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Open mike 26/11/2012

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, November 26th, 2012 - 117 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Open mike is your post. For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the link to Policy in the banner).

Step right up to the mike…

117 comments on “Open mike 26/11/2012 ”

  1. KhandallaMan 1

    Annette, Phil and Trevor are upsetting the balance in the Caucus. 
    Instead of making space for the newer generation to shape itself they are tying them all up with their apron strings.
    The current mess owes much to Annette, Phil and Trevor meddling like ageing parents. 
    Their individual motives are irrelevant. The pattern is universal. 

    An early declaration that they will bow out in 2014 and retirement to the back benches in Shearer’s forthcoming re-shuffle will set the scene.  These steps will significantly change the profile and dynamic of the Caucus. 

    If Shearer wants “to move on” he needs to cut the apron stings with Annette, Phil and Trevor. 

     
    • David H 1.1

      They should have gone when Helen went, But they won’t they will want to bludge off the Taxpayer for another 3 years.

  2. just saying 2

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10849776

    Goff has already declared an intention to stand. Why am I not surprised?

    Note the ironic headline. It’s getting to be old hat in the Crosby-textor PR world for protagonists to brazenly declare themselves to be particularly virtuous in regard to a glaring fault, and accuse their opponents of being particularly guilty of it. I can imagine Key, apparently sincerely, confiding in an audience that he is compassionate to a fault, and that he has to be careful to ensure that his kind heart doesn’t prevent him making essential tough decisions.

    It seems the only way Goff can be stopped from doing whatever the hell he likes, is for his local LEC and party members to vote for a different candidate to represent them at the next election.

    I’m thinking about lobbying the party (however one does this kind of thing) about mandatory limits on the time representatives are allowed spend in parliament. I’m thinking five terms in total (which can be served as a block or across time) and two terms leading the party.

    • Socialist Paddy 2.1

      Shame. There is a perfectly good replacement waiting in the wings. Michael Wood would bring some youth and vigor to the position.

      • JazzaBelle 2.1.1

        An early announcement by that three would add another jolt of enthusiasm into the activist base.
        The party is damaged by the perception that it has been stalled since 2008.
        That is an aspect of the very vocal frustration expressed at the Conference, at branch and LEC meetings and in Email and blogs.
        Annette things her advice to Sherer us helping. It is not. Last weekend was a mess created by the HO, the leadership and their confidants.
        If anger-management-problem Hipkins and the PR machine keep blaming Cunliffe they will miss hearing the message from the members.

      • David H 2.1.2

        And thats the message that needs to be sent. Old guard out and lets please have some new blood!

    • Lanthanide 2.2

      “I’m thinking five terms in total (which can be served as a block or across time) and two terms leading the party.”

      How long was Helen in parliament? Wasn’t she elected in the 80’s?

      This is a bad idea.

    • prism 2.3

      js
      +1 To limitation of terms. But 5? (15 years). Say four – 12 years enough, and if we changed to a four-year parliamentary term then that would revert to three – 12 years. Getting politicians out of their seats seems to require a shoe horn, or in some cases a car jack. And there is a lovely sense of ownership and pride at being an electorate that has its own MP in the House.

      Overseas they are having difficulties choosing or holding onto the leadership – France for instance. And if you let the military or religious get into politics (Israel, Egypt, Burma etc) – you are halfway or even 90% stuffed and car jacks against tanks and military personnel are laughable unless some desperate group turn the jack into an IED (Innovative/Improvised Explosive Device?)

  3. Te Reo Putake 3

    Good result for redundant kiwi workers thanks to union activist Kymberley Inu. WINZ have finally accepted that redundancy pay should not extend the stand down before benefit payments start. Now all WINZ have to do is make sure that their call centre staff stop lying to redundant workers about their entitlements.
     
     

    • just saying 3.1

      A really important victory!

    • Bill 3.2

      I thought that came in a few years back (after, of course, I was forced to spend all my redundancy at a rate equal to benefit payments before I could claim any entitlement)

    • higherstandard 3.3

      Sounds like WINZ call centre is similar to the IRD, according to my accountant there is a huge difference in relation to the advice and service you receive depending on who’s on the other end of the line, mind you the same could be said of the places I’ve worked in over the years.

    • Te Reo Putake 3.4

      A lot of the difficulty at the WINZ (and ACC) call centre is the prevailing philosophy on openness. Best practice is to overprovide information, and point out to an applicant everything they may be entitled to, ensuring the correct benefit is paid from the start. However, under a bash the bennie philosophy, it appears that call centres are encouraged to be frugal in their information provision. Or just straight out lie.

