Open mike 09/08/2021

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, August 9th, 2021 - 99 comments
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99 comments on “Open mike 09/08/2021 ”

  1. Jenny how to get there 1

    BAU in the age of climage change?

    When images of storm surge waters pouring into New York subways and train tunnels in China with commuters trapped inside railway carriages with flood water up to their necks. It is hard to know what to make of this.

    Except to say that this is even worse than the bike bridge.

    With predicted sea level rise of over one metre by 2100 and five metres 2300, alongside storm surge events, (if the current portal remains at Victoria Park or even the Britomart Centre), the projected design life of this tunnel will be short, before it will/is flooded as well.

    I find it interesting that both, National and Labour are in lock step behind this proposal.

    It would be interesting to know what the Green Party's position is.

    Do the Green Party support or oppose the government's $15 billion under harbour tunnel?

    Can we expect a statement from the Green Party leaders or Green Party spokesperson on transport, either endorsing, or condemning this proposal?

    Bonkers.

    Blowout! Auckland harbour tunnels will cost $15 billion

    Simon Wilson, NZ Herald, 7 Aug 2021

    The estimated cost of an Auckland harbour crossing by tunnel, as promoted by Finance Minister Grant Robertson on Tuesday, has ballooned to $15 billion.

    This is a 50 per cent increase on the previous estimate, of $10 billion….

    https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/news/politics/blowout-auckland-harbour-tunnels-will-cost-15-billion/?

    • cricklewood 1.1

      Probably should get on with building a new bridge, Add dedicated bus lanes both ways so the busway is as efficient as possible. Pedestrian/Cyclist/Ebike/Scooter lanes under the main deck.

      I'm not convinced on a tunnel nor rail as public transport from the shore. I'm more in favor of an electrified bus fleet.

      • Jenny how to get there 1.1.1

        yes

      • Johnr 1.1.2

        Another bridge is all very well but where to put it?

        The present harbour bridge has enough capacity. It's the on ramps and merging traffic that jams the whole motorway system. Another bridge marrying into this system will compound the problems

        Isn't it time that the powers realise that the CBD is only a small blip on the Ak landscape and the need for everybody to congregate there is one of the major congestion causes.

        Wouldn't it be far more cost effective to offer businesses some real incentive to relocate into Aks many dormitory suburbs, there by negating the need for people to travel to or through the CBD.

        • WeTheBleeple 1.1.2.1

          I like the way you're thinking.

          Adding to that – we push everyone into the same space… and time.

          There's no reason we could not stagger work times to alleviate rush hour woes.

          9-5 should be just one of a range of shift options. Companies that can should flex their flexibility.

          Work from home is good and well but I note on social media community pages the biggest whingers typically work from home. It may be making them antisocial? An alternative is to have some office days, and some work from home days. These also could run on staggered times.

          It's not that hard to think outside the box unless you're a moron – something which many business and council executives seem to take great pride in.

          The uptake of public transport is however in dire straits because covid. So while I like the ideal of getting everyone on buses, I completely understand the reticence of many to utilise the services. Plan B is to electrify our fleets.

          In the interim, who's enjoying the traffic jams other than oil executives.

          • GreenBus 1.1.2.1.1

            Even better if work times are same to utilise car sharing and public transport to cut back traffic and not just in big apple.

            • WeTheBleeple 1.1.2.1.1.1

              Well clearly that plan doesn't work, large numbers of Aucklanders sit stuck in traffic every day. We're talking predominantly white collar workers: Share their cars? – lol jokes!

              My neighbourhood's full of pot bellied pigs who, as a rite of passage to their 50's, get themselves a sports car. Share? Give a toss? More lols.

              Covid has totally bitch-slapped attempts to get us into public transport, and ride sharing is not taking off either.

              Nature separates species in time and space because it works. Huge diversity in a single tree can be found. Partitioning works. Night bugs, dawn bugs, day bugs, dusk bugs… canopy, sub-canopy, ground, below ground…

              We can learn from this – or we can claim our superiority over nature once more and jam everyone and everything in the same space and time – cos that's working out great.

