Open Mike 25/09/2016

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, September 25th, 2016 - 154 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

openmikeOpen mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose. The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

154 comments on “Open Mike 25/09/2016 ”

  • Comments are now closed

  1. Nick 1
    25 September 2016 at 7:16 am

    Watched ShonKey try very hard to explain his security council mtg, just did his yeah, nah, she’ll be right mate. He’s really good at filling up airtime with nothing but blah blah.

  2. Paul 2
    25 September 2016 at 7:44 am

    JEZ HE DID! Despite a purge that prevented a quarter of Labour supporters from voting.

    http://www.thecanary.co/2016/09/24/jez-despite-purge-prevented-quarter-labour-supporters-voting/

  4. save nz 4
    25 September 2016 at 8:35 am

    Coming our way with the National government – having to compete with multinationals to buy our own water…

    “A small town in Ontario, Canada, has prompted fresh scrutiny of the bottled-water industry after its attempt secure a long-term water supply through the purchase of a well was outbid by the food and drinks multinational Nestlé.

    When authorities in Centre Wellington, population of about 30,000, learned that Nestlé had put a bid on a spring water well in their region, they scrambled over the summer to counter with a competing bid. The goal was to safeguard a water supply for the township’s fast-growing population, Kelly Linton, the mayor, told the Guardian. “By 2041, we’ll be closer to 50,000 so protecting our water sources is critical to us.”

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/sep/24/canada-nestle-water-well-bid-centre-wellington

    • millsy 4.1
      25 September 2016 at 9:28 am

      That is what will happen if the government brings in tradeable water rights.

      • aerobubble 4.1.1
        26 September 2016 at 11:05 am

        wtf. Farmer groups want to be able to use wayer, gm, etc, to make money, it does not matter other frmers aquifers dry up, or gm escapes, as long as the corp farmer can make profit oblivious of effects… ..just like shitty rivers.

        why would any farmer lobby argue for gm and against regional efforts to grow value? Is the farming lobby a talk fest for big corp?

    • Jenny Kirk 4.2
      25 September 2016 at 10:04 am

      This is already happening in the north, unfortunately.
      A small iwi is battling the Northland Regional Council to retain its long-held rights in the Poroti Springs which the NRC is busily selling off water rights to overseas companies – including Nestles which has been looking at Poroti Springs too. I’m not sure how far along Nestles has got with its resource consent application to withdraw water from the Springs.

    • b waghorn 4.3
      25 September 2016 at 1:05 pm

      there is a bottling plant taking the best aquifer water in the havlock north/ napier area for bottling will the locals drink shit.

  5. Pete George 5
    25 September 2016 at 8:41 am

    Food for thought (I think some of it applies across the spectrum).

    The left now suffer from closed minds and moral smugness. They are moribund and backward-looking.

    They run from ideas. Opposing philosophies distress them.

    They pillory dissenters as stupid or immoral and often both. There’s no debating or explaining, just abuse for those who step outside received wisdom.

    The left have taken to social media with gusto. It only takes 140 characters to abuse and attack.

    They fill Twitter and blogs with their righteousness and smugness, puffed up by their own perceived moral and intellectual superiority.

    There’s no allowance that a person with a differing view might offer an opportunity to learn and to strengthen your ideas and perhaps, just perhaps, to change them.

    That’s never allowed as a possibility.

    Their minds are closed and they gasp and take offence at any idea or opinion different to their own.

    Indeed, ganging up against dissenters on social media is what binds them. Their attacks on others proves to them their correctness and superiority.

    The left are puzzled about why they’re politically marginalised but never trouble themselves to listen to those who have turned away from them. They look down on them and despise them.

    The left view their political failure as the fault of voters who must be hoodwinked, stupid, selfish, or suffering some other ethical or intellectual shortcoming. Why else would they not be supporting the left when they are so good and true?

    The problem is never with the left or their doctrine.

    They are a self-reinforcing sect who in their wretchedness and anger are becoming ever smaller. Their narrow and insular outlook prevents them reaching out. Little wonder it’s not attractive to new recruits.

    Labour is the narrow party that has shut itself off from the great bulk of New Zealanders.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11714771

    Some of that may be a bit on the nose but it is generally quite close to the mark. If you react badly to that you may well be proving Rodney’s point.

    If the left want to attract more support they need to look more attractive.

    • Paul 5.1
      25 September 2016 at 8:47 am

      Rodney Hide is not someone whose views are worth listening to.

    • Garibaldi 5.2
      25 September 2016 at 8:54 am

      Rodney Hides opinion? Fuck off.
      I have just read through yesterdays Open Mike…. wow. Well done all the contributors , esp CV and Paul and Adrian, for ably fending off the narrow minded, ignorant defenders of ‘ pax Americana ‘ or , to put it more bluntly, those who are basically backing Zionism.
      For me all the hypocrisy of the USA can be summed up in one word….. Vietnam.

