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Open mike 14/06/2021

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, June 14th, 2021 - 87 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

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87 comments on “Open mike 14/06/2021 ”

  1. bwaghorn 1


    I ask you to put aside your enmity for farmers and consider how unfair it is to tax farmers for buying Utes when there is no viable other option.

    We carry dogs ,chemicals,chainsaws and alsorts of other things you really dont want in the back seat.

    And who the hell would be seen in the Tesla ute!!

    • David 1.1

      This policy is not designed for the productive economy. It’s middle class welfare for the luvies who want to drive a subsidised 80k Tesla to lunch.

      • mac1 1.1.1

        Middle class welfare! The new target group for National. Having belted beneficiaries, de-unionised workers, they're now after the middle class.

        They're wrong on two counts. First, the Tesla meme is an exaggerated reaction to a policy that moves NZ car owners towards fuel efficiency and renewable energy.

        Second, the middle class are the "mum and dad investors", those "ordinary hard-working kiwis" and middle of the road voters. National mocks them at their peril.

        "the luvies who want to drive a Tesla to lunch" indeed!

        All they'll have left are the one per centers and their 10% wannabes to compete with ACT for.

        Or are we seeing a new rural conservative party arising out of the ashes of National as the middle class hate meme and the 'luvies to lunch' seems to indicate a rural bias there.

    • Macro 1.2

      There is a rebate is also available for hybrid vehicles. There are hybrid utes available. You don't all have to have a ranger.

      • Jimmy 1.2.1

        Which brands do hybrids? I know Toyota are working on a hybrid ute but it may not be available for a while and as you say, Ford Ranger don't do one. Do Mazda or Mitsubishi do them?

        • Macro

          I know that the hybrid toyota hi lux is just about here, if not already here.

          From August last year.

          The 4×4 hybrid technology is well developed – just the addition of a different body, and enough people demanding them.

        • Ad

          Ford does the Ford 150, already launched and produced now.

          They are already swamped with orders.

          • Jimmy

            All well and good Ad if you live in USA…………..and even then production starting middle of 2022!

            "Right now it seems that this Lightning will only be available in America, with left-hand drive production kicking off in the middle of 2022. We're reached out to Ford New Zealand for comment, but we won't be holding our breath for the electric truck. "


            • McFlock

              So the gap between vehicles already in the country and that being available in mid-2022 is… how long?

              Who needs to urgently buy a 4wd?

              • Jimmy

                I think you're dreaming if you think that will be available in NZ in 2022.

                Who needs one now? Seems like a lot of builders, electricians, plumbers?, Farmers and other trades people. Look at top vehicle sales in NZ for 2020.

                1. Ford Ranger 7,975
                2. Toyota Hilux 5,796
                3. Toyota RAV 4 5,341
                4. Mitsubishi Triton 3,687 and Holden Colorado at no. 10 with 2,487
                • Andre

                  "Need" is something different than "purchased for image or tax rort reasons".

                  • Jimmy

                    They are very practical vehicles for throwing timber in the back along with a wheel barrow and a ladder. Try doing that with a Nissan leaf. So often is a need. Currently in NZ there seems to be no alternative and probably the Hybrid Toyota Hilux will most likely be the first available non diesel option in NZ but probably wont be until 2022 at earliest.

                    • McFlock

                      Well, the fees won't begin until 2022, so that's convenient timing, innit.

                    • Andre

                      Yes, there are a few that * need * a double-cab ute – or at least, a double-cab ute is the most practical vehicle for them.

                      I suspect they're a small minority of double-cab ute purchasers. Certainly of the double-cab ute owners I know, the majority of them are quite open that a station wagon or van would be much more practical, with a trailer for the very rare big loads, but the tax benefits and image of the ute swung it for them. Oh, plus towing the boat, although they don't mention that bit to the IRD.

                      After all, all these various groups of people managed just fine in the times not very far back when double-cab utes weren't the domineering feature of our roads.

