so.
2. The public sector organisation would not achieve a political mandate for doing so.
Different means of accountability, same end result.
Now the cash flow mechanism is simpler, faster and more direct. If you can’t find the cash to pay the wages and overheads this month you must take immediate action. Indeed this is why the private sector is good at things that are relative low-risk, short-term and local in scope … like selling baked beans. The downside is that it’s very hard to get things done that you cannot extract an immediate direct cash-flow from.
By contrast political accountability works over more variable time-frames, with more variable responses. If a government ultimately loses the confidence of the people they eventually have to take some action. But there is a fair bit of flexibility, resilience and ability to spread risk over time. This is why the public sector is better at high-risk, long-term and globally scoped undertakings ….like education and health.
Taken to the next level – and this is already done in some sectors, car industry, defense etc…- is the use of robots in production and online shopping instead of shops. Who is really needed in such a “productive world”? It also means that there is no need to be governed as the corporates are not even overseen today, let alone under such circumstance.Tax take will decline to a mere trickle and the rulers of foreign politics and defense could as well be appointed directors of the corporate body. This would be the smallest government and highest productivity one can think of.
I belief we have to rethink the way society works, the sooner the better.
“and online shopping instead of shops. ”
You still go to “shops”?
Beside your snide remark – yes ordinary people do actually go and get i.e. groceries – you have not come up with an answer to the issues our society is and will face. Slogans wont cut it.
Oh yes you do Srylands…….be honest now. And posing as a rightie who thinks ShonKey Python is actually Matt McCarten Left…….well…….you just look like a fuckwit.
Honesty is the best policy mate……wherever you’re at.
Have a Snickers bro’. You’re mean when you’re disappointed and outed for it.
Actually, the government can and should create jobs. Saying that it shouldn’t is just making our society ever more dependent upon the rich which is, of course, what they want and why they created the fiction that governments shouldn’t. When governments go round looking after the people that they’re supposed to serve the capitalists lose power.
Your view is in direct contradiction of reality.
I don’t think Shitlands has ever been treated at a public hospital, been pulled over by a policeman, or had a letter delivered to his address, by the sounds of it. Or, he’s an idiot.
Whatever – there is too much drug use amongst welfare recipients. Go to the East Cape and talk to logging companies trying to recruit tree pruners. They struggle to recruit and retain young unemployed men because of drug testing. It is a serious problem.
Of course employed people will use more drugs than those on welfare – they have more money. Doesn’t mean that it is not a serious problem.
logging companies have also been exploiting workers, the word gets around young people don,t want to go out in work gangs to work for eight hours, when they get to work they are given the dangerous work with little training while the contract workers take the easy work easy money
The eight hours becomes 10 to 12 hrs work with no pay for the extra hours putting these workesr health safety at risk no pay for the extra hours and quite often no pay at all as alot of these contractors keep the wages and fob off young naive workers!
more blame shifting just like your leader!
then we should drug and alcohol test students whose parents are wealthy,as they are getting 70% of their fees paid for by the state mp.s are recieving 100% funding by the state drug test cops ird staff work and income defence force roading contractors etc etc.
Sure no problem with those suggestions. Well done.
nice – so that’s about half the population you want mandatorily drug-tested then, oh great hero of freedom.
+1
I don’t think that employers who pay minimal wages for difficult dangerous and dirty work, far from home, are going to get the pick of the bunch, somehow.
Not busy, today? Again?
You need to find a useful hobby.
The problem is not a lack of training places. It is a mixture of motivation, ability to relocate, and sadly very low skill levels, demotivation, and drug use.
The problem is a lack of training programs. It is also a mixture of incompetence by government, ability to forecast when builders would be required, and sadly, very low levels of intelligence.
FIFY
What’s not to like aye! It’s a win win situation. Those Chinese will work for nothing (their visas will be tied to a specific employer – just to keep track of them of course), and Fonterra can assist in some sort of feeding programme akin to weatbix and milk in schools. Perhaps something like corn product and milk whey.
Nathe-the-man Guy and Soimun Brudges can keep an eye on the whole scheme to ensure transparency and oversight.
Yes but most Chinese are lactose intolerant. Getting Fonterra to feed them – bad idea.
Srylands we here are BS intolerant so go back to KB like you promised a few days ago but as usual you blindly follow your leader in breaking promises
I imagine their also botulism-intolerant too – but then what’s a few chinks between friends! We’ve still got the nargy-nation to work on for our next FTA – and who knows ….. something may still come of that South American jaunt earlier this year
correction ‘their’ should read ‘they are’.
No doubt there will be a brown shirt along shortly though to rectumfy the sitch
‘
I used to be a shocking grammar Naz1 . . . then I saw this: http://youtu.be/J7E-aoXLZGY
Beautiful.
“A lack of training programmes”
Here is a list of (some free) courses – all with spaces available.
where is the list?
vacant as always, spylands
And srylands pulls out all the BS.
You’re not forced to bring them in at all.
No, it’s a lack of being supported through training either by the government or the businesses.
Well, I’m pretty sure that if you paid enough to cover expenses including the expense of relocating then people would be motivated. Drug use isn’t that much of an issue – never has been. If it was all those people drinking alcohol (a legal drug) wouldn’t have a job.
That “cycle” is a direct result of capitalism because capitalism forces poverty on the many. When people don’t have access to the needed to resources to better themselves, to make a go of life then they inevitably lose self-esteem and start to see no point in doing anything. Get these people to the resources they need and that cycle will come to an end but the capitalists don’t want that because then they’d actually have competition and wouldn’t be able to profit so much.
“Well, I’m pretty sure that if you paid enough to cover expenses including the expense of relocating then people would be motivated.”
God what an entitlement culture you live in.
Their support should be a bus ticket to ChCh. One way.
Srylands,
Supplying people with the means that they don’t have to get somewhere and set up somewhere to live is not displaying an attitude of ‘entitlement culture’, it is simply an attitude of addressing the practical obstacles that a person on welfare would have to getting those jobs in Chch.
Surely even you can see this point?
Are you willing to pay to go to work? Because that’s what you’re asking people to do.
“No, it’s a lack of being supported through training either by the government or the businesses.”
So a student allowance or a loan is not good enough? Bloody hell.
When it doesn’t cover the bills? No it’s not and nobody should ever have to borrow to do training.
