Open mike 09/01/2024

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, January 9th, 2024 - 68 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:


Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

68 comments on “Open mike 09/01/2024 ”

  1. Muttonbird 1

    Tufton Street in London is a synonymous descriptor for right wing think tanks and lobby groups close to the Conservative government. Particularly 55 Tufton Street, which houses a who's who of Eurosceptics, Brexiteers, libertarians, fossil fuel lobby groups, climate change deniers, anti-immigration groups and interestingly (or not), the LGB Alliance.

    Birds of a feather flock together.

    [TheStandard: A moderator moved this comment to Open Mike as being off topic or irrelevant in the post it was made in. Be more careful in future.]

    • Robert Guyton 1.1

      Nasty snots.

    • Molly 1.2

      Organisations rent premises in shared buildings. Hardly a headliner.

      "…interestingly (or not), the LGB Alliance."

      Why – and how – is that interesting?

      • weka 1.2.1

        it's interesting because it's a TRA stick to beat them with. Brilliant example from MB.

    • Drowsy M. Kram 1.3

      The LGB alliance has stated "the office [at 55 Tufton Street] was chosen because it's handy, flexible, and that it became available at the right time".

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGB_Alliance#Media_coverage_and_criticism

      • Muttonbird 1.3.1

        Yeah, it's all just a coincidence:

        “I can tell you we’ve rented a single large room that is ideal for our purposes. The office is fantastically well-served In terms of transport links. In addition, we spend a lot of time trying to make our case to politicians and the office is just a few minutes’ walk from the Houses of Parliament.

        – Kate Barker, Managing Director LGB Alliance

        As equalities secretary, Liz Truss is reported to have had regular meetings at 55 Tufton Street with groups such as the IEA. The UK government staged a significant U-turn on its attitude towards progressing LGBTQIA+ rights during the same period, culminating in a backpedal on Gender Recognition Act reform and the collapse of the #SafeToBeMe2022 event earlier this year.

        Truss’s second-in-command at the time, Kemi Badenoch, has now taken on the post. She too has links to Tufton Street via the Cato Institute and her former adviser Alex Morton, who went on to become head of policy at the Centre for Policy Studies and subsequently the IEA’s director of strategy.

        This is why I mentioned it. Pertaining to the influence of right wing think tanks which is the purpose of the post, the LGB Alliance is a highly political lobby group now housed the the very building synonymous with far right/libertarian lobby groups, and as such should not be immune from scrutiny and criticism.

        https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/5050/lgb-alliance-55-tufton-street-think-tanks/

    • SPC 1.4

      It's interesting that it is so hard to discern if any organisation not seen as aligned with political right has a place there.

    • weka 1.5

      Birds of a feather flock together.

      Aye, some lefties still don't get that politicised lesbians will flock with the people who support their rights. That's probably not you.

      Do you believe that lesbians should date males who have socially but not surgically transitioned to identifying as female. If you can't answer that with an unequivocal no, then you really are incapable of why LGBA might not GAF about who is in the building with them.

      I don't know if the LGBA are RW (it would surprise me if they were positionally), or politically naive, or just working with what they've got.

      Myself, if I was running such an organisation, no way would I have made that choice. But I'm a leftie. Many people aren't and increasing numbers used to be but are no longer. If the LGBA are getting assistance from other Grafton St tenants, maybe that's because they can't get it from the left (and the right is taking full advantage of that, duh).

      Which just brings us back to the lady dick question, and why some lefties still think there is any kind of respect for the position that lesbians should like lady dick. Do you really think lesbians and gays are going to care about the opinions of lefties with such a strong degree of homophobia?

      • roblogic 1.5.1

        I think many in the LGBA are lifelong lefties who have been vilified and rejected because they maintain the orthodox view of biology that was unchallenged across time and culture until a strange movement took hold of the narrative in the last 10 years. Here's one of them:

        I don't want the far left, or the new left, I want the old left.

        Working people paid properly for their time, their housing secure, their kids educated to the highest standard, their food nutritious, their communities maintained.

        A left that values & respects the working class

        https://x.com/Serena_Partrick/status/1743697222703657010?s=20

        • weka 1.5.1.1

          We're a very long way from home now. I like Serena's twitter. While GC people like KJK are obviously conservative and in her case, ex-swing voter (or maybe she still is), I haven't seen anything obvious like that with LGBA. I would guess you are right in that there's a core of old left. Probably people from across the spectrum. The new politics is mixed, and not partisan. Trad lefties can't get their head around it, but we know that Māori have their own politics, so why not LGB, or women.

          • Belladonna 1.5.1.1.1

            Trad lefties can't get their head around it

            Have seen this play out in my own family. Family member who is lesbian and a hard-left voter all her life, highly supportive and activist in the 2017 campaign for Ardern. Did not vote in the last election. She couldn't stomach any of the left parties, given their (in her eyes) abandonment of LG people in favour of trans; and couldn't square it with her conscience to vote right.

            [Please note, in common with most urban liberal gay people, she is in no way 'anti-trans' – and has very long-standing friendships with many in the trans community – but believes that women's spaces (and lesbian relationships) need to be for women.]

            However, if there was a centrist party which supported LG in an upcoming election – I wouldn't be surprised to see her voting for them….

