Open mike 27/08/2013

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, August 27th, 2013 - 160 comments
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Open mike is your post. For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the link to Policy in the banner).

Step right up to the mike…

160 comments on “Open mike 27/08/2013 ”

  1. Saarbo 1

    NZ Herald – Editorial today

    Arguing the case AGAINST democracy.

    “There is good reason to confine these elections to a party caucus. MPs are generally well briefed on policy issues and aware of the national interest. They also work closely with leadership contenders and are best-placed to assess their character and capabilities.”

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11114759

    Jeeez…I guess the Herald just wants their BORN TO RULE beloved National Party to run things…unbelievable.

    • geoff 1.1

      Also from granny herald:

      http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11114788

      So much for secret voting eh…

    • North 1.2

      Saarbo @ 1. This is great really. Granny showing the depth of her true colours. Perfect justification to scorn and lambast the meddlesome, clutching of the pearls hypocrisy she launches against democracy. Dismiss, dismiss, dismiss !

      • beGone Craven SpyBill leopard 1.2.1

        True colours alright.

        The Herald [of big money interests] refers to good governance:

        “This carries risks not just for Labour but for the good government of New Zealand… ~ The Herald [Propaganda]

        What good governance is that referring to?

        This comment appears to entirely ignore the way that our legislation is being ‘rushed through’ at every turn and how we have recently incurred a massive lost to our democratic rights and principles.

        It appears to ignore that there is an increasing yawning gap between the most wealthy and the least in this country.

        These two issues alone prove that the governance in our country over, really, a very long time is a complete failure.

        Good governance – what utter rot.

    • One Anonymous Knucklehead 1.3

      This carries risks not just for Labour but for the good government of New Zealand if the consensus between the two major parties on economic fundamentals is undermined by a leader’s public commitments in a campaign for the party’s vote.

      The consensus? Does Granny mean selling New Zealand legislation to campaign donors? Or subsidising Rio Tinto?

      There is no alternative? Really, Granny? Are you sure?

      • vto 1.3.1

        That is astounding.

        The NZ Herald is effectively stating that the wishes of the people of New Zealand must be subordinated to some other structure. The Herald is promoting some form of higher power than that of the people.

        The Herald has lost the plot.

        The Herald can go wander down to the local turgid creek and drown itself all alone.

        • Tracey 1.3.1.1

          Even Brian Edwards doesn’t want a democratic process to select the leader. No wonder National has managed to erode so many democratic rights, the media actually don’t much like democracy either.

          perhaps its because many will have to leave wellington to cover the contest?

          • vto 1.3.1.1.1

            Well clearly then, Brian Edwards and the Herald need to be put out to pasture and some fresh air blown through the place.

            They have become stale, bereft of clarity, empty of history, …..

            Brian
            Edwards
            is
            a
            classic
            waste
            of
            space
            .
            .
            .

        • Colonial Viper 1.3.1.2

          It seems there’s been an “economic consensus” between National and Labour that we haven’t been told about until now. (But we’ve all seen operating…)

        • Anne 1.3.1.3

          There were also rumours that Mr Cunliffe was offering positions to some MPs in return for their support. Mr Cunliffe has denied that but the rumours indicate the campaign might not be as clean as the party hierarchy is hoping.

          So Labour’s own dirty tricks brigade is back in full swing? Where’s Trevor Mallard? Or could it be closer to Cunliffe’s home city this time?

          http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11114788

      • Tracey 1.3.2

        Does that mean don’t tell the public what you will do, so you can do what you like when elected?

    • BM 1.4

      Looks like a win to Robertson.
      Excellent.

    • Tracey 1.5

      Provided the candidates in the contest behave like adults during the contest, the media will have no option but to write substance…

      I switched from TV1 news some years ago but after Gowers “coverage” yesterday I may leave that channel too.

      To my mind his job is to advise me what is going on and who is saying what. He sees his job as giving me his opinion not facts. Why do political jounos and politicians think we are all too stupid to make up our own minds.

    • framu 1.6

      They also havent caught on that selection via a party wide vote is how the greens have elected their leaders for ages. They talk as if its some new crazy thing

    • yeshe 1.7

      They are also heavily editing comments on John Armstrong’s piece this morning .. I wrote a fairly innocuous comment ( innocuous in terms of needing moderating) and it has failed to appear … in fact there are zero comments showing.