Uruguay to Become First Nation to Fully Legalize Marijuana: Blow to Ruinous US War on Drugs
And the sooner we legalise marijuana here in NZ the better as well.
Christ Draco T!!!!
This IS serious!
You do realise those bloody narco states COULD (possibly, maybe, at a pinch) be financing the Yell Kida!
What can be done?
This really IS a crisis!
I know …. let’s trust in our Proim Munsta and our agencies of state to protect us.
After all – we lekd them, and they’ve got OUR best, bestest, bestest bestest intrusts at heart! (AYE?)
Portugal and the Netherlands have already moved in terms of legalisation. Uruguay isn’t the first, but it is good seeing it happen in South America. As always, drug laws there are used to attack the poor, curb civil rights and excuse brutal militarised police forces.
It would be nice to have intelligent discussions on this website without sryland continually derailing it.
So boring.
I don’t think it was intelligent before I came along.
🙄
Still here?
Schrilands you are just wheeling out the same lines word for word letter for letter even the punctuation marks of other neo liberal has beens!
Show us some evidence your neo liberal moralistic crap works.I have researched and studied economics for over 30 years and have found no place your simplistic naive short sighted model works!
We should all just ignore him. He says nothing of any value.
I know.
However he takes up so many space and we have to skim past all the comments to get to constructive discussions.
Grant Robertson on democracy in the Labour Party.
http://blog.labour.org.nz/2013/08/04/labours-policy-platform/
That apparatchik Beltway Grant Robertson on “democracy” on Beige Alert?! “Leonid Brezhnev* on democracy” would be less cynical, more inspiring and sincere.
Nice words. Coming from someone else, I might believe them.
*Not the worst, but certainly the dullest.
latest Poll
:
ONE News Colmar Brunton poll:
NAT 46%(dwn 3),
LAB 33%,
GRN 14%(up 5),
NZF 3%,
MAO 2%,
ACT 1%
CNSV 1%(dwn 1)
Congratulations to the Green Party. Thoroughly deserved.
Yes thoroughly deserved. Well done Greens.
Interestingly, the polling period was 27th to 31st July, so got much of the housing policy stuff, but missed much of the Henry inquiry blow up.
I thought the Greens would do well on the GCSB issue. Let’s hope they can sustain the momentum.
More deets here:
76% of polling was done after Labour’s housing announcement ..
Party which is disciplined, focused, consistent, competently led, not back-stabbing … gets more votes.
Party which isn’t any of those things … doesn’t.
This will be a surprise to nobody at all. So naturally, nothing will change.
Interesting. Looks like the MP will hold the balance of power.
MMP seat allocator has change a bit, lets see if this link works… this is based on the MP having 2 electorate seats, and there being an overhang of 1 seat. It assumes that UF don’t retain their seat (and that NZF are out for being under the 5%).
NACT = 58
Lab/GP/Mana = 60
MP = 3
Total seats 121
(can’t remember the rules, who gets for form govt in that situation?)
http://www.elections.org.nz/voting-system/mmp-voting-system/mmp-seat-allocation-calculator?asPercentage=1&partyName_0=ACT+New+Zealand&partyVote_0=1&electorateSeats_0=1&partyName_1=Alliance&partyVote_1=0&electorateSeats_1=0&partyName_2=Aotearoa+Legalise+Cannabis+Party&partyVote_2=0&electorateSeats_2=0&partyName_3=Conservative+Party&partyVote_3=1&electorateSeats_3=0&partyName_4=Democrats+for+Social+Credit&partyVote_4=0&electorateSeats_4=0&partyName_5=Green+Party&partyVote_5=14&electorateSeats_5=0&partyName_6=Labour+Party&partyVote_6=33&electorateSeats_6=0&partyName_7=Libertarianz&partyVote_7=0&electorateSeats_7=0&partyName_8=Mana&partyVote_8=0&electorateSeats_8=1&partyName_9=M%C4%81ori+Party&partyVote_9=2&electorateSeats_9=2&partyName_10=National+Party&partyVote_10=46&electorateSeats_10=0&partyName_11=New+Zealand+First+Party&partyVote_11=3&electorateSeats_11=0&partyName_12=United+Future&partyVote_12=0&electorateSeats_12=0&partyName_opt_0=Other+Party&partyVote_opt_0=0&electorateSeats_opt_0=0&partyName_opt_1=Other+Party&partyVote_opt_1=0&electorateSeats_opt_1=0&partyName_opt_2=Other+Party&partyVote_opt_2=0&electorateSeats_opt_2=0&partyCount=13&optPartyCount=3&action=Calculate+parliamentary+seats
Doesn’t seem to change much if UF keep their seat
http://www.elections.org.nz/voting-system/mmp-voting-system/mmp-seat-allocation-calculator?asPercentage=1&partyName_0=ACT+New+Zealand&partyVote_0=1&electorateSeats_0=1&partyName_1=Alliance&partyVote_1=0&electorateSeats_1=0&partyName_2=Aotearoa+Legalise+Cannabis+Party&partyVote_2=0&electorateSeats_2=0&partyName_3=Conservative+Party&partyVote_3=1&electorateSeats_3=0&partyName_4=Democrats+for+Social+Credit&partyVote_4=0&electorateSeats_4=0&partyName_5=Green+Party&partyVote_5=14&electorateSeats_5=0&partyName_6=Labour+Party&partyVote_6=33&electorateSeats_6=0&partyName_7=Libertarianz&partyVote_7=0&electorateSeats_7=0&partyName_8=Mana&partyVote_8=0&electorateSeats_8=1&partyName_9=M%C4%81ori+Party&partyVote_9=2&electorateSeats_9=2&partyName_10=National+Party&partyVote_10=46&electorateSeats_10=0&partyName_11=New+Zealand+First+Party&partyVote_11=3&electorateSeats_11=0&partyName_12=United+Future&partyVote_12=0&electorateSeats_12=1&partyName_opt_0=Other+Party&partyVote_opt_0=0&electorateSeats_opt_0=0&partyName_opt_1=Other+Party&partyVote_opt_1=0&electorateSeats_opt_1=0&partyName_opt_2=Other+Party&partyVote_opt_2=0&electorateSeats_opt_2=0&partyCount=13&optPartyCount=3&action=Calculate+parliamentary+seats
However if the MP lost all their electorate seats, the left would have a clear win. Would the GP, Mana and Labour work together on that? Apparently they’d rather lose the election.