            • weka 1.5.1.1.1.1

              thanks, that's a good explanation.

              What some lefties seem to be missing is that a) people who used to vote left or centre left are starting to hate the left and b) the right are laughing all the way to the bank on this one and are very good at making use of it.

      • Muttonbird 1.5.2

        You've called me a misogynist and a homophobe in recent weeks. I don't care much but they are fairly direct accusations against a commenter.

        I’m not getting into the chicks with dicks obsession because that is certainly prejudicial, demeaning, othering, harmful speech.

        • weka 1.5.2.1

          In fact, I didn't call you a [insert prejudice] last time, I pointed out to you the shortcomings of political slur name calling. You appear to not have grasped this and are doing it again.

          So now I will directly call you a homophobe. I asked if you believe that lesbians should have to include males in their dating pool, you have responded by saying you're not getting into it, which I will take as an admission that you are ok with lesbians being told to date males.

          That’s lesbophobic. It’s just an updated version of blokes saying lesbians just need a proper shag (by a bloke), and it’s based in the position that lesbians don’t get body autonomy and sovereignty but men do. It’s classic, core patriarchy, and it’s rape culture, so yeah, you’re a misogynist too.

          You also threw in a TRA diverting cliche about GCFs – that the political arguments we make are about penile obsession. Heard it all before mate, all very Freud when really women just want our bodies and our politics to be respected.

          edited.

          • weka 1.5.2.1.1

            and while I'm here, let me just spell it out some more.

            Historically lesbians have been raped by men because 'lesbians just need a good shag'. That still happens, and it’s part of het bloke culture. ie heterosexual male culture sanctions this.

            I've listened to young lesbians talk about what it's been like in LGBTQI+ communities where older males who have transitioned to being a trans woman 'mentor' them, and then after a while the pressure to be sexual arrives.

            To make that very clear, the young women are homosexual, and the TW are male heterosexuals.

            When women object to this they are told they are bigots, and ostracised in via peer pressure. It's horrible, disgusting, and the lefties who support this and/or are in denial that it is happening should be ashamed of themselves.

            You also can't then wonder why so many are abandoning the left. Did you really think women would roll over and see our rights destroyed and rape culture entrenched via liberal politics?

    • Corey 1.6

      So what? Plenty of left wing orgs, mps and activists share buildings with or rent from right wing outlets.

      Activists who don't like the Lgb alliance aren't going to win people over by attacking them.

      As a gay man, there is a large and ever increasing number of lesbians and gay men all over the world who are extremely uncomfortable with being connected with Trans activists and want to split from a movement that share wildly different goals to lesbians and gays.

      It's a lot closer to a 50/50 split than many trans activists are willing to admit because most gay and lesbian people who feel this way stay silent because they fear being ostracized, but in private…

      Gays and lesbians have had cis hetero women and men utterly highjack our bars, our apps and our culture.

      Lesbians and gays are constantly being told now by progressives that our sexuality is "genital preference" that we'd like the genitals of the opposite sex if we only gave them a chance, that we are sexual racists for not sleeping with trans people, that our same sex spaces must be open to members with genitalia of the opposite sex and calling us same gender attracted, which is why you hear more and more l and gs refer to themselves as homosexual.

      We've had our history rewritten by progressives saying that trans activists threw the first brick at stone wall (as someone whose been to stonewall it's untrue and the trans person they say did it openly states she wasn't even there)

      Gay and lesbian culture survived it being illegal for millenia and it will survive this new homophobic progressive form of conversion therapy.

      LGBT acceptance has been trending down for the first time in decades for the four years because of trans activists, we're not going back in the closet.

      You're not gonna win over gays and lesbians by calling us right wing for liking the same sex.

      The left needs to stop attacking people it disagrees with and start actually trying to win over voters the left have already lost the youth vote (Trump now wins with young voters in all recent polling) we've lost working class people of every race and we are starting to even lose lesbians and gays… The left are running out of voters to alienate…

      Maybe it's time the left stopped telling people how to live their lives and attacking people for wrong think and start focusing on economically making people's lives better because identity politics ain't never gonna win the left another election.

      • Muttonbird 1.6.1

        So what? Plenty of left wing orgs, mps and activists share buildings with or rent from right wing outlets.

        Really? Not at 55 Tufton St, I expect.

        A movement that share wildly different goals to lesbians and gays.

        What goals are those, to live without prejudice, harassment, discrimination and with dignity. Seems like you share the same goals…

        Gays and lesbians have had cis hetero women and men utterly highjack our bars, our apps and our culture.

        What is with the us and them vibe? You complain about activists ostracising people yet create this ugly division between gay people and heterosexual people. You can't exclude people from bars.

        I said before I'm not going to get into people pants on this because it really is none of my business. Warfare within the LGBT community is something for that community to sort out. There are laws against harassment, online or otherwise, based on sexual preference, I believe, and anyone breaking those laws should be held accountable.

        Gay and lesbian culture survived it being illegal for millenia and it will survive this new homophobic progressive form of conversion therapy.

        Restricting or banning identity, therapy, education and support for transgender people is a road which leads directly to it being made illegal.

        LGBT acceptance has been trending down for the first time in decades for the four years because of trans activists, we're not going back in the closet.

