Open mike 05/10/2015

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1. Tautoko Mangō Mata 1

   5 October 2015 at 6:36 am

   TPP update

   Richard Madan ‏@RichardMadan 32s33 seconds ago
   Canada says #TPP agreement “close”; won’t go as far as Japan & Mexico that says imminent. So not a done deal yet #canpoli #elxn42

   Richard Madan ‏@RichardMadan 17m17 minutes ago
   A burst of energy filled hotel after word #TPP deal reached. I’m up live on @ctvnewschannel in moments to bring latest #elxn42

   Guajardo Says He Expects TPP Deal Sunday; Biologics, Dairy Still Not Done
   ATLANTA – Mexican Economy Secretary Ildefonso Guajardo Villarreal said midday Sunday (Oct. 4) that he expects Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) trade ministers will be able to reach an agreement by the end of the day here, but that parties were still working to hash out a compromise on the exclusivity period for biologic drugs.

   U.S., Australia Float Joint Biologics Text To Other TPP Countries For Vetting
   ATLANTA – The United States and Australia have jointly developed a text proposal on the exclusivity term for biologics medicines and overnight began showing it to other Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) countries in an effort to build support, in a move that is raising optimism that negotiators can reach a broader agreement by the end of the day Sunday (Oct. 4), according to informed sources.
   http://insidetrade.com/

   Burcu Kilic ‏@burcuno 44m44 minutes ago
   Reportedly Japanese Minister Amari said “a deal in principle”. Plenary sometime between 1&3 pm, press conference at 4 pm. #tpp

   Burcu Kilic ‏@burcuno 47m47 minutes ago
   Mexican Minister briefing Mexican stakeholders “we are making progress & expect a deal today”. #TPP

   Burcu Kilic ‏@burcuno 1h1 hour ago
   There has been so much speculation lately so i just want to set the record straight “nothing is agreed until everything is agreed” #TPP
   9:16 AM – 4 Oct 2015 · Details

   Burcu Kilic Retweeted
   León Felipe Sánchez ‏@lion05 1h1 hour ago
   Go Australia! Save the world from pharmaceutical apocalypse #TPPA

   Burcu Kilic ‏@burcuno 2h2 hours ago
   There are some reports that AU-US agree on 8 yrs data excl. Ignore them, US has only 4 yrs data excl., the rest (8 yrs) is market excl. #TPP

   Burcu Kilic Retweeted
   John Kehoe ‏@Johnkehoe23 1h1 hour ago
   @burcuno Robb says no change to Aus laws or regs on biologics.What this means for other countries I’m not sure http://www.afr.com/news/politics/national/us-australia-drug-dispute-is-holding-up-settlement-of-the-trans-pacific-trade-deal-20151003-gk0r65 …
   • b waghorn 1.1

     5 October 2015 at 6:49 am

     Jane Kelsey is due one tv1 any minute to talk tpp
     • Paul 1.1.1

       5 October 2015 at 6:53 am

       Would appreciate feedback on this interview
       • Srylands 1.1.1.1

         5 October 2015 at 7:06 am

         Why does TV nz keep interviewing this person. She is totally negative.. At least balance the communism with some other mainstream views.

         Peter Petri is expert on the TPPA and has taken a keen interest in the benefits to New Zealand.

         Ppetri.com
         • b waghorn 1.1.1.1.1

           5 October 2015 at 7:09 am

           English is on in 10 for your balance ,who do you think will be more honest?
           • David H 1.1.1.1.1.1

             5 October 2015 at 2:12 pm

             English was caught out this AM by Nadine in the Interview.. Can’t any Nat lie straight in bed .
         • Tracey 1.1.1.1.2

           5 October 2015 at 7:25 am

           Because she is an expert in aspects of the TPP slylands. You may not like her view but that doesn’t change that she can support her view. As for needing someone positive about TPP, aren’t Groser, English, Collins, Key, Joyce, and Dr Wayne Mapp enough for you and your media delights?

