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Open mike 15/10/2019

Written By: - Date published: 7:00 am, October 15th, 2019 - 105 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

105 comments on “Open mike 15/10/2019”

    • Anne 1.1

      Stalkers come in different guises and cover both genders. They are not always motivated by romantic obsessions or broken relationships. My stalker from years back was a woman who was prone to obsessive jealousies of others she perceived to be more successful in life than herself.

      They usually have other types of personality disorders and can be extremely cunning at carrying out their covert activities. Hence most of them get clean away with it. The situation is not helped by a NZ Police Force who don't seem to have much knowledge or understanding of the nature of covert stalking.

      More often than not it is the stalked who end up getting the blame and not the stalker.

      From the link:

      Frustrated, stigmatised, blamed

      Compounding victims' misery was a lack of help stopping their stalkers' reign of terror. Most said their experiences with police were negative.

      One wrote that trying to report her stalker was a "total joke".

      Only a small majority (54 per cent) of those who took part in the survey reported the stalking to police at any stage.

    • Dukeofurl 1.2

      Yes . NZ does have a 'stalkers law'

      https://www.govt.nz/browse/law-crime-and-justice/abuse-harassment-domestic-violence/stalking-and-harassment/

      Harassment has a legal definition — on at least two separate occasions within a period of 12 months, the harasser needs to have committed "specific acts", like:

      • following you
      • entering your property without your permission
      • unwanted or threatening phone calls or letters
      • giving you offensive material
      • doing something that makes you fear for your safety.

      Saying things like NZ doesnt have a stalkers law, is misleading, as casual readers might think you are referring to something you know about

      Anybody can get a restraining order from the Court , doesnt require the police consent or even a judges order

      • Chris 1.2.1

        "Anybody can get a restraining order from the Court , doesnt require the police consent or even a judges order"

        Really? I thought an application for a restraining order required a determination by a DC judge.

  1. ianmac 2

    Bridges/National defied the Speaker's ruling on National's attack ads just before 2pm. Today Mallard is expected to announce decision on what next. Could be $1000 fine or imprisonment but that is unlikely. More likely is a consultation and a bringing forward a discussion on the rules.

    I think Bridges will carry on in the meantime as perhaps the recent poll might have been a cause/effect of those ads?

    • Peter 2.1

      Everyone agreed to the rules (or were bound by them) yet someone broke them.

      I wonder what the reaction will be if Irish rugby players against New Zealand this weekend smack people around the head unpunished and win the match.

      I'm sure in that event all the National supporters will say the rules are stupid and the assaults on the head were okay.

      Surely it was only after good intellectual consideration and probity discussions they agreed to the use of video rule. Intellectual and probity factors have changed dramatically. i.e. they aren't in Government.

      They are as deep as a glob of phlegm in the gutter.

  2. Chris 3

    Megans Woods lost for words on Ninetonoon. No surprises there. Without nationalising the electricity industry there's nothing she or her government can say.

    • Pat 3.1

      The Minister either didnt understand the questions or chose not too…..concerning

      • Chris 3.1.1

        If she's a disciple of Jim Anderton she probably knows her government's attempts to bring electricity prices down won't work. Anderton wanted to nationalise the industry so she's possibly in a tight spot having to sell what she knows is bullshit.

    • tc 3.2

      Shonky knew exactly what the impact of getting private equity into the SOE generators would have and he told no end of porkys to ensure it came to pass.

      The numbers would be intruiging, take out the 4 levels of profit/external audit/regulatory/internal audit/management/duplicated systems (mostly the stonkingly expensive SAP) across generator/grid/lines/retailer.

      You could probably freeze power prices for some years, payout the private equity then consolidate them back to the NZED model.

      Labour lacks the bollocks to go anywhere near this.

      • Pat 3.2.1

        "Labour lacks the bollocks to go anywhere near this."

        Agree…though addressing the distribution would be a major step in the right direction….and it was the distribution she really appeared unwilling/unable to address in that interview

    • Dukeofurl 3.3

      "Megans Woods lost for words on Ninetonoon"

      Thats a bold claim. Any sort of background to the questions or even the words 'she should have said'

      At the moment all we have is a claim of silence ……

      • Chris 3.3.1

        Apologies Dukeofurl. I should've said Woods' couldn't explain how the changes will bring prices down. And as far as what she should've said goes, well, she should've said the changes won't bring prices down because they won't.