      Censorship stinks.

  2. Tiger Mountain 2

    Just ban the printed Herald from our lives. I bought it in the 70s and 80s to see what the bosses were up to today. But have not plunked down loose change for two decades now, yes I admit scanning it online and if the paper version goes totally down the web version would be pay to read or disappear too. Yay.

    The dirty filthy Eastern Suburbs toffs that kept the rag going all the 20th century lying, misleading and distorting reality for New Zealanders. Yay. Truth has gone too. Don’t buy the Herald and if there is one at work or a cafe–bin it, do us all a favour.

    • tc 2.1

      You can see the fear in granny and the other MSM outlets when the potential for genuine change to rock their isolated and priviledged world appears.

      They are part of the problem and don’t want the solution.

      Funny thing is if TVNZ hadn’t been so anti charter and waged war against it they could’ve been an outlet not so easy to flog as it stands now under the nats but then Ellis didn’t take over $1m p.a. to strengthen the nations voice but to bark it’s owners tune.

  3. Tracey 4

    It seems odd how little coverage at stuff and herald brownlee’s loss in the High Court yesterday has taken.

    Despite spending lots of time in the media and their original defence talking about the drawback to rewarding people who didn’t take out insurance according to Cameron (Lawyer for owners) it never came up in the case.

    Brownlee says he will consider an Appeal.

    The point is the High Court has found that Brownlee and CERA did not apply the law as stated.

    Isn’t this just more bullying type behaviour by brownlee? 50% or nothing. Take it or leave it we are bigger than you. brownlee spending our money on trying to uphold his belief that Insurance companies will be harmed if the law is upheld.

    Maybe he is drafting a bill under urgency to overturn the Court.

    Thank God for the Courts. No wonder the nats don’t like the judiciary at the moment.

  4. Raa 5

    Interesting piece about the role and power of political blogs ..

    http://inside.org.au/the-war-the-bloggers-won/

  5. David 7

    LABOUR’S GOT TALENT: just love this little put down line from Key and Whaleoil about our selection process: that kind of smug sneer at something everyday NZers love and want to celebrate- good people getting up and having a go- is just what you’d expect from an elite so out of touch they dont recognise real emotion and public feeling: either pain or, in this case, determination and passion. Yep, damn right Labour’s got talent: and one way or another, you are going to feel it.

    • Winston Smith 7.1

      “Yep, damn right Labour’s got talent: and one way or another, you are going to feel it.”

      – lol! Cunliffe, Jones and Robertson sure but who else?

      • David 7.1.1

        Open your eyes, Winny. Or actually go meet ’em!

        • fender 7.1.1.1

          Nah too busy worshipping the National “talent” or lack of it in fools like N. Guy, H. Parata, P. Bennett, G. Brownlee, J. Collins, J. Keystroke et al, bottom of the barrel stuff.

  6. AsleepWhileWalking 8

    In news not covered by The Herald or Stuff….

    Public told volcanic geyser’s sudden eruption on a public road 900m from Rome airport nothing to be concerned about:
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/italy/10265372/Volcanic-geyser-erupts-close-to-Rome-airport.html

    Despite being a stone’s throw from the end of a main runway at Fiumicino, Europe’s sixth largest airport, which handles 37 million passengers a year, Mr Basili said there was no cause for fear over flight safety. “This is a limited phenomenon – it will not have created alarm at the airport,” he said.

  7. Sanctuary 9

    Ye Gods. I just read Brian Edwards take on things regarding the Labour leadership contest. I wish he had never started a blog. Better to keep your mouth shut and the reputation forged in your youth intact than retiring, writing a blog, and presenting for all to see your sad descent into a bewildered old age. The poor old bugger is stuck in New Zealand circa 1973, he clearly has no idea of the dynamics of New Zealand in 2013.

    • Winston Smith 9.1

      Yeah true what was Dear Leader thinking keeping him on…

    • billbrowne 9.2

      I gave up on him when he posted something about the weather forecast always being different from what he could see out of his own window.