           Has Peter Petri seen the deal?
           • Paul 1.1.1.1.2.1

             5 October 2015 at 7:27 am

             Srylands bases his opinions on the cult of John Key.
             • Majic Mike …

               5 October 2015 at 4:04 pm

               Paul 5pylands just repeats what ever he is told.
               No brain no pain.
           • Paul 1.1.1.1.2.2

             5 October 2015 at 7:29 am

             He uses the ‘too big to fail’ argument.

             http://www.nbr.co.nz/article/tpp-too-big-fail-says-visiting-us-trade-deal-specialist-petri-b-175060
             • Draco T Bastard …

               5 October 2015 at 1:11 pm

               Ah, so he’s one of those people who supports massive corporate subsidies at everyone else’s expense which thus increases poverty for the many while enriching the rich.
           • Chooky 1.1.1.1.2.3

             5 October 2015 at 8:42 am

             +100
         • millsy 1.1.1.1.3

           5 October 2015 at 7:27 am

           Why dont you admit you think it is OK to our government to be sued for outlawing the pollution of our rivers.

           TPPA = profit before people
           • Paul 1.1.1.1.3.1

             5 October 2015 at 7:32 am

             Some people would defend anything.
             • Draco T Bastard …

               5 October 2015 at 1:08 pm

               SSLands would be one of the people suing.
         • Draco T Bastard 1.1.1.1.4

           5 October 2015 at 1:07 pm

           Why does TV nz keep interviewing this person. She is totally negative..

           Because she’s a knowledgeable person who knows what she’s talking about and who doesn’t let ideology colour her thinking.

           At least balance the communism with some other mainstream views.

           The problem is the mainstream views – they’re disconnected from reality.
2. Tautoko Mangō Mata 2

   5 October 2015 at 6:58 am

   Japan and Mexico had already accepted the 8 for biologics so they have finished playing their hands. That’s why they are keen to push things through.
3. Tautoko Mangō Mata 3

   5 October 2015 at 7:07 am

   Burcu Kilic ‏@burcuno 43s44 seconds ago
   In less than 2 hours, we may have the #TPP or maybe not. There are mixed messages but another meltdown like Maui is very unlikely.
   Burcu Kilic ‏@burcuno 4m4 minutes ago
   Burcu Kilic Retweeted iPolitics
   Chile & Peru are still fighting hard. I am sure ‘quite a number’ of high-level calls are going on now. #TPP
4. Tautoko Mangō Mata 4

   5 October 2015 at 7:18 am

   Burcu Kilic ‏@burcuno 50s50 seconds ago
   Just heard there would be a Canadian Press briefing at 3 pm. Quite curious what is happening to Canadian supply management system. #TPP

   Burcu Kilic ‏@burcuno 3m3 minutes ago
   # USTR just announced closing press conference, which will be held at 4 pm ET. Guess “#TPP in principle” is coming
   • Paul 4.1

     5 October 2015 at 7:24 am

     Bill English lies about TPP being pretty open
     Admits NZ has not taken a strong line on pharmaceutical issue.

     In less than 2 hours our sovereignty will be gutted.
     Key will have done his job and sold us to his banking and financier masters in the US.
     • Tracey 4.1.1

       5 October 2015 at 7:26 am

       Getting desperate to have poor Bill English speaking on it. He has his hands full lying about how the surplus is achieved (or not)
5. millsy 5

   5 October 2015 at 7:24 am

   Looks like we can say good bye to lower power prices and hello to high water prices, as water schemes are privatised.
   • Paul 5.1

     5 October 2015 at 7:24 am

     A sad day for democracy.
   • Puckish Rogue 5.2

     5 October 2015 at 8:50 am

     I hope you’re right cause I’ve got some spare cash that i wouldn’t mind putting into (almost) guranteed returns
     • maui 5.2.1

       5 October 2015 at 9:23 am

       I hear Serco shares are going cheap if you want to get in on that action too..
       • Puckish Rogue 5.2.1.1

         5 October 2015 at 9:31 am

         I prefer utilities
         • thatguynz 5.2.1.1.1

           5 October 2015 at 11:26 am

           Of course you do – for the very reason same they should be run for the common good.
     • Draco T Bastard 5.2.2

       5 October 2015 at 1:14 pm

       I just love how you RWNJs gloat about becoming ever bigger bludgers.
       • Paul 5.2.2.1

         5 October 2015 at 3:08 pm

         Shameless.
       • Puckish Rogue 5.2.2.2

         5 October 2015 at 4:10 pm

         You lefties got me more money through partial privitisation of the power companies so if you have a problem with it then you need to take a good, long hard look in the mirror to see where the problem is
         • Draco T Bastard 5.2.2.2.1

           5 October 2015 at 4:19 pm

           We know where the problem is – it’s you and your selfish bludging ways.
           • Puckish Rogue 5.2.2.2.1.1

             5 October 2015 at 4:25 pm

             Its the people that’re blinded by ideology that’re the problem
             • Draco T Bastard …

               5 October 2015 at 4:50 pm

               Yeah, the RWNJs.