        On the conservative right, possibly. They have never accepted transgender people anyway.

        The rest is just right wing talking points, but following your post history you have always been highly critical of progressive politics, so no surprise there.

        The left will do what they always do, empathise with and support those marginalised for things they have no control over and try to provide an environment for everyone to live in healthy, safe and dignified lives, notwithstanding they don't always hit those targets, and sometimes don’t even get close.

  2. millsy 2

    LGB Alliance hold a number of views that could be interpreted as socially conservative.

    Exhibit A: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGB_Alliance#Views

    The founder also wants LGBTQ clubs at school banned:

    https://www.thepinknews.com/2020/01/23/lgb-alliance-co-founder-malcolm-clark-predatory-gay-teachers-anti-gay/

    [TheStandard: A moderator moved this comment to Open Mike as being off topic or irrelevant in the post it was made in. Be more careful in future.]

    • weka 2.1

      From exhibit A:

      1. Lesbians are in danger of becoming extinct because of the cultural and social pressure to transition.
      2. Lesbians don't have penises
      3. Homosexuality is same sex attraction, not same gender identity attraction.
      4. Strongly supports the historic repealing of anti-homosexuality legislation, and strongly supports the introduction of same sex marriage
      5. Opposes conversion therapy where gays and lesbians are transitioned to the opposite sex
      6. Opposes the affirmation only approach that leads to the transitioning of children who would otherwise grow up to be lesbian or gay.

      Now tell me millsy, which of those positions is conservative (and please explain your thinking)

      • millsy 2.1.1

        Weka..

        As I said above:

        The founder also wants LGBTQ clubs at school banned:

        https://www.thepinknews.com/2020/01/23/lgb-alliance-co-founder-malcolm-clark-predatory-gay-teachers-anti-gay/

        I dont think anyone who call themselves socially liberal or left, can argue from any position that LGBT support networks in schools should be broken up.

        • weka 2.1.1.1

          sweet, so your exhibit A doesn't in fact demonstrate your claim that the LGBA are socially conservative. You apparently just made that up.

          Let's look at Exhibit B.

          The first thing I'll point out is that Pink News doesn't cite primary sources and in fact goes out of its way to avoid linking people to the original material. For instance, when they say,

          Clark’s inflammatory anti-gay comments were made in an online discussion about an LGB Alliance supporter being kicked out of an LGBT+ nightclub in Glasgow for refusing to reverse her t-shirt bearing the group’s slogan.

          They don't link to that online discussion, so we have no easy way of knowing the context.

          That approach means PN are basically a propaganda machine. You can compare to the approach on TS, where we expect links and back up to mean something.

        • Visubversa 2.1.1.2

          Oh yes we can very much support supposed LGBT "support groups" in schools from being removed from the position where they deny the very existence of same sex attraction, and influence young people to believe that humans can change sex and that their adolescent concerns and problems can be solved with chemical castration and/or sterilising and mutilating surgery.

          LGB is about same sex attraction but we are force teamed with a bunch of straight people whose interests are not ours and in many cases are incompatible with our interests.

        • Molly 2.1.1.3

          "The founder also wants LGBTQ clubs at school banned.."

          Why would you think that is the case?

          Let's see what Malcolm Clark actually wrote, and discuss whether his concerns are warranted or can be mitigated:

          • SPC 2.1.1.3.1

            Yeah I noted that, not seeing the point is not a policy of banning.

            His opine of a bygone era of teachers hitting on pupils, and teens with a known same sex identity being at greater risk so not supporting LGBT, is in fact an argument against LGB groups.

            • Molly 2.1.1.3.1.1

              He is raising safeguarding issues, and relating how he recognised the safeguarding failures in his own school life.

              There is also a discussion to be had around sexual orientation being asked to be considered by pre-pubescent children – ie. at primary school. Many children will understand the beginnings of attraction, but will not relate this to sexual activity at this age, unless introduced to this adult perspective.

              The discussion point in this case, is whether it is harmful to children to be prematurely exposed to such considerations or discussions.

              There have also been recent safeguarding failures reported by clubs, that have allowed predatory and exploitative behaviour to occur:

              https://reduxx.info/trans-teacher-placed-on-indefinite-leave-after-disturbing-videos-surface/

              https://reduxx.info/scottish-lgbti-police-association-fundraising-for-youth-charity-under-investigation-for-historic-child-abuses/

              So then the question becomes: in a time of societal acceptance are these clubs necessary, or do they cement the othering of those with homosexual orientations, and allow for exploitation at a time of exploration, growth and personal understanding of self (exacerbated by hormone fluctuations)?

              Are they conducted with strict adherence to gold standard safeguarding vetting and practices?

  3. millsy 3

    The so-called LGBT Alliance want LGBT support groups in schools broken up.

    [TheStandard: A moderator moved this comment to Open Mike as being off topic or irrelevant in the post it was made in. Be more careful in future.]

    [please provide evidence for this assertion. Evidence here means all of these:

    1. a link that contains the evidence (and no, you can’t use Pink News, see my comments elsewhere on this).
      1. supporting quotes.
      2. explanations for why you think the links/quotes support your assertion.