    • Ron 9.3

      Why are we so obsessed with people like Edwards. Yes of course he is getting old and wanders a bit but he is also allowed to have an opinion. So many on this forum seem to see him as some sort of enemy and I am sure that is not correct. He has expressed certain opinions and that should be end of it.
      Can we not just accept differences and stop using these forums for personal attacks on people

  8. geoff 10

    The right/corporate media looks set to go full retard on Labour. It’ll be a rerun of the response that we got from the electricity policy announcement.

    It would be best if the Cunliffe/Robertson/Jones camps coordinated their media to frustrate the likes of Paddy Gower et al.
    And maybe gag Trev and throw him in a cupboard for a month would help too. (that’s a joke! not advocating violence!) 😀

    • Winston Smith 10.1

      “And maybe gag Trev and throw him in a cupboard for a month would help too”

      – That would probably help Labour gain a couple of percentage points

  9. just saying 11

    Giovani Tiso:
    http://bat-bean-beam.blogspot.co.nz/2013/08/the-leader-vanishes.html

    ….When the announcement was made, anticipating a move of this nature, it occurred to me briefly that I should go and download as many ‘Shearer pages’, as many speeches as I could. You never know when such documents might become useful, and I remembered how difficult it was for me to track down some of the things that John Key said when he was deputy leader of National, simply because as soon as he became leader his comms people decided that his record had to be reset, and all previous statements in service of another master deleted.

    So: I knew about this, I fully expected this, and yet I was surprised at how quickly it happened, almost as if a measure of glee was being taken in scrubbing off the old leader’s likeness. Were I in the appropriate mood, I might reach for such historical precedents as the chiselling off of the symbols of a hated dictatorship or, more pointedly, the removal from the photographic record of the people who could no longer be seen to have been close to comrade Stalin. After all, with no hyperbole whatsoever, it’s the exact same logic at work: one that negates history, or rather that asserts the prerogative of power to continually write and re-write the past according to the needs of the present…

  10. i just heard bridges on nat-rad..

    ..what is it with those younger male tory mp’s..?

    ..and their issues with the spoken word..?

    ..they dance around the english language like constipated dogs trying to work it out..

    ..bridges totally over-masticates his words..and then sprays surrounding environs with the remains..

    ..and tremain and guy..(who i call heckle and jeckel..(old cartoon..look it up..and wonder at the spooky similarites..)

    ..both of them are glottal/strangled-word disasters..(tremain in particular..)

    ..and of course guy when on his own is called ‘clutch cargo’..(once again..old cartoon..look it up..be spooked again..(and be really spooked how guy has that whole clutch thing of just the lips moving when speaking down just so..

    ..and really..for everyones’ peace of mind..guy should be asked to disrobe..to prove there are no wires sticking out/plugged into him..

    ..and then of course there is jonathan ‘cigar-boy’ coleman..and his peculiar habit of tossing a handful of marbles into his mouth..before speaking..(so if you listen carefully…you can hear them rolling/bouncing off each other)

    ..and of course todd (‘pompadour’) mclay..doesn’t toss marbles into his mouth..

    ..he stuffs his full of plums…

    ..is it a basic requirement of being a young(er) tory male mp..?

    ..to talk weird..?

    ..(the evidence is overwhelming..)

    ..and i can hear you asking:..’but what about craig ‘the hapless one’ foss..?..you’ve left him out..’

    ..the thing is with foss..i am still so dazzled by his haplessness..

    ..i am yet to move on to his verbal-tics..

    phillip ure..

  11. Winston Smith 13

    Is it true that when someone asked him about where he lives he said some malarkey about because his wife wanted to breastfeed?

    If true (and I read it on “other” blogs so I’ll concede it may be wrong) he’ll have to watch comments like that because people can see right through things like that, if true of course.

    Should have just said hes worked hard to get to where he is and wants to give everyone else the same opportunity for success or something similar

    • Tracey 13.1

      Crikey, when did you become concerned about political leaders lying? Or are you concerned for him that he doesn’t lie well enough to beat the current King (Key)?

      • Winston Smith 13.1.1

        All politicians lie, John Key lies, Helen Clark lied, whoever becomes the leader of Labour will lie, everyone lies especially politicians

        What interests me is that there are some lies the voting public accept and some they don’t. It appears to me that the smaller the lie the less likely the voting public is to accept it.