    • The Chairman 3.4

      Megans Woods lost for words on Ninetonoon.

      For the 60% of consumers on low-fixed charges and whom pay their bills on time it doesn't seem (going off that interview) prices will go down for them.

      In fact, it sounds as if prices will increase for this grouping so as to offset a drop in price for a number of high use consumers.

      Considering only 40% of power consumers are on a high use tariff, it seems the Government are going to piss off the majority of low use consumers when faced with power price hikes as a result of the Government's reform.

      That's going to hurt the Government come election time. Talk about shooting oneself in the foot. And talk about giving National another club to bash them with.

      • In Vino 3.4.1

        Well, well, well. "this is going to hurt the Government" yet again…

        By the way, please stop using the word 'whom'. It is correct only in a few uses, and you tend to get it wrong. 'Who' is almost never wrong in modern English – much safer.

        • The Chairman 3.4.1.1

          The Government is already copping the blame for higher fuel costs, rising rents/housing costs (via the lack of state homes being built, increased rental standards along with the talk of a CGT and the dropping of it encouraging investors, not to mention the Kiwibuild failure/reset) and now it seems they want to add higher power costs to the list.

          If they can't see the potential voter backlash from this (higher power costs) they are clearly out of touch. And the list is growing, there is now talk of higher rubbish disposal charges. They can't afford a growing list of costs they are adding onto voters while they sit on a surplus, thus they need to get this one (power reform) right and lower costs for the majority if not all.

  3. aom 4

    Here we go again. According to the DomPost headline, 'Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern distances Labour from failed Wellington mayoral candidate Justin Lester'. This is in the same realm of reality as depicting her as an apologist for sexual abuse. Lester didn't need to be thrown under a bus, he walked in the way and went under by himself. In essence, he never was a Labour man. In office, he proved to be at the beck and call of the likes of the developers and the Chamber of Commerce and appeared to be subservient to his CEO. Obviously, the PM has a better nose for reality than those of the party who compromised the 'Labour' brand by supporting Lester, who proved to many, that his self-belief exceeded his abilities. If any more proof is required that he wasn't up to it, it is provided by the election of Labour branded Councillors, including two new ones who were relative 'unknowns'. One of these succeeded in a 'true blue' ward and neither replaced 'red' predecessors.

    • +100 !

      And now I think about it, nor was Lester that worried about standing up for the other elected representatives when they were calling out the administration’s inadequacies. (Case in point, Simon Woolf DARING to comment on street lighting problems. How very dare him to have pointed out the bleeding obvious!. And there are quite a few other examples)

    • Agora 4.2

      Forster's grinning pale blue image confronting Miramar travellers was an aesthetic crime and deserved a proportionate response.

      • Chris 4.2.1

        The perennial schoolboy. Just shows what can happen if you hang around long enough. Sights set high. Career councillor. Got there in the end. "Well, I started off mopping the floor…"

    • Paaparakauta 4.3

      If that was the case why did they need to replace him with Andy ?

      • Chris 4.3.1

        Andy's a Winston man, a conservative through and through.

      • aom 4.3.2

        There were no other viable options apart from Diane Calvert, whose votes ended up going to Foster under STV anyway – her votes swung it for him. Seemingly, the Wellington voters were pretty savvy. Andy Foster's agenda will have to get past a far more critical and muscular Council than the previous one. Predictably, more than a few of his proposals will struggle to survive.

  4. Agora 5

    The Ethics of Film.

    https://www.ethicsfilmfestival.com/

    [deleted links]

    [that many links is spam (which is why your comment got caught in the spam filter). Feel free to post again, but with some commentary of your own and less links – weka]

    • Agora 5.1

      Digital is rapidly becoming the norm, transforming our work and behaviour across all sectors. It is now embedded in business models, integrated with processes and practices as organisations move towards digital-as-usual businesses. While organisations employ technology to increase productivity and efficiency, the big elephant in the room is ‘’Ethics’’. Organisations must be mindful of the risks of unethical practices, whose adverse impact can be amplified by digital connectivity.