                    • logie97

                      Pop down to any country golf course and see how many tradies, rural estate agents and farmers have used their "work essentials" to get them to golf. And the farmers are probably using pink diesel to power them as well …

                    • Pat

                      @logie…pink diesel isnt a thing in NZ…we have RUC instead

                  • bwaghorn

                    Now I've never owned a new ute and never will I guess, but there are valid reasons to turn you utes over every 3 years or so due to thier resale value falling off a cliff after that

                    • logie97

                      Pat – yes RUC, but the diesel that fills the tanks of the farm ute is not from the local bowser. It is delivered in bulk to the farm for the tractors and some of it finds its way into the ute's tanks.

                    • bwaghorn []

                      The whole reason for ruc's is because it's the simple way for road tax to be gathered when huge amounts of diesel is not for rd usage . I'm picking more than a few farmers pay alot of ruc while not actually on the nzta road network.

                    • Pat

                      @logie…very possibly so but that makes no difference to the RUC incurred.

                • McFlock

                  Funny how many of the ones in the supermarket carparks or on a school run have neither trade tools or advertising. I guess they're all undercover tradies.

                  BTW, since 2019 the rav4 has had a hybrid option, so low emission. the farmers and tradies can all buy them.

                  I wonder if toyota do the black trim and tints for extra, like some of the other road tanks? Gotta look butch, but as soon as it's about emissions then "omagerd I haz no cash" lol

                  • bwaghorn

                    You letting your bias show , I just firmly believe that social good taxs need to be avoidable to be fair . And ite are hands down the best option for us out here .

                    Got my ute 2nd hand ,got mint tints btw bit of a midlife c thing😀

                  • weka

                    that lots of townies own utes and 4WDS isn't a good reason not to support country people owning them.

                    • weka

                      there's politics too,

                    • McFlock

                      The number of people who will "need" to buy a new 4wd in the (maybe) months between when the fees start and when more varieties of low/no-emission (therefore rebated) 4wd come on the market will be very small indeed.

                      I suggest it will be much smaller than the listed number of 4wds sold in 2020, which was Jimmy's response to my "who needs to urgently buy a 4WD?" I doubt anywhere near that number were in a sudden, urgent need to have a new 4wd that day.

                    • weka

                      Thing that interests me more is how the 2nd hand market will be affected. Theory 1 is that prices will increase as utes/4WDs become less available. Theory 2 is that prices will drop as there will be an excess on the market due to Aucklanders buying EVs rather than SUVs. We're all guessing atm.

                      I'm less optimistic about the EV 4WD market than you. I want to hope I am wrong, but the whole thing is shifting deck chairs on the Titanic, so I should probably shut up.

              • Jimmy

                Well here you go McFlock. Seems like Jacinda has been given incorrect info. regarding the availability of electric / hybrid utes. Farmers and some tradies if they need a ute are not going to have any electric option for over two years. And if you think the Ford Lightning will be available in two years time right hand drive, I have a bridge to sell you.

                "Toyota has since confirmed it has no plans to bring any electric utes into New Zealand within the next two years."


                • McFlock

                  Seems like Jacinda has been given incorrect info. regarding the availability of electric / hybrid utes.

                  Seems like you're conflating electric and hybrid, which your link doesn't do:

                  Lala noted Toyota has sold 23,257 hybrid vehicles in the past five years.

                  In the same period, the company said it sold just under 5300 EVs – 45 percent of which were in the "luxury market".

                  "Hybrid technology is more readily available and is significantly more affordable for everyday Kiwis," Lala said.

    • satty 1.3

      If you require machinery for your business, like a farm, isn't that a tax-deductible expense?

      Same for tradies, I thought that's the reason many tradies have to top-of-the-range utes with sports-package etc. Surely that's the only version suitable for the job they have to do.

      I think it's essential long-term to reduce the number of gas-guzzlers coming into the country now. Those cars – the majority of those are not used on farms (Toyota Hilux and Ford Ranger have the highest sales in NZ) – will be on the road for the next 15 to 20 years. Same with busses: Wellington Council should have been forced to replace the trolley buses with fully electrical ones. Instead we got more polluting (incl. noise as a form of pollution) ones, that will be around for a long, long time.

      • bwaghorn 1.3.1

        By all means tax townies lux's, and the more intelligent tradies I know use Van's, they are a far better fit for their type of cargo.