    • David H 3.5

      Yeah but will they back pay or reimburse, ALL those that they have made to use said redundancy payment??

      Tui Moment

  4. Chalupa Batman 4

    http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2012/11/rodney-hide-on-rorts-in-government-tendering/

    So anybody on the left want to take out a National MP?

    • Descendant Of Smith 4.1

      The thing that I think is frustrating about government departments these is the seeming inability to simply use the local tradesman in the local communities.

      The tendering process simply gives most work to the biggest firms and local small businesses miss out.

      Over time the cost goes up cause someone has to pay the motel bills of the workers travelling to these towns and the small local business closes.

      It’s just another step in the breakdown of government departments being part of local communities.

      The days of government departments giving a local family the towel laundering to do to help them out financially are long gone but so are many small local electricians, builders, etc who did the local work.

      The above type rort seems to reflect a type of commercial nepotism – look at how many things Jenny Shipley has been involved in – vetting CV’s that turned out to be fake, power company sales, train sales, earthquake recovery advice for example.

      National contracts for everything from laundry to toilet paper to property leasing to planning work just seem to consolidate the power to give contracts in the hands of a few with plenty of cases of disaster e.g. backhanders for leases.

      Part of any tendering should include considering local economies just as large national tenders should consider NZ contracts first e.g. building trains. biggest or cheapest should not be the only consideration.

      • Draco T Bastard 4.1.1

        National contracts for everything from laundry to toilet paper to property leasing to planning work just seem to consolidate the power to give contracts in the hands of a few with plenty of cases of disaster e.g. backhanders for leases.

        That’s not just National but Labour and every local government since the 1980s. It’s simply easier to negotiate with a single company that can supply everything than it is to negotiate with many small companies. Prior to the 1980s and the Rogernomic trashing of the economy most of those would have been done in-house. If the government wanted a building then it went and bought the land, built the building on it and then hired the cleaners to keep it clean. Nowadays they look to see who can make the biggest profit from government funds for the same services which inevitably costs more.

    • David H 5.1

      The Chaos one what an ad for Gaffa tape. “Even keeps a Rocket in one piece until it’s fired.”

  5. Dr Terry 8

    Great column (as usual) from Tapu Misa, today’s Herald.

    • just saying 8.1

      Cheers for the tip Dr T.
      Tapu Misa on Shearer – recommended:

      http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10849903

      Maybe the world hasn’t gone mad after all.

    • karol 8.2

      Thanks for the heads up, Dr T.  It’s here.  Misa is watching from outside any LP faction, thinks Cunliffe has faults, saw no evidence of a coup, and thinks Shearer is not doing as well as Goff during last electoral cycle – hence, no wonder some LP members are not happy.

      Besides, as far as I can tell, the smearing and whispering campaigns (so vague as to be impossible to defend) have all been targeted at that other David. ….

      The rank and file is said to have favoured Cunliffe but Shearer narrowly won the caucus vote, led by the old guard, who, it’s now well known, deeply dislike Cunliffe (though why is not clear, even in a town not known for keeping secrets. One Labour MP who asked what Cunliffe had done to deserve such antipathy is still none the wiser). …

      Those at the conference were certainly excited. I watched it on YouTube and was less smitten. Maybe you had to be there to feel the rapture.  

      However good, it was asking a lot of one speech. Especially when Shearer’s subsequent TV appearances show him bumbling his way through straightforward questions on Labour’s new housing policy and Cunliffe’s summary execution.  

      It’s nonsense to say this doesn’t matter.   There is no “rightful leader” of the Labour Party. The position isn’t Shearer’s by right, nor Cunliffe’s for that matter. It ought to be threatened if enough people feel the incumbent hasn’t earned it.

    • deuto 8.3

      You bet me to it – a top notch summation in my opinion.

      Here is the link.
      http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=10849903

      I have read all the comments here over the last week or so – and agree with many of them, but have had other more pressing matters to deal with following the death by choice of a long standing friend.

      Tapu’s article says what I have been thinking but much more succinctly than I could have managed.

      I am still deciding whether to join Labour as many have suggested. Leaning toward doing so but only to add my voice and vote to the further democratisation of their internal processes to allow members a far greater say.

      EDIT – Now see that Karol provided the link as I was typing my comment. EDIT 2 – and js!