http://www.elections.org.nz/voting-system/mmp-voting-system/mmp-seat-allocation-calculator?asPercentage=1&partyName_0=ACT+New+Zealand&partyVote_0=1&electorateSeats_0=1&partyName_1=Alliance&partyVote_1=0&electorateSeats_1=0&partyName_2=Aotearoa+Legalise+Cannabis+Party&partyVote_2=0&electorateSeats_2=0&partyName_3=Conservative+Party&partyVote_3=1&electorateSeats_3=0&partyName_4=Democrats+for+Social+Credit&partyVote_4=0&electorateSeats_4=0&partyName_5=Green+Party&partyVote_5=14&electorateSeats_5=0&partyName_6=Labour+Party&partyVote_6=33&electorateSeats_6=0&partyName_7=Libertarianz&partyVote_7=0&electorateSeats_7=0&partyName_8=Mana&partyVote_8=0&electorateSeats_8=2&partyName_9=M%C4%81ori+Party&partyVote_9=2&electorateSeats_9=0&partyName_10=National+Party&partyVote_10=46&electorateSeats_10=0&partyName_11=New+Zealand+First+Party&partyVote_11=3&electorateSeats_11=0&partyName_12=United+Future&partyVote_12=0&electorateSeats_12=1&partyName_opt_0=Other+Party&partyVote_opt_0=0&electorateSeats_opt_0=0&partyName_opt_1=Other+Party&partyVote_opt_1=0&electorateSeats_opt_1=0&partyName_opt_2=Other+Party&partyVote_opt_2=0&electorateSeats_opt_2=0&partyCount=13&optPartyCount=3&action=Calculate+parliamentary+seats
With just those party’s whoever the Maori Party sided with would form the Government…
Yep, but,
Will NZF reach the threshhold?
Will the MP get any seats, and will they hold their list votes?
My view on NZFirst, touch and go, But, always remembering that even under massive fire from the opposition and media at the time NZFirst still managed 4.8% of the party vote so i cannot see that Party being as low as 3%,
NZFirst tho will struggle, there is little impetus for ‘activists’ to support that Party in 2014 and the opposite is now true,
i take my view of the Mana Party from a basis of what occurred in the Ikaroa-Rawhiti byelection after which the Roy Morgan polled Mana at 1.5%, (a list seat in it’self),
Given that Mana, contesting Ikaroa-Rawhiti for the first time picked up 4000+ votes off of the Maori Party then there is no reason to believe that Mana will not end the 2014 campaign with up to 1.5-2.5% of the party vote,
Flavell on those numbers is GONE from Waiariki, his majority is only 1900 votes and Labour have nothing to gain by seriously contesting this electorate seat and lots to lose as this besides Hone’s Te Tai Tokerau is the next most winnable seat for Mana,
Sharples’s Tamaki-Makaurau is also a goner for the Maori party where Sharples holds it by a mere 1000 votes over Labour’s Shane Jones who should win it for Labour in 2014 although with a large chunk of the electorate and Party votes going across to Mana,
Auntie Tariana’s seat, meh???, i cannot pick it, don’t know who Tariana has picked to stand there and don’t know what sort of strength Mana have in the electorate, Labour i am picking to just win it with Mana picking up a good chunk of the Maori Party’s party vote,
The Maori Party party vote across NZ, i pick it to halve, and 90% of that halving of the Maori Party % to go to the Mana Party,
If there’s a overhang in Parliament 2015 it will be one of Mana Party MP’s…
Thanks, good to see some analysis of the Maori seats. Still, Mana made some big predictions in the past that haven’t come true, so I’m not sure that the MP can be ruled out so easily. The question then becomes, what would they do if they held the balance of power? Presumably go back to their electorates and members as ask?
The real problem is NZF, and Labour/left voters, including some here, who believe that a NZF list vote helps the left somehow. Would like to see someone explain that too.
The posit that a vote for NZFirst applied for the 2011 election, and i might add had Labour gained a couple of more % points than what it did would have come within a whisker of giving Slippery’s crew the kick,
But it isn’t Mana that is making such predictions, those are my very own little analysis of where Mana now stand in the Maori political pecking order and are based upon the Ikaroa-Rawhiti by-election,
In Ikaroa-Rawhiti the Maori Party lost 1/2 it’s 2011 vote all but a 100 of those votes went to the Mana Party,
A simple transfer of that Maori Party loss across all the Maori electorates will see them disappear from the Parliament, and, my rough calculations tell me that Mana would only need pick up 1/2 of those lost Maori Party party votes to gain 2.5% of that party vote,
The loss of that Maori Party party vote in 2014 is also why i see Labour as polling a bit lower than it’s actual support as the share of the Maori Party party vote that Labour will pick up is probably 1%…
Seriously???, i assume you mean what would the Maori Party do if by some fluke that party is still represented by an MP in the 2015 Parliament,
Go back to their electorate and members and ask, that a giggle, Te Ururoa would consult the nearest mirror and then phone all and sundry telling them He is open for Biz and please gentleman place your bids now…
“But it isn’t Mana that is making such predictions,”
Mana seemed confident that they would decimate the MP. They haven’t done that, yet. I think they will continue to grow, but not as fast as they were suggesting. That’s why I’m not entirely convinced of the collapse of the MP, but can live in hope (although I tend to think it’s for Maori to sort out, and I don’t know enough to know if the collapse of the MP entirely is a good thing or not).
if they held the balance of power in Nov 2014.
Are you suggesting that when they first had the choice to go with NACT, that they said they would consult with their members, but didn’t?
8% of people polled would give their electorate vote to the Green party. FFS!
Yes, so let’s have the people who say don’t vote tacitcally, come along and explain that now 😉
Although to be fair, the GP does campaign on two ticks, so that’s probably where the stupid is.
Green party campaign on two ticks? Got a link for that weka?
Sorry, no, but I heard it straight from Russel Norman’s mouth before the last election. He might not have said actively campaigning (so I don’t know if it was on billboards, that sor of thing), but he definitely meant that GP policy was to go for both ticks.
Because giving my electorate vote to Labour would mean voting for effing Robertson. I’d rather sandpaper my nipples.
Pretty sure that counts as tactical voting Rhinocrates.
