Open Mike 23/02/2016

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, February 23rd, 2016 - 119 comments
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119 comments on “Open Mike 23/02/2016 ”

  1. vto 1

    Not only do we in the south island have to put up with extreme dangerous life-threatening driving by tourists…

    … we also have to put up with freeloader camping all over the place.

    What a complete waste of space these bludgers are. They ruin our local parks and reserves. Stinky euro trash.

    • Macro 1.1

      You think you have it bad!
      The permanent population of of the Coromandel is around 30,000. Over summer that swells to 130,000.

    • weston 1.2

      ive always found it supprizing that campervans dont seem to be equiped with something as basic as a spade , perhaps there might need to be instructions on how to use one also ?

      • vto 1.2.1

        No, freeloader camping needs to be banned fullstop. The parks and reserves end up like a dirty person’s backyard.

        Freeloader camping is not the freedom camping New Zealanders have enjoyed in the past – nothing like it. Freeloader camping is living (not camping) in public parks, which is against the law. Also makes the public parks unuseable.

        It is all going to end in tears

        • marty mars 1.2.1.1

          where I live the pop increases at least 10 fold for summer – lots for fcampers, lots of cityfolk, and the locals make the tourism $ so they can relax over winter a bit.

          and I also think this fcampng is out of control – I really struggle to see any benefits tbh

          • vto 1.2.1.1.1

            Maybe our Minister of Tourism could do something about it ……..

            yeah right

            • Pasupial 1.2.1.1.1.1

              If you’re talking about people squatting in national parks, rather than shitting at the side of the road, that’d be more DOC than Tourism, wouldn’t it? Of course, they’re likely to have the same do-nothing response. But then again, there are quite a few homeless New Zealanders who live much of the year in parks too (and increasing numbers sleeping in cars and under bridges).

        • Puckish Rogue 1.2.1.2

          I agree

        • Kevin 1.2.1.3

          Have seen the same thing in Europe at the TdF a couple of years ago. Pop up tents on the road shoulder and shitting on the side of the road only 50m away. Should be banned. End of story. They are just doing what they do back home. They contribute next to nothing to the local economy other than the 2 minute noodle and alcohol department of the local supermarket.

        • Rosie 1.2.1.4

          Would love to see some controls around “freeloader” camping (I like that).

          Here in Wellington they like to camp over night by the beaches or in parks. There was an article in the local paper about residents complaining about the mess the campers leave behind at Owhiro Bay. Some campers were interviewed and actually complained about the lack of free facilities for them to use. The audacity! The sense of entitlement!

          I don’t really want to pay for other peoples holiday facilities through my rates when I haven’t been able to afford to go on a holiday myself since 2007. And not when our council are too mean to build public loo’s that local residents request for their beaches. We have a real public loo shortage as it is so summer is a bad time to get caught short as you’ll find the loo’s in an appalling state, blocked up and unable to be flushed.

          WCC won’t pay for public toilets, but won’t ban freedom campers, won’t pay for bus shelters http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/news/76977054/wellington-short-of-162-covered-bus-stops-report-finds but will find the money to build a convention centre nobody wants.

          • McFlock 1.2.1.4.1

            I live close to a local tourist attraction, and even tour bus passengers have been known to take a dump in people’s gardens due to the lack of public toilets.

            When I get onto the occasional rant about tourists, the response is sometimes “tourists bring $800million into the local economy annually”. So fair enough, put some bloody bogs in then.

            Freedom camping is the same: they do local attractions, buy food from local shops. Toilets at the popular spots are hardly too much to ask.

            • Rosie 1.2.1.4.1.1

              I thought those tour buses had loo’s on board?

              Maybe instead of landing the responsibility for providing public loo’s on to local councils we should have Ministry of Tourism funded loo’s built the vicinity of tourist attractions – like the one near you. You don’t want your front yard to be next………..

              We really do have Freudian level councils around the country, expecting us to keep it in, (I know this from my former life as a sales rep) so help from central government would be really useful.

            • Draco T Bastard 1.2.1.4.1.2

              When I get onto the occasional rant about tourists, the response is sometimes “tourists bring $800million into the local economy annually”. So fair enough, put some bloody bogs in then.

              Yep. A few thousand to install and maintain decent facilities would be worth it then.

            • weka 1.2.1.4.1.3

              “Toilets at the popular spots are hardly too much to ask.”