    • save nz 5.3
      25 September 2016 at 8:56 am

      Yes, we can really listen to Rodney – ACT last election getting less than 1% of votes. Bit like at the amount of voters who actually take ACT seriously and soon to be the amount of people who take the Herald seriously.

      Even die hard Natz supporters know that Granny is not really a news organisation anymore and you can’t trust news from Granny – sponsor-an-article cum crony-alert-reporting style. Have MR less than 1% Hide as a commentator just reinforces their dying readership.

    • Stuart Munro 5.4
      25 September 2016 at 9:12 am

      The left will not get support from the right – they would be fools to look for it.

      • Draco T Bastard 5.4.1
        25 September 2016 at 11:00 am

        +1

        But we do need to point out their delusional ideology and how it fails the nation.

        • Stuart Munro 5.4.1.1
          25 September 2016 at 11:51 am

          Yep – and revolutionary as the idea might seem to the likes of Pete George, a country with 300 000 children in poverty and an entire generation consigned to homelessness has no particular need to slide further to the right. It has significant and pressing pragmatic problems that paying lip service to the bloody idols of neoliberalism will not address.

          • Colonial Viper 5.4.1.1.1
            25 September 2016 at 11:54 am

            and an entire generation consigned to homelessness has no particular need to slide further to the right.

            Labour will have the first affordable $600,000 homes ready by 2019. So the Aucklanders priced out of the housing market today only need to put their lives on hold until then.

            (By which time the prices of the “affordable” homes will be more like $700,000).

            • Stuart Munro 5.4.1.1.1.1
              25 September 2016 at 12:11 pm

              It is of course optimistic, but the hope is that when they get their paws on the reins of power they will begin to govern, part of which will necessarily include addressing such problems. Better that they have a local Corbynist lobby to encourage them probably, or a community housing initiative to show them the way.

              • Colonial Viper …
                25 September 2016 at 12:22 pm

                What are their plans with these “reins of power”?

                How are they going to “address such problems”?

                Labour have now had 8 years cooling their heels in Opposition. What have they come up with in that time that we can look forward to?

                • Stuart Munro …
                  25 September 2016 at 12:48 pm

                  One of the outcomes of the last election for Labour was to notice that the Gnats produced no policy. The Gnats have no intention of being lampooned in public for their gross dishonesty and manifest stupidity. This is a lesson Labour has learned. We will only see a general picture of what they might do – but if you want genuine growth and reform that will need to come from a community base. Produce a working model & Labour might be very happy to fund and proliferate it. But thus far it doesn’t seem to be how they choose to fight their corner.

                  • Colonial Viper …
                    25 September 2016 at 12:59 pm

                    One of the outcomes of the last election for Labour was to notice that the Gnats produced no policy. The Gnats have no intention of being lampooned in public for their gross dishonesty and manifest stupidity. This is a lesson Labour has learned.

                    Labour has been facing off against the National tories since the 1930s.

                    You can’t tell me that they’ve only just figured out how Tories think.

                    • Stuart Munro …
                      25 September 2016 at 1:15 pm

                      The Tories changed their presentation. Under Bill English they represented themselves honestly as the crooked and unambiguously backward set of chumps they actually are. Key brought in the Crosby Textor thing – and the MSM decided they could embrace bias without any proximate prospect of comeuppance. Now the media are locked in – they will be reformed when the Gnats leave power and they know it.

                    • Colonial Viper …
                      25 September 2016 at 1:36 pm

                      We on The Standard can figure this shit out way fucking faster than the Labour caucus.

                      A Labour Govt is going to do fuck all “reform” to the MSM.

                    • Stuart Munro …
                      25 September 2016 at 2:03 pm

                      Nevertheless a strong press is believed to be one of the pillars of a healthy democracy – and I think we are feeling the lack. But yes, the LP isn’t setting speed records. Partly this is that feature of organisations that they grow to do the opposite of what they were established for. This is where a large activist membership is supposed to apply corrective feedback.

                      There are some curiosities in reform movements in that they require a receptive environment to develop new ideas – an incubator or as the trolls would have it an echo chamber. The Beijing student uprising resembled nothing so much as a magnetron – the ring of university campuses acting as the circulating amplifying chambers feeding the centre.

    • Psycho Milt 5.5
      25 September 2016 at 10:07 am

      If you react badly to that you may well be proving Rodney’s point.

      Pete George is moribund and backward-looking. He suffers from a closed mind and moral smugness. He runs from ideas and opposing philosophies distress him.

