Open mike 12/07/2011

Written By: notices and features - Date published: 6:00 am, July 12th, 2011 - 85 comments
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85 comments on “Open mike 12/07/2011 ”

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Jenny 1

12 July 2011 at 6:27 am

‘
According to John Key, the Maori Party are prepared to be with him in a coalition arrangement with Brash.

Prime Minister John Key said a National coalition with both the Maori and ACT parties after the election would still be workable.

stuff.co.nz

Meanwhile though prepared to work with Brash in coalition with National, the Maori Party have decided not to honour their agreement with Harawira, not to run against each other.

How can this be wise?

Breaking their agreement with Harawira, in itself is not a good look. To do it for the benefit of the Nats and their coalition partner ACT is even worse.

I believe the Maori Party are making a serious tactical mistake in underestimating the the potential support that Mana will gain in the wider electorate.

It is likely that in a three way split in reward for their treachery, the Maori Party will retain only one seat in parliament after election.

This result would exactly replicate that of Jim Anderton after his betrayal of his own followers against their overwhelming opposition to the bloody war in Afghanistan.

Like Anderton, Turia will receive a sinecure little back office position from her coalition partner in reward for her treachery, achieving nothing further worthwhile for her people. To suffer being patronised in public, but quietly mocked behind her back by her coalition partners.
Secret Squirrel 2

12 July 2011 at 6:43 am

I doubt there will have been many minds changed in the “Bribe the tribe, clash of Brash” debate last night.

I think it was interesting rather than game changing or party saving. And Sharples – I’m not in New Zealand by anyone’s invitation, I was naturally born in this country!
happynz 3

12 July 2011 at 7:13 am

Yet another announcement of a poll from TV3 this morning this time stating that 70% of Christchurch residents are very pleased with the government’s response to the earthquakes. No mention of who was asked, what was asked, and when the poll was taken.
- Carol 3.1
  
  12 July 2011 at 7:26 am
  
  I no longer take TV3s coverage of news and politics seriously. They are just an arm of the Nat propaganda machine. I’ve got better and more productive things to do with my time than watch TV3 news or The Ntion.
  - happynz 3.1.1
    
    12 July 2011 at 7:31 am
    
    Ditto TV1 and Prime News as well. Their news presenters spend their time apparently reading National Party press releases, sport news and then weather.
    - higherstandard 3.1.1.1
      
      12 July 2011 at 7:56 am
      
      Ditto all news agencies that I disagree with, they are all clearly paid for and run by the political parties I disagree with.
      - Carol 3.1.1.1.1
        
        12 July 2011 at 8:15 am
        
        Oh, come on HS. TV3 has gone beyond the line the way it promotes National Party lines these days – especially Duncan Garner. I prefer TV1 & Stratos these days for TV news, and RNZ in particular for NZ news & current events. TV1 also slants to the right more often than not.
        
        higherstandard 3.1.1.1.1.1
        
        12 July 2011 at 8:31 am
        
        There is pathetic whinging from those of all political persuasions about the perceived bias of various media outlets.
        
        One week they’ll be slighting their perceived bias the next they’ll be quoting the same media operation to support their point of view.
        
        Carol …
        
        12 July 2011 at 8:55 am
        
        That’s always the weak argument used against criticisms of media bias. But I stand by my judgement about TV3. Sometimes TV3 does more positive Labour/left reports, but most of the time it slants to the right. So WHEN it does do a positive left story, it’s worth taking note of and repeating.
        
        The NoW debacle shows just how much media can interfere with political process, and cofirms my judgement from following UK media, that Brown was being undermined by the media.
        
        Also, Dr Margie Comrie has done some research of the coverage of TV news during the last NZ election. I’ve seen her talking about it. Although her focus was on Maori TV, the data shows a bias by TV One & TV3 towards Key & National over Clark & Labour Dduring the 2008 election period. This is seen in the fact that there was a higher percentage of face time given to Nats/Key over Labour & Clark. Key was in the 40-50% range & Clark in the 30-40% range. Maori TV on the other hand were more slanted to Labour & the Maori Party.
        
        Draco T Bastard …
        
        12 July 2011 at 10:52 am
        
        The NoW story is proof that we can’t leave news reporting to the private sector as it’s essentially corrupt. They did everything that the privatisers say that government supported news would do. Hell, they were actually worse, the privatisers say that government news would do what the government tells them but in the UK the politicians were doing what the Rupert Murdoch told them.
        
        Colonial Viper …
        
        12 July 2011 at 11:50 am
        
        And you can’t leave news reporting and journalism to a public sector which has been ordered to behave like the private sector.
        