               So glad we could agree on that.
   • northshoredoc 5.3

     5 October 2015 at 8:56 am

     There is no evidence and no chance that water schemes will be privatised.
     • Rosemary McDonald 5.3.1

       5 October 2015 at 10:42 am

       I’d be interested to know your definition of “privatised”, and what exactly you mean by “water schemes”.
6. les 6

   5 October 2015 at 7:28 am

   the Natz have assured us TPP will be a ‘quality’ deal…thats comforting…in context with other deals they’ve done…like..Sky City Convention Centre.
   • Paul 6.1

     5 October 2015 at 7:31 am

     Just the TPP has massive impacts that will shackle us to neoliberal dogma whatever we vote.
7. Paul 7

   5 October 2015 at 7:33 am

   Bill English says the TPP will be positive for our economy.

   The TV1 Breakfast interviewer failed to ask ‘Why’?
   Why, Bill?
8. Tautoko Mangō Mata 8

   5 October 2015 at 7:49 am

   Guajardo Says He Expects TPP Deal Sunday; Press Conference Pushed To Roughly 6 P.M.
   Second Update: ATLANTA – Mexican Economy Secretary Ildefonso Guajardo Villarreal said midday Sunday (Oct. 4) that he expects Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) trade ministers will be able to reach an agreement by the end of the day here, shortly before the U.S. government announced that the closing press conference for the ministerial is tentatively scheduled for 6 p.m. local time. http://insidetrade.com/

   Burcu Kilic ‏@burcuno 1m1 minute ago
   It is still questionable whether Chile & Peru agreed/wld agree 5+ something biologic exclusivity. I really hope they haven’t & won’t. #TPP

   Burcu Kilic ‏@burcuno 3m3 minutes ago
   Reportedly #TPP biologic deal includes 2 alternatives; 8 yrs exclusivity or 5 + something but not 3 yrs (at least in letter).

   Too big to fail means when it does fail, the public have to pay out!
9. Morrissey 9

   5 October 2015 at 9:19 am

   OPEN LETTER TO JOSIE PAGANI:
   This is the THIRD request for you to respond
   Monday 5 October 2015

   Dear Josie Pagani,

   On this forum, nearly three weeks ago, I asked you to answer two questions:

   1.) In the light of your support for the destruction of Afghanistan, do you support the invasion of the United States and Great Britain, the bombing and obliteration of British and American schools, hospitals, power stations and churches, and the killing of hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions, of American and British civilians?

   2.) Can you explain your statement that Hezbollah and Hamas are anti-Semitic?

   Could you please respond?

   http://thestandard.org.nz/all-the-left-wants-is-a-clean-contest-of-ideas/#comment-1071118

   This Open Letter to Josie Pagani was also published on:
   Saturday 3 October 2015.
   Sunday 4 October 2015.

   So far, she has failed to justify her statements.

   Note: Josie Pagani has a history of making unsupported claims and failing to respond when challenged. I am still waiting for her to provide evidence for a scurrilous claim she made about Martyn “Bomber” Bradbury. On her Pundit blog, I wrote:

   You claim, without providing any evidence at all, that “Martyn Bradbury’s unreasonable aggression has produced a truckload of ugly incidents lately”.

   Could you back up that claim with specific examples please?

   http://pundit.co.nz/content/the-left-must-stand-up-to-abuse
   • Paul 9.1

     5 October 2015 at 10:36 am

     The right wing don’t have any arguments, Morrissey.
     Just catchphrases, memes and ad hominem attacks
     • Morrissey 9.1.1

       5 October 2015 at 12:11 pm

       Her continued silence actually says a lot about her integrity, or lack of.