      If he reacts badly to that he may well be proving my point.

    • Bearded Git 5.6
      25 September 2016 at 11:05 am

      @ Rodney Hide rubbish on the Left…”They run from ideas” ….compared with this do-nothing regime…LOL.

      Call me closed minded if you like but I never ever ever ever read Hypocrite Hide.

    • Gabby 5.7
      25 September 2016 at 1:09 pm

      Or you just think Perky is a waste of skin.

  6. Richard Rawshark 6
    25 September 2016 at 9:03 am

    The good thing about Rodders is. He’s full of shit and everyone knows it.

    Aucklander’s want his testicles danglin from the sky tower in recognition of his superb super city idea.

    I imaging stepping out in public is wonderful for him. Wondering if someone will dent his face.

    As for the article. It’s actually a reflection of their own closed minds, they(people like him) think everyone else is behaving like they do themselves.

    Rodney telling the left they have closed minds is more so outrageous that it will click bait people into A reading his article,. B push up ratings at the Herald which thankfully is diving like a Stuka!

    I used to read the Herald, now it’s a third rate click bait celebrity mag. They lost the plot. If the Herald doesn’t turn it around soon it’ll be gone.

    Sacking Rodney and actually reporting news would help.

    • Paul 6.1
      25 September 2016 at 9:18 am

      Hide’s idea is basically there is no alternative to neo-liberalism.
      I think he’s also a climate denier.

      So we should be listening to this git.
      Ha ha.

    • Draco T Bastard 6.2
      25 September 2016 at 11:04 am

      As for the article. It’s actually a reflection of their own closed minds, they(people like him) think everyone else is behaving like they do themselves.

      Yep, pure bloody projection and we see it from the RWNJs all the time as they use their own actions to justify keeping things the way they are and even to make things worse instead of making things better.

  7. Pat 7
    25 September 2016 at 9:06 am

    “Willem Wiskerke, a spokesman for Greenpeace Netherlands said: “He is a climate denier like Donald Trump, nothing more, nothing less, a rightwing, fact-free populist who denies the climate crisis and will not put any effort into solving it.”

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/sep/23/dutch-parliament-votes-to-close-down-countrys-coal-industry

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/sep/23/existing-coal-oil-and-gas-fields-will-blow-carbon-budget-study

    meanwhile…..
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/84445709/large-area-off-canterbury-coast-proposed-for-oil-exploration

    • Manuka AOR 7.1
      25 September 2016 at 9:18 am

      “You will like me very much” – the Don to fossil fuel execs:

      “The same day as a new report highlighted the carbon emissions calamity that would accompany new fossil fuel extraction, Donald Trump promised an audience of fossil fuel executives that is the very agenda he would pursue if elected to the White House.

      ” “Oh, you will like me so much,” the Republican presidential candidate said in his address to the Shale Insight conference in Pittsburgh on Thursday.

      “He promised to lift regulations, open up more federal lands for fossil fuel extraction—including coal and fracking—and ease the way for new fossil fuel infrastructure projects including pipelines.

      ” Trump said he would get rid of “all unnecessary regulations, and [place] a temporary moratorium on new regulations not compelled by Congress or public safety.” He also called anti-coal regulations “unfair to our people and our workers.” ” http://www.commondreams.org/news/2016/09/23/trump-fossil-fuel-execs-you-will-me-so-much

    • Manuka AOR 7.2
      25 September 2016 at 9:22 am

      From your Stuff link:
      “A large chunk of Canterbury’s coast will again be offered up for oil and gas exploration, under a Government proposal described as “lunacy” by Christchurch’s deputy mayor.

      “The Government wants to set aside nearly 300,000 square kilometres of New Zealand’s east coast for oil and gas companies as part of its 2017 block offer.

      “The annual block offer allows companies to compete for exploration permits.

      “This year’s proposed offer would open up the largest area near Canterbury yet.

      “It includes a space near the Banks Peninsula Marine Mammal Reserve, home to the endangered Hector’s dolphin.”

      “Last year’s offer was deeply unpopular with the Christchurch City Council and environmental groups.

      “They argued that deep-sea drilling could threaten the region with a catastrophic oil spill for little economic gain.”

      • Pat 7.2.1
        25 September 2016 at 9:27 am

        why encourage further investment and reliance on near term stranded assets……unless you don’t believe those assets will be stranded.

      • Richard Rawshark 7.2.2
        25 September 2016 at 11:03 am

        If they struck oil there the economic gain would be out of this world.

        If there was a big earthquake there, their could possibly be an out of this world catastrophe.

        It’s just business to National we need energy we buy oil in, it would save us money and make money and jobs,. pure business.

        You cannot change nature.