              In a city or town, sure. But not in the wilderness/undevelopped country. The problem isn’t people needing to poo, it’s the numbers. Build it and they will come. NZ has yet to have a decent conversation about how many tourists it can sustain without fucking everything up. Myself, I think we are past that point. If we want to make money from tourists we should be focussing on low number high return tourism, not selling our soul for the cheapest buck tourism we have now.

              • McFlock

                I avoid the wilderness, so can’t comment on that.

              • Bill

                Wee spade. Dig hole. Bury shit. I know it’s not a perfect solution, but at least it’s not shit and bog-paper lying around. I’d venture that it’s a better option than the chemical laden ‘toilets’ in self contained vehicles.

                • Colonial Viper

                  Seems like NZ has chosen its biggest industries based on shitting all over our environment.

                • Draco T Bastard

                  I’d venture that it’s a better option than the chemical laden ‘toilets’ in self contained vehicles.

                  It’s not. There’s a very good reason why we changed to full treatment of human waste over the centuries.

                  • weka

                    Yeah, because citified Europeans used to throw their shit in the street and create epidemics.

                    • Draco T Bastard

                      And that is what Bill was saying was better than chemical toilets.

                    • weka

                      No, he was saying that burying human waste was reasonable. Which it is if you don’t have too many people. That’s completely different than throwing raw sewerage in the street.

                  • Bill

                    Full treatment or sending down long pipes to be ‘out of sight and out of mind’?

                    Plenty of places where ‘we’ still just pump raw sewerage a half mile or so off-shore. Plenty other places where more obvious solids are removed first. Some places where a bit of ulta-violet is used.

                    Not so common to use it as fertilser … a forestry option was explored in Dunedin – vetoed.

                    • Draco T Bastard

                      Plenty of places where ‘we’ still just pump raw sewerage a half mile or so off-shore. Plenty other places where more obvious solids are removed first. Some places where a bit of ulta-violet is used.

                      [citation needed]

                      Not so common to use it as fertilser … a forestry option was explored in Dunedin – vetoed.

                      Would still need to be treated first and we would also need enough forest to complete the transformation from simple shit to fertiliser.

                      I’m in favour of the idea but it needs to be done properly.

                • weka

                  “Wee spade. Dig hole. Bury shit. I know it’s not a perfect solution, but at least it’s not shit and bog-paper lying around”

                  10 people a night, 150 nights a year, in an area the size of a small supermarket car park.

                  • Bill

                    I dunno how long shit takes to decompose in given varieties of environment, therefore can’t really say anything about any ‘carrying capacity’ of a given area.

                    I do know that long-drops are no answer.

                    And I know that removing solids and pumping out to sea is no answer.

                    I admit to just being downright suspicious of those chemical fucking loos.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      “Chemical Fucking Loo”

                      hmmm not much of a nickname that :mrgreen:

                    • weka

                      lol @ CV.

                      Bill, you don’t have to know much about decomposition rates, so much as imagining an area of land and how many holes you could dig in it. If you fill the whole area with holes and then have to start again you are now digging up someone else’s shit. Humanure, a system that composts excrement above ground, is left to sit for 12 months after the final addition. That’s a system that uses heat to kill pathogens, which you don’t have in a hole in the ground.

                      I agree that digging a hole is a good way to dispose of poo providing one isn’t near water, or somewhere that floods, and if there aren’t too many people using the same site. But there are too many tourists, no doubt about that any more.

          • Sabine 1.2.1.4.2

            i live in town, next to a cycleway and park, no public facilities. And as I don’t have a separate toilet in my business I can’t allow people to use my restroom.

            So where do people go, especially those with kids? In the bushes. Yes thats where they go.

            And yes there should be more public facilities, but I guess we don’t have money for that.

            Maybe we should hand over adult depends to tourists arriving in our lovely green clean country? Or tell them to poops in the waterways like our cows do.

          • weka 1.2.1.4.3

            “but will find the money to build a convention centre nobody wants.”

            How are you going to have conferences to talk about all the big problems if you don’t have a new convention centre?

    • Pasupial 1.3

      vto
      I take it you mean this story?

      http://www.odt.co.nz/news/national/374063/tourists-defecating-tekapo-church

      I’ve always seen this as much an infrastructure problem as a tourist one. There needs to be a lot more public toilets and waste disposal sites, especially at rest stops. Before we start going on about; “Stinky euro trash”, it might be wise to consider the behaviour of kiwi travelers overseas (and within the country for that matter).