    Or, you can retract the assertion and agree that from now on you will provide evidence for such assertions, up front, at the time you make the comment.

    I’m also going to remind you of why you were banned this time last year for a whole year. This is partly about you perpetually running fact free lines on TS, and also because it ended up taking a lot of moderator time (not just me and not just on this topic). The is a clear pattern of behaviour and what you might not know is that the mods have even less patience now than a year ago.

    https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-07-01-2023/#comment-1929460

    I see another mod also also talked to you in the brief few days you have been back from your ban. If you do actually want to be here to take the government to task, I suggest you stick to that, but even with that you still need to abide by the above regarding evidence and assertions. I won’t be asking again. – weka]

  4. Morrissey 4

    "Let's give her a call…"

    Washington Post propagandist Elizabeth Dwoskin has waded into a situation way beyond her competence. She's been telling lies about real journalists. One of them, Max Blumenthal, decided to call her live, on air. She did not perform well….

  5. Anne 5

    Maggie Barry being her usual entitled self despite her protestations to the contrary:

    https://www.1news.co.nz/2024/01/07/maggie-barry-misunderstanding-led-to-police-being-called-to-flight/

    • Robert Guyton 5.1

      2 truths going head-to-head! 🙂

    • Peter 5.2

      There could be the start to a little like minded, like operating club – she might start one. Maggie and Gaurav Sharma. If anyone besides me remembers who he is.

      https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/former-politician-maggie-barry-denies-abusing-air-new-zealand-crew-member/57QYCYGG7VFXDHQHQKTZ2V2CBI/

    • Morrissey 5.3

      Hilarious. Shades of that absurd old fool Sir Robert Jones being kicked off a plane after he refused to follow seatbelt procedure.

      • Robert Guyton 5.3.1

        Rules?

        RULES?

        Pour moi?

      • Anne 5.3.2

        With his usual puckish humour, here is David Slack's take on the matter:

        DON’T YOU HATE IT ON AN AIR NZ FLIGHT when you go to say:
        Oh sorry, I didn’t realise I needed to take this off, I’ll do it right now
        and it somehow comes out as something that causes a 20-minute flight delay and requires the cops to sort it all out?

        You will notice this picture is not well coloured-in.

        What we have here is not so much a they-said/she-said situation as a they-diplomatically-said-not-much/Maggie-Barry-issued-a-baffling-press-statement situation.

        It was no worries she breezily says—and I’m paraphrasing here to make it shorter—the silly Air NZ people for whom I have the utmost respect seemed to have got hold of the wrong idea and once I understood what the silly girl was trying to tell me to do, I did it, and very soon we were up up and away with the useful assistance of His Majesty’s police force.

        See sidebar "More than a Fielding” for whole post".

  6. Adrian Thornton 6

    Here is a perfect example of why the West has finally (and totally) lost what ever tattered remains of it's supposed 'moral high ground' in the arena of world geo-politics….and probably why the story of the most televised genocide in history that was published here on The Standard yesterday, only got 17 comments….compare the amount of comments that the war in Ukraine got for over a year on TS, with the Liberal class, amped up by their news feeds, which had them running around with their hair on fire…holy hell, the Liberal class are just so fucking pliable and so willfully ignorant, that it even catches an old cynic like me out sometimes……

    All CNN Gaza Coverage Seen by Bureau Monitored by IDF Before Publication

    "All reporters in Israel must sign an agreement to abide by such rules set by the IDF, and Israel has reportedly censored thousands of news stories since the beginning of the current massacre in Gaza"

    bbc-bias …An indepth report on the obvious BBC bias re; Gaza genocide.

    And yet I can guarantee you, that while it will be without doubt, still acceptable to use both these compromised sources for any geo-political story on TS going forward, if any one were to use RT as a source in a debate here, it would be instantly dismissed out of hand….without even the slightest thought of double standards….but then as we have witnessed with dismay, the Liberal class and their media have been torturing and upending logic and truth so regularly over the last decade, why would they see a problem…of course they don't…up is down, black is white…got it.

    John Pilger: Silencing the Lambs: How Propaganda Works
    https://consortiumnews.com/
    “Leni Riefenstahl said her epic films glorifying the Nazis depended on a “submissive void” in the German public. This is how propaganda is done. “

    • SPC 6.1

      I don't think the number of comments angle hunts well – there was only 10 on Open Mike..

      • Belladonna 6.1.1

        I'd also think that much the same is happening over the Gaza situation on TS as happened over Ukraine.

        The same talking points being repeated, and countered, and neither 'side' convincing the other. My observation is that many commentators have just stopped engaging.

        • Adrian Thornton 6.1.1.1

          "The same talking points being repeated, and countered, and neither 'side' convincing the other. My observation is that many commentators have just stopped engaging"….Yeah you are probably right, I know have mostly given up on TS…shame it used to be fun going hard here, giving it out and getting it back just as hard…but those good times are long gone.

    • Incognito 6.2

      You’re still the same habitual one-eyed whiner.

      … and probably why the story of the most televised genocide in history that was published here on The Standard yesterday, only got 17 comments …

      Since 7 October 2023, there have been 14 Posts with “Israel” as category:

      https://thestandard.org.nz/category/international/israel/

      That’s an average of 5 Posts per month here on TS.