      At ACCA’s Ethics Film Festival 2019, we will explore the “ABCD” of Ethics in a digital environment: AI, Blockchain, Cybersecurity and Data Governance; as we explore and discuss good practices and guidelines in the responsible adoption of technology and what accountants, financial and IT professionals of the future need to know.

      • greywarshark 5.1.1

        That sounds interesting. ACCA is in Singapore. Perhaps some of the films can be accessed after the Festival and there are a bunch from previous years. Those trying to keep up with the thinking of the digital age may like to take this further – can they be seen here in NZ? On-line?

  5. Agora 6

    MPs at Westminster are more likely to have mental health issues than either the general public or other people in comparable professions/managerial posts, suggest the responses to a survey of parliamentarians, published in the online journal BMJ Open.

    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/07/190701184622.htm

  6. NZ Herald Article states Organised Crime Evolving Rapidly in NZ

    I am not sure what the answer is obviously our Intelligence Services are analyzing this threat. The drug problem is helping breakdown NZ Society with much of the damage unseen ?

    The gangsters we see on the street and in the newspapers are mere cogs in the wheel or the tip of the iceberg ?

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12276597

  7. Pat 8

    " Indeed, the real question that is left hanging in the air after half-an-hour listening to Stephen Mills is not why anyone wanting real change would vote for the parties of the Left, but why they would bother voting at all."

    OUCH!

    https://bowalleyroad.blogspot.com/2019/10/losing-labours-mills-tone.html

    • Sabine 8.1

      a few of us have been saying that, and literally we end up voting for 'kinder' and 'gentler' cause that is all they got. A bit of lube, a red ribbon, and see the screwing over of you does not hurt that much anymore, Right?

      there is absolutly no reason for anyone to vote for either of the assorted clown show that is NZ politics and its enablers.

      • Pat 8.1.1

        And the onus is on the current gov to provide one….sadly they seem incapable of such as the article notes (and recent polls indicate)

        • Sabine 8.1.1.1

          i don't really care about news and articles and polls.

          i do however see what is happening around me, and literally what is happening around me is nothing. And i guess i am not the only one to see that.

          There is very little difference between either party – and i include all parties. they are more worried about keeping their jobs then they are worried about actually delivering measurable changes.

          In saying that we can have ineffective J.A or bullshit S.B or worse Paula Benefits.

          Great choices we have here, right? kinder gentler do nothing, or rude and brutal do nothing. and online voting or purple thumbs is not gonna change the fact that we are run by selfserving morons.

          • Pat 8.1.1.1.1

            the news articles and polls can serve a purpose….I only see and interact with a tiny proportion of the country and therefore ask myself if what I observe is typical or not.

          • Jimmy 8.1.1.1.2

            Perhaps we should pay politicians less. I know they say if you pay peanuts you get monkeys, but look at the lot of overpaid monkeys we have (and I am talking all parties). Many of these people will never get a job in the real world paying any near as much as they currently earn. Too many are just there for themselves milking it for as long as possible as they no they will never get as high paying a job.

            • Sabine 8.1.1.1.2.1

              i have been saying that for a while.

              they should earn no more then minimum wage. That would go long ways towards weeding the likes of Paula Benefits and such out for ever. Only the truly dedicated would run, or the min wage would go to 75 $ per hour and ruin everyone who ever created a job.

              • McFlock

                flipside is that you'll get MPs who will be even more blatant about getting the payoffs on the back end.

                I don't mind paying MPs a couple of hundred thousand a year. I do mind it when they immediately get private sector jobs in the policy area they were negligent about, lobbying their former colleagues.

                • Sabine

                  i do mind paying wages to people who don't deliver.

                  but then i do pay wages to people, and i do know that i have to make a whole lot of money already to just pay someone min wage +8 % holiday + 3 kiwi saver, and it bothers me endlessly if i have to pay someone for not pulling their weight and literally just occupying seats.

                  as for pulling one in the back or the front or by the side, they already do that quite openly and happily irrespective of their chosen side.