        Jim Nald …
        
        12 July 2011 at 11:59 am
        
        Along the lines of what I’ve said in the past on TS … the UK Fourth Estate reveals itself to be financially owned and morally mortgaged to the Tory Estate.
  - rod 3.1.2
    
    12 July 2011 at 3:04 pm
    
    The Government didn’t forward $46 Million to TV3 for nothing.
- Colonial Viper 3.2
  
  13 July 2011 at 8:08 am
  
  Reminds me of the news services in Iraq or Libya where the dictator of the day is proudly announced to have won 98% support in the latest elections. That’s some real vindication there.
logie97 4

12 July 2011 at 7:58 am

On potential refugees. “They’re not welcome here,” he said.

Can think of a few “peoples” of this world who a generation or two ago,
were equally as desperate to escape “oppressive” regimes in Europe.

Would he have held the same dismissive attitude towards them?
- Jim Nald 4.1
  
  12 July 2011 at 9:22 am
  
  When his photo-ops are losing the shine, he desperately looks for issues to fan the fires of public debate. Last week, he attempted euthanasia – stirring a discussion that is. This week, it is asylum seekers but he can’t get much traction as it is evident he is morally bankrupt.
  
  The left should not lose focus on the economy, for which opportunities for improvement and growth have been mismanaged and squandered by this administration.
mickysavage 5

12 July 2011 at 8:00 am

Gawd. Key must be counting his lucky stars. Just as he and National are on the ropes he gets the chance to engage in a little bit of redneck rascism, and not about ACT either.

News that a group of refugees including children expressed a desire to come to New Zealand has allowed him to say they are “not welcome”.

No doubt Key is hoping that the debate about Asylum seekers gets as heated as in Australia. When I was there recently I could not believe that a couple of hundred people fleeing their country and wanting to settle in a country of 20 million could attract such heat. The issue seemed to be the political story of the day.

The chances of a boat actually reaching New Zealand are remote beyond belief. Why bypass Australia and travel thousands of miles to reach a similar nation?

And so much for the rule of law. International law requires a country to accept refugees and to consider their claim for status properly. Compassion requires the same.

But what are such considerations when there is an election to win …
- higherstandard 5.1
  
  12 July 2011 at 8:14 am
  
  That’s right Mickey he should have said that we would welcome them with open arms rather than discouraging an influx of economic refugees.
  - mickysavage 5.1.1
    
    12 July 2011 at 8:23 am
    
    No HS
    
    He did not have to say a thing. If he was going to say something he should have said that New Zealand is bound by international law and would abide by its obligations.
    - higherstandard 5.1.1.1
      
      12 July 2011 at 8:34 am
      
      Bullshit, in this instance he said exactly the correct thing and you’re just practicing partisan political hackery because it didn’t come out of the mouth of a Labour politician.
      
      Step back and imagine the same words coming out of Helen Clark’s mouth and reconsider your position.
      - mickysavage 5.1.1.1.1
        
        12 July 2011 at 8:56 am
        
        BS yourself HS.
        
        I recall clearly Helen Clark’s Government deciding to accept 750 Afghani refugees from the Tampa after John Howard’s government refused to allow it to land. I cheered at the time.
        
        I have since met a number of them and they are very decent generous people.
        
        Helen would not only have talked differently she has shown that she would have decided differently. No dog whistle for her, just compassion.
        
        mickysavage 5.1.1.1.1.1
        
        12 July 2011 at 9:13 am
        
        Oops it was 150 refugees.
        
        Seti 5.1.1.1.1.2
        
        12 July 2011 at 11:20 am
        
        What does your leader say about the issue micky?
        
        The Labour Party is also saying no to Sri Lankan asylum seekers.
        
        A group of boat people detained in Indonesia have been seen showing signs that they want to come to New Zealand.
        
        The Government has rejected them.
        
        Labour leader Phil Goff holds a similar view and says we can’t run immigration policy on sympathy and let everyone that turns up her into the country.
        
        He says the way to go is meet our responsibilities with our refugee quota, not promote gain for people smugglers who’re making money out of the misery of others.
        
        By your reasoning Phil is showing his incompassion, nyet?
        
        weka …
        
        12 July 2011 at 11:25 am
        
        Labour leader Phil Goff agreed refugees should only be accepted if they came through the official channels.
        
        However, he would not agree with the Prime Minister’s choice of words that the asylum seekers were “not welcome”.
        
        “I’d put it in a different way. I think that shows a lack of human feeling for the suffering of the individuals concerned.”
        
        The Prime Minster was building the situation into a bigger problem than it was, he said.
        