Not that sophisticated. Pure and simple disgust.
When you vote, you don’t vote for someone who says that they’ll give you a fluffy unicorn, you vote for them if you have confidence that they will actually try to.
Beltway Grant doesn’t quite exude that impression from every one of his pores.
Sure, but the point we were discussing was people giving two ticks to the GP, because they think the GP needs two ticks, when the GP don’t and someone else would be better off with the electorate tick.
Your case sounds entirely reasonable to me, but I’m curious what you would do if electorate voting Robertson was tactically the better thing to do eg if it was a close contest between Labour and National. Or hypothetically, Robertson was standing in Ohariu and had a chance of ousting Dunne/UF. Would you still electorate vote away from Robertson (assuming that person met your unicorn criteria)?
“Criteria” is plural. “Criterion” is singular and more appropriate. Sorry about the pedantry – I do admit to being a wanker.
I see your point and agree, and pragmatically, I might get extremely drunk and tick Robertson if it were very close if Franks or Prebble were standing again, but I reserve my right to say that as a Wellington Central voter, I do not see Robertson as my representative.
His electorate office is literally right across the road from a WINZ office on Willis Street, he could see it right out his window, but that hypocrite doesn’t give a wet shit about the poor in real life.
“Tactical voting” for me means voting for the “least awful who’s likely to get a seat at Bellamy’s”, and that’s bad faith as far as I’m concerned. I deserve better than the least awful as my representative, I’ve lived here a lot longer than that opportunist and carpetbagging Beltway Grant doesn’t cut it.
“I’m curious what you would do if electorate voting Robertson was tactically the better thing to do eg if it was a close contest between Labour and National.”
There’s an assumption built into that question that supporting Labour is necessarily a tactical goal.
Also, there’s a difference between tactical voting and strategic voting.
“Tactical voting” for me means voting for the “least awful who’s likely to get a seat at Bellamy’s”, and that’s bad faith as far as I’m concerned. I deserve better than the least awful as my representative, I’ve lived here a lot longer than that opportunist and carpetbagging Beltway Grant doesn’t cut it.
I don’t think I’ve ever voted in an electorate where I felt like the candidate would be a good representative of me, so voting for me has always been more pragmatic, around what kind of govt is realistic, or what I don’t want, rather than thinking that I’m voting with any kind of purity.
“I’m curious what you would do if electorate voting Robertson was tactically the better thing to do eg if it was a close contest between Labour and National.”
There’s an assumption built into that question that supporting Labour is necessarily a tactical goal.
Also, there’s a difference between tactical voting and strategic voting.
Yes true, I can that it might be better for Roberston to have a low electorate vote and that that might serve the left better in the medium and long term. Maybe even the short term.
I guess the better example is Waitakere and having Sepuloni as the electoriate MP instead of Shipley. But that doesn’t really compare with Rhinocrates situation, who is stuck with a useless option.
I disagree that your interpretation of my voting has been tactical.
Tactical voting is what delivered Banks to parliament.
voting for me has always been more pragmatic,
Indeed, appropriate point,Weka, so I guess that we see conflicting idealisms, not ideologies.
I am an idealist when it comes to democracy. If I have to vote for a representative, then they have to represent me.
Still, while a candidate would never be “perfect” for me (too much hair, likes Dmitri Shostakovich and Brian Eno less than me, etc), I just simply cannot accept Beltway Grant as my representative under any terms. He has no loyalty to his electorate because he’s a parachute candidate, he has no loyalty to the traditional Labour voter or those whom Labour needs now.
I urge people to make moral and ideological choices about their representatives.
This is the issue: representatives are representative , not merely expedient.
That said, I hope that you have a better candidate for your electorate.
I guess the better example is Waitakere and having Sepuloni as the electoriate MP instead of Shipley. But that doesn’t really compare with Rhinocrates situation, who is stuck with a useless option.
Indeed – that would suddenly make things easy- albeit expensive (I really don’t have the budget for much good whisky).
I was very sad not to see Carmel Sepuloni win, especially considering her opponent, and by such a small margin!
Yes but the same could be said of Labour when they contest the Te Tai Tokerau and Waiariki seats,
Polling in the 30’s on the party vote Labour has got nothing to win even if they won both electorates,
Labour should they win both those seats will not gain any extra MP’s in the House and winning those 2 seats might cost Labour the election, the fact is should they not contest those 2 seats Labour will have the number of seats in the House dictated by it’s % of the Party vote and at least 2 seats in the House that Will Not ever vote for National…
Let’s put it like this: Natz gained 47% of the electorate vote in that Culmar Brunton Polling. Labour gained 39% and Greens 8%. If those who plan to waste their electorate vote on the Greens instead voted for Labour candidates, they would also have 47% of the electorate votes. An 8% swing in favour of Labour candidates could secure another 5 electorate seats at least. Basically if you vote for The Greens in your electorate, you may as well be voting for your National party candidate.
“Basically if you vote for The Greens in your electorate, you may as well be voting for your National party candidate.”
The answer is obvious then – vote for the National Party candidate. They are all left wing parties anyway.
Sure, just like Ronald Reagan and Bush Senior were left wing pro-union pro-worker pro-manufacturing Presidents.
Never let it be said that i would have a moan about a mainstream media poll that shows the left in a good position,( and still a long way out from November 2014),
But, this poll strikes me as ‘funny’ in that it shows the Green vote to have jumped a massive 5% while showing only a loss of 4% in total from other Party’s,
What also does not quite compute is that 4% of ‘shown’ shift has come from the Conservative Party and National Party to the Green Party,
Now no matter how much i would be amused at such a wild swing in the mood of the electorate taking 4% from the far right of the spectrum across to the far left seems to me to be a little far fetched,
Of course, Labour for all i know may have picked up that far right vote decamping from National and the Conservatives at the same time as the same % of Labour voters scarpered across to the Green Party, all very confusing i know, and, i might add, slightly unbelievable,
Having had my moan tho, the Colmar Brunton is pretty much where i see the state of the party’s to be ( in my opinion),
Altho i pick Labour to be a little light and the Greens to have profited in this particular poll because of that light reading for Labour, (believe me i would like nothing better than to be proved wrong),
No Mana Party, i think that’s a mistake especially after the Ikaroa-Rawhiti by election result showed the massive gains Mana have made mainly at the expense of the Maori party…
PS, the length of time between Colmar-Brunton’s, 3 months, may explain some of the strange looking shifts i was having my wee moan about,
That and the Brunton says that 2% of the fence sitters came off it and declared a prefferrence…
Chuck on roughly 10% positive for the combined left to allow for the ah standard Brolmar bias, and allow for the Spygate traction to come (thank you Pascale), and sleep well Standardistas. For your sins (and yes we all sin dear, sorry thought that was your leg) three mail hairies, a hail holy queen for Peter may god rest his soul and fast from Shearerpoking for a week cold showers maybe, go now and sin no more, sorry sorry something on your cardy..