                  • McFlock

                    they don't perform, they get voted out. Nobody will drop a mid-range career for a pay cut in a role that will probably only last three years, and then go back to what they were doing.

                    We have lots of low-level corruption in NZ, but we're beginning to get the US-style movement of politicians between elected representatives to profiting from special interests.

                    I'd keep the pay high, but think of something like registering lobbyists and banning former mps from such a role for at least three years.

          • sumsuch 8.1.1.1.3

            I note Simon Bridges's rival in his party, Judith Collins, seems to go to the left of him despite her reputation. At least the foulie rightos over the ditch haven't yet got a foothold here.

            • McFlock 8.1.1.1.3.1

              If she went right, she'd be in on ACT's territory. By going 2008-ish labour-lite, she boosts her preferred PM ratings.

  8. Sabine 10

    people might enjoy reading this article.

    https://www.truthdig.com/articles/the-age-of-radical-evil/

    Immanuel Kant coined the term “radical evil.” It was the privileging of one’s own interest over that of others, effectively reducing those around you to objects to be manipulated and used for your own ends. But Hannah Arendt, who also used the term “radical evil,” saw that it was worse than merely treating others as objects. Radical evil, she wrote, rendered vast numbers of people superfluous. They possessed no value at all. They were, once they could not be utilized by the powerful, discarded as human refuse.

    We live in an age of radical evil.

    and i think really that once we see the current happenings world wide, we can see that clearly our overlords – elected, selected, instated, and tolerated – do see at best a profit centre – child care, education, health care, at worst a cost centre, aged care, unemployment / other benefits, pensions and such. And once us the public realises that we can start looking at these goons in parliaments and see them for what they are. Goons, that would let us die if only they could, so as long as they get re-selected/instated, so as long as they can cash in, in the hopes that when they turn in to cost centres they have amassed enough wealth and connections to go by. But it should be remembered that our 'human rights' that we like to claim are nothing more then artificial construct that we give each other, either to all of us, or them giving it to some of us.

    this one came out before the selection of the shitshow in the US

    might be a good reminder that nothing is new under the sun.



  9. Old birds slower to think around problems, whereas juvenile birds much better.

    And what she found was that young kaka are innovative and persistent problem solvers – whereas older birds are so set in their ways that they failed to solve several of the experiments. It turns out you can’t teach an old parrot new tricks, after all.

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/ourchangingworld/audio/201802744/smart-kaka-can-you-teach-old-parrots-new-tricks

  10. joe90 12

    Surely they would've known about this shit when the engaged him.

  11. Why can't we take academics seriously all the time? When they play at semantics that's when.

    author interview Why do we do terrible things? Listen duration 19′ :19″

    From Afternoons with Jesse Mulligan, 3:10 pm on 14 October 2019 https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/afternoons/audio/2018717648/why-do-we-do-terrible-things

    There is no such thing as evil. There are bad choices, very bad choices, that individuals can and do make. Dr Julia Shaw from University College London says heinous crimes are generally circus shows, not evil.

    Julia uses research to explain why we do terrible things in her book, Evil: The Science Behind Humanity's Dark Side.

    Haha – caught her out – she used the word 'evil' to describe evil. If we choose to describe 'terrible things' as 'evil' which involves the feeling of OTT viciousness of which we disapprove, that word is a valid choice from all other words to convey our opinion about something.

    Women with long hair with curls in it cannot, because they have been to university and call themselves (probably) an academic, state that a word does not apply to something to which it obviously refers and describes.

    There are more ways of looking at anything rather than one. Someone else will consider my pointing out that Dr Julia Shaw has long curly hair is inappropriate, and actually sexist. I wouldn't deign to say that there is no such word as sexist, and that instead I am just a silly, muddled, confused person.

    • In Vino 13.1

      Heard part of the interview, and your last sentence sums up what I casually wondered about Dr Julia Shaw.

  12. marty mars 14

    yep – they all bend the knee to money – sad bastards

    A day later, the ramifications of the momentous week that preceded the Kurds allowing the Assad regime to retake the province is still sinking in, across Syria and far beyond in Riyadh, Baghdad, Cairo and the Gulf.