    • save nz 7.3
      25 September 2016 at 9:24 am

      @Pat – Hides not even a populist. No one ever voted for him.

      • Pat 7.3.1
        25 September 2016 at 9:31 am

        Rodney’s piece has no bearing on my post..though I do agree he is unlikely to ever be described as populist (nor popular)

      • Pete George 7.3.2
        25 September 2016 at 9:35 am

        Epsom 2005:
        – Rodney Hide 21,102
        – Richard Worth (National) 8,220
        – Kate Sutton (Labour) 5,112
        – Keith Locke *Greens) 2,787

        New Plymouth 2014
        – Jonathan Young (National) 21,566
        – Andrew Little (Labour) 11,788

        Young is ranked 38th in National’s caucus.

        • Pat 7.3.2.1
          25 September 2016 at 9:45 am

          “Under Hide’s leadership, the vote in the September 2005 elections severely reduced ACT’s party parliamentary representation. ACT’s share of the party vote dropped from over 7% of the total in 2002 to around 1.5%; its representation in Parliament fell from nine MPs to two. Despite this reduction, the party remained in parliament due to Hide winning the Epsom seat. As a consequence of its reduced share of the vote, ACT received a significant cut in taxpayer-funded Parliamentary resourcing and Hide shifted his electorate office in Remuera to Newmarket, the same location as that of ACT’s head office”
          wiki

          Thanks Rodney

          • Pat 7.3.2.1.1
            25 September 2016 at 10:02 am

            now that Rodney’s (and by extension, ACT’s) popularity/support has been bought up it occurs to me if you want to measure the publics appetite for neoliberal theory you only need to examine the level of support for ACT, which I believe peaked at around 7% and now languishes within the MoE

            • jcuknz 7.3.2.1.1.1
              25 September 2016 at 3:20 pm

              It is quite amazing that ACT got 7% as we always beleived that there were only 5% intelligent enough to vote ACT. Now some 4% are looking elsewhere …. NZF ?
              Sorry that is trolling but I couldn’t resist 🙂

        • Richard Rawshark 7.3.2.2
          25 September 2016 at 9:46 am

          Explain what your getting at Pete please.

          I feel a correction coming on if your trying to tell me Rodney won that against National on his popularity alone.

          As for Andrew, yeah well, never been NP, wouldn’t have a clue to judge that result.

          • Pete George 7.3.2.2.1
            25 September 2016 at 1:46 pm

            I was showing that ‘save nz’ is wrong, Hide has had many people voting for him in an electorate, especially when compared to Little.

            I said nothing about ‘his popularity alone’, it was more complex than that but Hide worked hard in Epsom. I don’t think anyone gets all their votes on popularity alone.

            In 2008 ACT got 85,496 votes, that had little to do with National and quite a lot to do with Hide’s efforts.

            • One Anonymous Bloke 7.3.2.2.1.1
              25 September 2016 at 1:54 pm

              Striding victoriously over Savenz’s use of a colloquial euphemism, don’t get altitude sickness.

            • save nz 7.3.2.2.1.2
              25 September 2016 at 2:46 pm

              @Peter George – save the spin. We all know that they were National voters told to vote for him to prop up the Natz. Not many people would willingly vote for Hide. He’s a joke, as is his ideology.

        • Richard Rawshark 7.3.2.3
          25 September 2016 at 9:48 am

          I like the way Kate Sutton still pulled in 5k of votes in Epsom, in bloody Epsom! Go Kate!

          National and Rodney/Act must have really ignored their constituents or been talking to much shit for that to happen.

      • Richard Rawshark 7.3.3
        25 September 2016 at 9:38 am

        In the old Newspaper days letters to the editor would have curtailed them from posting to much of fringe politicians crap like Rodney.

        The complaints and stinging letters he received would have told him that. The editors letters would have also put the dickhead back where he belongs, talking fringe politics to nutters in a mental health ward.

        Take this little fact in, someone born since 1980 doesn’t know truth or proper politics like us older people. They have never heard dissention. They have never seen proper protests(springboks tour someone born 1980 ain’t going to remember) They don’t know what unions can do, all they know is wall street, greed is good, consumerism and having the latest phone and trainers is important.

        • alwyn 7.3.3.1
          25 September 2016 at 10:11 am

          ” talking fringe politics to nutters in a mental health ward.”
          By this I assume you mean the way a senile old fool like Geoffrey Palmer on his ideas for a written Constitution?
          Now there is someone who really should be ignored.

          • Richard Rawshark 7.3.3.1.1
            25 September 2016 at 10:45 am

            alwyn the list of people who enter representative politics with completely the wrong mental attitude, and who have not been scarred in some way by their nurture is tiny. Most of them who seek the halls of power, do it for fame, and ego.