      These had a combined total of 665 comments and 12,063 views. Of course, these are quantitative metrics and don’t tell us much about quality or impact.

      Only a dimwit would ignore the fact that we just had a General Election and that almost everybody is currently on holiday recuperating & recharging. Site traffic reflects this, as does pretty much everything in MSM and SM; Daily Review is lying on the beach.

      … if any one were to use RT as a source in a debate here, it would be instantly dismissed out of hand….without even the slightest thought of double standards …

      This is your usual biased bollocks. It depends on the context and the merit/strength of the comment presented, among other things.

      For example, look at this thread (https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-25-06-2023/#comment-1956312) in which a commenter linked to RT and your own singularly biased response about news sources.

      … but then as we have witnessed with dismay, the Liberal class and their media you have been torturing and upending logic and truth so regularly over the last decade, why would they you see a problem…of course they you don't…up is down, black is white…[you] got it.

      FIFY

    • UncookedSelachimorpha 6.3

      The BBC is quite often guilty of bias, I agree.

      In my case, I see evil and wrong doing on both sides of the Israel / Palestine conflict. Those who cheerlead only for Palestine often hold up Al Jazeera as a reliable source – when in fact it is owned by Qatar, a mysogynistic, authoritarian monarchy that provides massive funding to the terrorist organisation Hamas. My observation is that Al Jazeera is every bit as biased as the BBC.

      Neutral News? A study of the neutrality in BBC’s and Al Jazeera’s reporting on the Israeli military operation “Pillar of defense”

      …none of the agencies are honest in their claims of neutrality. There are various examples that show that BBC is favoring the Israeli view of the operation while Al Jazeera clearly promotes the Palestinian.

  7. Grey Area 7

    Can people please not use so many initials. Shorthand may be helpful for the poster but for others of us left struggling to keep up they can be unhelpful. Having to resort to internet searches to work out what initials mean can become tiring.

    I guess GCF is a gender critical feminist? TRA? IEA? I had to look up LGB Alliance because I'd never heard of it.

    Over time we come to understand some shorthand if we regularly enter certain discussion spaces but if we enter them infrequently to me they are barrier.

    • Johnr 7.2

      I wholeheartedly agree Grey. I try to follow the thread of the conversation to be fair to the participants.

      But, especially with the gender alphabet soup stuff, after 20 or 30 he said she said comments in an alien vocabulary, that seems to not progress the discussion, my eyes glaze over.

      It would be nice if their was a button at the bottom of my phone screen that I could activate to get to the next subject and bypass this type of non productive dialogue

      • Muttonbird 7.2.1

        It's difficult to follow this stuff but appreciate that commenters like yourself and Grey Area take the time to do so without prejudice.

        I have looked back at my comments and I have used one acronym/abbreviation but the explanation for it is in the appropriate link. Also appreciate the time taken to read those links which isn't available to everyone.

        One issue with the comment @1 is that it was removed by a moderator, for some reason and without explanation, from it's original context as part of another post which makes it more difficult to follow.

        I didn’t intend for it to be stand alone.

    • millsy 7.3

      TRA = Trans(gender) Rights Activist

      IEA = Institute of Economic Affairs, basically the UK's version of the Business Roundtable.

      • Grey Area 7.3.1

        Thanks. When I searched for TRA, out of the first 60 hits Google's AI provided there was nothing about gender. And putting in "TRA meaning" didn't help either.

    • weka 7.4

      Fair point Grey Area. I will try to remember to use the full name at the start of a comment (but will prob use the initials after that, maybe as the thread goes on too).

      • Grey Area 7.4.1

        Thanks Weka. If the full term is in view the initials are okay but I also agree with Johnr about the alien vocabulary. I also try to follow discussions like the preceding one but it's tough when initialised terms are used as if we should know what they mean.

        • weka 7.4.1.1

          this is useful feedback. Sometimes it's easy to slip into thinking everyone is ignoring a topic apart from a few people who are commenting, so thanks for raising this aspect as well.

  8. Tricledrown 8

    National are happy to have cult religions which have women in subservience take money and help from these happy clappy patriarchal cult like religious nutters who also have jumped on the conspiracy theorist band wagon finance ,help and legislate for a few votes.

    Youth suicide and social division will increase while these moral lowlives control everyone else.

    Watch an episode of how I escaped a cult.

    Bert Potter 'Brian Tamaki etc etc

    • Belladonna 8.1

      Taking conspiracy theory quite a bit too far.

      I really doubt that Bert Potter followers were National voters (a hippy commune-style enclave – which would have been exceedingly alien to the National Party of the 20th century).

      I equally doubt that Brian Tamaki followers are voting National (except, possibly, strategically as their local MP in an electorate vote). Given that Tamaki had an endorsed party in the last election, and absent that, they would seem to be more closely aligned to Peters and NZF (certainly in its most recent incarnation).

      If you have any actual evidence that 'cult religions' are funding National (election donation amounts over $20K have to be declared within 10 days) – perhaps you could provide it.

      https://elections.nz/democracy-in-nz/political-parties-in-new-zealand/donations-exceeding-20000/

    • Pat 9.1

      Nothing to do with new Gov…..this is an issue thats been building for decades and accentuated by population growth.