       Just catchphrases, memes and ad hominem attacks

       Ironically, if you go to her Pundit page, you’ll find it full of prim little homilies counseling “the left” against precisely the kind of behaviour in which she routinely engages.
       • Paul 9.1.1.1

         5 October 2015 at 3:09 pm

         I have so many things to do rather than read or listen to Pagani.
         I admire your tenacity in doing so.
   • millsy 9.2

     5 October 2015 at 11:08 pm

     Give it up — she aint going to reply.

     She sees herself too good to post on here.
10. esoteric pineapples 10

    5 October 2015 at 9:27 am

    Anyone who is interested in keeping up-to-date with the latest global protests etc might enjoy Revolution News ” an international group of independent journalists, photographers, artists, translators and activists reporting on international news with a focus on human rights,” with daily coverage of global protests, human rights, social movements, civil rights, environment, Internet censorship, etc

    Here’s their website – http://revolution-news.com/

    and on Facebook – https://www.facebook.com/RevNews?fref=ts
11. RedLogix 11

    5 October 2015 at 9:45 am

    Gun Violence Solved – a truly American solution to a uniquely American problem:

    http://juanitajean.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/CQZ3bmzUcAA4wGb.jpg

    Warning – coffee spurt trigger

    Or slightly more seriously:

    http://www.examiner.com/article/what-if-gun-laws-were-like-abortion-laws
12. One Anonymous Bloke 12

    5 October 2015 at 10:07 am

    Meanwhile, we’re on the cusp of something special.

    “In 2008 there were 850,532 people receiving a benefit from the ministry. This number grew in 2009 to 923,105 with the increase in part attributed to the impact of the Global Financial Crisis and the growth in our ageing population,” a ministry spokeswoman said.

    To date there are 1,045,837 clients on Work and Income’s books…

    Emphasis added.
13. Paul 13

    5 October 2015 at 10:38 am

    Wonder if Mr Hooton does any of the following when he appears on 9 to noon today?
    a. uses the meme ‘chicken little’
    b. makes ad hominem attack on Jane Kelsey
    c. uses the catchphrase ‘too big to fail’
    d. diverts using pandas or flags or Chris Brown or…..
    • Morrissey 13.1

      5 October 2015 at 12:39 pm

      He was more outrageous than normal, and Mike “I Agree With Matthew” Williams was weaker than normal.

      To her credit, Kathryn Ryan at least tried to say something intelligent, but Hooton dominated from start to finish, as usual.

      Transcript* on the way….

      * Yes, Felix, I know, I know…
      • Paul 13.1.1

        5 October 2015 at 3:10 pm

        Looking forward to it.
        You listen to Hooton so we don’t have to.
14. Chooky 14

    5 October 2015 at 11:09 am

    Rewriting history :

    According to Kathryn Ryan’s radionz ninetonoon programme the Syrians are fleeing Assad!!!! …is this propaganda and disinformation?….because it certainly wasnt challanged by Ryan…

    (I thought the Syrians democratically elected Assad and they were fleeing ISIS)

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/ninetonoon/audio/201773272/europe-correspondent-carsten-von-nahmen

    Washington educated Carsten von Nahmen argues that ” according to human rights organisations the forces of Assad, the ally of Russia, are responsible for the vast majority of casualties in this war and caused millions of Syrians to flee to neighbouring counties and to move on to Europe “….

    http://www.zoominfo.com/p/Carsten-von%20Nahmen/1291121086

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/04/bashar-al-assad-winds-reelection-in-landslide-victory

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/harrowing-images-show-desperate-syrian-refugees-break-through-fence-to-turkish-territories-to-escape-10320170.html

    http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/isis-terror/im-refugee-now-syrians-fleeing-isis-forced-street-n380196
    • Chooky 14.1

      5 October 2015 at 9:13 pm

      ‘Donald Trump supports Putin ‘bombing the hell out of ISIS’’

      https://www.rt.com/usa/317641-trump-syria-putin-isis/
15. Puckish Rogue 15

    5 October 2015 at 11:13 am

    Finally hes seen the light

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3258264/The-U2-U-turn-years-telling-hand-aid-Bono-admits-trade-eradicate-extreme-poverty.html
    • McFlock 15.1

      5 October 2015 at 12:31 pm

      dunno which is funnier – what you call “the light”, or that you believe a daily mail article that’s based entirely on one short possible quote from anyone who makes even the most vague attempt to give a damn about others.
      • Puckish Rogue 15.1.1