              All because we make a plan doesn't mean it's a good plan. Seen central city lately? – our town planners are freaking morons.

        • satty 1.1.2.2

          Does this mean all IT people move to the north, all insurance people to the west and all bank people to the south? Are we starting a mass migration project here?

          If people don't move permanently, based on their new work location, there's the possibility of more road chaos: In an ideal world with all business in a central spot (CBD) and all workers of the CBD evenly distributed around that centre means very little interference in the commute. After a split of the single CBD into several smaller CBDs it can, dependent on the worker distribution, lead to longer commutes for a significant number of people (that can't move) and to more "crossings" of workers that have to travel to a remote CBD.

        • Gabby 1.1.2.3

          Cue howls of moneyed rage from chamber of commerce and cbd real estate speculators.

    • Bearded Git 1.2

      Yes, let us now listen to the howls of outrage from ACT and the Nats about this $5,000 million increase in cost after their howls about a bike/pedestrian bridge costing just 4.6% of the cost of the tunnel.

      But of course they love cars so much they will say nothing.

    • Incognito 1.3

      With predicted sea level rise of over one metre by 2100 and five metres 2300, alongside storm surge events, (if the current portal remains at Victoria Park or even the Britomart Centre), the projected design life of this tunnel will be short, before it will/is flooded as well.

      Really? You made that up, didn’t you?

      • Macro 1.3.1

        Really? You made that up, didn’t you?

        From the link that Jenny included in her comment

        Sea-level rise is faster than previously believed and could exceed 1 metre by the end of the century unless global emissions are reduced, according to a survey of more than 100 specialists.

        Based on new knowledge of climate sensitivity and polar ice melt, the experts say coastal cities should prepare for an impact that will hit sooner than predicted by the United Nations and could reach as high as 5 metres by 2300.

        BTW I was involved in setting out the upgrading of Fanshaw Street and well remember the excavation of the foot path outside the then vodafone building. We hit water after about 50cm which would recede after high tide. (ie that main arterial -which is on reclaimed land – is just over 50cm above high water mark)

        • Incognito 1.3.1.1

          Thanks.

          Can Jenny or you tell us what the projected design life of this tunnel is and how short it will be when those predicted environmental changes in 2100 and 2300 (and in between) eventuate?

          • Andre 1.3.1.1.1

            I'm guessing a tunnel under a harbour probably already has a hefty pumping system installed, and stopbank dams at both portals are really easy to do.

            • Incognito 1.3.1.1.1.1

              Let’s hear from Macro or Jenny whether they have anything of substance to support Jenny’s claim about the short projected design life of the tunnel. Sounds to me that somebody did these projections and that they were not plucked out of thin air. Maybe this is already accounted for in the design plans and this is part-reason for the high projected cost. So, let’s hear it.

            • Macro 1.3.1.1.1.2

              Yep that is the case – but even so we only have to look at the recent flooding of the NY subway, and the recent similar flooding in China to know that such a tunnel would not be without risk.

              • McFlock

                Isn't the NY subway operating again?

                Temporary disruption on occasion (when nobody should be using it anyway, e.g. a hurricane) isn't necessarily a major problem.

                • Macro

                  Obviously it depends upon where the entrance to the tunnel would be located. As I pointed out above the land around the viaduct basin back to the bottom of Franklin Street and the bottom of Queen Street is actually reclaimed land and little above current High water. The amount of flooding in a freshly dug hole some 100 m from the wharf side had to be seen to be believed. You couldn't pump it out – the contractors had to wait till the tide went out to work. It was basically just loads of rock and rubble.

                • WeTheBleeple

                  Recent disruptions to the Tube in London saw locals dealing with the bus system to try to get to work. Suffice it to say there were many disappointed bosses/punters etc waiting for their workers/entertainment to arrive.

                  As one comic said of the price and service: It's like paying 20 quid for a basic cheeseburger and getting a plate of shit.

                  There's no real contingencies built into anything. The neo-libs have demanded efficiency and now we see they've actually served us all a big plate of shit. How's the eating?

                  These folks fixated on BAU are merely whistling in the wind to try keep their spirits up. It's a nonsensical but understandable reaction to realities they're finding too hard to accept. The weather is breaking systems at such a rate we'll run out of funds to fix them.