And look where most of it has come from… the National Party.
Finally – an acknowledgement that unionism is the solution.
http://www.businessinsider.com.au/labor-unions-wages-2013-8
Fonterra’s handling of the contamination at their Hautapu Factory is unbelievable. I cant help but think the attempt to cover this up and the lack of openness and honesty we are seeing from Fonterra is related to the way our country is currently lead. Key and National have turned cover ups and dishonesty into an art form.
This Fonterra cock up is catastrophic…expect some fairly senior heads to roll this week….and I predict an eventual reversal of the 50 cent increase in the payout announced earlier this week (Thats probably best case scenario at this stage)
I wonder if HONESTY & INTEGRITY will play an important part in the 2014 election…should be good for the Green Party, clearly the only major party that has this in truck loads.
+1
Agreed. Absolute shocker.
But real corruption and the Corporate state have now arrived in NZ.
Fonterra, too big to regulate. Farmers run the show. I see a Feds spokesman blames the testing and the media – after all, no-one died. (Since lost the link, mmmm…!)
Where is the Ministry of Primary Industries in all this? Hardly a suitable regulatory authority. Minister Guy spends most of his time talking up the benefits of irrigated dairying, and downplaying its effects on the environment.
And this is the Nats’ doing – they set up MPI. If the regulatory authority was the Min of Health things might have been different.
This will be the week that Key heads away on holiday again, my guess.
Federated Farmers vice president Dr William Rolleston begged people not to jump to conclusions.
”As far as we know no-one has got sick, it’s the testing that has brought this to the surface … and that has to be something that will help build Fonterra’s reputation,” he said.
MPI and Fonterra needed to do further testing, he said.
”
Got it. Another Federated Farmers’ Classic!
if the regulatory authority was the Min of Health things might have been different.
It would be the fault of the quasi autonomous company asure nz that would have oversight and would have some portion of the phytosanitary certification,whether they were informed or when is another matter.
testing would be especially difficult,if there was suspicion of the causative agent .i would suggest it would only be able to be tested at Wallaceville or an overseas certified lab.
Fonterra’s handling of the contamination at their Hautapu Factory is unbelievable. I cant help but think the attempt to cover this up and the lack of openness and honesty we are seeing from Fonterra is related to the way our country is currently lead. Key and National have turned cover ups and dishonesty into an art form.
This Fonterra cock up is catastrophic…
Saarbo, do you have something I can read that supports that. Because what I’ve seen on Stuff etc doesn’t.
Do you know what the actual risk is? AFAIK, they found the Clostridium botulinum bacteria in its inert, not its active form. That’s a different thing than botulism.
Don’t get me wrong, I think Fonterra rate fairly high on the evil scale, and are capable of covering up things to save their own butts. But, I don’t think they are stupid enough to allow botulism into the food chain and then go slow on resolving that, so am guessing the actual risk is pretty low. Unfortunately the MSM aren’t providing any useful information on that, so we’re pretty much in the dark.
Foodborne botulism is a rare illness caused by eating foods contaminated with botulinum toxin. Spores of C. botulinum are ubiquitous in the environment (3), but growth and elaboration of toxin occur only under particular conditions that include an anaerobic, low-salt, low-acid environment. Bacterial growth is inhibited by refrigeration below 4°C, heating above 121°C, high water activity,or acidity (pH <4.5) (4). Toxin is destroyed by heating to 85°C for at least 5 minutes, and spores are inactivated by heating to 121°C under pressure of 15–20 lb/in2 for at least 20 minutes (5).
My emphasis.
http://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/10/9/03-0745_article.htm
Only what I have read in the media Weka. This happened in May 2012, why are we only hearing about this now? remember this is all in the shadow of the melamine disaster, Fonterra need to treat any contamination with real care and respect. China and Russia have stopped all Dairy imports from NZ. My thinking is that this is catastrophic.
Only what I have read in the media Weka. This happened in May 2012, why are we only hearing about this now? remember this is all in the shadow of the melamine disaster, Fonterra need to treat any contamination with real care and respect. China and Russia have stopped all Dairy imports from NZ. My thinking is that this is catastrophic.
I’m a bit confused by that. I agree that the health risks should be taken seriously, but that is separate from economic issues (my thinking is the slowing of the industrial dairying in NZ would be good for NZ).
Re the health issues, well I’ll say it again, we don’t know what the risk is, but it’s possible that it is very low. Clostridium is not synonmous with people getting ill from botulism. You need specific conditions for that to happen.
To put it another way, I think the real concern here is that the MSM haven’t reported what the actual risk is. If it turns out that Fonterra have been negligent and cavalier, then throw all kinds of shit at them.
The other factor is, how common or rare is it for a pipe to become contaminated in this way? How often do people in NZ get botulism? We don’t have a context to understand this within.
And industrially produced food is always going to have levels of unsafety that are specific to it. Look at the ecoli outbreaks in the US in recent years – they came from spinach that was grown with animal shit spread in the fields, and then the spinach was distributed via the industrial food supply chains and it was difficult for them to figure out where it came from and what the source was. I’d like to know how clear and efficient Fonterra’s supply chains are.
Yes, I understand where you are coming from Weka, I hope you are right. But we do know that the Chinese are incredibly sensitive since the melamine disaster which is completely understandable. Attached is the e mail from the fonterra Chairman yesterday, it raises a big question around TIMING. The problem occurred in May 2012 (Point 1), a POTENTIAL issue discovered in March 2013 (Point 7), Issue confirmed in July 2013 (Point 8)…..why did all of this take so long?
Fonterra let farmers know within a matter of hours whether there is contamination in their supply, why does it take Fonterra factories so long….its not a good look.