        “It is a potential problem. Not one person has every come by boat to New Zealand. You can’t rule it out entirely. But it is not an overwhelming threat to New Zealand.”
        
        http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/5269065/Sri-Lankan-community-backs-Key
        
        Methinks some people need some training in how to read the media 😉
  - Colonial Viper 5.1.2
    
    12 July 2011 at 8:41 am
    
    an influx of economic refugees.
    
    And how the frak do you know they are economic refugees, and not a community being persecuted for their involvement in the Sri Lankan civil war?
    
    Reports say they are Tamils and if they directly supported the losing side in that war they are now screwed and their lives under official or unofficial threat.
    
    Don’t be such an a-hole before you know the facts, and don’t be like John Key who couldn’t give a fuck about any of that minor detail.
- Colonial Viper 5.2
  
  12 July 2011 at 8:36 am
  
  Key is continue the play of ACT’s racist card. As I said in the Implosion-Watch thread, I bet he knew about these asylum seekers Sunday morning.
  - ak 5.2.1
    
    12 July 2011 at 10:23 am
    
    Aye. Geriatric serial-adulterer racists who have just ripped off the taxpayers half a bill for a worthless report are welcome in government but persecuted women and kids in fear of their lives can’t get a toe on the beach. Lovely chaps, these NACTZies.
    - Jim Nald 5.2.1.1
      
      12 July 2011 at 10:37 am
      
      They are madly sprouting. Another mushroom popping out at 3pm today:
      
      http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/5271093/Federated-Farmers-president-Acts-new-candidate
      
      At this rate, are KKK costumes running out of stock?
      - Red Rosa 5.2.1.1.1
        
        12 July 2011 at 12:18 pm
        
        ACT must be getting truly desperate.
        
        The Nicholson term in Federated Farmers ended with sighs of relief from the agribusiness and agripolitical fraternity. Nicholson went out a fortnight ago, with rantings echoing Brash on the usual suspects – local bodies, Big Govt, climate change denial etc etc.
        
        More moderate characters have now been elected to Feds national leadership, with an apparently genuine urban-friendly look. So even Feds will be backing away from their previous leader.
        
        Looks like another futile attempt at ACT life support. John Key’s enthusiasm for euthanasia should be applied to political parties.
        
        Jim Nald 5.2.1.1.1.1
        
        12 July 2011 at 3:35 pm
        
        Never to disappoint – ACT is comfy cemetery for yet another male, pale and stale …
        
        http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/5271093/Nicolson-to-take-on-English-as-ACTs-new-candidate
        
        Maybe Alasdair Thompson would like to be their Women’s Affairs spokesperson?
- Olwyn 5.3
  
  12 July 2011 at 9:36 am
  
  The refugees are indeed unlikely to get here, since according to the story they have already been arrested in Indonesia, and sent to the the controversial processing centre near Malaysia. When I was in Australia recently it was pointed out to me that about 3,000 people a year try to get into Australia off the boats, while a great many more than that are brought in as “experts” to work, their expertise often being a willingness to work for low wages. The former generate a lot of talk back heat, while the latter are virtually ignored. What is creepy and Orwellian though is the way these sorts of stories are internationalised – it’s as if there are news bite forms, for which particulars are sought to add colour, detail and “authenticity” to a concept. If it worked in Australia or perhaps America, the idea seems to be, then let’s run it up the flag pole here and see if anyone salutes it.
- Blue 5.4
  
  12 July 2011 at 9:44 am
  
  “Just as he and National are on the ropes” What ? “On the ropes” would indicate a lack of support and a party which is dysfunctional in the extreme. Even you can’t believe that, or are you thinking of the leaderless Labour Party ? Just because you say it to an already converted audience smacks of cheerleading. Polls and public opinion would disagree with your statements, as I believe the important “poll” at the end of the year will as well. Given the vacuum of opposition policies and personalities, its no wonder they will barely have to try to beat a splintered left wing.
  - freedom 5.4.1
    
    12 July 2011 at 12:43 pm
    
    Like most of us, in my professional and my private life, I speak to a wide variety of people.
    The one thing i do not see in the real world, that is reported repeatedly in the media and the infamous Polls, is this supposed supremacy of the National Party as preferred leaders of the country. The last few months however I constantly hear from long time National supporters that they do not agree with what the Government is doing and they have no intention of voting for them in November.
    
    One old timer, a wealthy stalwart of the Nats told me the other day this is the worst Government they can remember in New Zealand’s history and he has already watched three of his grandchildren leave NZ with no intention of returning. I have certainly been impressed by the voracity some of these people express when shown the morsels of ineptitude by this Government.
    