        But until there is a selection of ev Utes with 500 is of distance and towing power , remove it from rural utes.

        • woodart

          what size ranch do you have that needs a 500 k range? our farm vehicles (utes and four wheelers) hardly ever do more that 80-100 k a day, and thats going between five different farmblocks and moving stock twice a day(currently doing that and grazing drycows). electric would suit us perfectly.as for towing power, electrics have unbeatable torque figures ,so towing is fine.

          • bwaghorn

            A gisborne coast farmer going to the sale in Napier would chew some ks in a day I expect. Pulling a 3 tonne trailer loaded up would take some grunt dontya think.

    • RedBaronCV 1.4

      Interesting point BW and I'm afraid I don't see farmers as the enemy. A lot of farming communities have been gutted by big biz buying up and forest planting or running industrial cow size cow farms.

      Yes there appear to be hybrid utes coming (but the toyota mentioned below may well not qualify because the other toyota hybrids are not actually plug in). Work vehicles are also tax deductible which lessens the impact – or purchasing off the second hand market.

      What do you think would be the best transitional policy until electric and hybrids are more readily available in that sector.

      • bwaghorn 1.4.1

        Just let them claim back the tax until such time there are atleast 2 or 3 models available that can do the job.

        Shit if I was in the position to I'd buy an electric tomorrow, I cant wait till our 4 wheelers are electric , one gets sick of the constant noise of the motor.

    • Gabby 1.5

      Don't worry, we all know there'll be an except-for-farmers clause.

  2. gsays 2

    Fantastic result overnight, our men's cricket team convincingly beating England to win a rare test series and return to the number one spot in rankings.

    6 first choice players were rested or injured and they still won in a canter. Great bowling, solid batting and disciplined feilding from our side was met with tardy fielding, sub-standard wicket keeping and poor batting.

    We take confidence and momentum into the Test Final vs India on Friday.

    Who misses out on selection will be interesting.


    • Jimmy 2.1

      Yes I reckon India may be more than a little wary of little old NZ.

      • Adrian 2.1.1

        They have been wary for a while,the BCCI pulled all the strings they could to get the final in Southampton, the home of world cricket ( yeah right ) and the most spin friendly pitch in England. Let’s put Ajax’s and Ish in the lineup and bowl the manipulators out of contention. Now that would be irony.

  3. Jimmy 3

    Well I guess this highlights the danger of both smoking and huffing.

    A possible NZ entry for the Darwin awards.


  4. Incognito 4

    A great article on the Minister of transport and the transformation that is happening right now.


    It's not just the announcement of the riding and walking bridge over the Waitemata Harbour, the directive to Waka Kotahi NZ Transport Agency to investigate opening a lane on the bridge for people on bikes, walking, scootering, or the various announcements that this Government will now not be sinking resources into specific road building projects that will bake in carbon emissions and poor health for the community for decades to come.

    Indeed, rather than looking at isolated local proposals, look at the overall picture that is emerging, which is pretty good from my PoV.

    I don't imagine that this is particularly easy for Wood. It has taken a long time for anyone in power to really get moving on this journey, which is a pretty good metric that challenging the status quo is hard when you want to collaborate and make it stick.

    It's not just about wanting it to happen, you need to keep your values front and centre, have the right amount of power at the right time, good relationships, as well as being confident in the evidence in the face of a very loud opposition to change.

    And on this issue it is only going to get louder as experts like Dr Kirsty Wild show us. I suspect it has been as much about convincing those who want to keep the status quo in his own party as anything – transport mode shift is not simply a party political issue, it's about values, identity and emotions.

    Well said. It really puzzles me that quite a few commenters here run the neo-liberal ruler over proposals like hardcore economists of the NZI and focus relentlessly on cold hard dollars, business plans, and ROIs. No values in sight but plenty of negative emotions on display.

    The linked article by Dr Kirsty Wild is very good too and the word “bikelash” is a perfect description of the anti-cycling bridge hysteria we have witnessed lately, here on TS and elsewhere.

    Two very good reads and highly recommended, as they filled a few gaps in my understanding, which is still vast and huge.