    Something far bigger was at play here; the end of US influence in Syria and the plunge in its status elsewhere. The public handover on show was that between the Assad regime and the Kurds, but the real power shift was between Washington – whose fighting troops have all but left the region, 16 years after invading Iraq – and Moscow, whose reach and influence across the Middle East has now been cemented.

    As if to celebrate the moment, Vladimir Putin arrived in Riyadh for a state visit on Monday, his first in 12 years, hosted by Saudi Arabia’s Crown Prince, Mohammed bin Salman, who three weeks earlier had similarly felt the humiliation of abandonment by US allies.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/oct/14/russian-shadow-falls-over-syria-as-kurds-open-door-for-assad

    • mauī 14.1

      How can it be that the brutal "regime" is the Kurds only saviour? What happened to those "opposition rebels" fighting for freedom alongside IS, surely they would help…

      • marty mars 14.1.1

        dunno maybe they are all crisis actors eh spongehead bobpants

      • joe90 14.1.2

        In Vlad's wildest dreams the U.S. would stand aside and green light Turkey's invasion, the Kurds would turn to Assad/Russia for support, the US would sanction Turkey, driving a wedge into NATO, strengthening a Russia/Iran/Turkey alliance.

        And lo!, his boy delivered.

        • mauī 14.1.2.1

          Syria and Russia are basically the only ones who can fix this mess, pushing the Turks out of Syria and returning the region to pre-coup stability.

          The Kurds made their own bed, supporting the US in destabilizing Syria, taking their oil and reneging on agreements. In response the regime is being very unregime like for not severely punishing them for that.

          • joe90 14.1.2.1.1

            Syrian Kurds are an historically suppressed ethnic minority and you're on the same side as their oppressors.

            You really are a POS, aren't you.

            • mauī 14.1.2.1.1.1

              Well, well, well… if it isn't Joe… How did the debate go today Joe? Avoid the questions on Ukraine did you?

              You know the Kurds were involved in the Armenian genocide and Saladins conquest…eh Joe? Probably not as oppressed as you think….

              • joe90

                Under the thuggish Assad dynasty Kurds have been discriminated against because of their ethnicity, denied Syrian citizenship, had their language and culture suppressed and their land and property seized and resettled by Arabs.

                But then, you're a POS with a boner for authoritarian thugs so it's no surprise you think these people deserve to be the victims of the horrors of the Assad's inter-generational punishment.

                [Please control your language and please no more personal insults thanks – Incognito]

      • Brigid 14.1.3

        And where have those White Helmets got to.

        Surely there's a dead baby mannequin around they could be filming at least.

  13. joe90 15

    Fifty. Nuclear. Weapons.

    And over the weekend, State and Energy Department officials were quietly reviewing plans for evacuating roughly 50 tactical nuclear weapons that the United States had long stored, under American control, at Incirlik Air Base in Turkey, about 250 miles from the Syrian border, according to two American officials.

    http://archive.li/cciES

  14. marty mars 16

    Nice post on fbook by Auckland Peace Action

    Today marks the 12 year anniversary since the police raids in Tuhoe. On that day some 300 police descended on the community of Ruatoki. The police then terrorised the community locking up women and children, arresting community leaders and leaving the whole country in shock. As the sham history celebration of #Tuia250 rolls around the country sailing the death ship Endeavour, let us not forget the struggle against colonisation has never ended, either here or overseas. #Resist250 #EndWhiteSupremacy

  15. ianmac 17

    The question of the attack ads by the National party has been referred to the Committee for revision soon.

    However Bridges will be restricted to just 5 supplementary questions each day this week in punishment for challenging the Speaker given that the Speaker is responsible for following the rules set by Parliament. No response yet from Opposition.

    PS: So the Deputy Leader of National was able to just ask the supplementary questions which would have been otherwise asked by Bridges. Just a blip then.

  16. Peter 18

    Five supplementary questions? A number reaching the IQ score of those who think can't see the vacuity, gormlessness and hypocrisy of the position of Bridges and his motley crew regarding the use of Parliamentary video.