      200 litre rainwater tanks are not going to do anything

      Slagging off the Nat led Gov may make you feel better but it ignores the fundamental causes of the problem, and so we will continue to make the stupid mistake of expecting a change of Gov to solve the problems

      • Muttonbird 9.1.1

        Of course, it's all Labour's fault. What was I thinking?

        • Pat 9.1.1.1

          Obviously not….it may however be "the fault' of a growth model that demands us to increase infrastructure to the point we can no longer provide the resources to maintain that which we have built….a problem not solved by blaming any particular political party as they all advocate 'growth'….and we all vote for them when they do.

          • Muttonbird 9.1.1.1.1

            Sustainable, modest, manageable and managed growth is fine. The Greens, MP and Labour all nod to this either in policy or action.

            I agree the 130K net immigration gain is ridiculous, but so too is the reluctance in NZ by the Atlas types, the Rand lot to make sure innovations to service any growth are available.

            • Pat 9.1.1.1.1.1

              "Sustainable, modest, manageable and managed growth is fine. The Greens, MP and Labour all nod to this either in policy or action."

              And there you have it….same problems , different managers.

        • Belladonna 9.1.1.2

          30+ years of failure to build and maintain infrastructure by Wellington City Council/Wellington Water.

          https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/explained/130757094/wellingtons-water-problems-have-been-decades-in-the-making

      • weka 9.1.2

        200L water tanks make a huge difference when it's the only water you have.

        Agree about the fundamental causes, but tbf NACTF were agin 3 Waters, and isn't the situation in Wellington exactly the kind of thing that 3 Waters was set up to address?

        • weka 9.1.2.1

          (4 x 50L tanks would be better, because you can fit them in the back of some vehicles and take them somewhere to get filled).

          • Belladonna 9.1.2.1.1

            Just not really practical in a city – especially with terrace housing and/or apartments (which is quite a lot of Wellington central).

  9. Muttonbird 10

    "I was really concerned during the election campaign, that I was told by a candidate that we're just trying to 'trans-ify' kids. What on earth does that even mean? I hadn't even heard of the 'woke gender curriculum', I had to look it up, and saw that it was something that was an imported culture war. That really concerns me. Our kids are beyond that.

    "We have a really good curriculum in this country. The guidelines are not the curriculum, they are adding to how we can make sure the curriculum is taught well. They are not compulsory, but they are absolutely superb."

    – Jan Tinetti.

    Basically we are now leaving sex ed up to Winston Peters and his influencers…

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/506348/government-accused-of-conspiracy-based-thinking-in-changes-to-sex-education