    • RedLogix 4.1

      Yes – this bikelash thing seems very peculiar. Here in Aus I can see and use plenty of cycling oriented infrastructure and I'm not seeing any particular reaction to it. Maybe there are some merits to being a pack of feral racist rednecks after all. /sarc

      • Incognito 4.1.1


      • Patricia Bremner 4.1.2

        Yes Redlogix, they (Aus) came at it from a health and fitness angle, and added exercise parks along the routes. Great example in Hervey Bay from the Urangan Pier to the Esplanade. Another advantage is five times our population to help bear costs.

        • greywarshark

          A good leverage to get government to act to help 'ghost' houses to be used, inhabited, managed competently and lawfully, and insured. There is one empty in Nelson where the children cannot agree on parents' estate terms and the house sits empty for years.


        • greywarshark

          Something went wrong when I put up this and then made change. I got my previous comment back. This is what was meant to go under yours Patricia.

          I read of a small town in Austria with nice scenery and needing some business. They established some lovely walks, in a loop which became popular and brought business. They had stops on the walk with seats at a view, and an attraction at each stop, also exercises to do – part of a health plan, where if you stayed two weeks say and did part of the walks, and ate to a special diet, you went away feeling rejuvenated and refreshed.

          That would be better than having madmen, women and children, throw themselves onto bikes and streak about the place, or ride side by side blocking access, or hare up hill and down dale in races or doing bike tricks. Inevitably there will be more accidents from being on two wheels than two legs.

          • Patricia Bremner

            Greywarshark, yes, now at 80 that I could do that. Lol Biking trails less my thing.

    • RedBaronCV 4.2

      Well a bikelash is hardly surprising. Don't get me wrong I am not interested in building more grand road projects (the Key holiday highway being a good example) . Putting more money into public transport yes.


      massive funding for a preferred leisure/health activity for a few people – not interested

      massive funding for a harbour crossing that benefits a very limited geographic area – not interested

      massive funding for a transport means used by very few people even if the current usage trebles- not interested.

      massive funding for projects that a good number of the community are physically unable to access – not interested

      This funding is being taken from a community that is constantly being told there is not money for hospitals, leaking schools, feeding kids, housing etc.It smacks far too much of entitlement by a very small group not a green solution for the many. Even down to the ‘why do we have to look at any cost benefits analysis” lines being run.

      • Ad 4.2.1

        On that criteria you provide, Auckland would have:

        • no train service
        • no ferry service, and
        • no bus service beyond Zone 3.


        All of those are used by few travellers, most physically unable to access them, all involve huge volumes of capital both private and public, all achieve minimal returns if measured by kind of trips taken on average, all are subsidised up to their eyeballs.

        When you scroll down to the Auckland modeshare maps by data meshblock, you can see that the areas with the most investment over the last two decades are the areas where public transport use is over 60%, and those areas are:

        • Takapuna-Devonport
        • Birkinhead-Glenfield
        • Epsom-MT Eden-Newmarket-CBD
        • New Lynn-Avondale-Pt Chevalier
        • Grey Lynn-Ponsonby


        And for that amount of subsidy per trip, and all of that capital, Auckland is barely holding steady against the car as a preferred means of getting to work. The 2018 Census Journey to Work stats show:

        • Private vehicle use in Auckland is slightly above that nationally but it has some down more, dropping from 72% to 70% in 2018.
        • Buses have increased share by 1.1% to 7.1%, trains have gone from 1.7% to 3%. That means a combined bus and train increase of 2.4%. Combined with ferries, PT is sitting at 10.7% share of journeys to work.
        • Working from home has also gone up but only by 0.9% so not as much as it has nationally.
        • Like Nationally, the overall share of walking and cycling has decreased but only just and it looks to be a reflection of other modes growing more strongly.

        If we are do defeat carbon saturation against the worst of our carbon debts, we are going to keep throwing $$billions of public subsidy against all kinds of non-car modes for decades. That will take all available modes, forming new networks, using lots of capital.

        The arguments you are using are the same ones I’ve heard used for decades, against any mode that competes against the car.