      • Rosie 8.3.1

        Sorry for the loss of your friend deuto. Take care

      • just saying 8.3.2

        Really sorry Deuto. There aren’t any words, so I won’t even try.
        I hope you have all the love and support you need to get through.
        Warmest wishes.

  6. Pete 9

    From The Guardian:

    The existence of an extraordinary global network of sham company directors, most of them British, can be revealed.

    The UK government claims such abuses were stamped out long ago, but a worldwide joint investigation by the Guardian, the BBC’s Panorama and the Washington-based International Consortium of Investigative Journalists (ICIJ) has uncovered a booming offshore industry that leaves the way open for both tax avoidance and the concealment of assets.

    More than 21,500 companies have been identified using this group of 28 so-called nominee directors. The nominees play a key role in keeping secret hundreds of thousands of commercial transactions. They do so by selling their names for use on official company documents, using addresses in obscure locations all over the world.

    This is not illegal under UK law, and sometimes nominee directors have a legitimate role. But our evidence suggests this particular group of directors only pretend to control the companies they put their names to.

    The companies themselves are often registered anonymously offshore in the British Virgin Islands (BVI), but also in Ireland, New Zealand, Belize and the UK itself. More than a score of UK agencies sell offshore companies, several of which also help supply sham directors….

    Further details from the International Consortium of Investigative Journalists

  7. Socialist Paddy 10

    Feck

    Josie Pagani is on Radio New Zealand feeding Hooton with attack lines against Labour concerning Labour’s change to a more democratic policy formation process which binds MPs to an agreed platform.

    Which side is she on? 

    • deuto 10.1

      Good question – certainly not on Labour’s side except perhaps the ABCs.

      I noted that, for once both at the start of this section and at the end, Ryan did not introduce Hooten and Pagani as being Hooten from the right and Pagani from the left.

      Interesting. Related to Shearer’s non-answer yesterday perhaps?

      • Matthew Hooton 10.1.1

        That’s exactly right. Kathryn carefully weighs up what has been said on The Nation and Q&A etc and then carefully changes the way she introduces people accordingly. It’s all part of the neoliberal conspiracy (in which Radio NZ is obviously involved).

        • quartz 10.1.1.1

          To give deuto, his/her due, that’s about half as unlikely as most of the batshit crazy stuff you come out with hooton.

        • deuto 10.1.1.2

          Well it got a reaction from you!

          While you are here – a question for you totally unrelated to the above.

          Do you have a middle name – and does it start with the letter “R”?

          Edit – comment and question are to Matthew Hooton.

        • felix 10.1.1.3

          “That’s exactly right. Kathryn carefully weighs up what has been said on The Nation and Q&A etc and then carefully changes the way she introduces people accordingly.”

          Don’t be so flip, Matt. By your own standards, this deviation from Ms Ryan’s longstanding and well-known weekly routine is most likely clear evidence that she’s mounting a takeover of Radio New Zealand at this very moment.

          ps my highly placed friends at RNZ confirm that this is the case.

          • Anne 10.1.1.3.1

            What’s more, I understand the actual coup is going to take place on Xmas day, but nobody will know it’s happened until the second week of January when they return from their hols by which time Ms Ryan will have it all signed and sealed.

        • muzza 10.1.1.4

          Honesty from Hooten – You will know full well that those in radio/tv/print MSM are only the representatives/mouthpieces of who the owners want to be peddling their version of “news”.

          Of course the whole thing is total BS!

          Well said Hoots!

        • Skinny 10.1.1.5

          I just can not take anything Hooten says seriously as a political commentator. Dog whistling & bending the truth is about it from Matthew these days. Too much of a rabid extreme neo liberalist point of view, which we can do without. >>>face the corner like a naughty child.

    • KhandallaMan 10.2

      SP, you are one of a dwindling number that listens to the 9 to 12 show in RNZ. It is as journalistically weak as the Jim Mora show in the afternoon. 

      • prism 10.2.1

        KMan
        So who do you listen to on radio if you’re dissing 9toNoon? And where is the daily best and fairest political discourse found in the land?

        • Lanthanide 10.2.1.1

          Checkpoint is very good. Morning Report is worthwhile when they interview someone important.

          Otherwise not much else worth listening to. Kim Hill is good but she’s not daily.

  8. Rogue Trooper 11

    and the answer to the meaning of life is 4:2, jumping jack flash to 5;
    Be wise in the way you act towards outsiders; make the most of every opportunity. Let your conversation be always full of grace, seasoned with salt, so that you may know how to answer
    everyone.
    (well, that was a colossus of a small book)

    -The Killing Moon (Echo and The Bunneymen) hanging aroound Villiers Terrace.