        In regards to the labour leadership I’m more the interested neutral party in that while I have opinions on who should lead I’m trying to see from the viewpoint of whats best for labour

        • McFlock 13.1.1.1

          good laugh for the day

          • Winston Smith 13.1.1.1.1

            You should try it some time, impartiality can give you a different viewpoint

            • Tracey 13.1.1.1.1.1

              are you claiming impartiality now?

              • Winston Smith

                Only for the leadership battle and thats because it doesn’t impact on me, once the leader is decided its back to full-on impartiality

                So yeah I’m thinking that the best chance for Labour winning the next election is Cunliffe leading but personally speaking I’d vote for shane Jones

            • McFlock 13.1.1.1.1.2

              I’ll let you handle it, Solomon the Wise

        • felix 13.1.1.2

          Putting aside the obvious hilarity of your last paragraph (!!!), you’re onto something with this:

          “the smaller the lie the less likely the voting public is to accept it.”

          although I’d look at it through a slightly different lens. I don’t think it’s the size of the lie per se, but rather the point of it.

          I’ve been thinking about corruption lately. I think as a society we’ve become accustomed to the idea that we’re all competing individuals seeking advantage over one another. Only a short while ago this would have been considered highly anti-social thinking, but now it’s the norm. A few decades of user-pays free-marketing has made selfishness acceptable, and greed admirable.

          When someone is caught lying to further their own interests, instead of judging the behaviour as anti-social and corrupt we understand that that’s just what you do these days. You look after number one. And while we might not always openly praise someone for lying and scheming in their own interest, we grudgingly accept it. We say “who can blame them?” We say “they’d be silly not to”.

          And in this selfish, individualistic, dog-eat-dog paradigm, it’s true. We’ve all become corrupt to one degree or another, we’ve done so simply by following the rules of the game. And the rules are look out for number one and never give a sucker an even break. And because we’ve all become corrupted to an extent, we accept the same corruption in others. We expect people to be trying to do us over at every turn.

          So when John Key looks down the barrel of the camera and flat out lies about, for example, how many shares he owns, and then gets caught, and then immediately changes his story, we don’t even blink. Because he’s just doing exactly what we expect everyone to be doing, being dishonest in service of his own interests.

          And I think that’s why we let these “big” lies go. Because it’s the norm. It’s what you’re meant to do according to the rules of the game. As long as it’s obvious that you’re lying to protect or advance yourself, it’s totally understandable.

          Just don’t ever get caught lying for no good selfish greedy dog-eat-dog reason, or we’ll start wondering what flaw in your character you’re trying to cover up.

          • Winston Smith 13.1.1.2.1

            Yes I’d agree theres some truth to that but I’d go further and suggest it also depends on what has been said before

            For instance we know National are for big business and we know Labour are for the battlers so when JK lies (maybe) about his shares thats no big deal but when Shearer “forgot” about his 50 000 plus that was a big deal

            However if JK (whos portrayed himself as a good family man) had been cheating on his missus and tried to cover it up I think the public wouldn’t forgive him

            • felix 13.1.1.2.1.1

              Thank you for the admission that National are for Big Business and not for the little people.

              Not many of your lot admit that obvious truth anymore.

            • Greywarbler 13.1.1.2.1.2

              For instance we know National are for big business and we know Labour are for the battlers

              This by W Smith is a telling point, really the nub of our problem in NZ. Between NACT for Big Business and the battlers supposedly Labour’s congregation, there is a huge yawning gap where most NZs are. That’s those who are able and willing to build and create and contribute and support a vital economically sound NZ. Most of Big Business is looking over their heads to international interests, the battlers and strugglers are at their feet pecking over the trickle down droppings, and wondering what the hell is going on up there, because it sure is hell down here.

              Most NZ is by Winston’s summary, unpolitically unrepresented. Who they gonna call – Ghostbusters? Now those fellas really stuck it to the green slime.

          • Mary 13.1.1.2.2

            Which of Key’s lies or which kind of lies are the ones that if exposed will force Key to fall on his sword?

            • felix 13.1.1.2.2.1

              He’ll never fall on his sword. He’ll have to be hounded out of the village with pitchforks, torches and rough music.