  17. AB 19

    Naomi Klein from 35:30 onwards on her new book ‘On Fire’

    Saying that the response to CC will open new frontiers for profiteering. Which means that without a Green New Deal, CC doesn’t just involve the world becoming hotter, but also that it becomes meaner and more unequal – a place where resource scarcity is forced first onto the underserving (the poor, people of colour or the ‘wrong’ religion) in a new configuration of austerity. The coming “climate barbarism." She also links this to the “eco-fascism” of the Christchurch shooter as part of a larger movement to eliminate those who don’t deserve to survive in the new world of scarcity.

    (Before that there’s also the brilliant Elif Sarican on Rojava)

    • Oh. That's the sort of thing I have been thinking. How mean we have got in NZ and for instance, thinking how willing we are to put up with the oppressive WINZ moralistic actually neoliberal puritan-like approach that is invasive of women's freedom and right to be a person. All that work for feminism and it only seems to have continued in the ability of some women who fit into the system getting to the upper echelons and getting big salaries.

    • Andre 19.2

      Unfortunately, that kind of position just gives ammo to the deniers and the let's-be-fast-followers claiming climate activists are just using climate change as a stalking horse for social engineering.

      • greywarshark 19.2.1

        Ignoring, in their denying-thought inept way, that we are being socially engineered all the time, including by them.

      • AB 19.2.2

        I think Klein's point is that we inevitably face a choice between two different forms of social engineering. That there isn't
        going to be a 'no social engineering' option.

        • Andre 19.2.2.1

          Maybe if you take Klein's position at the moment in isolation. But anyone that takes even a cursory look at Klein's history will soon become aware she's long been about social engineering. In contrast, she's a relative latecomer to climate activism, and her transition was clearly about using climate change to leverage her social views.

          • greywarshark 19.2.2.1.1

            I consider that any reasoned person would consider that considering climate change and society culture are interlocked as the vital areas of focus in thinking about the path to whatever future we will have, and may help to get us closer to the one we hope for.

            • Andre 19.2.2.1.1.1

              That's great if you're just looking for a rousing "right on" from already committed activists. But if you're interested in persuading undecideds that action is necessary, it's not helpful to link two unrelated issues. The negatives an undecided may feel about one of the issues transfers too easily into rejection of arguments about the other.

              When each of the two separate issues has standalone arguments about their merits, far better to argue each issue separately.

              In the case of climate change, there really are conservative-oriented arguments for taking action against climate change change that don't require wholesale rejection of the existing economic framework. Just like there are very good arguments for seriously modifying the current socio-economic framework that is currently so heavily tilted in favour of the already wealthy and powerful that don’t require reference to climate change. The likes of Klein and Sanders have been making those arguments for decades before climate change became a popular issue.

              That climate change as a factual problem has been turned into a political identity issue is as much the fault of activists like Klein falsely conflating them as it is the fault of big corporate underhanded manipulation.

              • Yes, wise folks will look at every avenue for pushing change that is good for us including the planet, And to be aware that many people can't see it holistically is a necessary to getting effective action quickly. I agree that tackling the problem at whatever level people are on is more essential than harping on about the connectedness of all. No time for campfies and singing kumbaya, jut choose your group, and add your tuppence worth of sense to ensure that a workable plan with a defined goal and a practice and method of courteious delivery, that is spelled out with regular checks for design flaws is adopted.

  18. Kevin 20

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/116574054/defence-minister-trumps-environment-court-decision-on-whenuapai-airbase-engine-noise

    Defence Minister Ron Mark has over written an Environment Court decision on noise restrictions for aircraft engine testing at Whenuapai Airbase, and advised anyone moving into the area to accept military aircraft noise.

    • lprent 20.1

      pre-existing land usage.

      I’d get as far if I started to try to be that kind of a NIMBY about the eagle helicopter that hangs around the motorway junctions a lot.

      Or since I’m in a mixed use area, if I started to complain about the bin pickups at 0400 at the businesses in our area.

      • greywarshark 20.1.1

        Pre-existing land usage should be spelled out to possible purchasers, and made very clear to house speculators. Live near the rural area, know that in winter they will have helicopters or giant fans stirring the air to keep the frost from killing the crop. Orchards do a lot of spraying etc.