  9. Pascal's bookie 12

    Whatever you think of the Hobbit, the films, Jackson, or anything else; this article is %100 Pure John Key:

    http://t.co/sp4yplKz

    • Lanthanide 12.1

      Love this part:

      “People that are into it are really into it, and they just can’t get enough of it.

      “It’s one of those things where if it’s your big thing they just have an insatiable appetite for this stuff,” he said.

      “In its own world, in its own way, it’s a franchise like a James Bond thing. Those people just love it.”

    • vto 12.2

      ha ha yep, this line is classic John Key “Will watch the movie, wont need to read the book”.

      You see, John Key is one of the shallowest people to ever be Prime Minister. He has no depth and he shows no depth. There is nothing to him… shallow

      • tc 12.2.1

        Or get a convenient opinion about it and go with that rather than have to admit his favourite part was probably from LOTR.

        The hollow men like their puppets shallow vto, makes them less likely to go off script if they lack the brains to go unscripted. Case in point the hard talk interview.

      • Reagan Cline 12.2.2

        I get the impression he is pretending to sound typical of one of the majority who support him. A crowd pleaser. Another “populist politician”. Someone in the New Zealand National Party picked a winner !

    • felix 12.3

      Last line of the article says it all. What a despicable little interloper he is.

    • seeker 12.4

      “In its own world, in its own way, it’s a franchise like a James Bond thing. Those people just love it.”

      Tolkien would have been thrilled to hear this description and comparison. You are right PB – 100% pure neanderthal John Key.

    • David H 12.5

      But judging from everything he says, I thought he couldn’t read. 😉

  10. Rosie 13

    Did anyone see that article on 3 news over the weekend about an American entertainment lawyer who has written a book about the negotiations between our govt and Warners regarding the ammendment of our employment law? The author appeared (justifiably) critical of the proceedings and consequences. Due to slight squiffiness at the time I missed most of the information. If anyone knows the author or the name of the book I’d be keen to know.

    Are you hobbited out? I am.
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/comment/columnists/dave-armstrong/7995832/Hobbit-fatigue-setting-in-already

    All the Hobbit marketing around town at the moment does nothing except leave a bad taste in the mouth.

    • deuto 13.1

      I think this might be what you were referring to, Rosie.

      http://www.3news.co.nz/Book-slams-Govts-accommodating-position-to-Warners-with-The-Hobbit/tabid/1748/articleID/278037/Default.aspx

      And i am hobbited out before it even begins – avoiding downtown Wellington for the next week or so.

      [On a different subject, thanks for your earlier message. Been difficult but not unexpected. In the last few weeks, I’ve become something of an expert on estate management/executor as there is no money for lawyers etc but getting there. It has highlighted a great gap again between the situation for the have and the have nots. Don’t think that many people realise that the support for those less well off financially that used to be available in such matters through the Public Trust no longer exists – they now charge for everything at close to legal firm rates. Free wills are also a thing of the past. May write something up for Open Mike on this in the near future when I get some free time.]

      • Rosie 13.1.1

        Hi deuto, thanks for the link, thats much appreciated. Will see if the library will get this book in:-)

        (Re Hobbit madness: My volunteer work day is a Wednesday and the worksite is just off Courtenay Place which means its going to be fun fun fun getting home! The bus stop at the Embassy theatre end of Courtenay Pl is being closed for the parade and moved to wakefield st. I checked it out with the bus co and they said “with all the chaos going on who knows if your bus will be there on time and what time you will reach your destination” 10 points for honesty!)

        And separately:Your friend was lucky to have you as a friend. It is sad that even in death inequality lingers. I have heard of families being unable to cope financially with expected or unexpected loss. This adds a really unfair burden to those already coping with grief. When you do have time it would be good to read of your thoughts and experiences in managing the affairs of your friend’s estate. I think it would be helpful for those of us who are unfamiliar with these circumstances

    • David H 13.2

      I live in Levin so I don’t get battered by it. And I have never read any of the books or seen any of the movies. Also I gave up on Jackson movies after King Kong what a slow boring movie that was.

  11. gobsmacked 15

    David Shearer interview on BfM this morning:

    http://95bfm.com/default,208812,labour-party-leader-david-shearer.sm

    It’s not his worst interview … he even shows a bit of passion at the end. But it’s mostly waffle.

    The funny part is him going on about Bloggers – he gets really tetchy!

    “Bloggers aren’t voters”, he insists. Thanks, Dave.