            It’s the one field I think psychological evaluation should be completed on, that is anyone seeking public office. IMHO.

            Start with John Key, and many questions about his mum, and how long he breast fed for. Did he find it comforting gently pulling her hair whilst he was feeding on the nipple at 10, or did he think it felt a little strange at that age.

            🙂

        • Jenny Kirk 7.3.3.2
          25 September 2016 at 10:12 am

          That’s what the media tells us, Richard Rawshark, but I do keep coming across young people who are thinking about other things – not just worried about not being able to own a home, but worried about climate change, dirty waters, oil drilling, and NZ (their home) being taken over by multitudes of others.

          I just hope there are enough of these younger people to carry on dissension and protests when the time comes for those things.

          • Richard Rawshark 7.3.3.2.1
            25 September 2016 at 10:34 am

            …..the time comes for those things.

            The youth I grew up with at that time would have marched to the beehive and thrown by force this National government out by now even.

            Seriously.

            Time comes for those things.., with this lot, it WILL be to late.

          • Chuck 7.3.3.2.2
            25 September 2016 at 4:02 pm

            “I just hope there are enough of these younger people to carry on dissension and protests when the time comes for those things.”

            Well you had about 100 protesters out in force yesterday for the union lead rally in Auckland.

        • Richard Rawshark 7.3.3.3
          25 September 2016 at 10:48 am

          sadly I did the one thing there I hate most, I stereo typed. Sorry. Their are a lot of good youth out there don’t get me wrong. barring the stereotyping i’m sure you all get the gist of what I said though.

          I consider the youth of the greens Genter etc, an example of youth excelling beyond what we could back in my day. But they seem fewer.

    • Bearded Git 7.4
      25 September 2016 at 11:08 am

      Real Clear Politics still has Clinton 2-3% ahead…the Democrats in with a chance of taking the Senate…House of Reps staying with Republicans

      • Richard Rawshark 7.4.1
        25 September 2016 at 11:15 am

        US RWNJ’s doing the Trumps going to win thing when Hillary will clearly pass the post, is an old trick they employ when it’s looking bad for their guy. In that it’s to stop the rot and keep voters and try to gain the undecided.

        Hope i’m right on that, even though Hillarys donkey deep in it too(war mongering), Trumps scarier and a big gamble. Better the devil you know.

        • Colonial Viper 7.4.1.1
          25 September 2016 at 3:15 pm

          US RWNJ’s doing the Trumps going to win thing when Hillary will clearly pass the post

          ????????

          What

          Lefties need to get in touch with the reality on the ground.

          RCP no toss up states electoral map now has Hillary on 272 and Trump on 266. (270 electoral votes required to win the White House).

          In mid Aug, Hillary was on 351 electoral votes and Trump was on 187.

          In other words, according to RCP in just over a month Clinton has lost almost 80 electoral votes, while Trump has gained that much.

          The gap between the two candidates on a no-toss up basis has therefore shrunk in 5 weeks by 164 electoral votes to just 6 electoral votes.

          Which explains why Clinton is shouting on TV that she doesn’t know why she isn’t leading Trump by 50 points.

  8. Penny Bright 8
    25 September 2016 at 10:53 am

    Good to see the latest attempt to spread CCOs and forced local government amalgamations has been shelved.

    Glad to have helped.

    Seen this?

    ‘Activists – get things done’

    Unlike ALL the other Auckland Mayoral candidates – I successfully petitioned Parliament for an urgent inquiry into Auckland Council Controlled Organisations (CCOs).

    The following information I made available to Mayors in other parts of NZ to assist in their fight back against the continued corporate takeover of our local democracy, our assets and our public property.

    The following proves that I already have an effective working relationship with central government.

    Read for yourself …

    https://www.parliament.nz/resource/en-nz/51DBSCH_SCR69296_1/924613ec7fb831c4e74bd062f73287ac2ceb5081

    Petition 2014/33 of Penelope Mary Bright and 55 others, and Report from the Controller and Auditor-General, Governance and accountability of council- controlled organisations

    Kind regards

    Penny Bright

    2016 Independent Auckland Mayoral candidate.

  9. Manuka AOR 9
    25 September 2016 at 11:07 am

    Nuclear Power and Climate Change – excerpt:
    “Overall, the idea that atomic power is “clean” or “carbon free” or “emission free” is a very expensive misconception, especially when compared to renewable energy, efficiency, and conservation. Among conservation, efficiency, solar and wind power technologies, there are no global warming analogs to the heat, carbon, and radioactive waste impacts of nuclear power. No green technology kills anywhere near the number of marine organisms that die through reactor cooling systems.