    If we could only get the Fourth Estate functioning again , then Democracy may stand a chance.
    - Kevin Welsh 5.4.1.1
      
      12 July 2011 at 2:51 pm
      
      Even my dis-illusioned right wing boss is now sick of “smile and wave politics”.
Murray 6

12 July 2011 at 8:11 am

Bit of a difference between refugees trying to gain entry through the legal channels and boat people trying to gain entry illegally, Don’t you think.
- mickysavage 6.1
  
  12 July 2011 at 8:31 am
  
  Nope.
  
  Article 31 of the UN Convention on the staus of refugees states:
  
  “The Contracting States shall not impose penalties, on account of their illegal entry or presence, on refugees who, coming directly from a territory where their life or freedom was threatened in the sense of article 1, enter or are present in their territory without authorization, provided they present themselves without delay to the authorities and show good cause for their illegal entry or presence.”
- Colonial Viper 6.2
  
  12 July 2011 at 9:17 am
  
  Bit of a difference between refugees trying to gain entry through the legal channels and boat people trying to gain entry illegally, Don’t you think.
  
  *Facepalm* of course! Desperate disenfranchised refugees with minimal resources should simply access legal channels!
  
  Perhaps the Sri Lankan government would have helped them to apply for refugee status in NZ while they were being persecuted, what do you think mate?
  - higherstandard 6.2.1
    
    12 July 2011 at 2:36 pm
    
    CV there’s a number of country’s they could seek refugee status in before taking the dangerous journey to our shores. Why not other asian countries ? Why not India ? Why not Indonesia or the Phillipines ? Why not Australia ?
    
    Why NZ ?
    - Vicky32 6.2.1.1
      
      13 July 2011 at 12:21 am
      
      CV there’s a number of country’s they could seek refugee status in before taking the dangerous journey to our shores. Why not other asian countries ? Why not India ? Why not Indonesia or the Phillipines ? Why not Australia ?
      Why NZ ?
      
      You’re trotting out the same tired arguments that were being used against Ahmed Zaoui in 2002-4, and with the same lack of logic. Do you really think these people have any kind of a choice? If they did they wouldn’t be in a boat, and would not have already been arrested, as Olwyn says above.
      Ahmed Zaoui was eventually released and the sky didn’t fall. It’s not going to fall if 150 Tamils come here. We’ve got plenty of room, for goodness’ sake, and plenty else as well, contrary to what I heard Key say on the news this morning…
      - higherstandard 6.2.1.1.1
        
        13 July 2011 at 7:51 am
        
        Answer the question Vicky.
        
        Why on earth would they want to sail more than half way around the world to come here when there’s a multitude of other countries closer by
        
        Colonial Viper 6.2.1.1.1.1
        
        13 July 2011 at 7:59 am
        
        Why on earth would they want to sail more than half way around the world to come here when there’s a multitude of other countries closer by
        
        Because NZ has a reputation for kindness and giving a shit. Especially about seriously listening to the stories of refugees and people seeking asylum from persecution in their home lands. Well, more of a reputation than the Australians.
        
        What of it?
        
        By the way, plenty of people sailed all the way around the world to make their lives here in NZ in the 1800’s, when they too could have chosen a multitude of other countries closer by.
        
        What of that?
uke 7

12 July 2011 at 9:21 am

LA Times reports:

“Argentine songwriter and singer Facundo Cabral, an icon of Latin American folk and protest music, was shot to death early Saturday by unknown gunmen who intercepted his car in Guatemala City and pumped it full of bullets.
…
Cabral, born to a dirt-poor family in provincial Argentina, rose to fame in the 1970s primarily as a writer and performer of protest songs, at a time when Latin America was shackled by military dictatorships, coups and crises. He went into exile in Mexico during Argentina’s military junta from 1976 to 1983.
…
In 1996 UNESCO named him an “international messenger of peace,” and themes of peace and brotherhood dominated his later work.”
freedom 8

12 July 2011 at 11:23 am

Stuff poll currently at 79.2% against helping the boat people

Once again I am ashamed and embarrassed at the growing disregard for others being expressed by people who call themselves New Zealanders. This is not the country i was raised to believe in, this is a quagmire of greedy and selfish sycophants who deserve the pain to come if they continue down this road to hegemony
- Jim Nald 8.1
  
  12 July 2011 at 11:39 am
  
  I love Key, the grateful and compassionate sod.
  
  If the boat has an Austrian-Jewish refugee lady and this were a few decades ago, isn’t it nice to know he would tell her she is unwelcome and turn her away? And New Zealand better off for that?
  
  Turning back the boat could be his new metaphor for kicking away the ladder?
  