        • RedBaronCV

          If bikes are so great why did people ever shift to cars? And last time I looked most of NZ still lived outside Auckland – but hey we should be so grateful that we want to pay for the bridge that is used by a small group of people from a very confined geographic area. We’d be better off shifting businesses to smaller towns.
          Rather than this mode shifting just up the public transport and maybe have bus lanes only on some of the mojor routes. No cars and no expensive outlay for an unproven mode shift.

          • Ad

            Cars are certainly a superior form of transport to the truck, horse, train, bicycle, scooter, and to walking, if you live in a city in which:

            – Central government completely reversed investment in rail and trams, and towards motorways and cars, since 1949 when Labour were voted out, totalling hundreds and hundreds of billions of dollars

            – all the tramlines were been stripped out 60 years ago

            – all the planning over 70 years had huge industrial areas separated by tens of kilometers from residential areas

            – passenger rail was stripped down so bad that they were close to just scrapping it in the 1990s

            – bus transport was privatised and essentially left for dead since the late 1980s

            – RUC was unable to be used on rail for multiple decades

            – cities were spread out and high rises were discouraged until the 1970s

            – road design favoured the car for nearly a century

            – cities were dominated by National-aligned majorities and mayors

            – where National-led governments since 1949 (ie over 50% of Parliamentary dominance) actively undermined public transport .. until the second term of the Key government.

            And as a result we have the most car-dominated urban environment in the OECD, one of the most car-saturated, most carbon-polluting, and in public health we have the third most obese city in the world.

        • Patricia Bremner

          I've said before, the horse people resisted the car… forcing cars to have a person walking in front yelling "Car coming" so they would not scare the horses.

          Now we need bells on the bikes.. especially in shared spaces. Pedestrians will need to be aware how quiet EVs are, when sharing spaces.

      • Molly 4.2.2


    • Jimmy 4.3

      It worries me that Sydney has about 4x the Auckland population, has a better climate for riding more year round, and is a flat bridge, and yet the cycle traffic per day is around 2,000 people. It's hard to imagine even 1,000 people using this in Auckland especially on a day like today.

      • Muttonbird 4.3.1

        You mean to say Sydney Harbour Bridge actually has a bike lane, why didn't we think of that?

      • greywarshark 4.3.2

        By cutting down refining in NZ, and relying on that done in other countries and having to be shipped here, people may have to cycle if transport systems are curtailed by fuel problems. Business will be given some leniency presumably. But we are getting more dependent on imports to keep the country going.

        With imported refined fuel there can be possible consequences if it isn't good quality (there has been fuel here – diesel? -that had some substance polluting it.) We are importing mostly unrefined fuel now, but we control our refining systems.

        We should be continuing with the refinery to ensure an intelligent cross-over to other fuels, and encouraging diminishing individual trip numbers with public transport – could be small local tuk-tuks and encouraging taxi circles with neighbourhoods using group trips to bus hubs, or where there are few buses available.

        Transport companies could be encouraged to reform their business style to use rail where it provides good value for both entities. We have to plan for the South Island where high seas will threaten the present main line, and roads can be blocked by slips and ruined bridges. Co-ordination and forethought, not precipitate business action would be wise.

        Some Marsden Point facts:

        1. Marsden Point produces 70 per cent of New Zealand's refined oil needs, with the rest being imported from Singapore, Australia and South Korea. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marsden_Point_Oil_Refinery
        2. New Zealand's locally-produced oil is generally exported because of its high quality and therefore high value on the international market. Australia buys most of this oil. The Middle East tends to be our largest source of crude oil — over half generally comes from there. https://www.mbie.govt.nz/building-and-energy/energy-and-natural-resources/energy-statistics-and-modelling/energy-statistics/oil-statistics/
        3. New Zealand's only oil refining company is pressing ahead with plans to convert its Northland refinery into an import terminal after reaching agreements with Z Energy May.25/21 https://www.interest.co.nz/business/110551/new-zealands-only-oil-refining-company-pressing-ahead-plans-convert-its-northland
          …[Refining NZ] The company said its agreement with Z Energy is for an initial term of 10 years.

          "The agreement includes provision for third party access to unutilised capacity on its Refinery to Auckland Pipeline (RAP). Refining NZ remains focused on concluding negotiations with its only other current refinery customer Mobil," the company said..