    “Rooftop solar panels do not lose ten percent of the power they generate to transmission, as happens with virtually all centralized power generators. S. David Freeman, former head of numerous large utilities and author of All Electric America: A Climate Solution and the Hopeful Future, says: “Renewables are cheaper and safer. That argument is winning. Let’s stick to it.”

    “No terrorist will ever threaten one of our cities by blowing up a solar panel. But the nuclear industry that falsely claims its dying technology doesn’t cause global warming does threaten the future of our planet. ” http://www.progressive.org/news/2016/09/188947/how-nuclear-power-causes-global-warming

    • Andre 9.1
      25 September 2016 at 11:30 am

      Financially it seems pretty clear that renewables are the cheapest option for utility-scale new builds, even without a carbon tax. So worldwide I doubt we’ll see many more nuclear new builds, at least in western countries.

      But it seems to me the appropriate comparison for nuclear is against fossil fuels. In that comparison, nuclear still looks pretty favourable to coal/gas/oil (and actually even hydro) in terms of land area ruined and human health/mortality footprints, even considering the worst case projections from Chernobyl, Fukushima etc. So to me, it looks like an environmental setback when a nuclear plant is closed prematurely while fossil plants feeding the same grid are still running and polluting.

      Overall, my views are pretty similar to Monbiot’s, who expresses them a lot better than I ever could. http://www.monbiot.com/category/nuclear/

    • Gabby 9.2
      25 September 2016 at 1:16 pm

      Just how ‘green’ is the production of solar panels?

  10. Red 10
    25 September 2016 at 11:09 am

    Interesting comments by Rodney Hide on the left in the herald this morning, expresses much commentary you see on this site

    “The left view their political failure as the fault of voters who must be hoodwinked, stupid, selfish, or suffering some other ethical or intellectual shortcoming. Why else would they not be supporting the left when they are so good and true?

    The problem is never with the left or their doctrine.

    They are a self-reinforcing sect who in their wretchedness and anger are becoming ever smaller. Their narrow and insular outlook prevents them reaching out. Little wonder it’s not attractive to new recruits.

    It’s astonishing that National is now the vibrant party looking to the future and open to diverse views.

    Labour is the narrow party that has shut itself off from the great bulk of New Zealanders.”

    • Garibaldi 10.1
      25 September 2016 at 11:17 am

      Red, go back to bed.

    • Paul 10.2
      25 September 2016 at 11:23 am

      You are being generous describing Hide’s outpourings as an interesting comment.

    • Sacha 10.3
      25 September 2016 at 11:30 am

      “the narrow party that has shut itself off from the great bulk of New Zealanders” sounds more like the one polling less than 1%.

    • Stuart Munro 10.4
      25 September 2016 at 11:57 am

      Unusually stupid RW slanders repeated by morons so abject they never learned to write their own.

    • Gabby 10.5
      25 September 2016 at 1:18 pm

      But the gnats are a bunch of lefties according to Seemore Coq. What are we to make of this?

    • framu 10.6
      26 September 2016 at 12:28 pm

      ““The left view their political failure as the fault of voters who must be hoodwinked, stupid, selfish, or suffering some other ethical or intellectual shortcoming. Why else would they not be supporting the left when they are so good and true?

      The problem is never with the left or their doctrine.”

      meanwhile – if you talk to people on the left you quickly find the above assertion to be based on a deliberate over simplification of actual arguments made

      in short – its horse shit

  11. whispering kate 11
    25 September 2016 at 11:18 am

    We had a wander around MOTAT on Friday and came across a potted history of Radio in New Zealand. This is what I read –

    “On New Year’s Day in 1932 the Government took over the responsibility of the Radio Broadcasting Company in providing a national service. This was done under a three man Broadcasting Board who was also given the power to impose restrictions on the private stations. By 1937 most of the private stations had been bought by the New Zealand Government. Two distinct systems were then set up – one NATIONAL and one COMMERCIAL.

    The first Director of Broadcasting was Professor James Shelley. He saw radio as an instrument of real democracy based on a sympathetic understanding of all points of view.

    In 1946 the commercial and non-commercial branches of the national radio system were amalgamated under the name New Zealand Broadcasting Service.”

    My words – the poor sod Professor Shelley will be turning in his grave at the state of our airways these days – so much for “a sympathetic understanding of all points of view.” There isn’t one jot of balance in anything we listen to on Radio or TV – just adoration for a corrupt Government which is sickening.

  12. Sanctuary 12
    25 September 2016 at 11:21 am

    If you want to hear an out of touch ex pollie who actually dislikes democracy making a complete fool of himself, tune in to Natrad and listen to doddery old Geoffrey Palmer play with his constitutional toy soldiers.