  Anyway, the Left should stay focused on the current economic issues and call their own shots as to when and how the asylum issues would be debated.
  - Roflcopter 8.1.1
    
    12 July 2011 at 1:46 pm
    
    Seems Goff doesn’t agree with you.
- Colonial Viper 8.2
  
  12 July 2011 at 11:48 am
  
  It’s a problem.
  - freedom 8.2.1
    
    12 July 2011 at 1:02 pm
    
    This year, more so than most, every single person has to be reminded they have a choice to make. The choice today is how much longer we want the degradation of our Nation to continue.
    
    All cliches aside, help each other and we win. Hate each other and we lose.
Pascal's bookie 9

12 July 2011 at 1:17 pm

I hear that at the Pike River enquiry, Pikey lawyers cross examining Don Elder are suggesting his comments yesterday were aimed at driving down PRC’s share price so that Solid Energy can get a better price.

I’m pretty sure that the commissioners will see different things from that line of attack than what the lawyers want.
- vto 9.1
  
  12 July 2011 at 3:38 pm
  
  If that is the best that Pike River Coal has then it is all bad for them. As it should be. John Dow is firmly in the sights.
mapped out 10

12 July 2011 at 3:20 pm

http://www.usdebtclock.org/world-debt-clock.html

We are not doing to badly , are we?
- higherstandard 10.1
  
  12 July 2011 at 3:41 pm
  
  Aye Carumba !
Carol 11

12 July 2011 at 3:41 pm

Interesting comment from John Key in Question Time today, in response to a question by Brendon Burns. The question was about Key’s Hard Talk comment that scientists are like lawyers and he could always find a scientist with an alternative scientific view on NZ’s 1000% pure status. Today Key added economists to the list of people who have as diverse views as lawyers. Leaving aside that lawyers are not scientists but aim to represent one side positively, I think it might be a useful quote to repeat back to Key when he’s quoting an economst to support his policies.
- Jim Nald 11.1
  
  12 July 2011 at 4:02 pm
  
  Next to be added to Key’s growing list of lawyers, scientists and economists: the diversity of bullshit from ex-currency traders?
  
  Of course, nothing equals the singularity of opinion from that of ACT’s living dead on racism, sexism, …..
NickC 12

12 July 2011 at 3:53 pm

Fantastic news coming out of the UK. If only our government had the balls to do something like this: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/david-cameron/8630945/David-Cameron-public-services-to-be-opened-up-to-competition.html

I think the biggest benefit will be to public servants themselves. I think the reason that public servants have a bad reputation in most parts of the country is that people don’t feel like they have a choice but to pay for them to be used. If you don’t like your local supermarket you can drive to the one down the road. What if you don’t like your local public service provider? You can’t do much about it so you develop a negative attitude.
- framu 12.1
  
  12 July 2011 at 4:16 pm
  
  yes – imagine how organised and cost effective the post CHCH quake efforts would have been.
  
  sure the PS can be improved, but what your advocating is a society with even bigger imbalances than we currently have – one where those that can afford it get it while those that cant – dont
- Vicky32 12.2
  
  13 July 2011 at 1:07 am
  
  If you don’t like your local supermarket you can drive to the one down the road.
  
  Oh if only! But what if you’re a little old lady who doesn’t drive? Or someone with disabilities? And there’s only one supermarket within a realistic distance?
  What Cameron is doing is complete idiocy!
vto 13

12 July 2011 at 4:02 pm

It is now official… ACT is doomed. The final nail in the coffin has been hit home.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/5271093/Nicolson-to-take-on-English-as-ACTs-new-candidate

Don Nicolson has had views and attitudes at Fed Farmers which have been divisive and ignorant. The man is a shallow twit. Witness Rod Oram’s withering piece on Fed Farmers and Nicolson in the SST this week.

Imagine being at one of their meetings or get-togethers. My god, you would go insane. Or burst your sides with laughter. And imagine when / if Key gets back in and has Brash and Nicolson bleating and screeching and dribbling at the mouth. Put this lot together for the public to see and you will be home and hosed.
Ianupnorth 14

12 July 2011 at 4:08 pm

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10738021 – Federated Farmers leader is going to be an ACT MP – but why are they not brave enough to stand in more than one electorate? That’s right, they aren’t a proper party, with a proper mandate and don’t want their arses being kicked.
- Jim Nald 14.1
  
  12 July 2011 at 5:13 pm
  
  Looks like there may be a method to the nuttiness — ACT will stand in ‘safe’ National seats and ask the super extremist cuckoos & rwnjs to vote tactically, eg electorate seat to Nats and party seat to ACT.
  
  The strategy is to ensure NACTzies metastasize and make New Zealand the diseased male, pale and stale body politic of the Pacific.
  