      • aidan 1.3.1

        yup totally agree, this is something the minister of tourism needs to address, don’t hold your breath though

      • vto 1.3.2

        Pasupial, no I wasn’t referring to that one.

        Provision of toilets is basic and there should be enough toilets – sheesh, I thought we were a first world banana country…..

        I was actually referring not to a lack of infrastructure to allow the inhabitants of these lands to go to the toilet, but to an excess of freeloader camping which is a different issue, though same smells.

        Freeloader camping is a complete bludge and shitmess. It has to stop. Simple.

    • Smilin 1.4

      The great tourism industry 20 billion a year and nobody talks about the real cost to the country of ecological devastation from all these never before seen environmental diseases
      Scaling back of the EPA
      If you’re rich you can dump your shit anywhere in NZ
      John ConKEYstadore our PM

    • Ad 1.5

      Still less crap than cows.

      Tourism is predicted to overtake dairy as export number 1.

      Easier to get upside value-add in tourism than dairy, with the Fonterra dominance.

  2. Penny Bright 2

    Hillary Clinton is not my ‘sister’.

    http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/bernie-sanders-will-becom_b_9289066.html

    We now have a chance to elect someone capable of fixing structural issues pertaining to Wall Street, foreign policy, and American politics.

    There’s a reason Bernie Sanders voted against the Iraq War and “blasted” Alan Greenspan in 2003, five years before the Wall Street collapse.

    There’s also a reason Hillary Clinton voted for the Iraq War and won’t disclose transcripts that earned her and her husband $153 million from Wall Street.

    Finally, Clinton’s issues with transparency are highlighted by Carl Bernstein in this CNN interview. As for why 67% of voters distrust Clinton, nothing exemplifies this dilemma better than a Washington Post article titled Hillary Clinton’s terrible, horrible, no good, very bad answer on whether she’s ever lied:

    PELLEY: You talk about leveling with the American people. Have you always told the truth?

    CLINTON: I’ve always tried to. Always. Always.

    PELLEY: Some people are gonna call that wiggle room that you just gave yourself.

    CLINTON: Well, no, I’ve always tried —

    PELLEY: I mean, Jimmy Carter said, “I will never lie to you.”

    CLINTON: Well, but, you know, you’re asking me to say, “Have I ever?” I don’t believe I ever have. I don’t believe I ever have. I don’t believe I ever will. I’m gonna do the best I can to level with the American people.
    ……..
    _____________________________________

    Penny Bright
    2016 Auckland Mayoral candidate.

    • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 2.1

      For those of us who are not US citizens, how do you suggest we use this chance to elect someone capable of fixing structural issues pertaining to Wall Street, foreign policy, and American politics?

      • vto 2.1.1

        Having a good rant on here helps

      • Grindlebottom 2.1.2

        We could start up an “adopt an American family” campaign and send them links to news items they might not have read, and helpful emails & facebook messages telling them who they should vote for because they may be too busy taking selfies and tweeting and stuff to actually know what the real issues are.

        Americans like being told what’s good for them by other countries. They pay a lot of attention to world opinion from the UK PM.

    • Smilin 2.2

      Just like here a different colour of the same thing witha few tweaks but who can be bothered the blueprint the same for everyone now
      Multinational corporate thuggery runs the world
      Capitalism doesnt like democracy its awkward to get around with all those people voting and standing against our right to rule as we use to back at the turn of the last century
      Really we only want to be left to run the world our way and keep the poor powerless and our dynasties intact ,you know we are all related us 1% of the richest somewhere and we want to keep it that way
      Lets hope the genetic bomb explodes before theres nothing left of the planet

    • Ad 2.3

      Hilary Clinton is my sister.

      Who’s yours?

  3. weston 3

    equipping campervans with spades and instructions on how to use one might help maybe

  4. Puckish Rogue 4

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/77147819/arrest-after-brown-substance-poured-on-gerry-brownlee-at-service

    Hope it made the guy happy because its probably worth a point or two to National

    • Stuart Munro 4.1

      Do tell us the Gnat approved method of making corrupt cabinet members do their jobs PR. Napier was rebuilt in two years from a much worse quake – but they didn’t have crooks like Brownlee profiting from the delay. If it were really worth a couple of points to National you’d be flinging the shit yourself.

      • Puckish Rogue 4.1.1

        The real problem is this, first a dildo, then a glitter bomb now this then what happens next time some looney decides they’re justified in throwing something…a brick maybe or someone uses a bat possibly

        All this does is tighten security around our politicians so we have even less access and makes the left look even more unelectable to swing or soft voters

        • marty mars 4.1.1.1

          the stretch has stretched and when it cannot stretch anymore it breaks – you’d blame it for breaking rather than blame those pulling and pulling and stretching it too much and that is a rightie way of thinking, so well done.