    • karol 15.1

      Lots of “bottom lines”.

    • Chalupa Batman 15.2

      I thought he didn’t read them?

    • QoT 15.3

      “Bloggers aren’t voters”, he insists. Thanks, Dave.

      Whiskey. Tango. Foxtrot?

    • Draco T Bastard 15.4

      Well, the bloggers aren’t voters who will vote for Shearer anyway (not the way he keeps insisting on insulting them).

      • seeker 15.4.1

        True- not now any way DTB

        • karol 15.4.1.1

          What Shearer actually says about

          Earlier in the interview he says he believes that he should “play the ball and not the man”  And that he’s not going to go back and “re-rehearse” his reasons for demoting Cunliffe. i.e he’s not going to explain that.

          Blogger bit starts at 5.17 mins:
          Then from about 5.37:

          Ah yes, but at the end of the day, the bloggers are not the voters.  In fact they’re a long, long way away from the voters, to be  perfectly frank.  When you go round the country and I talk to the people, I have a better sense, I believe, than bloggers sitting there in front of a computer, quite frankly.  Especially when they are sort of blogging anonymously.  i don’t have a.  I don’t listen to them.  i don’t read them. I do what I believe is right.

          It seems being anonymous, particularly impairs one’s understanding of what voters think.

          • gobsmacked 15.4.1.1.1

            bloggers sitting there in front of a computer

            As opposed to right-wing journalists who show their approval of Shearer, by using goose-feathers and parchment?

          • Te Reo Putake 15.4.1.1.2

            “It seems being anonymous particularly impairs one’s understanding of what voters think.”
             
            Indeed. That whole anonymous voting thing must really grind his gears too. It totally devalues the opinions of the voters when they cast their ballot in secret.

          • QoT 15.4.1.1.3

            As a blogger I, of course, cannot talk to people around the country, because I’m chained to my desk. I do not have friends, family, workmates, old school chums. I cannot have conversations around the water cooler either literally nor figuratively.

            Whereas David Shearer, travelling from photo op to photo op to meet people who have chosen to show up to see him (and are thus totally unbiased), yeah, he’s the one with the unvarnished view of social reality for NZers.

          • vto 15.4.1.1.4

            If people like Shearer are so upset about anonymity then let’s see a law proposing that voting in the general election be made public instead of secret.

            Do Shearer and all those others bleating about anonymity actually know why voting is secret?

            and while at it – another bloody fail on his presentation on the tv3 news. For fucks sake sharpen up. What a dopey answer to the question about whether $50k sections are available in Auckland. Somebody get a PR Training Course for Shearer for a Christmas present.

            Each opportunity stuffed up like that is another whack on a coffin nail for Labour. Imo.

            2c from behind the curtains in front of the computer removed from reality.

            • quartz 15.4.1.1.4.1

              Fuck he’s awful: http://95bfm.com/assets/sm/208812/3/shearernov26.mp3

               
              It’s not like he just stumbles on difficult concepts or unusual syntax. In this soft student radio interview he actually says “these houses are… um… are…………. um built.” How the fuck is this guy going to cope standing on a highly lit stage with people attacking him and communicate even the simplest of economic ideas. The motherfucker can’t even remember that you “build” houses!!! What the fuck does his addled brain think you do with houses??? Roll them up and fucking smoke them??? It’s like he’s missing the elemental structures of language, like that part of his brain responsible for simple syntax isn’t functional.
               
              And they say that anyone that points this out is part of a conspiracy??? That’s like saying the enlightenment was a smear campaign. Stupid fucking cunts.
              • Herodotus

                He has revert back to form after a glorious 30 minutes 8 days ago, with his lack of confidence in knowing the subject (54sec in). I do not blame David for this, it is those who thought out the policy without thinking about the “how” aspect (A King and others). Even the artist impression (33 seconds in) does not enter reality to a 90m2 house on a 120m2 section. A good idea easily dismissed by poor planning Fail to plan or plan to fail??
                http://www.3news.co.nz/Labour-dreaming-with-housing-plan–property-developer/tabid/370/articleID/278168/Default.aspx

                • QoT

                  Oh my fucking god. I know I’m biased, but for any politician that’s just fucking embarrassing. Couldn’t they even get an intern to go on Trademe and scope out the prices of sections before the Leader went out to look like an utter numpty on TV?

                  (Probably Cunliffe’s fault that Shearer didn’t have the numbers.)