        • Ad 20.1.1.1

          OMG Whenuapai purchasers could have it explained by looking out the fucking window.

          And have done so since 1937.

          • greywarshark 20.1.1.1.1

            But they don't look out the window till they have purchased or built and then can act on unreasonable laws that allow them to complain and try to alter pre-existing conditions that are the resuslt of whatever business or enterprise is established there or should be able under intelligent town planning to be in a suitable business zone there.

            • lprent 20.1.1.1.1.1

              It is really hard, if not realistically impossible, to alter pre-existing conditions where these were well known and part of the existing legal rights before a new purchaser started to occupy their property. Which is the case here.

              The reason for this is obvious. The litigants trying to gain a property right at the expense of another without permission or recompense. Now the environment court can look at it without looking at property rights, but the courts it would have been immediately appealed to have would not.

              It is possible where the original occupiers are doing something outside their rights, or doing something illegal, or doing something that is dangerous.

              If a council wants to change the conditions of someone's property rights, then they will ultimately have to recompense for taking those rights unless they can show immediate danger.

              Which is why councils try not to do it because the compensation is usually pretty extreme. What usually happens instead is that the rates rise with the value of the property as it gets built up, eventually the cost plus the value of the property rises to the point where someone sells up.

              In this case Ron Mark will have simply short-circuited it. Had the environmental courts decision been taken to appeal (and it would have been), it would have been overturned on property rights and prior usage alone. The environmental court decision and the factors behind it probably wouldn’t have even really entered into the legal argument.

              In the event that the appeal court decided that there was a public health or safety issue, then the blame should have fallen squarely on the council for letting those housing buildings to be built. Personally as a Auckland city ratepayer, I wouldn’t have wanted to pay for the NIMBYs on the North Shore. I’d have been wanting that the whole cost of compensation to the defense department be levied directly in the suburbs concerned.

  19. The Chairman 21

    News headlines are used to grab your attention.

    They help set/frame a narrative. And tend to stick in people's minds.

    When taken together, the two misleading headlines used for the two recent polls paint a picture that Labour have taken a huge drop in the polls with National increasing and as a result, National (along with ACT) are currently in a position to win.

    Unfortunately, for a good number of those that don't follow politics too heavily, this is the picture that will now stick in their minds and may influence their support going forward.

    As swordfish highlighted the other day, Newshub's headline for their Jan 2018 Poll (which recorded near-identical results to their most recent poll) was dramatically different.

  20. Eco maori 22

    Kia Ora Breakfast.

    Its great that pressure is getting put on the companys that makes our clothes too provide a living wage and a humane work environment.

    That is a great idea getting Wahine in the trades carpenter plummer electricion. These days with the Lithuaniam battery powered tools the jobs are no were as labour intensive as they used to be actually I say that the jobs are quite easy now days . We just need to teach the Tane to respect Wahine on the job site actually teach Tane to respect Wahine fullstop.

    Tiny houses is the way of the future lowering the cost to get into a Whare and drastically lowering our carbon footprint.

    All consumer products need to be made in a sustainable way. I agree closed loop system for consumer goods. We have to learn to stop making a MESS of our own back YARD.

    Papatuanuku food day there is no reason for tangata to be starving on the Papatuanuku in the year 2019. There is enough food growing on Papatuanuku to feed everything.

    Ka kite Ano

  21. Eco maori 23

    We came from our natural environment we depend on the other creatures of our environment for food there are many factors of our Papatuanuku that needs all the diverse creatures to function effectively. It baffles me why a lot of people don't get those facts that people need other creatures to survive.

    The age of extinction

    Biodiversity touches every aspect of our lives – so why has its loss been ignored?

    The evidence is unequivocal: biodiversity, important in its own right and essential for current and future generations, is being destroyed by human activities at a rate unprecedented in human history.