          • Puckish Rogue 4.1.1.1.1

            Actually I’d like to know why he acted the way he did, does he have a legit claim or just didn’t get the deal he wanted? who knows but doing what he did takes it from a legitimate form of protest to assault

            • marty mars 4.1.1.1.1.1

              I find our concern for this person illusory – I’d say you just want more sticks to hit him with.

              • Puckish Rogue

                Bollix I’m from Christchurch myself and I know that there are a lot of people that haven’t had the best time of it and I also know there are those that aren’t telling the whole story as well

            • Wonderpup 4.1.1.1.1.2

              His son died in the earthquake. His protest, as naive as it was, is pretty widely supported in the East of Christchurch.

              • Puckish Rogue

                I think he needs to speak to someone because its not healthy carrying that around for so long

                • Pasupial

                  PR

                  Perhaps he should consult the mental health services provided by the health board.

                  No, wait a minute; haven’t they had their funding slashed leading to long delays in getting treatment? Who could have foreseen that such penny-pinching to grub up cash for an election year taxcut bribe would have negative consequences? I guess his chosen method of commemorating the dead differs from the government’s one of exploiting them.

                • Wonderpup

                  I agree. He should just get over his son, and be resilient. Otherwise he’s just another moaner, standing in the way of reconstruction. (sarc).

                • joe90

                  Yeah, dude wasn’t prominent enough to maintain his anonymity.

                  • Magisterium

                    Kinda hard to remain anonymous when you’re a paedophile with a criminal record who attacks a Minister of the Crown at a memorial service.

                    • joe90

                      But not if you’re prominent professional with a fragile state of mind.

                    • McFlock

                      or a “prominent new zealander”…

                    • joe90

                      special peeps

                      “In this case there is no offending against any individuals within the New Zealand community.

                      “Therefore publicity in my view is not required to flush out any potential offenders or to enable members of the community to keep themselves safe from you.

                      […]

                      He had also begun therapy to treat his paraphilia.

                    • joe90

                      The court accepts a prominent professional with a fragile state of mind and convicted criminal deserves name suppression because he has no offending against any individuals within the New Zealand community and allows him to characterise his offending as paraphilia.

                      Doesn’t a sad sorry sack of shit like Howland deserve the same treatment?.

                • Magisterium

                  So you agree, Howland is a paedophile with a criminal record.

        • mac1 4.1.1.2

          Escalation. A bit like this pyramid of violence?

          https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10101566814489992&set=a.553686228192.2122674.199104866&type=3&theater

          I happened to be in Parliament in the Gallery late last year when three protesters threw a bag of pamphlets over the side of the gallery all over the government benches. The only upshot that I can predict is that there will be a glass wall fronting the visitors’ galleries, large, very physical ushers, and increased security screening measures to detect non-metal objects of protest, or worse.

          One thing is for sure. People are getting angrier and more frustrated with this government.

          • Puckish Rogue 4.1.1.2.1

            One thing is for sure. People are getting angrier and more frustrated with this government.

            Which means we can expect an increase in security around MPs

            • mac1 4.1.1.2.1.1

              PR, the pity is, though, that MPs are not making enough moves to alleviate the concerns of these angrier and more frustrated citizens.

              A citizenry generally contented with its MPs would act differently.

              Inequality is growing. Our society is becoming polarised again. Political polls indicate a high level support for the government at 47%.

              It also indicates an opposition of about the same level, representing some very discontented people. A million did not vote last election. Did they stay away because of contentment, or disenchantment.

              Angry, frustrated, sick, desperate people don’t make for a harmonious society, and our MPs who need protection are being shielded from this reality, and either are in denial, don’t care, or think that it is acceptable.

            • Sabine 4.1.1.2.1.2

              Well, well with 28 Police Station closed since 2009 and two more scheduled to be closed soon, there is a surplus of Cops in need of work. 🙂

              They can all be security guards (private company of course) to the guys that got them unemployed 🙂

              Feeling safer yet?