                  Major crisis are converging. Countries are burning and crops are failing all over. Even here in 'the best place to spend an apocalypse' we're seeing how the weather doesn't give a toss about such hubris.

                  Diversification and decentralisation is absolutely called for. The global supply chain is a joke in the face of ever increasing storm severity and frequency – the oceans will become uninsurable – ships as ecological disasters waiting to happen. It's not if, it's when.

                  Really, we need to hunker down and collectively create resilience in our systems right now! As for business types, they need to sit the fuck down and shut the fuck up.

                  • McFlock

                    So how many auckland tunnels are you after?

                    • Incognito

                      Ooohh, I sense an underwater spaghetti junction coming on.

                    • Andre

                      Squiddy Junction!

                    • Incognito []

                      😀

                    • WeTheBleeple

                      Me? Tunnels? I only want to eliminate tunnel vision.

                      Yeah ok, that was as flat as my screen…

                      What I see is climate change is happening much faster than anticipated. Scientists try hard not to be alarmist but we've been told for several decades we're heading off a cliff and not two fucks was given.

                      As things now progress at a faster clip, tipping points will kick off other tipping points and the whole shebang will cascade into chaos long before such dates given like 2100 (1 m rise) etc. We've got nothing left in the bank, zero time.

                      We should be on a war footing right now. Instead – we're "looking forward to November when COP26 world leaders meet to discuss climate"… AGAIN!!! How fucking ridiculous and hopeless and full of shit are these people. I guess every summit they get another massive backhander by oil Inc. so it's all good for them, till they realise they're also fucked.

                      These billionaire clowns signing up for NZ citizenship so they can hide down here after fucking everything. Disgraceful, inhuman assholes.

                      Tunnel, bridge, traffic flow… PFFFT. How about stop banks, wetlands, crop diversification, local manufacturing. Assessment of what we can and can't make and fill the gaps to do what we can. Circular economy, local economy. Divest and diverge from the sociopaths right now.

                      But no, another distraction. Olympics, a new phone, some vacuous celebrity bint talking about another vacuous celebrity clown.

                      What's the bet half that ship full of covid infected sailors is brimming with Amazon products. For the must haves.

                    • McFlock

                      See, I thought Jenny was saying the tunnel was a stupid idea because the entrance might be under water in a hundred years. Not sure what Auckland Transport can do about crop diversification before then…

                    • WeTheBleeple

                      It's all connected and you know it. Our obsession with getting traffic moving is a ridiculous sideshow in the face of climate change which is now upon us.

                      We need to be on a war footing, doing all we can to mitigate the worst effects because there is no time left. We can worry about future roads when the future is not in question.

                      So you be flippant and foolish all you like. You know exactly what I'm talking about.

                      p.s. hahaha, gosh, good one.

                    • McFlock

                      Yes, it is all connected.

                      But local transport needs shouldn't be held in stasis because we still have coal-fired power plants.

                      We need to move off fossil fuels while still updating our infrastructure. How does increasing traffic congestion help address climate change?

          • Jenny how to get there 1.3.1.1.2

            Incognito

            9 August at 4:08 pm

            …..Can Jenny or you tell us what the projected design life of this tunnel is and how short it will be when those predicted environmental changes in 2100 and 2300 (and in between) eventuate?

            Hi Incognito, as you are probably aware there is a lot of uncertainty about when the predicted environmental changes brought on by climate change will eventuate.

            In answer to your question about when these events may eventuate; recent events here and overseas which caught many experts by surprise, seem to suggest that the modeling of when these events will eventuat may be underestimating the expected time line.

            In answer to your other question about the designe life of this tunnel:

            As yet, none of the details of this proposed tunnel, including its projected design life, have been released by the government.

            However, I would expect that the designers have factored in climate change into their planning.

            That being the case;

            With rising ocean temperatures that fuel hurricanes, with expanding tropical zones, with tropical cyclones creeping further south. (and north).

            On good authority I have been advised that there is probably more than even chance, that a storm surge caused by a climate change supercharged cyclone, will see the southern portal to this tunnel, muted to be at Victoria Park, being overtopped within the next 50 years.