  The question is which is the next electorate that ACT will stand, and who that candidate might be.
Secret Squirrel 15

12 July 2011 at 4:49 pm

I think it’s a very good move for Don Nicolson to stand for Act (any party will do) in Clutha Southland. He’s got relevant experience for the electorate and should be able to spend more time looking after his constituents that Bill English can from Wellington.

I’d like to see him do well (unless a better candidate stands there). We need smarter voting with more electorate focus rather than party palaver.
- Pascal's bookie 15.1
  
  12 July 2011 at 6:47 pm
  
  Don Nicolson is a stone cold lunatic.
  
  Read this.
  
  http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/farming/5211126/Free-enterprise-cooks-up-a-tasty-stew
  
  Now go back and read it again.
  
  Don is campaigning for the list vote. he isn’t focusing on the electorate at all. He is going to try and get farmers votes by preaching to them about how hard done by they are and try and get enough ACT votes from the Fed Famers network.
  
  This is exactly the same play that ACT ran with in 08 with the sensible sentencing trust Get somebody with a ready built network of emails and mana within a niche group of easily targetable voters; give him a list spot far enough down that he isn’t guaranteed a spot, and bob’s your uncle, should be good for an extra MP worth of votes, maybe more.
  
  It’s farming all right.
  - Colonial Viper 15.1.1
    
    12 July 2011 at 10:17 pm
    
    Meh don’t be too worried, ACT has backstabbed all their women, unceremoniously and undemocratically dumped Hide, backstabbed Maori, seen their monied corporate supporters vapourise and resurrected a leader that rural National voters deserted.
    
    Now with Nicholson portraying themselves as principled visionaries with the country at heart.
    
    Farmers aren’t fools.
  - vto 15.1.2
    
    13 July 2011 at 9:23 am
    
    P’s b, that is just nutty what he is going on about.
    
    Don Nicolson is a nut. “The ETS is a secret plan by the international green movement to create jobs and stave off anarchy”…… that’s what Nicolson thinks. Oh lordy ………..
    
    We have another Garrett / Peters / Bob the builder on our hands………….
Morrissey 16

12 July 2011 at 5:20 pm

New Zealand’s top brains spring into action following Super 15 disaster
Radio Sport, Sunday 10 July 2011 3.30 p.m.

The Canterbury Crusaders lost the Super 15 final on Saturday night. That means New Zealand’s best intellects will be working hard to work out the reason for the calamity….

MURRAY DEAKER: Plenty of spare lines, you’ll get straight through if you ring now. Phil, your thoughts?
CALLER PHIL: I want to talk about the All Black squad. Murray, I am very, very concerned. I think we will have a lack of intelligence, once the ball goes past Daniel Carter.
DEAKER: [long, thoughtful pause] Conrad Smith?
PHIL: Yes, but what if he’s injured, Murray?
DEAKER: [long, thoughtful pause] I know what you’re getting at, Phil.
PHIL: Yes, well, it needs to be said, Murray.
DEAKER: [with utmost gravitas] A lot of people talk about this in private, but are not prepared to talk about it in public. But I don’t give a toss about that! The problem is that in this country we have a lot of boys that are early maturers.
PHIL: Yes, oh yes.
DEAKER: These guys haven’t got the slender build of, say, a Dan Carter, or a Jeff Wilson, or an Andrew Mehrtens.
PHIL: That’s right, Murray.
DEAKER: So they’ve never had to jink, or sidestep, or run around any opponents. They are so huge that all they have ever had to do is barge past them. They’ve never had to think! Because they’re early maturers!
PHIL: It’s a worry. Because these overseas teams, they’re thinkers, Murray! They’re private school boys, and they’re thinkers.! The Australians, Murray, they’re just so educated! I remember once when the lowest-qualified player in the team was a chartered accountant, Murray!
DEAKER: Yes, but we’ll not see the likes of Nick Farr-Jones, David Kirk, Sir John Graham and Sir Wilson Whineray again. They were very bright guys!
PHIL: I’m so worried, Murray….

…ad absurdum, ad nauseam, ad infinitum….
- Colonial Viper 16.1
  
  12 July 2011 at 10:11 pm
  
  Every level of rugby is in talent trouble, down to the bloody radio commentators.
  - Morrissey 16.1.1
    
    12 July 2011 at 11:02 pm
    
    The playing talent is just fine. In fact, they are better than they have ever been.
    
    But as you point out, the commentators are, almost without exception, substandard.
    - logie97 16.1.1.1
      
      13 July 2011 at 12:28 am
      
      Of course, Deaker wasn’t implying that the “cultures” of the blood that is coursing around the veins of those outside Carter is significant in “thinking” – of course he wasn’t and neither was the caller.
      - Morrissey 16.1.1.1.1
        
        13 July 2011 at 5:37 pm
        
        Yes he was, and so was his moronic interlocutor “Phil”.
        