        • Smilin 4.1.1.3

          Party politics and protectionism funded by Natcorps corporate buddies is the problem
          How do you institute wartime powers when there is no war and don’t give me that looting crap and all the other BS reasons given by the govt if there’s one of those right wing justifiers out there
          Really this is Natcorp screwing democracy and nothing more and protecting the US govt and the multinational interests and we haven’t even made TPPA law yet It appears to be working well without all that legal shit to answer to the voters or the sovereignty issues or Canterburys right to control there own problems

      • BM 4.1.2

        How is Brownlee profiting from the delay?

      • alwyn 4.1.3

        They didn’t have an RMA either.
        Basically they had two dictators who had no real constraint on what they could do.
        There was very little red tape at that time and no legal challenges to anything they decided.
        http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/news/4811992/What-Napier-can-teach-Christchurch-about-earthquake-recovery

      • Smilin 4.1.4

        Yeah well said and thanks for the reminder about how real work was done

    • Jones 4.2

      Hah! Inside job…!!! 🙂

  5. joe90 5

    I’m liking unmarried women drove turnout in practically every demographic.

    Single women are also becoming more and more powerful as a voting demographic. In 2012, unmarried women made up a remarkable 23 percent of the electorate. Almost a quarter of votes in the last presidential election were cast by women without spouses, up three points from just four years earlier. According to Page Gardner, founder of the Voter Participation Center, in the 2012 presidential election, unmarried women drove turnout in practically every demographic, making up “almost 40 percent of the African-American population, close to 30 percent of the Latino population, and about a third of all young voters.”

    Perhaps more dramatically than any other voting block, un­married women — comprising as they do other liberal-voting groups including young women and women of color — lean left. Way left. Single women voted for Barack Obama by a wide margin in 2012 — 67 to 31 percent — while married women (who tend to be older and whiter) voted for Romney. And unmarried women’s political leanings are not, as has been surmised in some quarters, attributable solely to racial diversity. According to polling firm Lake Research Partners, while white women as a whole voted for ­Romney over Obama, unmarried white women chose Obama over Romney by a margin of 49.4 percent to 38.9 percent. In 2013, ­columnist Jonathan Last wrote about a study of how women ages 25 to 30 voted in the 2000 election. “It turned out,” Last wrote in The Weekly Standard, “that the marriage rate for these women was a greater influence on vote choice than any other variable.”

    http://nymag.com/thecut/2016/02/political-power-single-women-c-v-r.html

    • Sabine 5.1

      reproductive rights.
      that is what a lot of women compels to vote democratic rather then republican.

      A women without reproductive rights, access to birth control and abortion, without access to gender specific health care (prenatal care is just one of these gender specific health care programme) is not in control of her life, unless she lives abstinence only or has a partner who is happy to control his fertility instead.

      And in the states, reproductive rights for women are nothing to be taken granted.

    • swordfish 5.2

      The Times They are a-Changing

      http://normanfinkelstein.com/2016/02/20/the-times-they-are-a-changing-2/

      Survey of young American voters by Republican pollster, Frank Luntz, finds:

      Most compassionate system
      Socialism 58%
      Capitalism 33%

      Corporate America embodies …
      Everything Wrong with US 66%
      Everything Right with US 34%

      Presidential Election
      Sanders 45%
      Clinton 19%
      Trump 10%
      (all others sub-10%)

      Broad Political Alignment
      Democrats 44%
      Independents 42%
      Republicans 15%

      “Make no mistake”, Luntz said in a memo to reporters, “This is the stuff of serious sea change for America”

      Similar generational divide in UK over Corbyn and Labour.

      • alwyn 5.2.1

        That is to be expected. You say “young” voters.
        Have you not heard the old quote which goes
        “If you are not a Liberal at 25, you have no heart. If you are not a Conservative at 35 you have no brain”.
        You, like the gentleman you are quoting, are probably dreaming if you think it will persist. After all, look at what happened to the 60’s generation.

        • swordfish 5.2.1.1

          Yep, … heard it … read it … kicked it to the curb.

          This remarkably amusing little Right-friendly bon mot has emanated over the last couple of centuries from various Tories, crypto-Tories, debauched decadent dandies, devious dilettantes and sundry Swedish Royalty (King Oscar II for one).

          They were talking of and to the wealthy elite – upper class youthful revolt (usually as much about wresting power from older elites than anything truly progressive/egalitarian/altruistic) followed by a rapid return to mater and pater’s staunch Conservatism by the age of 30 and a slap-up meal at Mrs Miggins’ Pie Shop.

          You do realise that the bloke I’m quoting is the Republican Party pollster – not the sort usually associated with dreamy flower power idealism I’d suggest.