            Taking these factores into account, I would say that the designers are probably aiming for a design life of 25 years.

            Speaking personally, (and you may disagree), but I think that if we are going to spend $15 billion on anything, I would hope it would be on something that will last a bit longer than that.

            • Jenny how to get there 1.3.1.1.2.1

              The interesting thing to look for, will be length of coverage the insurance industry are prepared to give this structure.

              Time for an OIA?

              No doubt their decision will be informed by the tunnel floodings overseas.

            • Incognito 1.3.1.1.2.2

              Never asked when these weather-related events may eventuate.

              Your “good authority” is of no use to us if we cannot verify anything.

              Taking these factores [sic] into account, I would say that the designers are probably aiming for a design life of 25 years.

              In other words, you have no idea and making a wild uneducated guess. What’s new?

              As I suspected, you made it up.

              Thanks for confirming and clarifying.

    • Velcro 1.4

      You are perfectly entitled to talk claptrap about sea level rise. But that does not mean we have to swallow it

  2. Jenny how to get there 2

    If the Northern Pathway bike bridge was bonkers, this is completely bonkers.

    "A compelling BCA may be difficult to produce. The last time it was done, in November 2020, the BCA was 0.2. That's a return of only 20 cents in value for every dollar spent.

    Even the proposed $685 million Northern Pathway bridge has a better BCA: it's 0.4…."

    "This is a 50 per cent increase on the previous estimate, of $10 billion…."

    https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/news/politics/blowout-auckland-harbour-tunnels-will-cost-15-billion/?

    Though the government have not said whether this $15 billion tunnel will include a road option, the previous estimate of $10 billion was for the rail and road option.

    From this I think we can safely assume, that the government has caved in to political pressure from the powerful roading lobby, and political allies, the Auckland Chamber of Commerce and the National and Act parties.

    In spite of right wing ideological committment to private cars.

    One thing Auckland doesn't need is another road way across the Waitemata feeding into the inner city and Northern motorway increasing congestion and pollution.

    Madness.

    • Ad 2.1

      The old bridge simply doesn't fit all modes, wasn't built for light rail, and is so old it's irredeemably fragile.

      People should just accept its expensive.

      No one in NZ outside Auckland has a clue about the scale we now operate at.

      CRL is $5b and 3.3kms long. Over a million a metre. Started by National government.

      Spend the money.

  3. bwaghorn 4

    Plaque ship in tauranga, 100 workers have been on board, hang onto your hat hope our luck holds, I say shut tauranga now.

    • Bearded Git 4.1

      Some anti-plaque toothpaste should sort this….or is it a plague ship?

      • Patricia Bremner 4.1.1

        Had your fun at someone else's expense. "q" instead "g" Big deal!!

        • Bearded Git 4.1.1.1

          Just a joke Patricia…..I made a friendly comment and owned up the other day when I wrote "incite" instead of "insight" and somebody humorously picked me up on it.

          Meanwhile I agree with your comment below that ships arriving here where half of the crew have Covid are a major Covid risk to NZ. Port and ship workers should be vaccinated already as a priority.

          Does anyone out there have info as to what percentage of these workers have been vaccinated?

      • bwaghorn 4.1.2

        I'll have to brush up on my spelling

    • Patricia Bremner 4.2

      A very frightening event, which shows the difficulties facing port and ship workers during the shortages and delays caused by the pandemic.

    • Treetop 4.3

      This was predictable as the third cargo ship in as many weeks. Just like Australia having Covid community transmission and the trans Tasman bubble being suspended for 8 weeks.

      See how the next 14 days go.

    • Jimmy 4.4

      Hopefully all the Tauranga port workers and their families are vaccinated (they are supposed to be) so hopefully no need to lock Tauranga down.

      • Muttonbird 4.4.1

        It doesn't matter if they are vaccinated or not, they are still going to spread it to those unvaccinated.

        • Patricia Bremner 4.4.1.1

          That is the issue The transmission by healthy people/asymptomatic people/vaccinated people is why mask wearing in mandatory in many vaccinated countries. Delta is a difficult and dangerous beast.