    Governments around the world recognised this at the Earth summit in Brazil in 1992 and established the Convention on Biological Diversity to protect and conserve biodiversity. But the situation has become more and more dire. I have chaired or co-chaired three international assessments on the state of knowledge of biodiversity, and all have repeated the same message – we are destroying it at an alarming rate. Each time we have called for action, only to be largely ignored

    The continued loss of biodiversity is not only an environmental issue. It risks undermining the achievement of most of the UN sustainable development goals. It is central to development, through food, water and energy security. It has significant economic value, which should be recognised in national accounting systems. It is a security issue in so far as loss of natural resources, especially in developing countries, can lead to conflict. It is an ethical issue because loss of biodiversity hurts the poorest people, further exacerbating an already inequitable world. And it is also a moral issue, because we should not destroy the living planet.

    In addition to playing a critical role in providing food, fibre, water, energy, medicines and other genetic materials, biodiversity is equally important in regulating climate, water quality, pollution, pollination, flooding and storm surges. It has vital social value, providing wellbeing when walking through forests or by rivers, or green spaces in cities.

    The youth of today are standing up and demanding action. School strikes and marches are sending a loud and clear message: “You are destroying our future, we demand action now”. Every one of us who lives in a democratic society must vote for politicians who care about these issues.

    Robert Watson is the former chair of the Intergovernmental Science-Policy Platform for Biodiversity and Ecosystem Services

    Ka kite Ano link below.

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/sep/19/biodiversity-touches-every-aspect-of-our-lives-so-why-has-its-loss-been-ignored

  22. Eco maori 24

    I think this is a great idea for energy companies to have Open source software to help speed up the process in changing to a low /no carbon environment

    To Go Green, the Energy Industry Goes Open Source

    Challenges around renewables are prompting players in the “traditional” sector to collaborate on software they can modify to address their changing needs

    The European Union aims to reduce carbon emissions by at least 80 percent by 2050. Former California Governor Jerry Brown signed an executive order last year calling for the state, the fifth-largest economy in the world, to go carbon neutral by 2045. Meeting these goals, or even the less ambitious goals set by other governments, will require utilities to buy more energy from sustainable sources like wind and solar power. That shift is already creating logistical challenges for utilities. Unlike more predictable sources of energy, the energy produced by a wind farm can vary from day to day, forcing utilities to offload excess supplies and make up for shortages. The solar panels on residential rooftops that feed into the grid pose their own challenges because the grid wasn't designed to facilitate a two-way flow of energy

    To meet those technological challenges, the energy sector is turning to open source software. Open source, which anyone can modify or share, helped power the rise of internet giants like Google, Facebook, and Amazon. Ostensible competitors worked together to develop software like the data-crunching platform Hadoop because it enabled them to solve difficult computing problems. Now all sorts of companies, ranging from Microsoft to Walmart to JP Morgan Chase use and make open source software.

    Ka kite Ano link below.

    https://www.wired.com/story/go-green-energy-industry-open-source/

  23. Eco maori 25

    Kia Ora 1 News

    Its great that Japans passion for Wahine and Tane Rugby is rising.

    Condolences to Blairs Vining Whanau.

    Its great that a New Space radar is being built in Aotearoa to track space debris.

    Ka kite Ano.

  24. Eco maori 26

    Kia Ora Te Ao Maori News.

    I agree that that Oranga tamariki should work with the local Iwi.

    It would be good to see more Maori donating there organs when they pass.

    Yes that is a high number of tangata whenua tamariki passing by there own hands and still some organisations keep putting the bads things about Maori to the front.????.

    The Mit teaching Rangatahi there cultures is awesome one must know there culture and whakapapa.

    Maori and Pacific are over represented in the tangata needing to get food donations .

    Te Arawa buying Makatu pies is great.

    Ka kite Ano

  25. Eco maori 27

    Kia Ora The Breakfast Show.

    Wai is A taonga of life if we taonga our NATURAL environment Te Papatuanuku will pay a premium to enjoy our Taonga everything will be excellent so long as Te rewards are shared with Tangata Whenua O Aotearoa.

    There you go Hone.

    I new were that was coming from Mr Poneke Te Carbon

    Tiny Whare is the way to go low cost low carbon.

    Archeologyst find 20 Sarcophagus that's cool they are a very ancient culture.

    Sharlet is qute looks like a wild one

    Assumption.

    Ka kite Ano

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