        5 October 2015 at 12:50 pm

        Well maybe now he’ll shut up about taxes while paying virtually none himself
        • McFlock 15.1.1.1

          5 October 2015 at 1:02 pm

          Because of the daily mail? You hold them in high regard, obviously.
        • Paul 15.1.1.2

          5 October 2015 at 3:11 pm

          Please don’t waste our time with sources such as the Daily Mail.
          A mouthpiece of fascist propaganda and hate speech.
          • Puckish Rogue 15.1.1.2.1

            5 October 2015 at 4:06 pm

            http://www.forbes.com/sites/markhendrickson/2013/11/08/u2s-bono-courageously-embraces-capitalism/

            http://utv.ie/Entertainment/2015/10/03/Bono-urges-businessmen-to-fight-poverty-46253

            and for more of the same

            http://www.pressreader.com/ireland/irish-daily-mail/20151003/281689728630373/TextView

            http://blog.independent.org/2013/08/12/bono-capitalism-takes-more-people-out-of-poverty-than-aid/
            • millsy 15.1.1.2.1.1

              5 October 2015 at 11:07 pm

              Best way to get the developing nations out of poverty is to mechanize their agriculture.

              I was watching something on TV some time back about fishermen in Tanzania who used dugout canoes — perhaps if someone bought them a decent sized fishing boat they would be able to catch enough food to feed their village and sell the surplus.
              • Draco T Bastard …

                5 October 2015 at 11:38 pm

                Don’t need to buy them anything – just need to teach them how to make plywood and plywood boats from their own resources.
              • McFlock …

                6 October 2015 at 12:20 am

                Actually, the plight of the local fishing industries in many developing nations isn’t due to us not giving them or teaching them anything.

                It’s large scale international fisheries stripping EEZs in the mid to deep water areas because the governments are either too unstable, too poor or too small to do anything about it. And if they’re really unlucky, then the hazardous waste industry find a handy place to drop tonnes of barrels where nobody is looking, much cheaper than safe incineration down to the elements.

                And then you get a two-fer like Nigeria, where many of the inshore/inland fisheries that are already over-exploited to support the population by themselves then get oil spills to finish the job.

                Developing nations have some of the most ingenious people on the planet, because you have to be when you’re on a buck a day. There’s not much we can teach them that would be useful for them. Best way to get them out of poverty is to ask them how we can help.
    • One Anonymous Bloke 15.2

      6 October 2015 at 7:18 am

      In other news, a musician has an opinion.

      Meanwhile, at the World Bank…

      …further reductions in poverty rates would come from evidence-based approaches, including: broad-based growth that generates sufficient income-earning opportunities; investing in people’s development prospects through improving the coverage and quality of education, health, sanitation, and protecting the poor and vulnerable against sudden risks of unemployment, hunger, illness, drought and other calamities. These measures, he said, would also greatly boost shared prosperity, improving the welfare of the least well-off in every country.

      Note the significant presence of what you might call “Socialism”.
16. Tiger Mountain 16

    5 October 2015 at 11:17 am

    time to retire Mike Williams from RNZ–please–his performance was truly appalling again today
    • Chooky 16.1

      5 October 2015 at 12:31 pm

      +100…yes please
    • Morrissey 16.2

      5 October 2015 at 12:36 pm

      Agreed. I have a transcript coming, composed in mounting disbelief and horror.
      • Tiger Mountain 16.2.1

        5 October 2015 at 1:17 pm

        frankly many commenters here would do way better against Mr Hooton

        Williams did not seem even dimly aware of the differing views on the TPPA, TTIPs and TISA of various UN agencies and prominent staff compared to what Helen Clark might say
        • greywarshark 16.2.1.1

          5 October 2015 at 3:08 pm

          Tiger Mountain
          Mike Williams could be described as ‘dimly’ – very appropriate for what I heard this morning which added to the majority of his previous utterings and mutterings indicates a mind dulled by? Accumulated alcohol, knocks playing rugger when younger, or a combination.

          He seems to have done well because he was good at raising money for the Labour Party. Always important but it doesn’t go near to putting him in as a political commentator. I’d rather listen to one of the political journalists not on TV and not immured in the left or right.