  6. Sabine 6

    Wonder what the Police could do with the 26 million spend on the Flag referendum. ?

    One could aks Mrs. Judith Collins, MP National Party, who holds the Police Portfolio in the National led Government.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/67617030/police-shut-30-stations-in-effort-to-combat-budget-cuts

    Budget cuts, so that Mr. Awesome Finance Man Double Dipper from Dipton Mr. English can enlarge or embiggen the surplus. Or maybe he is just aiming to privatise our Police Force, like state housing and hospital meals. 🙂

    National Party, no money for public safety, but plenty for Dish Rags with the wrong colour.

    Quote: “Thirty police stations have closed to the public as police struggle to balance the books.

    The force has quietly been reviewing its 400 “public facing” properties – which includes stations and community policing centres – as a Budget freeze continues to bite. And with resources thinly-stretched, response times to 111 calls are rising.

    Since 2009, the shutters have come down in 28 stations and another two are to be closed, which means the public must go elsewhere to report crime.” Quote End

    • Tautuhi 6.1

      God Help !!!

    • Smilin 6.2

      the alarming facts of one section of mismanagement by this govt
      Maybe the incidents of assault on the Natcorp ministers should sink in that people are getting sick of the PR BS

    • Draco T Bastard 6.3

      National: Tough on crime – as long as doing so is cheap and doesn’t cut in to anticipated tax cuts for the rich.

    • alwyn 6.4

      “Wonder what the Police could do with the 26 million …”.
      You are going to join the back of a very, very long queue. I must have seen at least 20 variations of that plaintive cry. Everyone appears to forget that there is only one lot of money and it couldn’t have been spent 20 or more times.

  7. Grim 7

    The above post reminded me of something,
    whenever a budget surplus is mentioned in the media,
    Labour needs to ensure the media also includes the government borrowing and national debt.

    There needs to be public education on New Zealand’s level of debt,
    Labour needs to explain that a budget is arbitrary and any surplus is bullshit until you actual stop borrowing.

    • Draco T Bastard 7.1

      Labour needs to explain that a budget is arbitrary and any surplus is bullshit until you actual stop borrowing.

      QFT

    • Nic the NZer 7.2

      The govt in NZ can run a budget deficit indefinitely. This follows from the one and only institution able to create NZ $ being effectively a govt department (the RBNZ accounts are consolidated into the govt accounts). The only consideration is the economic consequences of running a budget deficit on unemployment, growth, inequality and inflation.

      The opposition should explain this to the public while focusing on the actual consequences of the govt actions on the economy.

      • Grim 7.2.1

        sorry only just saw this reply,

        http://www.budget.govt.nz/budget/pdfs/pit/pit-ch6.pdf

        Treasury and the NZDMO do not lend directly to the government,
        all borrowing is via issuing securities, bond etc.

        Borrowing.

        If the mechanism for currency expansion (based on GDP) was to introduce currency via financing government services that would be wonderful.
        Then government debt would be directly tied to GDP and a balanced budget would be guarantied.

        Alas new money printed is lent to banks at OCR -official cash rate
        government borrows money from the selling of securities just above OCR
        (transactions managed by the independent NZDMO, who also manage government accounts)

        treasury issues new currency but only to non government entities, government borrows money from those same entities, remember the issued currency is required to circulate, the life blood of the economy,

        once you understand the convoluted way it has been setup you’ll begin to see behind the curtain.

        • Nic the NZer 7.2.1.1

          The big question about govt spending is can parliament instruct its central bank. In being able to do so its always possible to setup transactions where the central bank is lending as required for the govt to spend. In NZ i believe the RBNZ legislation already allows for this anyway. As long as this is feasible the deficit or govt debt becomes a non issue and parliament can spend as desired.

          A system where the govt spends new currency directly will however behave in a similar way to the present day settlement system. The reason for this is when new currency is spent it becomes reserves for NZ banks to use as settlement. When a surplus of reserves is in the banking system then the inter bank rate can fall below the official cash rate as banks lend reserves to each other at a discount to the OCR. So the reserve bank or treasury need to borrow the surplus spending to keep the central bank in control. This has the same result as if the govt borrows first and then spends ultimately.

    • Smilin 7.3

      Cheers the astounding facts about how real accounting works not the PR BS show called the budget
      Gareth Hughes said it in plain terms that even a problem gambler would grasp to his road to recovery
      120 BILLION IN DEBT no ifs buts or maybes

  8. Kay 8

    Very true words from a UK Labor MP penned after a visit to Auschwitz and easy to see the same thing happening in NZ. (1st time I’ve submitted a partial article with link, apologies if I’ve included too much of the article)

    ‘Some people matter and some people don’t.