        • Jimmy 4.4.1.2

          Absolutely, that's why we need everyone that wants to be vaccinated, to be vaccinated as soon as possible.

          • Muttonbird 4.4.1.2.1

            Quite, but they aren't, so if there are cases found among the port workers whether vaccinated or not, Tauranga must be locked down.

    • Muttonbird 4.5

      I can't believe port workers have been allowed to go on board foreign vessels. Tell me that is not true.

      • McFlock 4.5.1

        Don't they kinda have to?

        • Muttonbird 4.5.1.1

          Oh, well. If people are looking for the source of all outbreaks in NZ since May 2020, look no further than the ports.

          • McFlock 4.5.1.1.1

            Well, no. That's not how any of that works.

            But if we're still accepting frieght, don't port workers make sure shipboard containers etc are hooked up properly before being hoisted, pilots guide vessels in, and various victuallers do their thing?

            There can be mitigations and distancing around most of those activities, but since day ISTR port workers being viewed as frontline staff. With, I believe, fewer breaches than MIQ.

            Which could be regarded as another example of precarious workers being "essential yet unappreciated".

            • Muttonbird 4.5.1.1.1.1

              I don't believe port workers have had fewer breaches than MIQ because there have been no substantiated breaches at MIQ since the lift button case.

              It is true that they are on the front line so I'm annoyed that ports and maritime unions and the MoH don't seem to have this under control yet.

              Do not associate with foreign crew at any distance, it's that simple.

              • McFlock

                How about before the lift button case?

                And I don't just mean disease leaks, I mean shit like people going to liquor stores, crossover at the check in counter, that dude who popped into the person's room for half an hour or so…

  4. pat 5

    More dysfunction in the public service

    https://www.newsroom.co.nz/conservation-board-bust-up-minister-weighs-in-ex-chair-speaks

    The number of ministries being exposed grows by the day.

    • Ad 5.1

      If you're looking for reasons for lack of progress in conservation issues in this government, look no further than this article and the sustained inability of the Minister to act on governance issues with Maori that are of her own making.

  5. Gabby 6

    Prolly cheaper to dynamite the bridge and make ppl stick to their own side or go round.

  6. Poission 7

    North Island power constraint 1730-2000 (9/8/2021)

    https://www.transpower.co.nz/sites/default/files/interfaces/can/CAN%20Low%20Residual%20Situation%204025411929.pdf

    Market responds with most expensive pricing on the planet (afaik)

    $10000 mwh.

    https://www1.electricityinfo.co.nz/

  7. Fireblade 8

    What's on tvnz 1 at 4:30 PM today? The freeview guide says it's confidential. Should we brace for a Covid case announcement?

    https://freeviewnz.tv/tvguide/whats-on/?channelId=9

  8. Gypsy 9

    For those who live outside of Auckland, you can once again look on and contemplate the madness of our Council and it's extended organisations.

    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2021/08/henderson-residents-fuming-after-shambolic-safety-trial-sees-192k-of-taxpayer-money-spent-on-painting-intersection-blue.html

    • Andre 9.1

      Yep.

      Then there's the cycleways into Glen Eden, which I frequently drive beside and have yet to see a single cyclist using. Dedicating part of the roadway for cyclists isn't actually the problem, it's that fukn moron traffic engineers put the worst kind of speedbumps in as well. The kind that give you the least bump inside your car when you maintain full speed over them, but are really unpleasant if you slow down for them. So the only real effect is gratuitously increasing wear and tear on your car's suspension.

      40 years ago in Palmerston North engineers were able to install speed bumps that were a long, high sine wave. So it was smooth and gentle going over them at speeds up to 40ish km/hr, but take them over 50 in most cars it would be horribly uncomfortable and often bottom the suspension.

    • Ad 9.2

      Auckland's footpaths are also barely used at all now.

      May as well demolish them too.

      • Gypsy 9.2.1

        Auckland's footpaths are used a lot. Around our way money has been spent on an unused cycle lane, so the footpaths haven't been repaired in decades. Auckland Council has lost the plot.