                  • Herodotus

                    And he lives in this city. Had it been Damien O’Connor, English, Parata, Dyson you could perhaps understanding not knowing the city.
                    Still would like to know the originators of the policy and why the nos. don’t balance, and why Shearers minders let him out without being well briefed especially for a photo opportunity (driving prices down by 25-30% bulk buying just as well there was not the obvious follow up question).So a $220-$250k house really costs for us today $275-$315k + land. Funny thing that sounds correct for development on a 650m2 on the extremities of Auckland ;-). Shearer fact check: Yes
                    http://www.pokenovillageestate.co.nz
                    Many here under estimate how difficult it is to carry out a successful photo op is (Key is gifted here) given what just went down !!!
                    http://tvnz.co.nz/one-news/video

                    • gobsmacked

                      Many here underestimate how difficult it is to carry out a successful photo op

                      If a politician creates a perception, the media (especially TV) will look for confirmation.

                      Shearer created the “er … um” perception during the leaders’ debate and then either (a) did not do anything about it, or (b) did, but hasn’t learned, perhaps cannot learn.

                      He is never going to shake that perception, and a speech is irrelevant (when only one person is allowed to talk).

                      It is hard to exaggerate the level of incompetence here. Think of all the UNPLANNED things that can go wrong (protestors turning up, gotcha questions off-topic, awkward member of public intrudes, pratfalls – the list is long). This was none of those things. It was a straightforward question on exactly what Shearer was there to promote. It doesn’t get any easier for a campaigning politician. It can get much tougher though.

                  • Rhinocrates

                    (A) Roll eyes.
                    (B) Sigh
                    (C) Face/palm
                    (D) Nod with a weary implication of “Yep, I expected something like that”
                    (E) Make tea.
                    (F) Note to self, “Oh yeah, that reminds me of the GCSB tape thingy.”

                    Can I say “All of the above”?

                    Simpler questions and answers:

                    Q: Why did Wall Street fuck the global economy?

                    A: John Key.

                    Q: Why is the UN so ineffective?

                    A: David Shearer.

              • prism

                quartz
                Are you alleging that David Shearer, or some other politician, commits incest? This is a serious and sensitive term and not just a run of the mill swear word. You are throwing around sexist insults like a farmer with a muckspreader. Swear words are more effective when used sparingly.

          • David H 15.4.1.1.5

            Nice one David Bloggers are not voters huh? Well we all have a vote so you are one down there. But even if you are right and we are a minority of voters, a lot of us are the minions that help in the 1001 little jobs that are essential to the smooth running of the election campaign. Imagine NO envelope stuffers, No one to drive those that can’t get to the polling booth, No one to make the thousands and thousands of phone calls a lot to abusive people, NO one, to do that what you have forgotten to do, the tasks you don’t have the time to do. Yep as voters we may not matter. BUT do you really want to piss us off????

          • lprent 15.4.1.1.6

            Ah yes, but at the end of the day, the bloggers are not the voters. In fact they’re a long, long way away from the voters, to be perfectly frank.

            Jez. Did he ever read the comments on his own posts at Red Alert? I guess he must have because he even answered some of them. I wonder if he thought that because he was a blogger that his opinion was abnormal.

            But the point is that mostly we work and deal with work mates, are involved with family (usually several families in my experience) and friends, etc etc and some of us have been doing this for decades that hopping on social media rather than watching TV for a few hours makes us “different”.

            FFS: doesn’t he have any kids around? The problem is that as any parent of teens can tell you, this is pretty much the norm for a hell of a lot of people who are current and future voters and under the age of 40. If they aren’t talking on blogs then they’re on facebook, twitter, or their phones. Many do all of those at the same time. The group who read political blogs typically have rather large friend lists so they literally broadcast whatever they’re interested in off to hundreds of people…

            About the only thing I have ever seen slow people down in their headlong rush towards digital communications is when they have very young kids. And that is mostly because kids adore the technology, especially touch screens and keyboards…

            Where does he live – in some mythic present where it is still the 70’s or 80’s?

      • Rogue Trooper 15.4.2

        well, at least people can learn something helpful along the way

  12. Draco T Bastard 16

    This is interesting:

    This information showed the successful CNR tender was $31.3 million and the Hillside tender was $37.7 million – a difference of only $6.4 million (Otago Daily Times, 21 November 2012).

    Local National list MP Michael Woodhouse was quoted as saying the difference between tenders was about 40% (Otago Daily Times, 16 November 2012).

    Ms Murray says the actual difference would appear to approximately 20%.

    So, we have a National MP either talking in ignorance or lying. But what about the $6.4m, what was so important that they couldn’t afford that?