        "Refining NZ processes a range of crude oils imported from offshore markets to produce premium and regular petrol, diesel, aviation and kerosene, and fuel oils for our oil company customers (BP, Mobil and Z Energy). The Marsden Point oil refinery supplies around 70% of New Zealand fuel demand, delivering fuel to Auckland through the Refinery to Auckland Pipeline (RAP), to Northland from the Marsden Point site and to other parts of New Zealand through coastal shipping vessels," the company says…

        Refining NZ is pushing ahead with plans to stop refining operations at New Zealand's only oil refinery at Marsden Point, Northland.

        Depending on various approvals the company is looking at switching to an import-only model by the middle of next year.

        "On current estimates, a final decision in Q3 2021 would enable a conversion to occur by mid-2022." …

        James said the company had been working hard on the detailed planning about "exactly how we might run an import terminal operation", and what other opportunities there might be for the site.

        "Marsden Point has huge potential being a large industrial consented site, with deep water port access, large electricity and gas connections and a highly skilled workforce. We want to explore what the best opportunities are for the site, for our region, and for New Zealand."

      • Koff 4.3.3

        Sydney is actually a really scary place to ride around off the few purpose built cycle paths.

  5. Drowsy M. Kram 5

    Attenborough calls on G7 leaders to show ‘global will’ to tackle climate change

    Leaders at the G7 summit in England have been told to demonstrate the “global will” to tackle climate change by David Attenborough.

    The television naturalist said the scientific response to the Covid-19 pandemic had demonstrated what was possible when there was a “clear and urgent” goal.

    But the fight against climate change was as much a “political and communications” challenge as a scientific one, he said in a video address.

    G7 summit: Sir David Attenborough presses leaders to show the 'global will' to tackle climate change

    And the G7 is also expected to commit to increasing their contributions to international climate finance, to help developing countries deal with the impact of climate change and to support sustainable growth.

    But environmentalists have warned that previous climate finance targets have already been missed, and that aspirations to conserve 30% of our land and sea lack any form of plan as to how the areas will actually be protected.

    Ahead of his address to world leaders, Sir David had said: "The natural world today is greatly diminished. That is undeniable."

    "Our climate is warming fast. That is beyond doubt. Our societies and nations are unequal and that is sadly is plain to see."

    On Saturday night, the leaders enjoyed a beach BBQ in Carbis Bay and witnessed a flypast by the Red Arrows.

    Critics questioned the display by nine aerobatic jet aircraft amid the summit’s focus on climate change.

    Maybe a 'spend & consume' strategy will limit global warming to 1.5˚C – time will tell.

    • bwaghorn 5.1

      I'm wandering around in short sleeves and the woolly hats sitting on the bike ( a stones throw from ruapehu), it's hard not to think 1.5° is already in the rearview mirror.

      • Drowsy M. Kram 5.1.1

        Apparently not; yet!

        World may hit 1.5 degrees temperature threshold in next five years, WMO warns [27 May 2021]
        There is a 40 per cent chance of the world temporarily hitting the 1.5 degrees Celsius global temperature rise threshold in one of the next five years, scientists have warned.

        Good for NZ winters; not so good for Aussie summers.


        • greywarshark

          Not so good for NZ winters. We benefit from the cold in all sorts of ways – keeping the bugs down for one. And some trees and plants need freezing as part of their growth cycle.

          • Drowsy M. Kram

            Thanks Grey – good in NZ winters for some cold-sensitive people who enjoy the outdoors, even the odd winter dip, and don't have much fruit'n'veg in their diets.

            And in Aussie the summer heatwaves could keep the bugs down – who knows.

            • greywarshark

              Wearing sensible clothes in winter here would help. Schoolkids don't like wearing raincoats, girls abandon long sleeves in favour of shoestring straps the minute some sun peeps through. Miniskirts come and go, hardly covering any leg, just leggings are worn instead of under trousers, jeans are worn though they are just cold cotton and wouldn't stop a snowman freezing. Getting away from computers or studying small oblongs, weird habit, would mean a short walk which is what I will have to do this winter.

              • McFlock

                Then there are the kids whose families can't afford good wet weather gear.