Recent Comments

Recent Posts

  • Major investment in teacher supply through Budget 24
    Over the next four years, Budget 24 will support the training and recruitment of 1,500 teachers into the workforce, Education Minister Erica Stanford announced today. “To raise achievement and develop a world leading education system we’re investing nearly $53 million over four years to attract, train and retain our valued ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    9 hours ago
  • Joint statement on the New Zealand – Cook Islands Joint Ministerial Forum – 2024
    1.  New Zealand Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Foreign Affairs Rt Hon Winston Peters; Minister of Health and Minister for Pacific Peoples Hon Dr Shane Reti; and Minister for Climate Change Hon Simon Watts hosted Cook Islands Minister of Foreign Affairs and Immigration Hon Tingika Elikana and Minister of Health Hon Vainetutai Rose Toki-Brown on 24 May ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Middle East, Africa deployments extended
    The Government has approved two-year extensions for four New Zealand Defence Force deployments to the Middle East and Africa, Defence Minister Judith Collins and Foreign Minister Winston Peters announced today. “These deployments are long-standing New Zealand commitments, which reflect our ongoing interest in promoting peace and stability, and making active ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Climate Change Commission Chair to retire
    The Climate Change Commission Chair, Dr Rod Carr, has confirmed his plans to retire at the end of his term later this year, Climate Change Minister Simon Watts says. “Prior to the election, Dr Carr advised me he would be retiring when his term concluded. Dr Rod Carr has led ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Inaugural Board of Integrity Sport & Recreation Commission announced
    Nine highly respected experts have been appointed to the inaugural board of the new Integrity Sport and Recreation Commission, Sport & Recreation Minister Chris Bishop says. “The Integrity Sport and Recreation Commission is a new independent Crown entity which was established under the Integrity Sport and Recreation Act last year, ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • A balanced Foreign Affairs budget
    Foreign Minister Winston Peters confirmed today that Vote Foreign Affairs in Budget 2024 will balance two crucial priorities of the Coalition Government.    While Budget 2024 reflects the constrained fiscal environment, the Government also recognises the critical role MFAT plays in keeping New Zealanders safe and prosperous.    “Consistent with ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • New social housing places to support families into homes
    New social housing funding in Budget 2024 will ensure the Government can continue supporting more families into warm, dry homes from July 2025, Housing Ministers Chris Bishop and Tama Potaka say. “Earlier this week I was proud to announce that Budget 2024 allocates $140 million to fund 1,500 new social ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • New Zealand’s minerals future
    Introduction Today, we are sharing a red-letter occasion. A Blackball event on hallowed ground. Today  we underscore the importance of our mineral estate. A reminder that our natural resource sector has much to offer.  Such a contribution will not come to pass without investment.  However, more than money is needed. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Government sets out vision for minerals future
    Increasing national and regional prosperity, providing the minerals needed for new technology and the clean energy transition, and doubling the value of minerals exports are the bold aims of the Government’s vision for the minerals sector. Resources Minister Shane Jones today launched a draft strategy for the minerals sector in ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Government progresses Māori wards legislation
    The coalition Government’s legislation to restore the rights of communities to determine whether to introduce Māori wards has passed its first reading in Parliament, Local Government Minister Simeon Brown says. “Divisive changes introduced by the previous government denied local communities the ability to determine whether to establish Māori wards.” The ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • First RMA amendment Bill introduced to Parliament
    The coalition Government has today introduced legislation to slash the tangle of red and green tape throttling some of New Zealand’s key sectors, including farming, mining and other primary industries. RMA Reform Minister Chris Bishop says the Government is committed to  unlocking development and investment while ensuring the environment is ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Government welcomes EPA decision
    The decision by Environmental Protection Authority (EPA) to approve the continued use of hydrogen cyanamide, known as Hi-Cane, has been welcomed by Environment Minister Penny Simmonds and Agriculture Minister Todd McClay.  “The EPA decision introduces appropriate environmental safeguards which will allow kiwifruit and other growers to use Hi-Cane responsibly,” Ms ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Speech to Employers and Manufacturers Association: Relief for today, hope for tomorrow
    Kia ora, Ngā mihi nui ki a koutou kātoa Tāmaki Herenga Waka, Tāmaki Herenga tangata Ngā mihi ki ngā mana whenua o tēnei rohe Ngāti Whātua ō Ōrākei me nga iwi kātoa kua tae mai. Mauriora. Greetings everyone. Thank you to the EMA for hosting this event. Let me acknowledge ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Government invests in 1,500 more social homes
    The coalition Government is investing in social housing for New Zealanders who are most in need of a warm dry home, Housing Minister Chris Bishop says. Budget 2024 will allocate $140 million in new funding for 1,500 new social housing places to be provided by Community Housing Providers (CHPs), not ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • $24 million boost for Gumboot Friday
    Thousands more young New Zealanders will have better access to mental health services as the Government delivers on its commitment to fund the Gumboot Friday initiative, says Deputy Prime Minister Winston Peters and Mental Health Minister Matt Doocey.  “Budget 2024 will provide $24 million over four years to contract the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill passes first reading
    The Coalition Government’s Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill, which will improve tenancy laws and help increase the supply of rental properties, has passed its first reading in Parliament says Housing Minister Chris Bishop. “The Bill proposes much-needed changes to the Residential Tenancies Act 1986 that will remove barriers to increasing private ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Montecassino Commemorative Address, Cassino War Cemetery
    Standing here in Cassino War Cemetery, among the graves looking up at the beautiful Abbey of Montecassino, it is hard to imagine the utter devastation left behind by the battles which ended here in May 1944. Hundreds of thousands of shells and bombs of every description left nothing but piled ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • First Reading – Repeal of Section 7AA of the Oranga Tamariki Act 1989
    I present a legislative statement on the Oranga Tamariki (Repeal of Section 7AA) Amendment Bill Mr. Speaker, I move that the Oranga Tamariki (Repeal of Section 7AA) Amendment Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the Social Services and Community Committee to consider the Bill. Thank you, Mr. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • First reading of 7AA’s repeal: progress for children
    The Bill to repeal Section 7AA of the Oranga Tamariki Act has had its first reading in Parliament today. The Bill reaffirms the Coalition Government’s commitment to the care and safety of children in care, says Minister for Children Karen Chhour.  “When I became the Minister for Children, I made ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • China Business Summit 2024
    Kia ora koutou, good morning, and zao shang hao. Thank you Fran for the opportunity to speak at the 2024 China Business Summit – it’s great to be here today. I’d also like to acknowledge: Simon Bridges - CEO of the Auckland Chamber of Commerce. His Excellency Ambassador - Wang ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Assisted depatures from New Caledonia