              We’ve accepted that he lies about money and business and that it’s normal. It’s now considered part of his charm. It’s part of his brand that he’s wiley and cunning and no-one gets one over him.

              He can lie his lying arse off and we’re all ok with it because in the world we live in that’s no longer considered an undesirable trait.

              • emergency mike

                Which is why Key is so happy to call Cunliffe a liar any chance he gets. If he and Winston Smith keep on spreading the meme that all politicians lie, then he can merrily carry on being a liar himself. If he gets caught out who’s gonna care except Blip and a few other lefties on the Standard?

                “Steal a little and they throw you in jail. Steal a lot and they make you king.” Bob Dylan

              • Tracey

                but wait, weren’t the national and ACT parties absolutely against lies by govt MPs when they were in opposition???? OH, I see, they were lying.

    • weka 13.2

      “Is it true that when someone asked him about where he lives he said some malarkey about because his wife wanted to breastfeed?”

      Only what I’ve read on ts, but he apparently said that his wife was breastfeeding and needed to live closer to her work. That is a completely valid reason for choosing where to live.

      • Winston Smith 13.2.1

        Sure it is *insert any vague reference to buying a bridge*

        Look theres nothing wrong with being successful and having the money to choose where you live but don’t drag your family into it because now his familys fair game

        ie Are your kids still brest feeding, when you will be moving back closer to the people you purport to represent and if not why not etc etc

        • weka 13.2.1.1

          I’m not commenting on Cunliffe’s choices. I’m stating that moving so you are closer to work while breastfeeding is a completely valid reason. Some people here seem to be saying it’s not.

          • Winston Smith 13.2.1.1.1

            Well its something he might want to watch out for…he might not want to give Robertson any ammunition

        • felix 13.2.1.2

          “but don’t drag your family into it because now his familys fair game”

          Really Winston? Are you applying that principle across the board to any mp who ever mentions their family?

          Bill English’s family are fair game, are they? And John Key’s family?

          (neither of whom live in their electorates either btw)

          • weka 13.2.1.2.1

            “but don’t drag your family into it because now his familys fair game”

            Daft. Are you saying that he should lie?

            • Tracey 13.2.1.2.1.1

              I think he is telling him he needs to learn to lie better if he wants to be PM.

              It’s the new standard our current PM has set..

          • Winston Smith 13.2.1.2.2

            If they use them as a defence as Cunliffe did then yes by all means

            • Tracey 13.2.1.2.2.1

              so, Key’s mum and sister are up for grabs… he used them as a defence of himself and his ability to l know how it is for the low income in NZ?

            • weka 13.2.1.2.2.2

              A defence against what? Being asked why he lives in a certain part of town?

              • Winston Smith

                Why he feels he doesn’t live near those he represents, the inference being that hes using the people to further his own ends but doesn’t want to live near the hoi-polloi

                Not a good look for a labour MP

                • Colonial Viper

                  John Key reckons its fine to live and holiday far away from the electorate he represents; Cunliffe on the other hand is actually IN the electorate he represents all the time.

                  Desperate righties must be desperate.

                • weka

                  “Why he feels he doesn’t live near those he represents, the inference being that hes using the people to further his own ends but doesn’t want to live near the hoi-polloi”

                  Do you have any evidence that Cunliffe lives where he lives in order to avoid living next to some people in his electorate (as opposed to the ones he does live near of course)? Or any evidence that the reason Cunliffe gave (his wife’s breastfeeding needs) was a lie?

        • Tracey 13.2.1.3

          isn’t having them on the hustings with you and so on “dragging” them into it. You are drawing a pretty long bow

  12. Tracey 14

    “A heavy shower sweeps across Auckland as the Herald heads towards the College Rifles Sports Club. It’s late June and the rain has been coming and going all day, and all month. It’s the sort of weather that’s killed off many a sports event, but there’s no need to worry on this occasion. In 2009 the club installed synthetic turf on its two rugby fields, rendering cancellations a thing of the past.

    Located a couple of hundred metres off Remuera Rd in a flood-prone valley, the playing surfaces at the historical club have traditionally been terrible.

    ‘It was a s***hole,” says club manager Derek Rope.

    Synthetic turf has come a long way. Up close it looks and almost feels like real grass, with little black rubber balls and flakes mimicking dirt. The lush carpet cost the club $2 million, $500,000 of which came from gaming trusts.