    • Bea Brown 12.1
      25 September 2016 at 11:47 am

      Well said. He would tie us up in expensive knots for years trying to nut out a constitution. The main benefits of the monarchy are its distance and saving us from yet another self-important ex-pollie (like Geoffrey?) pretending to be our head of state.

      • Red 12.1.1
        25 September 2016 at 2:22 pm

        It’s a esotreic academic law professors hobby horse, law lecturers blather on about it in 101 law since the the beginning of time The rest of us don’t really give a monkeys, status quo is fine, bigger issues to deal with

      • Chooky 12.1.2
        25 September 2016 at 3:02 pm

        +100 to all that

    • andrew murray 12.2
      25 September 2016 at 5:42 pm

      I am not sure that you or your two supporters know what your talking about…

  13. Chooky 13
    25 September 2016 at 11:53 am

    What happened to ‘Open Mike’ on the 24th at the end?….comments aren’t showing properly

    • Chooky 14.1
      25 September 2016 at 3:00 pm

      +100 rhino…lol…we live in a time of profound bullshit, trivia …and wasted time and white collar technological trickery and bankster fraud and usury…driven by materialism and venal mindless greed

  15. Chooky 15
    25 September 2016 at 2:56 pm

    ‘Obama implicated in Clinton email scandal – New FBI docs’

    https://www.rt.com/usa/360528-obama-implicated-clinton-email/

    “President Barack Obama used a pseudonym when communicating with then Secretary of State Hillary Clinton by email, while her IT company referred to her email deleting as a “cover-up”, new FBI documents reveal….

    During the interview with Huma Abedin, who served as deputy chief of staff under Clinton, the FBI reportedly presented her with an email exchange between Clinton and a person she did not recognize. The FBI then revealed the unknown person’s name was believed to be a pseudonym used by Obama. Abedin reacted by saying, “How is this not classified?”

    This exchange could expose Obama as having mislead the public on the issue, given his 2015 statement that he found out about Clinton’s use of a private email server “the same time everybody else learned it, through news reports.”…

  16. Richard Rawshark 16
    25 September 2016 at 4:37 pm

    Cops, a lot of talk about cops lately, underfunded, understaffed, ignoring things, skewing stats..

    If Key remained PM lets say for another decade god forbid, how long do the standardista”s think it will be before a police surcharge to come out, comes along.

    What was it 25 police stations to close, but a little while ago they close a load down too.

    Why do we pay tax under national, they have pretty much driven everything under.

    • Colonial Viper 17.1
      25 September 2016 at 6:25 pm

      Anyone can talk about moving left of the centre; where is the left wing action, the left wing policy and the left wing personnel from Labour to back it up?

      • b waghorn 17.1.1
        25 September 2016 at 7:19 pm

        He would be silly to show all his cards to early , but going on clarkes performance on the tpp and praising of shit key, having Little publicly slap her down speaks volumes.
        He is the right man for the next pm.

    • ropata 17.2
      25 September 2016 at 10:01 pm

      More crap neoliberal advice from last century. Thanks but no thanks Aunty Helen. Little was right to distance himself from Helen’s divisive legacy.

      Anyway, Key currently rules the “centre” and won’t be budged. Labour’s only chance to get it back is if FJK makes a huge ballsup like David Cameron, but I reckon Key is more self aware

      John Key is an exceptional politician. As cunning as Fraser, as likable as Lange. But his set piece, 'statesman' speeches are bloddy shite— Morgan Godfery (@MorganGodfery) September 21, 2016

      • Kiwiri 17.2.1
        25 September 2016 at 10:10 pm

        Aunty Helen was right and is always right. She was smart to quickly dump any left-wing policies unpalatable to the centre so that she could appeal to the ‘middle’ voters.

        • ropata 17.2.1.1
          25 September 2016 at 11:10 pm

          Wrong, she lost the 2008 election because she wasted her political capital on pet social policies that alienated most voters. And she failed to address inequality and the growing housing bubble.

          I respect her as a well-intentioned and highly intelligent person, her government was excellent on foreign policy, but she bought into the “Third Way” Blairite bullshit on economic matters, a betrayal of all workers & class struggles of the last century

  18. Barfly 18
    25 September 2016 at 7:12 pm

    In the “ghost zone” ?

    In the Green Party?

    In the next election I will be voting Green Party(not Labour ) for the first time in what will be my 12th election.

    The last time I voted National was for Muldoon, and I honestly believe that was the last time a National Party leader gave a shit for the ordinary kiwi.

    Meh, I need another beer.

  19. Muttonbird 19
    25 September 2016 at 7:39 pm

    Looks like things have got worse in Syria today just as John Key chaired the Security Council this week with blithe, meaningless sound-bites.

    Coincidence? I think not.

    John Key has made an art of dividing those he pretends to represent.