        Would “Phil” be you, by some chance?
chris73 17

12 July 2011 at 5:56 pm

I thought this was an interesting post by dim-post:

I think (non-empirical statement coming up: if I was a political columnist I’d write ‘some say’ or ‘most New Zealanders think’) that if you asked the public why Labour is unpopular then part of the answer would involve a perception of Labour as an unethical, sleazy party (built up by years of scandals like the repeated funding/election spending rorts, Chris Carter, Shane Jones, Phillip-Field, support for Winston Peters, etc). But I also think that if you suggested to Labour MPs or supporters that their party was sleazy or unethical they would be genuinely shocked, because they see themselves as ‘the good guys’ – and they’d attempt to litigate each of the examples I made above (‘it’s the mainstream media’s fault for reporting it! And what about Double Dipton Bill English?’) With the counter-intuitive result that they continue to behave unethically – damaging the integrity of the Labour Party brand and further alienating voters – while still considering themselves highly ethical, and refusing to even acknowledge any of the damage these scandals have caused them. (Because they didn’t really happen, because Labour is so ethical.)

Sort of what I’ve been saying for awhile but he/she does it more eloquently then I can
Draco T Bastard 18

12 July 2011 at 7:22 pm

Fletcher seeks payback for Pink Batt stack
An interesting story. It goes like this.

1.) Oz government announces subsides for insulating homes
2.) Fletcher’s buys bulk stuff to make insulation and keeps said insulation in stock
3.) Due to some serious issues, Oz government cancels insulation subsidy
4.) Fletcher’s seeks compensation from Oz government

Stuff like this is actually sickening. There was no guarantee on the part of the Oz government that Fletcher’s would sell the stock and so the risk that Fletcher’s took is all on their heads. They didn’t need to buy all that stock and they still have it. They haven’t actually lost anything except what they thought, incorrectly, was government guaranteed profits.

Really, all they need to do is just sell the damn stuff. Knock the price down a bit and I’m sure that they’ll still be able to find people who want to insulate their home.
- davidc 18.1
  
  12 July 2011 at 9:15 pm
  
  1.) Oz government announces subsides for insulating homes
  2.) Fletcher’s buys bulk stuff to make insulation and keeps said insulation in stock
  3.) Due to some serious issues, Oz government cancels insulation subsidy
  4.) Fletcher’s seeks compensation from Oz government
  
  You missed a few points…
  1.) Oz government announces 4 billion dollars of subsides for insulating homes
  1.a oz Govt does deal with Fletchers et al to limit margins on basis of massive amount of work.
  
  3.a Oz Govt forgets to require installers to have any training.
  3.b A bunch of guys die during install.
  3.c Oz Govt thinks money can be betyter spent elsewhere.
  3.d Oz Govt cancells subsidy, leaving tens of thousands of houses cold and wasting energy and money.
  
  4. a . Fletchers rightfully expect to be paid for materials brought specifically for a project.
  4.b Fletchers get paid. (hasnt happened yet but it will, behind closed doors)
Adrian 19

12 July 2011 at 8:31 pm

VTO, Fed Farmers are pretty irrelevant , they have 13000 membership payers ( the other 14k or so is made up of associates like family members ) . and he couldn’t get a majority or 6500 farmers to vote for him, if that.
- chris73 19.1
  
  12 July 2011 at 9:20 pm
  
  Thats probably more then Labour has at the moment
Draco T Bastard 20

12 July 2011 at 9:04 pm

This Media is Corrupt
Monbiot

The papers cannot announce that their purpose is to ventriloquise the concerns of multimillionaires; they must present themselves as the voice of the people. The Sun, the Mail and the Express claim to represent the interests of the working man and woman. These interests turn out to be identical to those of the men who own the papers.

So the rightwing papers run endless exposures of benefit cheats, yet say scarcely a word about the corporate tax cheats.

Sounds about par for the course in NZ as well.
- davidc 20.1
  
  12 July 2011 at 9:20 pm
  
  but they ( the ones who wouldnt run the ACT ad) did print this…
  
  http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/comment/5268588/Editorial-Time-Labour-learned-to-play-by-the-rules
  - chris73 20.1.1
    
    12 July 2011 at 9:46 pm
    
    Did you read my post at 17? Thats exactly the point hes making.
  - Colonial Viper 20.1.2
    
    12 July 2011 at 10:07 pm
    
    Ah yes the Dom Post, in the style of Rupert Murdoch. Turning the quibble about a full stop into a media charge of treason for political reasons.
    - chris73 20.1.2.1
      