    The number of employees earning over $100,000 a year reportedly increased from 405 in 2011 to 564 in 2012.

    KiwiRail now employs four people who earn over $440,000 a year compared to one in the previous year, at a cost of at least $2.4 million between them.

    Yep, apparently wages for the top executives.

    Nor is the closure due to lack of work, she says.

    According to the KiwiRail 2011/2012 annual report, it has 535 new wagons “and more to come”. KiwiRail has said on previous occasions at least 3000 are needed.

    “If that is true there is plenty of work for Hillside Workshops.”

    Plenty of work to do just no will at the top to do it. And, no, it’s not cheaper to get it all done by other countries. In real terms, it’s actually far more expensive.

    • prism 16.1

      DTB
      Well doesn’t our economic policy follow Ricardos theory or something interpreted as – Each country should do (only) the things that it is particularly skilled at, and export that, and import other countries efficiently made items.

      And that explains why we are retreating into 19th century economic trends, with a hole in the middle caused by the vanished industrial age sector, and now concentrating on the labour-poor technological age.

      E&OE What do I know, I’m just a seeker after understanding.

      • Draco T Bastard 16.1.1

        Well doesn’t our economic policy follow Ricardos theory or something interpreted as – Each country should do (only) the things that it is particularly skilled at, and export that, and import other countries efficiently made items.

        That’s the theory – it’s a load of bollocks as most of the free-market theory is. Transportation must make it far more expensive to produce what we use elsewhere. It’s only the capitalist paradigm and its profit drive, which the free-market theory is based upon, that can make it look cheaper.

  13. gobsmacked 17

    Please. Make. This. Stop.

    Shearer on TV3 News … promoting the housing policy, asked a simple question about cost … and guess what? He does the goldfish – mouth open, nothing, mouth closed. For God’s sake.

    HE CAN’T COPE.

    Everybody knows this. And even you think David Cunliffe is the anti-christ, you know it. Shearer won’t survive an election campaign, and no amount of head-in-sand self-delusion will change that.

    Cut the crap, have a contest between Robertson and Cunliffe and anyone else, but just …

    Make. This. Stop.

    • Rhinocrates 17.1

      May I suggest a sack of potatoes?

      Potatoes are unpretentious, firm and earthy. That will appeal to the heartland.

      They are not elitist, like artichokes.

      Potatoes do not talk much – this reflects the taciturn kiwi nature and shows that they understand the rule that “it is better be thought a fool and say nothing than open your mouth and remove all doubt.”

      Potatoes are discrete and tactful. This gives them the appearance of a Buddha-like wisdom. “Apolitical” as Shearer’s promoters would have it. Really, what could seem less political than a potato?

      Potatoes do not loose their composure under pressure. They do not stammer and insult anyone. They do not say, “citizens over eighteen who have access to the internet do not vote”.

      They’re good for you.

      Cut into small sections and deep fried, they are delicious.

      Baked and with sour cream they are delicious.

      Roasted they are delicious.

      Even mashed they are good.

      Face it: potatoes are great no matter how they are treated. They have resilience and composure under the most brutal of treatment and everyone likes them.

      David Cunliffe is not a potato.

      So let’s not beat about the bush here! A sack of potatoes is far better than David Shearer! You know it makes sense!

      Vote Spuds! Now!

      • Chalupa Batman 17.1.1

        Bolger didn’t do too badly…

      • felix 17.1.2

        I’ve got a few sacks of horse shit and sawdust and I’ll put any one of them up against Shearer AND your spuds if you wanna make it a three-way contest.

        My sacks are humming with life and energy, bursting with fresh and fertile ideas. This is the nourishment the grass roots are crying out for!

        Let’s grow a stronger party from the ground up!

        Horse Shit for Labour!

        • Rhinocrates 17.1.2.1

          Potatoes smell better than horse shit, but I have to admit that sawdust, especially pine, has the advantage when it comes to fragrance. This is going to be a tough competition, but I submit that the nutritional value of potatoes is more appealing to the proles, I mean voters, and they will see through the facile appeal of your sawdust! Horse shit might appeal to rose bushes, but rose bushes aren’t voters!

          • vto 17.1.2.1.1

            I’ll see your sacks of potatoes and horse shit and raise you three chickens.

            • Rhinocrates 17.1.2.1.1.1

              Ha! Chickens make poor interview subjects. They wander about, making random clucking sounds and are notoriously prone to picking on those perceived to be weak, undermining the appearance of solidarity. On the other hand, a single potato will show calm and decorum under all circumstances and a whole sack of them will be likewise stoic and determined. This will indicate that the front bench is steady and unified, unlike the present state of affairs.