E mail from John Wilson to Farm Suppliers yesterday.
Good evening
1)Fonterra today advised eight customers of a quality issue involving three batches of whey protein concentrate (WPC80) produced at a single New Zealand manufacturing site in May 2012.
2)These companies are now investigating where the affected product is in their supply chains and if necessary, will initiate consumer product recalls.
3)There have been no reports of any illness linked to consumption of the whey protein. –4)Dairy products such as fresh milk, yoghurt, cheese, spreads and UHT milk products are not affected.
5)Food safety is Fonterra’s number one priority. Fonterra takes matters of public health extremely seriously and is doing everything it can to assist its customers to ensure any affected product is removed from the marketplace and that the public is made aware.
6)The business is working closely with New Zealand’s regulatory authority – the Ministry for Primary Industries – to keep New Zealand and offshore regulators informed.
7)Fonterra initially identified a potential quality issue in March this year, when a product tested positive for Clostridium. There are hundreds of different strains of Clostridium, the majority of which are harmless.
8)Product samples were then put through intensive testing over the following months. On Wednesday 31 July 2013, a test indicated the potential presence of suspected Clostridium Botulinum in a sample – a strain which can cause botulism.
9)This particular Whey Protein Concentrate (WPC80) is used by Fonterra’s customers in a range of products including infant formula, growing up milk powder and sports drinks – and that is why the business has acted with speed so any potentially affected product is removed from the marketplace.
10)Fonterra is continuing to work with customers and will provide more information as it becomes available.
John
Pono, Weka. We don’t really know the full health risks, but from what we do know, the reaction does seem a little disproportionate. Just like the recent reaction to the wrong paperwork which held tonnes of mutton on Chinese wharves.
What we do know however, is that the Chinese are rather sensitive to international criticism. Especially from arrogant minnows who cuddle up to Taiwan and Uncle Sam. Oh – and that our own dear wee PM recently accused them publicly of “spreading their tentacles” in the South Pacific.
The pink hand of Gooberdick strikes again.
Ok, but again, that’s an economic issue not a health one. Why should we care if the Chinese stop buying our diary?
an art form.
No, “art form” indicates skill and care.
Er, agreeing with you by the way 🙂
Fair point Rhino.
National are classic bull shit artists.
For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled.
Richard Feynman (Nobel Prize winner)
There are other opinions
John Key (arsehole)
haha, you are an Artist Rhinocrates!
Well, like an artist, I’m starving… or at least, forced by economics into brief periods of sobriety.
🙂
If all else fails you can stick your head under a rug with Shostakovich……Shostakovich gets more and more appealing
Schrilands with all your neo liberal arguements can you show us some proof they work which countries or states work .name policy country or sate ,show,evidence or put
Up or shut up!
Schrilands with all your neo liberal arguements can you show us some proof they work which countries or states work .name policy country or sate ,show,evidence or put
Up or shut up!
Here you go:
New Zealand’s economic performance over the last six decades has been poor compared
with most other Organisation for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD) countries.
Theory and evidence suggest that high levels of government expenditure, as a share of the
economy, can be detrimental to economic growth due to the economic costs of raising
taxation to finance expenditure
Economic theory suggests that a large government may undermine economic growth
through the cost of financing expenditure and differences in the rate of productivity growth
between the public and private sector.
A number of countries have smaller governments than New Zealand, including Australia and South Korea, with the larger governments generally being European.
The classic natural experiment is North and South Korea. North Korean economic policies are remarkably similar to those expounded by many The Standard contributors. Didn’t work so well.
The other example is Australia – much smaller government over the last 30 years compared to NZ, with deeper more competitive markets – The country has a population 5 x NZ’s but the sharemarket is 30x larger. Says it all. (Another reason we desperately need 100% privatisation asap)
And of course New Zealanders vote with their feet by moving there in large numbers.
Schrilands BS Australia smaller govt than NZ what absolute tossing lies.
Australia has out grown NZ because of cheaper housing better family tax credits concentrated population bigger govt subsidies tougher tarrifs Capital gains tax mining mining and mining!
Australia has a far bigger govt than us lower house upper house state govts wow!
You are just plain lying
Ok you will be rushed into the front bench of National Monday morning born leader liar!
Australia smaller govt than NZ what absolute tossing lies.” Tosser.
Bloody hell – you people don’t let facts get in the way do you? Australia has a much smaller government share of GDP than NZ – that includes ALL levels of government. In 2011 Australia had a government sector = 34% of GDP – in NZ it was 44%. The trend over the last 30 years has been for an overall widening of the gap.
And of course because government is smaller overall tax take is smaller too.
Mining explains a relatively small proportion of Australia’s economic performance – the resources boom was a help but it has been the services sector that has driven growth.
But feel free to ignore facts and carry on with your prejudices. Australia has grown despite some negative policies like PMV subsidies – NOT because of them
Look at figure 8 in this report:
http://www.treasury.govt.nz/publications/research-policy/tp/govtsize/14.htm
Australian government expenditure – at all levels of government has been between 5 and 10% of GDP SMALLER than NZ for 30 years. And the gap is increasing.
http://www.treasury.govt.nz/publications/research-policy/tp/govtsize/13.htm
It says a lot that you think the opposite is correct.
shrilands thats federal spending. mining has been booming for the last thirty years their population is concentrated which is cheaper to provide services.
that is federal govt spending it does not include state govt spending then when you look at the size of govt spending per person, Australia out spends us take mining out of the equation and your figures will look sick, unemployment has been higher in Australia most of that time
Australia spends more on health welfare defence infrastructure per head than we do!
The size of the Australian economy allows them to spend more on all fronts than us.
Another reason is health insurance and compulsory super savings aren’t included!
Compulsory super savings has cut the amount of govt super paid out as well!
Now the mining boom is over Australia is hitting the skids NZ will feel the effects!
Australia has way more tarrifs than us as well!
Where Australia is making faster gains is in education they spend way more than us Australian have better access to tertiary education with much better performing universities.
“that is federal govt spending it does not include state govt spending” WRONG
Really? BTW I wish you would use punctuation.
It includes ALL government spending, including state spending net of intergovernmental transfers.
Australia has smaller government.
Of course it spends more per head – it is a richer country.
This is just a silly debate about something that is factual.
it is funny that you seem to attribute australia’s growth due to a single crude and highly debateable measure, while ignoring the many other factors that might also contribute to growth (including economies of scale: “Australia has smaller government.