      12 July 2011 at 10:12 pm
      
      Actually thats Dim-Post, leftie blog if you didn’t know
      
      http://dimpost.wordpress.com/2011/07/12/vicious-circle/
      
      also no right turns wasn’t bad either
      
      http://norightturn.blogspot.com/2011/07/goffing-it-up.html
- prism 20.2
  
  12 July 2011 at 9:22 pm
  
  dtb that’s a good point – the stories about welfare cheats encourage loathing from the employed middle and upper lower class to those less capable. George orwell noted this reaction i think in the road to wigan pier. n the newspapers the financial/business stories are corralled in specialist compartments – sometimes a big story unfolds there unseen by the readers of the everyday news. nbr is read by just a few – the business world is seen as hard to understand or boring. a good move – more people should listen to rod oram.
Morrissey 21

12 July 2011 at 11:07 pm

Why is National Radio, or ANYONE, still talking to the S.S. Trust?

Just a few months ago, Noelle McCarthy, filling in for Jim Mora, interviewed the bloodthirsty Hawkes Bay boer Garth (The Knife) McVicar. Noelle made no attempt to hide her contempt and loathing for McVicar, and tried in vain to get him to say why he had supported the knife-killing of a boy in Auckland, and why he continued to defend the vile criminal and grave-robber David Garrett…
http://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-09032011/#comment-306178

It seemed then that National Radio was declaring publicly that it would have no more to do with that reptile or his disgusting organization.

No such luck, however. On “The Panel” this afternoon, Jim Mora interviewed some fanatic from the Sensible Sentence Trust, this time about the death in jail of a man who murdered a girl in 1967. I was so shocked at the fact that Jim Mora would even countenance interviewing one of these knife enthusiasts, I failed to ascertain if the S.S. Trust supported this murder or was against it.

I whipped off the following e-mail….

From: Morrissey Breen
Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2011 4:30 PM
To: Afternoons
Subject: Why are you continuing to quote the S.S. Trust?
Dear Jim,
Why are you quoting anyone from the Sensible Sentencing Trust? You are aware, I take it, that Garth McVicar loudly and defiantly supported the killer of a teenage boy in Auckland, and still expresses support for the hypocrite and criminal David Garrett.

It’s all very well having Jock Anderson making flippant jokes about Tamil refugees and asylum-seekers, but continuing to quote such a depraved and discredited organization as the S.S. Trust takes the level of irresponsibility on “The Panel” to a new low, and raises serious questions about your integrity and your judgement.

Yours sincerely,
Morrissey Breen
Northcote Point

At 5.15 p.m. Jim replied….
No it doesn’t. I do not want to censor views. Jim
- Vicky32 21.1
  
  13 July 2011 at 1:21 am
  
  No it doesn’t. I do not want to censor views. Jim
  
  Wow, what a deep and meaningful response! I can’t stand Mora and won’t listen to him any longer, which is a pity…
- Colonial Viper 21.2
  
  13 July 2011 at 8:05 am
  
  No it doesn’t. I do not want to censor views. Jim
  
  What BS. How many times has he censored the views of people speaking out against the BS positions of the SS Trust.
  
  Giving air time weight to the views of a group of discredited narrow minded idiots like the SST doesn’t help Mora at all.
  - Morrissey 21.2.1
    
    13 July 2011 at 5:41 pm
    
    Giving air time weight to the views of a group of discredited narrow minded idiots like the SST doesn’t help Mora at all.
    
    I note that one of Jim Mora’s Panelists today was the odious Stephen Franks, an S.S. Trust lawyer and close friend of Garth the Knife McVicar.
- prism 21.3
  
  14 July 2011 at 2:08 pm
  
  Morrissey Which means that Jim Mora says that his mind is as wide open to anything as a fence catching papers in a gale.
  - Morrissey 21.3.1
    
    16 July 2011 at 9:10 am
    
    Which means that Jim Mora says that his mind is as wide open to anything as a fence catching papers in a gale.
    
    I think the problem is his producer. Jim just has to work with what is arranged for him. It’s the same with the extreme right wing commentators Brian Crump has to interview in the evenings.
    
    The list of political “correspondents” that regularly commentate on National Radio is depressing: From New Zealand: Michael Bassett, Michelle Boag, David Farrar, Jock Anderson, Stephen Franks, Deborah Hill Cone, Rosemary McLeod, John Bishop, John Barnett, Graham Bell, Richard Griffin, Neil Miller.
    
    From overseas they are just as bad, if not worse: Lana Shaheen, Liat Collins, Irris Makler, Jason Morrison, Rory Carroll.
    
    Someone actually decides to use such partisan, dishonest, cynical commentators—and it’s not the poor old host.