                • greywarshark

                  Have you worked in an op shop, and seen the stuff there that is passed over because 'not everyone is wearing it'?

                  Alternatively some op shops CHARGES are Too High. They need to find a way, about a month after every new season changeover, and people dash in to get the best stuff, to have families that are known to be needy come in on a closed morning say, and get all the family something warm and a few extras for just a few dollars; good to pay something then they don't feel like absolute beggars.

                  But people often don't buy useful stuff in reasonable condition. I think even amongst the hard-up there is a dress code that governs the choices.

            • greywarshark

              Yes that bug thing makes my skin crawl! Mainly at the thought of the combination of us and CC killing the world. And yet so many people go blithely on.

              …Uncertain and afraid
              As the clever hopes expire
              Of a low dishonest decade:
              Waves of anger and fear
              Circulate over the bright
              And darkened lands of the earth,…

              Faces along the bar
              Cling to their average day:
              The lights must never go out,
              The music must always play,…

              WHAuden Sept.1./1939

    • Gabby 6.1

      Is Pengy entitled to info about communications in a non office of the PM capacity?

  6. greywarshark 7

    This is an example of how womens lib didn't finish its task of improving conditions for women, gaining proper respect and understanding for their vital role in guiding their children and being in a mutual nurturing partnership with their partner, attaining reasonable and secure standard of living, and realising a full life in the community.

    Official figures show that in the March quarter, the number of women in casual, fixed-term or temporary roles was up 4.4 percent on a year earlier. There was a 2.2 percent drop in women in permanent roles.

    For men, there was a 4.4 percent drop in those in less secure jobs, and only a slight 0.2 percent decrease in those in permanent work….

    Contract work Pffftttt.

    But she'd like something more secure – a permanent part-time job.
    "I'd prefer that over doing the contracting work, purely because you just don't know how much money's coming in every week and when it's going to stop, because at any stage they can actually turn around and say we've got no more work for you."

    But permanent jobs that she can fit around her kids are hard to come by.
    "There's probably quite a few mums that feel the same way. We all want to work and we've got the skills to work. It just means that we have to find employers that are keen to actually take us on."

    And now we have this deprivation that affects everyone.

  7. Adrian Thornton 8

    Here is a very excellent interview with author Jenny Chan, talking about her book on contemporary industrial Chinese workers and the dire conditions in the mega factories they work in while making so much of what we all consume….strangely enough this issue is never really brought up any more, even throughout this current anti-China moment…very strange.

    Dying for an iPhone

    • gypsy 8.1

      Hi Adrian. I have visited factories in a number of locations in China, Vietnam, Bangladesh and into the Pacific (although obviously not since early 2020). I have visited factories in China that would do any country proud in terms of workers conditions, but I have also visited many that were stuck in a time warp of shocking conditions, both in the factories themselves and in worker hostels/accommodation. I have walked out of more than one in utter disgust.

      • greywarshark 8.1.1

        Interesting gypsy. We can look to you for some reliable information about some things we don't read much about.

  8. Andre 9


    What kind of administration gets its Justice Department to secretly investigate one of its own top lawyers while said top lawyer is still serving with zero hint of any kind of impropriety or disloyalty?

    Is it just me, or does it really look like the only criteria Repugs use for selecting their presidents is whether their choice can be bad enough to make previous Repugs look better in hindsight? I mean geez, trying to dig dirt on McGahn is waay lower than even anything Nixon tried.


    • gsays 9.1

      Sounds a little like Nicky Hagar's treatment here when he spoke truth to power.

      • Ad 9.1.1

        Unlike Nicky Hagar, I would be very surprised to see the US DoJ issue an apology and an undisclosed compensation.

        Would be great if I were proven wrong on this one.

  9. greywarshark 10


    Howsing – looking at what people are complaining about in Wellington.

  10. greywarshark 11

    A good leverage to get government to act to help 'ghost' houses to be used, inhabited, managed competently and lawfully, and insured. There is one empty in Nelson where the children cannot agree on parents' estate terms and the house sits empty for years.


  11. Gabby 12

    Geoff Williams of Rotorua's council is enviably adept at flannel with his outward looking internally appointed 7 outcome focused deputy ceos blahblahblah.

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