Of course it spends more per head – it is a richer country” – and bigger in every way).
You can’t explain (let alone predict) a substantial part of a massive chaotic system with a single abstract measure. It’s just stupid to try.
Factual? More like stupid and irrelevant. NZ is poorer than most other OECD countries because we were idiots and followed the neolib free market prescription to the letter.
The fact you can’t see that is a serious problem undermining all your ongoing natter about what to do next.
Billions of NZD have been extracted out of NZ workers and companies to feed Australian bank shareholders over the last few years.
Of course the Aussies are doing it right.
NZ is poorer than most other OECD countries because we have a poor productivity record. The policy response to that has been well covered by the Treasury.
Even if Labour wins the next election they will get with the programme and follow most of these policies. e.g say goodbye to NZ Power.
http://www.treasury.govt.nz/publications/research-policy/tprp
Listening to treasury is what fucked up the country in the first place. More of the same will merely continue the same trends.
Really? You know which of the Treasury’s policy recommendations have been accepted by governments? You are really clear on that? I doubt you eben know what they are.
Other way around: if treasury is indeed consistent with your deranged political lens, then we can pick which policies were at least partial treasury recommendations. Privatisation, deregulation, removal of workers’ rights, and blaming the poor.
Using high levels of unemployment as a tool to control inflation.
It is simple:
“Productivity is the biggest long-run determinant of wages and living standards.”
It is productivity stupid.
not about productivity; productivity is a crock
why should a worker bother to participate in “productivity” improvement when time and again its the worker who gets screwed by changes while the fat cat owners take 98c out of every new dollar generated.
its about share of income – too much now in the hands of owners, corporates and shareholders, not enough in the hands of ordinary workers and citizens
“not about productivity; productivity is a crock”
I’m not going to try again. That is such an idiotic claim.
The CTU recognises that productivity is central to prosperity. Sure they might have different views to Treasury about HOW to lift productivity but they also will have a lot in common, and the CTU would certainly not say “productivity is a crock”.
http://union.org.nz/workplace-productivity/challenge
“Improving productivity has been identified as a key factor for New Zealand’s long term, sustainable economic growth and prosperity. Productivity levels affect our living standards, our ability to create jobs and our ability to afford education, health and other services.”
New Zealand Council of Trade Unions – Te Kauae Kaimahi
Your quote is as stupid as saying “humidity is the biggest long run determinant of precipitation”.
In a chaotic system, no single factor can be the deterimant of a desired outcome. In fact, the same input of that “determinant” can have dramatically different outcomes depending on what every single other factor is doing.
Treasury is wrong again treasury is loaded with right wing purists.
You look at every single industry in NZ and ask if they are improving productivity they are!
treasury is a right wing think tank subsidized by the tax payer.
so
Shrilands I wasn’t wrong STATE TAXES ie stamp duties land tax Varying state payroll taxes are not included in the OECD figure’s nor are3.5% + medicare contrbutions nor are compulsory 9% super contributions .so by the time you add those contributions into the overall figures theirs not a lot of difference!
Campbell live looked at that last week came to the same conclusion!
Manurfacturing has declined by 70% since the 1960’s 60% of Australia’s economy is service Industry.
Shril more lies from you federal govt taxes Aprox A$ 340 billion out $1008 billion
33% aprox as you have pointed out
State pay roll ,land taxes, stamp duties not included!
super contributions not included as they are seen as private investments
Medicare contributions not included as they are private contributions
We pay all of that to one govt so your facts are bullshit!
Please Australia also has an additional layer of GVT state which increases its governance ratio above NZ
Schrilands what was liar key in south Korea for recently was it to get them to allow our exports in to their country!
“what was liar key in south Korea for recently was it to get them to allow our exports in to their country!”
What?
I thought you said Korea had more open markets
If smaller government is so great for the country, why is it that unemployment and inequality skyrocketed at the same time the NZ cut the size of its govt around 1990?
It’s all very well saying that smaller government is better for the country, but that means shit if you have no job and can’t afford to put shoes on your kids’ feet. In fact, it’s more like your “economic theory” isn’t so much a better economy as it is throwing as many people under the bus as possible, and then blaming them for being unemployed or otherwise in need.
Australia has a higher minimum wage, something like a partially functioning union movement, a huge number of government subsidies to business, government investment in infrastructure, mineral resources that they exploit regardless of environmental and social cost, an apprenticeship program, government gifts to first home buyers, and far more government bureaucracy than NZ. Hardly a model for us to follow, but more successful in purely economic terms. Oh, and while Kiwi workers do a lot of the heavy lifting over there, Kiwi executives powder their noses at bars next to the Sydney Harbour and complain about how we want to care for our environment, all while spouting their Randian delusions. Cocaine does that, it makes people delusional. It’s almost as bad as neoliberal economics.
“Fonterra yesterday announced three batches of a whey protein called WPC80, manufactured in May last year, may have been contaminated by a dirty pipe at the company’s Hautapu plant”
So if there was another contamination event this instant, we wouldn’t know about it till October 2014 earliest?
“Fonterra said it initially identified a potential quality issue in March this year, when a product tested positive for Clostridium”
Link: http://www.odt.co.nz/news/national/267332/fonterra-products-hit-botulism-scare
But they can’t even tell us what country and products contain the fouled whey 3 months later? This is bad on so many levels.
You are right. Given the time to discover the contamination I would have thought a lot more product may have been contaminated.
Judith Collins is talking absolute drivel when she says the government can’t intervene in the Teina Pora issue.
http://tvnz.co.nz/national-news/nothing-stopping-review-teina-pora-case-labour-5526358
She says:
“New Zealand has an independent, highly regarded judiciary, with a robust appeal process for people who feel they have been wrongly convicted,”
and
“It would be completely inappropriate for a Minister of the Crown to interfere in the court process.”
This is complete and utter bile. If anyone thinks Key’s full of lies and deceit and has ongoing and total contempt for the intelligence of our citizens, then they should know we’d be in for far more of Collins ever became PM.
Andrew Little has rightly pointed out that the appeal hasn’t been lodged yet. But even if it had there’d still be nothing to stop the government looking into whether there were grounds to put things right. The Crown would (or at least should) in fact be doing this if and when the need to prepare for an appeal arose.