    Foreign Minister Winston Peters has confirmed a New Zealand Government plane will head to New Caledonia in the next hour in the first in a series of proposed flights to begin bringing New Zealanders home.    “New Zealanders in New Caledonia have faced a challenging few days - and bringing ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Assisted departures from New Caledonia
    Foreign Minister Winston Peters has confirmed a New Zealand Government plane will head to New Caledonia in the next hour in the first in a series of proposed flights to begin bringing New Zealanders home.  “New Zealanders in New Caledonia have faced a challenging few days - and bringing them ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Government to rollout roadside drug testing
    The Coalition Government will introduce legislation this year that will enable roadside drug testing as part of our commitment to improve road safety and restore law and order, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says.  “Alcohol and drugs are the number one contributing factor in fatal road crashes in New Zealand. In ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Minister responds to review of Kāinga Ora
    The Government has announced a series of immediate actions in response to the independent review of Kāinga Ora – Homes and Communities, Housing Minister Chris Bishop says. “Kāinga Ora is a large and important Crown entity, with assets of $45 billion and over $2.5 billion of expenditure each year. It ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Pseudoephedrine back on shelves
    Associate Health Minister David Seymour is pleased that Pseudoephedrine can now be purchased by the general public to protect them from winter illness, after the coalition government worked swiftly to change the law and oversaw a fast approval process by Medsafe. “Pharmacies are now putting the medicines back on their ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • New Zealand-China Business Summit
    Tēnā koutou katoa. Da jia hao.  Good morning everyone.   Prime Minister Luxon, your excellency, a great friend of New Zealand and my friend Ambassador Wang, Mayor of what he tells me is the best city in New Zealand, Wayne Brown, the highly respected Fran O’Sullivan, Champion of the Auckland business ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • New measures to protect powerlines from trees
    Energy Minister Simeon Brown has announced that the Government will make it easier for lines firms to take action to remove vegetation from obstructing local powerlines. The change will ensure greater security of electricity supply in local communities, particularly during severe weather events.  “Trees or parts of trees falling on ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Wairarapa Moana ki Pouakani win top Māori dairy farming award
    Wairarapa Moana ki Pouakani were the top winners at this year’s Ahuwhenua Trophy awards recognising the best in Māori dairy farming. Māori Development Minister Tama Potaka announced the winners and congratulated runners-up, Whakatōhea Māori Trust Board, at an awards celebration also attended by Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and Finance Minister ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • DJ Fred Again – Assurance report received
    "On the 27th of March, I sought assurances from the Chief Executive, Department of Internal Affairs, that the Department’s correct processes and policies had been followed in regards to a passport application which received media attention,” says Minister of Internal Affairs Brooke van Velden.  “I raised my concerns after being ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • District Court Judges appointed
    Attorney-General Judith Collins has announced the appointment of three new District Court Judges, to replace Judges who have recently retired. Peter James Davey of Auckland has been appointed a District Court Judge with a jury jurisdiction to be based at Whangarei. Mr Davey initially started work as a law clerk/solicitor with ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Unions should put learning ahead of ideology
    Associate Education Minister David Seymour is calling on the Post Primary Teachers’ Association (PPTA) to put ideology to the side and focus on students’ learning, in reaction to the union holding paid teacher meetings across New Zealand about charter schools.     “The PPTA is disrupting schools up and down the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Craig Stobo appointed as chair of FMA
    Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Andrew Bayly today announced the appointment of Craig Stobo as the new chair of the Financial Markets Authority (FMA). Mr Stobo takes over from Mark Todd, whose term expired at the end of April. Mr Stobo’s appointment is for a five-year term. “The FMA plays ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Budget 2024 invests in lifeguards and coastguard
    Surf Life Saving New Zealand and Coastguard New Zealand will continue to be able to keep people safe in, on, and around the water following a funding boost of $63.644 million over four years, Transport Minister Simeon Brown and Associate Transport Minister Matt Doocey say. “Heading to the beach for ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • New Zealand and Tuvalu reaffirm close relationship
    New Zealand and Tuvalu have reaffirmed their close relationship, Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters says.  “New Zealand is committed to working with Tuvalu on a shared vision of resilience, prosperity and security, in close concert with Australia,” says Mr Peters, who last visited Tuvalu in 2019.  “It is my pleasure ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • New Zealand calls for calm, constructive dialogue in New Caledonia
    New Zealand is gravely concerned about the situation in New Caledonia, Foreign Minister Winston Peters says.  “The escalating situation and violent protests in Nouméa are of serious concern across the Pacific Islands region,” Mr Peters says.  “The immediate priority must be for all sides to take steps to de-escalate the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • New Zealand welcomes Samoa Head of State
    Prime Minister Christopher Luxon met today with Samoa’s O le Ao o le Malo, Afioga Tuimalealiifano Vaaletoa Sualauvi II, who is making a State Visit to New Zealand. “His Highness and I reflected on our two countries’ extensive community links, with Samoan–New Zealanders contributing to all areas of our national ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Island Direct eligible for SuperGold Card funding
    Transport Minister Simeon Brown has announced that he has approved Waiheke Island ferry operator Island Direct to be eligible for SuperGold Card funding, paving the way for a commercial agreement to bring the operator into the scheme. “Island Direct started operating in November 2023, offering an additional option for people ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Further sanctions against Russia
    Foreign Minister Winston Peters today announced further sanctions on 28 individuals and 14 entities providing military and strategic support for Russia’s invasion of Ukraine.  “Russia is directly supported by its military-industrial complex in its illegal aggression against Ukraine, attacking its sovereignty and territorial integrity. New Zealand condemns all entities and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • One year on from Loafers Lodge
    A year on from the tragedy at Loafers Lodge, the Government is working hard to improve building fire safety, Building and Construction Minister Chris Penk says. “I want to share my sincere condolences with the families and friends of the victims on the anniversary of the tragic fire at Loafers ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Pre-Budget speech to Auckland Business Chamber
    Ka nui te mihi kia koutou. Kia ora and good afternoon, everyone. Thank you so much for having me here in the lead up to my Government’s first Budget. Before I get started can I acknowledge: Simon Bridges – Auckland Business Chamber CEO. Steve Jurkovich – Kiwibank CEO. Kids born ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago

Page generated in The Standard by Wordpress at 2024-05-26T05:28:33+00:00