              • vto

                Put four tv channels on the telly… one of Shearer, one of a potato, one of a pile of horse shit (even with a sawdust garnish) and one of my three chickens…

                Which one do you imagine the people would most watch? One must think of the media.

                • felix

                  The camera is a fickle mistress. Horse Shit has been spending a lot of time on the ground around the country, meeting and listening to the Real People ™ , and the Real People ™ are saying that when you get up close enough, Horse Shit really shines.

                  Besides, any sack of shit can get media training but what can you teach a chook or a spud?

                  • locus

                    pretty b**** funny… horse shit gets my vote and what with the worms and compost it’s win win for the spuds and chooks

      • Rogue Trooper 17.1.3

        That is hilarious.

  14. joe90 18

    Please, please can this be the real thing.

    Definitive Proof of Politifact’s Bias

    They also unfairly tarnish Michele Bachmann as a liar, when anybody who follows her already understands that many of her statements aren’t meant to be truthful in the first place — she simply says what she feels.

  15. BLiP 19

    .

    Surprise, surprise . . .

    A political marketing expert says four of the country’s biggest newspapers were substantially biased in their coverage of last year’s election – mostly in favour of John Key.

    Massey University Associate Professor Claire Robinson assessed all the election images run in The New Zealand Herald, the Herald on Sunday, the Dominion Post and Sunday Star Times.

    She says Labour and Phil Goff have real grounds to feel they were unfairly treated . . .

    • karol 19.1

      The press release that the above article is based on.

    • Blue 19.2

      Cue squawking from the MSM: “We’re not biased, we /just have a really, really big crush on John Key/ don’t accept those findings, we can find a different expert with another opinion/ Oh John, you’re so cheeky! Ooh! /we are nothing but fair, balanced and objective/ but John is just so *hot*/ and we maintain that we have the best political coverage in NZ/ especially if you want to find out what John had for breakfast/.

  16. Descendant Of Smith 20

    Interesting research on the genetic ( strictly speaking epigenetic) effects that aspects such as famine (poverty) have on future generations.

    http://protomag.com/assets/the-new-heredity

    Epigenetics as I understand is about the proteins that sit on top of the gene and that suppress or encourage the switching on and off of the gene.

    http://www.nature.com/scitable/topicpage/obesity-epigenetics-and-gene-regulation-927

    The poverty that is currently being inflicted on New Zealanders now will likely have long lasting effects including those not born yet.

    On the other hand creating a more egalitarian distributed society with decent housing, sufficient food and heating and stable environments will likely have our future citizens coping more easily with problems such as climate change.

    What we create today suddenly seems more important.

  17. muzza 21

    http://laudafinem.com/2012/11/21/public-confidence-in-nz-courts-on-the-verge-of-collapse-rogue-jurors-out-of-control/

    I’m sure people would have seen this sham by TVNZ last weekend, and I would advise the above link as must read!

    NZ really is controllably out of control!

  18. Rogue Trooper 22

    This “Macdonalds” thingy (is that how you spell that cardboard food place?) is a bit of gaff innit

    simile without fries?

  19. Draco T Bastard 23

    TVNZ7 survey results ‘concealed’

    Former broadcasting minister Jonathan Coleman announced in February 2011 that TVNZ7 would be canned. Two months later, he justified his decision by saying it had a weekly audience of only 207,000.

    He admitted in May this year that the figure, which he said was provided by officials, had been calculated wrongly.

    Mr Thomas said the research indicated that, by January 2010, more than 500,000 people watched TVNZ7 at least once a week.

    It showed TVNZ knew Dr Coleman’s figure was wrong, he said.

    TVNZ spokeswoman Megan Richards said the research was carried out as part of its reporting back to the Government. “So the Government was fully aware of the contents of each survey.”

    TVNZ believed the research was commercially sensitive “despite the non-commercial nature of the channel as a whole”.

    Oh, I bet it was commercially sensitive – TVNZ1&2 would have been losing audience share to TVNZ7.

  20. Rogue Trooper 24

    at least people may learn something along the way

  21. joe90 25

    Of 13,950 peer reviewed articles 24 rejected global warming: In One Pie Chart

    By my definition, 24 of the 13,950 articles, 0.17% or 1 in 581, clearly reject global warming or endorse a cause other than CO2 emissions for observed warming.

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