Ultimately there’s absolutely nothing stopping the Crown looking at the case again because it would be done with a view to being of benefit to Teina Pora. For example, a party in any litigation can choose to agree with the arguments of the other side. This is how parties to litigation reach settlement!
Judith Collins is wholly disingenuous in trying to spin the line that it would be inappropriate for the government to “intervene” in the Pora case. Doing so is not “intervening” – if there’s prina facie injustice she in fact has a duty to act. What she’s in effect saying is that the government does not have the power to fix an injustice. That’s plainly wrong. I’d go further to say it’s just darn right nasty, uncaring, cold and inhuman. Heaven help us if she’s ever PM.
Her redneck voters will look at the guy and say “So what if he didn’t do this one. Being in prison will have stopped him committing other offences.” The vileness inherent in their thought processes knows no bounds.
Her supporters would be saying that. It’d be good if MSM challenged her on her flawed logic and lack of principle. It always amazes me when lawyers try to do what she’s doing because it shows she’s prepared to use personal bias and adherence to ideological dogma to override established public service ethics and basic legal principle. It’s sometimes difficult to know precisely how in particular cases this happens. I don’t know Collins well enough to say whether she could be called a narcissist or not, but it’s pretty clear a lot of the signs are there.
I know the type Murray Olsen. All hot pontification about cases and lives they know absolutely nothing of. Larry-Loudmouth-Williams-Radio-Live style.
But wait until it’s one of their own entitled little bastards in the dock. The most innovative excuses and rationalisations when it’s one of their own little bastards in the dock.
And of course it would be madness, what’s more patently unjust, for other than a rehabilitative sentence to be handed down. “We want counselling for this boy right now ! Blah Blah Blah !”.
Dealt with the type thousands of times. Thick socially retarded fuckwits.
Collins is right in the first instance and it’s routine stuff…….while the case is in progress…….etc etc.
I’m not absolutely sure where it’s at so far but I recall hearing mention of application for the exercise of the royal prerogative, a pardon. Seemingly because there appears to be no taste for it in the government (Collins) it is now heading to the Privy Council. Because of Collins, Collins can say – “case in progress……” Technically.
A cry-off of course. Given that Judith is so absorbed in her Thatcher pretensions we cannot reasonably expect any other response. The same personal trait led her to all sorts of extraordinary overtness (and the spending of a rather large amount of public money) re the Binnie report.
You see this is a 17 year old (now 38), never amounted to much, Maori boy with a criminal record. Yes, in the slammer for 21 years. And yes, a fact which senior police officers, damn, the Police Association, are calling to be investigated. Unprecedented.
I’d like to think that Judith would agree he’s entitled to a pardon as matter of urgency and twenty, no thirty million. If you can put a price on it at all…….
There’s the rub. The Justice Sow values the money and fears the ignominy of having to concede, more than putting right the travesty. After all………we’re only talking Maori boy criminal underclass here……..
“Collins is right in the first instance and it’s routine stuff…….while the case is in progress…….etc etc.”
With respect, that’s not quite the case. If an injustice is identified the Crown can choose to address it at any point, regardless of whether an appeal has been lodge, is being contemplated or not. This, of course, makes sense: if the Crown has done something to someone it later realises it shouldn’t have it has every ability to fix it. What’s also important to note is that this is over and above the Royal Prerogative, which is different again. You’re right in that Pora’s off to the PC because government isn’t listening, which highlights further Collins’ lie that her hands are tied because the matter’s “with the courts”. This is a particularly large amount of shit coming out of Collins’ mouth this time, probably more than usual, and which the nature of has got me thinking about whether she’s narcissistic.
I agree entirely Mary. Don’t misunderstand me. I’m identifying that Collins is technically right in one part alone of the broad legal picture.
Of course it is from there that Collins chooses to speak.
The “speak” is rubbish as a disguise or excuse for this boy not already having a pardon.
All of the Thatcher disdain mentioned above is true. As are the reasons for that disdain.
Florists usually like flowers, jockeys horses, dancers dancing.
How come this Minister of Justice has a problem with you know what ?
Anyway, thanks to Jonathan Krebs counsel for Teina Pora – personal commitment to get the case to London for the Privy Council irrespective of insufficiency if any of legal aid grant. Would gladly contribute.
Thanks North. I guess my point is that I think Collins is not technically correct on anything she’s saying on this particular issue. What is the “one part alone of the broad legal picture” you’re saying she’s technically right about?
I hope you can see this. It’s Teina Pora’s daughter, who has more dignity in her left nostril than the whole of the NAct caucus:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=470358289701338
Bugger you Olsen. Fucking crying.
thank you murray… we have a long journey to bring us back to decency and justice. kia kaha to this young woman …
Hi Mary. My apprehension was that the Privy Council appeal was already underway and accordingly Collins was technically able to invoke sub-judice even though that amounted to a sidestepping of the huge justice issue here. Sub-Judy-Say. Horrors !
Then I see from the Herald this morning that the appeal is not yet underway and that Collins is now prepared to consider a formal investigation. Something she was always able to engage of course, had she the will to do so.
So yes, my assessment of Collins’ behaviour is unjustifiably charitable. For my part I simply cannot understand how a minister responsible for “Justice” could drag her heels in this unprecedented case………concerns of senior police officers, the Police Association, forensic pshychiatric evidence etc etc.
All that aside a gathering momentum now appears. Hopefully it is such that even the Justice Sow cannot stem it. Who knows ? The minister’s “doing the numbers” in what is already something of a cause celebre might well persuade her to make like donning the cloak of “justice” rather than deviously obstruct.
All power to Teina Pora ! And once he is free, all power to a very high level ministerial or other enquiry to identify the how and whom in this travesty. And fix on a truly awesome sum in compensation.
There should be no hiding in the thickets of extant legislation (if any) to artificially limit the level of compensation. There must be special legislation if necessary. Mmmmm…….that’s where this minister is bound to be a problem.
Notwithstanding their pious talk Justice and Truth are basically malleable concepts to this crowd. Money and how they “look” is their real imperative. The evil unleashed on Teina Pora is surpassed only by the evil extinguishment of Susan Burdett’s life. It is our duty as a nation to make truly conspicuous amends, mindful that compensation of whatever striking level can never truly displace the evil Teina Pora has suffered.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10908262