          Mike Williams – Labour Party activities
          Williams initially started working for the Labour Party as an education officer but rapidly moved into fundraising where he instigated a number of new practices:
          – A pledge system, whereby supporters agreed to pay a regular amount using the then-new automatic bank transfer system;
          – Sending out requests for donations to the party membership, enclosing pre-paid reply envelopes;
          – Visiting businesses to solicit donations;
          – Systematic canvassing and direct-mailing.

          These activities helped the party to achieve a landslide victory in 1984. After the election, Williams joined the Australian Labor Party in Canberra but had returned to New Zealand within a year.
          Williams was appointed as Campaign Manager for the 1999 election which was won by the Labour Party. After the election he was appointed as Party President.
          Commercial activities
          Williams set up two successful companies based on his experience of Labour Party organisation. Insight Research (now UMR Insight) was a market research company (which was sold in 1994) and Insight Data, which specialised in direct-mail and marketing and was sold in 1997.[7]
          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Williams_%28New_Zealand_politician%29
          • Chooky 16.2.1.1.1

            5 October 2015 at 8:14 pm

            +100 greywarshark
            • greywarshark 16.2.1.1.1.1

              6 October 2015 at 12:33 pm

              Hey Chooky i would like to hear you for the Left on radio. You are full of get up and go, keen fresh ideas, know about politics and up to date with all. What is your voice like for presentations?
17. Tautoko Mangō Mata 17

    5 October 2015 at 2:41 pm

    Latest TPP News

    Burcu Kilic ‏@burcuno 4m4 minutes ago
    Oh, #TPP press conference is postponed until sometime tomorrow.

    Guajardo Hopes For TPP Deal By Midnight; Market Access Remains Hurdle
    ATLANTA – Mexican Economy Secretary Ildefonso Guajardo Villarreal said here Sunday evening (Oct. 4) he hopes a Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) deal can be reached by midnight, but that an agreement is being held up as countries engage in last-minute bilateral negotiations on market access, a likely reference to the dairy talks underway between New Zealand and other countries.
    • veutoviper 17.1

      5 October 2015 at 2:55 pm

      Hi TMM (ps – looked up a translation and like it!)

      Noticed you were missing today. Lots more on what is happening etc on the TPP deal close? post and comments. Its been quite a morning.

      Richard Madan, CTV correspondent at the Atlanta negotiations has turned out to be a good source on Twitter for totally up-to-date reporting.

      Links on the other post eg http://thestandard.org.nz/tppa-deal-close/#comment-1078647

      Gordon Campbell article also linked is well worth reading.
18. Draco T Bastard 18

    5 October 2015 at 4:23 pm

    How the Koch brothers and the super-rich are buying their way out of criticism

    “There’s really no choice,” a university dean told me. “We’ve got to go where the money is.”

    And more than at any time since the Gilded Age of the late nineteenth century, the money is now in the pockets of big corporations and the super wealthy.

    So the presidents of universities, congregations, and think tanks, other nonprofits are now kissing wealthy posteriors as never before.

    But that money often comes with strings.

    When the Charles Koch Foundation pledges $1.5 million to Florida State University’s economics department, it stipulates that a Koch-appointed advisory committee will select professors and undertake annual evaluations.

    As I say, the problem is the rich. We simply cannot afford them and how they skew our society to favour them at everyone else’s expense.
    • Rodel 18.1

      6 October 2015 at 9:54 am

      DTB I can see the beginnings of this in NZ….Possibly eventually reaching down into our primary schools..charter school sponsors have begun.
19. Rodel 19

    5 October 2015 at 7:25 pm

    Father said ;
    ‘in WWII when British planes flew overhead, the Germans dived for over.When German planes flew overhead the British and ANZACs dived for cover.
    When American planes flew, everyone dived for cover.’
    It appears that nothing changes.
    • Chooky 19.1

      5 October 2015 at 8:13 pm

      lol…i have heard something similar

      … terrible what happened in Afghanistan!…no excuse

      http://www.msf.org.au/from-the-field/field-news/field-news/article/afghanistan-kunduz-eyewitness-they-had-just-been-working-in-the-hospital-to-help-people-and.html

      http://www.doctorswithoutborders.org/country-region/afghanistan

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