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/world/314163/security-council-to-meet-as-syria-violence-escalates

  20. joe90 20
    25 September 2016 at 7:41 pm

    I’m loving the DPRK News Service. (yes, it’s a parody account)

    As expected, oily cave troll Ted Cruise offers endorsement of shouting rotting papaya Donald Trump, to applause of idiot racists across US. pic.twitter.com/5PyU7G1l2g— DPRK News Service (@DPRK_News) September 23, 2016

  21. Pat 21
    25 September 2016 at 8:27 pm

    it would appear the more things change the more they stay the same….has CT got this right?..from an Aucklander’s perspective?

    https://bowalleyroad.blogspot.co.nz/2016/09/from-good-guys-to-fall-guys-spinoff-and.html

    • ropata 21.1
      25 September 2016 at 9:10 pm

      A well written rant, shame Trotter didn’t get his facts straight, some reactions from Spinoff/GenZero author here (the whole thread on twitter is longer)

      Never seen anyone get this pissed over a b-. If I publish my academic transcript will you stop calling us corrupt?— Leroy Beckett (@LeroyBeckett) September 25, 2016

      saying we have been paid for our opinions or anything GZ do is laughable and kinda offensive to the ridiculous amount of work we do for free— Leroy Beckett (@LeroyBeckett) September 25, 2016

      For what it's worth, scorecards and UP campaigns funded entirely from small donations from our supporters. All that went to promotions— Leroy Beckett (@LeroyBeckett) September 25, 2016

      • Colonial Viper 21.1.1
        25 September 2016 at 9:37 pm

        note that Beckett didnt even try to defend their shitty endorsement of Right Wing Ralston or their BS labelling of Mike Lee as an anachronism.

        • Pat 21.1.1.1
          25 September 2016 at 9:45 pm

          i know nothing of Lee but the endorsement of Ralston was what caused the enquiry…and as you note, they didn’t defend their endorsements merely their funding.

        • ropata 21.1.1.2
          25 September 2016 at 9:50 pm

          The colour of his jib is not the issue, the Spinoff criteria are policy positions that will deal with the housing crisis

    • ropata 21.2
      25 September 2016 at 9:16 pm

      That said I think Trotter is right about the UP being twisted by property developers & speculators for their own ends, it is the ambulance at the bottom of the cliff. Need to close the immigration floodgates, penalise speculation & McMansions, and implement proper rates/LVT based on unimproved land value.

      • Colonial Viper 21.2.1
        25 September 2016 at 9:36 pm

        They’re privileged kids of the top 10%. Of course they’re going to endorse Key’s mate Bill Ralston ahead of public transportation champ Lee.

        • ropata 21.2.1.1
          25 September 2016 at 10:09 pm

          A major problem with Millennials is they have no concept of life outside of the market oriented neoliberal narratives. From TDB:

          Underlying this debate is the mute acceptance of the government’s ‘more is always better’ mantra by so many. Anyone who dissents is attacked overtly and covertly. Huge population increase is being pursued solely to line the pockets of the already rich and will be detrimental to NZ in most respects. We should be growing quality, not numbers. We would not have to build hundreds of thousands of homes over productive horticultural land if we accepted pursued a small, high quality niche approach.

  22. Chooky 22
    25 September 2016 at 11:23 pm

    Is the EU doomed?…interesting article by an Irishman, Bryan MacDonald

    ‘Like the Soviet Union, is EU heading for ash heap of history?’

    https://www.rt.com/op-edge/359327-soviet-union-eu-history/

    “A while back, Mikhail Gorbachev famously said: ‘The most puzzling development in modern politics is the apparent determination of Western European leaders to re-create the Soviet Union in Western Europe.’

    Gorbachev wasn’t referring to the European Union’s hunger to expand eastwards, but instead the bloc’s top-heavy governance, where smaller states are increasingly dominated by larger members.

    This was evident last year, when Angela Merkel pretty much unilaterally imposed a liberal migration policy on the confederation, which has led to massive division…

  23. Kiwiri 23
    25 September 2016 at 11:35 pm

    And from 2’46”:

    “The European Union is in dire straits, the European Union is disintegrating” (Varoufakis)

    • ropata 23.1
      26 September 2016 at 12:03 am

      Thanks for that, it led to this great TED talk by Varoufakis

      • Kiwiri 23.1.1
        26 September 2016 at 2:14 pm

        You’re very welcome. And this one also sometime at the end of last month:

        “Market Economy – Reinvent or Reboot?”

        Yanis Varoufakis versus Clemens Fuest, at the Alpbach Forum, along the lines of the proposition: “The market economy is the best model. It will also successfully manage the challenges faced in the future.” Agree or disagree with this statement?”