    “The Selection” process is writ large at the memorial. A single decision made in seconds determined if you would turn left for hard labour or right for imminent death. It took years of drip drip drip feeding to convince nations of people to turn away and ignore the horror. Jewish people didn’t lose their identity as humans overnight. The people who turned away and did nothing, didn’t lose their sense of justice in a heartbeat or at the simple say so of a foolishly moustached maniac. Drip drip drip… whisper it quietly… some people matter some people don’t. Drip drip drip… they are getting something you can’t have. Drip drip drip they don’t like you, they think they are better than you… drip, drip, drip. They, they, they, us, us, us.

    Working with victims of domestic violence and sexual exploitation, you learn pretty quick how grooming a person to your way of thinking is the most dangerous weapon, mankind possesses.

    At Auschwitz we light a candle, we remember, this is past, this is in novels, films history books. This isn’t us anymore. Isn’t it? Everyday we receive our daily intravenous drip, of who matters and who doesn’t and recently someone increased the dosage.

    Now a new row has broken out at Oxford University, where I’m ashamed to say that some in the Labour Party society appear to be tolerating the intolerable. Everyday we hear stories of otherness, Islamophobia and antisemitism, in full swing. People pitched one against the other, taxpayers pitched against benefit claimants, women against men. Refugees versus migrants. Everyday we receive our dose of “us” versus “them”. Drip, drip, drip.

    For many the Holocaust is best summed up in numbers. Six million Jews murdered. Still today it’s all a numbers game. Hundreds of thousands of people washed up on beaches, fleeing for their lives. Thousands of women, raped and murdered all around the world. So many x thousands living on some benefit or other, while y thousands of people go out to work. There is safety in numbers, we can be shocked by all the big numbers and then go back to watching the Bake Off. In every number is a person just like you. While we can keep seeing people as “them” we have learned nothing from a gruesome past.’
    http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/jess-phillips/lets-stop-drip-drip-drip-of-otherness_b_9274840.html?utm_hp_ref=uk

  9. joe90 9

    In bed with the media.

    (Scroll down – 21:25 Found Objects: are Joe & Mika tilted toward Trump?)

    http://harryshearer.com/le-shows/february-21-2016/

  10. aerobubble 10

    Your car broke down, and you are forced to push the car outf the way of traffic. Do you stop at the red amd lose all the momentum or push through when there is no traffic.

    Yes, another day another reporter manufacturing hate speach against pedestrians on bikes. No, bike riders do not have to obey the road rules, any more than pedestrians.
    Motorized vehicles obey the road rules, as cyclists cannot get to forty kms an hour duh, they are incapable of safety obey road rules in the second lane of a 100kmh dual carriageway. Road rules dont need the complication of regulating pedestrians, skate borders, moterized wheel chairs, etc, all of whuch could not reach seventy kmh.

    So please stop the hate. Only motor vehicles obey road rules to regulate them.
    Oh, and i see cars driving on foot paths (late night 2am paper deliever), i see car driver breaking road rules when its safe to do so and necessary i.e accidents. So whose the prig journalist making new laws up.

    When a person can get off their bike and safely push their bike through a red light, i have no problem with a cyclists riding through one. Safely, since cyclists have much greater view. Now sure there are always idiots who ride like idiots and thats called jay walking, and should be covered under some nuisance law, as the idiot cyclist who cycles unsafely past a red and into hospital will always be punnished more than the state ever could. So near scrapes should be hauled before courts. But safe cyclling is just like a broke down car, momentum saving.

  11. Grindlebottom 11

    I’m really puzzled with what’s happening to some pages on this site for me, Lprent.

    Yesterday I couldn’t open the General Lord Dannatt: UK should work with Assad in Syria page, and I reported that in Open Mike 22/02/16. (Much later on it did open ok.)

    Pages showing a red flag icon (instead of the grey square one) in the chrome tab, but just not opening, has been an intermittent problem for me for a couple of months now. Most often it’s been Open Mike pages that don’t open for some reason.

    I think at least one other person reported similar problems in a reply. You were going to look into it, and suggested it might perhaps have been a problem with my ISP’s (Spark) caching? I don’t have this problem on any other forums or websites.