    Synthetic turf also covers the scrum practice area and the netball and tennis courts. There’s a brand new pavilion, state-of-the-art gym and 32-bed accommodation block for touring sports teams.

    The club’s bad days are well and truly behind it, thanks in part to its success in accessing gaming trust money. Seven trusts have kicked in over $1 million to help fund the redevelopment projects, and there is more to come. The club has already secured $300,000 of trust money to put towards the final phase of its development, a swimming pool complex, and is hoping to raise that figure by another $200,000.

    Clubs like College Rifles in Remuera have developed programmes and facilities using gambling money. Photo / Richard RobinsonClubs like College Rifles in Remuera have developed programmes and facilities using gambling money. Photo / Richard Robinson

    Given that just 23 of the country’s 17,534 pokies are situated in Remuera, it’s hardly a surprise that a club that began life in 1897 with a membership of military personnel drawn from Auckland’s schools has been held up as the poster child for the dubious wealth redistribution that accompanies the gaming trust model.

    “Why should poor people in Mangere be supplying first-class facilities in Remuera?” Maori Party MP Te Ururoa Flavell asked when he launched his ill-fated Gambling Harm Reduction Bill.

    It’s a fair question, and one Mr Rope doesn’t duck. “People say it’s a Remuera rich club – it’s not,” he says.

    Only 25 per cent of the club’s 5000 members across a sports portfolio that ranges from badminton to lacrosse are Remuera locals.”
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11114737

  13. tricledrown 15

    For something completely different Charter schools in the UK a complete failure after years: of trialing charter schools which have the advantage of new buildings and public and private funding have shown an initial burst of achievement all be it less than public schools then a continual decline the independent uk reported today.

  14. northshoreguynz 16

    Looking forward to seeing a front bench reshuffle under DC. Parker should keep finance, but I suspect the others will be up. Ardern for all her promise has allowed Bennet to sail on, Hipkiss a failure V Parata, and who does housing, and health??

  15. Jackal 17

    Today, 3 News reports:

    Mr Key predicts Dr Norman will become Deputy Prime Minister and Finance Minister.

    LOL!

    • karol 17.1

      Key looking desperate even as he claims Cunliffe will be desperate to be PM at all costs and take Norman on as deputy of finance minister. Typical rightie that Key – manages to project all his shortcomings on to the opposition.

      PS: The comments below the article mostly say Key is the desperate liar.

      • Tracey 17.1.1

        typical transference karol? He thinks other are behaving how he behaves???

        I chuckled… how quickly he sinks to the personality politics he claims to never sink to.

      • amirite 17.1.2

        We’ll see who’s truly desperate when Key is forced to make a deal with Winston Peters, despite constantly dismissing him.

    • northshoreguynz 17.2

      Judith Collins for Leader of the Opposition?

      • Jackal 17.2.1

        I would prefer to see Gerry Brownlee as the next Natz leader in opposition. Even though they’re both vindictive snakes, big Ger is a bit better at hiding it. Whoever it is, Keys days are clearly numbered.

        • weka 17.2.1.1

          Brownlee as NACT leader…. at least that would swing the Chch vote to the left again.

        • Winston Smith 17.2.1.2

          “Whoever it is, Keys days are clearly numbered”

          – Why, has his popularity dropped below 40% or something?

          • northshoreguynz 17.2.1.2.1

            So <40% is the trigger point for a coup. Good to know, thanks for that.

            • McFlock 17.2.1.2.1.1

              Patrick Gower’s seen a letter, I’ve heard…

            • Winston Smith 17.2.1.2.1.2

              More like suggesting that the chances of Key getting rolled is highly unlikely based on how popular he is

              • McFlock

                might want to send a memo to Collins about that. It’s all very well being personally popular, but that doesn’t help her keep her cabinet post if Nats only get 45% in 2014.

            • Blue 17.2.1.2.1.3

              That’ll explain Why Shearers gone then.

  16. Tracey 18

    “Wellington Central MP Grant Robertson said he paid for taxis and accommodation himself, but his airfare was covered by taxpayers.

    “As a parliamentarian I am able to use parliamentary resources to fly wherever I like in the country, that’s part of the arrangement we have.