  9. Drowsy M. Kram 10

    Covid 19 coronavirus: Judith Collins aims 'one trick pony' jab at health boss Ashley Bloomfield (NZH – 8 August 2021)

    Aiming a 'one trick pony' jab at Collins would be generous, imo, but if she's on the lovely money then bottle her immediately, starting with those precious 'genie eyebrows'.

  10. Cricklewood 11

    Wow only 9 out of 98 workers who boarded the Covid ship vaccinated…

    Given its only been a short time period and its delts surely we need to get them into an MIQ facility for 2 weeks asap…

    Fully paid of course…

    • AB 11.1

      Are they Port of Tauranga employees? If they are, how much time do we need to give private sector employers to get this sorted – or are they so ineffectual that the Government needs to regulate now? Looks like we might again be putting ourselves at risk by appeasing businesses – while, ironically, the government gets lambasted for not appeasing them enough.

      • Cricklewood 11.1.1

        Not sure the whole story is a little concerning given unloading was paused then restarted then crew testing done… but thought vaccination rates on the border were much better than that… surely MOH would have been keeping track… if not better get a move on because it seems a massive vulnerability.

        I really hope we quarintine the effected workers for 14 days, its only going to need one case to slip through.

        • I Feel Love 11.1.1.1

          Well with no vaccine mandate what would anyone expect? Bishop is blaming the Govt of course, so are National promoting a mandate? Is anyone? If not, then plenty of people won't get vaccinated, including privately employed port workers, as is their right.

          • Cricklewood 11.1.1.1.1

            I do wonder where this sits within health and safety legislation given the danger involved and increased likelihood of exposure to Delta…

            The next week or so will potentially make or break the covid response as our overall vaccination rate is nowhere near high enough if delta gets a toehold.

        • Gabby 11.1.1.2

          I wonder if it was the shipping company that laid down the law.

          • Cricklewood 11.1.1.2.1

            Possibly we are very exposed re shipping 3 major players have already withdrawn from Oceania…

          • joe90 11.1.1.2.2

            A decade of treating workers like shit says it ain't the shipping company.

            The Maritime Union has backed calls by whistle blowers at Port of Tauranga who have come forward after suffering serious workplace injuries.

            Several workers spoke to Newshub after suffering chronic injuries while driving long shifts on container straddles, but had to remain anonymous for fear of retribution by employers.

            Maritime Union of New Zealand National Secretary Craig Harrison says Port of Tauranga gets glowing references as a profitable business in the media – but that profit is obtained from unsatisfactory working practices.

            https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU2107/S00002/port-of-tauranga-is-responsible-for-worker-harm.htm

            22 Feb, 2012 12:00 PM

            […]

            Casual workers at the Port of Tauranga say they are too scared to report accidents and injuries for fear their employer will blacklist them for future work.

            The union representing port workers, the Maritime Union, says casual workers fear they will be overlooked for work if they report being injured on the job.

            https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/safety-fears-raised-at-tauranga-port/VBVKPAU2NFWPBBVSEMU2K7QGZE/

    • Jester 11.2

      Aren't these 98 people front line workers? The 89 should now be told, as they are not vaccinated, they are on unpaid leave until they either get vaccinated, or the port finds them another position (if any available) that is not front line, if they don't want to be vaccinated.

      I thought front line people were already supposed to be fully vaccinated. Hasn't the date been and gone. This is how Covid will get back in otherwise.

      • Sabine 11.2.1

        Nope not all border worker were covered in Group 1 and 2. Remember also that Group three has just officially begun to be vaccinated at the End of July, which is now 10 days ago, and Group 4 is still a bit away, unless they now just open to all ages – which is what they should/could do.

        But here from the Ministry in 12 July 2021

        https://www.beehive.govt.nz/release/govt-makes-covid-19-vaccinations-mandatory-more-border-jobs

        “However only 54 percent of active port workers have been fully vaccinated, and we need to see this number increased to avoid the risk of COVID-19 entering the country via our ports.