    Anywaaaay…I just went to the Open Mike 22/06/16 page to see if there was any update. But I can’t find out cos that page won’t bloody open for me today 🙂 . (You suggested I try shift+f5, or shift+refresh if it happened again, but no joy.)

    I also couldn’t open today’s Open Mike about two hours ago, but I can now?? I’m using Win 7 & Chrome Version 48.0.2564.116 m, but firefox and IE have the same problem.
    I dunno whether I’ll be able to open this page later to check for any reply but I’ll try.

  12. ianmac 12

    “McCully not contesting East Coast Bays seat….Quite when that will be, and whether I seek election as a List Member of Parliament in 2017, are decisions for the Prime Minister in the first instance.”
    Make way for a Conservative candidate?

  13. Macro 13

    Thieving employers should be prosectuted
    And as if that is not enough!
    It seems to me that employers need to be licensed in order to be allowed to hire staff. If they cannot follow the rules for the fair employment of people, or if they rob or steal from them, then they should be subject to the full force of the law – as they would expect if the employees stole from them!
    Furthermore some of these employers are repeat offenders, and have continuously shown that they cannot be trusted to treat employees fairly. In such cases they should never be given the responsibility of being allowed to hire people again and their license should be withdrawn.

    • Draco T Bastard 13.1

      I hold that if a business breaks the law consistently then it needs to be nationalised and all the debts held to the previous owners.

      And, yes, licensing of the managers and business owners would probably help as well.

  14. Draco T Bastard 14

    Going Interstellar

    The full version is here.

  15. Penny Bright 15

    Seen this?

    http://m.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11593820

    Chris Darby has become the latest councillor to have second thoughts about dramatic housing density plans in Auckland suburbs.

    The North Shore councillor told the Herald he was “undecided” and that natural justice and opportunity for public participation by those affected were key issues for him.

    Mr Darby and Whau councillor, Ross Clow, have indicated in the past 24 hours that they could vote with 11 councillors who want to dump a proposal to rezone thousands of homes for more intensive housing without consulting affected property owners.
    ……….
    _______________________________

    FYI – don’t know about any of the other 2016 Auckland Mayoral candidates, but I have been given speaking rights at the Special Governing Body meeting to be held on the Auckland Council’s Unitary Plan Committee above-mentioned ‘out of scope’ changes to the Proposed Auckland Unitary Plan.

    Wednesday 24 February 2016
    2pm
    Auckland Town Hall.

    Penny Bright

  16. Sacha 16

    Another angle on tomrrow’s special meeting about the future shape of Auckland:
    http://www.metromag.co.nz/city-life/simon-wilsons-auckland/an-open-letter-to-the-auckland-council/

  17. Nic the NZer 17

    Major stouch in Democrat land. Mainstream economic models appear to favour the Sanders proposals over the Clinton proposals.
    http://neweconomicperspectives.org/2016/02/krugman-gang-4-need-apologize-smearing-gerald-friedman.html

  18. Penny Bright 18

    If big Republican donors support Hillary Clinton – should ‘everyday’ Americans?

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-02-22/hillary-clinton-backed-major-republican-donors
    Authored by Eric Zuesse,

    An analysis of Federal Election Commission records, by TIME, which was published on 23 October 2015, showed that the 2012 donors to Romney’s campaign were already donating more to Hillary Clinton’s 2016 campaign than they had been donating to any one of the 2016 campaigns of (listed here in declining order below Clinton) Lindsey Graham, Rand Paul, Carly Fiorina, Chris Christie, Rick Perry, Mike Huckabee, Donald Trump, Bobby Jindal, Rick Santorum, George Pataki, or Jim Gilmore.

    Those major Romney donors also gave a little to two Democrats (other than to Hillary — who, as mentioned, received a lot of donations from these Republican donors): Martin O’Malley, Jim Web, and Lawrence Lessig.

    (Romney’s donors gave nothing to Bernie Sanders, and nothing to Elizabeth Warren. They don’t want either of those people to become President.)

    Clinton is the only Democratic candidate who is even moderately attractive to big Republican donors.
    …….
    _______________________________

    Penny Bright
    2016 Auckland Mayoral candidate.

    • Smilin 18.1

      better the devil you know it would appear , Clinton, than one that is a socialist speaking to get accountability by the financiers -the new untouchables that never have to pay the billions they have swindled out of ordinary believers in the value of what they’ve worked for

      NZ 1984 16 BILLION IN DEBT 2016 120 BILLION

      Same here as in the states

      “Natcorp pullin the wool since 1936”

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