    “I think you should refer those inquiries about what we are allowed to do to Parliamentary Services because they set the rules.”

    He said MPs’ salaries were reduced years ago on the basis that the ability to fly around the country was provided.

    “My judgement is that I will not be using any other resources apart from that.” ”

    Cool, more sense of entitlement.

    ” Deputy leaders
    Each member of Parliament who is the deputy leader of a party whose members in the House of Representatives number not less than 25—
    Base salary 179,300
    plus
    For each additional member of the party in the House of Representatives over 25 up to a maximum of 35 610
    plus
    For each additional member of the party in the House of Representatives over 35 up to a maximum of 45 340 ”

    plus expenses.

  17. Tracey 19

    here we go

    “Deputy leaders
    Each member of Parliament who is the deputy leader of a party whose members in the House of Representatives number not less than 25—
    Base salary 182,800
    plus
    For each additional member of the party in the House of Representatives over 25 up to a maximum of 35 630
    plus
    For each additional member of the party in the House of Representatives over 35 up to a maximum of 45 360 ”

    That any of them cant pay for anything associated with their latest job application is beyond me.

  18. Colonial Viper 21

    Maori affairs interview with the candidates

    Not sure if someone has already posted this. Very interesting and good viewpoints from all 3. The interviewer doesn’t hold back!

    https://www.maoritelevision.com/news/politics/native-affairs–labour-panel

    • bad12 21.1

      CV, ‘Native Affairs’ my friend, i found that quite an enlightening interview of the 3, Native Affairs for some strange reason seems to always elicit a better view of the people it interviews than the mainstream,

      Shane Jones didn’t say anything there which would raise my opinion of Him, the reverse in fact, Jone’s faux ‘one of the boys in the smoko room’ line is simply cringe worthy,

      David Cunliffe scored best with His ‘governments have the right to change gambling legislation and SkyCity better be prepared’ line and while i am not a gushing groupy Cunliffe leads in my opinion of who should win this contest,

      Grant Robertson, disappointed me, full stop…

    • karol 21.2

      Thanks, CV for the link.

      Jones seems haughty for all his common man claims: often with his head tilted back and looking down his nose. Robertson looks like he’s doing a job interview – too wordy and sounds more like a backroom worker than someone to front for the party. Cunliffe is composed, clear, and has some short sharp answers – looks like a leader.

  19. funny story!!..

    if questiontime today was a talent-contest for labour…dyson got the gong..

    http://whoar.co.nz/2013/new-zealand-parliament-list-of-questions-for-oral-answer-tuesday-27-august-2013/

    (excerpt..)

    “..bloody hell..!…ruth dyson is actually doing better than any of the three contenders..up against key..

    ..(dyson is expressing potent disgust at keys’ laughing/sneering at/saying that screwing vacant land owners out of 50% of their land values was ‘fun’..)

    ..and the strength of dysons’ performance is because of the fire in her belly..(and cunnliffe/robertson could do worse than take note of that..and spark up..!..)..”

    phillip ure..

    • Jackal 22.1

      +1 Dyson really kicked arse in the house today. The news at six even covered the story reasonably well so that the National voters with a few brain cells to rub together will be thinking twice about continuing their support.

      It’s bad enough that the government is trying to force people in Christchurch to sell their land at half its value, but to say that it’s their fault because they didn’t have land insurance is despicable! There is no land insurance available, which is something a Prime Minister with even half a brain would comprehend.

      What is the point in the current government appealing the courts ruling when they will surely lose? What a god damn waste of taxpayers money.

  20. tracey 23

    Te reo putake

    that these guys claim to champion the poor but think if parliamentary services says they can charge something to us they will… at least so far robertson will.

    • Winston Smith 23.1

      For once this is a cross-party rort with each party as bad as each other

    • Te Reo Putake 23.2

      Bollocks. We live in a democracy and parliamentary representation is one of the guarantees of that. All parties get funded the same way from parliamentary services and the deal is that MP’s get free flights on our taxpayer owned airline. It’s been that way, or similar, for decades. Railways before that. A few weeks ago, the taxpayer paid for every Nat MP to fly to Nelson to have their conference. Did you complain then? Remember, the Tories also claim to champion the poor. Ask Appaller Bennett, she’s all about giving the poor a helping hand round the head and a loving boot up the arse.