        “I am extending the mandatory order to cover a further 1800 currently unvaccinated active border workers. This is necessary to lift the uptake of the vaccine among the wider border workforce and strengthen our ongoing response to COVID-19.

        https://covid19.govt.nz/covid-19-vaccines/how-to-get-a-covid-19-vaccination/vaccinations-and-work/border-and-miq-worker-vaccinations/

        How the requirements work

        On 1 May 2021, it became mandatory for a narrow group of border workers and Government officials working at the border or an MIQ facility to be vaccinated against COVID-19.

        From 15 July 2021, it will also become mandatory for most border workers (air and port) to be vaccinated. This is required by new legislation. The COVID-19 Public Health Response (Vaccinations) Amendments Order 2021 comes into effect at 11:59pm on 14 July.

        When affected workers must get vaccinated by

        • All government employees must have had their first dose by 26 August 2021.
        • Privately employed border workers must have had their first dose by 30 September 2021.
        • After the dates above, any new workers covered by the Order will need to have their first dose before starting work. This applies to government and private business employees

        So even by Government orders currently there is no mandate that forces people to be vaccinated at this point. See bold above.

        One might find it easy to complain about misinformation etc, but it can't be stressed enough that a. People currently working in Ports for private companies and government as of today are not mandated to be fully vaccinated. They still have till the end of August and September to do so. That is not Misinformation, that is straight from govt. and the covid site.

  11. Pingao 12

    Just a quick note re your first paragraph. Group 3 have been able to get vaccinated since May. Group 4 has been underway since late July and those 50 years old and above can get vaccinated from this Friday (this age cohort has been brought forward apparently today).

    https://www.health.govt.nz/our-work/diseases-and-conditions/covid-19-novel-coronavirus/covid-19-vaccines/covid-19-getting-vaccine/covid-19-vaccine-rollout

    • Sabine 12.1

      https://www.health.govt.nz/our-work/diseases-and-conditions/covid-19-novel-coronavirus/covid-19-vaccines/covid-19-getting-vaccine/covid-19-vaccine-rollout

      According to this, if you believe the government, Group 4 has started 28 July with people aged 60. Today is the 9th of August.

      Not sure how many people you expect to get vaccinated in 11 days. I'd say atm they are trying to get as many jabs in as many arms they can get and supplies allow. Assuming that most Port worker will be younger then sixty, not many of these will have gotten the invite for the jab, and as per the government mandate if they are working for a private company they have until the 30 of september for their first jab and until the 28 th of August if they work for government.

      so yeah, group 4 has been 'open' since 28 July.

      • Andre 12.1.1

        I'm 57 with nothing to bump me up the priority list. I got my texted invite to book on Friday 6th August. I'm booked in to get my DNA-reprogramming-space-laser microchips installed on Wednesday next week (initially got a slot for this Thursday, but had to reschedule)

        (alwyn, eat your heart out!)

      • Pingao 12.1.2

        If a border worker hasn't yet received an invitation to book their employer must enter their details on the border worker register and the DHB are to prioritise their vaccination.

        https://covid19.govt.nz/covid-19-vaccines/how-to-get-a-covid-19-vaccination/vaccinations-and-work/border-and-miq-worker-vaccinations/

        So … it is dependant on the individual worker (and if that doesn't happen) then the employer to make it happen.

        Like Andre I got my invite to book on the first day that my age cohort was eligible. I am booked for this Friday for jab 1. It all seems pretty easy to me and I don't really understand why so many of the port workers were unvaccinated. I am tending towards casting accusing looks in the direction of the employers/PCBUs.

        • Sabine 12.1.2.1

          there is no requirement for any border worker to be vaccinated as of today, they have until end of August and end of September for their FIRST JABS.

          so you can look and cast an accusatory eye where you would like, but it does not negate the guidelines by government. Which i posted above. And until the government changes these guidelines, the governement should not blame anyone.
          As for you finding it easy, heck i found it even easier. I was included in ‘wider’ whanau and did only need to provide my NHS number and have now been fully vaccinated for over a week now.

          So unless you can actually provide anything to show proof that these workers are all evil bad doers hellbent on bringing the country to the brink with their unvaccinated ways, you should simply accept the fact that as per the government guidelines they are not mandated to be vaccinated before Aug for government border staff and Sept for private employment border staff.

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