      The 3 candidates are flying around the country in an exercise in democracy. This is not only historic, it’s an entirely appropriate use of the Parliamentary budget. Don’t buy into the right’s meme ‘o’ the day, Tracey.

  21. The Chairman 24

    So much for unifying the left.

    Cunliffe rules out Norman as potential Finance Minister

    http://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/auckland/news/nbpol/2086420229-cunliffe-rules-out-norman-as-potential-finance-minister

    Greens co-leader Russel Norman won’t be the Finance Minister under a David Cunliffe or Grant Robertson-led Labour Government.

    • Colonial Viper 24.1

      That’s a hopeless, contextless quote. This one is better:

      Mr Cunliffe responded to Mr Key’s comments this morning, saying: “Mr Key probably ought not make statements about other people telling lies because his record might not be entirely clean.”

      Mr Cunliffe again ruled out appointing Dr Norman as finance minister under a Labour government.

      “But I have said that he is an able and senior politician with whom we would have a good relationship and there could be a place for him within our economic team. It would not be as minister of finance.”

      http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11115155

      • The Chairman 24.1.1

        It’s not entirely an open door invite to unite, but at least he didn’t completely shut the door in their face.

        2 out of 10 for effort?

  22. leftriteleft 25

    War! more war!
    US forces to strike Syria (pending).
    If Key sends troops — he is nothing more than his ulta ego
    Obama.
    The Smiling Assassin and the Mass murderer.
    What a combination.

    • Colonial Viper 25.1

      Sheeeezus.

      Egyptian solders shoot and kill hundreds of unarmed protestors. Result: US continues billions in military aid.

      Unknown, unproven party uses chemical weapons on Syrian civilians, killing hundreds. Result: war to take down Assad’s government.

  23. newsense 26

    Dann vs Gower-

    Gower asks how Cunliffe is going to go man-to-man with Key, Dann asks if he would raise taxes on the rich-

    Dann gets my vote…breath of fresh air

  24. karol 27

    NZ GCSB Bill being covered on Al Jazeera tomorrow morning (19,30 GMT) I make that 6.30am NZ time, not around 7.30am as Selwyn Manning is tweeting.

    • Colonial Viper 28.1

      Robert Reich is very good, but in my opinion he doesn’t go as deep as Chris Hedges and Richard Wolff in explaining how this has all come about.

      Essentially, the civil movements which were crucial in pressuring and forcing the politicians to create the New Deal were, over decades, deliberately dismantled, co-opted, undermined and destroyed.

      It pays to remember how much pressure was required to make Roosevelt and the corporate/banking elite agree to the New Deal. Hundreds of workers, unemployed, activitists were killed in the process, during the Great Depression.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exuGv3HsV-U

      Today the Democrats are just as much friends of big oil, big pharma and big banking, as the Republicans. The civil movements which used to pressure for political economic change for the working class and underclass are long dead.

      And so, the corporate and banking elite have the whole playing field their way now.

      • joe90 28.1.1

        Atwater.

        “That voter, in my judgment,” he claims, “will be more likely to vote his economic interests than he will anything else. And that is the voter that I think through a fairly slow but very steady process, will go Republican.” Because race no longer matters: “In my judgment Karl Marx [is right]… the real issues ultimately will be the economic issues.” He continues, in words that uncannily echo the “47 percent tape” (nothing new under the wingnut sun), that “statistically, as the number of non-producers in the system moves toward fifty percent,” the conservative coalition cannot but expand. Voila: a new Republican majority. Racism won’t have anything to do with it.

        http://www.thenation.com/article/170841/exclusive-lee-atwaters-infamous-1981-interview-southern-strategy#axzz2d8Jra8tt

        • Colonial Viper 28.1.1.1

          Cheers. 🙂 I believe that as usual, the next election will be one or lost on the Economy.

  25. lprent 29

    Sorry about the shutdown. Was setting up a new cdn system.

  26. weka 30

    David Cunliffe ‏@DavidCunliffeMP 17h

    “@laydbackcat: @BreakfastonOne Will he repeal the spy bill ? and restore “fundamental rights to privacy” as David Shearer stated ?” Yes

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